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Lewis HowesLewis Howes

Vanessa Van Edwards on The Science of People with Lewis Howes

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Vanessa Van EdwardsguestLewis Howeshost
Apr 24, 20171h 21mWatch on YouTube

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Transcript

  1. 0:00 – 0:52

    Subway intuition: sensing fear before a purse snatch

    1. VE

      This thing happened to me in New York City. I was in New York City and, um, I was walking by myself after a dinner party into the subway. So I was, like, kind of already nervous, and I walk into the subway, walk on the car, and, like, immediately I feel fear. Like-

    2. LH

      Oh

    3. VE

      ... you know that feeling you get, like, in the pit of your stomach where you're like... And, like, I could feel the hairs on the back of my neck stand up, and I was like, "What is it? What is it? What is it?" And I'm, like, looking around the car, and everything looks fine. And right before the doors close, a guy standing right next to me grabs the purse of the woman sitting, an elderly woman sitting, and runs out the doors. And I was like, "How did I know?" [upbeat music]

  2. 0:52 – 2:23

    Reuniting on the show and introducing “Captivate” with playful connection cues

    1. LH

      Welcome back, everyone, to the School of Greatness podcast. Excited about our guest today, Vanessa Van Edwards. Good to see you.

    2. VE

      Yes.

    3. LH

      Thanks for being here.

    4. VE

      Hand hugs.

    5. LH

      Hand hugs.

    6. VE

      Can we do a hand hug?

    7. LH

      What's a hand hug? Like this?

    8. VE

      It's this.

    9. LH

      Oh.

    10. VE

      Oh. Wasn't that good?

    11. LH

      What's a finger hug? Oh. [laughs]

    12. VE

      Oh. The oxytocin.

    13. LH

      That's right. Yeah, the connection.

    14. VE

      That was so much oxytocin.

    15. LH

      The connection. [laughs]

    16. VE

      Ah. [laughs]

    17. LH

      I'm excited about this. We had you on, what, like three years ago maybe, right?

    18. VE

      Yeah, yeah.

    19. LH

      It was a while ago. And, uh, it was a massive hit, and we're having you back on now because you've got a new book out called Captivate: The Science of Succeeding with People. And this is the type of stuff that I love talking to you the most.

    20. VE

      You gotta do your captivating face. Yeah, that's good.

    21. LH

      I know, it's like the, it's like the-

    22. VE

      It's like Blue Steel

    23. LH

      ... right? [laughs]

    24. VE

      It's like, it's either like a-

    25. LH

      Smizing?

    26. VE

      [gasps] Smizing, or it's like a Blue Steel. Yeah.

    27. LH

      Exactly.

    28. VE

      [laughs]

    29. LH

      Um, this is the stuff that fascinates me the most.

    30. VE

      Yeah.

  3. 2:23 – 3:59

    Owning awkwardness: why vulnerability helps people trust the “expert”

    1. LH

      I love the first couple pages where you-

    2. VE

      Ooh

    3. LH

      ... it shows a photo of you with, like, I don't know if you have braces on or not, but you're like-

    4. VE

      Oh, yeah. Oh

    5. LH

      ... you have, like, uh, helmet hair, you have braces. You're like-

    6. VE

      Do you like my vest? [laughs]

    7. LH

      ... you know? [laughs] Yeah, you're like-

    8. VE

      That is, that is the sound I was making when I took that picture

    9. LH

      ... brr. [laughs]

    10. VE

      [laughs] Just like that. Okay, wait.

    11. LH

      Uh-

    12. VE

      Can I tell you about that picture, though?

    13. LH

      Sure.

    14. VE

      So I'm, I'm in LA.

    15. LH

      Yes.

    16. VE

      My family's here. [laughs] And I give my mom the galley.

    17. LH

      Uh-huh.

    18. VE

      And she was, like, so excited.

    19. LH

      Yeah.

