JRE MMA Show #134 with Belal Muhammad

Belal Muhammad 0:00 (drumming music plays) Joe Rogan podcast. Check it out.

Narrator 0:04 The Joe Rogan Experience.

Belal Muhammad 0:06 Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music plays)

Joe Rogan 0:13 Bro, what's happening, brother? How you doing?

Belal Muhammad 0:14 Good, man. How you been?

Joe Rogan 0:15 Very good to see you.

Belal Muhammad 0:17 Excited, man. It's one of those (sighs) milestones that you, you achieve. It's like, "I get to talk to, I get to talk to Joe Rogan."

Joe Rogan 0:23 Oh, coming on here? Oh, that's ridiculous.

Belal Muhammad 0:24 Yeah, I was like (laughs) -

Joe Rogan 0:25 That's hilarious. That's hilarious, man. Well, it's, it's an honor to have you on. I appreciate you.

Belal Muhammad 0:28 I, I appreciate you.

Joe Rogan 0:29 I'm a big fan. And, uh, you're in a great spot right now, man. You're on, you're on the run. You're like, you're, you're there. You're like at the fucking door, you know.

Belal Muhammad 0:37 Yeah. It's been a long road. It's like-

Joe Rogan 0:39 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 0:39 ... when I look back at it, where, where I've been and where I'm at right now, like you still don't even like believe it. But it's like, I still need to get over that hurdle where people still don't believe in you, still people are still looking for excuses of, "Why you beat this guy? Why you beat that guy? Why you don't deserve the title shot?"

Joe Rogan 0:54 But it's not always the case, and then all the sudden you're the fucking man. Like that was Charles Oliveira, right?

Belal Muhammad 0:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:59 For the longest time, people thought, "Oh, he falls apart, he falls apart." And then all a sudden everybody had to go, "You know what? He's the fucking man." You know? Until Islam got a hold of him, he was, you know, he was like a, a completely different entity than he was like back when Cub Swanson knocked him out.

Belal Muhammad 1:15 Yeah. When you look at the way his career is, the way he-

Joe Rogan 1:18 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 1:18 Like people don't give enough credit for that.

Joe Rogan 1:19 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 1:19 And the way he dominated some of the best guys-

Joe Rogan 1:21 Oh my God.

Belal Muhammad 1:22 ... once he was in his title reign.

Joe Rogan 1:23 When he beat Gaethje, the, the way he beat Chandler. I mean, my God.

Belal Muhammad 1:27 Yeah. But, I mean, now people know how good Islam is.

Joe Rogan 1:29 I know.

Belal Muhammad 1:29 People are respecting him the same way I feel like I'm not getting respected. And then-

Joe Rogan 1:33 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 1:33 ... now when he plays with him like that, beats him on the feet and then finishes him on the ground, I think that now people are realizing, all right, well, Islam isn't all talk. Like when DC and all of them are saying that, like, "He's gonna be better than Khabib." Now they're realizing it.

Joe Rogan 1:47 Anybody who said it was all talk is a fool. If, if you watch the way he submitted Drew Dober.

Belal Muhammad 1:52 Oh.

Joe Rogan 1:52 He just smooshed him.

Belal Muhammad 1:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:53 I'm like, there was no getting up there. There was j- it was just a, a matter of time before he put the smoosh down on him.

Belal Muhammad 2:00 Training with those guys, I tell people, I'm like, "If you never train with the guys from Dagestan, from somebody on their team, you don't know what it feels like." It's not, it's not regular jujitsu. Like it's like quicksand, where you're in there, you think you're moving, you're looking for a way out. Uh, you know, I'm, I'm really good at flow rolling and everything, and then I'm training with them my last camp, and I'm like, "I cannot move to the, with these guys." None of them. Like everybody on their team has that same style, same, uh, uh, pressure on top. And I'm feeling it and I'm like, "I need to change what I do in Chicago. I need to change what I'm doing." 'Cause these guys are so dominant with the way they play, the way they, uh, grapple. It's like they're gonna beat everybody. Nobody's gonna mess with them.

Joe Rogan 2:36 What is the difference?

Belal Muhammad 2:38 For, well, for f- the mentality I think is a big thing too. Uh, you know, when you're rolling with somebody new, you, you'll get a flow roll with them. You'll play around to see how they're feeling. Uh, but them, they don't have that at all. It's, "I'm not gonna lose a round. I'm not gonna lose a minute when I'm going against you." If I'm gonna r- this is our first time rolling with each other, you know, I'm on my back. I'm going to my back, starting on my back and I'm like, "All right, let's, let's move." So I'm trying to play like, uh, guard, trying to go for arm bar or anything like that. And then Khabib just yelling at me, "Get up. We're not playing jujitsu. This is get up. This is MMA. We're not playing jujitsu. Not a... You're, you're on your back. You're losing." And their mentality is, "Let me hold you down 'cause I'm not gonna lose this round. I'm gonna stay on top of you. I don't care if I'm in your guard the whole time."

Joe Rogan 3:18 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 3:18 "And I'm just staying on top of you with pressure. You just lost." Even though the, the round's over, I'm sitting there like, "Man, we haven't done anything." It's like, "I'm just laying on my back. You haven't done any pressure, no ground and pound or anything." But I just lost 'cause I'm on my back.

Joe Rogan 3:29 Right.

Belal Muhammad 3:30 And I figured that's their mentality. They don't wanna lose any round in practice. They don't wanna lose, uh, any minute in grappling. If they get taken down, they're popping right back up. It's not, "Let me get taken down. Let me play on my back a little bit. Let me flow a little bit like that." No.

Joe Rogan 3:41 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 3:42 It's rough, hard, hard, hard, hard, hard. And I think that's what transfers their mentality into the, the, the cage when there's no, there's no, "Let me warm up here." It's like right into it. Khabib goes in there, he grabs you, he holds you down. You don't, you never felt it before 'cause his strength is another level, and that's why I feel like a lot of these guys break once they feel it.

Joe Rogan 4:02 I would be really interested to see... I mean, the b- the best guy off his back arguably in the lightweight division is Oliveira. And Oliveira really couldn't do anything with Islam. I mean, he really, he, he gave, you know, some difficulties. He made it, he got into the second round. It was like, it was work. But he didn't really threaten, you know. Where he threatens everybody off his back. That's the thing about Oliveira is like he'll catch you on the feet and he'll trade with you on the feet 'cause if you drop him, he'll, like gladly goes to his back to invite you into his guard.

Belal Muhammad 4:35 Yeah, and-

Joe Rogan 4:35 But with Islam, he couldn't do a damn thing.

Belal Muhammad 4:38 Yeah, a lot of those guys before Islam were afraid to go to the ground with him.

Joe Rogan 4:41 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 4:42 Like Gaethje dropped him a couple times.

Joe Rogan 4:43 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 4:43 Chandler dropped him and like they stood up 'cause you're, you got, you had that fear.

Joe Rogan 4:47 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 4:47 With Islam it was like, "I don't care. He's gonna feel what it is on the ground."

Joe Rogan 4:50 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 4:50 Like they always say, "Sambo is better than jujitsu." And he just has that mentality like, "I wanna beat you at your own game." And the way he tapped him out from half guard-

Joe Rogan 4:59 Ah.

Belal Muhammad 4:59 ... with that arm triangle. I'm like, "Nobody's ever treated Oliveira like that."

Joe Rogan 5:02 Well, that squeeze must be another level.

Belal Muhammad 5:03 (laughs) Yeah, I was rolling with... Like, I would roll with him and that first week he's catching me with like an anaconda choke every time I'm going with him and it's just squeezing, squeezing. I'm like tapping. And then Islam's nice, so like he'll sh- tell you like, "You need to do it. You need to do it this way." And he'll show me the technique with it. When Khabib's on top of you, he's like breaking me at every single point and I'm asking him for a... "No, brother, you just gotta keep going." And I was like, "All right, cool." Uh, so the next time he does it, he's just on top of me again. He's like mounting me, then I'm turning giving him my back and then he's like just laughing as he's talking to the guys outside of the cage as he's on top of me. And I'm feeling like disrespected-

Joe Rogan 5:37 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 5:37 But like this is all Khabib. But like at least like Islam he'll be like, "Brother, do this way, do this."

Joe Rogan 5:43 Right.

Belal Muhammad 5:43 "This is the way you get out of it." So by the-

Joe Rogan 5:44 He's giving you some tips.

Belal Muhammad 5:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 5:46 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 5:46 So by the third week he wasn't catching me with it anymore, but his squeeze is just a no- a different type of squeeze.

Joe Rogan 5:51 They have a very, very disciplined camp, right? Like you, you have to have your hair cut a certain way. Like y- you can't be fucking around showing up with blue mohawks or nothing crazy.

Belal Muhammad 6:01 (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 6:01 Like it's very disciplined, right?

Belal Muhammad 6:03 Yeah, I think that's one of the, the reasons why they're all successful. I feel like...When Khabib walks into the room, it's, it's like an army. We all get up, we all stand in line. He'll stand in line, he'll point to who's sparring hard in the cage, because it's a different type of sparring too, where normally for us we have a sparring day in Chicago, or most teams I've trained at will have a sparring day like Monday or Wednesday, uh, whereas ev- for them, they're doing everything every day. It's small glove sparring every day, then right after that you're taking off the gloves and you're grappling every day. Then right after that, you're going in the cage and you're wrestling on the cage every single day.

Joe Rogan 6:35 Small glove sparring every day?

Belal Muhammad 6:37 But it's, it's light. So it's, uh, where-

Joe Rogan 6:39 Sorry.

Belal Muhammad 6:39 ... where it's, you don't want to knock, you're not trying to knock each other out.

Joe Rogan 6:43 Right.

Belal Muhammad 6:43 But then if he points to you that you're going to be hard sparring, hard sparring, then you're going in the cage with big gloves on.

Joe Rogan 6:48 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 6:48 And those guys are going, were going hard and he's cornering and then Javier Mendez is in there cornering, so it's, you're getting that real fight feel.

Joe Rogan 6:55 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 6:55 For me, I was down there with him for five weeks, so Khabib would corner his guy and my coach Lewis Taylor was down there with me with, uh, in Dubai, and he would corner me. So it was like, it's a real fight feel. The guys outside of the cage will sit there peeking. So you get those little nerves-

Joe Rogan 7:10 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 7:10 ... that you would get, uh, in a fight. And I'm sparring with somebody, his cousin Abubakar, who's, uh, also in the UFC welterweight, you're sparring with somebody you're really not used to. So you also still have that, that tension that you feel like, "I don't know what this guy's gonna do. He's not one of my normal training partners where I know, well, he got a good left kick or he got a good-"

Joe Rogan 7:27 Right.

Belal Muhammad 7:28 "... cross. I know what he's gonna bring to the table." It's like, no, it's a real fight feel every single time, because I don't know what he's gonna bring to the table. He doesn't know what I'm gonna bring to the table. And we have two corners cornering each other in there. So-

Joe Rogan 7:40 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 7:40 ... when it's your hard sparring, you're in the cage. When it's not hard sparring, you're outside of the cage, you're doing a little bit of technique, then it's light sparring goes.

Joe Rogan 7:48 So was this, uh, camp going there and training there for five weeks, is that, uh, just a big change in the way you look at things and like a, an eye-opening experience?

