JRE MMA Show #146 with Francis Ngannou

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. FNFrancis Ngannou0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) What's up, champ? How are you?

   4. FNFrancis Ngannou0:15

      I'm good. You?

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:15

      Good to see you.

   6. FNFrancis Ngannou0:16

      Good to see you again.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:17

      So you have, uh, been on a journey, my friend. A lot of things have happened. First of all, congratulations on securing this fight. That is a big deal. A lot of people doubted it was gonna happen. You were right.

   8. FNFrancis Ngannou0:30

      Uh, thank you, thank you. Yes, it was a big deal. It wasn't easy. Um, but we finally get it, you know. I get a, um, a help of a lot of people, and the Saudi were very, were very interested about this fight.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:45

      Yeah, it was one of those fights where you had to take a big gamble by relinquishing your UFC crown and leaving-

   10. FNFrancis Ngannou0:52

       I didn't relinquish anything.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:53

       You didn't relinquish it?

   12. FNFrancis Ngannou0:54

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:55

       What ti- well, fill me in then. Tell me what happened.

   14. FNFrancis Ngannou0:58

       Well, we didn't come to an agreement.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:59

       You didn't come to an agreement?

   16. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:01

       So you decided, "I'm not signing with the UFC." You're a free agent.

   18. FNFrancis Ngannou1:05

       Yes.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:06

       And then, did neg- negotiations then start for the Tyson Fury fight? How did it s- how did it start?

   20. FNFrancis Ngannou1:12

       Um, you know, it's been like four years since Tyson Fury and I were being, uh, going back and forth on social media. So, there was a little bit of a warm up somewhere there, and, uh, it- it kind of, like, take a couple months before we get to- to a conversation. You know, it wasn't just easy. Those boxing promotion, the boxing world is a little wild.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:37

       Yeah, it's a little different.

   22. FNFrancis Ngannou1:38

       Yeah, uh, yeah, i- it's d- completely different. It's a different animal.

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:41

       In what way? Like, explain to us.

   24. FNFrancis Ngannou1:44

       The way that they- they do things, you know, uh, it's, uh, this guy from this promotion fighting with this guy, against this guy from this promotion, who has a better position, who has what to lose, who is getting what. And then, how them, kind of, like put things, I will not say manipulate, but little bit like that. Everybody trying to adjust thing on his own benefit.

   25. JRJoe Rogan2:08

       Mm-hmm.

   26. FNFrancis Ngannou2:08

       Look what is good for him, which is good. But, uh, yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan2:12

       A lot of boxing fights don't get made.

   28. FNFrancis Ngannou2:15

       Yeah.

   29. JRJoe Rogan2:15

       They get talked about for a long time, like Tyson Fury and Usyk. For a long time, was Terence Crawford and Errol Spence. They get talked about for a long time and they almost get made, and then they don't get made, and they almost get made, and then they don't get made.

   30. FNFrancis Ngannou2:29

       A lot of politics behind.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   One of them was…

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      What was the- was one of them the ability to box?

   2. FNFrancis Ngannou15:03

      One of them was the ability to box. They say that wasn't an option. Boxing is dead, it's not possible, this and that. (slaps leg)

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:13

      Now what does that feel like to you knowing that Conor McGregor did it and fought Floyd Mayweather and made $100 million? What is that like for you to be sitting there being told that you can't box?

   4. FNFrancis Ngannou15:25

      Well, uh, I don't used to ... I don't used to take what people tell me for an answer.

   5. JRJoe Rogan15:34

      Hmm.

   6. FNFrancis Ngannou15:35

      Right?

   7. JRJoe Rogan15:36

      Right.

   8. FNFrancis Ngannou15:36

      I used to do my own thing-

   9. JRJoe Rogan15:38

      Right.

   10. FNFrancis Ngannou15:39

       ... on my, in my, on my own way.

   11. JRJoe Rogan15:41

       Right.

   12. FNFrancis Ngannou15:41

       And it seems to work pretty good, so. But I wasn't going to force to change everything. I wasn't expecting to go there and demand this, demand that-

   13. JRJoe Rogan15:51

       Right.

   14. FNFrancis Ngannou15:51

       ... and just have everything. You know? It's like, it's a big company, it's like an institution.

   15. JRJoe Rogan15:57

       Right.

   16. FNFrancis Ngannou15:57

       You know? So, there is a way that they do thing-

   17. JRJoe Rogan16:00

       Right.

