EVERY SPOKEN WORD
150 min read · 30,050 words- 0:00 – 1:47
Masvidal’s long career: staying healthy, learning, and avoiding shortcuts
- JMJorge Masvidal
(drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.
- NANarrator
The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music plays)
- JRJoe Rogan
Looking great.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Thank you, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
Looking good.
- JMJorge Masvidal
War time.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yup. King of Miami, what's up?
- JMJorge Masvidal
What's up, my brother?
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) Good to see you, man.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Always a fucking pleasure.
- JRJoe Rogan
Always a pleasure to see you too, man. Bro, I've been a fan of yours since back in the day. When I saw you-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Strike forces.
- JRJoe Rogan
... fought Bodog.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Bodog. Nah, damn.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Saw you fight Yves Edwards on Bodog.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, I did.
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm like, "Damn, this dude's fucking dangerous."
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, I did, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. You're, you're still in the game, man. It's, uh, it's, it's beautiful to see, you know? Crafty veterans.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, man. I, uh, attribute it a lot to, like, God with the gifts that I was born and also the training that I do. I never get too far away from the training. And another thing is that, uh, I, uh, I've kept it, like, natural for the most part. I've seen a lot of guys come in four or five years. They, they do a little bit of the enhancements and cheating-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... and then tear this, break that, so these guys ain't around no more. I just feel like, um, I, one, I couldn't afford it when I was coming on any of that stuff, so I just never did it, you know? So I've always kept, like, my body more or less healthy. I've had injuries that are horrible, obviously, in combat sports, but I've always just been able to, like, heal through them. And it always, uh, one thing I've always believed in for the sport, for anybody listening, wanting to get into the sport and have longevity, is like as long as you know that every day you could learn something new from whoever it may be, you'll, you'll always be going forward. You know, the moment you think you know it all, that's it, bro, you fucked up, you know.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
So I've always had that mentality since I was young. And, uh, and I still have it to this day. You know, a white book could teach me something, or, like, a setup or something. Not necessarily maybe the greatest technique, but just a different way to do a technique and I, and I might be able to pull it off. So I've always, uh, stuck firm to that commitment, you know?
- 1:47 – 3:47
Worst injuries and how he manages chronic wear-and-tear
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, for sure. That's very important to have that beginner's mentality. You know, what is the worst injury you've ever had?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Like, pain-wise? Eye poke for all of back.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I, I, uh, I shot, like, a high crotch and the guy's elbow was, like, resting on his hip and it, and he just, like, locked out and, um, it went right into my thumb. His thumb went right into my eye and I was throwing up immediately. Like, 10 seconds after I started throwing up and I couldn't... I was doing, like, the Harlem shake. I couldn't control my body. I was just shaking and throwing up, it was so much pain. After that I had to wear an eye patch for about, like, five weeks because I had double vision. So I would, like, look at you and see, like, two, three of you, and that would last for, like, five weeks. So, um, I was supposed to have surgery on it and they scheduled me for surgery. I came back in and the doctor's like, "Hey, man, um, maybe you don't need surgery. You, you did amazing healing. Like, sweating's gone down a little bit. You kind of don't need the surgery." So I was like, "Oh, let me not get the surgery," and I wore that eye patch for five weeks. That, that was the most painful injury of my life. The other ones have just been, like, uh, long-lasting injuries. Like my hand is all fucking wrecked, you know? Uh, back's pretty messed up, but I get, I get through it, you know. Cold plunge, sauna, a lot of stretching, things like that. Like they're, they're, they're... I can work through it. But the eye and the hand have been, uh, the worst probably.
- JRJoe Rogan
Did you break the hand?
- JMJorge Masvidal
No, but I've torn, like, numerous ligaments and tendons on the hand. You know, that's why my, my fingers look like they're throwing up gang signs, all crooked and stuff, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
But yeah, that, that's been, like, uh, one of the more lagging ones. And the knees and stuff, you know, you know how the sport is.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Pulling on your joints, meniscus tear here, ACL there. But those, uh, I've been able to rehab and work through them. They, they suck, like, when I'm running or, like, on a cold day, but it, it's nothing that I can't work through. The, the hand is like sometimes I gotta just give it a pause, like a week I can't throw my right hand, I just gotta use my left and stuff like that.
