JRE MMA Show #90 with Rashad Evans

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   3, 2, 1, bo-…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      3, 2, 1, bo- You can tell a lot about a man whether or not he's one of those dudes that has one of them-

   2. RERashad Evans0:06

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:06

      ... wallet phone cases.

   4. RERashad Evans0:08

      (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:08

      Rashad Evans, you're a wallet phone case guy.

   6. RERashad Evans0:10

      (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:11

      You, you pack it all into one package.

   8. RERashad Evans0:12

      You know what? I wasn't always a wallet phone case guy. It's kinda something that just, you know, I kind of evolved into. I was one that was carrying around the, the, uh-

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:20

      Man purse?

   10. RERashad Evans0:21

       ... the man purse for a while.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:22

       Mm.

   12. RERashad Evans0:22

       And, and after a while I kinda transitioned to just the, the, the wallet case.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:27

       That's a lot of work, though. Look how thick that sucker is.

   14. RERashad Evans0:30

       It's, it's like a Costanza now.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       Look at that thing.

   16. RERashad Evans0:32

       It, it, it, it ... I know. And there's the thing-

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:33

       That thing's giant.

   18. RERashad Evans0:34

       Every single time I clean it out, I tell myself I'm not gonna put any more cards in there except for the ones I need. But, it just attracts the cards.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:41

       Yeah, that's a problem. I have one of those Ridge wallets. You know what those are?

   20. RERashad Evans0:45

       Yeah, yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:45

       Those are the shit because you can't really get much in there. I get, like, a credit card or two and my license, and that's it.

   22. RERashad Evans0:53

       See, that's- see, that's what I need. I need to have that discipline-

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:55

       Yes.

   24. RERashad Evans0:55

       ... where there's nothing else to carry but what I have to carry.

   25. JRJoe Rogan0:58

       And it's got a little money clip on it, so I'll s- sh- shove a couple bills in there, and that's it.

   26. RERashad Evans1:02

       That's it. See, that's-

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:03

       I go out like that.

   28. RERashad Evans1:04

       That's what I need. I got it.

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:04

       That's what you need, front pocket.

   30. RERashad Evans1:06

       Uh-huh.
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Were you not the…

   1. RERashad Evans15:00

      after I came back from my injuries, I just wasn't the same f- fighter anymore. I just was not.

   2. JRJoe Rogan15:04

      Were you not the same physically or was it mentally?

   3. RERashad Evans15:07

      It was physical, but it also, it became mental because it wa- because physically I just didn't feel the same, you know. I didn't feel like I, I ever regained the power back in, in my legs. And for the most part, my legs were everything, you know.

   4. JRJoe Rogan15:18

      What were the injuries?

   5. RERashad Evans15:20

      I had two ACL surgeries on my, on my right knee. And that completely just, uh, it, it changed everything for me because, you know, being a smaller, like, heavyweight, all of my power was all in my legs, you know.

   6. JRJoe Rogan15:32

      Right.

   7. RERashad Evans15:32

      And whatever I couldn't make up for in the size department up top, I was usually able to make up for with the power in my legs, you know.

   8. JRJoe Rogan15:39

      Is that related to the injury that you got when you were at Jackson's and Diego Sanchez crashed into you?

   9. RERashad Evans15:45

      No, that was ... So that was a different injury. So that was, uh, MCL.

   10. JRJoe Rogan15:48

       Okay.

   11. RERashad Evans15:48

       But it was on my left knee. So the right knee was the-

   12. JRJoe Rogan15:51

       Okay.

   13. RERashad Evans15:51

       ... one that got injured.

   14. JRJoe Rogan15:52

       That always drove me crazy 'cause I'm like, "Why the fuck is a guy training for-

   15. RERashad Evans15:55

       (laughs)

   16. JRJoe Rogan15:55

       ... a world title fight, uh, in a regular class w- where everybody knows-

   17. RERashad Evans15:59

       I know.

   18. JRJoe Rogan15:59

       ... people collide into people in regular classes all the time, with millions of dollars on the line."

   19. RERashad Evans16:03

       Crazy. I know. But th-

   20. JRJoe Rogan16:04

       And I see that all the time, though, in top gyms.

   21. RERashad Evans16:06

       And, but that ... See that, see that's, that's, that's where the, the training has gone. Like, like before where you, we would train like maniacs. We would train crazy as hell and put ourselves in some crazy situations.

   22. JRJoe Rogan16:15

       Mm-hmm.

   23. RERashad Evans16:16

       And you, and you try to put yourself in those situations because you, like, "You know, I did it before, and I've done it so many times, and nothing has happened." But when you start to move up and there's more on the line, then you always have to take every single precaution because you can't afford to take a step back, you know.

   24. JRJoe Rogan16:32

       Right.

