How To Overcome The Worst Pain Of Your Life - Jeremy Renner

Chris Williamson 0:00 Are you sick of people asking you how you are?

Jeremy Renner 0:03 No, no, no. I mean, I, I, it's, it, it's, well, there's a real, uh, honest answer that comes behind it, right? Um, whether they're asking or not, you know, you get a real honest answer.

Chris Williamson 0:13 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 0:14 And, um, and, and sometimes, it's in the inopportune times. I remember, I was doing a, uh, podcast, and, but it was over Zoom, right? And the technical issues that were happening to set it up, and the thing, and then ha- what mic to use and how to use this. I mean, I was, I'm not the tech guy. And I was getting very frustrated, and I was getting probably pretty hangry. And like, the beginning of this podcast was probably pretty awful. I was quite, quite a (censored) . (laughs)

Chris Williamson 0:39 (laughs)

Jeremy Renner 0:40 But, but they ask you... Look, I'm sorry, I'm just gonna work through this and the thing, I'm not good with tech. And it, I di- I just, I di- I just have this real, realist, honest way to kind of live. So I'm not sick, in the long, long, the long way to answer this. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not really s- sick of people asking how I am 'cause I just really do tell them. And if they do care about, you know, if it's, if, if it's, uh, about the recovery or if it's about just sort of my, my health or even mental health.

Chris Williamson 1:04 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:05 You know, I, I, I don't care what, how they intend it.

Chris Williamson 1:08 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 1:08 I'm, I, I just sort of explain kinda how I am in a really truthful, honest way. And it's quite beautiful.

Chris Williamson 1:13 Have you always been like that?

Jeremy Renner 1:15 Um, I've always been pretty, pretty direct. But I don't think I'd be as open and revealing. I'm much more open and revealing because of having to focus on myself so much.

Chris Williamson 1:27 Why do you think that is? No time to obfuscate or sort of play the social moray game?

Jeremy Renner 1:34 Yeah, I was never good at that, man. I'm like, I, um, I'm in a crowd of people, I'll get anxiety. And, you know, uh, I'd have to, like, medicate with, like, you know, alcohol or something to sort of calm the nerves of being around so many people.

Chris Williamson 1:46 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:47 Um, I was thinking if there's gonna be a fire, so many people are gonna die and people are gonna get hurt.

Chris Williamson 1:51 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 1:52 People, people are kind of terrible to each other in large crowds.

Chris Williamson 1:54 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 1:55 They get... The more people in a room, the, the respect level for humanity kinda diminishes.

Chris Williamson 2:00 Yeah, the more humans there are, the less humane they are.

Jeremy Renner 2:02 Exactly.

Chris Williamson 2:02 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 2:03 And I just refuse to be in that environment 'cause I think it's disgusting. Uh, that behavior, I'm very affected by it and very sensitive to it.

Chris Williamson 2:10 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 2:10 So I just choose not to be in those environments.

Chris Williamson 2:14 It sounds like you've got, I don't know, a little bit of a nervous disposition. I think I would say that that's my kinda background too. Uh, th- uh, thinking, sometimes overthinking, uh, uh, looking for potential errors and issues. And maybe being a little bit sensitive to the energy of what's going on around you.

Jeremy Renner 2:30 Def- definitely very sensitive.

Chris Williamson 2:31 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 2:31 Always been an observer.

Chris Williamson 2:32 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 2:32 And, um, quite insular in kind of my thoughts and things. I'm not a, a talker and of, of small things. I can't really have any quite sm- small trivial talk.

Chris Williamson 2:43 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 2:44 Um, I certainly can have a good time, tell jokes and da da da, but most of the conversations I have are, are quite in depth or quite thoughtful-

Chris Williamson 2:51 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 2:51 ... um, or spiritual or psychological, um, emotionally driven, uh, connective sort of tissue.

Chris Williamson 2:57 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 2:58 Not just sort of like, "Let's just talk about," whatever, "the Starbucks order."

Chris Williamson 3:03 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 3:03 I mean, I just don't belong in that conversation. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 3:07 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 3:07 You know what I mean? But that's just me.

Chris Williamson 3:08 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 3:08 Right? So I just, you know, when I know those things about myself, I just try to put myself not in those situations so I don't set myself up to fail.

Chris Williamson 3:16 Is there a, a challenge with wanting that level of openness, that level of emotional connection, vulnerability, but also having an additional level of scrutiny? Lots and lots of attention, press, people caring. So it's kind of two things are a little bit at odds there.

Jeremy Renner 3:33 Yeah, but not now. Now, it used to be. Because, um, the, the platform was to be a, a famous person talking about a movie or some, some work you did. Well, it's just not that, right? I'm, I'm here today to talk a- about health and wellness and overcoming obstacles. And it's-

Chris Williamson 3:51 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 3:51 ... it's nothing more human than what I-

Chris Williamson 3:53 So it feels much more personal.

Jeremy Renner 3:54 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, it's more, I think, exciting 'cause I think there e- there are willing ears. I don't have to force, "Hey, I'm here to tell you about this Avenger movie. And here, I, I can't, I can't-"

Chris Williamson 4:08 It was wil- a lot of willing ears for the Avenger movies.

Jeremy Renner 4:09 Yeah, there was a lot of willing ears, but I couldn't really talk about anything. And then, you know, you're kinda, not that you're selling something, but you're kinda selling something.

Chris Williamson 4:16 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 4:16 This, I'm not, man. I really am not. And, and it's, it, there, there, there's, I think... I still am not sure how and why there is interest in something, in me dying and coming back, perhaps. (laughs) You know, I, I don't really know what's interesting. I could tell you why it's interesting to me. Well, you know why it's interesting to me? Is that I'm not fucking dead. That's why it's really cool, man.

Chris Williamson 4:41 Mm-hmm, yeah.

Jeremy Renner 4:42 (laughs) I don't know for anybody else.

Chris Williamson 4:43 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 4:43 They're still alive, they're all doing great. For me, I'm happy just to kind of m- keep moving through my days and g- and getting better. And that's really exciting to me. That makes me feel quite alive.

Chris Williamson 4:52 Did it feel... It, it sounds like one of the byproducts of movie stardom is a bit of constriction then.

Jeremy Renner 5:00 Mm.

Chris Williamson 5:00 A level of constraint that must be day-to-day, "Hello, sir, you need to be awake in the trailer at this time. We need to have you in hair and makeup by then. These are the lines, these are the scenes, this is sit in the seat. Hang on. Sorry, the DP's fucked it again, you're gonna have to sit back down for another 90 minutes while he tries to fix the lighting."

Jeremy Renner 5:15 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 5:16 But then as you spread out into the public world as well, it's, well, this is pretty carefully controlled. We need to be focused toward the movie, like box office, box office, box office.

Jeremy Renner 5:24 Mm, mm.