- JRJoe Rogan
I remember when you got a meniscus injury and I was worried about that, but you just rehabbed it?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Just rehab, man. I, uh, I, I don't really like surgery, you know. And I, and I've talked to a lot of other athletes that did do, like, uh, the meniscus repair and then it tore again and then they-
- 3:47 – 4:21
Rehab-first mentality: avoiding surgery and using new medical options
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... were out for, like, six months. I was like, "Nah, it's not gonna be me." So I've always focused on, like, rehab, get whoever's the best rehab person around at that time that I could find for that particular injury and just get to work. And if after some time I'm, I'm not seeing any gains then maybe I'll try some other stuff. And there's so many advances in the medical field now, like the stem cell, that, that's helped me out tremendously with my knees, giving me a full range of motion to be able to, like, squat all the way down. I, I was having trouble, like, breaking parallel. Once I'd have a little bit of weight on my back I'd just feel crazy tension on my knees. Since the stem cell I got, like, a full range of motion back on my knees, you know.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's beautiful.
- JMJorge Masvidal
The hand as well.
- 4:21 – 5:27
Stem cells, where he got them, and why fighters travel for treatment
- JRJoe Rogan
Where did you go to get the stem cells?
- JMJorge Masvidal
The UFC sent me up for, for my hand. I went to California and, uh, it was freaking amazing. It was right after the Nate Diaz fight. Uh, both my hands were jacked and on, and on one of the, the blows that I hit Nate with, I hit him in the top of the head, and you could see it on the video, my hand folded. It just kind of had, like, shitty technique for that one punch. And, um, I couldn't even wipe my ass, I, I swear to you, bro. The, the, the pain that I had, it was just... I couldn't bend it in like that. I did the stem cells, three weeks later I was like, "Holy smokes, this is insane." And, um, and my knees and hands I did it in, uh, down in Colombia at BioXcellerator.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
That was freaking a great time too. They took care-
- JRJoe Rogan
That's the way to go. When you can go to those, uh, other countries, whether it's Panama or Colombia or they do it in Tijuana now too, it's like they can do shit that you can't-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... do in America.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
They just load you up.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You get the full spectrum over there, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. And you just... Fucking heals everything.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's incredible.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It's, it's crazy.
- JRJoe Rogan
And it's great for stuff that you don't even know is wrong, you know?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's great for just overall longevity and body healing.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I've heard they, uh... I haven't done them because you know how
- JRJoe Rogan
Hey, Joe.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... Usada's with us, but I've heard about the IV, uh, stem cells as well, they're freaking great for you as well.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's incredible.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- 5:27 – 8:18
Weight cutting realities: why 155 became impossible and 170 made him better
- JRJoe Rogan
It sucks that, you know, the IV thing is an issue. But, you know. It's, uh... I mean, you don't cut a ton of weight. I mean, you used to fight at 55 and at 70.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Not, not at 75. Yeah, 55 I, I was a ton of weight, a ton of water weight, because I, my, my body fa... I lived a different life there. Very strict diet for, like, I had to... Once I turned, like, 25, 26, I had to have, like, proper notice. Like nine weeks' notice to get myself in shape to come in on fight week at, like, 174 to drop down to 156. And right around, like, 172, 173, I was 5% body fat already. So it was, it was just straight water and it was fucking torturous. And then, um, Usada, when I decided to move up, Usada came in the game and outlawed the IVs for us, right? So I was like, "There's no way I can make 155." And that's when I made my move to 70.
- JRJoe Rogan
But it's been phenomenal for you at 70. I think-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Mm-hmm.
- JRJoe Rogan
You're better at 70. I really think-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, for sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
... because you're just stronger and healthier.
