JRE MMA Show #40 with Eddie Bravo

1. 0:00 – 2:08

   Bruce Lee as a rite of passage: introducing Eddie’s son to the master

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      Ready?

   2. EBEddie Bravo0:00

      Um, (sighs) let's do it.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:03

      Four, three, two, one. Boom! And we're live.

   4. EBEddie Bravo0:08

      (coughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:08

      You were just telling me- you were just telling me how your son is getting into Bruce Lee. 'Cause we were looking at this, uh ... Shout out to, uh ... How do you pronounce his name correctly?

   6. EBEddie Bravo0:18

      Bruce Lee.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:19

      No, pla- Plastisel. Plastisel dude.

   8. EBEddie Bravo0:21

      (laughs)

   9. YJYoung Jamie0:21

      Um, I don't know-

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:22

       I've only seen it written.

   11. YJYoung Jamie0:23

       ... which of the two actually made it. But yeah, Plastisel, I believe is the name of it, yeah.

   12. EBEddie Bravo0:25

       (sighs)

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:25

       Yeah, but, but I mean, how do you pronounce the artist name?

   14. YJYoung Jamie0:28

       I think it's Phong.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:29

       Is it Phong?

   16. YJYoung Jamie0:29

       Phong Tran, I think is his name.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:29

       Yeah. Shout out to Phong. This thing is the shit. His art is amazing, these little Plastisel things. Look at this-

   18. EBEddie Bravo0:35

       Yeah.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:35

       ... Rory MacDonald, how great is that?

   20. EBEddie Bravo0:37

       Yeah, th- the whole lineup's amazing.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:39

       Yeah.

   22. EBEddie Bravo0:39

       I mean those are-

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:39

       Biggy, sunglasses come off.

   24. EBEddie Bravo0:41

       ... legends. Nothing but legends.

   25. JRJoe Rogan0:42

       Legends.

   26. EBEddie Bravo0:43

       But y- yeah. Um, you know, I wanted-

   27. JRJoe Rogan0:45

       How old's your son now?

   28. EBEddie Bravo0:46

       He's six now. And you hear these, uh, stories-

   29. JRJoe Rogan0:50

       (coughs)

   30. EBEddie Bravo0:50

       ... um, constantly about people remembering the first time they saw a Bruce Lee movie.
2. 2:08 – 5:39

   Nunchuck compilations, ‘Bruce always wins,’ and the kid-question gauntlet

   1. JRJoe Rogan2:08

      Has he seen anybody do it on video or only learned it from a class?

   2. EBEddie Bravo2:11

      This is, this is what happened. So he's, he's all into nunchucks, he's beating me up with them all the time. He loves nunchucks. And I, and I said, um... Oh, then I wore one of those Roots of Fight shirts.

   3. JRJoe Rogan2:20

      Oh.

   4. EBEddie Bravo2:20

      And it was Bruce Lee with nunchucks, right?

   5. JRJoe Rogan2:23

      (laughs)

   6. EBEddie Bravo2:24

      And he looked at my shirt and he said, "Daddy, who's the guy with the nunchucks?" And I thought, "Okay, it's time."

   7. JRJoe Rogan2:31

      (laughs)

   8. EBEddie Bravo2:32

      It's time. (laughs) "Son, sit down." So you know kids are so easily brainwashed. I can get my kid into Satanism.

   9. YJYoung Jamie2:43

      That's funny.

   10. JRJoe Rogan2:43

       You ever seen this little kid?

   11. EBEddie Bravo2:44

       Yeah, yeah. He's amazing. He's amazing.

   12. JRJoe Rogan2:46

       He's got the Bruce Lee outfit on-

   13. EBEddie Bravo2:47

       Hey.

   14. JRJoe Rogan2:47

       ... and everything. The jumpsuit.

   15. EBEddie Bravo2:49

       Dr- dr-

   16. JRJoe Rogan2:49

       This kid's a beast.

   17. EBEddie Bravo2:50

       He's a- amazing. And he's got-

   18. JRJoe Rogan2:52

       What-

   19. EBEddie Bravo2:52

       ... he's got, uh, the Game of Death sequence down.

   20. JRJoe Rogan2:54

       It says, uh, the video is, "My son," and then in parentheses, uh, "five-year-old acting Bruce Lee's nunchuck a scene."

   21. EBEddie Bravo3:03

       Yeah. Yeah, he reenacts the whole thing note for note. I think he was on like America's Got Talent or some shit too.

   22. JRJoe Rogan3:09

       Wow.