Chris Williamson 5:24 In that way, has this been a, uh, sort of break glass moment that's allowed you to sort of really step outside of yourself and not feel so constrained by just being the movie person?

Jeremy Renner 5:37 Yeah, yeah. I mean, and it's been that way for a minute, but now there's sort of a, a, a sort of byproduct of this change, uh, this shift from, you know, being famous for XYZ, whatever it is for people. And then now, it kind of wipes a- wipes away, at least temporarily, that it's more about the man that, that I am-

Chris Williamson 5:59 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 5:59 ... but I've overcome some obstacles.... and not that I, I have a fake bow and arrow in a, in a movie, you know? It's, uh, it, it's something much more real and something really quite tender and beautiful. Uh, I get these amazing, um, exchanges on the street instead of like, the rude sort of in the middle of spaghetti dinner, you know, with my daughter taking selfies that, that I owe them apparently. It's now like, "Well, glad you're here. Um, you fought through something really amaz-" da, da, da, whatever, that's like really thoughtful, amazing, almost like sort of fortune cookie lines of like just beautiful, um, sentiments that, that are connective and not like, "I deserve a selfie."

Chris Williamson 6:39 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 6:40 It's, it's really flipped on its head and it's quite beautiful. It's-

Chris Williamson 6:43 They see you, not the character.

Jeremy Renner 6:44 Yeah, yeah. And that's what makes this kind of exchange so great. I don't know, I have no idea what I'm t- t- going to talk about or have anything really to say except I can have a conversation about real things.

Chris Williamson 6:56 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 6:56 And the view of certain things, you know, you write down like, "Oh, I think this is interesting," or, "Let's talk about this," and, um, I can do that because I, like all I have to do is be me, and that's, that's the coolest thing to be. (laughs) But I don't typically get to do that because I'm out, like you were saying. Is it some other sort of, kinda like when, when your life's planned out every 10 minutes and, you know, you get a bathroom break and I can, I can be me and go to the bathroom.

Chris Williamson 7:18 Hang on, your bathroom breaks are scheduled?

Jeremy Renner 7:20 (laughs) Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:21 You're kidding.

Jeremy Renner 7:21 Sometimes they're not. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 7:23 Right, okay.

Jeremy Renner 7:23 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:23 Just hold it in.

Jeremy Renner 7:24 Especially like, on press tours and things like that, yeah, yeah. (laughs) It's pretty, it's pretty crazy but, you know, do the things you love, man. That's it. Just do the things I love and don't worry about it.

Chris Williamson 7:36 I, uh, I wonder how many... (laughs) I wonder how many other guys and girls from your industry have this sort of odd cathartic daydream of something happening to them that kind of relinquishes the-

Jeremy Renner 7:52 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 7:52 I'm not s-

Jeremy Renner 7:54 Yeah, I know. Fuel, fuel up the guesswork. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:56 What is it, what is it that you really admire about Jeremy's career?

Jeremy Renner 7:58 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:58 Well, you know, the Avengers thing was all right, but that bit where he got run over by the snowplow-

Jeremy Renner 8:02 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 8:02 ... that really was peak moment.

Jeremy Renner 8:03 Yeah. It is, it is, it really is, man. I mean, I highly recommend it. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 8:07 Mm-hmm, yep.

Jeremy Renner 8:07 You know, at least if the outcome is, is my outcome.

Chris Williamson 8:10 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 8:11 Um, I don't recommend it, right? It's, it's excruciating.

Chris Williamson 8:13 Hmm.

Jeremy Renner 8:14 Um, but the amount of gifts that came from such a thing, I think, are, um, I guess to me, I mean, it's, it's all my, my life is and, and what it, what i- with filled with gratitude and love and, and truth and, um, pure joy. Like, it, it's just really clear, like all the white noise is gone and for, st- for, for someone to have that in their life, do you have to die to do it? No. It's part of the reason why I wrote the book. There's a lot of things I did learn and maybe other people can.

Chris Williamson 8:43 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 8:43 And you know, there's a lot of people that struggle. I got some life hacks to help you with struggle and pain-

Chris Williamson 8:48 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 8:49 ... and, um, pain management, um, all those type of things. Like, uh, but, e- even as a famous person, there is some like probably, I think could be some envious things too, like you said, from it 'cause there was a lot of great things that, that came from such a horrific moment.

Chris Williamson 9:05 Hm.

Jeremy Renner 9:06 But I'd, again, I'd, I'd do it again in two seconds for the right reason.

Chris Williamson 9:09 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 9:10 I'd probably not jump back on that machine this time. Uh, I don't know what I'd do. I'd probably-

Chris Williamson 9:16 What were you, what were you actually trying to do? You were trying to stop it from hitting...

Jeremy Renner 9:21 To crush, from crushing, uh, my nephew.

Chris Williamson 9:23 Your nephew.

Jeremy Renner 9:24 Yeah, yeah, from this big giant snow blade and just going towards him and he was at the truck that was perpendicular and just gonna, just gonna crush him.

Chris Williamson 9:30 Mm-hmm. So you jumped up to get in the cockpit?

Jeremy Renner 9:33 I jumped. To try to stop it.

Chris Williamson 9:34 Right.

Jeremy Renner 9:34 'Cause it knocked me off.

Chris Williamson 9:35 Pull, pull some-

Jeremy Renner 9:36 Yeah, it knocked me off and it hit the wrong button and knocked me off and it went forward on him. I'm off on, I'm off on the machine, so the machine's running on its own now.

Chris Williamson 9:44 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 9:45 That's never happened. So, yeah. Yeah, so I probably wouldn't jump back on the machines. (laughs) Or maybe I would, you know?

Chris Williamson 9:52 Yeah, well-

Jeremy Renner 9:52 You don't, you don't get the opportunity to think and reflect back on what you do, you know? You just do it or don't. And I'd rather it be me than my nephew.

Chris Williamson 9:59 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 9:59 You know what I mean? I don't wanna deal with like the haunting images of, on New Year's Day of my nephew split in half, you know?

Chris Williamson 10:06 Yeah. It's strange thinking about these people that come up to you and they see you, they see something that's really true to you.

Jeremy Renner 10:13 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 10:14 And I don't know, I wonder how many people, how many other people, even if it's not as performative as being an actor, have this sense of having to show up as someone.

Jeremy Renner 10:24 Hm.

Chris Williamson 10:24 And when someone comes up and says, "Well done," there's a degree of hollowness to the praise because this is me, but it's me as a performer. It's not me, right?

Jeremy Renner 10:35 Right.

Chris Williamson 10:35 I'm aware that this is an artistic outlet for you, it's a calling that you have in life. You, you, somebody who's a musician, somebody who's a, a, a, a, a presentation, a coach that goes into businesses, somebody who's a PT or whatever.

