JRE MMA Show #64 with Khalil Rountree Jr.

Joe Rogan 0:03 And boom. (fists thudding) What's up, man? How are you?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:06 Good, man.

Joe Rogan 0:06 Thanks for doing this.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:07 Thank you for having me on.

Joe Rogan 0:08 I was so impressed with, uh, your performance from that... past UFC that I had to, I had to talk to you.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:15 I was like, that was a- I've seen guys make, like, you were always a very dangerous striker, from obviously, from the Gokhan Saki fight. Every guy- everybody got to see that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:22 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 0:23 But to see how fluid you were against a beast like Eryk Anders. I mean, Eryk Anders is a scary cat.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 0:29 He's d- he's coming for blood, right? And you were so fast, man. It was crazy to watch. It was really interesting.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:36 Thank you.

Joe Rogan 0:36 Like, what b- If you had to give yourself a percentage leap that you've gone up over the last year, what do you think it would be?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:44 Compared to like...

Joe Rogan 0:45 Well, who you were before that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:49 Not that high of a leap. I mean-

Joe Rogan 0:50 Not that high of a leap.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 0:51 Like, that performance for me was like, I feel good about it, but that was only four months. So I'm like, I know that there's so much more for me to gain.

Joe Rogan 1:00 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00 That's why I'm like, yeah, I gotta go back. So the leap not, not too much because I know there's still a lot more to go.

Joe Rogan 1:06 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07 A lot more. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:08 Wow. So you've decided... So for people who don't understand what we're talking about, you went to Thailand.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:12 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:13 You spent four months down in Thailand. And, um, you, you, dude you f- were fighting like a Thai boxer.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:18 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:18 It was crazy, like, Mark Dellograte, who, uh, works in the production truck-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:22 He's the guy who picks out the instant replays. He and I talk back and forth sometimes while the fight's going on.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:26 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:27 And Mark, Mark, you know, with his heavy Boston accent, like, "Dude, classic Thai."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:31 "He's classic Thai stance."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:33 He was just so light on that front leg, dude.

Joe Rogan 1:35 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:36 Wow!

Joe Rogan 1:36 Dude, that inside leg kick was so ferocious.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:39 It was fun to watch, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:40 So, it's just... Usually, wherever I go, um, I've always been good at just, like, kind of absorbing the culture. I'm a guy, like, I can go into a room full of people, and I can just kind of pick up what the energy is like. And that's another reason why I wanted to go to Thailand. So, just the way that they train, and the discipline, the power, but the relaxation. Like, everything I was learning, just like, man, there's so much more to Muay Thai.

Joe Rogan 2:10 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 2:10 So I would just, even the days that I didn't train, I'd just sit around and just watch these guys because Muay Thai is more than just punching, kicking, elbows. I mean, there's balance, you know what I mean? There's, there's repetition. Like, how many kicks are you throwing? You know, the guys at the stadiums, they're like, they're kick, kick, kick, kick, kick.

Joe Rogan 2:27 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 2:28 So I was able to learn a lot, man. And there's still a lot to go.

Joe Rogan 2:32 It's beautiful to see someone on that pursuit. And I think it's, um... It's much like Roger Mayweather said about boxing, like, most people don't know shit about boxing.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 2:41 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 2:41 The way he said that it's like, if anybody is gonna say that, he's gonna say that, because there are levels and layers.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 2:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 2:47 And there's, there's paths to go down. And it's interesting when you see someone f- uh, li- committed with a very, uh, like, a very specific style, like, your, like, your adoption of that Muay Thai style. So ef- it's so effective as a striking style. It's really interesting when you think of all the different ways to attack with striking-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:07 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 3:08 ... that that one way became very particularly successful.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:11 You know what? Before I even started training MMA as a whole, um, my first mixed martial, my first martial arts class was a Muay Thai class. I knew that I wanted to train Muay Thai or learn Muay Thai.

Joe Rogan 3:26 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:27 Um, and so since I've started, I always thought like, "Yeah, I wanna go there," you know? Just maybe it's cool. But, um, Muay Thai has always been my thing, but I'd never really learned it, like, the actual way. You know-

Joe Rogan 3:40 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:40 ... like, from the roots-

Joe Rogan 3:41 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:41 ... of, uh, of where it comes from. Always just kind of like passed down or like Brazilian style Muay Thai.

Joe Rogan 3:46 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:47 You know, like shoot the box type stuff. So-

Joe Rogan 3:49 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:49 Um, that's completely different from stadium Muay Thai. And most people don't know shit about stadium Muay Thai, you know?

Joe Rogan 3:56 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 3:56 Like, unless you go to, unless you go to Bangkok.

Joe Rogan 3:58 Let's characterize it for people.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:00 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 4:00 Would you say that that Curitiba style is just way more aggressive, different, uh, different way they utilize techniques?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:07 Yeah, it's, it's-

Joe Rogan 4:08 Not light on the front leg.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:09 So-

Joe Rogan 4:10 Sometimes they are. Like, Mor- Shogun would be light on his front leg a little bit.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:14 One thing that they were doing a lot that's pretty similar is just, like, they go at it. Shoot the box, they'll go at it-

Joe Rogan 4:19 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:19 ... and you just go until the other guy stops, pretty much. Um, but from the shoot the box that was, like, very combo based, like, punches and kicks. So, like, one, two. Like, you have to memorize these crazy combos. Cordero is, he, like, I think he's one of the guys that just, like, passed it down a lot.

Joe Rogan 4:36 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:37 There's Diego Lima, I think, guys like that. But-

Joe Rogan 4:38 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:39 ... they have this system, and it's very, like, combination based, um, memory slipping, punch, kick, all the stuff. But the Thais are just like, it's just straight kick, you know, like, punch. If you, you fall down on that front foot, elbow, knee. It's just, uh, it's broken down completely differently.

Joe Rogan 4:58 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 4:58 Um, it's just a whole, a whole different style. Yeah, it is. Like, so the, the shoot the box stuff has punches, kicks, knees, elbows, combinations, same tools that you're gonna use in Muay Thai, but Muay Thai has got a whole different game plan.

Joe Rogan 5:10 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 5:11 You know, clinching, like, I've never trained as much clinching in America as I have in Thailand in just four months. And I've been fighting or training now for like nine years. So just in four months, I've gotten more clinch time in Thailand than I have, you know, in my whole career.

Joe Rogan 5:27 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 5:27 And that's because it's a whole different game. You got to master the clinch in T- in, in Muay Thai, you have to for effective, like, real true Muay Thai.

Joe Rogan 5:36 Are you getting a lot of wrestling over there?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 5:38 Yeah. So that's one thing, too. I heard, um, I heard Schaub talking about it. Um, Tiger has amazing s- like, it's am- an amazing gym. 40 to 60 guys on the mat from everywhere. Chechnya.

Joe Rogan 5:51 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 5:52 You know, in- everywhere and everywhere, man. Those guys, they come there maybe for a week, maybe two weeks.

Joe Rogan 5:58 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 5:58 Um, maybe for a month. But you're getting constant, um, good training. Uh, grappling, everything, MMA, boxing.... CrossFit, ev- everything you need is in one place. It's, it's, it blew my mind being there, honestly.

Joe Rogan 6:11 Um, that's fascinating. And your, y- do, are you st- the coaches that you were working with before, are you still working with them in Thailand? Are you just gonna... uh, y- I know you talked about actually moving to Thailand?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 6:23 Yeah, yeah. The plan is to move there, like, as soon as possible.

Joe Rogan 6:25 Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 6:26 Yeah. So, I was like hitting you up, like, "Joe, I want to get on your show."

Joe Rogan 6:29 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 6:29 "I want to talk a little bit." Um, but, yeah, I wanna, um, the plan is to move to Thailand, like, within the next couple weeks, for at least a year. And I wanna go there just because I can just train. The, the lifestyle is completely different. I can walk to the gym, hop on a motorbike. It's just, it's so simple. Um, but to a- answer the question about my coaches, um, I always have my brother in my corner. He's just kind of like moral support. We started this together. Um, I had a conditioning coach/friend/mental type of, like, support, um, Lorenzo Pavelka, and then my head coaches have switched probably two or three times in the last couple fights. I had Kenny Johnson from Blackhouse, um, John Wood from Syndicate, and now I have George Hickman from Tiger Muay Thai. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 7:17 And so, this change that you decided to make, uh, did it come after the Johnny Walker fight?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 7:23 Yeah. So, the Johnny Walker fight, like, that camp was tough, man. Like, I was doing so much to try to improve in my wrestling and grappling because that was always, like, a big hole in my game. Um, so I spent so much time wrestling over at Blackhouse with Kevin Casey, and this guy that I fought, Blake Shroup, they're huge. And these guys are great grapplers. So-

Joe Rogan 7:47 Kevin Casey's a powerhouse.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 7:48 Yeah. He'll put you into the ground and he feels like cement block on top of you.

Joe Rogan 7:51 Yeah. That's old school hicks and jujitsu.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 7:53 Exactly. High pressure, man.

Joe Rogan 7:55 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 7:55 So, um, yeah, I would, I was just grinding myself into the mat every day for that camp expecting like, "Okay, I'm comfortable on the feet. If he goes to the ground, I'm ready." And, um, I, I think I just completely lost sight of, like, my striking, my Muay Thai in that fight. His size, everything, I just kind of froze up, man. I was just like, "Uh," I didn't know what to do, how to get there, so...

Joe Rogan 8:17 Well, it's all part of the education, right? I mean, this is what this, this career of fighting that you're, you're on this path, is what it's all about.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 8:24 Yeah. And fighting for me is like big self-awareness too, you know?

Joe Rogan 8:27 I think it's always important though, when a guy has a setback, to see how he responds. Some people get discouraged, some people get encouraged, some people just decide, like, they're gonna be much more committed, and that's what you did.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 8:38 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:38 You just... I mean, making that move to do your camp in Thailand and seeing how it paid off, I mean, Eryk Anders is a very tough customer and you essentially shut him out.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 8:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 8:47 I mean, it was very, very impressive, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 8:49 That was the, that was the, the plan though because I knew he was tough.

Joe Rogan 8:52 He's tough.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 8:53 I've trained with him before, I sparred with him before that, everything. And like, he's, I've watched all of his fights. The guy's hard to put away.

Joe Rogan 8:59 We were making a case for the fight being stopped.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:02 We were making a case. I mean, DC was, uh, saying, like, "The, we can stop this fight." I was saying it. I was like, "You're, you are fucking his legs up." We were like, "This is-"

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:10 I didn't think about it during the fight. I wasn't like-

Joe Rogan 9:11 I'm sure you weren't.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:12 "... Oh gosh, let's stop it." Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:12 But that guy's so damn tough. He kept coming, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:15 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 9:16 I mean, he, he never stopped trying to win that fight.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:18 Yeah, there's no quit in him.