Belal Muhammad 7:57 Yeah, because, you know, I'm a guy that I like to cross train a lot. I'll, I'll, I'll go to a bunch of different gyms. I've been to Sanford MMA, I've been to Fortis, uh, I've been to Canada before to train with Fraz Khabib. And I want to get, bring that knowledge back to my team and back to my coaches and be like, "Yo, these teams are successful, this is what they're doing. This is what we gotta start doing too," because we're a small gym in Chicago and, you know, we have a, we had a real champion, Juliana Pena with us, but still, you have to keep evolving. You have to keep trying to do what the best teams are doing and seeing how their team is, how disciplined they are. It's like none of the guys are gonna show up late to practice. You're not gonna show up late and smile and laugh. It's like once he lines everybody up, you better sprint there in that line because he's gonna tell you what your duties are for that day.

Joe Rogan 8:39 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 8:40 And then when it's grappling, every single one of those guys is an amazing grappler. There's guys in there that you don't even know their name. They're still young, 19 years old, 18 years old, uh, they're just starting, but they still had the same type of grappling as Khabib. They still feel super strong and I'm like, "Who the heck is this guy?" So I'll look up his name and I'll be like, oh, 12-0, 15-0, 16-0.

Joe Rogan 9:00 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 9:00 And the whole team is full of killers. But I just want to bring their mentality, I think, is a different type of mentality that a lot of gyms don't have of being more disciplined. And I think that comes from being Muslim, I think a lot of it comes from that is, is just be- being religious. You're, you're bringing a different type of discipline where you have to pray five times a day and every single one of the guys is doing that. None of their guys are drinking, none of their guys are going out and partying.

Joe Rogan 9:23 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 9:24 If there's guys that come to practice and they look a little bit tired, Khabib will take their phone away from them and he won't give it to 'em until the next day, tomorrow morning. So, he'll take their phone at night, 9:00 PM and then you have to go to sleep, get a good night's sleep, and then next practice he'll give you your phone back because you're probably on your phone all night playing games or something stupid.

Joe Rogan 9:41 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 9:41 And he'll, like, he pays attention to those things and the fact that he wants you to win that bad, 'cause he doesn't need to be there, he doesn't need to give you the knowledge, he doesn't need to care that much about you if you don't care about yourself. But it just shows you like how much of a, uh, a great person he is too and it just makes you want to work that much harder for him.

Joe Rogan 9:59 Well, just being around someone who is, if he's not the GOAT, I mean, uh, is there a GOAT? I don't know. It, it might be Mighty Mouse, it might be Jon Jones. It could be Khabib. Uh, it's, it's in the con-... There's a conversation to be had for many fighters when they're in their, their prime. Like, but Khabib's the first one to really retire completely undefeated. Where you, you can make the argument that even the rounds he lost, if he lost like one round against Conor and maybe one round at another point in his career, they were barely.

Belal Muhammad 10:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:28 Barely. They were like coasting rounds where he just like, was refreshing himself and then comes back and dominates.

Belal Muhammad 10:34 Yeah, I mean-

Joe Rogan 10:34 You know, so if you're training with a guy like that, like fuck, man.

Belal Muhammad 10:38 Yeah, and I think that that's a big thing too is, you know, one, one time we were training in Vegas and I have a, uh, a Moroccan kickboxer that I train with and we were down there training with Khabib's team and he's sparring one of their guys. And you know, he's a great kickboxer and their guy's obviously a, a great grappler, but he has striking. So the first round he's taking my guy down, beating him on the ground. And the second and third round he's like, "Let me strike with him a little bit 'cause the ground is kind of like too easy." So he's striking with him. My guy's landing hard kicks, hard punches, hard knees, and then Khabib just like stops him and like snaps at him, like, "You took him down, you treated him like a baby. Like why are you gonna sit there and kickbox with a kickboxer? I don't care if this is practice, I don't care if this is sparring. The goal is to win. If you want to look stupid, you want to be dumb, then go against the plan, go against the route that's gonna help you win." He's like, and that like opened your eyes too. It's like he knows the path to victory.

Joe Rogan 11:27 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 11:27 All the guys know the path to victory. It's, it's hard grappling, heavy grappling and strength on the ground. It's like, why are you gonna be dumb and spar with the Moroccan kickboxer for, and-

Joe Rogan 11:36 Ego.

Belal Muhammad 11:36 ... take that damage? Yeah, ego.

Joe Rogan 11:37 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 11:38 And-

Joe Rogan 11:38 Ego is a motherfucker (laughs) .

Belal Muhammad 11:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 11:40 It really is. So many guys just decide to trade with people for no reason and they wind up getting lit up when they really should be taking the guy down.

Belal Muhammad 11:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 11:48 You know?

Belal Muhammad 11:48 I feel like that's what a lot of these newer guys coming up... Um, I was training with, uh, Ohio State wrestler. He was in Vegas visiting and he was like gonna transition into MMA and he was telling me like, "Yeah, you know, I like this gym, but, uh, the, uh, and you know, in wrestling I'm killing the guys, but then I don't know nothing about sparring." So on sparring day, I'm telling these guys like, "You know, it's, I'm still learning." And then d- he said, "Everybody's trying to throw hard at me because I'm killing them in wrestling." And I'm like, "You gotta find a gym where the guys don't have egos where-"

Joe Rogan 12:14 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 12:14 "... they're gonna try to help you build yourself 'cause if you're sparring hard and you don't really know how to take a punch or anything, you're only gonna hurt yourself."

Joe Rogan 12:20 Right, and you're gonna get your ticket punched too many times. And then by the time-

Belal Muhammad 12:24 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 12:24 ... you get into fights, I mean, there's quite a few guys that I know that by the time they have their first or second pro fight, they've already had six, seven concussions in the gym, you know?

Belal Muhammad 12:32 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 12:32 And like, man, like you're already at a deficit.

Belal Muhammad 12:34 Yeah, I look at-

Joe Rogan 12:35 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 12:36 ... when I go to gyms and I see a guy, like they're laughing about it. Like, "Oh, I gave... I knocked Chris out yesterday, man." And I'm, I'm looking at it like, w- like, "Why? Is that what you guys do?" And it's, it changes my mentality 'cause when I'm first coming up I used to like, we'll spar like 15-minute rounds, just non-stop boxing. And I'm, now when I think back to that, I'm like, "It was so stupid," because I know how to take a punch. Why am I gonna take a punch at practice-

Joe Rogan 13:00 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 13:01 ... when I'm not getting paid for it? Like build the skills.

Joe Rogan 13:04 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 13:04 And if you find the right training partners, and I feel like I have like the perfect training partners where we spar super light and we're still getting that same movement, that same fluidity with the striking, with the speed, with everything, but we're not putting an extra oomph on it. And if you can't, if you don't have any guys like that in your gym, I think a lot of these guys are gonna have shorter careers or they're gonna get broken a lot earlier than they should have.

Joe Rogan 13:26 It makes a big difference with timing too. Like, you, you really develop timing when you can get a guy who's willing to spar light with you, because then you're not thinking about the consequences of missing or getting countered and you could really just develop that ingrained timing. And occasionally hard sparring.

Belal Muhammad 13:42 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 13:42 But hard sparring all the time, I mean, the early days of the UFC guys would just fight. They would go into the ring in, in, in their, their, whatever their gym was, and they would beat the fucking shit out of each other. And somewhere along the line people realized like, hey, this is, you can only sustain this for so long. You're not gonna have a long career doing this, and you're not gonna reach the best of your potential. Like when you look at all the variables that take place in a person reaching their full potential, I think one of the things you're doing that's really good is going to different places. I think that has a big factor, that, that make, that's a big factor. And being exposed yourself to the guys like Firas Alhabib or Khabib, or all these other different minds that can give you a different approach and you could take a little bit here and a little bit there. But also it's like being smart in your training and knowing when, when to push and when not, when you're being a bitch and when you're actually being a meathead, 'cause you're just going too hard and you're fucking your body up.

Belal Muhammad 14:37 Yeah. And a lot of guys had to learn that the hard way-

Joe Rogan 14:41 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 14:41 ... where it takes them like, "Oh, I had a..." You know, when you're coming up, you're fighting for pennies. You're not, you're not fighting for anything. I'm, I used to fight for $150 and I would tell my family, "No, I'm making like 15,000."

Joe Rogan 14:52 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 14:52 And yeah, like I would sit there and lie to them. But it's 'cause you ha- you had that dream, you had that push.

Joe Rogan 14:57 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 14:57 And you, and I had that end goal where I knew I, I was gonna make it, or I, I felt like I could have made it. So when I, I had, you gotta have, I think, leaders in the gym room that are gonna teach you the right things.

Joe Rogan 15:08 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 15:08 Because if you have those guys, and those bigger gyms I feel like there's so many UFC fighters in there, 20, 30, 40 guys. Yeah, it's great training partners, great things. But if it's a guy like trying to come up, on the come up-

Joe Rogan 15:19 Right.

Belal Muhammad 15:19 ... or anything like that, they're gonna use you as a body for them.

Joe Rogan 15:22 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 15:22 And they're gonna beat you up. And who are you gonna talk to? You're gonna talk to the coach, but the coach will be like, "Well, this guy pays me more, so I'm gonna stick with him. So you just go in there and give him some rounds. Keep it quiet, like nobody, nobody really cares what you have to say." So I think smaller gyms is, are better for that. And for me, I had, uh, my coach Louis Taylor, he was a fighter and when I, when he, when I came in, I was 23 years old when I first started fighting. And he was already a veteran in the game. He was in it, so like he... I was following in his footsteps and he was teaching me all the small things. "Don't go to that boxing gym. What are you going to go to that boxing gym for? They're... Boxers hate MMA fighters. They're gonna just try to knock you out." And, you know, I, I would sit there, go on my own a little bit. You're like, "You know, let me just see how it is," 'cause it's ego. Then you go over there and they're just trying to knock you out and it's like, what did I gain from that? It's just...

Joe Rogan 16:08 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 16:09 It's hard sparring, but it was like I didn't really gain any skill level. I gained toughness, but it's not really gonna help me win. I need better footwork, I need better defense, I need better this. I was still on the come up learning, so just getting beat up is not gonna help me.

Joe Rogan 16:22 Yeah, the small gym versus the large gym, that's the big debate, 'cause some people think a place like American Top Team, they have dormitories. You got all these guys coming in from Russia and, and Morocco and all these, all these places, all parts of the world, they're coming to American Top Team. And, you know, you might get some sparring with some fucking killers, but how many coaches are really paying attention to you when you're just a guy who just started out there? Is this a good place to develop? Are you running the risk of being injured because you're just going to war every day, versus a small gym where you get individualized attention and people are really paying attention to you? But then it's like, which small gym? Like every small gym is different. Some small gyms are really good.

Belal Muhammad 17:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:02 Some small gyms the guys are on point, they have a deep well of knowledge and they can really coach you. Some small gyms, the guy's kind of out of his league and, you know, he's bringing guys to the UFC and giving them shitty... I mean, you've, you see guys in the corner-

Belal Muhammad 17:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:15 ... give shit advice. And you're hearing this guy like, he's not giving any technical advice at all. This dude is like, he's doing things, he's making mistakes and he's not getting any coaching. He's getting like, "Go out there and fucking win. Go out there and kick his ass." You're like, "What?" He doesn't-

Belal Muhammad 17:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:28 Don't you think he already knows that? He knows that already. So that's a bad small gym, you know.

Belal Muhammad 17:32 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:33 It's, it's really finding the right pla- and finding the right place is so crucial. It's so crucial. And finding the right training partner is so crucial.

Belal Muhammad 17:40 Yeah, I think the key, honestly, is training partner is you have to have the right guys that-

Joe Rogan 17:44 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 17:44 ... really care for you, 'cause I've been at gyms where guys really don't care if you win or lose.

