Danny T | DJ Life, Building A Personal Brand & Mental Health | Modern Wisdom Podcast 147

Chris Williamson 0:00 What does it feel like watching your mate walk out in front of five and bit thousand people?

Casey 0:05 Yeah, I think it's, it's just there's a very sort of clear vision about, you know, how far we want to take this. Where it's not completely mapped out of how we're gonna do it, but I think Danny's willingness to try stuff and my sort of relentlessness in making it happen, that's kind of where it's been a real success.

Danny T 0:23 I did, 'cause I did the O2 Academy the year before, and Church six months before that.

Chris Williamson 0:27 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 0:27 So it was like, "O2 Academy's the biggest venue in Leeds. Where do we go next?" As if there's a video of me on my Snapchat heading to the O2 going, "One day, one day I'll play here." Nah, nah, I'm joking, but it's always nice to dream. Right, you imagine you're in Newcastle City Center, and one person screams as loud as they can. You hear that person over 2,000, 3,000 people around you. Imagine that times 5,000 all at the same time-

Chris Williamson 0:51 For you.

Danny T 0:51 ... as you stepped out and, um, you're like, "Oh my God. How's this even real?"

Chris Williamson 0:59 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back. It's Danny T! Hi Danny, how are you man?

Danny T 1:06 I'm good, I'm good, I'm good.

Chris Williamson 1:07 What a pleasure.

Danny T 1:08 I know.

Chris Williamson 1:08 It's been so long coming to get you on here.

Danny T 1:10 I know. We've just been speaking for about 20 minutes before this, though.

Chris Williamson 1:13 I know, yeah, but that's what you... There's... You can't get straight into it.

Danny T 1:16 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:16 There's gotta be a bit of foreplay. You get what I mean?

Danny T 1:17 All right, okay.

Chris Williamson 1:18 That was the cunnilingus before we get into the-

Danny T 1:19 Oh, so good to see you. It's been-

Chris Williamson 1:21 Yeah, "Hi Daniel, how are you?"

Danny T 1:22 It's been, it's been, it's been, it's been a while.

Chris Williamson 1:23 But it's not just you.

Danny T 1:25 It's not.

Chris Williamson 1:26 Who've you brought with you?

Danny T 1:27 This is, this is my other half, my... (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:30 Oh, stop.

Danny T 1:30 This is my, my manager. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:32 Introduce yourself.

Casey 1:33 Uh, I'm Casey, Danny's manager. And... I'll say friend.

Danny T 1:37 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:39 What's it-

Danny T 1:39 He re- he reels me in. He keeps me from getting myself in trouble.

Chris Williamson 1:43 What's it like being Danny's manager, Casey?

Casey 1:45 Uh... (laughs) Fun, alongside challenging.

Chris Williamson 1:50 What's the challenges you come up against?

Casey 1:53 Um, mostly toning down his wild ideas. Um-

Chris Williamson 1:57 Have you got any wild ideas that you've not let through recently that you can say on camera?

Casey 2:01 That I have-

Danny T 2:02 You delete a few Instagram stories.

Casey 2:05 Yeah, I mean, the post of you, like, semi-naked before your show was, uh... That was a bit of a battle between us as to whether or not that-

Chris Williamson 2:11 That got censored, right?

Danny T 2:13 (laughs)

Casey 2:13 No, it went up.

Danny T 2:15 I w- I won that one.

Casey 2:16 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 2:16 Okay, yeah.

Danny T 2:17 I, I, I won that one.

Casey 2:17 But though this is just sort of a routine back and forth between what's allowed and what's not.

Chris Williamson 2:21 I understand.

Casey 2:23 But it's all part of the, uh, fun craziness that is Danny's personal brand.

Chris Williamson 2:26 I get it. So Danny, you're a DJ, I guess. That's, you, you play music, right?

Danny T 2:30 I do.

Chris Williamson 2:31 You press play on a deck.

Danny T 2:32 Once. Just press it and stand there and-

Chris Williamson 2:34 Leave it, leave it to go.

Danny T 2:35 wave your hands a little bit.

Chris Williamson 2:36 But you've had s- like last few years, you know. For the people that don't know about Danny's kind of surge through popularity, especially recently, that you just sold out Leeds First Direct Arena.

Danny T 2:47 Yeah, yeah. Floor standing sold out.

Chris Williamson 2:49 How many w- so many people was that?

Danny T 2:51 Five and a half thousand.

Chris Williamson 2:52 Five and a half thousand people. And you're just... I, I mean you're a very good DJ, but you're just some fella.

Danny T 2:58 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 2:58 Like, do you know what I mean?

Danny T 2:59 I think that's one thing that makes it more popular, is the fact that I am just-

Chris Williamson 3:06 Some fella.

Danny T 3:07 ... could be everyone's pal.

Chris Williamson 3:08 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 3:08 Like, it's not like, "Oh my God, I've got to go see this superstar." It's like, (laughs) "I know what his dogs are called."

Chris Williamson 3:14 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Danny T 3:15 Which is part of the kind of how the following's come, 'cause people just wanted to be part of, like, the life that I was living at the time, which has got more sensible over the years. But the parties have got bigger and bigger, aren't they?

Chris Williamson 3:29 Mm-hmm. So, you know, you're probably a pretty good role model for the local club DJ that is now taking it to the absolute nth degree, right?

Danny T 3:42 Yeah, if they're really wanting to, to push themselves and go further, yeah. A lot say they want to, a lot don't really want to put in the work. They think it was easy. Think it was... They think what they've seen is the route rather than what I've actually done that they won't have ever seen. They just think that, like, they can, "Oh, we can do that now."

Chris Williamson 4:06 I mean, we-

Danny T 4:06 "We can go there now." I'm not saying they shouldn't try, but they need to try harder. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 4:10 No, no, I get it, man. Like, 'cause it, it-

Danny T 4:11 I'd love to see more people doing it. It is... There's, there's a, there's a massive gap for where I was two or three years ago.

Casey 4:18 And just to sort of build on that, I think, you know, what people are sort of seeing the past maybe year or so is the combination of what I've worked with you four years now.

Danny T 4:27 Mm-hmm.

Casey 4:27 But even prior to me coming on board that was... (laughs) You know, there's things that you did beforehand which are sort of coming to a head now, and that's... It's the culmination of all of those years of work.

Danny T 4:38 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 4:38 I think the quote that I love that kind of relates to what you were talking about there is, "People will grind away, and grind away, and grind away, and it takes them 10 years to become an overnight success."

Danny T 4:48 Yeah, yeah, yeah. That, that's 100% true. But at the same time, I get so many messages like, "Oh, what's the easiest way?" Or, "What's the quickest way?"

Chris Williamson 4:56 I mean, what did you, what did you just get a message, a question for the podcast as we started? Like, "Hey man, what do I need to start DJing?"

Danny T 5:03 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 5:03 And you were like, "Well, some DJ decks."

Danny T 5:05 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 5:05 But there's part of me that thinks that's like asking Floyd Mayweather like, "What raps should I buy?"

Danny T 5:10 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 5:11 Like, you have someone who has moved themselves through this route, right?

Danny T 5:15 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 5:15 Like, ask them the, the questions that matter. So I, ladies and gentlemen, and p- fledgling DJs, I am gonna... I've strapped him down to a couch and I'm gonna ask all the questions that everybody wants to know.

Danny T 5:26 Oh, okay.

Casey 5:26 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 5:26 So the first question I want to know, right? I'm a, I'm a, a young DJ. Maybe I've got a couple o' nights a week, local gigs. Maybe support slots, couple o' warmups, maybe just about getting my first, you know, main slot at an okay student night in a typical town in the UK. How do I get myself from there to getting booked in, uh, venues abroad, to having a genuine following on social media that care about me, to being able to release mixes that people listen to?

Danny T 5:52 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 5:52 Like, what do I do? Where do I start?

Danny T 5:54 One thing people get really, really mixed up is social media and real world. Social media followings can look massive and not be big in the real world.... whereas some people can have quite small social media followings but be- be touring the world as known acts. Like if you look at, (coughs) Craig David's got a massive social media presence now. But when he first came back, he had like 60,000 Instagram followers and was selling out a weekly pool party with 5,000 people in Ibiza. Like, that figure on Instagram is something that people focus far too much on instead of real live people. Like, you imagine they're- they're desperately trying to get more and more online followers to try and share their music online. Tut, the value of that compared to ... It might be different now, but when I first started handing someone a CD that they would listen to and stay in their car for five years-

Chris Williamson 6:58 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 6:58 ... even longer. Th- there was a- a guy stopped me in the middle of the street in Bristol that still had my CD in his car from 2014. Like, that's so much more valuable. Like, investing in yourself is so much more valuable than focusing on a figure of Instagram followers, 'cause I know people with a third of a million followers that are skint.

Chris Williamson 7:22 Man, so perfect example of that. I was talking about The Secret today, and The Secret is this book film where people, it's like think it, say it, achieve it. But it removes the hard work from it.

Danny T 7:34 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:34 It's like, get off your ass and actually do the thing you need to do. And I think a lot of the time people use that quantifiable metric of popularity which is, "How many followers do I have?" Or whatever, "How many replies did I get?"

Danny T 7:45 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:45 It's like, bro, if you don't add 300 tickets when you get booked by a- a- an, uh, promoter-

Danny T 7:51 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:51 ... like myself, it doesn't matter. I do not give a flying fuck about how many followers you've got on Instagram.

Danny T 7:58 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:58 I want to know if I book you for X many hundred or thousand pounds-

Danny T 8:02 How many more people?

Chris Williamson 8:02 ... how many more people are coming through the door?

Danny T 8:04 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 8:04 And if that figure ends up being a roundabout, like, either zero or positive, as in you make me more money than you cost me, I will continue to book you-

Danny T 8:12 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 8:12 ... because it's the freest money I'm ever, ever, ever gonna make.

Danny T 8:15 Yeah.

Casey 8:15 And just to sort of build on that, I think it's ... If you, like ... Essentially social media following is a, it's a number on a screen but particularly for DJs, like, first and foremost you are an entertainer. Your sole purpose as to why you exist is to entertain people. So therefore, rather than questioning, you know, if you're gonna start up and try and, like, build your brand or accumulate followers, look at how can I entertain people? How can I, you know, start getting people to want to come and see me? Focus on the things that matter rather than, you know, building up the metric that's-

Chris Williamson 8:46 Okay. So not focus first and foremost on Instagram.

Danny T 8:49 Focus on the real world, yeah, focus on-

Chris Williamson 8:51 But what's that, what is that for a DJ? Tell me. What's the steps?

Danny T 8:54 Do different things in a club. If you get opportunities, take them and make sure people notice that something has changed, something's different, something's different about that platform. If they're watching a resident DJ and it's, it's a resident DJ's job to keep it like this all night rather than smash it for five hours, 'cause the crowd just wouldn't be able to hold it. But if you get an opportunity to step on, even if it's the last hour, if you make that last hour increasing just anything, just, like, the intensity, the music, the everything about the room just increases, people will want to know why is that different? And the more they're asking why is that different and they see somebody and they see the logo up on the screen, they'll be like, "Oh, the last hour at so-and-so club was so good. Last night it was so-and-so that were playing." They can tell- tell one person. That one person takes five of their friends to go. They go away tell 10 people. Straightaway that's 50 people that know that you're different to what they're used to. You're more exciting, so they wanna go and see you more.