    20. VE

      She's like, "Oh my God, yay." And she opens it, she was like, "Why did you choose this picture?"

    21. LH

      Ooh.

    22. VE

      I was like, "Mom, like, that's real." Like-

    23. LH

      It's real life

    24. VE

      ... like, that's, that was me. And she said something that was interesting. She was like, "That was the most painful part of your life."

    25. LH

      Hmm.

    26. VE

      "Why would you share that?"

    27. LH

      Hmm.

    28. VE

      Which I think is a really-

    29. LH

      You have to

    30. VE

      ... y- you have-

  4. 3:59 – 5:57

    Lewis’s social re-engineering: learning to connect by becoming friends with everyone

    1. LH

      I, I love it. I mean, if I showed you a photo of myself, I sent a photo actually yesterday 'cause-

    2. VE

      I don't believe you, though

    3. LH

      ... no, hold on.

    4. VE

      No way.

    5. LH

      Let me, let me s- I'll send you a photo of me awkward.

    6. VE

      No, you were, like, an athlete.

    7. LH

      No, no.

    8. VE

      I was, like, a mathlete. Come on.

    9. LH

      I was, I was an athlete the way you are a, an extrovert. I was not, uh, you know, an athlete because I was good, because I was bad. And I said, "I'm gonna master this," just like you were.

    10. VE

      Okay.

    11. LH

      And we're like, yeah. So that's kinda how I became one.

    12. VE

      Are you gonna show me a vest picture?

    13. LH

      I'm gonna see if I can-

    14. VE

      Because I wanna see helmet hair.

    15. LH

      No, not a vest picture.

    16. VE

      [laughs]

    17. LH

      Let me see. I'll show you a photo of me.

    18. VE

      Recovering awkward Lewis.

    19. LH

      I mean, this is-

    20. VE

      That's what I wanna see

    21. LH

      ... this is pretty goofy, you know?

    22. VE

      Oh. [laughs]

    23. LH

      [laughs]

    24. VE

      Yeah.

    25. LH

      It's pretty, like-

    26. VE

      Yeah. [laughs] Oh

    27. LH

      ... lame, goofy.

    28. VE

      Yes.

    29. LH

      Yes.

    30. VE

      Yes, this would fit really well next to mine.

  5. 5:57 – 10:47

    What actually makes people popular: liking others, reducing ambivalence, creating safety

    1. VE

      And I was like, "Yes." So there was research. I've always been fascinated by the popular kids, right?

    2. LH

      Mm.

    3. VE

      Like, these, these magnetic sort of like-

    4. LH

      Yes

    5. VE

      ... what makes a kid cool or popular, whatever that is. And Van Sloan did a really interesting research experiment with teenagers- And he found, well, can you guess what makes the most popular kids popular? Like, what is it? It could be anything from attractiveness to clothing to the way they talk. If you had to guess. Listeners, guess too.

    6. LH

      What makes a popular person popular?

    7. VE

      Yes.

    8. LH

      Hmm. Their confidence? I don't know. Their outgoing-ness?

    9. VE

      Okay, that, I would have guessed outgoing.

    10. LH

      Yeah.

    11. VE

      That's exactly what I would have guessed.

    12. LH

      Yeah.

    13. VE

      Like extroverted, talkative, which was like, I was like, "Oh, please don't let it be that." So first of all, it wasn't attractiveness, which I think-

    14. LH

      Yes

    15. VE

      ... is very important for people to keep in mind.

    16. LH

      Interesting.

    17. VE

      It wasn't the most beautiful girls or the hottest guys. What it was is the most popular kids also liked the most people.

    18. LH

      Hmm. That makes sense.

    19. VE

      And like now that I heard that, which is exactly what you just said-

    20. LH

      As opposed to just five people, they're like, you know-

    21. VE

      Right

    22. LH

      ... everyone.

    23. VE

      Yes, exact- It's like he, what he found was is that the most popular kids, when they were asked, "Who do you like?" They had the longest list.