Joe Rogan 17:48 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 17:49 But if you have that family feel where they're gonna be in the gym for you no matter what, and they're gonna push for you and they're gonna watch your opponent and give you that opponent's look... Like in bigger gyms if I'm a UFC fighter and you're a UFC fighter, you're telling me I'm fighting Wonderboy. And, and in my smaller gym I had every single one of my five guys that I've trained with, all of them try to give me that Wonderboy look. They're all paying attention to what he does. "Hey, I think he does this extra." In a bigger gym they're like, "I'm not a karate guy. I'm gonna give you what I got."

Joe Rogan 18:13 Right, right, right.

Belal Muhammad 18:14 He's like, "You want this or not? Uh, I, I gotta get paid too, uh, unless you're gonna pay me for it." But that's what I love about the smaller gyms is 'cause I fought Demian Maia. I didn't have one black belt in my, uh, gym. I didn't have one black belt that was helping me push or grapple. So I had the mi- mindset of I have great wrestlers that I'm training with. Every single one of my guys is a great wrestler, so I will... Let's just not hit the ground. Let's just push my, push my wrestling so hard that he's gonna tire himself out trying to take me down. So I don't have to overthink it, the situation. When I fought Wonderboy-I was, I'd been at camp with Anthony Pettis when he fought Wonderboy, I'd been at camp with Woodley when he fought Wonderboy. And Woodley brought in ...

Joe Rogan 18:51 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 18:51 ... say he's northcut. Anthony Pettis, uh, was using Mike ... your roads, and they have that karate style.

Joe Rogan 18:56 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 18:56 But for me, I was, uh, then I asked Anthony, like, "So, you think I should bring somebody in?" He's like, "Honestly, just watch this tape." It was, uh, I forgot who it was. It was a kickboxer that fought, uh, uh, Raymond Daniels-

Joe Rogan 19:07 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 19:07 ... and he like, lit him up. And he's like, "Watch this."

Joe Rogan 19:09 Nicky Holzken.

Belal Muhammad 19:10 Uh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 19:11 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 19:11 And he was like, "Watch, watch this." And he like, lit him up. And he's like, "Just follow that routine," 'cause, uh-

Joe Rogan 19:16 Or it was Valtellini. It might've been Valtellini.

Belal Muhammad 19:18 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 19:19 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 19:19 I think it was Valtellini.

Joe Rogan 19:20 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 19:20 Yeah, 'cause he, he showed me the tape and I was watching that. I was just re-watching it of, just the pressure he gave and everything like that.

Joe Rogan 19:25 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 19:25 And I just wanted to mimic that 'cause he's like, "Yeah, I had a karate style guy, but Wonderboy's different, man. His, his kicks are a lot snappier than you think. His spinning kick is a lot snappier than you think. His angles are a lot different." So he said, "Don't try to overthink mimicking him. Just stick with what you got and do what you're good at."

Joe Rogan 19:41 Was he the most puzzling guy that you fought?

Belal Muhammad 19:43 Yeah, I think so. I, like, I never even wanted that fight. I was-

Joe Rogan 19:46 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 19:46 ... I was telling, I was telling my manager, I was like, "Bro, give me Chimaev."

Joe Rogan 19:49 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 19:49 I was like, I was like, because also just that Wonderboy is a guy you can't hate. Like-

Joe Rogan 19:56 Right.

Belal Muhammad 19:56 ... I always love watching Wonderboy fight.

Joe Rogan 19:57 Right.

Belal Muhammad 19:57 He's the nicest guy in the world.

Joe Rogan 19:58 The nicest guy in the world.

Belal Muhammad 19:59 Yeah, and you gotta find a reason to hit him and-

Joe Rogan 20:01 Right.

Belal Muhammad 20:02 ... and dislike him. Um, and just like, his highlight reel. And I'm looking at it, and like I said, I was in two camps watching these guys, and they're telling me like, "He's nothing like these other guys." He's like, "Kicks are snappier," he goes, "It hurts so much," and you're seeing him and I'm like, "Man, I do not wanna be on his highlight reel. I do not wanna get hit with a spinning heel kick."

Joe Rogan 20:18 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 20:18 And he was coming off of a loss, and I feel like guys coming off of won losses, their mentality is different. They're that, they're that much hungrier-

Joe Rogan 20:25 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 20:25 ... where they wanna get it right back, so-

Joe Rogan 20:27 I was so impressed with him in Kevin Holland fight. That Kevin Holland fight was amazing.

Belal Muhammad 20:31 Yeah, but mentality, like I said-

Joe Rogan 20:33 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 20:34 ... Kevin Holland, I'm like, "Bro, you took him to the ground."

Joe Rogan 20:36 Right. Why?

Belal Muhammad 20:36 Why you gotta stand up for ego?

Joe Rogan 20:37 They made an agreement, apparently-

Belal Muhammad 20:39 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 20:39 ... to not go to the ground. Like, Kevin, you're a black belt in jujitsu. And you're, you're like, in the top 10 of the division. Like, what are you doing, man? Like, you, you really could be a contender, a top contender.

Belal Muhammad 20:53 Literally, and beating a guy like Wonderboy, that name value right there-

Joe Rogan 20:57 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 20:57 ... the UFC already wants to push you. You have, you're, you know, you have a good push be- behind you with Holland-

Joe Rogan 21:01 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:01 ... so I'm like, "You beat Wonderboy, you could probably be right there in the next line for the title shot."

Joe Rogan 21:06 Actually, I don't know if he's top 10 at welterweight. Like, but, the, the fight was supposedly scheduled at, that was a welterweight fight, right?

Belal Muhammad 21:13 Yeah, that was a welterweight. But Wonderboy-

Joe Rogan 21:15 And then-

Belal Muhammad 21:15 ... was ranked top 10, so he would-

Joe Rogan 21:16 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:16 ... probably take his number if he beat him.

Joe Rogan 21:17 Yeah. That fight was crazy because I just, I, I just couldn't imagine why he wouldn't wanna vary his approach when you're fighting with a 57 and 0 kickboxer.

Belal Muhammad 21:30 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 21:31 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 21:31 Bro, I had so many people messaging me after my fight with him, like, "Bro, you were ... all you did was hump him. All you did was ..."

Joe Rogan 21:36 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:36 I was like, "Bro, he's 57 and 0 kickboxer."

Joe Rogan 21:39 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:39 And then after the fight-

Joe Rogan 21:40 Good job. (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 21:41 Yeah, they were like, "L- l- uh, he's old, he's this, he's this." And I'm like, "Whoa, look it, he b- he beat, uh, Holland and striking," so I guess he's still got some fight left in him, huh? Like ...

Joe Rogan 21:50 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:50 He's not done.

Joe Rogan 21:51 He ain't that old.

Belal Muhammad 21:51 I'm like-

Joe Rogan 21:51 He's not that old.

Belal Muhammad 21:52 And he doesn't take a lot of damage-

Joe Rogan 21:54 No.

Belal Muhammad 21:54 ... himself. He's been knocked out once by Anthony-

Joe Rogan 21:56 By Pettis.

Belal Muhammad 21:56 ... Pettis.

Joe Rogan 21:56 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 21:56 But that was it.

Joe Rogan 21:57 Well, he got dropped really bad by Woodley. Tyron hurt him bad. And, you know, it was, that was, that's the way you have to fight him if you're a guy like Tyron. Like, everybody's like, "That fight was boring." Like, yeah, that's smart.

Belal Muhammad 22:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:09 You have to fight him smart. You can't just charge at that dude. You're crazy. He's so good at countering and he moves like a snake.

Belal Muhammad 22:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:15 Like he moves back and forth like a snake, the way he pops back and then pops back in.

Belal Muhammad 22:20 When he's beating guys like Luque and he's beating Jeff Neal-

Joe Rogan 22:23 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 22:23 ... and he's like making 'em look like amateurs-

Joe Rogan 22:25 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 22:25 ... 'cause they all wanted to play that, "Let me, oh, you want, I'm gonna strike with you. I'm gonna strike with you."

Joe Rogan 22:28 Right.

Belal Muhammad 22:28 Doing that game and you can't beat him at that game. There's-

Joe Rogan 22:31 But that karate stance is so different, everything, his movement-

Belal Muhammad 22:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 22:35 ... I mean, his, his sideways stance and then attacking you with that front leg, everything's different.

Belal Muhammad 22:40 It's, and it's from a ... it's, like, so sophisticated. Like, we can-

Joe Rogan 22:43 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 22:43 ... hit you with this and he'll bring it over the top. And he, like, when I first came out, he threw one spinning heel kick at me and I was like, "All right, I'm shooting. I'm not-"

Joe Rogan 22:49 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 22:49 I was like, "I'm not gonna play this game." I'm like ... And then when I took him down, that just started giving me, building the confidence, building-

Joe Rogan 22:55 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 22:55 ... the confidence, building the confidence. It was like, "All right, well, my wrestling is up there." Where people beforehand were like, h- uh, "Joni Hendricks couldn't take him down. Joni Hendricks, the national champion. Woodley d- uh, couldn't take him down." And I was like-

Joe Rogan 23:07 Joni Hendricks, when he fought Wonderboy, was on the slide.

Belal Muhammad 23:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:11 The, like, there was a big slide with Joni Hendricks. It was Joni Hendricks versus GSP, who was a motherfucker. There was the Joni Hendricks that knocked out Jon Fitch and Marvin Campman, uh, Martin Campman. Like, that Joni Hendricks was a bad motherfucker. He was a beast. But by the time Joni Hendricks got to, like, Paulo Costa-

Belal Muhammad 23:31 Oh.

Joe Rogan 23:32 ... that Joni Hendricks was done.

Belal Muhammad 23:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 23:34 He was done. I don't know what was going on in his personal life. I don't know how hard he was training. I don't know if USADA got to him. I don't know what happened, but he was not the same guy.

Belal Muhammad 23:43 Yeah, he's one of the main guys where the USADA comes in and they're like, "Do you remember he used to-"

Joe Rogan 23:47 How do you fall off that much? Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 23:48 "... knock guys senseless?"

Joe Rogan 23:50 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 23:50 They would go flying.

Joe Rogan 23:51 That power, yeah.

Belal Muhammad 23:52 He would crack guys. Like, with Fitch, he cracked him and Fitch goes flying. Everybody goes flying. And then all of a sudden the power goes away.

Joe Rogan 23:58 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 23:59 It was wild.

Joe Rogan 24:00 Yeah, and then you're, you're thinking back to the GSP fight where it's like-

Belal Muhammad 24:03 Right.

Joe Rogan 24:03 ... how could somebody be that good-

Belal Muhammad 24:05 Right.

Joe Rogan 24:05 ... and, like, somebody who almost beat the GOAT, who a lot of people-

Belal Muhammad 24:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:08 ... say is the GOAT and all of a sudden you fall off that much. And it's only, like, two years, three years later.

Belal Muhammad 24:12 Right, real close to beating him.

Joe Rogan 24:14 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:14 Like, maybe you could've given it to him. Like, if it, I mean, that wouldn't have been the most egregious decision.

Joe Rogan 24:20 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:20 Yeah. Crosby would've for sure gave it to him.

Joe Rogan 24:22 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 24:23 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:23 Who, who knows? (laughs) He might've given George every round. Who fucking knows?

Belal Muhammad 24:27 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 24:28 Yeah, man. There's some bad judging, right? There's so, some of those fights we're like, "What in the fuck are you guys watching?"