Jeremy Renner 10:46 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 10:46 You know, "I really loved what you did with my wife's, get her transformation for her wedding," or whatever it is, "Thank you so much." It's like yeah, yeah, yeah, but like, what about me?

Jeremy Renner 10:54 Yeah, yeah, well there is that.

Chris Williamson 10:55 There's me, there's a me, there's-

Jeremy Renner 10:55 You, you just have to... Yeah, look, if you, there, there's, there's great things that come with being famous and it allows a lot of freedoms and a lot of ch- more choices as for hopefully doing you, something you love to do. Hopefully you're not famous for like being a serial killer or something, right? But being f- you know, in the, in the world, if you're a famous football player or whatever the heck it is, you, you just have to sort of, um, take, take, you know... Yeah, that's gonna be a feeling. You're not gonna be seen and witnessed. But how, and how they see you like, I like to be... I'm glad I'm seen as the at least, um, they're picking out the right roles.

Chris Williamson 11:25 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 11:26 "Oh, I love you in this, I love you in The Hurt Locker, I love you in The Town, I love you in..." You're not picking out something from, you know, back in '94 or something.

Chris Williamson 11:32 Yep, yep.

Jeremy Renner 11:32 You're picking out the right ones. I'm like, "Good, I'm glad you like me for those ones. I'm happy about those movies too."

Chris Williamson 11:36 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 11:36 And yeah, there's, there's... I don't take emptiness with it. Like I look at it from like...... it, it's- you have to sort of, uh, filter through, uh, this is what they know you as.

Chris Williamson 11:49 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 11:49 You know what I mean? And not, and, and then you go- at, at the end of the day, there's too much of it. You're like, "Okay, look, I just need to..." I can only have so much tolerance in, to, to deal with, okay, I'm still a human being. I can't, I'm just not this cardboard cutout of me, right, that people know me as. So that's why, you know, I just, but I make decisions about that. Like, I'll stay home more often, or I, I have, unless I have a lot of tolerance in my tank of tolerance-

Chris Williamson 12:11 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 12:11 ... to like, so I can emotionally accept this.

Chris Williamson 12:14 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 12:14 And have my time, and I'm touched and pulled and fingered and all sorts of weird things happen. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 12:20 It's not a-

Jeremy Renner 12:21 You gotta have enough tolerance to-

Chris Williamson 12:23 To be fingered.

Jeremy Renner 12:24 Yeah, to be fingered. Now I don't get... I don't... I, yeah, it's not so bad now. I think people look at me, or at least I feel like they look at me with more fragility, so they don't come in, like, throw me around or, like, smash me around a bit-

Chris Williamson 12:36 Oh, of course.

Jeremy Renner 12:36 ... and pull me. Um, it feels a little different now, which is, which is great. I'm gra- I'm great.

Chris Williamson 12:42 Okay.

Jeremy Renner 12:42 Happy about that.

Chris Williamson 12:43 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 12:44 So-

Jeremy Renner 12:45 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 12:45 I, I, the kind of elephant in the room, I guess, and I, I didn't know that you'd gone through your accident.

Jeremy Renner 12:51 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 12:51 I didn't know that that had happened. I was like-

Jeremy Renner 12:53 Right.

Chris Williamson 12:53 ... you know, I, they, yeah, Jeremy must have... He did the... And then he did a series, and then The Avengers finished, and then maybe that come back, there's a series for that. And, oh, yeah, just, you know, you kind of weren't there, and then you were. So if you hadn't seen this bit in between, if you'd just been watching, like, the wrong kind of headlines-

Jeremy Renner 13:10 Right, right.

Chris Williamson 13:10 ... nothing would have occurred.

Jeremy Renner 13:11 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 13:12 Uh, so for the people that sort of weren't aware of what happened, it has something to do with a snowplow. Can you give the, the, the overview?

Jeremy Renner 13:18 Yeah, the over- overview. Um, it was, it's a, um, uh, well... (laughs) I don't know what overview (laughs) . It was hard enough to recount to write the book, you know?

Chris Williamson 13:31 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 13:31 (laughs) But the, the, it was, now, now I got to write the trailer.

Chris Williamson 13:35 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 13:35 Okay, so... (laughs) The setting's in Lake Tahoe, and, uh, it's New Year's, and we always have my family, uh, in New Year's. And we were snowed in for a few days, um, sort of Armageddon, Snowmageddon we called it, type of, type of thing. So we had no power, no electricity, no nothing. And we were having a great time, but New Year's Day was gonna be sunny, so I had to clear the driveway so we can get out and get some fresh air and that type of thing. And, uh, in the mountains, uh, you know, it's j- you're at 8,000 feet elevation, you get a ton of snow. So we have, like, probably 10, 12 feet of snow. So that's like sand, you know, you gotta move this stuff to kind of get it out. We're supposed to go skiing and all that stuff. Ends up hav- I'm taking the snowcat, which is used. A snowcat, if you don't know what it is, it's like a, like a tank. It moves on the snow. It's about 16,000 pounds wet, and it's got a big shovel in the front of it, and it usually drags behind it, you know, stuff. But it's like, like a tank, and it turns like a tank or a skid steer. Um, so it's pretty nimble. And it floats on the snow, 'cause it has these steel tracks, and they're wide. So, kind of like snowshoes, if you will, right, so you don't sink in it. But, which is great for that, but when we took it up to the d- end of the driveway, which is about a half mile long, we were taking cars that were stuck in the snow and things that were buried. You don't even know what's underneath all that snow. So, you have to be ver- very careful. So we're dragging all this stuff out of there so we have a driveway so we have access to maybe go get food, supplies, something, anything, right? So, we, we take the snowcat and drag all the stuff out. The final one was my truck, and we got it to, to the top of the, the mountain where there's a plowed driveway, and where it's hard, and we can actually, can maneuver a bit better. And then my nephew, this takes the help of my nephew, Alex. And, um, so, and we've done this a thousand times. I mean, it's, this is like mowing the lawn for us up there in the mountains. It was just a, we're on this, it's kind of a slope, and it was very icy, and we were sliding, and I didn't like that I was sliding towards him as he was trying to unhook a chain from this giant machine. And, uh, so I turned it around to try to talk to him, and couldn't see him, and I was sliding towards him, so I backed up. But again, you have to understand this machine. You have to see this machine to understand it, but you have to step on these giant tracks, the things that roll and move, to get in and out of the machine anyway. There's no other pla-

Chris Williamson 16:00 There's no little ladder.

Jeremy Renner 16:01 There's no platform. There's no ladder. There's no nothing. You just have to jump onto the giant metal tracks, and then you jump into the cab to start driving this thing, right? Kind of a design flaw, if you ask me, 'cause it's- (laughs) 'Cause it's really unsteady. Anyway... (laughs) It's not really a pedestrian, uh, type of vehicle. This is a commercial for, commercial vehicle for, for, uh, ski slopes, right?