   25. RERashad Evans16:33

       And, um, for me, once I had my knee injuries though, I just mentally was not the same person. And when I competed, I wasn't the same person. And then it'd affect me because then I'm like, "You know, I'm not the same person."

   26. JRJoe Rogan16:45

       Did you lose the ability to explode with your knees? Did you have meniscus damage as well?

   27. RERashad Evans16:51

       Um, I had meniscus damage.

   28. JRJoe Rogan16:52

       Wow.

   29. RERashad Evans16:52

       I lost the ability to explode, and I lost, um ... It would get tired. My leg would get tired, you know. And it didn't have the same bounce, the same rhythm.

   30. JRJoe Rogan17:00

       Mm.
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   Yeah. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan30:00

      what happened. I mean, it's a...... apparently, according to biologists, it's the biggest mystery in the fossil record, that the human brain doubled. And not just that any organ would double in size over a period of two million years, but that the organ responsible for the theory of evolution in the first place doubled over two million years is really interesting.

   2. RERashad Evans30:20

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan30:20

      But it coincides with climate change and coincides with these rainforests ... And this is all Terence's work I'm, I'm repeating. It coincides with these rainforests receding into grasslands and then these ungulates, these cow, cow-like animals that would live on these grasslands and eat the cow and take shits. And then the manure would grow ... Or, uh, the psilocybin rather would grow in the manure and they, they would follow these cows around and then eat their mushrooms that would gl- grow in their manure. And it also coincides with the earliest, earliest civilizations would all worship cattle. Like, uh, Chacal Hill-

   4. RERashad Evans30:58

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan30:58

      ... which is one of the earliest known civilizations. They had these ... It was a real cattle worshiping, uh, sort of a ... I don't, I don't wanna say a cult, but, the, the way their culture would operate, they worshipped cattle. And some could say, "Well that's 'cause they ate them and they used their milk." I'm sure, I'm sure, that had something to do with it, but like the Hindus don't even eat them, they just worship-

   6. RERashad Evans31:21

      Yeah.

   7. JRJoe Rogan31:21

      ... them. Imagine that? You got a billion people living in a place, everyone's starving and they're not eating the cows. They're not eating the most delicious animal-

   8. RERashad Evans31:27

      Right.

   9. JRJoe Rogan31:27

      ... on the planet. Well it's because they grew mushrooms! And the ancient Hindu scripts like Soma, is one of the, the main sacraments that they would talk about and no one really understood. To this day, they're not exactly sure what Soma is, but it's some sort of a psychedelic sacrament and it probably was a combination of many things, but a big one was most likely psilocybin was a part of that. And that sort of corresponded with their relationship with cows, that they had this, this worship of cattle, th- they wouldn't eat them and the reason is 'cause God came out of their butt.

   10. RERashad Evans32:03

       (laughs)

   11. JRJoe Rogan32:04

       In their eyes, you know, they would make the manure, the mushrooms would grow in the manure and, I mean there's all sorts of mushroom iconography in all of their ancient religious artwork and-

   12. RERashad Evans32:14

       I mean, I think mushrooms have ... I, I, I know mushrooms have played a big part in our society-

   13. JRJoe Rogan32:19

       Yeah.

   14. RERashad Evans32:19

       I mean, and in our civilization and our ancient civilization.

   15. JRJoe Rogan32:23

       For sure.

   16. RERashad Evans32:23

       And I don't think it's been, you know, properly covered the way that, uh, it could be, but-

   17. JRJoe Rogan32:27

       Right.

   18. RERashad Evans32:28

       Um, it, it, it's amazing because the minute you, you eat a mushroom at the right dosage, you feel it. You feel the fact that it's like, oh this is something ancient because there, there's something that happens when, when you go to that place where you, you, you lose the, you lose the self.

   19. JRJoe Rogan32:48

       Mm-hmm.

   20. RERashad Evans32:49

       When you lose the self, then there's, there's something that, that happens that's, that's just magical. There really is no way to, to explain it or dress it up with words. It's just, it's just a ma- something magical that happens once you reach that level.

   21. JRJoe Rogan33:03

       Yeah, whenever I have these conversations with people, there's two types of people. There's people like you that have had the experiences that go, "Mm-hmm." And then there's people that have no experience with it at all that look at you like, "Pfft, yeah it's mushrooms." But I feel bad for those people.

   22. RERashad Evans33:16

       I do too. (laughs)

   23. JRJoe Rogan33:17

       Because I know how I used to think and I would've dismissed it the same way. I would've said this is the foolish notions of frivolous, spiritual people that are just being ridiculous and they think, "Oh it's all about the mushrooms, man."

   24. RERashad Evans33:31

       Yeah. (laughs)

   25. JRJoe Rogan33:32

       And, but it is! It i- if you do it, you'll realize like, oh well ... If you do any real potent, breakthrough psychedelic, any real breakthrough psy-psychedelic experience is gonna make you humble. It's gonna make you realize like oh, there's more to this than everyday consciousness.