Joe Rogan 9:20 None.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:20 I mean, even in the-

Joe Rogan 9:21 Zero.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:21 ... in the Santos fight, remember?

Joe Rogan 9:22 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:22 Like, it was just going-

Joe Rogan 9:23 Do or die.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:23 They were-

Joe Rogan 9:24 Do or die.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:25 Yeah. No, then he tweets-

Joe Rogan 9:26 He said-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:26 ... he was like, "I haven't been that tired since like my wedding night," or something like that.

Joe Rogan 9:28 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:29 He's always got good, good tweets after the fight.

Joe Rogan 9:31 I, I l-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:31 Shout out to Eryk Anders.

Joe Rogan 9:32 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:32 I love what Jon Anik said too. He loves when he fights 'cause then Bruce Buffer has to say, "Ya boy." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 9:38 (laughs) Ya boy!

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:41 Eric, ya boy!

Joe Rogan 9:45 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:45 (laughs) Hey, why does, uh, where does he keep his suits, man? He's got a new suit every-

Joe Rogan 9:49 Oh, he's, he's a bad motherfucker, dude.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:51 ... he's just-

Joe Rogan 9:51 The insides of him always has, like, different decorations and shit.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:54 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 9:54 They commemorate different places where we're at. Bruce Buffer, he's, he's got style.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 9:59 I just imagine him have a level in his house just, oh, like suits-

Joe Rogan 10:02 Oh, yeah. Sure.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:03 ... like a mall. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 10:04 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:04 Like, you go into a, to the Nordstrom or something.

Joe Rogan 10:06 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:06 But his is just all suits that he's worn before.

Joe Rogan 10:08 Uh, I mean, well, un- unless he donates 'em. He might donate them to charity.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:12 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:13 Y- that might be one of the, or auction them for charity or something like that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:16 Oh, that'd be good.

Joe Rogan 10:16 Yeah. He's a, he's a fun dude. He's the best ring announcer of all time too, man. When that guy starts wailing-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:22 ... you get so pumped up.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:24 Seriously.

Joe Rogan 10:24 He, his fucking head gets red. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:26 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:27 He's like, he's so intense, man. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:29 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:29 Like if you watch boxing, th- they're much more smooth, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:33 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 10:34 When Bruce Buffer gets into it, man-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:36 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:36 ... he digs in.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:37 I remember seeing him first yell at, like, at TJ Dillashaw, and he was like, "Oh."

Joe Rogan 10:41 Yeah. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:41 I was like, "Oh, shit." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:43 He gives you goosebumps.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:44 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 10:45 He really does. He gives you goosebumps.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:46 Yeah, you just feel his energy, right? You're just like-

Joe Rogan 10:48 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:48 ... "I'm there wait- ready for a fight." Like, I'm kinda nervous and then Bruce comes over like...

Joe Rogan 10:52 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:53 Out of the blue corner, you're like, "Oh, all right."

Joe Rogan 10:55 You're talking about a dude who blew his ACL out from jumping up in the air-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 10:59 (sighs)

Joe Rogan 10:59 ... while he was reading someone's name.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:00 Remember that? Oh my gosh.

Joe Rogan 11:01 That's how intense he gets.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:03 Bruce here is tough dude.

Joe Rogan 11:03 He blew his knee.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:04 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:04 He's fucked his knee up from just getting crazy.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:07 Oh, man.

Joe Rogan 11:08 Yeah. That's-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:09 Oh, Joe, really quick.

Joe Rogan 11:10 What do you, what do you got?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:11 Okay. So, um, remember I told you to turn your AirDrop on?

Joe Rogan 11:14 Yes, yes.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:15 During the show. Um, so I didn't wanna come here empty-handedly. So, I haven't slept in probably, hmm, 24 hours, more than 24 hours. But last night, I was drawing and I know you like art so I was like-

Joe Rogan 11:32 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:32 ... "Oh, let me, let me draw these illustrations for you." So, I just wanna send them to you.

Joe Rogan 11:36 Okay.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:37 So turn your AirDrop on.

Joe Rogan 11:38 It's on.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:39 And as soon as it comes through, I'll send them. But yeah, I really, just like, man, yeah, I just wanna, if you wanna keep them, use them for like wallpapers or post them up, whatever you want.

Joe Rogan 11:50 You made this?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:51 Yeah, I did all of these, man.

Joe Rogan 11:53 Dude, that's... I look ridiculous.

Narrator 11:55 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 11:55 Yeah, I did the little like... (laughs)

Joe Rogan 11:57 (laughs) I'll put it on, uh, Instagram later.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:00 Cool, man.

Joe Rogan 12:00 That's very cute.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:01 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 12:02 Well, it looks like me.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:03 I'm getting ugly.

Joe Rogan 12:04 As I get older, I see pictures of me when I was younger.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:06 (laughs) No, I saw this, there's a picture of you in the gym and you had this like crazy face.

Joe Rogan 12:09 So much prettier. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:09 I'll actually show you the, the, um, the actual one. It's really good.

Joe Rogan 12:12 Oh, I know what you're talking about, Instagram.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:13 You know what I'm talking about?

Joe Rogan 12:14 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:14 Yeah, I was going crazy during this stupid cha- fitness challenge I was having with my friends. We were working out-

Joe Rogan 12:19 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:20 ... doing six hours of cardio a day trying to beat each other and-

Joe Rogan 12:23 So stupid. That's when I was taking that picture. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:25 That was a good one. I was like, "Yeah, let me, let me copy that one."

Joe Rogan 12:28 So when you, uh, decide to move, are you taking anybody with you? You go solo?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:34 Mm. I'm gonna start off going solo. Um, I would like to get, you know, my brother to come visit. I'd like to get my mom to come out.

Joe Rogan 12:43 Really? It's awesome out there.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:44 As many... Yeah, yeah. And, and just cheap.

Joe Rogan 12:46 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:46 And just kind of simple living. My, and my mom, I don't think she's ever left the country. So, I think it'd be really cool for her to go out there. But, at the moment, I'm just really, like... This place is great for my career right now-

Joe Rogan 12:58 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 12:58 ... and great for my training, so I just want to get there ASAP-

Joe Rogan 13:01 How-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:01 ... and get back to work.

Joe Rogan 13:02 Sorry, how do you, um, account for jet lag? Like, do you? Do you just, uh, like w- Do you give yourself enough time to adjust to the time difference?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:12 You know what? The whole time I was there, I would... My sleep schedule was off. I never adjusted.

Joe Rogan 13:17 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:17 So I was going to bed maybe 2:30 AM every morning.

Joe Rogan 13:21 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:21 And then, like, get up, run at five, and then, you know-

Joe Rogan 13:25 Get tired later.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:26 ... get tired later. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 13:27 It's weird, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:28 The schedule was all off. And then when I came back, it took me, like, a week or two to adjust, so...

Joe Rogan 13:34 I was disappointed how stupid my body was.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 13:36 Like, "Hey, dummy, go to bed now."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:38 (laughs) "I'm telling you, just go to bed now." (laughs) Like, my... I didn't know my body had such a rigid schedule. When you jack that thing sideways and you're on the other side of the planet, your body just really doesn't know what the fuck is going on. Seriously. And then for me being stuck in that plane for so long-

Joe Rogan 13:52 Oh, yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:53 ... man, it was like, "Ugh."

Joe Rogan 13:54 Yeah, you're too big for them little seats too.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:55 Yeah, man.

Joe Rogan 13:56 So, when you do that, if, say if you have a fight in Vegas-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 13:59 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 13:59 ... and you're gonna go from Thailand to Vegas, do you show up two weeks early?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:02 Hmm, yeah, uh, the f- well, this is my first time, um, flying back to the States after being in Thailand, and I flew a week early. No, I flew two weeks early. One week I stayed in Vegas and then fight week stayed in Atlanta.

Joe Rogan 14:12 Okay.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:12 And I think that was perfect timing.

Joe Rogan 14:14 Oh, that's good.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:14 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 14:14 So, like, you got a li- a little difference in time-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:17 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 14:17 ... between those two.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:17 And weather too, man. It's so hot.

Joe Rogan 14:19 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:19 Like, we train outside, and it's humid and hot.

Joe Rogan 14:22 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:23 So, um, between every round, it feels like th- you know, like the third round of a fight. If it were going into the championship rounds, I've never been there, but I'd imagine that it'd feel very shitty. And, uh, that's how it feels every round in Thailand. It's just like you're covered in sweat.

Joe Rogan 14:38 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:39 It's just hot, thick. Yeah, that was probably like my fifth round or something like that, and we- dude, I was dead by this point.

Joe Rogan 14:46 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 14:49 Shout out to the editor for making me not look as tired as I was. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 14:54 Yeah, so we're, what we're looking at, folks, for the people who are just listening is, uh, a s- bunch of videos of you training, strength and conditioning, pummeling up against the, the wall. So you getting everything done there?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:04 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:05 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:05 And that's Joseph Henley right there. He was on the, uh, on The Ultimate Fighter... I forgot what season. They called him Leonidas. He's a black belt out there, and he helped me out a lot, man. It- there's... You run into so many different people, and he's like, "Yeah, like, I'm a black belt. Any type of grappling you want, any positions you want to work, like, we'll go over it, we'll create a system, whatever."

Joe Rogan 15:22 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:23 And... So he was really big help in this preparation-

Joe Rogan 15:25 Beautiful.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:25 ... for this fight, yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:26 A bunch of free spirits living there, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:28 Oh, so many.

Joe Rogan 15:29 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:29 So many. But everybody's down there with a goal.

Joe Rogan 15:31 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:31 Like, they want to get in shape, they want to get healthy or-

Joe Rogan 15:33 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:34 ... you know, spiritual path, whatever it may be, yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:36 There's something romantic about the expat living in Thailand having a good time, you know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:41 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 15:41 Something romantic about that. It's, it's interesting, you know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 15:43 Yeah, it's really cool.

Joe Rogan 15:45 Yeah, I mean, that whole culture, man. I mean, the, the Thai and Muay Thai culture, it's... What a phenomenon. If you look at combat sports and then this one that it's so tied into these stadiums, it's so tied into gambling and betting.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 16:00 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 16:01 It's so... I mean, it... Kids get indoctrinated into it at a very young age.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 16:04 Super young. Super young.

Joe Rogan 16:06 It's wild.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 16:06 There's, there's guys at the gym that I was at, um, little kids, they'd come right after school, and they go to Muay Thai training, and they're training just like the older guys, and then they go right back to ho- like, home, eat dinner. But that's just their lifestyle. So it, it starts as a kid. It's like, go to school, Muay Thai, go to sleep. And then as an adult, it's like, Muay Thai, feed your family, Muay Thai, feed your family. These guys live at the gym, man.