   18. FNFrancis Ngannou16:00

       ... and that can change. So I'm like, "Okay, if that's, if so, let's take boxing out." Why? Because give me three fight, contract of three fight. I was- I knew that I can knock a three fight contract in a year. Then from that moment, I was free, because I want, I want a middle ground, like a alternative, a way to get out by giving something out.

   19. JRJoe Rogan16:26

       Mm-hmm.

   20. FNFrancis Ngannou16:26

       You know?

   21. JRJoe Rogan16:27

       Right.

   22. FNFrancis Ngannou16:27

       Just to get something at the end.

   23. JRJoe Rogan16:29

       Got it.

   24. FNFrancis Ngannou16:29

       You know? Because it's really hard to get in the negotiation and just like, "Oh, I want this, I want that, I want that."

   25. JRJoe Rogan16:36

       Right.

   26. FNFrancis Ngannou16:36

       And stop there. At some point, you have to compromise to push back, give something in order to get something.

   27. JRJoe Rogan16:43

       Yeah.

   28. FNFrancis Ngannou16:44

       So, stuff like that, um, was the thing that I was about it. And, um, that seems to be attractive to them. So one, uh, three fight deal, no extension, that seems to be attractive. Two fight was supposed to be potentially Jon Jones fight and rematch, and one fight is the trilogy with Stipe.

   29. JRJoe Rogan17:09

       Hmm.

   30. FNFrancis Ngannou17:10

       That was their request, and work for both party. Then, um, we get to, (laughs) we get to another point, sponsorship deal. Why a sponsorship deal? Because, um, before that, I had a deal. After the Stipe fight, I have- I had a, a deal on the table for over $1 million for a cryptocurrency wallet. So, I was going to have, like, I think 1.2 million, which is the money that I didn't, I never had in, in the fight. I was going to have that in a sponsorship, and the deal was this close to sign. And then they announced the Crypto.com deal.
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   So, you decide to…

   1. FNFrancis Ngannou30:00

      that's not how they do thing over there.

   2. JRJoe Rogan30:03

      So, you decide to start talking to other people then?

   3. FNFrancis Ngannou30:07

      Yeah.

   4. JRJoe Rogan30:08

      And who do you talk to first?

   5. FNFrancis Ngannou30:11

      Um, people started to reach out. I wasn't even the one, uh, talking to people. And, you know, at that time, I just wanna let this weight drop out of my shoulder. For some reason, I feel relieved.... I feel relieved. There was so much pressure into that process, you know. And I was in Cameroon. I'm like, "Man, just live your life," you know?

   6. JRJoe Rogan30:36

      Mm-hmm.

   7. FNFrancis Ngannou30:37

      Whatever is yours out there will come to you. Like, but I get, um, uh, the first person that reached out was Pete Murray from PFL. And then, I was just like, "Yes, let's hear him out." And he came out, we speak, he asked like what I'm looking for and stuff. We speak, I'm like, "Ah, looks good." A couple of days after, he made a proposal. I look... I mean, I didn't even ask for not anything, but when he make a proposal, I look at the structure of that proposal. I'm like, "This is good." You know, everything was ta- being taken consideration, you know. Obviously, there's always, there's always gonna be a way of, to negotiate in the contract, but the way that they structured it, I was already happy. I'm like, "I think this guy is trying to make me happy."

   8. JRJoe Rogan31:43

      Yeah.

   9. FNFrancis Ngannou31:43

      Right?

   10. JRJoe Rogan31:43

       Well, they need someone like you.

   11. FNFrancis Ngannou31:45

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan31:45

       PFL doesn't really have the big stars.

   13. FNFrancis Ngannou31:48

       Yeah. So, but we keep that contra- and at that time, I'm like, "Let's wait. I'm not rushing to anything. Take some times and everything." And then, we-

   14. JRJoe Rogan31:59

       So, you didn't sign that yet?

   15. FNFrancis Ngannou32:00

       No, I didn't sign.

   16. JRJoe Rogan32:02

       No.

   17. FNFrancis Ngannou32:02

       We also get to a Chatri. Even Chatri reach out. We talk, same thing, and then couple of days, (laughs) they send their own contract. But when I was put in that contract next to the PFL one, it was day and night.

   18. JRJoe Rogan32:22

       The PFL was much better?

   19. FNFrancis Ngannou32:23

       Yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan32:24

       Okay.