Chris Williamson 9:58 Why are you more exciting? Because I- I think you are, but I want you to define why you think you're more exciting.

Danny T 10:05 (laughs) I don't even know. I just-

Chris Williamson 10:07 Is it the turntablism? Is it the mixing in of tracks?

Danny T 10:09 It's a bit, it's a bit of, like, the speed that I actually mix at. The fact ... Whether I do it live or not, the crowd don't care. The crowd care about what comes out the speakers.

Chris Williamson 10:20 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 10:21 But the- the speed and the flow of which I mix at means that there's never a lull. That's just my style.

Chris Williamson 10:29 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 10:29 (clears throat) There's never a point in my set where the crowd actually get time to breathe, come-

Chris Williamson 10:36 Have you ever been ... Sorry to interject there. Have you ever been a- a resi in clubs?

Danny T 10:39 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 10:39 Like a proper resident?

Danny T 10:40 Yeah, yeah. I used to for years. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 10:41 How did you, how did you make that work? 'Cause y- you've just identified-

Danny T 10:44 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 10:44 ... and, you know, for some of the people that are listening that maybe don't understand music that much-

Danny T 10:49 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 10:49 ... but have been out clubbing, anyone will know when they've gone in and the DJ's just smashing their tits off at, like-

Danny T 10:55 Mm.

Chris Williamson 10:55 ... house tunes are getting played, and you think, "This feels a bit fast." And you're like, yes, it feels a bit fast. It's 136 BPM.

Danny T 11:01 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:02 Like-

Danny T 11:02 And it's got to, it's got to build to that, and you've got to-

Chris Williamson 11:04 So how do you do that? How do you do that? Before we get back to why you're different. Like, how do you make Danny T a resident DJ in a club that plays a four-hour set?

Danny T 11:12 Uh, just networking. I was partying. I was just going out all the time.

Chris Williamson 11:17 What was the music like?

Danny T 11:19 Uh. Started off with house music, but my first proper residency was an R&B night.

Chris Williamson 11:24 (laughs)

Danny T 11:24 'Cause I just wanted to play music. I just really-

Chris Williamson 11:26 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 11:26 ... wanted to play music. And it got to about two hours before the night was about to open which I even had a cut of the night. Three ... Like, me and two friends got offered the Friday night at a club in Leeds, brand new, just opening. And an hour before, I was like, "Oh, wait. I need ... I haven't got any music."

Chris Williamson 11:45 (laughs)

Danny T 11:45 So I'm there, like, on iTunes, like, buying Usher albums and ... Now I look back, it was the complete wrong music (laughs) for the-

Chris Williamson 11:52 Yeah.

Danny T 11:52 ... for the night that it was. But that was a stepping stone. That was an opportunity that I got that I grasped and tried my hardest with, and that's, that's what you gotta do. Just take every opportunity. And there in't a rule book. There isn't a rule book either, like, what works for me might not work for somebody else.

Chris Williamson 12:08 Mm-hmm. So y- we've touched on different because of the speed of mixing in and out.What else, what else makes your sets different? Why are people sitting up and listening to you?

Danny T 12:16 You're saying about, (laughs) about three hours.

Chris Williamson 12:18 Yeah, for the people that, again, don't know-

Danny T 12:20 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 12:20 ... when we're, when we're recording, I've managed to get Danny not only here and get a podcast out of him, but I've then strapped him to a set of decks-

Danny T 12:26 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 12:26 ... to get him to play at Quids in Newcastle later on tonight. Um, but you know what I mean? Like, what, what else is it?

Danny T 12:31 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 12:31 Is it, is it mic work? Is it the-

Danny T 12:34 Mic work's got a, a lot to do with it. It has got a lot of... You can add so much personality with mic work. You can be... You can almost make the crowd want to challenge and better each other, which is like, "Right, I'm gonna go crazier than that person," without actually saying, "Can you go a bit crazier than them, please?"

Chris Williamson 12:52 Knock each other's heads off, yeah.

Danny T 12:53 Without going too far, you can really... You can control a crowd. You can literally, like... You can have the crowd in the palm of your hands, like, you could literally, like... I don't know. It's hard, it's hard to-

Chris Williamson 13:06 I think you're- (laughs)

Danny T 13:06 It's hard to describe 'cause I just do it.

Chris Williamson 13:09 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 13:09 I don't think about it now. It's, it's come from... It's never been like, "Right, let me sit back and think, 'How can I do this?'" It's always been a slow progression of building up and, "Yeah, that works better, so I'll use that. That works better, so I'll do that." And it's, uh, it's been a slow progression, so to me, it's not like, uh, I don't think about it. It just happens now.

Chris Williamson 13:31 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 13:32 So thinking back, it's actually quite hard to think, "How could I do it?" Like, I won't be-

Chris Williamson 13:36 You, you nee- I'm asking you to unlearn everything-

Danny T 13:37 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 13:38 ... that you know naturally do, right, which is-

Danny T 13:39 And break it all down again?

Chris Williamson 13:40 It is, it is gonna be a challenge.

Danny T 13:42 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 13:42 I, I wanna ask, and this, I wanna ask both of you guys separately this same question, right? Um, last long years playing gigs, doing all this sort of stuff, and then hometown, Leeds. You sell out Leeds First Direct Arena, five and a bit thousand people. Like, what... First off, Casey, what does it feel like watching your mate and client, whatever you wanna call it, walk out in front of five and a bit thousand people?

Casey 14:10 Um, (sighs) it's weird. We had a conversation at the start of the year, and it was very much like, okay, obviously off the back of Leeds Arena, like, "Where do we go from here?" Sort of like, "What's the next step?"

Danny T 14:21 The O2, O2.

Casey 14:22 O2.

Danny T 14:22 I did, 'cause I did the O2 Academy the year before-

Chris Williamson 14:25 Yes, yes.

Danny T 14:25 ... and Church six months before that.

Chris Williamson 14:27 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 14:27 So it was like, "O2 Academy's the biggest venue in Leeds. Where do we go next?"

Chris Williamson 14:31 Mm-hmm.

Casey 14:32 Yeah.

Danny T 14:32 Like, "Nah, I ca- I can't do a..." As if there's a video of me on my Snapchat after I'd had my hair cut heading to the O2 going, "One day, one day," going past Leeds Arena, and I was like, actually said this. I actually went-

Chris Williamson 14:45 365 days. (laughs)

Danny T 14:45 I literally went, "One day, one day, one day I'll play here. Nah, nah, I'm joking, but it's always nice to dream." And that was just over a year before.

Chris Williamson 14:53 You did it. Okay, so he's walking out. What's it like?

Casey 14:54 I think at that time it was, (sighs) it was just a- an idea, but I think anything that we sort of set our stall out to do, uh, like, it has actually happened that way. And that's not through, like, you know, you can sit here and say, "Oh, it's law of attraction," or it's this, that, and the other, but, yeah, I think it's, it's just there's a very sort of clear vision about, you know, how far we wanna take this, where it's not completely mapped out of how we're gonna do it, but I think Danny's willingness to try stuff and my sort of relentlessness in, in making it happen, that's kind of where it's been a real success-

Chris Williamson 15:29 Mm-hmm.

Casey 15:29 ... in that he has very, very crazy ideas. I can kind of tone them down, or refine them, or shape them into something that's gonna elevate what we've already done. Um, and yeah, it's, it's just, it's nice to see, like, Danny doing something he loves, uh, and obviously there's other benefits that come from that. But yeah, I think to put someone in an environment where they get to do something that they love every single day, you know, earn a living off of it, like, that's, that's actually been the biggest reward of it.

Chris Williamson 15:55 That's awesome. Danny, walking out on stage, five and a bit thousand people?

Danny T 15:59 (laughs) Uh, it was just like... There's no way to describe it. Right, you imagine you're in Newcastle city center or Leeds city center walking down, and one person screams as loud as they can.

Chris Williamson 16:14 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 16:15 You hear that person over two, three thousand people around you.

Chris Williamson 16:18 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 16:19 Imagine that times 5,000 all at the same time-

Chris Williamson 16:22 For you.

Danny T 16:23 ... as you stepped out. And, um, you're like, "Oh my God, how's this even, like, how's this even real? How's..." Even afterwards for four or five days afterwards, I was still like... I'd watched the, the wa- the video of me walking out, and I was like, "How have I, how have I even done that? Like, how, how is that even-"

Chris Williamson 16:43 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 16:44 ... "achievable or a possibility," or, like, it did just seem like just, just not even real, not even real at all.

Chris Williamson 16:52 That's cool, man.

Danny T 16:52 But, like-

Chris Williamson 16:53 You know, that's you, you, you're actualizing. You're getting to what it is that you wanna do.

Danny T 16:55 But no point was I, like, nervous. I weren't, I weren't nervous at all. I had loads of people message, "Oh, I bet you're so nervous," and I was like, take my phone, "I can't see people-"

Chris Williamson 17:06 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 17:06 "... telling me I should be nervous," 'cause I'm not. If I didn't want to do this, I wouldn't have tried to do it, like-

Chris Williamson 17:11 I wouldn't have-

Danny T 17:12 ... I've sat there and gone, "I want to do this." Why would I be nervous? 'Cause I've chosen to do it. I've not done it to impress other people. I've done it 'cause it f- felt good and it was the next progression for me and myself in my career.

Casey 17:26 And-

Chris Williamson 17:26 So I spoke to Kozzie, I spoke to Kristoff, um, about this, and he says that even now he'll play, for him, a small-sized gig, which might be, you know, f- 2,000 to 5,000 people, like, the smallest gigs he plays, he still shits himself every time. This is a guy who supported Eric Prids on New Year's, Eve, Eve, Eve, New Year's Eve, Eve, and New Year's Eve. Like, for the last few years played at the biggest venues, played Creamfields, played everything. First, the first issue lineup release for Creamfields this year and Ultra has him on the, the top banner, and he's, like, drinking, desperately trying to calm his nerves.

Danny T 18:03 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 18:03 Like, doing his g- like, his ex-missus got him doing breathing exercises before he goes out.

Danny T 18:07 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 18:07 Like, but-

Danny T 18:08 Do you know what though? This is the difference.... he's come in from being sat at a computer, making music, progressing, making better music, loving music, making music he loves, to then having to be a DJ. I've come from being a big personality, party animal, DJ, then I've learnt to make music.

Chris Williamson 18:29 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 18:29 So, the, the, the ballsy side of it, the me being on stage is no problem 'cause I've been stage thousands of times before.

Chris Williamson 18:37 Yeah, I think-

Danny T 18:38 It's not like I'm chucked in at the deep end, it's like-

Chris Williamson 18:40 Yeah.