Joe Rogan 16:31 Jesus.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 16:32 They live at the gym, and they go home maybe two days after a fight just to take care of their families and then come right back to the gym and get ready for the next fight.

Joe Rogan 16:40 Now, o- of course, at Tiger Muay Thai, you know, you've guys... Everybody knows, uh, dif- various people in different organizations.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 16:48 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 16:49 UFC, Bellator, what have you, uh, One FC, but what about those guys that are fighting in those little small Thai gyms and stadiums? Like, how much access do they have to grappling, or how... But do they ever... Do, do they... Are they th- satisfied to just do Muay Thai? Is there at all like a movement in Thailand to start doing MMA like you're doing?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:07 There... No, es- especially at Tiger, um, a lot of those guys are coming over to the MMA and s- and learning jujitsu and wrestling.

Joe Rogan 17:14 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:14 One of the guys I was learning to clinch from, um, he was like, um... He's got probably 300 fights.

Joe Rogan 17:19 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:20 Um, 300 Muay Thai fights, and he started training MMA and taking MMA fights. So it's de- They're o- They're definitely opening their mind to it and, and, and hopping in there. And there's access. In Bangkok, it's a little different, um, 'cause that's very, like, stadium based-

Joe Rogan 17:34 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:34 ... you know, like high-level Muay Thai. And, uh, they're not too focused on MMA. There are a couple MMA gyms, but if you want to do that, if you want to get the best of both worlds, it's in, it's in Phuket at Tiger. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 17:46 So, uh, in... Is there any MMA at all in Bangkok?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:50 Uh, they got a couple places, but nothing with like, uh, like pro fighters or any high-level fighters.

Joe Rogan 17:56 Okay.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 17:56 But they do have, they do have maybe three or four MMA gyms there with just guys stopping in or guys who practice, you know, a little bit of everything.

Joe Rogan 18:04 I'm always really interested in countries that figure something out better than everybody else.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:09 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 18:09 When it comes to leg kicking, like, nobody figured it out any better than the Thais.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:13 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 18:13 It's like no one argues that, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:15 No, seriously.

Joe Rogan 18:16 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:16 And their shins, man, like... I think they're just... That's done for. They don't even feel the front of their legs anymore.

Joe Rogan 18:22 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:22 'Cause they can kick anything, and they're getting kicks checked. There's guys that... Joe, they'll fight one night at the stadium, go five rounds, and then...... sleep, and maybe the next day go fight, like, another small event or a smaller event-

Joe Rogan 18:36 Jesus Christ.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:37 ... sometime even in the same night. And it's like, man, aren't you... Like, your shins don't hurt, your elbows don't hurt, nothing. And these guys, they're just like, they're bulletproof. They're used to this, man. It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 18:47 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 18:48 And they're... First time in my life I go into a locker room and the red and blue corner is both in the same room, probably as big as this studio, and they're all getting their hands wrapped together, getting massaged out together, everything. No weird energy in the room, like, you know, in the UFC, like, they separate us. We have to kind of be separate, whatever purposes. But, like, in Thailand, they're just, like, hanging out same room, you know, talking, whatever, and then they just go fight right after.

Joe Rogan 19:15 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 19:15 It's so weird. Like, the- the peace, it's- it's so weird, man. It was the first time I experienced that and I was like-

Joe Rogan 19:20 (laughing)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 19:20 ... "Maybe I can start lightening up a little bit." Like-

Joe Rogan 19:23 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 19:23 ... "It's only a fight." And that's kind of something I had to tell myself, um, for this one. I had to, like, really fall back and rely on my training 'cause I was really nervous. I was nervous to start, um, to try the new stuff that I learned now.

Joe Rogan 19:36 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 19:36 I never threw many leg kicks in any of my fights. Um, I've never really did that stance. Everything that I did was pretty much brand new, um, and I was really nervous. I was like, "What if it doesn't work?" You know, like, so many different, so many different feelings. And, um, for this one I, uh, the only thing I could tell myself was, like, "Rely on your training." And a few other things. I actually got, um, I got, like, hypnotized too before. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 20:03 Dude?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:03 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 20:04 Who did it to you?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:05 Um, my friend Dominique. Um, he has- he has this, like... I met him through one of the f- um, one of the other UFC fighters, like Julian Marquez. I met him, I met him through him. And he's like, "Oh, yeah, I do, like, hypnotism, all this stuff." I'm like, "Okay, cool. I've done it before. I did it in California." And, um, so I think three weeks, two or three weeks prior to the fight, we had a few sessions a week where it just, like, helped me to really get that visualization clear. 'Cause we have so many thoughts all the time, right?

Joe Rogan 20:34 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:34 And everything just, like... Thoughts are constantly coming in, and to stay focused and to really, like- like... get the outcome that we've, you know, set our intention to, it's kind of hard-

Joe Rogan 20:48 So-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:48 ... with so many distractions, so.

Joe Rogan 20:49 When you go into his office, and- or wherever you do it-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:52 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 20:52 ... and you guys talk about it, do you set a goal before you start the session?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 20:57 We do this thing called timeline therapy. So it's like, I'm just kind of sitting there with my eyes closed and, um, we kind of just do this... We'll pick a subject, whether it's like, you know, pain, fear, you know, nervousness, something. We'll just pick a subject, a feeling-

Joe Rogan 21:12 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 21:12 ... whatever's going on. And, um, it's kind of just like a visual timeline of, like, where did this start, where did it-

Joe Rogan 21:19 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 21:19 ... come from, what's the event, whatever. And we kind of just talk about that for a while. And, um, I just kind of dig to this place of where the nervousness is coming from or where the, you know, where the fear is coming from, or whatever. I kind of just, I find a place on my timeline and I dig from it, whether it's in the future, the past, whatever. And, um, then we get things clear and then, um, and then after that he kind of helps me, guides me into this, like, hypnotism which is really just, like, a really deep relaxation. If I wanted to open my eyes or something like that, I feel like I could, but I wanted to relax. I wanted this to help, you know?

Joe Rogan 22:00 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 22:00 I wanted my vision to be clear, so I did my best to just, like, surrender to the process and I'd say it's not something where I woke up and I was like, "Oh, yeah, my life is changed." But, um, I can definitely remember the thoughts that I had so that I can stay more on, like, in that-

Joe Rogan 22:16 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 22:16 ... in that lane of what I wanted. And in my- in my hypnotism, I actually visualized not winning the fight because I didn't want to strive too hard to win. Like, it's just something that I've been kind of studying. It's like the outcome is not really, like... The winning or losing, I don't want to base too much on that. I just want to put on, like, a great performance. So I visualized after, one thing, hand- like, just having my hands in the air, seeing my brother smile, my coach smile, and then slapping hands with the crowd, um, on the way out. And then I-

Joe Rogan 22:52 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 22:52 ... was also like, "And I want to see my win bonus and my show money." And these are the things that I wanted to see. These are the outcomes that I wanted. Not so much just, "I want to win the fight," but the things that I, like how I wanted it to happen.

Joe Rogan 23:03 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 23:04 And having that vision clear, it helped me. And so, like, everything that I visualized before that, uh, it happened. I was like, "Cool." Hands raised, slapped hands with everybody in the crowd on the way out, signed both my checks, and that was like, that was the end of it for me until the next session, until I want to get clear on something else, you know? It was cool.

Joe Rogan 23:25 Wow. So had you done anything like that before, any mental coaching, any-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 23:29 Yeah, before the Gokhan Saki fight, I did something very, very similar. Yeah, with, um, with another guy, uh-

Joe Rogan 23:34 Was that the first time you'd ever done it?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 23:36 First time doing hypnotism, yeah, definitely. And, um, yeah, my friend Matthias, he's here, and, uh, he's really good too. And he'll just, like, take some notes. You kind of just have a conversation in the beginning. And everything comes from your unconscious mind. It's not somebody telling you something.

Joe Rogan 23:54 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 23:54 I just dumped out whatever my unconscious mind was telling me. He was just helping me to, like, relax, be at peace, and just listen to, like, my unconscious mind just un- unfold all of these kind of like hidden answers that we-

Joe Rogan 24:08 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:08 ... all have, you know? So it's, that's it.

Joe Rogan 24:11 Now, when you get hypnotized and you're thinking about a specific fight, do you think about specific things you're trying to accomplish, things that you think you'll do to him that you'll have an advantage at, or a strategy, or, like, how do you, uh-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:24 So those were thoughts that were happening-

Joe Rogan 24:27 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:28 ... before my hypnotism. But then all of those thoughts were coming from-... the anxiety-

Joe Rogan 24:37 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:37 ... or coming from the nervousness. You get what I'm saying?

Joe Rogan 24:39 Yes.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:40 So it's like, "Let's go back on the timeline to why you're feeling nervous that, like, all these things are happening. They're gonna ... y- you, you're anticipating all these things happening and it's making you feel nervous, so let's go back to the nervousness and revisit that. Why?" You know?

Joe Rogan 24:54 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 24:54 And then I'm like ... My subconscious ... my unconscious mind just likes spewing things out and then after the process of that mixed with the hypnotism, I'm not even thinking about, "Oh, I'm gonna hit this arm drag," or whatever. I just ... I'm thinking about having my conscience clear and my mind clear, and everything so that I can get the expectation that, like ... or the, the visualization that I created. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 25:22 So have you tried different versions of that or different styles of, of hypnosis?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 25:27 Mm ... No, not that I can ... I mean, I've done a lot of just, like, closed eye, like, emotional intelligence type of, like, exercises, you know, like where I'm just like ... My eyes are closed and I have someone helping me visualize internally, you know, like just whether it's dreams or emotional pain, or whatever it may be. Yeah-

Joe Rogan 25:52 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 25:53 ... I've had people just ... like, guided meditation almost, yeah. But the actual name, like hypnotism, I've only had it done by two people.

Joe Rogan 26:00 Well, it ... As ... When you're watching fighters, if you're ... I think fighters are one of the most complex puzzles for psychologists.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 26:10 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 26:11 Because I think it's a, a super rare state. Like the r- the rare state that someone gets to where they can be completely calm and see everything in the heat of a, a dangerous encounter with another trained fighter.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 26:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:22 And when you're watching these things play out on TV, you oftentimes see how much anxiety plays a factor or doesn't play a factor, how much someone having the "I don't give a fuck" attitude for real, it can play ... It can be a benefit and it can fuck you up sometimes too. And to see these complex psychological puzzles play out and see fighters struggle and then regroup, have a bad fight and come back better, all that stuff is like ... ve- it's ... It's really like a giant microscope on the human character.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 26:54 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 26:55 You know? And, like, a guy like you who comes back from that Johnny Walker fight and looks sensational against Erik Anders, man. It was like ... That was one of those things where you're like, "I like what I'm seeing." This guy, he figured some shit out, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:08 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:08 (laughs) I mean, like, that is ... That was, that was incredible. It was really fun to watch, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 27:12 As a guy who really loves Muay Thai, it was fun to watch.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:15 Thanks, man. Like, that was ... And that's, that's kind of the goal too going forward is that I wanna continue to, like, put on stuff like that, continue to learn Muay Thai and then ... 'Cause that fight kind of raised the bar, right?