   21. FNFrancis Ngannou32:25

       In the-

   22. JRJoe Rogan32:26

       And did PFL, uh, put a clause in to allow you to box?

   23. FNFrancis Ngannou32:30

       Yeah.

   24. JRJoe Rogan32:30

       Yeah.

   25. FNFrancis Ngannou32:30

       N- no. Boxing was, was first for me. Right?

   26. JRJoe Rogan32:33

       And would the PFL be involved in the boxing promotion?

   27. FNFrancis Ngannou32:36

       That was up to me.

   28. JRJoe Rogan32:37

       Okay.

   29. FNFrancis Ngannou32:37

       That was up to me, but they didn't really like want to. It's not their expertise, but if they can help in some way or be involved in some way, again, it's up to me, right?

   30. JRJoe Rogan32:50

       Okay.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Right. …

   1. FNFrancis Ngannou45:00

      I think e- easy job."

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:01

      Right.

   3. FNFrancis Ngannou45:01

      No, man.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:02

      Yeah.

   5. FNFrancis Ngannou45:02

      When the guy's in the ring moving, you're like, "Okay, is it, like, something that they are remoting or something?" I'm like, "No, don't you fool me. I have seen you."

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:10

      No, he's very, very skillful.

   7. FNFrancis Ngannou45:12

      Yeah.

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:12

      Very skillful.

   9. FNFrancis Ngannou45:14

      Yeah.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:14

       But, you know, you have probably the most sensational punching power I've ever seen in the heavyweight division in the UFC.

   11. FNFrancis Ngannou45:22

       Um-

   12. JRJoe Rogan45:23

       It's you and Derrick Lewis. Is... You're the two biggest-

   13. FNFrancis Ngannou45:25

       May-

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:25

       ... knockout artists ever.

   15. FNFrancis Ngannou45:26

       Maybe. But again, uh, I think in the heavyweight division, everybody can knock-

   16. JRJoe Rogan45:32

       Yes.

   17. FNFrancis Ngannou45:32

       ... everybody out.

   18. JRJoe Rogan45:33

       Yep.

   19. FNFrancis Ngannou45:33

       The problem is to connect.

   20. JRJoe Rogan45:36

       Yes.

   21. FNFrancis Ngannou45:36

       That's the most problem, bro.

   22. JRJoe Rogan45:38

       Yeah.

   23. FNFrancis Ngannou45:38

       When you walk to... Everybody hit somebody in the shin-

   24. JRJoe Rogan45:42

       Right.

   25. FNFrancis Ngannou45:42

       ... it's going down.

   26. JRJoe Rogan45:43

       But can you connect?

   27. FNFrancis Ngannou45:43

       How to connect.

   28. JRJoe Rogan45:44

       Yeah.

   29. FNFrancis Ngannou45:45

       The delivery system.

   30. JRJoe Rogan45:46

       Yes.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:15:00

   Right. …

   1. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00:00

      f- find all those stuff, but you have it in your mind.

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:00:03

      Right.

   3. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00:03

      You can speak to yourself.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:00:05

      Right.

   5. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00:05

      You can question to yourself. I mean, I don't need a sports psychology to tell me why I'm doing this. It's out of passion. I do this because I love it. It's, it's not a job, you understand?

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:00:18

      Yeah.

   7. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00:19

      I question myself, like, "Why did I get here? How come did I came from where I came from and get here?" Then I find all those reason, and then therefore, I put my s- my stuff together, right? Maybe some people do. Some people clearly need people to like, uh, uh, help them to control their self. Uh, I see that in a lot of fighter. Basically, they need, like, a coach or something, somebody to tell them what to do, like they don't know, like to tell them what time to train.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:00:55

      Mm-hmm.

   9. FNFrancis Ngannou1:00:56

      I'm like, "You know you have a fight."... you gonna, you schedule your training at this time, you have this and this to work on. You can schedule that and get there every day at the same time, uh, do your thing, go home, get ready for another day. But some people do need somebody to get them that.

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:01:16

       So, do you schedule all your training?

   11. FNFrancis Ngannou1:01:18

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:01:19

       Everything?

   13. FNFrancis Ngannou1:01:20

       I schedule everything.

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:01:21

       Really?

   15. FNFrancis Ngannou1:01:21

       Yeah. And my team, I organize all my team, you know, mostly about people that I feel the good energy about because, again, I don't believe in so many things. I don't believe in, like, "Oh, this guy is the great, uh, he's a great trainer. He can do this." No. I believe that everything comes from a fighter and the energy that people around him can bring, can help you win. So, when I ... In my team, I favor people energy. People like, how ... The energy that they brings around, you know, I favor them and that's how I judge if somebody is best or not, is by his energy.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:02:02

       Mm.