Chris Williamson 16:28 Right.

Jeremy Renner 16:28 So it's not something-

Chris Williamson 16:29 Typically people aren't hopping in, hopping out-

Jeremy Renner 16:30 Right, right.

Chris Williamson 16:30 ... unhooking a whatever.

Jeremy Renner 16:32 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 16:32 It's a shift.

Jeremy Renner 16:32 Yeah, exactly. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 16:34 Yeah, yeah.

Jeremy Renner 16:34 And, uh, so it was just one of those things. You have to step out to try to talk to him, to hear him, and all these things at any rate. And there's a little toggle switch on the steering column. That's what'll move it forwards and backwards and, and put it in neutral. And I just keep going backwards, just so I could, I don't slide into him, 'cause I can't really see him. And then in doing so, I'm stepping on the tracks, hit the button wrong, it threw me off, and now the machine's rushing towards him. I have no idea. I know he's within, between the truck, and that's 10 feet away. I get up as quick as I can, and I just quickly jump back on this machine, or try to jump back in the cab, leaping up and over three feet, these spinning tracks. And then, you know, I don't make it, and I get caught underneath this machine, and it crushes me and rolls over like a tank would run over a log. It's just, you know, doesn't think.

Chris Williamson 17:23 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 17:24 Does it? And, uh, and it didn't crush my nephew, which is great, but, uh... (laughs)

Chris Williamson 17:33 That would have been a real double whammy.

Jeremy Renner 17:35 Oh, yeah, that would have been terrible. Yeah, I mean, it's, yeah. Yeah, would my body slow it down a little bit? Probably-

Chris Williamson 17:41 (laughs)

Jeremy Renner 17:41 Probably not. Probably not. This thing's, this thing will climb up a tree. This thing, it's, it's gnarly.

Chris Williamson 17:46 Fuck.

Jeremy Renner 17:47 The power of this machine is, is quite insane. It's, it's impressive. You need it. It's the only thing that'll kind of operate in the, that kind of snow, that kind of...... just kind of crazy conditions.

Chris Williamson 17:57 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 17:57 And so, at any rate, um, you can, you can edit this the way you want. But then it, it... The end of the... I break, like, 38 bones, my skull cracks open and I, my eyeball comes out. I can see my eyeball with my other eye. Uh, I can't breathe. I'm awake the whole time during this thing. And I have to survive for 45 minutes on the ice till I get heli-lifted out of there. And, uh, a lot of the book is about... Tells you about that experience-

Chris Williamson 18:22 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 18:22 ... because there's a lot of things. There's the death and coming back, and, uh, there's a lot. There's a lot of mindset stuff, a lot of, uh, fortitude. Mental acuity is what got me through. The physical and... I mean, there's a lot of things that got me through.

Chris Williamson 18:37 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 18:38 But the, the power of the mind and the body is wonderfully responsive to your thoughts to heal itself, to hurt itself, whatever. But it's, uh, it's, uh, pretty, pretty amazing what the mind can do.

Chris Williamson 18:54 Did you have a practice? Uh, so, uh, m- meditation?

Jeremy Renner 18:58 Oh, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 18:58 But did you have this prior?

Jeremy Renner 19:00 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 19:00 Right. Okay.

Jeremy Renner 19:01 Yeah. I-

Chris Williamson 19:01 How, how do you think this situation would have been different or how well do you think that your practices in advance contributed?

Jeremy Renner 19:10 It's, it's hard, it's hard to know. I mean, that's why I had to reflect. I mean, that's one thing that was very cathartic about this book, is just reflecting back on what prepared me for that situation. I've been in... Not near-death experience situations before, but I've been in, like, um, high-adrenaline situations.

Chris Williamson 19:28 Do your own stunts.

Jeremy Renner 19:28 How do you react?

Chris Williamson 19:29 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 19:29 Or just how do you react to, like, things that... You know, car crash or something, someone gets hit on the freeway and what do you do or... You, you either react or, you know, you, you go into shock, or how people deal with the flow of adrenaline rush through their body, right? And I've always been challenged and I've always come out clear-headed in all those adrenaline rush situations. So it's hard to know because that's how I've always been. I like roller coasters, but I'm not, like, a thrill junkie really, right? I'm not, like, an adrenaline junkie, but it's just... I just know how my mind reacts in those situations. I'm always very, very clear-headed about it and an actionable person. So that helped. And then, um, you know, there was, like, breathing. Breathing was like... You see meditation. Well, I was in lamaze class when I was 12 years old when my mom was pregnant. So, and that... All lamaze is, is preparation for birthing a child. Man- mitigating, you know, pain, managing your pain as you... You know, it's very, very painful for a woman as she's giving birth. So you use these short breaths and all these sort of things, mental... Eating ice chips and keeping their attention away from their cervix, right? (laughs) Right? And do all these sort of things. I learned that at 12. I lear- didn't know that that was going to save my life on the ice as I got ran over by a snow cat, right? (laughs)

Chris Williamson 20:41 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 20:42 But that was huge in it. That's all I was trying to do. Look, if you can't breathe, what are you gonna do? Look for your next breath. You need to breathe. I saw my eye, I'll worry about that later. I saw my twisted legs, I'll worry about that later. That'll hurt. Then, then I have to find my next breath or this is all... I'm a goner, right? Everything will start failing. I'll lose consciousness, my organs will fail, I'm dead.

Chris Williamson 21:05 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 21:06 So, you know. Yeah, there's a lot of things I think prepared me, but I can only reflect. I can't say for certainty, right? How could we?

Chris Williamson 21:13 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 21:13 Um, but yeah, I think there were a lot of things that, uh, that prepared me. But it was definitely the mental thing. Do anything, you know, even into the recovery. It's like, it's, it's... The only thing you have control of is your perception of something. That is it. You think you can control your body, you think you can control something, but it starts with your brain and your mind and, and your, your spirit, of what you believe in, what you see, how you see something is all in your control. It's... And I'm not, like, the half glass, half empty kind of dude, right? But it's a version of that. I could have made it... I could have whined and complained and like, "Oh, God, I'm never gonna work again as an actor." None of that. I didn't care about any of that, right? That had no value to me. The value was the, the mental acuity to, to get through, to find my next breath, to zoom out so big and so wide and I keep my perspective there. I live in a very comfortable, loving, pure life with a... Where I oversimplify the simplicity of life because it is just that simple.