- JMJorge Masvidal
For sure. I, I didn't have the pop, um...... at 155 after I turned 26, 27, which usually a man loses his strength and power at the end of his career, you know. And it was, like, a month before the fight, I'd be hurting people in sparring. As I got nearer to the fight, I just, I didn't have that electricity, that pow, pow, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JMJorge Masvidal
So, I really started to, like, "Man, fuck," you know? It's, uh, it's something I'm gonna have to do, and it was in the back of my mind. But I would always work out with 70-pounders and, um, like, 45-pounders. At American Top Team, we had a lot of sandbags at 155, so I, I would work out with them as well, but I was like, "We might have to cross paths." So I, I didn't make it, like, my main staple to work out with those guys. So, I knew that there was a strength level difference at me at 170, but I knew I could hurt those guys when I touched 'em, you know, every time. So I, I, I knew if I could work on my strength gains and get a little size, I'd be all right at 70.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, well, look at the Darren Till knockout.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, that was fucking phenomenal.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, I mean, I, I wonder how many fighters are cutting their career short by dehydrating the shit out of themselves.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It, it's, it's rough. You know, when you're young, you get away with it, always. Your body, you could get run over by a truck and you wake up the next day. But there comes a point where you kinda just lose that, you know? And I don't care how young you are, your, your chin, once you cut over, like, 12, 13, 14 pounds of water, your chin and legs-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... take a massive hit, I feel like.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, that's why I'm amazed that-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Reflexes, too.
- JRJoe Rogan
... that Pereira, who's, uh, walks around b- like, 40 pounds heavier than 185, I mean, he's fucking huge.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, yeah. But usually, the big boys also could have more, more water to, to release-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... you know, the 205ers, the 85ers, the heavyweights. But yeah, that guy's massive. I've seen pictures of him off-season, I'm like, "Holy smokes, he looks like a fucking small heavyweight at times."
- JRJoe Rogan
When he gets into the octagon at 185, you can't believe he ever weighed 185.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
He's so fucking big.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
It's a giant advantage, but I wonder how long he can do that. He's like 34 now, you know?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- 8:18 – 10:09
Gilbert Burns in Miami: game plan, hometown pressure, and title implications
- JRJoe Rogan
Um, so you got a big fight coming up. You're mid-camp.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
Thanks for coming down, man.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Hell yeah, bro.
- JRJoe Rogan
So, uh, Gilbert, that's a good fight.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It's a great fight, man. Um, I th- I think, uh, wrestling's not that good, so I know I could negate him on the wrestling takedowns and just keep his stand-up. In stand-up, he makes a lot of mistakes constantly, I, I feel, you know, just looking at it from a striker's point of view. I, I feel he's like tailor-made for, for me to give him a fucking left hook to the jaw and end his night, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Well, it's an exciting fight, and Gilbert's a fucking dangerous man. So, it's, it's... And it's the co-main event in Miami. It's gonna be wild.
- JMJorge Masvidal
20-
- JRJoe Rogan
I'm so excited.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... 20 years I ain't been to Miami.
- JRJoe Rogan
Woo. That's gonna be wild. Just the moment when you get into that fucking octagon, the pop that you get-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
... it's gonna be insane.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
- JRJoe Rogan
In Miami, woo.
- JMJorge Masvidal
In Miami, in Miami.
- JRJoe Rogan
Woo.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And, and forever the, the road has been my home, so I've always felt comfortable. Like, "Okay, we're gonna f- fight Abu Dhabi, fight Ireland, cool. We're gonna fight California, Texas." Cool. It's, I, I've always felt great. So definitely, he's gonna be, like, a little bit more added pressure, a little different being in my actual home, you know? I've always-
- JRJoe Rogan
But you're gonna wake up in your own bed.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I'm gonna wake up in my own bed, that is true. I'm gonna take a drive from my house to the arena in my car. You know, it's, it's all gonna be like...
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Like if I'm going to sparring, but little bit more added chips to it, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
For sure, for sure. Yeah, it's, uh, it's an exciting time for the welterweight division, too. You know, with you having that, uh, beef with Leon, and Leon now having retained the title. And they're talking about Colby, but I feel like with a good showing against Gilbert-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, skip Colby's bitch-ass right away.
- JRJoe Rogan
... you, you skip the line (laughs) .
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, for sure.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, it becomes-
- JMJorge Masvidal
And Leon wants it, you know, more than anything.
- 10:09 – 13:59
Leon vs Usman trilogy: confidence swings, KO recovery, and timing rematches
- JRJoe Rogan
It'll be a big fight. It's gonna be a gigantic fight. What did you think about the rematch, the, the rubber fight with, uh, Leon and Kamaru?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Uh, little lackluster, you know. And, um, eh, Usman, uh, maybe, like, there, there was times where I, I didn't see him, like, stepping on the gas like he usually does, you know? And it might've been 'cause he just took this fight too early. I, I always think that when a fighter gets knocked out, you, you really... You know, and I got this from, like, the old-timers in boxing, you need to really let your brain and your confidence, like, heal and come back, you know? 'Cause then you get back in, and you get touched, and you're like, "Whoa, I'm, I might get knocked out."