   23. EBEddie Bravo3:09

       So I sat him down and I, and I explained to him, I go, "The master of the nunchucks, the number one guy..." You know, 'cause l- like I was, like I was saying earlier, you could get kids to believe in anything. You could brain... I could, I could get my son into Satan easily. He'd be all a- about Lucifer. Boom. I got him into the Browns quick.

   24. JRJoe Rogan3:29

       But they're little kids.

   25. EBEddie Bravo3:29

       Yeah, little kids.

   26. JRJoe Rogan3:30

       Yeah.

   27. EBEddie Bravo3:30

       You know-

   28. JRJoe Rogan3:30

       Very malleable.

   29. EBEddie Bravo3:31

       Yeah, totally.

   30. JRJoe Rogan3:32

       Yeah.
3. 5:39 – 10:54

   Rewatching Enter the Dragon: plot details, villains, and the ‘fast-forward the nudity’ moment

   1. EBEddie Bravo5:39

      Yeah, he got completely blown away. So a week later, a week later I go, "Today you're gonna watch the greatest martial arts movie of all time." "Enter the Dragon 'cause it's Bruce Lee, Dad, isn't it?" I go, "Yes, it's Bruce Lee."

   2. JRJoe Rogan5:54

      (laughs)

   3. EBEddie Bravo5:54

      So we sat him down, we put on fi- and he can't stop asking fucking questions about every guy. "Okay, Daddy, who are the good guys? And who are the bad guys? Is he a bad guy or is he a good guy?" So we got it down, the three main good guys. You know, Bruce Lee is the main good guy. Uh, um, Williams was, um, uh-... his name escapes me, the Black famous martial artist. Jim Kelly, Jim Kelly.

   4. JRJoe Rogan6:20

      Oh, wow-

   5. EBEddie Bravo6:20

      Yeah, yeah.

   6. JRJoe Rogan6:20

      ... I forgot about Jim Kelly.

   7. EBEddie Bravo6:21

      Yeah, hey, Jim Kelly's awesome. And, uh, he did die in the movie, which, I mean, they were doing that shit back then. You know what I mean? Uh-

   8. JRJoe Rogan6:29

      They were killing good guys.

   9. EBEddie Bravo6:30

      And then Roper, John Saxon, he was the third-

   10. JRJoe Rogan6:33

       That's right, John Saxon.

   11. EBEddie Bravo6:33

       ... good guy. Yeah, it was Roper, Williams and Bruce Lee and they were all-

   12. JRJoe Rogan6:37

       Look at that.

   13. EBEddie Bravo6:37

       ... they were the good guys. And the bad guys, do you remember the bad guys' names?

   14. JRJoe Rogan6:40

       No.

   15. EBEddie Bravo6:41

       Han was the, the, uh, the dude on the top left. He's the-

   16. JRJoe Rogan6:44

       He's the guy with the claws?

   17. EBEddie Bravo6:46

       ... former Shaolin monk who went bad-

   18. JRJoe Rogan6:49

       Oh.

   19. EBEddie Bravo6:49

       ... and started selling heroin on his island and-

   20. JRJoe Rogan6:52

       (laughs)

   21. EBEddie Bravo6:52

       ... and, and, and, uh-

   22. JRJoe Rogan6:54

       Oh.

   23. EBEddie Bravo6:54

       ... prostitution rings and all that shit.

   24. JRJoe Rogan6:56

       Dude, I completely forgot the plot of this movie.

   25. EBEddie Bravo6:58

       Are you kidding me?

   26. JRJoe Rogan6:59

       Yeah.

   27. EBEddie Bravo6:59

       It's the greatest fucking plot ever.

   28. JRJoe Rogan7:00

       Well, I r- I remember watching it-

   29. EBEddie Bravo7:02

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan7:02

       ... but it, it's ... You know, I didn't take it seriously, I always thought it was fun. I always, I always looked at it not like, "Holy shit, we're gonna see this wild action movie."
4. 10:54 – 15:59

   Why Way/Return of the Dragon is ‘corny’—but the Colosseum fight still rules

   1. EBEddie Bravo10:54

      He was blown away and, uh, mission accomplished. He's, he's Bruce Lee's number one in, uh, to him and ... But I made a mistake. The next week, I'm, I made him sit down and watch Return of the Dragon, which the end scene was a great scene with Chuck Norris in the old Rome Colosseum.

   2. JRJoe Rogan11:12

      Mm-hmm.

   3. EBEddie Bravo11:12

      But the whole movie before that is so bad.