Chris Williamson 22:21 In other news, this episode is brought to you by Momentous. If your workouts feel flat, your recovery is slow, or you've just been feeling off, it might not be your training plan or diet. It might be something a bit more boring, like your testosterone. So if you're not performing in the gym or the bedroom the way that you want or you just want to naturally improve your testosterone, Tongkat Ali is a fantastic research-backed place to start. And when this is stacked with zinc, it can make a huge improvement in testosterone production, strength, recovery, and energy, which is why I'm such a huge fan of Momentous's zinc. It supports testosterone, boosts vitality, and helps keep everything running like it should. And if you're still unsure, Momentous offers a 30-day money-back guarantee. So you can buy it and try it for 29 days, and if you don't love it, they'll give you your money back. Plus they ship internationally. Right now you can get 35% off your first subscription and that 30-day money-back guarantee by going to the link in the description below or heading to livemomentous.com/modernwisdom and using the code "MODERNWISDOM" at checkout. That's L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S... (laughs) E-N-T-O-U-S... L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S dot com slash MODERNWISDOM, that's MODERNWISDOM at checkout. How long did that 45 minutes feel?

Jeremy Renner 23:32 Hmm. Wow. It was probably the first 25 that were the toughest 'cause I don't think, I don't think an EMT or fire department can get there until, like, the first half hour. So the first half hour is rough, and I died in that time because I got tired. I just got... Because doing... The, the equivalent of breathing that we all don't even think about breathing, it's not even conscious, right? It's just sort of reflexive. It just happens in our body.... but I had to, like, work. And it was like doing, like, a one-arm pushup. It took s- every piece of physical energy I could do- Mm-hmm. ... just to exhale a little bit, so I could get a little bit more back in. I was suffocating. Yeah. It felt like- It- It felt like drowning. I mean, uh, yeah, in a way. Yeah, yeah. I was still getting air. You can't do that under water. Mm-hmm. But I was, it was, I was like a boa constrictor kind of feeling. Like, it just squeezes more. You start, blow out air, it's squeezing you. And it's because my whole ribcage, my shoulder, all this side of me was, just collapsed on my lung. It was already collapsed. And so I was suffocating myself. So I got, once I had my nephew lift my arm up enough to lift my ribcage off my lung, I could get a little bit more air in. Mm-hmm. It wasn't like suffocating so much. Mm-hmm. So I can... It was still excruciating, but to breathe was quite, quite the effort. And if, if you, just to take deep breaths for a minute, you, you feel lightheaded and you might pass out. But like this is just, it's just, it was just exhausting. And with each exhale, exhalation, and then inhalation, it was just like... So did it feel long? I don't know. I can't answer that. It was just like, I was waiting for my next breath. I ne- was never sure it was gonna happen, but I was gonna will it to happen. But you got tired. And I got tired. And that's when I... That's when I... I just, it, everything just started slowing. And actually, probably I guess maybe it felt like a long time, 'cause it'd start, things started to get slow. And consciousness was, there, the neighbors got here by this point. Um, a lot of things transpired. Um, it was me and my two neighbors I never met, and my, my nephew Alex there, for the first half hour. They're on the phone call with 911, whenever, and, um, trying to, they were trying to do everything they can to keep me alive. And yeah, I just got tired, and that's when I was gone. And then came back. And I was pissed about it. (laughs) And I did- I saw my eyeball again. I'm like, "Oh!" 'Cause it was so great. I'm like, "Oh, it was so great! I was having such a good time!" (laughs) 'Cause I, 'cause I was going, 'cause I did sort of r- regulate breathing, and then it just started to slow. The heart rate started to low- th- slow. It was like 18 beats per minute. It was, it wasn't just sort of like I just croaked, right? I just kind of, it was just smoothly into it. Gently away. And it's like, yeah, just gently away. And like, later, everyone. It was great. And then something brought me back. Psych! Goddammit. And I saw my eyeball again. I'm like, "Oh, dude! (laughs) I'm in this busted body. I'm in this busted body again." I'm like, "All right. Here we go. Just get back into it." So it wasn't, uh, no one was... I mean, the CPR would've ............................ No. Yeah. No, no, no, no. It wa- it wasn't for very long. It was only like probably, you know, you know, my neighbor... 'Cause it just happened to my neighbor the day before when she saw her uncle die. What? Yeah. Or, yeah, I think it was her uncle. Or no, it wasn't her brother. I think it was her uncle. And it just happened to her then. She, and she happened to be, worked in the medil- medical field anyway. So, it's kind of a great thing having kind of a nurse be your neighbor. (laughs) Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But, um, yeah. She said, "You're, yeah, I saw, I saw you go." And, uh, yeah, 'cause all, your face turns all these colors and it's like a lizard or chameleon or something. At any rate, um, so I don't think it was gone for very long, but it do- doesn't really matter, I suppose. Um, I guess, not long, not dead enough to have, you know, brain dead, you know, or whatever. I don't know. Maybe I'm brain dead now.

Jeremy Renner 27:34 (laughs) What does, uh... I've always, I've always wondered this. What does looking at your own eye look like? Uh, you know, it's, it's one of those, it's a queer situation. You know? Um, it just like if looking at your foot facing the wrong direction. And then your other leg, i- uh, that's not a joint. Mm-hmm. It was broken, shattered, like- Mm-hmm. ... they're just twisted all- Mm-hmm. ... like a pretzel. I knew that was supposed to hurt. Did it? No, it'll hurt later. I'll worry about that problem later. And just like the eye, I'm like, "Oh, man." And I, and I rolled my face on it. It's like, "Let, at least let me put that thing on ice." 'Cause I was like laying on the icy asphalt. So, "Let me ice that thing." You know? I thought about that, dude. Right? And I say, and it is funny, right? But that's what I thought about. I'm like, "Oh, do you think they'll let me put that on ice?" And then, and I had my nephew lift my arm just so I can breathe. There was like conscious, my hyper, hyper-focused conscious stuff- Mm-hmm. ... was to survive. So you had a lot of- And, and I, and I went through every checklist of my body. I have a strong, strong awareness of my body as well, as an athlete, as a stunt performer, also as an actor, 'cause it is my instrument to, to even act. So, I'm very, very aware of my body, how it works, the, all the things, so, to my knowledge. I don't know all the things, but at least I know the basics of how my body should operate. (laughs) So, I'm just constantly going through, like, you know, what it really initially felt like for my breathing was like when you get, when you lose your wind. You get kicked in the stomach or punched in the stomach. It's that suffocating trying to find your breath, right? It's what it sounds like on the 911 call. Just like this, "Uh, uh, uh, uh, uh." Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right? It's just you can't, can't get air in, right? So it's like you're cramping in your diaphragm. So I kept saying, "If I get this cramp out of my diaphragm, I can get a deep breath in." And I mean, this is, it's never coming. But I keep telling myself- Mm-hmm. ... "As long as, let me relax, let me relax. Let me see if I can just get this..." The immediate is get that b- air in. If you're not getting air in, your immediate thing you need in your life is air in. Right? Pretty obvious. So, start there. (laughs) So, just trying to work through that and getting my body to be in a place so I can get air in. Mm-hmm. And eventually, it got to that place where he had to hold it in a very specific, my arm up in a specific way so I can breathe. Mm-hmm. I could start regulating the painful way to now I, the new way I breathe. The one-arm pushup breathing type of thing. Lot of effort. And, uh, yeah. It's, uh, that... But all the mental part of that is, is, is the main thing that got me through initially. That sort of mental focus.No one was gonna help me breathe, no matter who was there, or who w- who could have done it or not, it, it, nobody could've. I was the only one that was gonna be able to make myself breathe, and, any way possible. No one knew exactly what was wrong (laughs) or how, how ............................ I was kind of flattened, my head's crushed, you know? There was blood everywhere. Um, so they're thinking a whole lot of different things. I'm like, "Fuck all y'all, I just need to breathe in, (laughs) so I can breathe out." I'd even use expletives, to help me laugh.