Belal Muhammad 24:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:35 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:35 Thinking back-

Joe Rogan 24:35 But-

Belal Muhammad 24:35 ... to the Petty fight. I'm like-

Joe Rogan 24:37 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:37 ... we're get, we're in-

Joe Rogan 24:38 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:38 I'm getting tagged in all the videos with you. And we were like, we were looking at each other.

Joe Rogan 24:42 We're both looking at each other. I said to you-

Belal Muhammad 24:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:43 ... right before I go, "He got it." I go, "Jarred got him."

Belal Muhammad 24:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 24:46 And we both agreed. And then I looked at you like, "What the fuck?" That didn't make any sense. I thought it was two to one.

Belal Muhammad 24:52 Yeah, for sure. And then I'm re-watching it. I'm like, I'll go back-

Joe Rogan 24:54 Yeah, we watched it.

Belal Muhammad 24:55 ... I'm re-watching and I'm sitting there like-

Joe Rogan 24:56 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:56 ... I still give it to Jarred. And it's like-

Joe Rogan 24:58 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 24:58 ... no bias in- involved. Obviously, there may be, but I'm like-

Joe Rogan 25:02 But just objectively-

Belal Muhammad 25:03 ... the stats.

Joe Rogan 25:03 Yeah, like, just stats.

Belal Muhammad 25:03 You're looking at the stats. Tw- he out-struck him 21 to, like, 16 in the first round, and he took him down, and all the judges gave Still the first round to Paddy, and I'm like-

Joe Rogan 25:11 It didn't make any sense.

Belal Muhammad 25:12 ... "How?"

Joe Rogan 25:12 And he caught him clean with that left hook. He was landing that left hook on a regular basis.

Belal Muhammad 25:16 All day, yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:17 Very clean.

Belal Muhammad 25:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:18 Yeah, that, he got fucked, and that's unfortunate. You know, I don't like when someone gets by just because they're famous, and they have this big personality, and, and everybody loves them. The problem with that is people are gonna be rooting against him now in the next fight.

Belal Muhammad 25:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:31 And so now he's gonna go in there against someone, and maybe he's gonna go in against someone who's on another level, like one more level up and he's gonna be in trouble.

Belal Muhammad 25:39 Yeah. And for a guy like him, I just don't think that he really wants it that bad. If you're going out of camp and you're getting up to 200 pounds, 2- 210-

Joe Rogan 25:48 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 25:48 ... and you're getting that big, th- you're not in a training room. Uh, for me, I'm in the practice room all day. I don't care if I have a fight or not a fight, and it's just building skills in between fights. Him, I'm looking at it, I was watching the fight for Jared, uh, 'cause I knew I was gonna be in his corner, so I'm watching tape, and I'm like, "He's gonna be the same exact fighter. That left hook's gonna land all day." His coach, very smart, he was like, "That left hook, that left hook, that left hook."

Joe Rogan 26:09 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 26:10 And it landed the whole fight, because he didn't evolve from his second fight, his third fight, his first fight.

Joe Rogan 26:14 Because, yeah, someone said that too, that his fights are like fat camps.

Belal Muhammad 26:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:19 Yeah, that they're really not like training camps where you're going over skills as much as he's just... He's got very good skills-

Belal Muhammad 26:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:25 ... but now he's just trying to lose weight.

Belal Muhammad 26:27 Yeah, you just gotta lose it.

Joe Rogan 26:28 He gets so big. He gets so big, he has a big pie face.

Belal Muhammad 26:32 Brother. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 26:32 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 26:32 I mean, you can make a show about it-

Joe Rogan 26:34 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 26:34 ... and, like, play that whole game, like it's, like it's a fad for you. But, like, in general, it's not good for your health.

Joe Rogan 26:39 Right.

Belal Muhammad 26:39 And if you're training with that much extra weight on you, that's when little injuries happen.

Joe Rogan 26:43 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 26:43 And he's about, he's going into surgery now, so I'm wondering if that played a part into it.

Joe Rogan 26:47 What's he going to surgery for?

Belal Muhammad 26:48 I don't know. They said he's not gonna be on the March card because he had surgery, the London card.

Joe Rogan 26:51 Oh, no shit.

Belal Muhammad 26:52 Yeah, so they-

Joe Rogan 26:53 Let's just see what the Paddy Pimblett is getting surgery on. He's a fun dude, though, man. His fucking personality and the way he dances when he gets inside the octagon and everything, it's very fun, but... Sometimes... Ankle surgery.

Belal Muhammad 27:03 Oh.

Joe Rogan 27:04 But sometimes you can be more famous than you are good.

Belal Muhammad 27:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:09 And that's a real problem when you run up against a Justin Gaethje or some fucking assassin.

Belal Muhammad 27:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:15 You know?

Belal Muhammad 27:16 And, and that's what I feel like. He has to level up from Jared. So-

Joe Rogan 27:19 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 27:20 ... who... Leveling off from Jared, I think is probably, like, top 15.

Joe Rogan 27:23 Oh, he had a partial tear of his ligaments in his ankle.

Belal Muhammad 27:27 Or something-

Joe Rogan 27:27 Hmm.

Belal Muhammad 27:28 ... or something like that.

Joe Rogan 27:29 It says, "A grade two injury to the ankle. Rehabilitation. Pimblett's doctor disagreed with the UFC lightweight. Continues to deal with swelling and soreness more than a month removed from his most recent fight." I wonder if he looked into stem cells at all? Oh, well, who knows? Either way, he's getting surgery.

Belal Muhammad 27:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:45 It's... Well, you know, I hope he heals up. But I hope he realizes that... I mean, he's openly talked about having an eating disorder.

Belal Muhammad 27:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:54 You know, and some guys do get that when they cut a ton of weight, and it, it really fucks with them.

Belal Muhammad 27:58 And you always have that mentality, like when you're in camp and it's about to be, like, two or three weeks out and you feel so good 'cause you're eating healthy for-

Joe Rogan 28:06 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 28:06 ... six to eight weeks, and it f- like, your body feels good, your energy feels good. And I always tell myself, like, "After this fight, I'm not eating bad. I'm not gonna go on any bad binges or anything." But it's like, right after you win, you're like, "I don't care no more."

Joe Rogan 28:16 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 28:16 Like, "I'm eating whatever I want." And-

Joe Rogan 28:18 Yeah, you're like, "I'll make up for it."

Belal Muhammad 28:19 But it only has to be... For me, it's, I only gives myself a week. If you go past-

Joe Rogan 28:22 Oh, one week?

Belal Muhammad 28:23 Yeah, you go to two to three to four weeks and-

Joe Rogan 28:25 A week must be glorious, though.

Belal Muhammad 28:27 (sighs) Man, it's like heaven. I...

Joe Rogan 28:28 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 28:29 And especially if you're winning. If... And for me, I was like-

Joe Rogan 28:31 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 28:31 I was flying back from Dubai, uh, from Abu Dhabi, and I was like, "I'm upgrading to, uh, business class. I'm gonna do business class." I got me, like, a big bag of M&M's. I'm just sitting there front row. My brother-

Joe Rogan 28:42 Nice.

Belal Muhammad 28:42 ... was able to sneak up there with me, uh, in business class 'cause it was, like, empty seats and they, like, they never asked him. So he sat up there the whole time with me. So me, him, and my coach are just sitting up there.

Joe Rogan 28:50 Eating M&M's.

Belal Muhammad 28:50 "Yeah, oh, let me get some French toast. Let me get this."

Joe Rogan 28:52 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 28:52 So it was like, it was like the best ride ever.

Joe Rogan 28:54 What's your binge food, the one binge food that you like to go to after a fight?

Belal Muhammad 28:59 I love nachos.

Joe Rogan 29:00 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 29:00 Yeah. I'm a nacho guy. I'm chips and cheese, like when-

Joe Rogan 29:03 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 29:03 ... I'm in Vegas, one time I was on the same... Me and Anthony Pettis, we were, uh, training together and we both won that, an- a card together. And he comes up to me, he's like, "Hey, uh, we're gonna go to the, the club at," uh, I for- I don't know what even the name of the club was, and he was like, "All right, we're gonna get a table over there." And I was like, "Yeah, I'm gonna go get a Nacho Daddy. I'm gonna go get some nachos." And he was like, looked at me like I was such a loser.

Joe Rogan 29:23 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 29:23 And my coach, my coach is like, "Bro, you're such a lame." And I was like... 'Cause I don't drink or party or anything, but my family's always at all the fights with me, so my best time is celebrating with them, going to eat with them. So he's looking at me like, "You're a lame, man." And I was like, "Bro, let's go eat." And he's like, "All right, man, let's go. Let's go together." So, so it was fun.

Joe Rogan 29:39 Well, you're probably adding time to your career. By not drinking, you're probably adding time to your career.

Belal Muhammad 29:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:45 You know? It's like... Look, uh, drinking is fun. There's a reason why people like to do it. There's a reason why bars are everywhere. It's fun. But the reality is, it's fucking terrible for you. And if you're a professional athlete and you're in this world of professional athleticism that has very little room for error, which is what you're in. I mean, you're in the, the, the-

Belal Muhammad 30:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:06 ... the hardest fucking sport, I think, in the world. And y- if you can maximize your recovery and maximize your health and maximize your vitality by not drinking alcohol, I would s- you know, I would tell people to do it. I mean, maybe a glass of wine here and there, a little glass of whiskey.

Belal Muhammad 30:23 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:24 No big deal. But guys who get drunk, guys who, like, really like to party and drink, man, you are fucking chipping away at your health.

Belal Muhammad 30:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:31 There's no if, ands, or buts about it.

Belal Muhammad 30:33 Yeah, I mean, I know a lot of guys that do it, and then they'll come into the practice room on Monday, they're hungover or something.

Joe Rogan 30:38 Oh. Get beat up.

Belal Muhammad 30:38 You're not really getting as much out of the session.

Joe Rogan 30:41 No.

Belal Muhammad 30:41 And I tell them-

Joe Rogan 30:42 And you, you get hurt.

Belal Muhammad 30:42 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 30:43 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 30:43 And I've seen it happen to a lot of guys, and I tell them, like, "How bad do you want it? How serious do you want it?" These younger fighters.

Joe Rogan 30:48 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 30:48 And I tell them, like, "It's not an easy road." Everybody always asks me for advice, "Oh, how do you get to the UFC?" And I'm like, there's no, there's no, like, easy road to the UFC. There's some people that will skyrocket right in there, like you said, they're famous-

Joe Rogan 31:00 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 31:00 ... they got a, a following behind them and they're gonna blow up right away, or there's guys that have to inch their way in. And-

Joe Rogan 31:05 Guys like you that grind.

Belal Muhammad 31:07 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:07 You've ground... You've worked your way through contender after contender after contender.

Belal Muhammad 31:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:12 You've been grinding, dude.

Belal Muhammad 31:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:14 I appreciate that, though, man. That's a mentality that I really appreciate because it's hard to do. And no one has to tell you that. That's a har-... when you're not making these, uh, monumental leaps in terms of, like, public consciousness and being celebrated, you're steady up that fucking ladder. That's what you're doing. And that, to me, is some of the most impressive shit. Like, that Sean Brady fight, that was a big fight, man.

Belal Muhammad 31:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:38 That dude's a killer. He's a fucking killer, and you put it on him, man. You put it on him, and you pressured the shit out of him. That was a, that was a big fight. It was a big fight.