   4. JRJoe Rogan11:16

      (laughs)

   5. EBEddie Bravo11:18

      It's so bad. And Bruce Lee, he, he, he directed it-

   6. JRJoe Rogan11:22

      (laughs)

   7. EBEddie Bravo11:22

      ... and, uh, and wrote it, and it was, uh, it's atrocious. It's, it's-

   8. JRJoe Rogan11:28

      (laughs)

   9. EBEddie Bravo11:28

      It's so bad.

   10. JRJoe Rogan11:30

       (laughs)

   11. EBEddie Bravo11:30

       (laughs) Except for the Chuck scene.

   12. JRJoe Rogan11:32

       Fight scene, yeah.

   13. EBEddie Bravo11:32

       Yeah, except for the end, but it's like high school kids put together, that movie.

   14. JRJoe Rogan11:36

       Damn.

   15. EBEddie Bravo11:36

       It's terrible.

   16. JRJoe Rogan11:37

       I'm gonna have to go back and watch that.

   17. EBEddie Bravo11:38

       Terrible.

   18. JRJoe Rogan11:38

       Yo, you know what we should do? We should do a fight companion. We've gotta like-

   19. EBEddie Bravo11:43

       And watch Enter the Dragon?

   20. JRJoe Rogan11:45

       Yeah, let's do that.

   21. EBEddie Bravo11:45

       That would be fucking great, dude. Are you kidding?

   22. JRJoe Rogan11:47

       Come on, man. A fight companion and watch Enter the Dragon.

   23. EBEddie Bravo11:49

       Look at this, look at this scene. So they're, uh, it takes place in Italy. His, uh, one of his, like, think his uncle or just-

   24. JRJoe Rogan11:57

       (laughs)

   25. EBEddie Bravo11:58

       ... or just somebody he knows has a Chinese restaurant in Italy. And the Italian mob, these guys, these are the goons, they're trying to run him out of business and, and, uh, control their business or, or pay them off to take the building or something. And they're, they're resisting in Italy, so they send, uh, Bruce Lee from Hong Kong to handle the mob in Italy.

   26. JRJoe Rogan12:22

       Dude, this looks so corny.

   27. EBEddie Bravo12:23

       It's-... fucking bad, dude. (laughs)

   28. JRJoe Rogan12:26

       So, what do you think happened? You think Bruce Lee was just partying too much, doing a little blow, having a good time out on the town, being a big Hollywood star, puts together this movie and just got a little crazy with it?

   29. EBEddie Bravo12:36

       Y- you know what?

   30. JRJoe Rogan12:36

       (laughs)
5. 15:59 – 16:51

   Bruce Lee’s realism: feints, cross-training, and the birth of ‘use what works’

   1. EBEddie Bravo15:59

      But with Bruce Lee fight scenes, what I like about them is you could see him... Although, you know, him beating up 50 guys at a time, you know, that, you know, how- how real can that be? But he does w- on one-on-one fights, he does a lot of feinting.

   2. JRJoe Rogan16:16

      Mm-hmm.

   3. EBEddie Bravo16:16

      He'll do boxing stuff, he'll do wrestling, he'll do jujitsu.

   4. JRJoe Rogan16:20

      Yeah.

   5. EBEddie Bravo16:20

      You see him mix it up and he's trying to make it, uh, a- a lot more realistic. Like the, you know, then you have, uh, your classic kung fu theater type movies where they're just like, "Ah, cha, cha, cha, pa, cha, cha."

   6. JRJoe Rogan16:32

      Right.

   7. EBEddie Bravo16:35

      "Cha, cha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha." You're like-

   8. JRJoe Rogan16:37

      Yeah.

   9. EBEddie Bravo16:37

      ... that shit is, just gets old.

   10. JRJoe Rogan16:38

       Those movies are so crazy.

   11. EBEddie Bravo16:39

       Bruce Lee, Bruce Lee will dance around, he'll throw a jab, feint, kick you in the leg, f- fake low, go high and knock you out. He does that against, uh, Chuck Norris-

   12. JRJoe Rogan16:48

       Yeah.

   13. EBEddie Bravo16:48

       ... in- in- in, uh, Way of the Dragon.

6. 16:51 – 20:13

   Two pillars of modern martial arts: Bruce Lee and the Gracies (and the UFC inflection point)

   1. JRJoe Rogan16:51

      And if you go back to 1970, like that kind of martial art technique, (clears throat) I mean he was, he was amazing. He was also the first guy that figured out how to put a bunch of martial arts together. And just forget about, "I'm judo, you're karate."