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And you pull the, the, the breaks, and you start, like, you know, maybe second-guessing yourself. So, I think maybe he took it a little bit too early, you know? I, I do think that, uh, he's the, in a way, better fighter than, than Leon in a lot of aspects. But Leon just has his number, it seems, right now.
- JRJoe Rogan
But Leon was also super confident coming into that fight. You know, I feel like once a guy becomes a- the champion, they, they gain confidence and they gain ability 'cause they just have this understanding-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... of what they're, they're capable of doing.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And the fact that it was in England, and it was, it was, it's-
- JMJorge Masvidal
And he had the title.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And he knocked him out, so it's like-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, all the above.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... you know, a lot of, a lot of factors.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You just don't know how a guy's gonna come back after his first KO loss. And it was a, it was a battle, it was a brutal one. Usman was down for a bit.
- JRJoe Rogan
How long after the Kamaru fight did you take off?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Uh, close to, like, eight to nine months almost. Maybe, maybe even longer, you know? All, all my coaches wanted me. Plus, um, it was like the first KO of my career, you know? So, more so on, like... Not, not my body was already healed, my brain, but they wanted to make sure that my mind was right, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It was-
- JRJoe Rogan
How long did it take you to get over it?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Um, I still haven't got over it, brother. I, I wanna fucking rip Usman's fucking-
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
... brains out, you know? Nothing personal to that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I just wanna get back in there and, and do it to him, you know? I, I've never been knocked down, and I've fought a lot. You know, we were talking about it earlier, Yves Edwards. Like, I've fought great strikers, you know, and they never even ca- came close to knocking me out. And it's not to diss Usman, but he's not... I don't put him in the league of one of these great strikers. He's a great fighter 'cause he could do a lot of things well, but I- after fighting him the first time and getting his best shots, and I cut 20 pounds of water and I took the fight in six-day notice, and I went to Abu Dhabi. I was like, "Bro, this guy will never hurt me." Like, he, he hits like a bitch, and then all of a sudden, he's the dude that knocks me out. And I had five rounds with him. So for, in that, I think it was nine months since the first fight-That he gained that type of power is just n- nuts to me, you know? It was, like, unreal, unnatural, you know? 'Cause I, I felt his fucking best punches in the first fight for five rounds and never hurt me, never, like, w- shook me up good, you know? (inhales) And then boom, surprise hit in the second fight.
- JRJoe Rogan
So, do you think it was, uh, a matter of you not respecting his power? As ... Or ... And, on top of that, him just getting better?
- JMJorge Masvidal
I, I always respect anybody who has two hands and two feet, so it's not like I'm, um, trying to do the touch me in the chin and I'll give a shot to take a shot. Definitely caught me by surprise when, when he, when he started to load up, I kinda saw, like, the back of his head, so I thought for sure he was gonna shoot, so I start to, like, drop my hands and I notice, like, midway, oh, it's a right hand. I try to check hook him, but it's too late already that the right hand had already penetrated the force field and took my ass out, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs) Yeah. It's, uh ... It's a moment that happens to many fighters and it defines who they are how they bounce back from it.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- 13:59 – 17:09
Handling Masvidal’s first KO loss: dark period, motivation, and Jordan Peterson
- JRJoe Rogan
Do you ever go to a sports psychologist?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Um, I just listen to Jordan Peterson a lot on YouTube, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
That's my dude right there for many, many years. I, I've never got the chance-
- JRJoe Rogan
Have you ever met him?
- JMJorge Masvidal
I haven't got the chance, but I'm actually, um ... By coincidence, he's in Florida April 9th, and I'm, like, doing everything in my power to make sure that I'm there, like, right after my fight. I'm gonna go. He's gonna have a, a conference down in, uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
I'll connect you guys.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, hell yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, yeah, I'll connect you guys.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, yeah. Um-
- JRJoe Rogan
For sure. He's a great guy.