Belal Muhammad 31:47 Yeah, that was one of those fights where, obviously, I wanted to fight upward. I thought that I... I fought Luque, who was on a seven-fight winning streak, and he was number five in the world, and I beat him, and then I beat Wonderboy before that, who was number five. And then you're gonna offer me number eight, and I was sitting there like, "This doesn't make any sense." Like, Cham- Hamzat's still out there. Gilbert Burns is still out there. Give me those guys, and they just weren't pushing it, and they were like, "Well, we'll give you him. We'll give you Brady," and I was like, "Honestly, I don't care."

Joe Rogan 32:11 Why do you think they weren't? I mean, um, Gilbert... Who's Gilbert fighting this weekend?

Belal Muhammad 32:15 He's fighting Magny.

Joe Rogan 32:16 That's right. That's a good fight.

Belal Muhammad 32:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:18 But it's a good showcase for Gilbert in, in, in-

Belal Muhammad 32:20 In Brazil.

Joe Rogan 32:22 ... Brazil, you know?

Belal Muhammad 32:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:22 And not, not that Magny's an easy fight. He's a very good fighter. But it's like, neither one of those... Uh, uh, like, beating Magny is not gonna move him into a title shot.

Belal Muhammad 32:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:31 You know? 'Cause Magny hasn't, hasn't really won enough fights as of late to warrant that. But beating you would.

Belal Muhammad 32:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:39 You know? Like, if you beat him, that moves you closer. Like, y- it's like, that's a consequential fight.

Belal Muhammad 32:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 32:45 And sometimes they do consequential fights, and sometimes they do fights where they'll, like, give a guy a good opponent but give it to him in their hometown, and, you know, they have it set up so it's nice. They offer you a fight that makes sense financially and it looks good.

Belal Muhammad 32:59 Just to build you up in that area.

Joe Rogan 33:01 Yeah, yeah.

Belal Muhammad 33:01 But...

Joe Rogan 33:02 But for you, a, a Gilbert fight or, more, more importantly, a Hamzat fight. Hamzat, you versus Hamzat would be gigantic.

Belal Muhammad 33:09 Yeah, and that's... I didn't get why they were undoing that one. I was sitting there like, "I'm asking for it." There was a million guys-

Joe Rogan 33:14 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 33:14 He says, "Oh, this... These guys are all turning me down." I'm like, "I'm not asking for extra money. I'm not telling me I need to have this, this, and this."

Joe Rogan 33:20 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 33:21 I'm, I'm like, "Give me that fight." And I'm showing people... I'm texting my managers. They're like, "They don't wanna do it." And I was like-

Joe Rogan 33:26 Hamzat doesn't wanna do it, or the UFC doesn't wanna do it.

Belal Muhammad 33:27 No, the UFC didn't wanna do it, and I-

Joe Rogan 33:29 Why didn't they think about you?

Belal Muhammad 33:29 They were like, "Well, he's gonna do Nate Diaz," and I was like, h- like, "Why are you gonna do Nate Diaz instead of me?" It doesn't make... Obviously to build his name, whatever.

Joe Rogan 33:38 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 33:38 But I was like, "This has to be a joke." And then I was like, "Well, give me Gilbert," and they were like, "Well, Gilbert's gonna fight Masvidal." And then I was... They were like, "There's nobody else for you but Sean Brady." So then you're like, "All right, well, as long it's in Abu Dhabi." I always just wanted to fight in Abu Dhabi because the first time I fought there, it was... The crowd there was amazing. The people there were amazing. So I was like, "Just give me him. If you guys think that he could beat me, if you guys want to push him, he's 15-0, and everybody's hyping him up to be the strongest man in the world, and if he touches you, you fall," I was like, "Let's do it." And I felt like after beating him and just the way I beat him in that crowd, I thought, "For sure, I'm gonna get a Hamzat fight after that." But they still didn't do it.

Joe Rogan 34:16 Well, Hamzat's not scheduled to fight anybody, is he?

Belal Muhammad 34:18 No.

Joe Rogan 34:19 Yeah, so maybe that just...

Belal Muhammad 34:20 But now they're saying he could be going up to middleweight.

Joe Rogan 34:22 (groans)

Belal Muhammad 34:23 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:24 Well, the thing about the middleweight thing is, like, yeah, he could go up to middleweight, and he would be a, a top flight middleweight, but he has fought at welterweight. Could he make the weight though? Like, that was a big problem after that fight with Kevin Holland. Like, you know, w- what, why are you weighing so much? Like, why did you weigh eight pounds over? And he said that they stopped him. He could have made the weight. And it's like, you never know. Like, maybe they did stop him. Maybe they, maybe it was the commission, and they looked at him, and, you know, c- them, those commission guys, they don't cut weight.

Belal Muhammad 34:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:55 They don't know. You look like shit.

Belal Muhammad 34:57 Yeah, you're always gonna look like that.

Joe Rogan 34:58 You look like, you look like death.

Belal Muhammad 34:59 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 34:59 You look like death.

Belal Muhammad 35:01 Nobody's ever gonna be there smiling, cutting weight, and-

Joe Rogan 35:03 Nobody's gonna be like, "Oh, he's great. Is it eight pounds to go? Yeah, let him go." (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 35:07 Yeah, yeah (laughs) .

Joe Rogan 35:07 (laughs) Eight pounds is a lot of fucking weight, man.

Belal Muhammad 35:09 But, yeah, that's a lot.

Joe Rogan 35:10 That's a lot.

Belal Muhammad 35:11 And I... For me, I think it's just the mentality for that fight. It's like, you're fighting Nate Diaz. It's not like you have to do the extra running, the extra jogging-

Joe Rogan 35:17 Right, right, right.

Belal Muhammad 35:17 ... while you're in camp. It's not like somebody that's making me want to work harder. When I fought, uh, Wonderboy, I'm working twice as hard. I'm doing five practices, three practices a day, doing whatever I can do because I'm so afraid of what he could do to me.

Joe Rogan 35:30 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 35:30 Nate Diaz, you're like, pretty much, pretty sure you're gon- probably gonna beat him pretty easily in the first round if you're Hamzat. So I don't... I just think that his motivation factor wasn't there.

Joe Rogan 35:38 (slaps hand on thigh) That might be it. Maybe he didn't work hard enough.

Belal Muhammad 35:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:42 Or, you know, maybe he's-

Belal Muhammad 35:43 He's just fake.

Joe Rogan 35:44 It also could be he's getting close to the top of the food chain, and there's a lot of pressure involved in that, and sometimes when people have a lot of pressure, they self-sabotage. There's that possibility.

Belal Muhammad 35:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:55 You know, you really don't know. It's, it's so hard to tell. That's why experience is so important, and that's why your resume is very impressive, because you've fought so many top guys. You've been around for so long. Like, you're a proven entity.

Belal Muhammad 36:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:09 And with a guy like Hamzat, you go, "Okay, well, he looked real good up until that Gilbert Burns fight," and the Gilbert Burns fight was a fucking war.

Belal Muhammad 36:16 Pshh.

Joe Rogan 36:16 That was a war.

Belal Muhammad 36:17 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:17 But man showed he had, he could take it. Man showed he can bounce back from adversity. He gets dropped and still drives forward. He gets a take-down. I mean, he showed he's a dog. He showed he's a fucking mad dog. But how many times can you do that? How many different fighters? How many... Who's gonna figure you out? Who's gonna find your chin? Who's gonna catch you? Who's gonna get your number? Who's, who's gonna get it? We need to know. And then maybe he's thinking that after the Gilbert Burns fight. You have a fight like that where you're steamrolling everybody, you only get hit four times in your first (laughs) four fights.

Belal Muhammad 36:49 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 36:49 He was just ragdolling people, man.

Belal Muhammad 36:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:51 Runs through Li Jinglian, fucks up Gerald Meerschaert, fucks up everybody, right? And then all of a sudden he's getting tagged, and Gilbert's a savage. Gilbert is a bad motherfucker. And that dude was just throwing bombs at him and clipped him and hurt him and rocked him, and maybe he's thinking, like, you know, "Who knows, man?" You, you never know. So that's why being a proven entity is so important.

Belal Muhammad 37:13 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:13 When you get a guy like yourself that's just had so many tough fights against top contenders, like, then you could see what a guy's made of.

Belal Muhammad 37:21 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:22 You know?

Belal Muhammad 37:22 And-

Joe Rogan 37:22 That's why betting lines are hard.

Belal Muhammad 37:24 Yeah. A- but also with, uh, Hamzat where you're looking at that Kevin Holland fight, where he just came out so hard. I'm like-

Joe Rogan 37:30 Oh my God.

Belal Muhammad 37:31 ... I wish we would've seen the second round, 'cause-

Joe Rogan 37:33 Yes. How, what was gonna get-

Belal Muhammad 37:34 ... he was going for daunces, all this-

Joe Rogan 37:35 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 37:35 ... scrambling. I'm like, "Nobody could keep up that pace, I don't care-

Joe Rogan 37:38 Nobody.

Belal Muhammad 37:38 ... who you are." And for-

Joe Rogan 37:39 And what do ... How do you recover in the second?

Belal Muhammad 37:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:41 And you're not gonna do that for five rounds.

Belal Muhammad 37:43 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:43 If you do that for a five-round fight, man, and you don't get him in the first, you're fucked.

Belal Muhammad 37:47 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:48 You're really fucked.

Belal Muhammad 37:49 That fi- that extra two rounds, I tell people it's, it's a difference. And-

Joe Rogan 37:52 But, but meanwhile he was right.

Belal Muhammad 37:54 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:54 See, the thing is like, we can second guess him all day, but Hamzat was right. He knew he could do that.

Belal Muhammad 37:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:59 He knew he could do that, and he was right. He, he ragdolled the shit outta Kevin Holland. I was impressed. I mean, I was really impressed. When you see what he's capable of when he puts the fucking pedal to the gas and really just stomps it to the floor, like that motherfucker's scary.

Belal Muhammad 38:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 38:14 He's very good.

Belal Muhammad 38:15 But that's... Those type of fighters are the ones that, like, I wanna figure out. Those are the ones-

Joe Rogan 38:20 Right.

Belal Muhammad 38:20 ... that were ... Everybody's telling me I'm gonna get walked through. All right, let me figure him out. Colby Covington's another one where Dana White, "Oh, uh, if Usman wasn't here, Colby would be the champion." And I'm like, "I don't think so." Like, I, I think Colby sucks. I don't think that he's a- as good as everybody thinks he is.

Joe Rogan 38:34 You think he sucks?

Belal Muhammad 38:35 I think that f- compared to me, I think I'll be able to walk through him. I think that he-

Joe Rogan 38:39 Really?

Belal Muhammad 38:40 ... he's a lesser version of Sean Brady, I think. Because if you're looking at the guys he's fought, he's beaten Woodley coming off of two losses, he beat Masvidal coming off of two losses, Robbie Lawler coming off of two lo- He hasn't fought one of the guys that's in the top 10 right now. He's getting so much credit for losing close fights to Usman. Like, "You're ge- ... You're a good loser?" Is that what people are trying to say to him? I'm like, "Bro, why does he get all that credit for?" Because he ... him and Usman stood toe-to-toe with the other ... Neither one of them went for a take-down, neither one of them tried to shoot at each other. They were just two wrestlers kickboxing, so because he made it a close kickboxing match with a wrestler makes him that much of a, a monster, a pound-for-pound guy? I just don't think so.

Joe Rogan 39:19 Really interesting. I'd like to see that fight.

Belal Muhammad 39:22 Yeah, but-

Joe Rogan 39:22 What ... Do, does he have a scheduled fight, Colby?