   2. EBEddie Bravo17:05

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan17:05

      Forget about that. Just- just- just use everything that works.

   4. EBEddie Bravo17:09

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan17:09

      Everything from everywhere.

   6. EBEddie Bravo17:11

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan17:11

      That was heresy back then.

   8. EBEddie Bravo17:13

      I mean, he- he might have been, um, (sighs) he may have been the first guy to do that, really. I mean-

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:19

      One of, for sure. One of, for sure.

   10. EBEddie Bravo17:21

       Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan17:22

       He's without a doubt like the... I think there's two, arguably two of the most important figures ever in martial arts. I think he might be number one and the other one is Helio Gracie. You really think about it, it's one guy tries to figure out how to beat men who are bigger than him, has a bunch of kids, they all turn out to be fucking savage killers.

   12. EBEddie Bravo17:44

       Yeah. (laughs)

   13. JRJoe Rogan17:45

       I mean, what are the odds, you know?

   14. EBEddie Bravo17:46

       It's the craziest family of all time.

   15. JRJoe Rogan17:48

       Craziest family of all time.

   16. EBEddie Bravo17:50

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan17:50

       And if you think about it, the impacts-

   18. EBEddie Bravo17:52

       But in a crazy, in a good way. Crazy in a good way.

   19. JRJoe Rogan17:53

       But in the best way possible.

   20. EBEddie Bravo17:55

       Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan17:55

       With 100% respect. I mean, Rickson, Royce, Royler, Helsen, you know, what the fuck, man?

   22. EBEddie Bravo18:01

       And there was different sides and even the-

   23. JRJoe Rogan18:04

       Yes.

   24. EBEddie Bravo18:04

       ... Gracies had, uh, you know, conflict within each other. It- it's- it's crazy.

   25. JRJoe Rogan18:08

       But all assassins.

   26. EBEddie Bravo18:09

       Yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan18:10

       A family of super assassins.

   28. EBEddie Bravo18:12

       Killers. Yeah.

   29. JRJoe Rogan18:12

       And then Royce who's another... I mean, it's- it's almost like Royce, although it came from Helio, he's almost as important. If he doesn't win that first Ultimate Fighting Championship, we don't- we don't get the same impact.

   30. EBEddie Bravo18:26

       Yeah.
7. 20:13 – 24:41

   Eddie’s personal origin story: from karate and boxing fandom to jiu-jitsu conversion

   1. EBEddie Bravo20:13

      UFC 1 no one really watched. They didn't have any B-roll. I remember seeing a preview for it and I would watch all boxing events no matter what. I was a boxing fanatic. I didn't miss any of those big fights ever. Even the small Tuesday night fights, I'd, I recorded that on my VCR. Always taped boxing events. Never missed them. But I didn't, I didn't watch that. I go, you know what I thought? It looks like it might be fake.

   2. JRJoe Rogan20:36

      (laughs)

   3. EBEddie Bravo20:36

      I thought it may be like a Fight Zone. Remember Fight Zone?

   4. JRJoe Rogan20:39

      Yeah.

   5. EBEddie Bravo20:40

      Uh, a little WWE but tried to make it look, uh, you know, more martial arts oriented. But... So I didn't watch it and then you end up, you know, you end up hearing, "Shit, that, that was real?" And I'll never forget my roommate came home from Guitar Center and he said, "Man, that UFC thing, that UFC Challenge, that shit's for real, man." I go, "Really?" And I was doing karate at the time and I go, "Was there a karate guy in there?" And he goes, "Yeah, but he got beat by some... I think he was Iranian, man."

   6. JRJoe Rogan21:11

      (laughs)

   7. EBEddie Bravo21:11

      "He was just choking everybody out. He would just..." I go, "He was choking everybody out? What do you mean? He would just grab their throat?" And he goes, "Dude, yeah. He would just grab their fucking throat, some Iranian guy and he would choke... He choked everybody out." That's what the guy told me at Guitar Center. I'm like, "Holy shit. Karate too?" I'm like, "Fuck, maybe I'm doing the wrong style."

   8. JRJoe Rogan21:29

      (laughs)

   9. EBEddie Bravo21:29

      And then the UFC, uh, UFC 2 came out and I, I remember I told my same roommate... He was staying home. It was on the weekend and I was going out, um, on the town and I remember calling him to say, "Hey dude, that UFC 2, that UFC Challenge thing is on. Tape it." Because I... he was gonna stay home with his girlfriend. He taped it. I got home, watched that motherfucker on tape. I c- I couldn't stand Royce Gracie that first, that first half of the show. Oh, I just wanted him to lose so bad. When he fought Minoki Ichihara... He was a karate guy. To me, that was my hero. I mean, I was doing karate for six months, man. You know what I mean?