Joe Rogan 27:24 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:24 People are like, "Oh, man. This guy."

Joe Rogan 27:26 For sure.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:26 He kind of put me back on the map, so now I'm ready to just go back and ... You know.

Joe Rogan 27:31 How many guys use mental coaches now, if you had to guess?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:35 A good handful.

Joe Rogan 27:36 A good handful.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:37 Yeah, a good handful. I think ... I think a lot of fighters-

Joe Rogan 27:39 I know Vinny Shormon. Vinny Shormon, he hypnotized me and he, uh ... he hypnotizes a lot of fighters.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:43 Yeah?

Joe Rogan 27:43 Yeah, he's, um ... Yeah, it was a trip. It was very strange. I was like, "Oh, this is real."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:48 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 27:48 I was like, "Hmm." It's a weird feeling, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:50 How long ago was it?

Joe Rogan 27:52 It was an old studio, so it had to be at least a year and a half, maybe two years ago.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 27:56 Okay.

Joe Rogan 27:56 Yeah, it was pretty weird. But he's a, a great mental coach too though. He knows, like, what's creeping around your subconscious-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:03 Mm.

Joe Rogan 28:04 ... just waiting to pop up and play tricks on you.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:07 I know.

Joe Rogan 28:07 "Are you sure you put in enough rounds?"

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:09 Vinny Shormon. Where does he live?

Joe Rogan 28:09 Uh, he's a UK guy.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:11 Okay.

Joe Rogan 28:11 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:11 I got to get linked up with him.

Joe Rogan 28:12 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:13 I'm all ... Uh, I don't care. Anybody, I'm like, "Yeah. Like, whatever you got."

Joe Rogan 28:16 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:17 "Vinny Shormon, let's go."

Joe Rogan 28:18 Yeah, he's a good dude. I'll connect you guys.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:19 Heck yeah.

Joe Rogan 28:20 I, I think it's, uh, a ... Probably one of the least trained aspects of fighting-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:26 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 28:26 ... is the mental aspect of it. You know, you realize how good guys are just by watching them train. You see them spar, you see them do all these things ... You go, "Damn, this guy ... This guy is fucking good. This guy's got great jujitsu. This guy got great kickboxing."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:39 You ever hear about the people that, like ... Their, their sayings, right? Like, "Man-

Joe Rogan 28:43 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:44 ... that guy is amazing in the gym, but when he shows up to fight, like-

Joe Rogan 28:47 Yes, yes. Exactly.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:47 ... he just doesn't put on."

Joe Rogan 28:48 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:48 Like, I've been that guy multiple times.

Joe Rogan 28:50 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 28:50 And like, yeah, a lot of it has to do with mentally.

Joe Rogan 28:52 Yeah, that's almost like an unaddressed giant chunk of the puzzle, like a third of the puzzle. Like if it was a pie, a third is keep it together. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:02 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 29:02 You know? He's ... You know, like-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:02 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 29:03 You, you know, like you ... You know when it's ready to go and now-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:06 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 29:07 ... and it's all happening, don't freak out.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:09 And you never, like ... Here's kind of the something that I think about. You never know everybody's situation, right? So the day before the fight we have weigh-ins, and then Dana comes back and, like, he gives us this ... our speech, right? So everyone there, you don't know what life position they're in, you know? So it's like, "Hey, there's a potential we can get a bonus." So all those guys are affected emotionally somehow.

Joe Rogan 29:29 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:30 You know what I mean? Some guys, maybe they don't care. Some guys, maybe they do. But then, like, we walk out and then there's a crowd, 15,000 people sold out. Look around, we got Joe Rogan sitting here, we got-

Joe Rogan 29:40 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:40 ... Mick Maynard sitting, we got Dana White, we got everybody sitting around. And then, like, we're still human too, so we're thinking like, "This is kind of like a test," you know? It's like-

Joe Rogan 29:48 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:49 ... we got all the ... we got the whole board (laughs) right here in front of me ready to take my test, you know? Like-

Joe Rogan 29:54 Yeah, wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 29:55 ... i- it really depends on, uh, like ... Uh, there's so much that goes into it, like, mentally. You got to be prepared for a lot of things, or some guys block it out, but it's just like, like anything else. It's-

Joe Rogan 30:06 You had to know about halfway into the first round some special shit was happening though.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 30:11 On this fight?

Joe Rogan 30:11 Yes.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 30:12 Uh, after ... So after the first round, I was very happy. I sat down. My coaches were like, "Okay, this is good. This is good. You're doing this." And I was like, "Listen, I, I don't want to know what's good. What should I expect the next round?" Like, I was ready to go. I told this straight to George. I'm like, "Dude, I don't care. What do I need to do next? What should I prepare for?" And he's like, "Prepare for a little bit more pressure. He's probably gonna try to shoot for the takedown in this round." And I was like, "Okay, cool." So that ... I was just looking for that and using my tools to kind of-... to just prepare for that. But, uh, definitely midway through the second round, I was like, "Okay, like I know he's still got a lot of power, all this stuff, but I think that, uh, that leg, I should be able to, you know, buy some time and take away a little bit of damage, like coming at me for sure."

Joe Rogan 30:58 It ... he, I mean he had to be in agony, and he never stopped coming.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:02 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:02 I mean, he had to-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:03 But he didn't wince at all.

Joe Rogan 31:04 (takes a deep breath)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:04 Like even on the cage, when I was just like ... when he was on the back and I was trying to kick his leg, he just ... his face, his facial expression never changed.

Joe Rogan 31:10 He's a (laughs) fucking savage, man. He's-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:12 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 31:13 He's a bad man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:14 Respect that guy.

Joe Rogan 31:15 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:15 For sure.

Joe Rogan 31:16 For sure, for sure.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:18 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 31:18 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:18 Even before, like even before the fight.

Joe Rogan 31:20 Now, how do you think-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:21 Before and after, he stayed the same.

Joe Rogan 31:21 Yeah, for sure. Yeah. No. I mean, maybe even more so, man. Not everybody can do that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:25 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 31:26 Not everybody can take that. You know? And to do it the way he did it with 100% of his character intact, never shirked, never shied away from it, kept moving forward, that's a dangerous person. And he's still getting better.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:37 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:37 That guy's just getting better.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:39 Oh, yeah.

Joe Rogan 31:40 When you were doing ... How much do you think the hypnosis helped you?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:45 (sighs) A really good amount, man. Like-

Joe Rogan 31:46 How much different did you feel? Like in what way?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 31:48 Mm, (sighs) I just ... I felt more clear. I'm ... I feel like a lot of times, I can be just kind of like an anxious guy. I just ... I f- ... I feel like I feel a lot of just energy that kinda like ... I don't know. I go into a room and I'm just like, "Ah." So having, having the focus on ... having my attention set on what I wanted to happen was 70%. Like, uh, I, I'd owe 70% of like the hypnotism, all that stuff to just help me to keep my thoughts on track.

Joe Rogan 32:22 Hm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 32:22 Something to re- ... fall back onto every single time. If I felt like I was getting distracted or getting nervous or whatever, I would remember, you know, the things that we went over in the hypnotism. And so every time, I just kind of like that ... hit that reset button or just the delete button on, on thoughts that I just didn't wanna have or thoughts that would make me feel anything other than happy and ready to go.

Joe Rogan 32:42 Now, how often do you practice this? Do you practice this outside of hypnosis? Is there like some things you concentrate on or meditate on?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 32:49 Uh, yeah. So I do my best to just ... it's kinda like ... the weird thing about me is fighting is something that has just kinda happened by accident, but it's caused me to search for so much peace, like inner peace because of everything that I go through emotionally being a fighter. So going from this-

Joe Rogan 33:12 Hm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 33:12 I know Shab told you about it, but going from this kid who was just like super overweight my whole life, never fit in with anybody. I was always just like this introverted, gothic, weird kid that nobody, you know, nobody ever talked to, di- never even wanted to fight. I've always been non-confrontational. But somewhere in the journey of becoming a fighter, I was like, "Ah, this is cool, but I need to find more peace because this is like ... it's bringing up way too much, just like, just way too much my, of my anger kinda like-"

Joe Rogan 33:48 Hm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 33:48 "... you know, from everything that I held onto." So, uh, I practice meditation, a lot of meditation. I read a lot of different ... I'll study different religions, whatever, wherever I'm at, um, all just to find peace, man, like just inner peace.

Joe Rogan 34:00 How does a non-confrontational guy wind up being an elite cage fighter?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 34:05 Hm.

Joe Rogan 34:05 (laughs) Stop and think about what I just said.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 34:08 You know what, yeah. It's-

Joe Rogan 34:10 (laughs) That's a very strange thing to say.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 34:11 I'm still trying to wrap my mind around it. But I think that, um, internally, there's just a lot of, there's a lot of expression. I, uh ... for me, it's a, it is a big expression, man. It's an expression of just my, my danger, my ferociousness, this, the, the, the, the, the part of myself that I've always held back. You know? It's like I have to hold back. I'm, I'm a big guy. You know? Like I ... if I get angry, I'm afraid I can, you know, (laughs) break something, you know? Like, you know what I mean? It's like it's crazy. So fighting for me, like when I train, after training, I'm super peaceful.

Joe Rogan 34:49 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 34:49 After I fight, I feel like I've grown. I feel like, "This guy's trying to hurt me," all these things.

Joe Rogan 34:54 Hm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 34:54 Like it's, it's, it's just a place where we both agree like, "Hey, I'll give you my strength versus your strength," or whatever, whatever powers that strength is what we meet in the middle. And so it helps me balance, man. It does. Yeah. 'Cause when I'm not fighting, I'm, I'm so relaxed, it's crazy. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 35:10 (laughs) It makes sense.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:12 And it ... I think that's something that could aid a lot of men, I think just at least training.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:17 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 35:17 Just espec- ... I think there's something particularly soothing about hitting a heavy bag. There's something particular. Like when you're done, man, you feel so good. When you're done hitting pads-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:27 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:27 ... when you're done sparring, you feel so just peaceful.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:30 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:30 Like you got it all out.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:31 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 35:31 You don't have anything left in you.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:32 Nothing left.

Joe Rogan 35:32 I think a lot of men carry a lot of extra bullshit.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:35 Yeah, man. Definitely.

Joe Rogan 35:35 A lot of extra, extra "Ugh." For no reason.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:38 You gotta let it out.

Joe Rogan 35:39 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:40 You gotta let it out.