   26. RERashad Evans33:49

       Yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan33:49

       There's more to this experience, this existence. There's something way bigger and you only can tap into it through a variety of different methods, whether it's, you know, w- what, you know, name your psychedelic or name your trance-like state that people can go into. There's a lot of different ways to tap into it but once you do, you realize like this is not ... This little thin thing that we're touching right now, this is not everything.

   28. RERashad Evans34:12

       Right. A- and that's the thing about it. It, it really just cuts through the whole materialism of everything.

   29. JRJoe Rogan34:16

       Yeah.

   30. RERashad Evans34:16

       It really shows that, um, materialism is just a, a product of consciousness, you know? And sometimes we, we tend to think that, you know, our, our, our consciousness is a product of the materialism but, you know, at the end of the day, consciousness is everything.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   Yeah. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan45:00

      Dominic Reyes was winning.

   2. RERashad Evans45:01

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan45:02

      The question is (clears throat) whether he won the third round. That's the one I believe that's up for grabs. Most people that I've talked to think Jon won the last two clearly, most people. Most people that I've talked to that are experts, most people, few d- disagree, believe that Dominic Reyes won the first three. And the third round is the one that seems to be, you could go, "Well, Dominic scored more, but it was close enough where you could see someone giving it to Jon, particularly since Jon was pressing the action, Jon was pushing forward. Maybe you could give it to Jon." But they thought Dominic won it. But they said, "If there's a disputable round, it is that third round."

   4. RERashad Evans45:42

      Yeah, I agree.

   5. JRJoe Rogan45:43

      But the... One fucking judge gave Jon-

   6. RERashad Evans45:46

      That was crazy.

   7. JRJoe Rogan45:46

      ... four rounds to one. That's insane.

   8. RERashad Evans45:48

      Yeah, that was insane.

   9. JRJoe Rogan45:48

      This is the same judge that when Ab- um-, I believe Ab- lo- Luke Thomas was talking about this, I'm, I'm sorry if I'm wrong 'cause I'm not saying the judge's name because I'm not sure if I'm correct, but I believe it's the same judge that, um, Trevin Giles who fought, uh, James Krause, um... The d- Giles and Krause was an amazing fight. Giles won a, wound up winning the decision, but the first round, Krause had his back for four minutes, and the ref- or the judge gave that round to Giles.

   10. RERashad Evans46:19

       Mm-hmm.

   11. JRJoe Rogan46:19

       Which is insane. I mean-

   12. RERashad Evans46:21

       Yeah.

   13. JRJoe Rogan46:21

       ... for four minutes, Krause had his back, was, uh, the guy was fighting off chokes. Krause was real close to submitting him couple times during those four minutes. And the judge, the same judge who gave four rounds to Jon Jones, gave that first round to Giles where there was a dude on his back for four-

   14. RERashad Evans46:39

       That's crazy.

   15. JRJoe Rogan46:39

       ... fucking minutes.

   16. RERashad Evans46:40

       That, that, that... Mo- most of the round. And maybe even a fucking more egregious f- fight was, um, uh, Andre Ewell versus, uh, Jonathan Martinez. That fight was fucking crazy. That fight was crazy. That was the most crazy one. Martinez won- Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan47:00

       ... that fight.

   18. RERashad Evans47:01

       Yeah.

   19. JRJoe Rogan47:01

       Martinez won that fight. Ewell broke his arm, I think. He, so, I'm not sure if it's a broken arm, but he had a significant injury to his right hand early in the fight, somewhere in between either the first or the second round, not sure. But he really couldn't throw a right hand, and it was kind of hanging, you could kind of see it was hanging. And Martinez put in work. It was an amazing performance by him, and he got fucked over, man, real bad. It was bad decision-making. There was a bunch of bad fights. There was a bunch of bad decisions.

   20. RERashad Evans47:28

       Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan47:28

       It wasn't just one.

   22. RERashad Evans47:29

       I know.

   23. JRJoe Rogan47:29

       There was, like, four or five on a, a card of, what, 12 fights, 11, 12 fights? I forget how many it was from the or- or- opening prelims. There was bad decisions, just almost like people who don't know what they're seeing.

   24. RERashad Evans47:43

       Yeah. And that, and that, and that's crazy too, especially when we reach the point that we have in mixed martial arts, you know. I think that we've, we- we've turned a corner, and that mean the fact that there's- there's so many, uh, so much out there, so much knowledge out there on the sport and everything else like that. And if you're gonna be judging it, you gotta at least know when somebody is, is winning a round. I mean, you know, there- there's aspects of, of Jon's game that, that was, you know, he'd score some points, you know, he was always moving forward with the action.