Danny T 18:41 ... I've gone, I've gone through that. Like, to me, someone chucking me in a studio with four people surrounding me-

Chris Williamson 18:48 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 18:48 ... that's where I'm like, "Oh, god."

Chris Williamson 18:49 If you and Eric Prydz were sat next to each other-

Danny T 18:51 Yeah, I'll be like, "Oh my god, oh my god, oh my god, oh my god."

Chris Williamson 18:53 ... ... trying to produce a track.

Danny T 18:53 Whereas he's the exact opposite, like...

Chris Williamson 18:54 I think I saw ... To push back on that a bit, Christos played a lot of gigs.

Danny T 18:59 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 18:59 Like, like back in the day, he'll have played thousands. But this is something that I know that we wanted to get onto, which is to do with mental health and other things. And I've had this in my mind for ages, it's unbelievable that there are people out there who have a particular talent in one area, like a- a- a- an eccentrically brilliant talent in one area of their life, but they don't have the personality makeup which allows them to maximize it.

Danny T 19:23 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 19:23 And obviously, the, the, the perfect, uh, uh, example of this is Avicii.

Danny T 19:28 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 19:28 You know, you have this guy who is capable of making the music, capable of playing the shows, he does the branding, he does, you know, everything, but he doesn't have the personality which allows him to deal with the lifestyle.

Danny T 19:41 He didn't wanna do the shows though. He was pulling his shows. He didn't wanna be doing the shows.

Chris Williamson 19:45 Hmm.

Danny T 19:46 That was it, he, he couldn't handle that much attention. Albeit, like the social media side of it as well would've been massive, but ... Like, it is crazy, you could- you could be in a room with 1,000 people, if one person says you're shit, that hurts. 999 people could think you're amazing and that feels great, but that one person that's- that'll- could literally just ... Or even tweet afterwards that's like a- a second kind of, it's a second wave of insults now. Someone doesn't have to just say it to your face.

Chris Williamson 20:21 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 20:21 They could tweet you afterwards.

Chris Williamson 20:23 But far fewer people probably will say it to your face now, isn't it?

Danny T 20:25 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the (laughs) the Mike Tyson, the Mike Tyson ... Do you see the Mike Tyson thing that's blown up today? It says, um-

Chris Williamson 20:33 No.

Danny T 20:33 What is it? There's f- uh ...

Casey 20:35 Social media has allowed people to be brave enough to say things, say horrible things.

Danny T 20:41 Without getting punched in the face. (laughs)

Casey 20:42 Yeah, without fearing the repercussion of getting punched in the face.

Danny T 20:44 Without getting punched in the face and that's so, that's (laughs) so true.

Chris Williamson 20:48 Massive.

Danny T 20:48 I've had people that have like slagged me off online walk up to me like face-to-face and shake my hand. And then I've realized afterwards that they'd been slugging me off online-

Chris Williamson 20:59 And you're that- you're that guy now. (laughs)

Danny T 20:59 ... and I was like, "Uh, how do you have the balls to do that online but then in real life you're like y- just scared? It's just-"

Casey 21:05 You know exactly the smallest guy in real life and you've got-

Chris Williamson 21:08 No, I know, that's true.

Danny T 21:08 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 21:08 What, uh, what have you been doing then? Obviously, people that don't know, can you tell us first off about what happens every summer with regards to your lifestyle? And then, can you tell me about how you've coped with that, or what your coping mechanisms are, and whether there were any periods where you were kind of not doing the self-care and maybe there aren't-

Danny T 21:25 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I'll go back a bit further first, 'cause if there's any like resident DJs that really wanna get themselves out there, going abroad's one of the best things that you'll do. Go do a season abroad. Go and do five seasons abroad. (laughs) Go ... Just go and enjoy yourself just like-

Chris Williamson 21:41 At Luton table.

Danny T 21:42 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 21:43 (laughs)

Danny T 21:43 Just, just go, just go and do it. Like I- I started to build a following in Malia by using what we've discussed before. That's where it all kinda started. Before the online stuff started, it started in, in real life, like I was a resident. Casey came out, this is before he'd started being my manager, he came out as a friend to Malia for four days. And we're like, "Why are you- why are you still a resident DJ?" And I was like, "Because it's ace, I love it, I get to play at these massive clubs on a weekend, it's brilliant." He was like, "There's 25 guys over there with Danny T T-shirts on that you don't even sell. They've had them made themselves. And there's four guys over there just got your name tattooed on them, like why are you still a resident? You could definitely get booked as an artist." And that's how it all started. That is literally how, that is literally how that side of things all started.

Chris Williamson 22:31 Why does abroad make a difference? Why does the season make a difference?

Danny T 22:33 Everything's more heightened abroad. Everyone's more excited. Everyone's got to ... They hold onto those memories. They see someone seven nights in a row on holiday, they associate that with having a great time, being drunk, meeting new people. And if you've made their night seven nights in a row, they'll love you forever. There's people coming tonight that saw me in Malia in 2012, '13, '14, like they'll remember you forever. They're literally like ... People, people are trying to book me for like th- "Can you, oh, can you come and play at my wedding? I'm marrying a girl I met in Malia in 2014." People remember like-

Chris Williamson 23:07 I would love, absolutely love-

Danny T 23:10 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 23:10 ... to see a Danny T wedding set up.

Danny T 23:11 I did, I did one in the Dominican-

Chris Williamson 23:13 Do, do you know anyone?

Danny T 23:13 ... with my friends, uh, uh, my friends. I went, I went over to the Dominican for that.

Chris Williamson 23:16 What was the first track?

Danny T 23:18 Lion King. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 23:19 (laughs)

Casey 23:19 (laughs)

Danny T 23:19 Big wobbly Lion King- Lion King bootleg.

Chris Williamson 23:22 Geez. Okay, so go abroad and then tell me like w- what's a week? Give me a week, Monday to Sunday, what's a week look like?

Danny T 23:29 Right, so that was when I used to actually go and just live over there for like 100 days or whatever.

Chris Williamson 23:33 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 23:34 Now, the last two years have been, I've had like three or four weeklies in resorts. So, it'd be Friday night in the UK at a gig somewhere, (coughs) anywhere in the UK. Saturday, same again, a gig in the UK. Straight to the, straight to the airport Sunday, fly to a resort Sunday. Play in that resort, then the Monday, two flights to get from one Greek resort to another Greek resort. Last summer I managed to get two days in Zante where I was just working the Monday and then Tuesday I actually just got to chill. And then two flights to Napa on the Wednesday. Fly back Thursday, have a day with my missus on (laughs) Thursday, and then straight back to-UK Friday, times 15 weeks. So I think I did like 80-

Chris Williamson 24:22 So is that like sort of May until September or something, yeah?

Danny T 24:24 Yeah, June, June till September, I did like 87 flights I think it were last summer. And I was petrified of flying. Like, I was like, I don't like, I hate the word anxious and anxiety, but that's-

Chris Williamson 24:35 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 24:35 I was-

Casey 24:36 You were anxious.

Danny T 24:37 ... like sweaty palms, (gasps) "Oh my God, we're gonna die," if we turned right. Like, I was the worst flyer. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 24:44 Were you?

Danny T 24:44 Dave was laughing behind the camera.

Chris Williamson 24:46 What, uh, what are you like after 87 flights then?

Danny T 24:50 Uh, I've conquered my own fear through breathing exercises.

Chris Williamson 24:56 No, Kozzie's done the same thing.

Danny T 24:57 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 24:57 Christos done the same thing.

Danny T 24:58 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 24:58 Not through breathing exercises, but just through exposure therapy. It's like if your dream is to DJ around the world, and the thing that you have to overcome to do that is flying, it's like you have something which allows you to transcend your fear.

Danny T 25:13 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 25:14 You know what I mean?

Danny T 25:14 I hear Prince won't fly.

Chris Williamson 25:16 Prince, no, so he does. He does it-

Danny T 25:17 Oh, has he started flying though?

Chris Williamson 25:18 ... on, on very... Well, I mean, how do you think he gets back home? Like, he doesn't swim.

Casey 25:22 No, there's no... Yeah, I thought-

Danny T 25:22 Yeah, I thought he had to get trains, boats.

Casey 25:24 There's that, famous story. <|agent|><|en|>

Chris Williamson 25:24 No, no, no, no.

Casey 25:24 Where he had to take-

Chris Williamson 25:24 So he, he does, he does fly.

Danny T 25:26 Oh.

Chris Williamson 25:26 But it's very limited. And Kozzie said this-

Danny T 25:28 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 25:28 So, he doesn't fly across America doing an America tour. Imagine if you were doing east coast to west coast. Like, he's on a, he's on a bus with Kozzie-

Danny T 25:35 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 25:36 ... and, like, Christos just sat there like, "I could've fucking been there in three hours."

Danny T 25:39 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 25:40 And he's like doing a-

Casey 25:41 (laughs)

Danny T 25:41 I would have just got on the plane.

Chris Williamson 25:42 ... two-day bus journey.

Danny T 25:42 I would have just got a flight. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 25:44 Okay, so you, we've spoken about, about the flying. But, you know, that's a... Your sleep's being messed up, your diet, your training-

Danny T 25:50 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 25:50 ... your nutrition. Like, uh, how are you... What's your head space like? Have you had periods where that's really damaged you? Or did you have periods where your head space went wayward in-

Danny T 25:58 I've been more physically exhausted, mentally exhausted, than actually, like, felt low. Like, a lot of DJs, a lot of DJs will play a massive, a m- a massive gig. Play in front of loads of people, whether it's an artist or a resident, leave, and then they feel horrendous. They feel really low, upset. They don't like what's going on. They're like, they feel as if they've let everybody down. It's like... And I get where that would come from, but I love that time afterwards. Like, after, after the arena show, when five-and-a-half thousand people left, I went and had a wander and a smile, just wand- wandered round the arena, like, "Has he... All these people came and stood here." Like, that, to me, I, I loved that. I, I like a bit of, like, private time.

Chris Williamson 26:52 Mm.

Danny T 26:52 Whereas for a lot of DJs, especially when, like, alcohol, um, amongst other things are involved, it's like, "Oh my God, this is amazing. The night's building, the..." Uh, where-

Chris Williamson 27:02 It's a big draw boy.

Danny T 27:03 ... where's all my friends?

Chris Williamson 27:04 That's, that's precisely what Christos brought up on our podcast.

Danny T 27:07 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 27:07 For him especially, because of how ruthless his tour is, he'll go three or four days without being in a bed sometimes.

Danny T 27:16 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 27:16 Because of the, the length of the flights, the change of the time zones, the number of flights, and, and transfers and stuff.

Danny T 27:22 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 27:22 And he said, um, "I wonder whether or not Casey is the s- part of the saving grace for this, and the fact that you've constructed a team that is around you." Because Kozzie doesn't have a tour manager.

Danny T 27:34 Mm.