Joe Rogan 35:40 You gotta let it out.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:40 They're not letting it out. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:42 You got ... some guys will build it up in the gym, right? And they're super huge, and it's like, "Nah, you gotta let it out, man."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:47 Let it out. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:47 They can't even swing those arms. What are you doing?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:48 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 35:50 (laughs) Yeah. You see less of that now-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 35:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 35:52 ... than you used to, it seems like. But, you know. It just ... it would be nice if ... I, I really think they should teach kids how to fight at a very early age.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:00 That'd be cool.

Joe Rogan 36:00 I, I think it's the opposite. It would have the opposite effect. I think people would fight less. I think if you taught kids how to fight, they would just train and spar, and they would, they'd get it all out of their system there, and they'd probably fight a lot less.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:12 It's in ... it's kind of like in our nature, right? Like-

Joe Rogan 36:14 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:15 Everybody-

Joe Rogan 36:16 It should be available.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:16 Everybody's got it, like a, a curiosity.

Joe Rogan 36:18 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:18 Like, "Oh, I wonder what it's like." So.

Joe Rogan 36:20 Yeah. The, the closest they have to it is the wrestling team.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:22 You can join the wrestling team, and they, they will teach you a very important part of fighting. But other than that, like they're not gonna teach you how to fight. But wrestling is kinda like ... now at least, it's kind of a loophole.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:32 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:32 Like they don't teach boxing in high school, but they'll teach you how to wrestle. And it-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:36 And they're, they're pretty crazy, man.

Joe Rogan 36:37 Crazy.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:38 And wrestlings get rougher it seems like.

Joe Rogan 36:39 Oh, fuck yeah, man.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:40 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:41 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:42 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 36:42 Yeah. Well, some of those high school kids are savages. I, I remember being a high school kid in a high school wrestling room. It was awful. You know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:47 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 36:47 Kids were trying to kill each other, you know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:49 They work out the hardest too, huh?

Joe Rogan 36:50 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:51 ... running with plates over their head and all that stuff. The football team's just lifting weights and running practice. Those guys are just doing ridiculous shit.

Joe Rogan 36:57 Yeah, they're always slaving.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 36:58 Slaving.

Joe Rogan 36:58 Everybody's seen that movie Vision Quest, right? You seen that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:00 No, I've never seen it.

Joe Rogan 37:01 (gasps) You never saw that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:02 I've never seen it.

Joe Rogan 37:03 Dude, uh, it's Matthew Modine, and Matthew Bodine plays this badass wrestler and he's going up against this dude who's this other badass wrestler. And he comes to visit the guy while the guy's training, and this dude's got a log on his back and he's walking up stadium stairs.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:18 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:18 And the, (laughs) and the, he says, "You think you make the weight?" 'Cause he, Matthew Modine's character is trying to cut weight.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:23 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 37:23 He goes, "I hope so." He goes, "Hope so too." And he keeps walking up the stairs like a kid. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:28 When did this come out?

Joe Rogan 37:29 A long time ago, man. Back when Madonna was young.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:33 Oh, this is, yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 37:33 Yeah. (laughs) That's the wrestler.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:35 This is the clip, right?

Joe Rogan 37:35 So he's walking up the stadium stairs carrying a fucking log on his back.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:39 That dude is jacked.

Joe Rogan 37:40 It's a great movie, man. Every wrestler that I knew when I was in high school, everyone worshiped this movie. What year did this shit come out?

Narrator 37:48 Uh.

Joe Rogan 37:50 It's probably like '85 or something.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:51 That's not the cover for it, is it?

Joe Rogan 37:53 '85, bam, I nailed it, son.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:55 Is that the cover for it?

Joe Rogan 37:56 Yes. Look at that. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 37:57 That doesn't even look like it has anything to do with a wrestler. I definitely would not click that on Netflix thinking that it was around.

Joe Rogan 38:02 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:02 You know, like a wrestler movie. At all.

Joe Rogan 38:04 She was hot as a sun too. Fun times. But yeah, that was like the quintessential wrestling movie because he just was dedicated. And then there was this friend who lied about being a Native American. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:15 Oh, (laughs) is that what that is?

Joe Rogan 38:16 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:16 I was gonna say, "What's that vest he's got going on?"

Joe Rogan 38:18 Yeah. He just wanted to be different and stand out. But it was a, it was a fun movie, man. It's a fun movie.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:22 I'll have to get into that, for sure.

Joe Rogan 38:24 Yeah, not a whole lot of movies about wrestling. That's the least glamorous but probably toughest sport for high school kids to get into.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:30 Definitely.

Joe Rogan 38:31 You know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:31 That's, I stayed away from it, man.

Joe Rogan 38:33 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:33 You know, I tried out for, I tried out for volleyball in high school. I actually made the team, but my grades were terrible so I never got to play. But I was like a heavyset dude and I tried out and made it.

Joe Rogan 38:43 Well-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:43 I think it was just kinda like a joke, though. I think the coaches were just messing with me and my friends too.

Joe Rogan 38:47 When did you get involved in martial arts?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 38:49 Uh, when I was 20, so 2010. So really quick, right after high school I started, um, I started traveling. So I used to play in a band. I used to play in mini bands. And played guitar.

Joe Rogan 39:04 What instrument?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:05 I played guitar, I played drums, I played keyboard, a little bit of everything. Every Christmas my mom would just know, would just get me a new instrument, and I'd lock myself in my room and teach myself how to play. And that's just always how, like music was my first love.

Joe Rogan 39:20 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:20 Instruments were my first love. So I-

Joe Rogan 39:22 You taught yourself?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:23 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 39:24 Was-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:24 I'd just put on like headphones and I would just match the sounds and then keep restarting the songs over and over again.

Joe Rogan 39:31 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:31 And then if it were like a keyboard song I'd play it, like just on the CD player and, you know, as it evolved. And for some reason, I can just m- I can match tunes with whatever instrument it may be.

Joe Rogan 39:44 You've always been able to do that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:45 Since a kid.

Joe Rogan 39:46 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:47 Yeah. So-

Joe Rogan 39:47 No, no formal training?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:49 Nothing.

Joe Rogan 39:49 That's f- cra- What? Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 39:51 Yeah. I've tried to take, I've tried to take guitar lessons before, um, but it didn't work for me and my mom was just wasting her money. Like I was learning, but it was kinda like school for me. Like I had a teacher and he's telling me, "Okay, this chord and this chord." And I was like, "Ah," like, "just let me feel it." (laughs) Like, "I gotta, I gotta feel it." You know? Like, "I can hear it, I can, I can feel it, I'll get it." And so I, I stopped going.

Joe Rogan 40:12 But how many people do it like, like that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 40:14 I'm not sure. I know that there's a lot of people that can just kinda play by ear, but so I'll, like I just love instruments, so I'll pick anything up and just start playing it and end up teaching myself how to play drums, bass, guitar, keyboard. I played the standup bass in, uh, in middle school. Um, I've got like a little home production, like beat studio at home, all that stuff. So after high school I started touring (sniffs) and, uh, that's when like I started getting my heaviest. We were eating fast food every single day, three times a day, never drank water. Soda only. Smoking like a pack and a half of cigarettes a day and just on the road traveling. And then, uh, by 19 I got up to 305 pounds.

Joe Rogan 40:55 (whistles)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 40:56 19 years old. And I remember one night laying down to go to bed and I just felt my heart pumping ridiculously and I was just like, "No way. This is like... I think I'm gonna die." And like I woke up in a panic. And (laughs) weird thing is I got up and I di- went outside for maybe like 10 minutes and I smoked another cigarette.

Joe Rogan 41:15 (sighs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 41:15 And I was just like, "This is the problem." Like, "I'm coughing up stuff and my heart is gonna give out and I'm only 19 years old." You know? So around that same week is when I discovered MMA with my brother just like watching Ultimate Fighter on TV. And so, uh, I went on my last tour and, uh, I told the guys like, "Hey, I'm gonna go train MMA." They're like, "Oh, you're gonna be a fighter?" Like, "You think..." You know? And I was just like, "I don't know what I'm gonna be, but I'm gonna go train and get healthy." And they're like, "Okay, cool." Like, "We'll see you in a couple of months." You know what I mean? (laughs) Like no one really believed that I was gonna go and actually train and fight. I told you, I've always been like this big, quiet, non-confrontational guy. So, um, yeah, I went and took my first class, Muay Thai, in March 1st, 2010. Took my first Muay Thai class and then after like a month of doing Muay Thai, I started to see progression and I started to see like my face was slimming down, all this stuff, so it gave me motivation to keep going. And then, um, I r- remember going to a MMA event, amateur, and I saw really big heavyweight guys going at it. So I was like, "Ah, I think I wanna do it. I wanna give it a try." And, uh, so my coach was like, "Okay, if you lose 100 pounds I'll, like, I'll find you a fight." And I was like, "100 pounds?" And he's like, "Yeah, I'll find you a fight if you lose 100 pounds." So, um, I just kept training. Within 11 months, lost 100 pounds and then took my first fight and then it's been like-

Joe Rogan 42:39 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 42:39 Every fight has been... Until now, because it's like now I have like more of a drive and a passion for it, but all the way up until then, everything kinda happened by coincidence or just like... I just, I didn't really...... want to fight but I had a lot of people like, "Oh, you're so good, like, keep doing it." And that was the first time in my life I've ever had people supporting me to, like, really do something that was big. And I was a new guy and I was in shape and, uh, I can... You know, girls are noticing me now-

Joe Rogan 43:08 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:08 And, like, all these... my whole life changed within a year of, of training MMA, like-

Joe Rogan 43:13 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:13 ... from going to this guy that nobody even paid attention to to just like, "Oh, hey, how's it going?" Or, you know, like, "Oh, you're so in shape." And I was just like, "Oh, this is weird." It's still weird. It's only been nine years, eight years, you know?

Joe Rogan 43:26 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:26 So everything's still very new to me. I've only... My first day stepping on the mat was, like, you know, nine years ago.

Joe Rogan 43:34 Dude, that's an amazing story.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:35 It's crazy.

Joe Rogan 43:36 That's like a legit success story.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:38 Yeah, it's-

Joe Rogan 43:38 You know?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:40 Is that you?

Joe Rogan 43:40 (phone ringing) What kind of ridiculous ringtone do you have, sir? What is that? (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:45 Sorry. I thought I turned it off.

Joe Rogan 43:47 What is that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:48 It's just, like, stock iPhone, oh, ringtone-

Joe Rogan 43:51 Oh, is it?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 43:52 Uh, you, you ventured into the options.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:54 Yeah. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 43:55 You went down in there.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 43:56 Yes, sir. Um, so, yeah, that's, like, that's kind of how everything started. And then with three fight, three or four fights, and then I tried out for the Ultimate Fighter. So I had, like, three or four fights in one year being a pro. And, uh, and then the Ultimate Fighter Trials came out and I, like, tried out for that and, like, made it on. And I was like, "Oh, shit." So most of my career has been in the UFC.