Belal Muhammad 39:24 He doesn't have anything-

Joe Rogan 39:25 He does, yeah.

Belal Muhammad 39:25 ... yet. But he's been missing, like w- I, I keep asking, yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:28 Well, he got sucker punched by Masvidal, and apparently he really got hurt from that.

Belal Muhammad 39:31 Yeah, I mean-

Joe Rogan 39:32 You know?

Belal Muhammad 39:32 ... I think it's f- hurt for a court, but-

Joe Rogan 39:34 You think so?

Belal Muhammad 39:35 Yeah, 'cause I'm like, i-

Joe Rogan 39:36 I don't know. I know people who-

Belal Muhammad 39:37 You think bad, man?

Joe Rogan 39:38 ... know him, and they said he actually got hurt. Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 39:40 Like brain damage?

Joe Rogan 39:40 He was fucked up. He was fucked up for a while after that fight apparently, or after that punch. They should've called it a fight.

Belal Muhammad 39:44 Like nerves, or ... Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:46 I don't know. I'd be talking out of my ass-

Belal Muhammad 39:48 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:48 ... but my friend who knows him well said, "Dude, he got really fucked up from that punch," 'cause he didn't see it coming.

Belal Muhammad 39:53 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:54 And Jorge just ran up to him and sucker punched him in the face.

Belal Muhammad 39:57 But when you're at that ... when you're that person, like, you have to have security with you. I'm like, "All the trash talk you say, all the dumb stuff, all the people that wanna kill you," I'm sure-

Joe Rogan 40:04 Right.

Belal Muhammad 40:05 ... American Top Team, all them Brazilians you talk trash about, like, you don't think that somebody sees you on the street is gonna hurt you. And that's what I feel like a lot of these guys need to start realizing, is like, you could say whatever you want to build a fight, but when you're talking about a guy's family, his kids-

Joe Rogan 40:18 Yeah. Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 40:18 ... like, he deserved it. I, I know that it was a sucker punch, it was dirty on Masvidal's end. Like, be a street fighter, go street fight him in the streets. Hit him with something, uh, but don't hit him and, like, run off. But-

Joe Rogan 40:30 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 40:30 ... I thought he deserved it.

Joe Rogan 40:31 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 40:32 (laughs) And I ... Like, I'm never gonna kick a man when he's down-

Joe Rogan 40:35 Right.

Belal Muhammad 40:35 ... but, like, I'll always kick Colby Covington when he's down. I don't care about Colby Covington. Like-

Joe Rogan 40:38 That's hilarious.

Belal Muhammad 40:39 ... I've had hate for, uh, Sean Strickland. And I've called him out before, and I was at the fight when he fought, uh, Pereira, and Pereira, like, knocked him out.

Joe Rogan 40:46 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 40:47 And I, like, got ... Like, I got up to go to the bathroom, and now he's like, "Brother, stop. Don't go anywhere. Don't say anything to him." I was like, "Bro, I'm just going to the bathroom." Like, I hate him, but I wouldn't, like, laugh at somebody that they just got-

Joe Rogan 40:57 Right.

Belal Muhammad 40:57 ... knocked out. Like, I wouldn't go up to ... "Oh, you just got knocked out, LOL," or anything like that, because I know what it is to get knocked out in a cage. I know what it is to want it that bad and be that close to, uh, achieving something and you lose, fall flat on your face. So, I would never talk trash about anyone. But if it was Colby, I'd probably laugh and point and-

Joe Rogan 41:12 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 41:12 ... everything, and like, I don't care about Colby. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 41:14 So he's your number one dude that you hate.

Belal Muhammad 41:16 Y- yeah, Colby, yeah, like-

Joe Rogan 41:17 Well, that's a real possibility for you.

Belal Muhammad 41:19 If he comes back. Like, people are ... just don't know. I'll ask, "When is he fighting?" "Oh, he's not fighting for a year. He's gonna be ... He's not gonna be fighting for a while." And then I'm looking at it like ...

Joe Rogan 41:27 They say why?

Belal Muhammad 41:29 I'm assuming because he's claiming brain damage with the, the court case.

Joe Rogan 41:32 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 41:33 And I know, like, some lawyers, uh, like injury lawyers, and he's like, "Yeah, when somebody comes in claiming brain damage," like all I hear is cha-ching. Like, I know that I'm gonna get paid for it, because you could claim, like, future injuries or anything like that. Like-

Joe Rogan 41:46 Mm.

Belal Muhammad 41:46 ... stuff that's gonna happen in the future. So ... And the, the court can't do anything. Like, "Well, we'll wait 10 years before we let you get paid or anything." And if you're suing Masvidal, who's worth millions of dollars, and you're claiming brain damage and they see you take a fight, they're probably gonna be like-

Joe Rogan 41:59 Right.

Belal Muhammad 41:59 ... "How are you gonna take a fight if you have brain damage?"

Joe Rogan 42:00 That's a good point. And that's really interesting too, is, like, has there ever been a fighter that sued another fighter for a sucker punch?

Belal Muhammad 42:07 (coughs)

Joe Rogan 42:07 Has that ever happened?

Belal Muhammad 42:08 No, I don't think so.

Joe Rogan 42:09 I don't think so either. Not that I'm thinking about it. I don't think in the UFC it's ever happened before.

Belal Muhammad 42:13 And I feel like that should be, like, guy code. Like ...

Joe Rogan 42:15 Right.

Belal Muhammad 42:16 ... I'm not gonna call the cops or anything like that. Like, I'm not gonna sue you off of that. And for ... Especially for them two, 'cause they had a relationship before.

Joe Rogan 42:23 Right. They were-

Belal Muhammad 42:24 And so ...

Joe Rogan 42:24 ... roommates.

Belal Muhammad 42:24 Yeah, you were roommates for that long.

Joe Rogan 42:26 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 42:26 And you're gonna sit there and go to court and sue them like that? That's ... To me, that's soft. Like, I'm not gonna ... If it's, if it's ... If I'm Colby, I'm gonna get revenge. If I'm Colby, I'm gonna ... You already embarrassed him in the cage? All right, well, hire somebody on the street to jump Masvidal, right? Like-

Joe Rogan 42:39 Oh, boy.

Belal Muhammad 42:39 Do the same thing to him. But when you're getting to that level, it's like, it's three guys. And I ... Like, I'm not a guy that's gonna go to court or snitch or do anything like that. It just ... I just don't like that mentality.

Joe Rogan 42:49 Well, we'll see. We'll see what happens. 'Cause if he gets $1 million out of the settlement, you're like, "Well, okay."

Belal Muhammad 42:55 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 42:55 You know? I mean ...

Belal Muhammad 42:56 $1 million for chipped tooth, all right.

Joe Rogan 42:57 It might. Uh, I don't know. I mean, if he really can prove brain damage. If he can prove that something really went wrong. I mean, we don't know.

Belal Muhammad 43:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:06 I mean, his career might be over. Who fucking knows? I don't know.

Belal Muhammad 43:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:09 I don't know what happened to him. You know? It's like sometimes guys get hit and they're fucked up.

Belal Muhammad 43:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:14 You know, especially if you don't see it coming.

Belal Muhammad 43:16 And especially ... Like, we've seen it with guys that get knocked out and they've never been the same-

Joe Rogan 43:19 Yes.

Belal Muhammad 43:20 ... from it.

Joe Rogan 43:20 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 43:21 And you're like, "How the heck did this guy just change so much-"

Joe Rogan 43:23 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 43:24 ... off of that?" And you're like-... they took that much damage in a fight and you don't know which fight it's gonna be. And that's why I tell guys, "Don't spar hard 'cause you don't wanna lose those years, lose those, that toughness from your chin."

Joe Rogan 43:34 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 43:34 Because you can't, you can't gain muscles on your chin.

Joe Rogan 43:38 Right.

Belal Muhammad 43:38 And I think Tony Ferguson was a big one of that. Like, after that Gaethje fight, he was never the same. And it's, like, a prime example of, like, bro, people get hurt and something changes in their, their body or their mind or something.

Joe Rogan 43:50 That was, that was a beating, man. That was a beating, that Gaethje fight. Oof. That was a beating. And Tony caught him, caught him with a big uppercut early in the fight, remember?

Belal Muhammad 43:58 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:59 He had him rocked.

Belal Muhammad 44:00 Yeah. He had him at, at the edge.

Joe Rogan 44:00 But he just decided to stand and tra- And Gaethje, instead of loading up, he started ... Trevor Wittman in the corner told him, like, "Settle down. Don't fucking try to take his head off with every shot. Pick your shots. Be technical." And then he started tuning him up. And when he started tuning him up, th- at the end of it, it was like, it was bad. And when ... I believe it was Herb Dean. When Herb Dean stopped it, I was like, "Whew, good stoppage," 'cause this is not ... This is ugly.

Belal Muhammad 44:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:26 I mean, he was, like, moving away funny and I was like, "He's, he got too many shots, man."

Belal Muhammad 44:30 Some guys are just too tough for their own good.

Joe Rogan 44:32 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 44:32 And-

Joe Rogan 44:32 That's Tony. He's so tough.

Belal Muhammad 44:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:34 That motherfucker's so tough. But-

Belal Muhammad 44:36 And think back to those f- like, how you said he almost dropped him at the end of the first and you're-

Joe Rogan 44:40 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 44:40 Looking back at, um, Pereira and Edesteinyo, he almost dropped him-

Joe Rogan 44:43 Yes.

Belal Muhammad 44:43 ... at the beginning of the first. You're like, "How many of those fights are there-"

Joe Rogan 44:46 Right.

Belal Muhammad 44:46 ... where it's like, one more second-

Joe Rogan 44:47 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 44:47 ... this guy would've won and the whole thing would've changed?

Joe Rogan 44:49 Yeah, if Izzy caught him with that punch two minutes to go instead of two seconds to go, who fucking knows, man? He could've stopped him in the first round.

Belal Muhammad 44:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:58 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 44:58 That was right ... And it changes-

Joe Rogan 45:00 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 45:00 ... everything in the whole division.

Joe Rogan 45:01 Well, you know, Izzy almost stopped him in the second kickboxing fight they had, too.

Belal Muhammad 45:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:05 Or, uh, yeah, the second kickboxing fight. 'Cause in the second kickboxing fight, the first one, I thought Izzy should've won a decision. It was very close, but I thought Izzy should've won. And the second one, Izzy had him rocked. Like, he had him wobbling and then they came in and gave him a standing eight count.

Belal Muhammad 45:21 Yeah, I didn't even know-

Joe Rogan 45:22 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 45:22 ... that, that like ... And I, I felt like he should've j- let him drop first before giving him the standing eight count. Like-

Joe Rogan 45:26 Standing eight counts are weird.

Belal Muhammad 45:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:28 They're so weird. It's like, "You're in trouble, I'm gonna give you a break," versus, "You're in trouble" and then the guy stops you. Like-

Belal Muhammad 45:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:33 Why? I don't agree with standing eight counts, I don't understand it. But that's what's like, I think the sup- I think MMA rules are, are superior in that, like, there's no, like, you get dropped and you come back up, because of the fact that there's ground fighting and ground and pound. When someone gets hurt and the, it's, uh, someone can put that person away, that's the end of the fight. There's a thing that happens in boxing when a guy gets dropped where you're like, "One, two," and you get up and then no one's hitting you. And they brush your gloves off and they go, "Come to me," and there's all this time and you have time to, sort of, get your equilibrium back and move around. That's probably worse for you.

Belal Muhammad 46:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 46:12 It's probably worse for you.