Chris Williamson 27:34 So, he plays this gig. He'll smash the, smash the arse off supporting Fairplay or Adam Beyer or whatever it might be, and then come back to a hotel room on your own surrounded by-

Danny T 27:44 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 27:44 ... a bit of room service.

Danny T 27:46 Ask Dave o's, ask Dave o... Casey-

Casey 27:48 I (laughs)

Danny T 27:48 ... Casey doesn't tour with me. Casey's like, Casey lives his life how I live my life. And when I'm not DJing, like, I'm in bed by 10 o'clock.

Chris Williamson 27:56 Got you.

Casey 27:56 Yeah, but I think, like, sort of going on even sort of further to what you said, like, the fact that you kind of had your heyday and party day when you was a resident in Miami.

Danny T 28:07 Yeah, yeah, it's-

Casey 28:08 You've kind of lived those experience. Now, because you are so motivated musically and with your career-

Danny T 28:14 Mm-hmm.

Casey 28:14 ... et cetera, there is, for some DJs, that, that drive and urgency to have that escapism, you know, with, like, drinking after their sets to avoid that sober comedown, if you like, of, "Oh, this is the reality that I'm faced with. I've just gone from being on stage and having this massive high..." And then, you know, sort of the realization that comes after that. Whereas some people will try and escape it with the alcohol, et cetera. I think for you, because you can kind of embrace it, and you actually like it-

Danny T 28:41 Mm-hmm.

Casey 28:41 ... and you want to be motivated the next day for work, like, that's where you get the-

Danny T 28:46 For me, the lowest-

Casey 28:47 ... motivation from.

Danny T 28:47 ... of the low feeling would be telling myself I'm getting up at 11 o'clock and waking up at 7:00 PM and thinking, "Oh, I've just let myself down here."

Casey 28:55 Mm.

Danny T 28:55 That's, that's much worse for me. Like, but if I'm on stage for 60 minutes, as much as I'm thoroughly enjoying myself, it's still a job. I've got a job to do. I've got a job to, just to smash it out the park for those 60 minutes. The time afterwards is reflection on how good the job was.

Chris Williamson 29:16 Mm.

Danny T 29:17 Or how good the... I can't, I don't, I don't wanna call it a job, 'cause when I first started I wanted to do it for free. It's just, it just so happens to pay now. But the performance, I like to think about it afterwards and be like, "Yeah, that was sick. That was like..."

Chris Williamson 29:33 Do you listen to your sets back ever to kind of-

Danny T 29:35 No, no, I can just remember. We've, well, obviously we have video content for every gig.

Chris Williamson 29:39 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 29:41 (coughs) I know which kind of drops have been the biggest, though. I, and I always... I'll be like, "Yeah, that one was good. Make sure we've got a video of that."

Chris Williamson 29:48 There is, there is a period of your, uh, post-work reflection that allows you to iterate on improving that though, right?

Danny T 29:55 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 29:55 So I was... I've literally today a podcast's gone out with James from podcast.co, um, where I talked about mine. And Rogan says that he never, ever listens to his podcasts back. Which is interesting, because he always listens to his standup routines back. And I think it's because first off he's gonna be so busy that after having spent three hours recording-

Danny T 30:14 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 30:14 ... with someone, then spending another three hours-

Danny T 30:16 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 30:16 ... listening to it back is a little bit much.

Danny T 30:17 You get tired of your own voice. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 30:19 Yeah. Uh, but I think the other thing is that he, he finds podcasting to be so well within his domain of competence that he doesn't need to. But for me at the moment, as someone who's still trying to improve and iterate on that, I think that reflection period is really, really important. But you, you touched on something real important, which is, I think...... a lot of DJs don't consider their job, a job.

Danny T 30:40 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 30:41 And I'm, I'm telling you, like, I am the guy, I am a fantastic example of who you need to impress. I've got four nights a week in Newcastle, either a, you know, multiple rooms of those. There's f- probably 100 grand of wages going out to DJs between all the different rooms, all the different bits. So I want a person who's gonna turn up on time. I want someone who's gonna put some social media up during the day without me asking.

Danny T 31:06 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 31:07 Without me having to fucking go-

Casey 31:08 I think-

Chris Williamson 31:09 ... "Oh, hi mate. Would you mind fucking putting-"

Danny T 31:10 This is our book. (laughs)

Casey 31:11 You know what it is? I think that's kind of ... Initially, Danny's sort of appeal to DJing was very much just an amplified party lifestyle, and the fact that he was-

Danny T 31:21 But I would still never-

Casey 31:22 ... a good DJ-

Danny T 31:22 I would still never be late, or sack it off, or not do the best job I could. I would never drink myself into oblivion and do a really ... Well, I would.

Casey 31:33 Well-

Danny T 31:33 But I'd still be able to perform. (laughs) I'd still be able to do, I'd still be able to do the set.

Casey 31:39 But I think that was sort of that, uh, you call it DJ etiquette, that sort of, those lower level basics of professionalism, it seemed to be absent for quite a few DJs. And it was something I sort of observed, and I think even you in the early days, because you had that, and that was just 'cause you wanted to be everyone's friend and you were that larger-than-life personality, I think particularly DJs don't realize how far that goes, you know. Yes, you need to be a technically good DJ and obviously be able to read a crowd and all of those sort of fundamentals, but if you're not a nice person, or, you know-

Danny T 32:09 Mm-hmm.

Casey 32:09 ... you're late or you're not posting on social media, you're not supporting an event, people aren't gonna wanna book you.

Chris Williamson 32:15 I mean, the, the DJ skills are what get you through the door. There's this blog post that someone sent to me the other day that talks about why nice guys thinks that, think that girls should like them. And it's like, hang on a second. (laughing) You think that because you're kind to your mum and you're always on time and you always put kisses at the end of a text-

Danny T 32:31 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 32:31 ... that girls should like you? They're like, "Fuck you. You do not know what girls like. There is a man out there who can do all of that, and he plays the guitar." And you're like ... (laughs) That's it. That's the fucking guy that plays the guitar.

Danny T 32:43 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Casey 32:44 Uh, it's ... Yeah. So you've-

Danny T 32:45 Going back to, like, just, just being that happy, friendly, jolly guy, I was on the phone to somebody, but, er, our Sky weren't working in our bedroom last night.

Chris Williamson 32:55 I know it wasn't because I, I've had to put someone on for free tonight because of you.

Danny T 32:57 (laughs) So I was ... I don't even know if I've told ... I put it on my story. I don't know if you've seen it. So I was on the phone to someone from Sky, and he were cracking a few jokes like he'd thought he were a, he were like a, a, a funny guy. And he, he were quite entertaining, to be fair. It was like, it was a bit of breath of fresh air that somebody that was sorting your, like, fixing your Sky was actually, like, putting a bit of personality into the call.

Chris Williamson 33:20 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 33:20 And, uh, he was like, "Oh, so, uh, oh, what, what were you trying to watch when it's not working?" Blah, blah, blah. And then we got talking. I was like, "Oh, where, where are you from in the North East?" Could tell he was from the North East. He was like, "Oh, Newcastle." I was like, "I'm playing there tomorrow." He's like, "Where at?" I was like, "Digital." He was like, "Whee, love Digital. Oh my God." Uh, he goes, "I tell you what. I'll do you a deal. If you sort me out, if I fix your Sky tonight-"

Chris Williamson 33:46 (laughs)

Danny T 33:46 "... you put me and my friends on in VIP-"

Chris Williamson 33:49 (laughs)

Danny T 33:49 "... at Digital tomorrow night." And that was it.

Chris Williamson 33:51 It was a fucking easy, easy deal for you, mate.

Danny T 33:55 And d'you know-

Chris Williamson 33:55 It's my door.

Danny T 33:56 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 33:56 (laughs)

Danny T 33:56 And do you know what?

Casey 33:56 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 33:56 (laughs)

Danny T 33:56 And Rebecca, my missus, Rebecca, said, as, as soon as she was like, as soon as she heard that, she went, "My God, you'll make friends with anyone." And I was like, that's, that falls back into this. It's just like-

Chris Williamson 34:08 Demeanor.

Danny T 34:08 ... why would you-

Chris Williamson 34:09 Conduct.

Danny T 34:10 ... why would you not ... Like, I, I totally respect people that don't want to make loads of friends, but just-

Chris Williamson 34:14 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 34:14 ... I don't know. I just attract friends. I just, like-

Chris Williamson 34:17 Well, I think, I think the, the point that you've made there is you are at a competitive advantage if you can.

Casey 34:22 Yes.

Danny T 34:22 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 34:23 Right? Because it's just-

Danny T 34:24 Especially in this in-, this industry.

Chris Williamson 34:26 It's people, man. You know? Like, and the, and we've touched on it before. Like, you have to be able to deliver the product. I'll happily sack a nice DJ who's shit at DJing. But I'll pick, over two DJs that are the same, I'll pick the one that's pushing the social media. I'll pick the one that does everything else.

Danny T 34:41 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 34:41 But as we've said at the very beginning, a lot of DJs look at all of the ancillary shit.

Danny T 34:47 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 34:48 All the stuff around the outside where it's like, are you releasing a monthly mix? Probably a pretty good pl- ... If I was a DJ, first thing I would do would be to have, like, build up a mix following. Keep- sharpens my skills, keeps me relevant with people.

Danny T 35:02 And you're searching for new music.

Chris Williamson 35:03 All the time.

Danny T 35:04 'Cause you can't just put the same stuff on every mix.

Chris Williamson 35:06 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 35:06 You've gotta constantly be hunting for new stuff.

Casey 35:08 The foundation of kind of what I put into play with Danny in the very beginning was, your, your personality is great, and you know, musically, people know who you are, and they will watch you on Fridays and Saturdays, potentially Sundays while they're hungover and scrolling through their phone. But that midweek between Monday and Thursday, what are you doing to grab people's attention? Like, are you engaging with those people? Are you putting out a mix? Like, as a DJ, you're meant to be their resource of information for music. Like, how are you keeping them engaged? How are you, like, letting them know about music? So a monthly mix was a, a great foundation for us. And then, yeah ...

Danny T 35:45 Or some weeks I was putting three mixes out. (laughs)

Casey 35:47 Yeah.

Danny T 35:47 Three mixes a week out when, when my, my SoundCloud was at its height. SoundCloud's dropped off. Everyone's kind of gone towards Spotify playlists now rather than actual DJ mixes. You can still get, get good plays on DJ mixes. People still do want them and still like for them, like them. But they weren't ... SoundCloud was just, like, the one.

Chris Williamson 36:08 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 36:08 And as I could see everything progressing, I was like, wait, I can put out two mixes this week. Go on, I'll put another one out tomorrow. And I was like ... 'Cause I was just sat at home just hunt- hunting for music. Like, even, even when I was in (...) I'd wake up and the lads would like, like, go past on their, on, on their peds past the restaurant and beat the horn laughing and joking 'cause I was sat staring at my laptop, and they were going to sunbathe for four hours.

Chris Williamson 36:34 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 36:34 And I'd be sat there.

Chris Williamson 36:36 But did it feel like work?