    24. LH

      Whoa.

    25. VE

      And that also meant that they were liked by the most people, and this was measured by typically they smiled more in the hallways. So they would do the, you tell me if this is right, so men, when they know, see someone they know, they give the upward, "Hey, nice- nice to see you," like it's like an acknowledgement.

    26. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    27. VE

      Versus if you don't know someone but you want to acknowledge them, you give them the- the downward nod.

    28. LH

      Hmm.

    29. VE

      Is that right?

    30. LH

      Probably, yes.

  6. 10:47 – 20:17

    Conferences and first impressions: like more people, prime conversations, and use context cues

    1. LH

      Yes, yes. Um, what we're gonna go into later, I'm gonna- I'm gonna hook you guys right now. We're gonna go in later and talk about how to understand when someone's lying-

    2. VE

      [laughs]

    3. LH

      ... and what to do about it. And this, Vanessa said that this is like a scary thing to talk about.

    4. VE

      Uh-huh.

    5. LH

      It's like, uh, she doesn't know if she wants to talk about it that much, but we're gonna go into it a little bit. But first, um, you have different sections in your book. There's the first five seconds, the first five hours, and the first five, mm, days, weeks?

    6. VE

      First five minutes, first five hours, first five days.

    7. LH

      Minutes, hours, days. Yes.

    8. VE

      Yep.

    9. LH

      Not seconds. But the first five seconds are important too, right?

    10. VE

      It, actually, I- I debated calling it the first five seconds. [laughs]

    11. LH

      I mean, it's true. Like-

    12. VE

      Like that would work.

    13. LH

      Yeah.

    14. VE

      Um, but the reason why I didn't is because a couple of chapters are on like conversation starters, and it's hard to get out a full conversation.

    15. LH

      In a few seconds.

    16. VE

      Right, right, right.

    17. LH

      Yeah.

    18. VE

      Yes.

    19. LH

      But there are cues within the first five seconds-

    20. VE

      Yes

    21. LH

      ... probably, right?

    22. VE

      Very much.

    23. LH

      Maybe- maybe sooner than that.

    24. VE

      I- I think that it happens the moment you first see someone. Um-

    25. LH

      Within a, within a second.

    26. VE

      With- within a second, and that, uh, that has proven as well online. Like a lot of our first impressions are actually happening digitally.

    27. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    28. VE

      Right? Someone emails you for the first time, they Google you, they see you on LinkedIn.

    29. LH

      See a photo, whatever.

    30. VE

      That's it. That's your digital first impression.

  7. 20:17 – 24:20

    Fear is contagious: the skydiver sweat study and why “fake it till you make it” fails

    1. VE

      And that's also a really important internal trigger. There's, um... Did I tell you about the skydiver study when we talked last time?

    2. LH

      Probably.

    3. VE

      Oh my gosh. This is like one of my-

    4. LH

      Tell me

    5. VE

      ... favorite new studies. So-

    6. LH

      Yeah

    7. VE

      ... what they did is, this thing happened to me in New York City. I was in New York City, and, um, I was walking by myself after a dinner party into the subway. New York City is like not, like it, I love New York, but like at night by yourself, it's like, eh.

    8. LH

      Mm.

    9. VE

      So I was like kind of already nervous, and I walk into the subway, walk on the car, and like immediately I feel fear. Like-

    10. LH

      Uh-oh

    11. VE

      ... you know that feeling you get like in the pit of your stomach where you're like [gasps] and like I could feel the hairs on the back of my neck stand up, and I was like, "What is it? What is it? What is it?" And I'm like looking around the car, and everything looks fine. And right before the doors close, a guy standing right next to me grabs the purse of the woman sitting, an elderly woman sitting, and runs out the doors.

    12. LH

      No way.

    13. VE

      Now, thank God, people stopped him like within five minutes of, like within five seconds of him getting off of the car, got the purse back. But I was like, "How did I know?"