- JMJorge Masvidal
He's gonna be in Florida, so I was like, "Bro, I, I gotta go there." I just wanna sit in the crowd and listen to this dude. I've been listening to him for years on, like, YouTube and stuff. And I listen to a lot of motivational speakers and stuff. Uh, sports psychologists, I've never really, like, seen one personally, but I'm sure it would help, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Um, it, it certainly can help, but Jordan is essentially giving you sport psychology. He's giving you, like, life lessons.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, yeah. And, and not just sports. I think, um, for, for me, i- I have, like, a lot of bad habits that I had from, like, growing up, you know, in, in the way that I did that I took into the pro world and, uh, I was still succeeding, you know? I was ... Um, let's say I stayed up all night for whatever reason it was. I was either chasing money or chasing chicks and then I went to sleep at 4:00 AM and I woke up at 9:00 AM and I went to the gym at 10:00 and I beat everybody's ass in that room and I'm like, "I, I don't have to change nothing."
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You know? And I went on to beat numerous good guys, challenge for world titles outside of the UFC, and, uh, I was doing really good, so part of me was like, "This is, this is just me. I'm just this person, you know?" But that wasn't the best version of me.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You know? And, like, little by little I've, I've had to, like, tear layers off me and like, "Hey, th- this is no good." And every time I've done that and I found out something maybe was holding me back, I've been able to get to, like, the next level. So, it's, uh, it's good to hear somebody like Jordan that, that addresses and is like, "Bro, you're a pussy, bro. If you can't let this go," and he tells you how it is. He's like, "This is why," and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So, I, I, I like it like that, like straight raw, like, "Just tell me the truth," you know? So, (smacks lips) I feel that for me personally, not just in the sports, but in, in, like, my life in general, like, finding those things that hold me back in, in many things, you know, from ... On the, on the personal side that I could bring into the professional and then it's, like ... It makes all the sense in the world, you know? Like, let's say I stop eating Domino's pizza now for like a month or, or whatever junk food I was, like, binging on and then I see, like, results and stuff, it's like, "Man, I just gotta change my whole lifestyle." Not just before the fight, but year round, you know? And those are ... Tho- those are the things where I, like, struggle and I've been working on a lot, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
That's the problem, I think, with really talented guys is that you can kinda get away without being disciplined.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And you don't realize that if you were disciplined, you'd be one of the greats.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. And, and it's like I, I have the discipline to make it to the gym under three hours of sleep or 10 hours of sleep. I'm gonna, I'm gonna make it to the practices. The coach is always gonna check my name off. I'm always just gonna show up to practice. But was it the fucking absolute best version of me showing up to that practice? Many times not, especially when I was younger, man. And just because in that room, whatever particular room I was in, I was always, like, a standout or one of the better guys. I was like, "Bro, I don't gotta change nothing, bro." And then, you know, that hits you.
- JRJoe Rogan
I remember there was a video that the UFC put out. I think the UFC put it out. It was you w- younger you just playing video games all night.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Uh-huh.
- JRJoe Rogan
And just, like-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Definitely. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
And everybody was, like, laughing about this just-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's what he does.
- 17:09 – 24:18
Sleep, discipline, and studying opponents: changing with age and learning from greats
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. And, you know, since young, since I wanna say, like, 17 years old, I started sleeping, like, five hours a day just because I, I couldn't get more than that. I'd lay in bed. I could go to sleep at 10:00 AM and I'd just wake up, like, at 5:00, 6:00 AM wired, so I started pushing those boundaries. Like, well, then I'd go to sleep at 3:00 in the morning. I'd wake up at, like, 9:00 just fine. I woke up at 10:00 fine and I did that for a large part and I felt good, you know? But with age, though, can't do that no more.
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Nowadays I get, like, my five cycles of an hour and a half at least minimum, you know? If not, I, I feel it nowadays, you know? And this started happening to me when I was, like, 34, 35. Like, it took a while for it to hit me. Now sleep is top three priority for me. It never used to be. It used to be like, "I'll take a nap if I'm that tired," or something like that. Nowadays it's like, "Man, I, I need my good sleep if I'm gonna get a good workout in," you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, it's good that you're aware of that, and some people never learn that lesson. Sleep is everything. It is everything. Your body recovers during sleep and also your mind recovers. I mean, to ... Just to know that you're well-rested when you're getting up and getting through the day, you just know you got a full battery.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It ... I didn't ... I never even believed in that. I was like, "Man, that's just motherfuckers being pussies, bro."