Danny T 36:37 No, no, 'cause I was enjoying it and sunbathing's boring. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 36:40 So, as I said, there's per- another thing that keeps on coming back in a lot of conversations I'm having-Your competitive advantage in life is doing what for you feels like fun, but for everyone else feels like work.

Danny T 36:51 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:52 That is the easiest way to find ... And for me, it's this, you know? Like, I've got work tonight till 3:00 in the morning, which is even later than you, depending on whether or not you're drinking. Um-

Danny T 37:01 (laughs) You've got to go back to Leeds. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 37:02 Um, so, you know, I've got that tonight, but I, I hassled you to come and do this podcast, because I'd have felt remiss, like I'd, "Oh, I, I want to know what it's like to walk out on stage in front of five."

Danny T 37:13 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 37:13 So for me, I am at a competitive advantage. For other people, for whom this would be ... You're lovely, but this would be fucking torture.

Danny T 37:19 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 37:20 Right? I'm enjoying it and so is everyone that's listening, but some people wouldn't want to have this conversation.

Danny T 37:23 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 37:24 Even some of the audience.

Danny T 37:25 But that's just you taking ... Not taking advantage, but that's you, like, yeah, taking advantage of an opportunity that, that could arise for both of us. It's just you ...

Chris Williamson 37:36 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 37:37 It's the one. It's you've got to want something.

Chris Williamson 37:38 I, I would, I would do this. I would do this even if there was no opportunity coming off the back of it.

Danny T 37:42 It's-

Chris Williamson 37:42 I would do this and not put it out.

Danny T 37:44 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Casey 37:44 It's them from you doing what you love. And I think literally, like, a big part of my job is, I said this to you at the start of the year, like, that feeling, that sensation that you got walking on stage at the first Direct Arena, my job through and through is to facilitate as many of those moments as possible this year.

Danny T 38:02 Yeah, yeah.

Casey 38:02 And beyond. Like, the fact that you get to do what you love, if I can make that happen time and time and time again, that's wholeheartedly why I exist. That is my job role in its entirety.

Chris Williamson 38:12 Mm-hmm.

Casey 38:12 The same for you. The fact that you're able to do what you love, like, why wouldn't you do that over and over and over again?

Chris Williamson 38:18 Mm-hmm. And the thing as well is, on top of that, you're ... This is this brilliant example I got from James Clear, guy that wrote Atomic Habits, and, um, he was talking about Steffi Graf. Remember Steffi Graf, the tennis player? So-

Danny T 38:28 Uh, no, no. I'm, I'm only 19. (laughs)

Casey 38:31 (laughs)

Danny T 38:32 Yeah, I re-

Chris Williamson 38:32 Yeah, yeah.

Danny T 38:32 Yeah, I remember Steffi. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 38:33 So Steffi Graf was part-

Danny T 38:34 Did she get sta- No, that was ... Did she get shot?

Chris Williamson 38:37 She's still alive.

Danny T 38:38 No, not dead, just shot?

Chris Williamson 38:40 I don't know. Why would ... That's a weird thing to happen. If anyone knows whether or not Steffi Graf's been shot-

Danny T 38:45 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 38:45 ... please leave it in the comments below.

Danny T 38:46 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 38:47 Um, so-

Danny T 38:47 I thought ... No, no, it was the other one that got stabbed on court. Tennis player.

Chris Williamson 38:53 Is this in-

Danny T 38:54 Um, with the-

Chris Williamson 38:54 Have you imagined this, Danny?

Danny T 38:55 No, what's she called? Monica Seles got stabbed on court, but they all have big rivals.

Chris Williamson 38:59 If anyone knows if Monica Seles has been stabbed on court, please.

Danny T 39:02 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 39:02 So s- she's about 12 years old, she's in the German youth tennis setup. They do a, an assessment, two broad spectrums. One of them is, uh, capability athletically and the other one is mindset. And it turns out that Steffi Graf was, um, the highest rated in terms of her technical ability, but she was also the highest rated in terms of love for the sport.

Danny T 39:23 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 39:23 So it's like, hang on a second, let's say that you have all the talent that Steffi Graf does. She'll still outwork you and it won't even feel like work to you.

Danny T 39:33 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 39:34 You know what I mean? Like, that is a formidable person to come up against.

Casey 39:37 Do you know what? It's ... So aside from managing Danny, I also like consult with other people, and the one thing that's been consistent throughout it is if you're an entrepreneur, a creative, or someone where, you know, you're putting something out there to some people, you have to have your why, and if you don't love what you do, like, you'll end up giving up. And I think the fact is, like, it hasn't always been easy for you, but the fact that you just want to DJ and you absolutely love it through and through, that's what gives you the consistency to like continue going even when it hasn't been ideal, hasn't, like, been as smooth as people may perceive it. Like, I just think if you want to be successful, like, having your why in terms of, you know, really, really loving what you do, that's what will enable you to stay the course.

Danny T 40:21 I've, I've said, haven't I, like, if I stopped enjoying this, I'd, I'd stop.

Casey 40:24 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 40:25 Do something else.

Danny T 40:25 I wouldn't just carry on doing it just 'cause it pays the bills. I'll go get a job. Like it's ...

Chris Williamson 40:29 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 40:30 I wouldn't do it making me miserable because it's made me so happy over the years. Why would I want that to go down? Like, stay on a high, like stay, leave, just le- just park it.

Chris Williamson 40:41 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 40:41 Park that. I don't enjoy it anymore. Do a retirement gig, make loads of money and then- (laughs)

Chris Williamson 40:46 (laughs)

Danny T 40:47 And then do, uh, and then go on and do something else.

Chris Williamson 40:49 Whatever's next.

Danny T 40:50 Yeah, whatever come, whatever comes next or whatever.

Chris Williamson 40:52 Well, there's that Nietzsche quote, which is a man with a strong enough why can bear any how. You know, like, there you go.

Casey 40:58 There you go.

Chris Williamson 40:58 Like, I'm, I'm happy to go through fucking fire and brimstone if kind of the challenge is worth it.

Danny T 41:04 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 41:05 So, you know, you'll, there'll have been nights where you've been basically no sleep, getting on a plane, fucking strapping your eye mask on. I've seen photos of you. You look like a-

Danny T 41:13 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 41:14 You look like a Teletubby just with their face up.

Danny T 41:16 Oh, that's a-

Chris Williamson 41:16 With like-

Danny T 41:17 ... that's some, that's some tech- that's some tekkers. That's flying tekkers.

Chris Williamson 41:20 Ah, right, okay.

Danny T 41:20 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 41:20 So, um, I'm gonna break the fourth wall a little bit. To the people that are listening, Danny's been teasing me with his travel hacks. Oh, mate, I need to go-

Danny T 41:27 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 41:27 I, I've got the best life hacks in the world for travel.

Danny T 41:29 Mate, there's, there's loads that I can't even share with you, 'cause if they start doing it, they'll cotton on to it and we won't be able-

Casey 41:33 Yeah, you'll ruin it for the rest of us.

Chris Williamson 41:34 Okay, so I n-

Danny T 41:35 There's a, there's a few I'll tell you afterwards, but-

Chris Williamson 41:36 Yeah. No, and, and I want you to be able to give us some that you're prepared to make.

Danny T 41:40 Right. Sleeping on planes, bearing in mind I used to be so anxious on a flight that I just had to cling onto the seat in front and couldn't, couldn't let go until we'd stopped-

Chris Williamson 41:53 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 41:55 ... for average of four hours, seven, eight flights a week. You can imagine how painful that was to start with. Now, the whole summer last summer, 87 flights, I was awake for no more than 15 minutes on each flight.

Chris Williamson 42:10 What do you do? What's your process? Talk me through it.

Danny T 42:11 Good, good headphones that go over the ear.

Chris Williamson 42:14 What do you use?

Danny T 42:15 I've just got Beats, like soft, soft, gray Beats that go over the top. So make sure they're soft, 'cause if they're in your ear, you could wake up 'cause it's hurting the inside of your ear. EarPods don't work. I, I love my EarPods, but they don't work for this. So over the top of the ear. Um, I u- just use the, the Headspace free trial.

Chris Williamson 42:36 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 42:36 Just loop the ten, the ten meditation, ten-minute meditations on it.

Chris Williamson 42:40 You know they've got a, a s- the sleep noise, which is like white noise but for sleep.

Danny T 42:45 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 42:45 You heard that?... and it's, like, different-

Casey 42:46 Yeah, I love ... it.

Chris Williamson 42:47 ... levels of hums and, and-

Danny T 42:48 I have that to go to sleep.

Chris Williamson 42:49 ... dreams.

Danny T 42:50 It's an app called Sleep Aid.

Chris Williamson 42:51 Okay, similar stuff. Okay, so you've got some ...

Danny T 42:53 That, and an, and an eye mask. An eye mask that doesn't touch the lids of your eyes, otherwise-

Chris Williamson 42:57 What eye mask do you use? Do you know where you got it from?

Danny T 42:59 It's an Amazon one, but it's like a round pad.

Chris Williamson 43:02 Ah, yeah, okay.

Danny T 43:03 That goes around. If it touches your eyelids, you wake up with really dry eyes and your eyes are all stuck together.

Chris Williamson 43:07 Okay.

Danny T 43:08 If it doesn't touch your eyelids, you, you literally wake up and you ... oh, I shouldn't have done that. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 43:11 It's fine. It's fine.

Danny T 43:11 You literally wake up and you're, like, fresh and ready to go, like it's-

Chris Williamson 43:15 So they're like, um ... for people that are just listening, they're kind of like furry goggles, aren't they? But with something over the front of the goggle as well.

Danny T 43:21 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, they look like a, like a world war, World War I pilot goggles-

Chris Williamson 43:25 Casper!

Danny T 43:25 Yeah, yeah. (laughs) Um, and I've got a, like a, um, a s- ... it's like a ... it's not a breathing mask, it doesn't help you breathe, but it just stops. Like, planes are literally the most unhealthy air in the world. It's just-

Chris Williamson 43:41 Oh, so you've got like a-

Danny T 43:42 I have one of those that clips round and just-

Chris Williamson 43:45 Do you know where you got your mask?

Danny T 43:46 Yeah, just, um, I buy everything ... (laughs)

Chris Williamson 43:47 Amazon's, uh-huh. Uh, did you ... can you remember the brand at all?

Danny T 43:50 No, no, no. I can't.

Chris Williamson 43:51 I'll try and get you to send it to me. If I can find it, it'll be in the show notes below.

Danny T 43:55 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 43:55 So you've got that. What about, um, a cushion for the neck?

Danny T 43:58 Yeah. You've got to have a so- ... I've got the same one in it, the same one I've had for, like, three years now, and it's ... it needs a wash. (laughs) It needs a good wa- (laughs) a good wash now. But I've never found one that's better. You've got to make sure when it's clipped together, you can't touch, like, your ear on your shoulders.