    14. LH

      How did you know?

    15. VE

      [laughs] So-

    16. LH

      [laughs]

    17. VE

      I, I was like, "I don't think I'm psychic."

    18. LH

      Yeah.

    19. VE

      So there's, what else is going on here? So there was a study that was done where they had first-time skydivers-

    20. LH

      Mm

    21. VE

      ... before they went up in the air run on the treadmill. They ran on the treadmill enough to get them real sweaty, and they had them wear sweat pads to absorb their sweat. They took those sweat pads out, they put them in a new sweat suit, and then they had them jump out of a plane. Took those sweat pads, obviously you get a little sweaty when you're jumping out of a plane.

    22. LH

      Sure.

    23. VE

      Then they had participants smell these sweat pads. I know, it's kinda gross.

    24. LH

      See which one was fear or which one's excitement or what?

    25. VE

      They didn't even tell them what they were smelling.

    26. LH

      Oh.

    27. VE

      They put them in a, a brain scanner, and they had them smell each one. And these people had no idea what was being tested.

    28. LH

      Yeah. This-

    29. VE

      They didn't even know they were smelling sweat, okay?

    30. LH

      Right, right.

  8. 24:20 – 33:25

    PQ (interpersonal intelligence): decoding vs encoding and why it impacts outcomes

    1. LH

      Mm. Amazing. Um, tell me about, uh, PQ.

    2. VE

      Yeah.

    3. LH

      What is PQ?

    4. VE

      Interpersonal intelligence.

    5. LH

      And I love this 'cause once, you're gonna tell us what that is in a second, but you have a, a test in the first chapter which tells you how your personality, what is it? Your-

    6. VE

      Your interpersonal, your, your level, your interpersonal, interpersonal intelligence.

    7. LH

      Level.

    8. VE

      Yes.

    9. LH

      Gotcha. How socially like- ... adaptive you are-

    10. VE

      Yes

    11. LH

      ... essentially is.

    12. VE

      Yeah. So I'm, I love quizzes.

    13. LH

      Uh-huh.

    14. VE

      I, I can't help it. [laughs] I love, I love quizzes.

    15. LH

      Sure, sure.

    16. VE

      Um, it's my, my, uh, I love checklists and all those to-do boxes things. So I was very focused on IQ, right? Like growing up, like-

    17. LH

      Mm-hmm

    18. VE

      ... book smarts-

    19. LH

      Yeah

    20. VE

      ... technical skills. I never heard about PQ. I never heard about social or emotional intelligence. So there's all these IQ tests and things like that, but I found that w- what a really good way to start is, like, where are, where is your smarts, right? Like socially-

    21. LH

      Yeah

    22. VE

      ... what are your social strengths? Like, we even have, like, StrengthsFinder 2.0.

    23. LH

      Yep.

    24. VE

      I'm working on something right now where I wanna do, like, social strengths 2.0.

    25. LH

      Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

    26. VE

      Like, like, what are our social strengths, which are just as important as some of our capabilities.

    27. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    28. VE

      And so the quiz is sort of like, okay, where are you at right now, right? Like, how good are you decoding? So we talk about social intelligence, there's really two things we're talking about. Decoding, so spotting cues, spotting hidden emotions, decoding lies.

    29. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    30. VE

      And encoding. Encoding are the signals that you send out to others.

  9. 33:25 – 40:35

    Personality wiring, neuroticism, and “resource language” triggers in relationships

    1. VE

      Wait, c- I, I, can I tell you something, though?

    2. LH

      Sure.

    3. VE

      Okay. So neuroticism, I'm high neurotic.

    4. LH

      Uh-huh.

    5. VE

      And I, I... People are always like, "Neurotic, it's such a bad word." But neurotic is a way, it's a way of talking about emotional stability. You are, I think, low neurotic, yes? You're not very neurotic. You're very emotionally stable.