   10. JRJoe Rogan22:04

       (laughs)

   11. EBEddie Bravo22:04

       I was all about karate. I didn't want Royce to beat him but then Roy... But by the time we got to the finals, I was a gigantic Royce fan.

   12. JRJoe Rogan22:11

       (laughs)

   13. EBEddie Bravo22:12

       I go, "You know what? I gotta learn this jujitsu." And I just quit karate and, and, um, found, uh, the Machados in the valley.

   14. JRJoe Rogan22:19

       It is really crazy when you think about what would have happened if that didn't take place. Like what would have happened if Rorion never put together the, the first Ultimate Fighter, right? It was partly his idea and Art Davies.

   15. EBEddie Bravo22:33

       Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan22:34

       What if... What would have happened if that didn't happen? Where would martial arts be? Would it be inevitable? Would somebody figure it out? Would Japan have figured it out?

   17. EBEddie Bravo22:42

       We would have figured it out eventually because-

   18. JRJoe Rogan22:43

       Maybe.

   19. EBEddie Bravo22:44

       ... uh, yeah, 'cause the j- jujitsu would have eventually grew out of Brazil.

   20. JRJoe Rogan22:47

       Right.

   21. EBEddie Bravo22:48

       There's no way you could have stopped the-

   22. JRJoe Rogan22:49

       But the way it grew...

   23. EBEddie Bravo22:50

       Yeah. And that was a huge explosion, but it would have got out eventually but with... Maybe, I mean, for sure not with the same impact.

   24. JRJoe Rogan22:58

       Yeah, but see like forever wrestlers were like... When, when you think about MMA, right now wrestling's a giant skill, right? A Mark Coleman type wrestler, big powerful wrestler who can take you down and beat you up from the top, that's giant. That was always the case but we didn't think of that. Like when you thought of like boxing versus wrestling or karate versus wrestling, nobody thought like wrestlers have a giant advantage. Nobody thought that. You would think, "Oh, the karate guy would probably fuck him up."

   25. EBEddie Bravo23:26

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan23:26

       Probably catch him with a karate chop.

   27. EBEddie Bravo23:27

       For sure.

   28. JRJoe Rogan23:28

       Knee on the way in or something like that.

   29. EBEddie Bravo23:29

       I wrestled un-... I ne- I never thought wrestling was a martial art at all.

   30. JRJoe Rogan23:32

       Yeah.
8. 24:41 – 28:47

   Pancrase vs. UFC: parallel origins, rule sets, and the ground-fighting gap

   1. EBEddie Bravo24:41

      Yeah. And like w- in Japan, they were doing Pancrase.

   2. JRJoe Rogan24:45

      Right.

   3. EBEddie Bravo24:45

      They were doing, like, judo.

   4. JRJoe Rogan24:46

      What year did they start doing Pancrase?

   5. EBEddie Bravo24:48

      I think they were doing it, uh, uh, at, you know, early '90s, and-

   6. JRJoe Rogan24:53

      So the Boss Rutten, Frank Shamrock, Ken Shamrock days, Matt Hume was in it back then. What years were those?

   7. EBEddie Bravo25:00

      Yeah, that's, that's hard to ... When was Pancrase 1 first aired?

   8. YJYoung Jamie25:06

      It was founded in '93.

   9. EBEddie Bravo25:07

      Founded in, in what month? Does it say?

   10. JRJoe Rogan25:10

       '93.

   11. EBEddie Bravo25:11

       Damn, 'cause that was the first UFC too.

   12. JRJoe Rogan25:12

       Yeah.

   13. EBEddie Bravo25:12

       No-November of '93 was the first UFC.

   14. JRJoe Rogan25:15

       (laughs) So it all basically happened around the same time.

   15. EBEddie Bravo25:17

       So may- I mean, is it possible that in November of '93, they see the UFC and then immediately Pancrase starts, like, a few weeks later and it's still '93?

   16. YJYoung Jamie25:26

       It was established on May 16th, 1993. And their first event was promoted on September 21st.

   17. EBEddie Bravo25:33

       Oh. So that was before.

   18. JRJoe Rogan25:34

       So it was established in May and then September. And what was the UFC in '93?