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
"What do you need? What do you mean you need eight hours of sleep? What you need is sleep when you die."
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
That used to be, like, a common thing, you know? Everybody around me would all say like, "Well, sleeping is for the birds and for dead people." And I really, like, kinda just embodied that. Like, "Man, I, I don't need sleep to go training." Now it's the complete opposite. I'm trying to clock in as many hours on a consistent basis leading up. But this is not just now for this fight camp, I've been, I've been trying to implement that for, like, the last two years of my life, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Well, I think that something that f- you know, it's, it's a part of what makes fighters great, is they have that incredible confidence, and they don't give a fuck, and they think they're different.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, it's-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Harold Guilty? (laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
... it's all the great... Yeah, a little bit of that. I mean, look at it, that's Jon Jones in a nutshell, right?
- JMJorge Masvidal
(laughs)
- JRJoe Rogan
I mean, Jon- I mean, the fun- one of the funniest fucking lines ever was when Jon was talking to DC at the press conference. He goes like, "I beat you when I was doing coke." (laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
(laughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
A whole night, a weekend of cocaine or something like that.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
That- that guy's just like... You talk about uber talent, that guy is like next-
- JRJoe Rogan
On another level.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... next level shit, man.
- JRJoe Rogan
Next level.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I mean, fuck.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And he happens to be fucking mean. 'Cause a lot of talented guys sometimes, they're not like the meanest guy. This guy is mean as it fucking gets, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, that's everything.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
That's everything. And it's just all the, all the above: genetics, discipline, intelligence, game planning.
- 24:18 – 28:47
USADA friction and weight-cut reform: testing, IV bans, and One FC’s approach
- JMJorge Masvidal
Or- or just like make it like even playing field for everybody. Be- because it's just like, uh, USADA oversees the Americans a lot harder-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... than a lot of these other countries that they can't even get into, you know, and fight-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh yeah, they're not-
- JMJorge Masvidal
... you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
... traveling to the mountains of Dagestan to give people piss tests.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You know? So it's just like, man, just make it fair for everybody. If I'm getting tested 20 times a year-
- JRJoe Rogan
Right.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... so-and-so and so-and-so in social should also be getting tested 20 times a year, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Well, the worst shit is like you hear stuff from like Volkanovski. They wake him up at like 6:00 in the morning-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Ugh.
- JRJoe Rogan
... the day before the fight.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, the- the... I- I've, I've had those-
- JRJoe Rogan
Insane. Cut and wait.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, my, my last camp, it was the same shit. It- it just doesn't make sense. They came in on a Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday at f- between 5:15 and like 6:30 in the morning to my fucking house.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh. Three days in a row?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Three days in a row.
- JRJoe Rogan
Just to make sure?
- JMJorge Masvidal
And it's like, what-Well, how about my sleep, bro?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You guys just wreck ... Like, I usually get up, like, around 8:00 in the morning. I'm out the door by, like, 9:15. Like, I h- I have a schedule. And this is, like, a week before a fight. You guys are just wrecking my shit because now I'm gonna go back to sleep in, like ... Or I'm gonna stay up. Now it's just-
- JRJoe Rogan
Fucks up your day.
- JMJorge Masvidal
It's not neat. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Fu- It could ... You could get hurt at training because of that, because you're tired.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You get caught with something maybe you shouldn't have got caught with.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I get in maybe, like, one time, but they literally showed up three times in my crib like that, you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
Why do you think they do that? Like, did someone tell them, like, maybe you're doing something? Like, what, what ... They think they're being slick? Like-
- JMJorge Masvidal
I, I, uh, I u-
- JRJoe Rogan
That's just stupid.
- 28:47 – 31:16
Boxing talk: rehydration clauses, Davis–Garcia breakdown, and the ‘mean’ factor
- JRJoe Rogan
Right. Yeah. I mean, the Gervonta Davis has a, uh, he has a clause-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Ten-pound clause or something. Ten pounds or something?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Yeah, with the, with, with Ryan, where he can't, uh, weigh more than a certain amount after the weigh-in.