    6. LH

      [sighs] I can have triggered moments that make me frustrated and-

    7. VE

      Yes

    8. LH

      ... yeah, but I'm, I think I'm pretty emotionally stable.

    9. VE

      Okay.

    10. LH

      But I like things the way I like them.

    11. VE

      Ooh.

    12. LH

      And so when it's not the way I like it, I, you know-

    13. VE

      Okay

    14. LH

      ... I get frustrated, but-

    15. VE

      So that, that's about the, the ritual that, like the habit, the setting things up.

    16. LH

      Yes.

    17. VE

      So y- as a low neurotic, you told me it will be fine.

    18. LH

      Yes.

    19. VE

      Now, for my high neurotics listening-

    20. LH

      [laughs]

    21. VE

      ... you might know who you are, when people tell you it will be fine, it actually makes you more nervous.

    22. LH

      Really? [laughs]

    23. VE

      Yes.

    24. LH

      "You know what? It's not gonna be fine. You need to work harder."

    25. VE

      [laughs] Yeah, that's right.

    26. LH

      "You're screwed."

    27. VE

      [laughs] I know.

    28. LH

      "You're gonna fail."

    29. VE

      That... Okay. So let me-

    30. LH

      Is that what I should say? [laughs]

  10. 40:35 – 53:38

    Big Five traits and free trait theory: working with differences (openness & conscientiousness)

    1. VE

      Yes. So- [laughs]

    2. LH

      [laughs]

    3. VE

      You're, you're like, "I don't know about this topic."

    4. LH

      Let's hear it.

    5. VE

      [laughs] So when we talk about signs of personality, there's a lot of things out there. DiSC and Enneagram-

    6. LH

      Uh-huh

    7. VE

      ... and Myers-Briggs-

    8. LH

      Yeah

    9. VE

      ... and all these things. The only one that is scientifically based is the Big Five, and it's five personality traits.

    10. LH

      Is it the five love languages?

    11. VE

      It's, it's... I, we talk about the five love languages actually.

    12. LH

      Okay.

    13. VE

      That's a good one, too.

    14. LH

      Yeah.

    15. VE

      Um, so there's like special five. Five love languages and the five Big Five.

    16. LH

      Yeah, I'm teasing. Yes.

    17. VE

      Um-

    18. LH

      I know that's not scientific, the love languages.

    19. VE

      Actually, I think-

    20. LH

      Although it seems-

    21. VE

      There is some science

    22. LH

      ... very practical. Yeah, yeah.

    23. VE

      There is some science behind it.

    24. LH

      Yeah.

    25. VE

      Yeah, there is. Um, and the Big Five have, has a lot.

    26. LH

      Okay.

    27. VE

      Um, and so everyone has these Big Five personality traits, and they're either high or low in them.

    28. LH

      It's one or the other.

    29. VE

      It's, it's-

    30. LH

      High, low. There's no middle.

  11. 53:38 – 1:00:37

    Flexible leadership and vocal power: why tone shapes trust (even in malpractice risk)

    1. LH

      There's another, uh, personality test with four quadrants. Have you seen this?

    2. VE

      DiSC.

    3. LH

      Is that what it is?

    4. VE

      DiSC. Like-

    5. LH

      Where it's promoter, supporter, analyzer, controller.

    6. VE

      Yes.

    7. LH

      Have you seen that?

    8. VE

      I think that, I think that that's DiSC.

    9. LH

      Is it DiSC?

    10. VE

      But I've seen that one, yes.

    11. LH

      Promoter, supporter, analyzer, controller, and you kind of, like, you rank, you go through a quiz-

    12. VE

      Mm-hmm

    13. LH

      ... of figuring out which quadrant you're the highest at.

    14. VE

      Yeah.

    15. LH

      So you'd be, you know, I'm a promoter, controller.

    16. VE

      Yeah.