Chris Williamson 30:32 Didn't swear once?

Jeremy Renner 30:33 Oh, I sw- I said- I had all these, yeah, it was, it was hookers, whores, and hamburgers, that I would scream out 'cause of the, the huffing of the H sound, would, would make me laugh, "Huh, huh, hooker, whore," right? "Ha." I had to do that to get air out.

Chris Williamson 30:49 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 30:49 So I could suck air in, and also have a laugh, "That's my eyeball. That's my twisted-ass legs. Ah, yeah. I already died, what else needs to happen? Th- this is my body, it's my body, I'm owning it."

Chris Williamson 31:00 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 31:00 So, that's, those are the... Sense of humor I even had-

Chris Williamson 31:04 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 31:04 ... if you can, in that horrifying, you know, drawn-out 45 minutes. You know?

Chris Williamson 31:13 And then, you get o-

Jeremy Renner 31:14 There's just no, there's j- just no like, rule book, there's no like, (laughs) directions in like how to, how to overcome something like that, right? We're not taught how to do anything like that. It's, you-

Chris Williamson 31:22 You didn't have a blueprint beforehand?

Jeremy Renner 31:22 ... you just, you just do what you can do, what do you got?

Chris Williamson 31:26 (sighs)

Jeremy Renner 31:26 And every- say yes to everything, do whatever works, right?

Chris Williamson 31:28 It's fascinating how much mental clarity you had.

Jeremy Renner 31:31 Yeah, yeah. You had to. Had to. I was dead. If I passed out, I would've been dead. I wouldn't be sitting here. I'd be dead. They're too far high up in the mountains, no one could've gotten to me. Dead man.

Chris Williamson 31:43 Oh, of course, you're so high up in the mountains that even breathing normally, I imagine, is a little bit more difficult-

Jeremy Renner 31:48 Yeah, at 8,000 feet-

Chris Williamson 31:48 ... for most normal people.

Jeremy Renner 31:48 ... yeah, at 8,000 feet, yeah. So maybe my, my body's also prepared for it. I also have, um, you know, higher m- higher amounts of oxygen in my body, 'cause I do work on that stuff, and, but, eh, there's, there's no one thing. But the mental part of it was the one thing that did get me through, at least to the next exhalation.

Chris Williamson 32:03 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 32:04 And then that got me, it bought some time, you know. I came back for whatever reason, and then the, the paramedics got there shortly after, and then they had to, you know, do the crazy thing on your chest, they stab your chest, like it's some movie or something.

Chris Williamson 32:19 And what are they, they're trying to re-inflate the lung?

Jeremy Renner 32:22 I think, either that or release pressure.

Chris Williamson 32:25 Right.

Jeremy Renner 32:26 Don't ask me, I'm not, I'm not, I didn't go into the details of it.

Chris Williamson 32:29 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 32:29 Um, even after the fact. I had to worry about other things than the scar on my chest, I could care.

Chris Williamson 32:33 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 32:33 Couldn't care.

Chris Williamson 32:34 But they come out, it's the guy that's choking on something and they put the-

Jeremy Renner 32:37 Yeah, it was kind of like that thing.

Chris Williamson 32:38 ... the big pen in the neck thing.

Jeremy Renner 32:39 It's pretty much like that.

Chris Williamson 32:40 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 32:40 Yeah, and like, oh my God, that happened .......................... Um, but yeah, then they could also get, you know, uh, fentanyl and all that stuff into you and, and sort of mitigate the pain.

Chris Williamson 32:49 Oh, that's fun.

Jeremy Renner 32:50 Yeah, yeah. So I think that's when things got a lit- when they were st- when they started cutting my clothes off, I'm like, "I relinquish my duties now."

Chris Williamson 33:01 I'm in someone else's body.

Jeremy Renner 33:02 "And I give my body to you." 'Cause I did the best I could. And now like, you know, so they, I think they were already had me regulating my breathing or using a, a pump to kind of regulate the breathing a bit more so I didn't have to like consciously fight for every breath.

Chris Williamson 33:16 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 33:17 So th- I just said, "I give my body up. I'm done." And I just let them go for it. And thank God for them. And (laughs) one was my friend, or a friend of my friend. One of my best friends, uh, he was a firefighter. He is a firefighter, but he just retired. And then, the guy that had, that jabbed me and stuff, he had to call my buddy and be, "Look, we're just got hella lifted out of here. Sorry we did the best we could." (sighs) Dude. (laughs) You get that phone call, you know? Dude, brutal, man. So brutal that, uh, my friend had to get that phone call. But any rate, all these little, little moments that come, keep flooding back, talking about it, you know?

Chris Williamson 33:57 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 33:58 Uh, such great, they're all, all, it all represents love to me. You know? If I g- if I catch any feelings. If I, if I, um, like I don't get triggered with rage, I don't get triggered with disappointment or sadness, ever. It's a trigger with an overwhelming sense of love and gratitude. Something, um, I hope never goes away. I can't imagine it will.

Chris Williamson 34:26 Kind of like alchemy.

Jeremy Renner 34:28 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 34:29 To take something like that and to see all of the love that came pouring back in.

Jeremy Renner 34:35 Mm. Yeah. I mean, it's what's, it's the ultimate thing that got me through. It's the, oh, it's the only thing you take with you when you die, is the love. Such a beautiful, beautiful space, place. And a loving space. Mm.

Chris Williamson 34:59 And then you come back round, in the ICU, presume?

Jeremy Renner 35:01 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no (laughs) yeah, yeah. And, uh, I was pretty much, I was, you know, they had to put me in a coma. And, um, get to work. There was a lot of lifesaving stuff they had to do initially. Don't know about any of those things. Even just to this day, I don't know all the things that they had to do, probably don't care or want to know. You know? You had to (laughs) move my ball, eyeball back in. I know there's duct tape in my eye. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 35:25 (laughs)

Jeremy Renner 35:25 I mean, (laughs) again, whatever works, dude. I mean, what's in my body is just hammers and screw- hammered screws and a p- a pipe that they've hammered through my knee to down here and screws and plates and, it's very like sort of just carpentry work. So putting duct tape on my face to put, hold my eyeball back in, you know, i- is just as, you know, is just how you do it.