Chris Williamson 44:16 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 44:16 'Cause otherwise you end up like ... I wo- ... (laughs) I woke up before without one and been like, "Oh, my God, how am I gonna, how am I gonna DJ?" I'm like pushing my head.

Chris Williamson 44:26 Yeah.

Danny T 44:27 And like, "Oh, my ..."

Chris Williamson 44:29 Yeah.

Danny T 44:29 Like, "What have I done to myself?"

Chris Williamson 44:30 Get your ear glued to your shoulder.

Danny T 44:32 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 44:32 Okay, so we've got that. What about sort of posture? What about seat choice? Do you try and-

Danny T 44:37 Seat choice is s- ... c-

Chris Williamson 44:37 ... aim for an aisle, aim for a window, aim for the front?

Danny T 44:40 That's a hack within itself.

Chris Williamson 44:41 Yeah.

Danny T 44:41 That's, that's a hack and a separate conversation which I'll speak to you about afterwards. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 44:45 That's secret info.

Danny T 44:46 But if you book a, if you book a seat towards the front of the plane, it isn't as turbulent as the back.

Chris Williamson 44:52 That's interesting.

Danny T 44:53 You don't get shaken as much. If you think about it, the wings are there. This ... i- ... the wings are there left and right, your first point-

Chris Williamson 45:00 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 45:00 ... is the first bit. It's the wings that are going up and down, not the front of the plane. So as the wings are going up and down, the back's moving more than the front.

Chris Williamson 45:08 That's interesting.

Danny T 45:09 So you always get worse turbulence at the back of the plane. I might have just made that up, but in my head it works. (laughs) And I always have.

Chris Williamson 45:15 If you've made, if you've made it up-

Danny T 45:16 I always have some ... I al- ... no, I think that's true.

Chris Williamson 45:19 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 45:20 I, I've, like ... but I'm ... I haven't researched or read that anywhere.

Chris Williamson 45:22 If, if you've made it up, someone will call it out, so it's fine.

Danny T 45:24 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 45:25 You can add these to today's listing, Danny.

Casey 45:27 (laughs)

Danny T 45:27 So-

Chris Williamson 45:27 But I've, I've, I've been on loads of flights at the front that have been fine, loads of flights at the back, and the back flights are always a lot ... like, they feel a lot bumpier. Mm-hmm.

Danny T 45:36 Even, like, when there's no turbulence. Like, you know when they don't have the seatbelt sign on?

Chris Williamson 45:41 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 45:42 Even when you're allowed to walk around, the back of the plane definitely bounces more.

Chris Williamson 45:45 What's the, um, most efficient way to get through an airport?

Danny T 45:50 Run. (laughs) It is worth paying £2.50 on a, in advance for fast track security.

Chris Williamson 45:57 Okay.

Danny T 45:57 Straight through. If you book it well in advance, it's 2, £2.50. It's, it's-

Chris Williamson 46:01 Is that with anyone that's like easyJet or Airport?

Danny T 46:03 No, no, you book it direct through the airport.

Chris Williamson 46:06 Right, okay.

Danny T 46:06 Yeah. I've been on ... I've been on flights before that if I didn't, if I didn't have that, I'd 100% missed my flight.

Chris Williamson 46:15 You'd have missed your flight.

Danny T 46:15 Like ...

Chris Williamson 46:16 But I suppose the problem is ... it's all well and good ... I can turn up to pretty much any flight departing from Newcastle, 'cause from here it is ten minutes-

Danny T 46:23 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 46:23 ... to the airport. I can leave here an hour and 15 before I need to depart, even with hold luggage, and be on the plane fine, unless there's a queue at security.

Danny T 46:33 Yeah.

Casey 46:33 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 46:34 And if there's a queue at security, you're done fucked. Like, and then-

Danny T 46:37 No, no, if, if you ... if there's a queue at security, all you do is run to the front and go, "I'm about to miss my flight," and they'll let you go straight through.

Chris Williamson 46:44 Okay. There's a hack.

Casey 46:44 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 46:44 That's a, that is a good hack. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 46:46 What about other stuff? What about ... are you taking water on board? Are you making sure if you've got like a tap-

Danny T 46:50 Every airport's now got a tap at the other side, so I just take an empty bottle of plastic water, if you don't-

Chris Williamson 46:54 Tap at the other side?

Danny T 46:56 S- as soon as you go through security, there's now a drinking tap.

Chris Williamson 47:00 Really?

Danny T 47:00 In every UK airport. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 47:02 That's interesting.

Danny T 47:02 That's it. I don't know if they've legally had to put it in, but they've-

Chris Williamson 47:05 You've noticed.

Danny T 47:06 ... everyone I've gone through now, they have one of those little-

Chris Williamson 47:08 So you've got, like, a-

Danny T 47:09 ... like, hook attached to it.

Chris Williamson 47:09 ... pro- protein shake or, like, a good chili bottle or something.

Danny T 47:11 Yeah, just take a, take a bottle. To be fair, I'm, like, so in a rush I'm not even, like, that prepared sometimes. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 47:18 Yeah.

Danny T 47:18 I'm just like, "Right, quick, grab it." Well, water's free on the plane.

Chris Williamson 47:22 Mm-hmm. You wanna have it ... do you know what I mean? You want the big bottle-

Danny T 47:24 Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's ...

Chris Williamson 47:24 ... that you've got with you at all times.

Danny T 47:25 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 47:26 I've got a, a good one. I've ... it's already been on a Life Hacks, but, uh, WHSmith versus Boots. If you go into WHSmith, they've got buttered sorghum loaves, uh, and it's 50 pence less for the-

Danny T 47:39 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 47:39 For the meal deal. Uh, and they've actually got, I think, a more premium selection of sandwiches, so-

Danny T 47:45 Thank you.

Chris Williamson 47:46 Fuck Boots. That's what I'm saying.

Danny T 47:47 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 47:47 Sorry, I still ... I'm still up for a sponsorship if you wanna give me some free-

Danny T 47:50 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 47:50 ... some free toiletries. What else? So what else have you got from-

Danny T 47:53 You've got to, got to, got to, got to make sure your liquids in a bag, 'cause that could save you 25 minutes there.

Chris Williamson 48:00 Oh.

Danny T 48:00 Don't make any mistakes. No ... well, I don't ... it depends how, how many times you travel. If you travel a lot, I know my laptop has to come out, I know my phone charger has to come out. That's, that's always good to have-

Chris Williamson 48:10 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 48:10 ... a f- a phone charger-

Chris Williamson 48:12 Mmm.

Danny T 48:12 ... to take on the plane.

Chris Williamson 48:13 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 48:13 'Cause if your iPhone's not the latest one, they make sure it don't last four hours. Um, so I always have, like, a phone charger. £20 for the massive ones, and it, it charges your phone six or eight times.

Chris Williamson 48:25 Five times, isn't it, exactly? Yeah.

Danny T 48:26 Yeah, exactly. I could literally take that on, on the road for four days-

Chris Williamson 48:30 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 48:31 ... and it'll just keep charging my phone.

Chris Williamson 48:32 I'm, I'm, I'm going to Athens this weekend for my birthday, and I'm taking an external charger and I don't need to worry about having a plug socket.

Danny T 48:38 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:39 I've got nothing else that I need to char- ... my Kindle will last for five weeks-

Danny T 48:42 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 48:42 ... 'cause they're monstrous. Um, and, uh ... yeah, you're right, you've got your external charger, you don't even care about what the power port is at the front.

Danny T 48:49 Yeah. I've just bought one for my laptop to take on.

Chris Williamson 48:52 ... a laptop-

Danny T 48:52 Big one, yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:52 ... external charger?

Danny T 48:53 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:54 No way does that exists.

Danny T 48:55 Yeah, it's for the... well, that's for the road. I just bought it.

Chris Williamson 48:58 Shh...

Danny T 48:58 100 quid off Amazon.

Chris Williamson 48:59 Holy shit. How many laptop chargers-

Danny T 49:01 I haven't tried it yet.

Chris Williamson 49:03 What does it say? It must have told you. How many laptop chargers do you get out of your charger? One?

Danny T 49:06 I don't know.

Chris Williamson 49:08 Fucking hell.

Danny T 49:08 I just went for the biggest one that... Davo, Davo obviously knows about carrying camera equipment through and if it's over 100 watt, you're not allowed to take it through security if they spot it.

Chris Williamson 49:18 Gotta be in hold luggage.

Danny T 49:19 So I knew that it wasn't allowed to be more than-

Chris Williamson 49:21 Like 95 watt or something?

Danny T 49:22 ... 100 watt, so I just, I just got the 100-watt one.

Chris Williamson 49:25 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 49:25 Which was the... like, that was the biggest one, but it's about this big. It's not even that heavy. It's got a fan built into it to keep it cool.

Chris Williamson 49:30 Shit is heavy.

Danny T 49:31 It's light. It's not even that heavy, is it? Look how-

Chris Williamson 49:32 Some cool piece of kit that, though.

Danny T 49:34 Yeah. Like-

Chris Williamson 49:35 I mean, do you run out of battery on your, on your laptop that much?

Danny T 49:38 Yeah, on the road, yeah. Yeah. Not... well, not... well, with my old laptop that would last about 15 minutes (laughs) .

Chris Williamson 49:44 (laughs)

Danny T 49:44 I've got a new laptop that, uh, that I had to buy-

Chris Williamson 49:47 Significantly better?

Danny T 49:48 ... after I had my last one stolen when I went-

Chris Williamson 49:49 What about for on the road, then? Let's say that you, that you're driving. Have you got any cool travel hacks for, for driving around on the road? Like have you got a preference on-

Danny T 49:58 Most, most, um, service stations have got, be it Rustlers os- or baby milk free microwaves, so you can actually take decent food on the road. You don't have to just live on meal deals.

Chris Williamson 50:10 So you could potentially pre-cook all of your stuff-

Danny T 50:12 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 50:13 ... or pre-cook some stuff.

Danny T 50:13 That's what I do. I've got it... Oh, I've got it in a bag here.

Chris Williamson 50:16 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 50:16 Watch.

Chris Williamson 50:16 Do you want to use my microwave?

Danny T 50:18 (laughs) .

Chris Williamson 50:18 It's like 50p.

Danny T 50:19 No, no. (laughs) Um, I don't know. Road hacks. Come on, you're with me all the time, what... um, drive at night. How, how to not pay for parking. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 50:34 Drive at night.

Danny T 50:34 Drive at night.

Chris Williamson 50:35 Man, I mean, uh, it... anyone that... between the hours of, like, 7:00 AM and 9:00, and then 3:30 PM and 5:30, the roads are just...

Danny T 50:46 Oh, Leeds is 'til 8:00, easy.

Chris Williamson 50:48 Really?

Danny T 50:48 Can't move.

Chris Williamson 50:49 Especially around the arena as well, I'm guessing.

Danny T 50:51 Uh, not even the arena. The whole of the city center's just, just mad, innit? My-

Chris Williamson 50:54 Cool.

Danny T 50:55 My parents live 10 miles away from me at the opposite side of Leeds. It's half an hour in no traffic, an hour and 45 minutes if it's busy. I live in London. It's just all 45 minutes.