Joe Rogan 44:18 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:18 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:19 Is that... Like, when you hear about fighters, uh, particularly boxers, you hear, like, a really well-managed boxer will get fights to test him but with, with a guy that you could beat.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:28 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 44:29 And you learn a different thing from each different fighter as you move up the ladder, and way more of them are undefeated when they finally get a, a shot-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:37 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:37 ... at either a title or a top contender. But in MMA, you could be fighting the top level guys within a couple of years of joining.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:46 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:46 And it could honestly be a couple years prior to that if you're particularly talented or you picked up martial arts. Like Ngannou, perfect example.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:54 Perfect example.

Joe Rogan 44:54 Francis Ngannou is like an incredible example-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 44:56 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 44:56 ... because he's really only done MMA for five years and he's still, right now, the scariest guy-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:02 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 45:03 ... in that cage. When he-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:04 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 45:04 When he's throwing bombs away, it's like you j- you just, like, go, "Uh, uh." When he knocked out Overeem, that was like an unca- that was an unheard of knockout.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:15 Yeah. I sparred with him in, like, in preparation for that fight.

Joe Rogan 45:18 Oof.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:19 And I actually almost got hit with that same punch. But, yeah, we went, Francis and I, and I went three rounds, um, in the cage.

Joe Rogan 45:25 Dude.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:25 And then I remember, uh, Forrest was there and, and John, the head coach of Syndicate, and, uh, they were like, "Okay, you guys, tone it down," 'cause we were going at it. And it wa- I mean, like, it was fun. Like, I like to go hard.

Joe Rogan 45:36 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:36 But, um-

Joe Rogan 45:37 How often, though?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:38 How often do I like to go hard?

Joe Rogan 45:39 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:40 Uh, every now and then. Yeah, every now and then.

Joe Rogan 45:42 Do you do mostly technical?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:45 Yeah. So like, in Thailand right now, it's like everyday technical-

Joe Rogan 45:48 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:49 ... one day sparring. Or one or two days sparring, yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:51 And when you say sparring, MMA sparring?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:52 MMA sparring, yeah.

Joe Rogan 45:53 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 45:54 And then the other days are just, like, technical grappling, grappling, and technical striking, and then, you know, wrestling and then, uh, yeah, I spar on Fridays.

Joe Rogan 46:03 Now, when they break it up, um, l- do, do you have someone who makes your schedule for you, like, for the week? Do you have all your training routines, like what, what your, the schedule set up for morning, evening, all that? Do you have that-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:16 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 46:17 ... planned out-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:18 So, um-

Joe Rogan 46:18 ... deep in advance?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:19 So they ha- like, so, for instance, like, the gym has a schedule of all the classes.

Joe Rogan 46:23 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:23 But, uh, the, the head MMA coach, George, would help me out like, "Hey, if you're getting ready for a fight, show up to these, these, and these, and I'll help you." And-

Joe Rogan 46:32 Almost like a curriculum.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:33 Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Joe Rogan 46:34 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:34 So that actually helped. And the cool thing about it is, like, everything was in line, so, like, whatever I worked with him personally in the morning we'd still be going over in practice and even in the night practice. So getting the same things, like, you know, multiple times a day instead of just one time and then you'll get it again later.

Joe Rogan 46:51 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:51 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 46:52 And when you're, you're training over there, um, you said you, like, 50 to 60 professionals on any given day?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 46:59 I've seen so many guys on the mat, yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:01 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:01 And I'd say on a very, very low day, 20. Like, so many people. So many people.

Joe Rogan 47:09 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:09 Guys and girls, man.

Joe Rogan 47:10 And how much-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:11 Of all levels.

Joe Rogan 47:11 ... of your time are you spending striking versus grappling? Do you specialize in one thing or the other?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:16 Well, I can train grappling all day and never get bored. And, like, even if I'm tired, I can still do it. Um, but then, like, grappling, I do it m- a lot of the times because I, I like it but it's mandatory-

Joe Rogan 47:30 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:30 ... and it's, and it's my job. So I, like, "Okay, I'm gonna go to grappling class." But, um, it seems like it's an even balance but I love to go to striking more 'cause it's just, like, that's my favorite thing. Um, yeah, so one striking class, one grappling class, one MMA class, all in one day, type of thing. So, like, two hours apiece and then conditioning and running and all that stuff in the middle. Eat, sleep-

Joe Rogan 47:57 And that's one whole day?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 47:59 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 47:59 Jesus.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 48:00 Yeah. Well, the MMA class is more like... So there's a class of MMA, one personal going over, like, my specific things that I like to work on and want to work on, and then maybe whoever's mimicking the opponent.

Joe Rogan 48:14 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 48:14 And then in the morning, Muay Thai. So m- for me, it's always great to start the morning off with Muay Thai. Wake up first thing, have coffee, do my 5, 6K run, train Muay Thai for two hours, eat, go do, um, MMA personal, and then do the MMA class at the end. And then go relax after. That routine, for me, can work every day. And it does. Everything's disciplined. Like, to do the same thing every day is very common in Thailand. And I think that that's why I was able to put that, um, that performance on and use that many kicks because we throw so many in one day. You know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 48:49 What's different about the training there?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 48:51 There's not, there's not really classes. Like, for MMA...There's not much talking. In Tae, in Muay Thai there's no talking. You know, it's like they tell you what to do a little bit, like punch, kick, knee, teep, five times, 10 times, 20 times, you know. Like it's ve- a lot of repetition and the same thing in the, in the MMA class. George gives us a lot of, um, time to drill and drill at our own pace and things like that before we go live. And I think that that's what's helped me the most, is less talking, more drilling.

Joe Rogan 49:25 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:25 Show me one or two things. We're mixed martial artists, we're gonna create something off of it, it's okay.

Joe Rogan 49:29 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:30 And, um, just let us drill it. Let us drill it. Walk around c- you know, correct if you need to, but I think people need to spend more time drilling on the mat. Go live every now and then just so you can feel what you're at, but the only way you're gonna get good is by drilling.

Joe Rogan 49:44 Yeah, it's just not as fun.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:46 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 49:46 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:46 (laughs) But it's training. I don't think training-

Joe Rogan 49:49 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:49 ... should be fun. You know, tell a dog to sit 100 times, you gotta give him something, like, you know, some type of treat, so.

Joe Rogan 49:53 The problem is certain parts of training are fun, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:55 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 49:55 That's which is probably one of the reasons why you like striking.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:57 Exactly.

Joe Rogan 49:58 It's fun.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 49:58 That part for me, I can just, yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:00 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:01 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:01 Yeah. It's, um, it, it's... I really believe that psychologists s- should study fighters. Study high level fighters and try to figure out what makes them tick because there's all these different versions. You're a different version. You're the, the 300 pound guy that decides to lose all this weight and now you're one of the best fighters (laughs) in the 205 pound division of the UFC.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:22 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:22 It's crazy, man. I mean, that's a, that's a wild story.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:25 It'd be really cool though.

Joe Rogan 50:26 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:27 Yeah. Maybe you'll get one. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 50:28 Psy- psychology studies on fighters is almost mandatory 'cause there's certain guys that, like, they're just impenetrable, you know. There's certain guys that just, they just, like Khabib.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:37 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 50:38 He's impenetrable.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:39 Like, you're not get-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:40 For sure.

Joe Rogan 50:40 The more shit you talk, the more he's gonna fuck you up when he gets a hold of you. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:44 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 50:44 Like, it's not working, man. It's not getting in there. And then there's cer- certain guys that, like, sometimes they're hot and sometimes they get rattled and, you know... It's, it's a crazy endeavor, what you guys do. It really is.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 50:57 Yeah. It definitely is, man. I think a documentary or something would be really cool too.

Joe Rogan 51:02 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:02 I think a lot of people and the fans need to see kind of a little bit more of the inside. The real stuff.

Joe Rogan 51:08 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:08 You know?

Joe Rogan 51:09 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:09 The, the, the real stuff. Like one of the craziest responses that I've been getting lately is people have hit me up on Instagram, they're like, "I can't believe you're just a normal guy. Like you're posting songs and, and, you know, like doing all the..." I'm like, "Yeah. I'm, I'm human just like everybody else." Like I think a lot of fans kind of forget that... I think we, as fighters, sometimes forget too. Like, hey, like for a little bit you can shut it off and be normal.

Joe Rogan 51:33 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:33 You know?

Joe Rogan 51:33 Yeah. It's, uh... (sighs) I mean, the, the balancing act is, it's a, a strange thing to ignore. You know, the balancing act that a fighter has to have with their p- their personality. With training and competing and then just being a normal person, and the highs and the lows and managing all the stress of an upcoming fight.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:52 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:52 And you're just sort of asked to go it on your own. Like, "Hey, good luck. Keep your shit together." (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 51:57 In the face of flying fists. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 51:59 And it sucks too 'cause the higher we go up, then it's just like... It's kinda hard to go anywhere behind, right?

Joe Rogan 52:05 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:05 It's like we're working to get to the top as fighters.

Joe Rogan 52:08 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:08 And we, we wanna be known and, and... But, like, the more w- the more... The higher that we go, the more, like, obligations, media, people wanna talk to you, all this stuff. So your time kinda gets short. I, uh, I was thinking about it last night. I'm like, "Damn. Like, getting to the top's gonna kinda suck." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 52:25 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:25 You know, media, like, you know, media week or fight week for everybody a- at the top, they're like, "Press conference this, that, that." And I'm-

Joe Rogan 52:33 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:33 ... I'm the type of guy where I just like to relax. So I'll definitely need, like, a psychologist or something.

Joe Rogan 52:38 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:38 (laughs) Somebody to help me out, man. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 52:40 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:40 More hypnotism, for sure.

Joe Rogan 52:41 Yeah. I would... I don't know how much they do at the UFC Performance Institute in t- in for, as far as mindset training.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:48 Mm-hmm.

Joe Rogan 52:48 Do they do any of that over there?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:50 Mm... Not that I've known.

Joe Rogan 52:51 I should ask those guys.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:51 Not that I've seen.

Joe Rogan 52:52 I mean, that place is insane. Have you had a chance to train there at all?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:54 Yeah, I did. I did two fight camps there.

Joe Rogan 52:57 Oh, wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 52:57 When I used to live in Vegas, yeah. And it, it's amazing.

Joe Rogan 53:00 It's a crazy place.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:01 But it was like, it was like a little too good for me. Like I, I started feeling like a little bit spoiled, you know what I mean?

Joe Rogan 53:06 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:06 I was like, "I gotta go run out in the street." Like I can't be-

Joe Rogan 53:08 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:08 ... running on these nice treadmills, man.

Joe Rogan 53:10 And I mean, to have a place like that where the company creates this super high level training environment that's, there's not another gym like it on the planet Earth.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:18 On the planet.