Belal Muhammad 46:13 Unless you're Tyson Fury and you get dropped-

Joe Rogan 46:16 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 46:16 ... by Wilder and you get up and you're like, "How the heck did he come up so hard?"

Joe Rogan 46:19 Came up and won the r- remainder of the round.

Belal Muhammad 46:21 Yeah, but you're looking at that, too, and, uh, you ever seen those videos of, like, the guy, the ref counting and somebody's like, "Dude, it was, like, 20 seconds the ref's counting."

Joe Rogan 46:28 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 46:28 Because you go, "One, two," and it's like, what if it's, like, a bad ref who's, like, counting a lot faster?

Joe Rogan 46:33 That does happen.

Belal Muhammad 46:34 And it, it changes everything too.

Joe Rogan 46:35 That happened with Mike Tyson and Buster Douglas. When Tyson dropped Douglas, that was more than a ten count.

Belal Muhammad 46:40 Oh, really?

Joe Rogan 46:41 Yeah, yeah. You can go back. There's people who have, uh, taken that video and superimposed it with a camera that shows you an actually count of ten.

Belal Muhammad 46:48 Oh, wow.

Joe Rogan 46:48 Yeah, and it goes to, like, 11 or 12-

Belal Muhammad 46:50 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 46:50 ... before Buster Douglas actually gets up. Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 46:52 That's crazy.

Joe Rogan 46:53 Let's just ... Uh, when you got a, someone going like this, "One, two," like, you should have a fucking clock. Like, if this is ten seconds, there should be a giant digital clock, and the moment someone gets dropped, that clock goes and has nothing to do with the referee.

Belal Muhammad 47:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:09 The referee should be reading that shit off the clock. That's it.

Belal Muhammad 47:12 Yeah, I don't know why they don't do that. Like, just point to it.

Joe Rogan 47:14 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 47:14 All right, he's down.

Joe Rogan 47:15 Exactly.

Belal Muhammad 47:16 He's down.

Joe Rogan 47:16 Look at the clock. He got seven, eight. Like, it's on the clock. It sh-

Belal Muhammad 47:21 It does, it-

Joe Rogan 47:21 Because guys can do a slow count and they can do a quick count, too.

Belal Muhammad 47:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:25 Six, seven, eight, nine, ten. You're like, "Hey, hey, hey, that's not ten."

Belal Muhammad 47:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:29 "That was seven. That was seven seconds, bitch." Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 47:32 And then y- y- when you're looking at it, too, like you said, when it comes to famous guys or, like, if Paddy Pimblett was boxing-

Joe Rogan 47:37 Right.

Belal Muhammad 47:37 ... and the ref liked him more-

Joe Rogan 47:38 Right.

Belal Muhammad 47:38 ... am I gonna count faster for you? Like-

Joe Rogan 47:40 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 47:41 We're all humans, right? Like, we all-

Joe Rogan 47:42 There's a-

Belal Muhammad 47:42 ... like somebody more than another person, uh, regardless of what you say.

Joe Rogan 47:45 Did you see the video of Dana and, uh, I think it was Hunter Campbell, I don't f- I'm not who it w- sure who it was, celebrating when Paddy got the win?

Belal Muhammad 47:53 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:53 They were like-

Belal Muhammad 47:54 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:54 ... "Fuck yeah." I'm like, "Oh, no."

Belal Muhammad 47:56 Dude. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 47:57 No. You can't do that.

Belal Muhammad 47:59 For, for me, I, I hate, like, losing in general, and then i- it hurts me more when I'm like ... Jared's like my best friend, he's like my boy, so seeing him lose and ... 'Cause I know how hard he works. He's one of those-

Joe Rogan 48:08 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 48:08 ... guys where I know that he puts the real time in and he puts the real work in and his, like, life story is so crazy.

Joe Rogan 48:14 It is crazy.

Belal Muhammad 48:14 So it was like-

Joe Rogan 48:15 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 48:15 That was his moment. That was his moment to shine, you know? The cr- the whole crowd's booing him before the fight and they're all like, "He's the biggest."

Joe Rogan 48:20 That could've turned him into a star.

Belal Muhammad 48:21 Yeah, and I'm like, "That could've changed everything." So-

Joe Rogan 48:24 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 48:24 ... for it to be, like, snatched out of his hand because three stupid judges, like-

Joe Rogan 48:28 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 48:28 ... piss you off so much. I'm like ...

Joe Rogan 48:30 Yeah, most people did not agree with that decision. There's, and there's controversial decisions. Like, I went back and rewatched Jan Blachowicz, uh, A- Ankalaev. That's a very interesting decision 'cause, like, the first round you go, "Who won that fight? Who won that round?" Because the first round, Ankalaev was pushing the pace, but Jan Blachowicz landed some very good leg kicks. You know? And m- that motherfucker goes shin to shin with people.

Belal Muhammad 48:54 I'm looking at him, like, I w- I wanna see how he's walking afterward, because-

Joe Rogan 48:58 Jan walked fine. (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 48:59 (laughs) Yeah, I'm like, "What does he have?" Does, does ... I'm like, "What kind of bones?"

Joe Rogan 49:02 He's made out of metal, dude. Jan Blachowicz is made out of metal. But it makes sense if you think about the power that dude carries. Like-

Belal Muhammad 49:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:09 ... he must have some dense ass bones.

Belal Muhammad 49:11 Yeah, and I'm like-

Joe Rogan 49:12 You know?

Belal Muhammad 49:12 ... you never s- Like, Ankalaev, I've seen him training before and this-

Joe Rogan 49:15 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 49:15 ... dude's a monster everywhere. And then you're like, "Wait, so his weakness is his lower shin?" All right, so we have, we have the weakness now. Other guys are looking at it like, "I'm not gonna do that, though. I'm not gonna come out there low-kicking-

Joe Rogan 49:24 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 49:24 ... his lower shin," because ...

Joe Rogan 49:26 I just think Blachowicz has, like, ultimate...... confidence in his ability to ... if guys want to get in a firefight with him, he has ultimate confidence that he could blast them out.

Belal Muhammad 49:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:37 You know? And, and I think he just has unf- ultimate confidence in his durability too.

Belal Muhammad 49:42 Yeah, he's tough. He's kind of like a Glover, where both of them just have that, like, crazy just-

Joe Rogan 49:46 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 49:46 ... like, old power and old toughness.

Joe Rogan 49:48 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 49:48 And they just have the discipline of just keeping their hands up. A lot of it didn't ... Not that new fancy footwork or moving back-

Joe Rogan 49:54 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 49:54 ... or Matrix-style stuff. Like, they just keep it simple. Keep your hands up.

Joe Rogan 49:57 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 49:57 Go underneath, chuck it off.

Joe Rogan 49:59 Yeah. Glo- Glover, man. 42 years old, fighting for the title again.

Belal Muhammad 50:03 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:04 Again. Amazing. What do you think of that fight this weekend?

Belal Muhammad 50:08 I'm excited for it. I ... Glover's one of those guys where I felt like ... I felt bad for him, because, that, you know, I thought it was gonna be one of his last fights, for them to take the title fight away from him. Like, "Ah." And then, like, every time I see him at the PI, he's, like, the nicest guy, and I saw him there that weekend for the Ankalaev, uh, fight. And I was like, "Oh, man, that sucks, man. It should be you in there." And he's like, "It's all right, man. Nice guys like us, man, we, it'll come back to us later, man. It takes us the long road, 'cause we're both nice guys." And-

Joe Rogan 50:32 That's interesting.

Belal Muhammad 50:32 Yeah, he was like, "The nicest guy in the world." Then I was like-

Joe Rogan 50:34 He is the nicest guy.

Belal Muhammad 50:35 And I was like, "Yeah, you know what? You're right." And it just made you feel good that, like, "I feel bad for you," but, like, he's like, "No, it's, I'll accept it. It's okay. It'll, it'll come back to me." So that, the way it just happened, I was excited.

Joe Rogan 50:45 What's interesting is he, he said he would fight Ankalaev, but he said he wanted to fight him in Brazil. He said, "I have to adjust my game, 'cause of-"

Belal Muhammad 50:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:52 "... I'm fighting a different guy now. Give me some more time to, to, like, train for this guy." Especially at 42 years old, and especially coming off of being a champion. He's supposed to be fighting Jiri Prochazka, who's this, like, bizarre style. Jiri just moves around funny, he's throwing crazy shots. He's got a very odd style.

Belal Muhammad 51:11 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:12 Very specific. So to go from that to Ankalaev, and Ankalaev is, like, standing tall and he moves really good, and he's, he's very fast and super technical. Totally different style.

Belal Muhammad 51:23 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:23 Like, you gotta prepare for different looks.

Belal Muhammad 51:25 Yeah. But, I mean, I understand the UFC's take on it. Like, you need a, a title fight for the pay-per-view. You gotta sell it. For that one, that they had in Vegas-

Joe Rogan 51:33 At 42, at 42, like, you gotta make your choices count.

Belal Muhammad 51:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:36 You gotta make it ... I like what Glover did.

Belal Muhammad 51:37 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:38 And look, he was right.

Belal Muhammad 51:38 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 51:39 He came back to help him.

Belal Muhammad 51:39 It worked out perfectly for him. And Jamahal's a dog, though.

Joe Rogan 51:42 Jamahal's a dog.

Belal Muhammad 51:43 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 51:43 Jamahal's a dog, and Jamahal's got crazy power, man. He's got crazy power.

Belal Muhammad 51:47 Yeah. He got that.

Joe Rogan 51:48 There it is. Jamahal, he has an intelligence, like a find chin intelligence. He finds your chin.

Belal Muhammad 51:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:55 He, like, sorts through all the shit you're doing. He, he's like, "Now's my time," and just drops bombs.

Belal Muhammad 52:02 And he's so calm in there.

Joe Rogan 52:03 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 52:03 He's like ... Even on the way that we ... Uh, when I fought Damey Maia, he was in the car with me on the way to the fight, 'cause he fought Paul Craig that day, and he's-

Joe Rogan 52:11 Interesting. He's the favorite.

Belal Muhammad 52:12 Oh, Jamahal is?

Joe Rogan 52:13 Yeah. Interesting. That's interesting. I guess it's just-

Belal Muhammad 52:16 The power.

Joe Rogan 52:17 ... Glover's age. It's the power and, you know, it's the ... Like, when you see him, the way he knocked out Johnny Walker, you're like, "Dude." Kinda glancing off the forehead.

Belal Muhammad 52:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 52:25 I mean, good shot, but wasn't even like his best shot. And, and Johnny Walker goes stiff. That Jamahal's got crazy power.

Belal Muhammad 52:32 And he, like, switched stances right before-

Joe Rogan 52:34 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 52:34 ... he knocked him out with that shot.

Joe Rogan 52:36 Yep.

Belal Muhammad 52:36 And I'm like, "Oh, a bigger guy that knows how to switch stances, so smooth."

Joe Rogan 52:39 Mm-hmm. Yeah, he's, he's very clever in there. And, uh, that power is undeniable man. His power is undeniable. Deiveson Figueiredo, he made me eat my words. That motherfucker got down to flyweight. I was like ... Uh, the last time I saw him, he was 300 pounds.

Belal Muhammad 52:53 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 52:54 (laughs) I was like, "Dude, you're never gonna be a flyweight again." He came in the octagon, I'm like, "You're heavier than me." Like, "How are you gonna get down to 125?" But he did, man. He looks ... Go to his Instagram. He, uh, he sh- he posted a photo today. Damn, he looks good.

Belal Muhammad 53:08 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 53:08 So, Deiveson, sir, made me eat my words.