Chris Williamson 35:45 Gotta use what you've got.

Jeremy Renner 35:45 You use what you got. And that's what they had (laughs) . And that's what we did. And that's what worked. My eye, my vision in my left eye is better than my right eye now.

Chris Williamson 35:54 You're kidding?

Jeremy Renner 35:54 It's better. Yeah. It's amazing. (laughs) I don't recommend it. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 36:02 So, what I'm, what I'm interested in is when, uh, and you've sort of hinted at this already, when the pain starts to kick in.

Jeremy Renner 36:10 Yeah.Well, that was the initial... The, the, from, is all, all, all the, every, every synapse is firing. Every, everything in your brain has go- lit up because, or when you get crushed. Like everything was... I, I didn't, I never experienced a feeling like that in my life. It's like a, it's like if you hit a, your hammer on your thumb, and you're like, "Oh, motherfucker." But like on every inch of your body. It's like, what is going on? There's so much information, you don't know what to pay attention to.

Chris Williamson 36:40 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 36:41 So that was very confusing. The pain was everywhere, in everything, even like in your spirit. It's like everything was... You, you don't know what was going on. So it was very confusing. It was very bright. Um, a lot of flashing. You know, 'cause when, there, there was like a lightning strike that happened when my skull cracked and the, the eye came out. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 37:00 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 37:01 (laughs) It's so weird that I'm talking about this. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 37:03 Yep, yep. When my skull cracked and my eye came out.

Jeremy Renner 37:05 Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, 'cause they don't look like it happened, right? (laughs)

Chris Williamson 37:08 Yep, yep.

Jeremy Renner 37:09 Um, yeah, there was like a lightning strike, and then, you know, the, you start messing with... I don't know. It was, it was such an overload. It felt like it was like, you know, you gotta turn off the power, because there was an overload of information, overload of pain. All your nerve endings are like on fire. Like it was like fiery hot lava. It was like all these things were happening. So it's, and, and again, the worst part of it is like you, you got stepped on by an elephant and you can't breathe. That's sort of, you just can't breathe. That was the worst of it. It's like, who cares about the rest of this stuff? I mean, all of it hurt, but I don't even know what that is anymore. Like pain, pain became my bitch a long time ago.

Chris Williamson 37:48 How so?

Jeremy Renner 37:49 It, it's, it's 'cause it's, it's, uh, it's all a construct in your mind anyway. It's your body's way of saying, hey, it's trying to preserve itself. Your body tries to preserve itself by saying there's pain. Oh, that's hot, don't touch it. Or this is that, don't do this. Try this, right? So they're getting on you. This is not during the accident, this is after the accident, and I started to deal with pain in, in a different way. And I had, I, I wrote a whole chapter on it called The Agreement. You know, about, about how when you can re- neural pathways, you can change them for your brain. How I receive pain is different how I received it before. I can still stub my toe and, ow, motherfucker, yes, right? But I understand what it means, what the body's really trying to tell me. Like when the body gets a break, it instantly swells, tries to c- create its own cast, and do all these sort of things to protect itself. The body just tries to preserve itself. It's a miracle what the body does. It's fantastic. If you are in alliance in what the body's trying to do, and the body realizes, ah, you, you were listening to me. Okay, I won't bother you so much anymore. And that's where we became the agreement of like, you can't tell me that's painful anymore, because that's a b- metal, piece of metal now. You're not even a bone you can say that's broken. So I have to reprogram my brain from receiving those pain signals in that way, and it takes a time. It takes, take about 28 days to really, really reprogram.

Chris Williamson 39:14 Yeah, explain this 28-day cycle.

Jeremy Renner 39:15 Yeah, it's, it's, um, it's like a lot of cycles. Like from a menstrual cycle, a moon cycle, uh, human patterns and behaviors. A lot of, a lot of toxicities to leave your body take around those times. But it's just something about that 28 days seems to be something congruent in a lot of different versions of our lives. And, um, with, with patterns, um, to really create a p- a positive pattern or take a negative pattern to a positive pattern, uh, it took 28 days. And then you don't have to think about it. It's not a conscious thought anymore. You don't have to be, be grudged to stretch every morning. You're just stretching every morning after 28 days essentially. It doesn't have to even be that long. It could take, be less. But to, um, it's, it's always in your brain, the power within your brain and your mind. And it takes fortitude, it takes trust, faith, and a whole lot of other bag of goodies that you, you can't be weak in spirit. You cannot. You have to be... You, if you don't believe it, then no one's gonna believe it kind of attitude. You've, it's not gonna get done if you're not gonna do it, right? You have to do it and believe it. And the, there was, it was a lot, a lot of that came through 'cause, uh, 'cause I had to walk on my leg. And then my leg had a spiral fracture, spun around, it was shattered. And so they had to hammer a, a big, um, a piece of titanium in, and just plates and screws, and plates and screws. And he said, "You're gonna have to walk on this thing. Otherwise, it's gonna be pretty much just like a log, stiff thing." I'm like, "All right."

Chris Williamson 40:45 To keep it mobile.

Jeremy Renner 40:46 Yeah, to, to move it. All the scar tissue, right? I have to, as you know, right, you gotta keep this thing rocking and moving. So I got the okay from the doctor, like I have to move this thing, otherwise it's gonna be just a club leg. So I start doing it, and my body is screaming at me, "Ow, ow." I g- step down, "Ow, ow, ow, ow, motherfu- Ow, ow, ow." "It's broken," my body's telling me. I'm like, "No, it's not." So I start yelling at my foot and my leg. I'm like, "Look, motherfucker." Sorry about my language, but (laughs) I'm just like, "Look, we gotta, we gotta, we gotta work this out." The doc says you're not broken, 'cause you're a piece of metal now. Like, I'm literally talking to it like it's a, like my appendage and my body is like a, like a, like a scorned lover or something, or like a, like a bad dog.

Chris Williamson 41:25 Naughty dog.

Jeremy Renner 41:26 Yeah, you know what I mean? It's like, "What are you doing? How would you, why would you cheat on me?"

Chris Williamson 41:29 Yep, yep, yep.

Jeremy Renner 41:30 You know what I mean? You know, it's, you're betraying me, essentially. It's, it's such a betrayal. And so to be so crazy enough to like, to talk about my appendage (laughs) as this separate thing-

Chris Williamson 41:41 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 41:42 ... you know, um, it wa- it was, opened up to this idea that, uh, I, I have to really change, I have to change it, 'cause I know with all the things I'm telling you I knew before, I just like, I have to really work this out. I'm literally arguing with my leg every day. I'm arguing with my leg many times a day. Many times I go, I have to go move it, get blood flow through it so, for blood clots, the, right, scar tissue, it's all this stuff. So otherwise, I'm threatening, "Dude, I'm gonna lop you off. I'm gonna chop you off. I'm gonna get a wooden peg, I'm gonna get a fucking parrot and an eye patch, and go live a pirate life, motherfucker. Either fucking do it or don't." Like I'm screaming it, right? I'm saying it like I'm saying it now, like no joke.But saying it with that intensity and that belief, dude... 'Cause I did also was okay living the pirate life, dude. I was totally okay with it. I was just happy I was alive.