   19. EBEddie Bravo25:38

       November.

   20. JRJoe Rogan25:38

       November, hmm.

   21. EBEddie Bravo25:40

       Crazy.

   22. JRJoe Rogan25:40

       Interesting.

   23. EBEddie Bravo25:41

       So right before the UFC.

   24. JRJoe Rogan25:43

       So neither one of them had been on air when they both started or they were both putting it together.

   25. EBEddie Bravo25:49

       It was the same time.

   26. JRJoe Rogan25:49

       So maybe, like, the idea was in the air.

   27. EBEddie Bravo25:51

       Maybe it was in the air, bro.

   28. JRJoe Rogan25:53

       Do you believe in that? The idea's just out there in the air?

   29. EBEddie Bravo25:56

       That is pretty crazy. But the fighters in Pancrase, they, uh, didn't have the jujitsu that the Brazilians had.

   30. JRJoe Rogan26:08

       No.
9. 28:47 – 35:19

   Why BJJ isn’t ‘just judo’: time limits, guard evolution, and training incentives

   1. EBEddie Bravo28:47

      No, Sambo had it down. Sambo had some good shit.

   2. JRJoe Rogan28:50

      That was some great shit.

   3. EBEddie Bravo28:50

      And judo, yes, judo, um ... Most, if not all Brazilian jujitsu moves, I mean, have been done in judo, and they're, actually, they came from judo. We, we know that. The Japanese know that. Uh, but a, a lot of American judo guys don't ... They can't, they can't seem to grasp that, 'cause they're like, you know, "The Gracie's ripped off Newaza. It's all about Newaza." We used to ... You know, there was a, you know, a sect of judo where they did focus on the ground. But, and that's all true, but the major difference is the Brazilians, they wanted to do a style where there wasn't a time limit on the ground. In judo, you could only fight on the ground for, I don't know, 30 seconds. It's l- it's limited. It's not that much time. So when you don't have that much time, there's a lot of shit you don't need to waste your time drilling, because you're only gonna be down there for 30 seconds. You need to focus on the moves that work in 30 seconds, and that's it. You don't have time to set shit up and be patient and relax. You can't clinch and catch your breath. You gotta, it's gotta, you gotta go into it. So what the Brazilians did is, uh, just allowed the fight to unfold on the ground and, and not have any stand-ups and just let them fight on the ground. And when that happens, uh, there's a lot, uh ... There's so much more you can do when there's no time limit on the ground. Not like no time li- I mean, you know, they're not gonna sp- without stand-ups, where you could just, most of the match is take, is- takes place on the ground. S- the game just evolves so quickly and so rapidly and, and, uh, that you can't compare ... Like, e- Japanese guys come down to Brazil and they d- been doing judo their whole life, and they get smoked by Brazilians. That always happens in the World Championships. The Brazilians are just on the ground all day, you know? And the guys that do judo, they're on the ground a little bit. They're never gonna be able to compete in a sport where there's no stand-ups.You know, so to say that, uh, Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu is just Judo, it's, that's, um, you gotta think about it. You gotta really break it down-

   4. JRJoe Rogan31:00

      It's silly.

   5. EBEddie Bravo31:00

      ... because it's, yeah, it's ridiculous.

   6. JRJoe Rogan31:02

      It's silly. It's silly. There's so many silly connections that people have to arts, you know? I mean, there's, there's people that legitimately think that white people shouldn't be able to teach karate because it's cultural appropriation because it's a Japanese art. There's people that think that's stupid, you know? There's, I think all of it's martial arts now. I mean, I think the roots and the bases are very important to recognize that, you know, hey, you know, Brazil did do a crazy thing with Jiu-Jitsu. Hey, uh, the Thais did do a crazy thing with leg kicks and elbows and knees. There's really some, some people that have contributed to martial arts in this really insane way. And the people that highlight those disciplines, like the elite of the elites, like the Bucaus and the Sanchize and the Marcelo Garcias and the Jacares, like all these people that highlight it on, in each art, they're all, like, super, super important. But overall, it all comes into one thing and that's, that's martial arts. I think martial arts, it's really, um, at this point, it's really, I mean, ultimately it's, it's one thing now. Ultimately, ulti- ultimately, like, when you, when you think about UFC, when you think about just Bruce Lee movies, what is it? Like, fight, how, what's the best way to fight? It's all together now. It's all combined because the best way is not just wrestling. It's wrestling with ferocious striking. It's wrestling with leg kick defense. It's wrestling with submission holds. It's all these different things. You have to have all these things. You can't just be one thing anymore. It's interesting to be from one discipline, but it's, like, what, if your kid is coming up right now and he's, like, your son's age and he starts to learn martial arts techniques, I think by the time he gets to be our age, it's just gonna be martial arts. People are just gonna be taking martial arts. I don't think there's gonna be as, as many specialists in the future, and I think that's probably a shame. Like, but, no, who's gonna want, uh, from a guy who did Tae Kwon Do his whole life, who's gonna wanna do that now?