- JMJorge Masvidal
That's little.
- JRJoe Rogan
Which is kind of, kind of bitch ass.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
A little bit.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Like, what do you care what he weighs in?
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. Like, you made-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Who, who do you got in that fight?
- JRJoe Rogan
I don't know, man. I mean, I, I'm a giant Gervonta fan. I think he's super fucking talented. But Ryan has that left hook. That left hook is preposterous.
- JMJorge Masvidal
He's got the reach on him too.
- JRJoe Rogan
That left hook is so fast.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
Like, he catches guys in exchanges. You don't even see it land.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
But it's mostly left hook.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, I know he has a right hand, he uses it. But his left hook is just so ... That style that he uses, using that reach and just whipping that left hook, it's-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Boom.
- JRJoe Rogan
Very unusual.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And his speed is way above natural. Like, his, he's, he's really up there with the hand speed. But so is Gervonta and especially in the, in the pocket.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh my God.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I mean ...
- JRJoe Rogan
Gervonta in the pocket is a monster.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh my God.
- JRJoe Rogan
He's, he's-
- JMJorge Masvidal
He reminds me of, like, a little Tyson.
- JRJoe Rogan
He's short and he... Like, he conserves his punches, where, you know, like, the first few rounds, he throws very few punches. He's just-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. He's just measuring. He's a computer man.
- 31:16 – 34:06
Calf kicks and MMA striking evolution: why they work and how stances change damage
- JMJorge Masvidal
I think that's kind of what hurt Izzy in the, the Pereira fight, putting those takedowns up there. It takes a lot of gas. If you, if you haven't been doing that for a lifetime, wrestling is one of the most draining things for the energy tank.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm. Without a doubt. I think with Izzy though, like, he talked about that left leg getting compromised, the calf kicks.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh.
- JRJoe Rogan
You know, I mean, Pereira landed, like, six calf kicks in that first round. Like, hard ones.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... he's got-
- JRJoe Rogan
Calf kick t- changed the fucking... Do you remember when the calf kick came into the game?
- JMJorge Masvidal
(exhales) Yeah. Uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
'Cause Benson Henderson was the guy who first started using it, but it wasn't as effective for some reason. So, like, other guys started using it and stopping people with it.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I think Ben... Yeah, you're right, Benson, uh-
- JRJoe Rogan
He was one of the first guys.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... I think he chopped up Nate with them pretty damn good.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. I, uh, I use them a lot. I, I remember I used them a lot for my KJ Noons fight. I used them a ton to chop him up-
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... 'cause he's a big boxer. So, I chopped his leg down with the calf kick, just boom, constantly going through. He'd throw, like, a left hook, pop. I'd chop the ca- the calf. He'd throw a jab, p-... I'd chop the calf. And that threw him off. I remember his balance, 'cause he started, like, kinda second-guessing me and not putting as much pressure. But I... Big believer of the calf kick. You know, I felt it and I was like, "This is it right here." You know? Plus-
- JRJoe Rogan
It's horrible.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah. I- and your leg is so much bigger, so much fucking-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... more muscle, you could, you could take the hit there. The one calf kick hits that nerve stem and it, like, fucking shoots up to your brain, and you're like-
- JRJoe Rogan
(coughs)
- JMJorge Masvidal
... "Whoa, don't take no more of those," you know?
- JRJoe Rogan
It's amazing because to the average person, they don't even know what happened. Like, they see a guy get calf kicked and the guy's still moving and they feel like nothing happened. But meanwhile, that guy who got kicked is like, "Oh, shit." Like, you, you're pl-... You got a poker face, but that leg is fucked.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Fucked.
- JRJoe Rogan
Fucked.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Fucked, and then bam.
- JRJoe Rogan
If someone hits it again, bang-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh.
- JRJoe Rogan
... they hit it again, like, "Oh, no." And then you're in trouble.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And then he's... And then they switch stances-
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- 34:06 – 42:03
Muay Thai favorites and technique appreciation: Saenchai, sweeps, and inspiration tape
- JMJorge Masvidal
What's your second favorite?
- JRJoe Rogan
Muay Thai.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Muay Thai, yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
I love Muay Thai. Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
I love Muay Thai.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, I love Muay Thai.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Who's your- who's your favorite Thai fighter?
