The GitLab way: Kindness, transparency, and short toes | David DeSanto (CPO)

ℹ️ EPISODE INFO

Released

April 14, 2024

Duration

1h 21m

Channel

Lenny's Podcast

Watch on YouTube

▶ Open ↗

📝 EPISODE DESCRIPTION

David DeSanto is the chief product officer of GitLab, which is the largest remote-only company in the world. They share many of their team meetings on YouTube, and they’ve grown from being an open-source code management product competing with GitHub to a multi-product platform that covers security, compliance, continuous integration, project management, and deployment tools, many of which are infused with AI magic. In our conversation, we discuss:

• How GitLab operationalizes transparency
• The philosophy behind recording and sharing team meetings on YouTube
• Their extensive public employee handbook
• GitLab’s core value of having “short toes”
• Challenges and advice for doing remote work well
• Strategies for ensuring effective communication in a remote work environment
• GitLab’s breadth-over-depth strategy
• The company’s unique approach to AI
• The value of using humor in high-stakes conversations

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Find the transcript and references at: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com/p/the-gitlab-way Where to find David DeSanto:

• X: https://twitter.com/david_desanto
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ddesanto/
• Threads: https://www.threads.net/@david.the.beard

Where to find Lenny:

• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com
• X: https://twitter.com/lennysan
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/

In this episode, we cover: (00:00) David’s background (04:20) Maintaining an epic beard (05:29) Why GitLab publicly shares team meetings (09:49) The GitLab Handbook (11:30) GitLab’s issue tracker (14:29) How to successfully build a culture of transparency (18:11) Benefits of operating with transparency (19:55) The value of building in public (21:53) How GitLab implements their core value of kindness (25:16) What it means to have “short toes” (27:41) Other core values (32:16) Common reasons for not fitting in at GitLab (34:42) Advice for remote teams (42:04) Advice for getting into product (43:52) Advice for PMs who are struggling in a remote world (48:25) Specific tools that help with remote work (53:13) Time zones and remote work (57:18) Breadth-over-depth strategy (01:04:14) AI at GitLab (01:13:11) GitLab’s products and solutions (01:14:54) Lightning round Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com. Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.

🎤 SPEAKERS

• Lenny Rachitsky

  host

• David DeSanto

  guest

• Narrator

  other

🧾 EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Lenny's Podcast, featuring Lenny Rachitsky and David DeSanto, The GitLab way: Kindness, transparency, and short toes | David DeSanto (CPO) explores inside GitLab: Radical transparency, remote culture, and product at scale GitLab CPO David DeSanto discusses how GitLab operationalizes extreme transparency through public meeting recordings, an open handbook, and a public issue tracker, and how this fuels community contribution and customer trust.

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