   7. EBEddie Bravo32:59

      Yeah, but when you're talking about Jiu-Jitsu, um, most people that do Jiu-Jitsu, um, are not doing it, uh, or they don't stay in it for the long haul and make it a lifestyle for the self-defense aspects.

   8. JRJoe Rogan33:15

      Right.

   9. EBEddie Bravo33:15

      They don't.

   10. JRJoe Rogan33:16

       No.

   11. EBEddie Bravo33:16

       They go in there 'cause they're playing a video game and they're staying in shape.

   12. JRJoe Rogan33:19

       Right.

   13. EBEddie Bravo33:19

       They're playing a, a game of death virtual reality video game trying to get taps, trying not to get, uh, tapped that much. You know? So, dude, mo- most of the guys in, in, you know, the, most of my students, they're just, like, you know, super nice sweetheart, uh, computer geeks. Just, just the nicest guys. They're, they're not in there ... They're in there-

   14. JRJoe Rogan33:40

       Right.

   15. EBEddie Bravo33:41

       ... just to play.

   16. JRJoe Rogan33:42

       Yeah. Well, it's a, there's a big difference between, um, we've talked about this before, but the big difference between guys who train together with Jiu-Jitsu and versus guys who train together with, like, kickboxing is the kickboxing people, they fucking hurt each other all the time.

   17. EBEddie Bravo33:54

       Yeah.

   18. JRJoe Rogan33:54

       Like bad.

   19. EBEddie Bravo33:55

       Yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan33:55

       Like they're beating each other up. They're kicking each other and punching each other and shit. Jiu-Jitsu guys tap each other out and then they're like, "Oh, I'm gonna get you back, bitch."

   21. EBEddie Bravo34:02

       Yeah.

   22. JRJoe Rogan34:02

       And it's, but it's okay. Everybody's okay.

   23. EBEddie Bravo34:04

       Yeah. And you've gone 100%.

   24. JRJoe Rogan34:04

       Like, "Oh, you got me. You got me."

   25. EBEddie Bravo34:05

       That's the beauty of it.

   26. JRJoe Rogan34:06

       Yeah.

   27. EBEddie Bravo34:06

       You, you, we get to s- the, the, the reason why Jiu-Jitsu is, uh, it's, I mean, opening up a Jiu-Jitsu school, like, in, in, in society today is, like, one of the safest bets out there ever.

   28. JRJoe Rogan34:19

       Right.

   29. EBEddie Bravo34:20

       It gets so addicting. You can't download Jiu-Jitsu. You can't pirate Jiu-Jitsu, you know? You c- or sparring rather.

   30. JRJoe Rogan34:26

       Right.
10. 35:19 – 1:06:42

    Street-fight realities: striking, spacing, and why sparring experience matters

    1. EBEddie Bravo35:19

       If you didn't know, if you didn't know martial arts... You know, the one thing that, uh, I'm gonna start doing once I'm totally healed again is I'm gonna start kickboxing.

    2. JRJoe Rogan35:27

       Yeah?

    3. EBEddie Bravo35:28

       Yeah. 'Cause I just see too many Instagram videos-

    4. JRJoe Rogan35:30

       (laughs)

    5. EBEddie Bravo35:31

       ... of dudes getting fucking lit up. I'm like, "You know what? It's a good idea once a week, you know?" And I'm not gonna make a big deal out of it. Maybe once a week, uh, tops. Once a week.

    6. JRJoe Rogan35:42

       Did you see that video-

    7. EBEddie Bravo35:42

       Just to go in there and just, y-

    8. JRJoe Rogan35:44

       But did you see that video he put up on Instagram today?

    9. EBEddie Bravo35:46

       No.

    10. JRJoe Rogan35:46

        From Draka? It's like a, I think it's Draka_Jr is the, the Instagram account. It's a crazy Russian account and it's, uh, two on one Russian fighting, a giant dude and two, like, normal sized guys.

    11. EBEddie Bravo35:59

        What?

    12. JRJoe Rogan35:59

        Yeah, look at this. (laughs) Give me some volume, Jamie.