- JRJoe Rogan
(inhales) Man, I mean, Saenchai.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Saenchai.
- JRJoe Rogan
You gotta go with Saenchai because he's been around so long and he's still fucking people up at, like, 37 years old.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And the grace that he does it with.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, my God. And the style is so different than everybody else's. He's light on his feet and he throws kicks with no telegraph. Like, a lot of these guys, uh, they're, like, power guys. The, you know, they're- they're plodding forward like Rod Tankhah, Mahab.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Oh, my gosh.
- JRJoe Rogan
But, you know, with Saenchai, it's just light on his feet-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... everything's shuffling-
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah.
- JRJoe Rogan
... and moving quick. He's very different. Like-
- JMJorge Masvidal
I-
- JRJoe Rogan
... there's no one like him.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Sin- since I started out watching Saenchai, I, uh, I was like, "Man, what makes him so special?" And I would really, like, dig into it because he's obviously, like, Michael Jordan of- of Muay Thai, you know? And I think one of the things that makes him so special is his ability to take you off your feet at any moment.
- JRJoe Rogan
Hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
So, that, like, I- I see him fighting guys and they immediately change styles when they're fighting him. They might be, like, a little looser and then they get swept off their feet.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yep.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And now they're just, like, their balance got compromised, and that's a huge thing. Like, you kick and then I put you on your neck and shoulders.
- JRJoe Rogan
Mm-hmm.
- JMJorge Masvidal
You're gonna rethink everything, man. And I think he's, like, the best at fucking manipulating your balance and sending you flying across the ring. And I've seen him do it to, like, great boxers, great kickboxers, great Thai guys. They lose all sense of, like, where they're at and stuff once you're flying through the air and you get back and now you're kind of, like, a shell of yourself. Now you're like, "I- I don't wanna get fucking swept again." And then, boom, a left, and then, boom, a kick, and then, boom, you get swept again.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yep.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Bro, it's fucking insane, bro.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. I- I agree. The- the sweeps are f-... That's a big key to his game. And also the angles. I mean, there's one KO where he hops to the side and jumping round hacks, like, ki- kicks that dude in the face.
- 42:03 – 1:05:41
Gamebred Boxing promotion: Roy Jones Jr vs Pettis and a stacked MMA-boxing crossover card
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah. So tell me about your promotion because you've got a big card coming up.
- JMJorge Masvidal
April 1st.
- JRJoe Rogan
Tell me about this. It's very exciting.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Tickets available on Ticketmaster. I gotta go full promoter on you, Joe.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah, go full promoter.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Pay-per-view.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
On demand.
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Comcast, all that linear pay-per-view stuff, and if you want the digital rights, uh, only the second time in history that the UFC partners up with, like, a boxing promotion. The first time was Conor-Mayweather, so you could also buy the pay-per-view through UFC Fight Pass.
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh, that's great.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Yeah, and it's Roy Jones Jr. (inhales deeply)
- JRJoe Rogan
And Anthony Pettis.
- JMJorge Masvidal
And Anthony Pettis.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whoo!
- JMJorge Masvidal
Jose Aldo versus Jeremy Stephens boxing.
- JRJoe Rogan
Whoo!
- JMJorge Masvidal
I'm l- like, I think that that's gonna be the fight of the night. You know, I could be wrong 'cause there's some other good matches. And Vitor Belfort, the guy we were just talking about-
- JRJoe Rogan
Yeah.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... versus Jacare. Who you got in that one?
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh my god.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Who you got in that one?
- JRJoe Rogan
Oh my god. Wow. Look at that.
- JMJorge Masvidal
The Fis- at the Fiserv Forum, Milwaukee-
- JRJoe Rogan
Wow.
- JMJorge Masvidal
... Bucks Arena.
- JRJoe Rogan
I like it. I'm very interested in Jones versus Pettis.
- JMJorge Masvidal
Ooh, wow.
- JRJoe Rogan
How long has Roy been training for this?
- JMJorge Masvidal
Well, um, my good friend, the, the one that help- be- because, uh, as we were setting up the card, um, Dean Toole, which is w- my matchmaker and helps me set up everything, was like, "I think I can get Roy Jones to fight for us." In my mind I was like, "Yeah, I'm sure, bro."
Episode duration: 2:53:26
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