   25. JRJoe Rogan48:10

       Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

   26. RERashad Evans48:10

       But, um, you know, even when he was moving forward with the action, he wasn't terribly too offensive. He would come with his legs, but, you know, a lot of times, he, he would allow, he would allow, uh, Dominic to kind of be the first one initiating and then moving off. And then sometimes it seemed like he was just kind of chasing him. But, um, you know, I- I think that, uh, it was, it- it was that third round. That third round was that- that hard round to score.

   27. JRJoe Rogan48:36

       Mm-hmm.

   28. RERashad Evans48:36

       But, uh...You know, it's- I, I, I think that Dom had the edge, but if you gonna beat the champ, then you gotta be the champ.

   29. JRJoe Rogan48:46

       Mm-hmm.

   30. RERashad Evans48:46

       And I don't think he did that. Jon Jones impressed me so much with the shots that he was able to take. But more or less, the mindset that Jon had. That, that, that mindset that Jon had in those championship rounds, to me, that, that showed that this guy is... You know, he is the total package in, in when it comes to fighting, just mentally speaking. You know, he's, he's somebody who I thou- thought that was frustrated and working through his own frustrating in the fight, for his frustration in the fight i- i- is, is difficult.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:09:26

   (laughs) …

   1. RERashad Evans1:00:00

      codes written down, and he'll, he tort-, he'll torture you in that basement.

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:00:03

      (laughs)

   3. RERashad Evans1:00:03

      He'll torture you. He'll, he'll get your mindset like sharp as hell, but he'll, he'll torture you in that, that basement, you know? And it-

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:00:09

      Well, it's so, such a diverse group of fighters, right? Zabite comes down there.

   5. RERashad Evans1:00:13

      Yeah. (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:00:13

      Marlon Moraes. It's a... He had so many, uh, interesting guys. Edson Barboza. So many interesting guys have gone through that gym.

   7. RERashad Evans1:00:21

      It's, it's so crazy. Like, when I first, um... Like, I was staying there, and I got to train with Zabite a little bit, and I got to live with Zabite and, and the Russian, the Dagestan fighters.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:00:29

      Mm-hmm.

   9. RERashad Evans1:00:29

      So it was pretty, pretty cool experience because it, you know, you kind of get to know their culture and just kind of just, uh, just get a different respect for it, you know? And those guys are, are just-... hard work of those Dagestani guys. They're so hard, they, they, they work hard, they pray hard, they, they just are very, very focused individuals. And you watch them, you're like, "Oh, okay." Uh, you know, even I'm like, "You know what? Maybe I need to get a little bit more serious about my thing."

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:00:54

       (laughs)

   11. RERashad Evans1:00:54

       You know? But, uh-

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:00:55

       That's where the, the f- the success comes from. I mean-

   13. RERashad Evans1:00:58

       That's, that's it.

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:00:58

       Think about how many great fighters come out of that region. I mean, it's really ... it's extraordinary.

   15. RERashad Evans1:01:03

       Yeah. And the- these guys are phenomenal. Like, I watch them after training and these guys do, um, this, this, uh, like, it's like a randori type of sparring afterwards. And they just do, like, jumping off the walls. All these kind of, like, these acrobatic crazy moves that you don't think will ever work and you see them, like, "Oh, my God. Where'd he, where'd he get that from?" They practice it all the time and they just, they just, they just do all these kind of crazy moves at the end of training and-

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:01:30

       At the end of training?

   17. RERashad Evans1:01:31

       At the end of training. I'm like, "Oh-"

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:01:32

       So, like, they're done with all the real work, let's just fuck around and see if we get creative.

   19. RERashad Evans1:01:36

       Yeah, they get creative and they just start just doing all kinds of stuff and they, you know, throw real moves in the air. But they just, they drill everything and Zabite, that dude is ... Zabite is, is probably, like, one of the best guys I've ever seen in training. Just, like, like martial arts wise. This guy-

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:01:52

       Yeah.

   21. RERashad Evans1:01:53

       He jumps off the cage and, and do all kinds of acrobats and come down doing all kinds of ground acrobats. And he just, he just makes it look so effortless and easy. It's crazy.

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:02:04

       He is really good. He's r- he's really good with his mixture of traditional martial arts techniques. You know, 'cause he has that kung fu background.

   23. RERashad Evans1:02:12

       Yep.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:02:12

       So he throws a lot of, like, round kicks and spinning kicks and all that kind of crazy shit.

   25. RERashad Evans1:02:16

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:02:16

       But then he'll hit you with, like, some judo shit. A lot of t- tosses and trips.

   27. RERashad Evans1:02:21

       Yeah.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:02:21

       And he's got great submissions too. I mean, he's got great wrestling, he's got great boxing. I mean, he's a weird combination of a bunch of different styles.

   29. RERashad Evans1:02:30

       And he's tall too.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:02:31

       Mm-hmm.

Episode duration: 2:24:58