    13. NANarrator36:05

        Whoa.

    14. JRJoe Rogan36:06

        This is crazy. Both these guys weigh about 160 and the other guy looks like he's about 300 fucking pounds. Look at this.

    15. NANarrator36:13

        (russian)

    16. JRJoe Rogan36:15

        Look how he's ragdolling these dudes. Fucking them up.

    17. EBEddie Bravo36:17

        Oh, shit. Those knees.

    18. JRJoe Rogan36:18

        Yeah.

    19. EBEddie Bravo36:19

        Fuck.

    20. JRJoe Rogan36:19

        This guy's giant, man. He's so much bigger than these two dudes. Oh, look at this.

    21. NANarrator36:24

        Oh.

    22. EBEddie Bravo36:24

        He's a beast. Holy shit.

    23. JRJoe Rogan36:26

        He's got good cardio too for a giant fucking dude, man.

    24. EBEddie Bravo36:28

        This is the white Kimbo.

    25. JRJoe Rogan36:30

        Yeah. Look, he's got good leg kick checking. He's got technique. He's not just a giant dude.

    26. NANarrator36:38

        (laughs)

    27. EBEddie Bravo36:39

        They're not faking it, right?

    28. JRJoe Rogan36:40

        No, man. They're beating the fuck out of each other.

    29. EBEddie Bravo36:43

        (laughs)

    30. JRJoe Rogan36:44

        Look, he's k- he's hitting this fucking guy hard.
11. 1:06:42 – 1:10:06

    Quintet explained: team submission grappling chaos and Eddie’s ‘Gio vs. Ishii’ breakdown

    1. EBEddie Bravo1:06:42

       Yeah. And it, that weekend is gonna be fucking insane 'cause that's, that's in Vegas on th- on that Saturday. The Friday before is quintet three. That's gonna be insane.

    2. JRJoe Rogan1:06:51

       What's that?

    3. EBEddie Bravo1:06:52

       Have you seen quintet yet?

    4. JRJoe Rogan1:06:53

       No.

    5. EBEddie Bravo1:06:53

       The team Jiu-Jitsu? Team savoni Jiu-Jitsu?

    6. JRJoe Rogan1:06:56

       What? What?

    7. EBEddie Bravo1:06:56

       Sakuraba show.

    8. JRJoe Rogan1:06:57

       Oh my God.

    9. EBEddie Bravo1:06:59

       Dude!

    10. JRJoe Rogan1:06:59

        Okay, okay, okay. I'm confused. I thought you meant team like four guys against four guys attacking each other all at once.

    11. EBEddie Bravo1:07:05

        No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

    12. JRJoe Rogan1:07:06

        'Cause I was watching that video, the Russian guy. It's still in my head.

    13. EBEddie Bravo1:07:08

        It's, yeah. Oh, no, no, no, no.

    14. JRJoe Rogan1:07:09

        Oh.

    15. EBEddie Bravo1:07:09

        Quintet is Sak-

    16. JRJoe Rogan1:07:10

        Yes.

    17. EBEddie Bravo1:07:10

        ... Sakuraba's show.

    18. JRJoe Rogan1:07:11

        Yes. I did. I saw that Boogie choked out Sakuraba. I was like-

    19. EBEddie Bravo1:07:14

        (laughs)

    20. JRJoe Rogan1:07:14

        ... "That is the craziest shit I've ever seen in my life."

    21. EBEddie Bravo1:07:15

        That was the craziest experience I've ever been in my life as, as far as Jiu-Jitsu goes. It's so different. We have never, we have never done this.

    22. JRJoe Rogan1:07:23

        Yeah.

    23. EBEddie Bravo1:07:24

        ... teen jiu-jitsu? It's fucking insane. There were so many ups and downs, man.

    24. JRJoe Rogan1:07:30

        It was crazy and when-

    25. EBEddie Bravo1:07:30

        It was insane.

    26. JRJoe Rogan1:07:32

        Why was Gio grappling against a guy that was so big?

    27. EBEddie Bravo1:07:35

        Well, this is the way they do it, okay? So there's four teams. It's a, it's a four-man bracket.

    28. JRJoe Rogan1:07:39

        Right.

    29. EBEddie Bravo1:07:39

        And, you know, the winner of these two teams fights the winner of these two teams and then they have, they're in the finals. So it's five on five. 950 pound weight limit. So you get to d-

    30. JRJoe Rogan1:07:49

        For the whole stack?

Episode duration: 2:01:53