Chris Williamson 51:04 Yeah, yeah.

Danny T 51:05 Just get the train.

Chris Williamson 51:06 (laughs)

Danny T 51:06 Train, car.

Chris Williamson 51:06 Have you ever been to LA?

Danny T 51:08 No. Yes.

Chris Williamson 51:09 Have you seen the traffic in LA?

Danny T 51:10 It's disgusting. Yeah, it's horrendous.

Chris Williamson 51:11 It's a m- it's beyond anything you've ever seen. Like-

Danny T 51:14 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:14 And the thing as well is it's... there's so many lanes, it's mind-blowing that you're on a motorway and you're like, "Oh, there must be a crash ahead." You're like, "No, this is just-

Danny T 51:23 There's just that many cars.

Chris Williamson 51:24 ... what traffic is like out here."

Danny T 51:25 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:25 Nose to tail for miles.

Danny T 51:27 It's like, like Dubai. It's like, at one point, the motorway, the freeway in Dubai is 11 lanes each way wide.

Chris Williamson 51:34 But the thing with Dubai, this is what blew me away, is that is a city which has been designed for millions of people to live there.

Danny T 51:40 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 51:40 So you can be doing 70 miles an hour 90 seconds before you reach your destination in the middle of the city. And then you'll peel off on this, like, real weird-

Danny T 51:50 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:50 ... spaghetti junction and then it just deposits you on, like, the Palm Jumeirah beach or whatever, and you're like, "How the fuck did I...? I was on a motorway two seconds ago."

Danny T 51:58 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:58 "How did I get here?" Um, yeah, that's... that is good. So-

Danny T 52:01 Or if you take a wrong turn, you've got a 17-mile detour to get back to where you need to be.

Chris Williamson 52:06 It's a li- it's little bit challenging, yeah. You don't want to fuck up with that. Um, so-

Danny T 52:09 (laughs) Tight Yorkshireman coming out here. So we've, we've been to Dubai. Me and my missus have been to Dubai, like, four times now. Not the last time we went, the time before that. Bearing in mind you can get a taxi from the airport to any hotel in Dubai for about 15 quid.

Chris Williamson 52:25 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 52:25 It's not actually that expensive.

Chris Williamson 52:26 Uber is outrageously cheap out there.

Danny T 52:28 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:28 It's insane.

Danny T 52:29 It's so cheap. And there's even, like, the local taxis are even cheaper than Uber.

Chris Williamson 52:32 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 52:33 Um, so we got there and I was like, "Right, no. We're gonna explore." It was nighttime as well. It was pitch black. We decided to get the train, which it was... it was probably about 6:00 or 7:00. It had gone dark, but it wasn't, like, the middle of the night.

Chris Williamson 52:49 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 52:50 The train was still running. I was like, "Right, we'll get dropped off at the bottom of the Palm and then just walk up to 5," which is the hotel we're staying at. It's only 100 yards or something. Got there and I was like, "Oh my God, there's four motorways in between here and the bottom of the Palm." Uh, there's no footpaths. You can't walk anywhere. So I was like-

Chris Williamson 53:07 I, I couldn't believe it.

Danny T 53:08 ... "How are we going to flag a taxi down here?" You're like, "Oh, right."

Chris Williamson 53:11 "Where do you need to go?" "Um, there." (laughs)

Danny T 53:14 And I looked, and I looked and we were literally at the bottom of the Palm from the hotel... uh, from the, from the airport on the train, bottom of the Palm, flagged down a taxi and we were at wha- I thought it was gonna be 200 or 300 yard walk from the train station. It was a seven-mile car journey to get there in the taxi-

Chris Williamson 53:34 Oh, shit. (laughs) He's really going around.

Danny T 53:34 (laughs) ... once we'd got there because you can't just go straight up. You have to go, like, round and then don't go too far 'cause you'll end up on that motorway, and then back on yourself and then up the Palm.

Chris Williamson 53:43 Jesus Christ.

Danny T 53:44 And then you have to go a mile past 5 to turn back and come back down the Palm to get to it, like... (laughs)

Chris Williamson 53:50 It is mad. I mean, anywhere-

Danny T 53:52 So if you go to Dubai, don't be tight. Just, just pay for a taxi. It's cheap.

Chris Williamson 53:54 It's so cheap, man. Yeah, you're right. Um, so we wanted to touch on some mental health stuff today as well.

Danny T 53:59 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:00 Have you guys been having, sort of, many discussions about this recently? Has there been any-

Danny T 54:03 We have a lot just in life anyway, just-

Chris Williamson 54:05 Yeah, yeah.

Danny T 54:06 We, we want to write a book called How- How To Be an Idiot. No, no. How To Survive In A World Full Of Idiots (laughs) .

Chris Williamson 54:14 Yeah. As an... uh, as an idiot?

Danny T 54:16 No, no, no. Right, okay.

Chris Williamson 54:18 So how, how do I survive in a world full of idiots?

Danny T 54:21 (sighs) How long have you got? (laughs)

Chris Williamson 54:24 Me? With, with the, the s-

Danny T 54:26 Our, our most common thing that we say to each other is that common sense is the least common thing in the world. Like it's actually so ironic because common sense is not common at all.

Chris Williamson 54:37 Give me an example of some uncommon common sense.

Danny T 54:40 Uh, uh, how to undo a light bulb.

Chris Williamson 54:45 (laughs)

Danny T 54:46 80% of people don't know how to change a light bulb. They'd have to work it out.

Chris Williamson 54:49 Where have you got that stat from?

Danny T 54:50 Oh, I can't remember. I've read it somewhere, but-

Chris Williamson 54:52 Is this the same place-

Danny T 54:53 I-

Chris Williamson 54:53 ... that you read being in the back of a plane if you're first turbulence?

Danny T 54:56 (laughs) I've probably just made that up as well.

Chris Williamson 54:58 I- I can't remember. I mean, Baynet-... things are a little bit, like, non-logical, like the way that you put a bayonet light bulb in. What else? What else is uncommon in common sense?

Danny T 55:06 Oh, I know loads of people that don't know there's two types of light bulb.

Chris Williamson 55:09 Okay, yeah.

Danny T 55:10 Two types of fixing.

Chris Williamson 55:11 Yeah, yeah.

Danny T 55:12 They didn't know, like, people that are buying houses, like, grown adults, 25, 30 year olds that, that don't know that there's two different types of light bulb.

Chris Williamson 55:19 There's people listening now that are going, "Fucking two types of-"

Danny T 55:21 Two types. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 55:23 (laughs) Um, what else? What else uncommon?

Danny T 55:25 Let's j- let's do the mental health thing. That's the, gonna be-

Chris Williamson 55:27 All right, cool.

Danny T 55:28 ... easier. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 55:29 Yeah, hit me.

Danny T 55:29 'Cause-

Chris Williamson 55:30 What have you been thinking about recently? What have you been talking about with your friends?

Danny T 55:33 Well, it's obviously massive and it is, it's- it's- it's probably the biggest buzzword. I don't know if buzz means that it's, like, a positive thing or not, but it's- it's so, it's so talked about in life in general, in the media, that, that mental health is this big problem that I think... I've never actually sat there and, like, Googled how do I not have mental health. Like, everybody's got mental health. I've just put some things in place that I think work to make sure I don't have any problems.

Chris Williamson 56:09 What like? What are they?

Danny T 56:10 Like, like the feeling of nostalgia. It's good to throw back to your childhood. I've got a bicycle I do, like, loads of bike rides, and that, that to me is not just a bit of fitness. That to me is, like, I finish the bike ride and I'm like, "Oh, that were amazing." I felt like a big kid again. It's like the feeling of going, "Whee?" when you're a kid going down a hill, like, that is a feeling of, like, the best, not the, not that your life might be bad now, but, like, the most trouble-free, easy, calm, happy times of your life is just being a kid when you have no worries. So putting things in place that bring you back to that I think are just, it's a tiny little thing that you can do to, to make yourself happier.

Chris Williamson 57:00 Mm-hmm. What about you, Casey? What have you been thinking about to do with mental health recently?

Casey 57:03 Um, I think gratitude is something that's com- very, very underestimated, uh, in terms of how it can benefit your mental health. Um, I just think it's a good foundation, and I don't know anyone who is, like, happy or, like, I'll say, really has, like, a productive mental health setting that doesn't actively or proactively practice, like, gratitude.

Chris Williamson 57:28 How have you instantiated that? How have you structured that into your life?

Casey 57:32 Uh, Six Minute Diary.

Chris Williamson 57:34 Hey, link in show notes below.

Casey 57:36 That was, that was actually a recommendation from your podcast.

Chris Williamson 57:39 Yes.

Casey 57:39 Um, yeah, that. There's, there's other little things, but I think, yeah, just, like, proactively taking measures to...

Chris Williamson 57:46 It's bizarre. If you, if you don't have a formalized structure like you now do with Six Minute Diary or anything else, if you're not innately built to be grateful for things and to be reflective in that way and to focus on the good, um, it is a real change, very, very drastic difference between the two. And I- I- I don't know about you, but I've done, I think filled like five or six in now, so I've been doing it, like, three years. And now I find myself doing things and thinking about things in a way that gratitude has taught me to. So I'll do some-

Casey 58:26 It's entirely perception.

Chris Williamson 58:27 Yep.

Casey 58:27 Yeah, it's just, it's entirely how you choose to look at something, and you can be presented with something, and the difference in mindset between how I choose to look at something, be it from, you know, what is this teaching me, uh, and, you know, am I looking at it from a position where, say, for example, you, people who go through trauma, it is quite easy to sit there and blame that trauma for, you know, how bad it's made you feel. But at the same time, that trauma is also responsible for all the good things that have come out of it. And literally just by being grate- not saying that you need to be grateful for trauma, but being grateful for the experiences and the lessons that you have learnt from that. It, nothing has changed in that dynamic, you know? It's just choosing to look at it from an entirely different perspective.

Chris Williamson 59:11 Couldn't agree more, man, yeah. The-

Casey 59:12 That's, yeah.

Chris Williamson 59:13 You are very much in control of your response to any situation. Um, and that's, I'm reading Man's Search for Meaning again for like the third time at the moment, Viktor Frankl's book. This guy, Holocaust survivor, who also created a school of psychology called logotherapy, and the, the quote from it is, um, "The final thing that can never be taken from any man i- is his ability to respond however he chooses to any given situation." And that's it, right? You can be in the worst situation in a, you know, Auschwitz, but you can still choose how you respond.

Casey 59:47 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 59:47 Someone says something s- to you, that is a freedom that can't be taken away. Now obviously it can be, you can't say, "Oh, I'm gonna fly away." I'm not a bird.

Casey 59:54 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 59:54 There are certain things you can't do, but there is always something you can.

Casey 59:57 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 59:57 And I think that sh- switching a victimhood mentality makes a big difference for people.