Belal Muhammad 53:11 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 53:11 I was like, "We're never gonna-"

Belal Muhammad 53:11 Well, we still got a couple more days. Friday, we'll see.

Joe Rogan 53:13 Oh, he made it. I think he made it. I, I was saying, "He's probably gonna go up to bantamweight," but no. Look at him.

Belal Muhammad 53:19 Oh, wow.

Joe Rogan 53:19 Damn, son. That dude shredded. Look at him. Look at him. You can't get more shredded than that. That's not possible. It is literally ... Like, he's got veins everywhere on his body. You can't get more shredded than that dude. That's fucking sh- sh- shredded-ed-ed-ed-ed.

Belal Muhammad 53:38 That's crazy.

Joe Rogan 53:38 That's their fourth fight, right?

Belal Muhammad 53:40 It ... That's nuts. They ... Some- I saw the stat today. It was like, uh, this ... "Deiveson Figueiredo hasn't fought anybody not named Brandon Moreno in the last four years."

Joe Rogan 53:49 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 53:49 Like, he, he fought him the last, the last four years, it's only been Brandon Moreno.

Joe Rogan 53:52 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 53:52 That's the only first time Figueiredo's fought.

Joe Rogan 53:53 It's crazy. The last, yeah, the last guy he stopped- Right here. Yeah. Here we go. It's the last time he fought someone. Well, he fought Alex Perez. November 2020. Yeah, and that was, uh, 2020. Yeah, and then before that, he fought Benavidez. He stopped Benavidez twice. He beat him twice. And then, uh, Brandon Moreno, and then the, uh, the remat- the last one, I thought Moreno won, man.

Belal Muhammad 54:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:16 I was, uh, shocked at that decision. You know, but then I was, I was real happy that Moreno got that fight with Kai Kara-France, got the interim title, and now they're fighting for Undisputed. I liked that fight. I liked that fight a lot. Those two guys match up really well.

Belal Muhammad 54:29 This is gonna be ... I mean, th- we could watch them fight-

Joe Rogan 54:31 Mm-hmm.

Belal Muhammad 54:31 ... five or six times. I think he's gonna keep switching back and forth, but now Moreno doesn't have his coach with him. He switched-

Joe Rogan 54:36 Right. That's interesting.

Belal Muhammad 54:37 ... Krause, and I'm wondering-

Joe Rogan 54:38 That's interesting.

Belal Muhammad 54:38 ... how that's gonna play a factor into-

Joe Rogan 54:39 What is your take on that whole thing? I don't know enough about what happened.

Belal Muhammad 54:43 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 54:43 Do you know enough about what happened-

Belal Muhammad 54:44 I, I don't know enough-

Joe Rogan 54:45 ... to comment on it?

Belal Muhammad 54:45 ... but it's ...

Joe Rogan 54:46 Doesn't sound good.

Belal Muhammad 54:47 When I watch that fight, when I look at that fight, I'm like, "This guy said he had a injury, then he just fell do-" He lo- literally just fell down. Like, it looked like he threw the fight, the, the one who was cornering that day.

Joe Rogan 54:56 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 54:57 And then he came out afterward and said, "Oh, you know, I had a injury." But it was like, at least act a little bit more if you're gonna go in there and throw a fight. Like, it didn't make-

Joe Rogan 55:04 What if you have an injury and you go and fight ... Uh, it says, "UFC's Jeff Molina suspended for alleged substantial involvement in ongoing James Krause investigation." Substantial.

Belal Muhammad 55:14 Yeah, they ... He was on, uh ... I've heard a thing that he was on, uh, his Discord, and he said that, like, Jeff Molina said that, like, "You know, I paid my, my mortgage, my house, my, my phone bill, everything with this Discord right here. Make sure you guys join it." So ...... like, he was pushing it hard, so I'm sure, you know-

Joe Rogan 55:30 Oh.

Belal Muhammad 55:30 ... he was, he was under Krause.

Joe Rogan 55:32 So his Discord, were they, th- is that something they were using for gambling?

Belal Muhammad 55:36 Yeah. I think somebody was telling me that-

Joe Rogan 55:37 Jamie, you, you know, you're aware of this, right?

Narrator 55:39 Yeah, I know some of the details.

Joe Rogan 55:39 Jamie was getting a big smile. (laughs) What do you know?

Narrator 55:41 Uh, what I heard, this is what I heard, there was up to, uh, 2,000 people using that Discord for gambling information.

Joe Rogan 55:47 Mm.

Narrator 55:48 And most of it was probably MMA stuff, probably all sorts of sports were being talked about. Uh, but one fight in particular, the, the line changed right before the fight from like, I think the favorite was like maybe -220 or something like that, to then, like, negative 450, which is a 4/1 favorite.

Joe Rogan 56:04 Mm.

Narrator 56:04 And more specifically, it was like a, of, uh, KO in the first round, and it happened in, like, 48 seconds or something.

Joe Rogan 56:10 Oh.

Narrator 56:10 And that fighter had never been KO'd or something too is what I was hearing.

Joe Rogan 56:14 So-

Narrator 56:14 But there was also way more going on.

Joe Rogan 56:15 ... people knew there was an injury and they were letting people know that there was an injury-

Narrator 56:19 Right.

Joe Rogan 56:19 ... so it affected the gambling line.

Narrator 56:20 And then they traced that shit back to find out-

Joe Rogan 56:22 Well, they fucked everybody, 'cause now you can't bet on yourself.

Narrator 56:25 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:25 Like, if you won, if you fought Khamzat and you're like, "Fuck, I'm putting 100 grand on myself."

Belal Muhammad 56:28 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 56:29 That's, that's cool.

Belal Muhammad 56:30 Yeah. There's a lot of-

Joe Rogan 56:31 You should be able to bet-

Belal Muhammad 56:31 ... fighters that do that.

Joe Rogan 56:32 You should be able to gamble on yourself.

Belal Muhammad 56:33 Yeah. I mean, if you're gonna gamble-

Joe Rogan 56:35 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 56:36 ... at least ... But now I don't think fighters are able to gamble even on, like, football or basketball or anything.

Joe Rogan 56:39 Oh, that's terrible.

Belal Muhammad 56:40 Like DraftKings or something, uh, went and tweeted out, like, you can't even-

Joe Rogan 56:43 That's-

Belal Muhammad 56:43 ... get on DraftKings.

Joe Rogan 56:43 ... terrible. That's terrible. You guys fucked us.

Belal Muhammad 56:47 Freaking Krause, man. That's ... When he, he was on Air Hawaii before and he said he makes more money gambling than he did fighting. And-

Joe Rogan 56:54 Oh, no.

Belal Muhammad 56:54 ... I think that, like, triggered everybody. Like, "Wait a minute. Let me check what you do."

Joe Rogan 56:58 Oh, no.

Belal Muhammad 56:58 And I met a couple of guys in Vegas and they were, like, talking about the situation and they're ... He was telling me, like, one guy was like, "Oh yeah, you know, I make like $500,000, uh, each UFC fight." And I'm like, "Really?" He's like, "Yeah-"

Joe Rogan 57:10 What?

Belal Muhammad 57:10 He's like, "There's fights that are ... The line's still out there even after the fight's done." So the fight'll happen, he knows who won and how they won and then Veg- some of the casinos will still have the line up.

Joe Rogan 57:20 What?

Belal Muhammad 57:21 Yeah. And he's like-

Joe Rogan 57:21 No.

Belal Muhammad 57:22 ... he'll go bet the house on it. And I'm like, "You're lying." He's like, "Bro, I'll show you my bank account. Like, this is what I do."

Joe Rogan 57:26 Wait a minute. Wait a minute. He's gambling after the fight is concluded?

Belal Muhammad 57:31 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:31 That's insane.

Belal Muhammad 57:32 That's what I was like, that can't be true. He's like, "Bro, there's casinos. I'll look for the casino that has it." He said, "All I do is gamble. That's what I do. And I'll wait for the fight to be finished and they'll still have the line up. And I'll go into the casino, put the bet on there."

Joe Rogan 57:44 That makes no sense.

Belal Muhammad 57:45 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:45 That seems like the casino should be able to get their money back, like it's already concluded before you bet.

Belal Muhammad 57:50 I don't know if I'll snitch on them or not, but yeah, that's crazy what I heard.

Joe Rogan 57:52 I think you might be snitching.

Narrator 57:54 No, no names were said, right? I didn't-

Joe Rogan 57:55 I don't got any-

Narrator 57:56 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 57:56 I didn't hear any names. I heard no names. Yeah. But I, I feel like you should be able to gamble. You d- you definitely should be able to gamble on your fighter and you definitely should be able to gamble on yourself. As long as you're not gambling for someone to lose and if there's a situation like this where it shows that someone is either taking a dive or the coach lets everybody know, "Hey, this guy's injured, you know, bet on the other dude," that kind of shit you really should be banned for.

Joe Rogan 58:20 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 58:20 And you shouldn't ... I mean, I don't know what Krause actually did and what actually is gonna happen to him, but that makes me upset. That's bi- that's terrible shit. That's terrible. For ... Especially, you ruined it for all these guys that, like, if you wanted to fight Khamzat and you wanted to bet 100 grand on yourself, or you wanted to bet on yourself against Colby, like-

Joe Rogan 58:39 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 58:39 ... you should be able to do that.

Joe Rogan 58:40 Yeah.

Belal Muhammad 58:41 That's, that's a fun storyline I wanna talk about that. Exactly. You have confidence in yourself-

Joe Rogan 58:44 Yes.

Belal Muhammad 58:44 ... that much. And ...

Joe Rogan 58:45 And doing commentary, I wanna be able to bring it up.

Belal Muhammad 58:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:47 Like-

Belal Muhammad 58:47 That would be cool.

Joe Rogan 58:48 ... this is how much he bele- believes in himself. He put 100 grand on himself. Yeah. But now you can't even do that.

Belal Muhammad 58:53 Yeah.

Narrator 58:54 Check this out. This is a, the, the company that found this is called US Integrity.

Joe Rogan 58:58 Mm.

Narrator 58:58 They found, I think this would be the PFL event. It says, uh, they showed fights that were taped a month ahead of time and aired them as though they were live.

Joe Rogan 59:07 No!

Belal Muhammad 59:07 Yeah.

Narrator 59:08 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 59:08 Who was telling me about that?

Joe Rogan 59:09 And people gambled on them?

Narrator 59:09 I think so, yeah (laughs) .

Belal Muhammad 59:10 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 59:11 Oh my God, that's so stupid.

Narrator 59:13 Ugh.

Belal Muhammad 59:14 This was one of the ones that he was telling me about too.

Joe Rogan 59:15 (sighs)

Belal Muhammad 59:16 He said that he, like, Krause put it on his Discord that he, they knew all the results from the, from this fight.

Joe Rogan 59:20 Oh my God.

Narrator 59:21 That's wild.

Joe Rogan 59:22 That is so dumb.

Narrator 59:23 (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 59:23 Yeah. They had all the results. He said-

Joe Rogan 59:25 That's so bushy.

Belal Muhammad 59:25 He was like, "You know, I made like $200,000, but I know guys that made like $800,000 off of that." And it was like the-

Joe Rogan 59:29 Oh my God. You're going to jail, bitch. (laughs)

Belal Muhammad 59:31 ... it was the Professional Fighters League Challenge Series. And I was like, "What?" And he's like, "Yeah, like they-"

Joe Rogan 59:35 That's so dumb.

Belal Muhammad 59:36 "... didn't. They didn't