    17. LH

      I'm first off promoter. I'm, like, a big idea. I'm passionate. I'm, like, excited. Let's go. Let's do this.

    18. VE

      Yeah.

    19. LH

      I like to be in control. I like to, you know, have all those things. Uh, and then it's support, analyze. It's kind of like the top four. But really I'm, like, very close to almost all of them.

    20. VE

      Mm-hmm.

    21. LH

      Like, all of them are pretty high.

    22. VE

      Mm-hmm.

    23. LH

      So I'm almost, like, very spread out.

    24. VE

      Yeah.

    25. LH

      And, like, the true leaders I hear is what they say is, like, you want to be able to tap into each quadrant-

    26. VE

      Right

    27. LH

      ... to connect to an analy- if they're an analyzer, you want to be able to be analytical with them.

    28. VE

      Mm-hmm.

    29. LH

      If they're a promoter, you want to be promoting with them.

    30. VE

      Mm.

  12. 1:00:37 – 1:06:21

    Lie detection basics: incongruence, contempt, and common myths about eye contact

    1. LH

      That's great. Okay. Uh, I wanna get to the final part of talking-

    2. VE

      Oh, yes

    3. LH

      ... about, uh, lying-

    4. VE

      Yes

    5. LH

      ... and how you can tell someone's lying. [laughs]

    6. VE

      Yes. Oh, God. So I, when Lewis-

    7. LH

      You don't have much of this in the book, right?

    8. VE

      I don't.

    9. LH

      Yeah.

    10. VE

      I don't have very much of this in the book.

    11. LH

      Why don't you have this in the book?

    12. VE

      The reason is because I think this is one of those evil superpowers.

    13. LH

      Eh.

    14. VE

      Yeah. It's like, it's like muha-ha. It's like that.

    15. LH

      Yeah.

    16. VE

      Because it is very powerful. The science behind lie detection is, is very concrete.

    17. LH

      Mm.

    18. VE

      It's not a guessing game. We do know a lot about what pe- what happens to people when they lie. The problem is, is amateur lie detectors do worse than people who don't know anything about lying.

    19. LH

      Ah, got it. [clears throat]

    20. VE

      That, so my, my, always my worry is, like, oh, my gosh, if I give someone a little bit of information, I actually make them worse. So for example, in the biggest study on lie detection that was done, we can spot lies with 54% accuracy.

    21. LH

      So flip a coin?

    22. VE

      Ex- exactly.

    23. LH

      Yeah. [laughs]

    24. VE

      It's terrible. Like, we're terrible. And by the way, like police officers don't... Oh, so can you guess, there's one group that did better on this. It's not police officers, it's not doctors, it's not teachers.

    25. LH

      Kids.

    26. VE

      No, I, I wish it was k- they actually didn't test kids 'cause that's a whole-

    27. LH

      Uh

    28. VE

      ... different IRB process.

    29. LH

      Who could test, who, who was more efficient in seeing if there's a lie?

    30. VE

      It was-

  13. 1:06:21 – 1:14:40

    Where lies happen most and how to reduce them in business calls and negotiations

    1. VE

      ... do you wanna guess the, um, mode of communication that has the highest amount of lies? So your choices are face-to-face, emails, IM, or chat, like text. Which do you think has the most amount of lies?

    2. LH

      Uh, text. Is that the least amount?

    3. VE

      It is... Nope. It is phone has the most amount of lies, and the reason for this is because-

    4. LH

      Oh, I think I know why.

    5. VE

      Tell me. Yeah.

    6. LH

      Maybe.

    7. VE

      Yeah.

    8. LH

      I just-

    9. VE

      I bet you, I bet you have it right

    10. LH

      ... I guess. Well, because one, well, I don't know. I was gonna say anything that's not recorded.

    11. VE

      Ah. Yeah, yes, that's it. That's the answer.

    12. LH

      But text is like, you got the proof or something, you can go back to it.

    13. VE

      That's exactly right, though. That's why. So phone has the most because there's no paper trail.