Casey 1:00:01 (coughs) I think as well, like, even with Danny's social media, you know, I think, as I said before, if you're a creative in any sense of the word, you're obviously putting some sort of creation to the world. So it's, you're gonna have people that like it, people that don't like it. How you choose to respond to that ultimately is a major influence on your own mental health. So Danny having people saying that they don't like his DJing or they don't like his mixing is like-

Danny T 1:00:24 It's not quite as nice as that, isn't it? (laughs)

Casey 1:00:25 No, it's not in any way, shape, or form, but-

Chris Williamson 1:00:28 That's a category.

Danny T 1:00:29 That's the, that's the-

Casey 1:00:30 That's the-

Danny T 1:00:30 That's the-

Casey 1:00:31 ... dulled down version of it.

Danny T 1:00:32 (laughs)

Casey 1:00:32 But again, how Danny chooses to respond to that stuff-

Danny T 1:00:35 But, like, I'm, I'm laughing about it. I'm laughing at people. I'm not laughing at them. I'm just laughing about the fact that people can be so offended by a combination of chords and sounds to think that I, they have to type that your music is as bad as AIDS or cancer. Like, that's, to me, that's, that's hilarious. How can you actually, like how is someone's brain...... that stupid to make those links. Like, music I don't like. You could just switch it off-

Chris Williamson 1:01:08 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:01:08 ... and be happy about switching it off. Instead, you have to, "Right, let me get my phone and tell everyone how much I don't like it." Like, that's so sad. That just, it shows how much of an unhappy person you have to be to, to do that. Like-

Chris Williamson 1:01:21 I think it, it's, everyone has these thoughts, right, that sort of burble below the surface. It's, uh, when dealt with jealousy, or envy, or genuine just dislike for something that you do. The problem is that social media rewards things that we either agree with or things that outrage us.

Danny T 1:01:38 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:38 And that's one of the reasons I think why every conversation now is getting polarized to the extremes.

Danny T 1:01:43 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:43 You have people that are grouping into spheres of awareness-

Danny T 1:01:46 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:46 ... on both end of the spectrum, and then you have the people that just come out with shock tactics.

Casey 1:01:52 There's no rationality-

Danny T 1:01:53 Yeah, yeah.

Casey 1:01:53 ... on social media. I don't think people are able to have conversations either. It's literally, "I agree with you," and I think there's such an eagerness as well for people just to say the first thing that comes to their head or jump on something that they think is a popular opinion.

Danny T 1:02:06 No, I think sometimes people sit there and plan it out for hours how to be the funniest they can be to get the most likes. Not even the funniest.

Casey 1:02:13 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:02:13 Just the nas- what's gonna get, like, what-what's gonna get me the most likes today?

Chris Williamson 1:02:16 I think you'd be s- I really think you'd be surprised, man. I think maybe some people that have that trolling mentality-

Casey 1:02:22 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 1:02:22 ... may constantly have, "Is this an opportunity to troll-"

Casey 1:02:26 Yes.

Chris Williamson 1:02:26 ... in the back of their mind.

Danny T 1:02:27 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:28 I don't think that any of the stuff that you see like that, the real vitriol comments, I don't think any of them are considered.

Casey 1:02:34 No. Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 1:02:34 I think they're all visceral. I think they're all just a bang, that response.

Danny T 1:02:36 I think a lot of times, like, they don't even mean them either. They don't, they're not even like-

Chris Williamson 1:02:39 Well, they just say it.

Danny T 1:02:40 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:40 It's just a thing. And this is, for never in human history have all of the things that we've said been recorded, ever. Right now, this conversation should, if it wasn't for technology, just between us three and the two guys behind the camera.

Danny T 1:02:54 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:54 That's what it should be.

Danny T 1:02:56 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:56 But now we have technology that allows us to do that, and you have the lack of friction that means that you can say something 24 hours a day that is recorded-

Danny T 1:03:04 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:03:04 ... forever on the internet. You know, and we're seeing this, so the Caroline Flack situation that's occurred this weekend. Um, The Sun had put a particular article up about her, and then as soon as-

Danny T 1:03:15 Deleted the articles.

Chris Williamson 1:03:16 They, they took the article down as soon as they realized they could get some free traffic.

Casey 1:03:19 And that's the thing I think, like, particularly with media, like, publications like that. The fact it's, I think Idris Elba done a very good quote about this where he said, you know, "People don't really care whether it..." No, it was Denzel Washington. It was like, "People don't really care if it's true or not. They just wanna be first. Like, see it and say it."

Chris Williamson 1:03:35 Mm-hmm.

Casey 1:03:35 So, I think particularly for The Sun newspaper, it's what headline is gonna sell the most articles. It doesn't matter if it's true, 'cause they just need people to read it.

Chris Williamson 1:03:42 Mm-hmm.

Casey 1:03:42 And they know they can get away with a small apology afterwards.

Danny T 1:03:45 And it's a lot worse now than it used to be. Like, there's so much clickbait out there. Like, people read the headlines and go, "Oh my God, it's gonna snow sheep tomorrow."

Chris Williamson 1:03:54 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:03:54 "Sheep are gonna drop from the ground," and when it a- what it'll actually say is, the article will be about some wallpaper-

Chris Williamson 1:04:00 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:04:01 ... of sheep falling from the sky that's actually a picture. But the headlines grip people, and sometimes they don't even read that deep into it. They're just like-

Casey 1:04:08 Because there's so much information-

Danny T 1:04:08 And they believe everything that's onli- like, everything that's online.

Chris Williamson 1:04:12 Didn't, didn't someone do a troll of this where they said, like, um, this huge, big article that got re-shared tons, and it said 89% of people don't read past the first, first, uh, headline of an article. Then the rest of it was explaining how that was a lie.

Casey 1:04:25 (laughs)

Danny T 1:04:26 (laughs) That's amazing.

Chris Williamson 1:04:28 And you're just like, yeah, it's just people that grab a link and re-share it.

Danny T 1:04:31 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:04:31 Um, but yeah, you know, I... It's, it's challenging for me to see the things that I do online. So, you're someone who's got exposed to more incoming social media than most n- normal people will do. What are some of the strategies you use to deal with that? Is it just ignore? Is it-

Danny T 1:04:53 Let, let Ca- let Casey d- let Casey see it-

Chris Williamson 1:04:54 (laughs)

Danny T 1:04:54 ... and not me?

Chris Williamson 1:04:55 Outsour- outsource it to someone else.

Danny T 1:04:56 I don't wanna see it. I don't wanna see it. Whether it's positive or not, like-

Chris Williamson 1:05:00 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:05:00 ... I'm not putting it out there for people... If I read 100 comments of, "Oh my God, it's amazing, I love you." Like, although that makes me feel amazing, that's not the reason I'm doing it.

Chris Williamson 1:05:10 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:05:10 I'm putting it out there 'cause I thoroughly enjoy it and I want it to continue, this journey that I'm on. It's like, so for me to not see the positive comments means that I don't see the negative comments. That's absolutely fine.

Chris Williamson 1:05:22 Price you're prepared to pay.

Casey 1:05:23 And what's the, and what's other point I think you, going back to what you said in the very, very beginning about, you know, I think the real support from Danny's following comes from the people that come see him in the shows. And the fact that people are there appreciating what he does firsthand, like, that's where you can get your satisfaction. It's not from people, like, commenting or anything like that, but the fact that people are willing to spend their hard-earned money and see you as a source of entertainment and, you know, they're there supporting you at your shows, et cetera.

Chris Williamson 1:05:48 Mm-hmm.

Casey 1:05:48 That's a much easier metric for you to gauge how successful you're, you are.

Chris Williamson 1:05:53 What I-

Casey 1:05:54 As opposed to sitting there reading loads of comments of how many likes you got on a video.

Chris Williamson 1:05:57 Yeah, yeah. For sure.

Danny T 1:05:57 I, I used to reply to, like, if some- something was bad or I didn't agree with it. I did, like, a few years ago-

Chris Williamson 1:06:05 Stabbing.

Danny T 1:06:05 ... I would reply, like... I remember once, and this is what kinda changed it. I won't say where, which club it was, but I was playing in a club. And someone DM'd, uh, messaged me on, they were on Snapchat. I wasn't even on, like, Instagram or anything. It was a private message on Snapchat saying, um, "You fat bastard. I've just paid a ten," as if I'd just paid a ten- a tenner, "to come in here and see you. You're getting stabbed when you leave here."

Chris Williamson 1:06:33 Nice message.

Danny T 1:06:34 And I replied saying, bearing in mind his username was his full name.

Chris Williamson 1:06:40 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:06:40 I replied. I s- I sh- I sent it, I showed it straight to the manager who was stood next to me. And he went, "Right, he's banned from here. I'll find out who he is. Pub watch, whatever, we'll make sure his name not getting..." So I literally replied saying, um, "Congratulations, mate. You've just got yourself banned for life." And that was it. That's all I replied saying. The next day, he screenshotted that and put it on Twitter, saying my reply. He didn't put what he'd said.And then his, his comment was, "All I did was call him a fat bastard and look at the response. Ha ha ha."

Chris Williamson 1:07:13 No, no, it weren't that, it was he said he didn't like it.

Danny T 1:07:14 500 likes?

Chris Williamson 1:07:15 He said that he didn't like your set and that you'd got him banned.

Danny T 1:07:17 Oh, right. Yeah, yeah. Y- y- yeah, it was something like, oh, yeah, he put up the screenshot of that, but he said all I said was I didn't like his set.

Chris Williamson 1:07:24 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:07:24 Or something like that.

Chris Williamson 1:07:26 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:07:26 And my reply was completely not to that whatsoever.

Chris Williamson 1:07:30 Mm-hmm.

Danny T 1:07:30 Did you get your screenshot and then put it in?

Chris Williamson 1:07:31 You can't. You couldn't quote tweet with a screenshot then, so what did I, what could I do?

Danny T 1:07:35 Yeah, okay.

Chris Williamson 1:07:35 And it had vanished by then anyway.

Danny T 1:07:37 I get it, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:07:38 I was literally like-

Danny T 1:07:39 Bitch.

Chris Williamson 1:07:40 Like, it, I think it only g- I think it got, like, 300 likes, his actual thing, but-

Danny T 1:07:44 Not good.

Chris Williamson 1:07:44 ... to me, that was 300 people that hated me and were happy to see my demise.

Danny T 1:07:48 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 1:07:48 And from that day I was like, "I, I can't see this stuff. It's, it's gonna stop me from doing something I love because of people that are not benefiting me in any way anyway."

Danny T 1:07:57 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 1:07:58 So if you care about the people that don't love what you do, like, that's the wrong energy. You don't need to focus your energy on-

Danny T 1:08:04 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 1:08:04 ... battling the people that are never gonna love what you do or benefit your career in any way, or ... Do you think being, like, authen- like, being sort of authentically vulnerable in the sense of appreciating that, you know, not everyone is gonna love what you do and you're okay with that.

Danny T 1:08:19 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:08:19 Like, the journey that we're kind of on, it's like there's obviously people that aren't gonna like it,