   17. FNFrancis Ngannou1:02:02

       And that's how I get along with, um, pretty much everybody of my team. We, I judge everybody based on this energy. If I feel like this is ... I'd rather have a good person next to me and then not to say my, my team... My team is great. They are all great. Everybody's very professional, um, commit, but if I feel like somebody has this energy and not even great, as great, I prefer that person than somebody that is g- a great trainer and don't bring that energy because-

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:02:42

       Mm.

   19. FNFrancis Ngannou1:02:43

       ... the energy is very important.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:02:45

       Yeah, you know-

   21. FNFrancis Ngannou1:02:46

       You know, wha- wha- when you start to get tired, when you're in the tough situation, the voice that you can listen and t- trust is more important-

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:02:53

       Right.

   23. FNFrancis Ngannou1:02:53

       ... than the technique that you can learn. You can't know all the techniques in the world and if you get there, your mind is not right, you are not doing shit.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:03:00

       Mm. Yeah.

   25. FNFrancis Ngannou1:03:02

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:03:03

       Yeah.

   27. FNFrancis Ngannou1:03:03

       But-

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:03:03

       So, the energy of the people you got, that's all down.

   29. FNFrancis Ngannou1:03:06

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:03:06

       You got a great trainer in Dewey Cooper.
6. 1:15:00 – 1:28:45

   Mm-hmm. …

   1. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:00

      It was the completely opposite way. They say, "Oh, Ciryl Gane has a cardio after two round... After a fight... He can't fight two fights a night. "I'm like, "Bro, come on. It depends." You know? And at the end of the fight, I'm like, "I'm not sure that he's ready to fight another fight. To take another fight on tonight."

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:15:19

      Mm-hmm.

   3. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:19

      You know? And, uh, unlike what they predicted, I lost the two first round and I started to win from the third round.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:15:28

      Hmm.

   5. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:28

      Which is like the contrary of what they predicted. (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:15:30

      Yeah.

   7. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:31

      So.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:15:31

      But nobody knew that your knee was that fucked up either, though.

   9. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:35

      (sighs)

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:15:36

       The UFC, the UFC knew it was injured. They let you wrap it, right?

   11. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:39

       No, no. They know. They know everything.

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:15:40

       They knew everything?

   13. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:41

       Yeah. When I did the MRI, he went to Dr. Deivison.

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:15:47

       Mm-hmm.

   15. FNFrancis Ngannou1:15:47

       And then when he was explaining it to me, he said, "Only, uh, four people know about this by now. Dana, Hunter, you and I." That's when he was ex-... How he was explaining it to me.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:15:59

       Did you consider pulling out of the fight?

   17. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:01

       (sighs) I thought... Yeah. In... You know, in the perfect scenario, I would have pulled out of the fight. You know? But I, I didn't wanna give them a opportunity-

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:16:13

       Another extension.

   19. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:15

       It wasn't about the extension. It was just to bury me.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:16:19

       Hmm.

   21. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:20

       I didn't wanna give the opportunity to bury me.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:16:22

       Yeah.

   23. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:23

       You know how...

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:16:24

       (clears throat)

   25. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:24

       You know how in this war they say, "Okay, I'm gonna die with my sword in my hand."

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:16:29

       Yes.

   27. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:30

       Yeah. It was about... It was like, "Okay, I'm dying with my sword in my hand."

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:16:34

       Yeah. Poof. That's a lot of pressure.

   29. FNFrancis Ngannou1:16:38

       Yeah. But when I heard about... When they explained to me what was going on in my knee, I was very, um... I was very worry. Then for somehow, I call... I g-... I ca-... I, I called Kamaru or he called me. Anyway, we were in the phone and we were talking and he would explain me like, uh, what he had and this. And I remember once I saw him in Vegas when he fought, I think it was C- Koby Covington the first time. And the guy was messed up, man. He was working like this in a fight a week, getting cortisone shots here and there. I'm like, "Damn, this guy is going to fight..." No, I thi-... Maybe it was Ty- Tyron Woodley. Said, "So this guy is going to fight on Saturday?" I was so worried. I feel bad about it. Man, at that night, he was sharp.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:17:38

       Hmm.

Episode duration: 1:58:53