    14. LH

      Yes.

    15. VE

      And you don't have to lie to someone's face, right?

    16. LH

      [laughs] True.

    17. VE

      Like it's r- it's real easy-

    18. LH

      Yeah

    19. VE

      ... to like turn your back and be like, "I'm gonna-"

    20. LH

      And no, yeah.

    21. VE

      Yeah. So, um, whereas email, text, and face-to-face.

    22. LH

      Yeah.

    23. VE

      Email, text has a paper trail, and face-to-face doesn't. So there's all these really interesting things about lying that we have misconceptions-

    24. LH

      Mm-hmm

    25. VE

      ... or we don't think about them. So by the way, if you're doing a lot of business on the phone, if you're doing a lot of coaching on the phone-

    26. LH

      Wow

    27. VE

      ... you really have to be careful. Um, all, I have a lot of students who are life coaches, they work with a lot of students, and they do a lot of phone consulting. What the problem with that is, is if it has the most amount of lies, or we're talking about hidden emotions, and if you're working as a coach, like you really have to spot those hidden emotions. You have to think about what are ways that we can either bring the video to this, like do video chat, or do in person.

    28. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    29. VE

      Or at least say, "Hey, I'm taking notes on this call. I'm gonna send you a summary after we hang up." That actually brings the amount of lies l- down to email level because you're telling them I'm gonna, I'm gonna commit this to black and white.

    30. LH

      Yes.

  14. 1:14:40 – 1:21:37

    Authentic charisma and five-day social experiments: from roses to relationship repair

    1. VE

      Oh my gosh. I would say that the, the, the last thing, and this is something that I tried to make a big point in the book, and I don't wanna hit people over the head with it, but I don't think I got it as, as well as-

    2. LH

      Mm-hmm

    3. VE

      ... I wanted, which is I don't think you should ever pretend to be something you're not. Again, I don't believe in fake it till you make it. I think that you're better off spending your time instead of trying to be the bubbly extrovert, is trying to find out what is your unique brand of charisma. Like what is your flavor? I think that the more time you can spend on that before trying to emulate-

    4. LH

      Mm-hmm

    5. VE

      ... someone else or trying to dial up something that isn't natural to you, is a much better place to be, and that's where happiness comes from, and that's where auth- that's what people mean when they say authentic. And so anything I've said today in this interview, or anything that you've read, try to figure out what's your unique take on that. Like ma- go prove, go make me prove my worth, right? Like if I, if I said something that sounded interesting to you, go make an experiment, right? Like go up-

    6. LH

      Yeah

    7. VE

      ... to 50 different people the next 50 days-

    8. LH

      Yes

    9. VE

      ... and see if you can try out a conversation starter if that works for you.

    10. LH

      Mm-hmm.

    11. VE

      If you can find your unique flavor, if you can treat it like an experiment, you can never fail-

    12. LH

      Yeah

    13. VE

      ... 'cause experiments never fail.

    14. LH

      Yeah, that's good. I, I did an experiment when I moved to New York City as well, 'cause I was like, "I want, I wanna meet some new people. I don't know anyone here."

    15. VE

      Yeah.

    16. LH

      And I called it the Red Rose Project.

    17. VE

      What?

    18. LH

      Can you guess what it was?

    19. VE

      Did you give red roses to people?

    20. LH

      [laughs] I did.

    21. VE

      Yes.

    22. LH

      Every day I bought roses and I would give them out.

    23. VE

      Yes.

    24. LH

      This is what I was signaling. I gave them out to girls.

    25. VE

      Yes.

    26. LH

      [laughs] And some-

    27. VE

      Wait, were you only trying to meet girls?

    28. LH

      Uh, yeah. [laughs]

    29. VE

      Yeah. [laughs] You were about to say no.

    30. LH

      I'm not gonna lie. I'm not gonna lie.

Episode duration: 1:21:42

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