Joe Rogan 53:19 (laughs) So-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:20 On the planet.

Joe Rogan 53:20 ... they, they just decided like, "Hey, go ahead and work out there for free."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:22 Seriously. They be like-

Joe Rogan 53:23 It's pretty dope.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:23 ... "Oh, you want a protein shake? Okay. You want food?"

Joe Rogan 53:25 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:25 Like, "Whatever you need."

Joe Rogan 53:26 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:26 "Just live here." (laughs)

Joe Rogan 53:28 Yeah. It's... Look, it's a great way to keep guys on track with their weight cuts too. You know? I mean-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:33 Very informational, that place. Like, they, they've taught me so much.

Joe Rogan 53:36 Yes.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:37 You know? Just about recovery and what to do afterward. Um, you know, they're, they're investing a lot in just, like, different programs for us to take home so that we can make sure that, um, like, our nervous system's good for the next day. Like-

Joe Rogan 53:51 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:51 ... they're putting so much stuff into figuring out how to help the fighters. And it's-

Joe Rogan 53:56 You know what else tripped out by, man?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 53:58 ... really cool.

Joe Rogan 53:58 That, uh, that underwater treadmill jammy.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:00 Isn't it amazing? Did you-

Joe Rogan 54:01 What?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:01 ... run on it?

Joe Rogan 54:01 No, I didn't. (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:02 No, you gotta do it. It's sick.

Joe Rogan 54:04 I was, I was wearing my clothes. I wasn't gonna jump in there, but I was like, "What? Look at... This is crazy, this thing."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:08 It's sick, man.

Joe Rogan 54:09 Did you do it?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:09 Yeah, I did it a few times.

Joe Rogan 54:11 What is it... Is it good for your cardio?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:12 Uh, it's, it's low impact on the joints.

Joe Rogan 54:15 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:15 So, like, it's... Oh yeah, you'll, you'll get a real good cardio, uh-

Joe Rogan 54:18 Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:18 ... real good cardio push on it. 'Cause there's jets blowing at you and the, the-

Joe Rogan 54:24 Treadmill.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:24 ... the treadmill's on the bottom. So you're trying just to not... You're running against the water.

Joe Rogan 54:29 Oh, wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:30 And so, like, depending on how deep you go, your arms are j-... That's all resistance.

Joe Rogan 54:34 Oh, shit.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:35 So you can go just waist level and it's a little bit easier, but the lower you go, the harder it is.

Joe Rogan 54:39 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:39 It's real good cardio. Did you do the zero gravity?

Joe Rogan 54:41 I didn't do any of the things there. I just looked at them.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:43 (sighs) That's what-

Joe Rogan 54:44 They just gave me the tour.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:45 ... that's the best one. That's the best one.

Joe Rogan 54:45 Forrest Griffin gave me the, the four one one. Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:48 They've done a lot. When's the last time you were there?

Joe Rogan 54:50 What's the zero gravity... It's been a while. Maybe a year. What, what was the zero gravity?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 54:54 They, they've done a lot. So there's a treadmill and you put these pants on and then you zip into this... Like, you zip into it.

Joe Rogan 55:00 Oh, I did see that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:01 And then you turn it on-

Joe Rogan 55:02 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:02 ... and it fills up with this air, then you can run-... up to, like, 10% of your body weight. So you f- it's just like-

Joe Rogan 55:10 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:10 ... it's another zero gravity, like, treadmill. It's not-

Joe Rogan 55:13 Low impact, right? Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:14 Low impact, super low and you can go all the way.

Joe Rogan 55:15 10% of your body weight?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:17 10%. So you're just, like, tippy toes, just like...

Joe Rogan 55:18 Oh, that's so weird.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:19 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 55:21 Yeah. Th- that's really weird.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:22 But yeah, they got a lot of-

Joe Rogan 55:23 It's good idea.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:23 ... cool stuff, man.

Joe Rogan 55:25 Well, they're at the forefront of, uh, all recovery methods and training methods and-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:29 Nutrition.

Joe Rogan 55:30 Yeah. And just-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:31 You see what they're doing for this on fight week?

Joe Rogan 55:32 What are they doing?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:33 So this last fight, um, they were like, "Hey, do you want any help? Do you have your meals prepped or anything?" Then I was like, "No, I don't." So I guess for the people that are fighting within US for now, um, they'll, they'll prep and make everything for, for fight week when you're cutting weight. And they'll make sure-

Joe Rogan 55:51 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 55:51 ... like, you stay in contact with, with the guys, Clinton, them, and they'll, uh, check your weight and then they'll make m- meals according to you, like, whatever you need, deliver them to your room and make sure-

Joe Rogan 56:01 That's outstanding.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:02 It was, it was the best. And then the recovery afterward, they give you these drinks, all, like, USADA approved, all that stuff, it's like no problems. They help-

Joe Rogan 56:10 Mm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:10 They help so much with that last weight cut and, uh, and rehydration. It's sick.

Joe Rogan 56:14 How much do you cut?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:16 This fight I cut 19, 19 pounds and that's a lot.

Joe Rogan 56:23 Mm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:23 Usually, I usually cut maybe four to seven pounds.

Joe Rogan 56:27 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:27 The last couple fights, I've j- I just coasted. But when I went to Thailand (laughs) there was a lot of sugar and a lot of stuff that I was eating out there, man.

Joe Rogan 56:36 Is that really what it was?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 56:37 Yeah, when I, I was in Bangkok for a long time and it's just a lot of street food, a lot of fried food and stuff. And I was just there and I'm like, "I'm gonna try everything." So once I got to Phuket, they actually have, like, health food stuff, vegan stuff. They have a lot of tourists there, so especially on the street. So the street that Tiger's on, all gyms. It's like five or six CrossFit gyms, maybe 10 restaurants, health food restaurants, everything. So I was able to stay on track there, so just, I was just back just a few weeks. Yeah, but I still made weight, so that was good. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 57:10 S- that's a lot of weight to cut though, right? Like-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:12 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:12 ... you like to cut, like, about five or six, is that what you're saying?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:15 Yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 57:15 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:16 No more than eight. Like, eight is pushing it for me, so.

Joe Rogan 57:18 What, what difference do you feel?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:21 Uh, the day after I didn't... With their rehydration method, I felt amazing. Usually if w- cutting that much I'd feel a little bit bloated, little heavy-

Joe Rogan 57:29 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:29 ... sleepy or all that stuff, but-

Joe Rogan 57:30 This, when you're talking... D- did you ever do IV or would you j-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:34 I did do IV, yeah, when I used to fight in the RFA at, um-

Joe Rogan 57:37 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:37 ... at 185. I used to fight at 185.

Joe Rogan 57:39 Oh my God.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:39 Yeah, that was...

Joe Rogan 57:40 That's hilarious. How much did you cut?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:42 Oh, I used to cut from, I tried to get as close to 200 as possible and then cut-

Joe Rogan 57:47 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:48 ... the 15. So-

Joe Rogan 57:49 You must have been super skinny at 200 too.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:51 Terrible.

Joe Rogan 57:52 Oh.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:52 Oh, terrible.

Joe Rogan 57:53 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:53 I'm struggling to make 205. Not, not, like, not struggling-

Joe Rogan 57:56 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 57:56 ... but, like, it hurts to make 205 now, so I couldn't even imagine, like... Oh, it sucked. So-

Joe Rogan 58:01 Well, what would you think about if they abandoned weight cutting?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:05 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 58:06 They just opened up more weight classes and abandoned weight cutting.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:10 Ooh, I mean-

Joe Rogan 58:12 Don't-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:12 ... I wouldn't mind it. I would, I would like to see that.

Joe Rogan 58:14 Don't you think it would be better for the fighters?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:16 I think it'd be better for the fighters and we'd see some-

Joe Rogan 58:18 And one less thing-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:18 ... really cool match-ups.

Joe Rogan 58:19 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:20 You know what I mean? 'Cause there's some guys that cut a lot of weight and there's some match-ups that would be really cool a- add different weights to.

Joe Rogan 58:25 I think it's one of those dumb things that's existed in the past and we never corrected.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:29 I think, I think we should stop it. It's not helping anybody. To lose weight for a fight so that you could be fit and in great shape, yeah, f- okay, sure.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:38 But how do you go about that?

Joe Rogan 58:39 But, I mean, losing weight, like, losing weight in training, not, like, massive dehydration-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:44 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:44 ... for weight cut day and then rehydration the next day for fight day. I think it's, it's a crazy strain that guys are doing to their kidneys and their bodies. I mean, many fighters have told me that they're, uh, they don't feel like they can take a body shot as well-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:57 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 58:57 ... when they cut a lot of weight. Like, that can't-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 58:59 Yeah, sometimes the, your head w- my head, I remember in the Johnny Walker fight, I had cut... Excuse me, could have been from the weight cut, but that morning, like, if I even tapped on my jaw, I just felt like my head was just, like, off, like, rattly, you know?

Joe Rogan 59:14 Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:15 Yeah, it felt very sensitive. And then-

Joe Rogan 59:16 Do you think that's from the weight cut?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:17 ... at, at the same night I get knocked out. I don't know what it was from, but I remember feeling that morning when I woke up-

Joe Rogan 59:23 Hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:23 ... 'cause usually I, like, I'll shake everything off, I'll, like, you know, like, punch myself in the jaw, all that stuff just to get ready for the fight.

Joe Rogan 59:29 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:29 And I remember that, that morning when I was, like, tapping myself on the jaw, my head just didn't feel right.

Joe Rogan 59:35 Dude.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:36 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 59:36 That's not a good feeling.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:37 No, but I got it checked after, I didn't have any, like, concussion or anything, so, uh-

Joe Rogan 59:41 Did you have some particularly hard sparring session or something close to that?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:45 Uh, I don't think close to it. During that camp, uh, like I said, I didn't feel it all the way until... I di- I didn't have it, it only, the only time I ever felt it was, like, after the weight cut, so it could have been from that.

Joe Rogan 59:59 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 59:59 Yeah. And I think that morning I actually ended up cutting the last little bit of my weight the morning of weigh-ins too, which is not usually like me, I usually cut it the night before.

Joe Rogan 1:00:09 So you said you like to start your day off with a run, um, are you doing that every day?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:13 Yeah, definitely.

Joe Rogan 1:00:14 Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:14 So that's one thing that I learned too is just training every day, not learn, but it just feels different. Now I, I, I have to go and train every day. When I was in Vegas, like, "Oh, I gotta drive 30 minutes," you know, all these things I had a lot of excuses to make up and now with the convenience of how training is now, I don't even make up excuses. I'm like, if I'm tired, I still, it's a two-minute walk, get your ass to the gym, you know?

Joe Rogan 1:00:38 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:38 And so, yeah, every, every single day training and then weekends off for sure.

Joe Rogan 1:00:42 So you're running every single day, then you're training every single day?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:45 Before Muay Thai, it's mandatory you, you run. That's how they train.

Joe Rogan 1:00:47 That's, like, that's how they train? Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:48 The trainers won't even let you train unless you run first.

Joe Rogan 1:00:50 How-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:00:50 You show up, you run. The day, the first day I showed up, uh, at, at Tiger's Muay Thai class, I didn't even have tennis shoes, I just showed up with my flip-flops 'cause I was staying right across the street. And I showed up, I start wrapping my hands and the trainer, he's like, "Are you gonna train?" And I was like, "Yeah, I think so." He's like, "You think so? Well, go run." And I was like, "I don't have shoes, I only have my flip-flops." And he's like-... just pointed like, "So? Go run." And I had to run like, I think it was like eight kilometers in- in flip-flops before I could-

Joe Rogan 1:01:19 Jesus.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:19 ... even train. Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:20 That's like four miles, right?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:22 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:01:22 Somewhere around there? Five and a half. Five and a half?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:24 Yeah. It's like f- four, like four miles, something like that. We just had to run, run, run, run, run, run.

Joe Rogan 1:01:29 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:29 I asked the girls like, "How long do we run for?" She's like, "Usually like five to six kilometers," or something like that. It was like-

Joe Rogan 1:01:34 Yeah. 5K is like three and a half miles. Yeah. I was gonna say that.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:36 Yeah. Five... I'd say like just cutting it short, 5K.

Joe Rogan 1:01:39 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:39 And then w- in flip-flops.

Joe Rogan 1:01:41 That's ruthless.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:41 And I was like, "Okay, cool." Yeah. I never, I never forgot my shoes again. I would always show up.

Joe Rogan 1:01:44 How bad that fuck your feet up?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:46 It wasn't too bad, actually.

Joe Rogan 1:01:47 No?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:47 No, 'cause I wasn't wearing shoes a lot anyway.

Joe Rogan 1:01:49 Oh.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:50 Just Thailand, sometimes you gotta take off your shoes before you enter the store, so.

Joe Rogan 1:01:53 So they're, they're hard-assed in their discipline with their wanting you to run first.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:57 They're just serious about it.

Joe Rogan 1:01:58 Very serious about it.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:01:58 Yeah, they're just serious about it. They're like, "Show respect," you know? Like...

Joe Rogan 1:02:01 And when you're running, are you running with a group of guys? Or you just-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:04 Everybody. Guys, girls. Whoever shows up to class.

Joe Rogan 1:02:07 But is it, uh-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:08 For the advanced class.

Joe Rogan 1:02:08 ... is like m- okay. So when they're running, are they running like, uh, organized, like i- in a group? Or are they just-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:14 So...

Joe Rogan 1:02:14 Is everybody running a few miles before class every time?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:17 So the first, the first Muay Thai gym that I trained at, the straight Muay Thai gym in Bangkok, they run as a unit every day, 5:00 AM.

Joe Rogan 1:02:26 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:26 As a team. They live at the gym, they eat at the gym, they sleep at the gym. They are, like they- they don't have homes. Their home is the gym-

Joe Rogan 1:02:35 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:35 ... and their job is just fight and eat, sleep, train, fight. That's it.

Joe Rogan 1:02:39 It's crazy when they, they even take on the name of the gym.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:41 Yeah. Exactly. (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:02:43 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:02:44 And that's a whole different life. Like that is what made me respect and learn and love Muay Thai so much, is how these guys trained and just, they lived together, everything. It was amazing. So they run as a group, but the other, like the other place, we all start off, but if y- if someone's lapping you and they just wanna run fast, like it's, it's totally fine. But before the class, everybody has to go.

Joe Rogan 1:03:06 Yeah. Wow. That's a smart way to do it, man. I mean, if you could really convince them to be conditioned all the time, and there's no, (laughs) like you have no option. You can't be out of condition if you're gonna run five miles every day.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:03:18 No. Five miles and then hitting, kicking, hitting and kicking pads for five to 10 rounds a day, clinching 45 minutes a day, like clinching at, after every session. It's like you run, knee bag, sit-ups, all that stuff. Second, second session is, um, kick the bag three to five rounds until a trainer picks you up. Like for me, I had to wait for (clears throat) a trainer to actually even like want to hold pads for me. If you just show up, you'll just be hitting the bag until a trainer was like, "Hey, okay. I'll hold for you."

Joe Rogan 1:03:51 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:03:52 And then once you actually find a trainer that wants to work with you, then you kind of, whatever their schedule is for you, they- they'll create it. They'll, you'll hold, they'll hold pads, you'll kick the bag, you'll do push-ups, you'll do sit-ups, and then clinch 30 to 45 minutes after. And it's the same thing every single day.

Joe Rogan 1:04:11 Wow. And, uh, d- do you ever worry that this might be something that would be monotonous because you're doing the same way every day? Or do you think we just concentrate on excellence?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:20 No, because it's also, uh, like going to the fights and there's so many different styles. So like people are doing the same thing every day, the repetition, but the styles are completely different, you know? Like nobody fights like Saenchai, right?

Joe Rogan 1:04:34 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:34 He does the same thing everybody else does, but he has his own style.

Joe Rogan 1:04:36 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:37 You know what I mean? Or some guys will do the same thing, but they don't even like to kick or knee. They just like to throw elbows.

Joe Rogan 1:04:43 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:43 I know plenty of guys like that where they just like, you know that when he goes, he's just throwing elbows all five rounds.

Joe Rogan 1:04:49 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:49 This guy's just gonna throw knees. So it's just like which tools do you use the best?

Joe Rogan 1:04:54 Mm-hmm.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:04:55 Like, are you a kneer? Are you a kicker? Are you an elbow guy? Are you a left kick? Are you a low kicker? It's kind of like which, which strikes are your, are your thing? And then you go watch the chaos and these guys are getting split open every night, fucking on the stretchers. They take them stretchers on the ring, man. It's amazing.

Joe Rogan 1:05:11 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:11 It's like not to see someone get hurt, but like just the, the fact that th- these guys are all out brawling every night. Every single night there's a fight at the stadium.

Joe Rogan 1:05:19 Shoo-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:19 And Thursday nights are the nights that like the, like the higher guys go and they're packed with people, thousands of people. Like the one I went to, there was a few thousand people there for the stadium. It looked packed and everyone's betting like, "Oh, no." And then when the kicks land, they're like, "Oh, hey." Oh, it's, the energy is crazy.

Joe Rogan 1:05:39 Wow.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:39 It's, they never show doubt, man. I'm getting hyped thinking about it.

Joe Rogan 1:05:42 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:42 Get me back to Thailand right now.

Joe Rogan 1:05:43 How did Saenchai figure out how to do Muay Thai different than anybody?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:47 Oh, man.

Joe Rogan 1:05:48 He's so interesting with his quick switches of the feet and like even the way he throws kicks is just got like a little different flavor to everything he does.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:05:56 I just, I don't think he can help it. You know what I mean? Like just something about the guy's character.

Joe Rogan 1:06:00 (laughs)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:00 It just like his, his fighting is him.

Joe Rogan 1:06:03 Right.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:04 You know? Like he's just, he's kind of outgoing, like just a weird funky guy and it makes sense that he fights like that. You know what I mean? It's not like he's just like serious, like stern guy.

Joe Rogan 1:06:13 Yeah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:13 But then goes out there and fights all crazy. Like he seems like his fighting is definitely an expression of himself.

Joe Rogan 1:06:20 He's so good, man. Yeah. He's so good. I- I like watching him just warm up. Sneakers on, outside sweating, throwing elbows and knees and shit.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:28 Everything.

Joe Rogan 1:06:29 He's a bad motherfucker, man. And he's, you know, he's not young.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:32 No. I think he's in his 40s.

Joe Rogan 1:06:34 Is he?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:34 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:06:35 Really?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:35 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:06:36 Oh, I didn't know that about him. Can we look how, uh, how old Saenchai is? 38. 38. Oh.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:40 He's getting there.

Joe Rogan 1:06:41 He's getting there. But meanwhile he's in his prime-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:42 Still fighting.

Joe Rogan 1:06:43 ... fucking people up all the time.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:44 Multiple times a month.

Joe Rogan 1:06:45 Multiple times a month.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:46 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:06:46 "Have fight. Good luck."

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:06:47 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:06:47 You know, shows fists and like dynamite. (laughs) His Instagram is awesome, man. And he's got these great videos of him warming up and you watch him, him, his movement, man. It's like, "Wow, that guy's... he's something special." It takes a lot of fucking energy to move around s- the way he does too.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:02 Yeah. I'm sure he still shows up to the gym every single day too.

Joe Rogan 1:07:04 I'm sure.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:04 And he's like holding pads for foreigners and all that stuff. I stopped by Yaokao Gym. He wasn't there, but I hear like-

Joe Rogan 1:07:09 There he is.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:09 ... he's always there. Look at that guy.

Joe Rogan 1:07:10 It's the motherfucking man right there.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:12 He just posted a video the other day wearing this crazy wig.Go to, see if you-

Joe Rogan 1:07:17 Can you see it?

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:17 ... can find a video of him.

Joe Rogan 1:07:18 There it is right there. (laughs) Look at this guy.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:20 (laughs)

Joe Rogan 1:07:24 Ugh.

Narrator 1:07:25 Ah.

Joe Rogan 1:07:27 Even how he throws his kick.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:28 It's different, right?

Joe Rogan 1:07:28 It's so different.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:29 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:07:31 Like, he doesn't really, like, turn all of his upper body like a lot of the ones I've seen.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:35 Right. He's, he's a volume guy, but he knocks guys out with one shot too.

Joe Rogan 1:07:39 Look at that catch.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:39 Yeah.

Joe Rogan 1:07:39 He didn't even like- Yeah. It's just instinctual, you know? Like, he didn't even-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:42 He's so good.

Joe Rogan 1:07:42 ... think about it. Didn't even flinch.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:43 He's so good.

Joe Rogan 1:07:44 Checked, up, swipe. Oh.

Narrator 1:07:49 Ah.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:49 It's interesting when you think of how many different people are doing it, and that this one guy stands out.

Joe Rogan 1:07:54 (clears throat)

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:07:55 I love outliers, man.

Joe Rogan 1:07:56 So that's one thing that I learned, compared to, like, watching Muay Thai in the-

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:08:00 Oof.

Joe Rogan 1:08:00 ... States and then going there, the amount of kicks and knees that they're throwing.

Khalil Rountree Jr. 1:08:04 Hmm.

Joe Rogan 1:08:06 I'm looking at fighting like, "Okay, like, when's the next punch gonna happen?" These guys throwing kick after kick after kick for five rounds. I was like, "Okay, I'm, I'm definitely not kicking enough,