Chris Williamson 42:30 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 42:31 I didn't care about acting again. I, I was... I'm just happy to see my family there with me, all the people I love around with me. I didn't care about what the future held for my body in that sense. You know what I mean? Or I was willing to do it. So (laughs) I'm threatening my leg that I'm gonna chop it off. I mean, it's like the... It's, it's the most insane thing ever. And I know I'm... I know that as I'm saying it, and I, I reflect back on it (laughs) sometimes at night, and I'm like, "Dude, that was a good talk we had. That was a good talk." (laughs) You know what I mean?

Chris Williamson 43:04 Good hustle. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jeremy Renner 43:05 You know? Like, um, it's pretty... It's a lonely business, recovery, right? When you're in a bed alone, you're the only one recovering, no matter how many doctors you got, how many people love you, giving you tea, whatever the heck it is. All that's amazing, but you're the only one that can make you get better. And that's it, man. And me and... Me and my leg were (laughs) were partners-in-crime at the time. And, uh... Yeah, I'm talking to curtains. I'm talking to all sorts of things in your... (laughs) It's quite a lonely space. But, um, it was the thing that helped me reprogram the neural pathways on how I receive pain. And it took about 28 days, took about a month, of me yelling at my leg as I'm doing physical therapy. I do... I'm doing it every day. I did it as soon as I got home. I was in two ICUs for six days apiece. As soon as I got home, 'cause I was breaking out of them every day, "Get me home, get me home so I can sleep." And soon as I got home, "I'm doing physical therapy." You know, "However painful it is, I don't care." So I got on it real quick. And, uh... So, so after doing that, this... Having this agreement with my leg, all the other things, like my ribs and all that stuff, kind of fell into place much better than I anticipated. I... My lungs were like plastic suitcases for all the goop and things to kind of come out of it. Blood and all this, like, stuff. It's so weird. I mean, it was quite a hot mess. But it was the leg that was really quite, quite the issue, um, 'cause it was the, the physical therapy part of it. And that's where, um, that's where I focused all my energy. Then the rest of the body just kind of fell into place. Um, it's like I focused on one, one bad dog that was pooping on my pillow or something. Like-

Chris Williamson 44:35 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 44:35 "Ah, yeah, I'll just focus on the leg." Uh, and, um... And then it just... I, I just... Pain became just something that I can manage 'cause I know my body s- sends signals to my brain, but it doesn't mean I have to receive it the same way.

Chris Williamson 44:50 What's

Chris Williamson 44:51 your advice to somebody who's currently dealing with pain?

Jeremy Renner 44:53 Uh, you know... (laughs) I, I'm not gonna say up to... You know what... Yet the thing... I think g- getting an understanding of it. I think there are other ways. You know, I think modern medicine is fantastic for the short term, but it... For long term and chronic pain, I think there's gotta be other ways. I deal with it all the time, but I certainly don't take pills. I, I, I do... Oh, sorry. I do injections of peptides, amino acids, vitamins, uh, maybe... I try... Anti... Some na- natural anti-inflammatories, things like that. I think everybody's gotta deal with inflammation. I think there's, um, a lot of great science that's coming out. Um, I get a lot of access to people that, um, have been dealing with it over a long time and also have been doing it for a long time. Um, but none of that matters. What matters is what your body says. I listen to my body. My body tells me what it needs, and I listen to it. I pay attention, and I also tell it to fuck off. Like, no joke. It's, it's a... It's, it's a... It's, it's a part of me. It is what I am, but it is just my spirit living in this vessel.

Chris Williamson 45:57 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 45:57 So I'm gonna take care of it the best I can, so I'm gonna listen to it, and it's going to listen to me. And it does. And that agreement I have with my body gets me through every day.

Chris Williamson 46:07 How do you know when to listen to it and when to tell it to fuck off?

Jeremy Renner 46:09 It starts to scream at me a-bit. It's cr-

Chris Williamson 46:11 The volume that it reaches?

Jeremy Renner 46:12 Yeah. Yeah, it gets a little louder. Or it's... It's actually not even that. It's more... It's repetitive in nature, not just something that... It's not just an afternoon or a st- or a stiff morning.

Chris Williamson 46:21 It's just fleeting.

Jeremy Renner 46:22 It's just like, "Oh, this has been a week of this repetitive thing." I'm like, "All right. I gotta... I gotta help my body out here. I'm not doing something right, or I'm doing something wrong. I'm putting something in my body, or I'm not..." Tha- it's something else, right? The body... Like, if you have an injury, usually some other part of your body-

Chris Williamson 46:38 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 46:38 ... overcompensates and that kind of stuff. So you have to really kind of watch, watch the whole thing.

Chris Williamson 46:44 We'll get back to talking in one second, but first, this episode is brought to you by AG1. I've been drinking AG1 every morning for years now, and it just got even better. AG1 Next Gen keeps the same simplicity, one scoop once per day, but now comes with four clinical trials backing it. In those trials, AG1 Next Gen was clinically shown to fill common nutrient gaps, improve key nutrient levels within three months, and increase healthy gut bacteria by 10 times, even in healthy adults. Basically, they've upgraded the formula with better probiotics, more bioavailable nutrients, and clinical validation. AG1 genuinely care about holistic health, which is why I've got my mum to take it, my dad to take it, and tons of my friends too. And it's why I put it inside of my body every single day. And if I found something better, I'd switch, but I haven't, which is why I still use it. Plus, if you're still unsure, they've got a 90-day money-back guarantee, so you can buy it and try it every single day for three full months. And if you don't like it, they will give you your money back for the lot. Right now, you can get a free year's supply, vitamin D3, K2, and five free AG1 travel packs, and that 90-day money-back guarantee by going to the link in the description below or heading to drinkag1.com/modernwisdom. That's drinkag1.com/modernwisdom. Just sink into the, uh... That reframing, that mental reframing around pain a little bit more for me.

Jeremy Renner 48:05 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:05 Again, somebody... I've, uh... Again, not run over by a, a snowcat. A full Achilles detachment, which was a-

Jeremy Renner 48:12 Yeah, yeah. Fuck. Get out of here.

Chris Williamson 48:13 That was a... That was a motherfucker.

Jeremy Renner 48:15 Terrible. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:15 Um, uh-

Jeremy Renner 48:15 Well, here's the thing. See, any... Singular in any one of those, it's way worse than getting ran over by the snowcat.

Chris Williamson 48:21 I would disagree.

Jeremy Renner 48:21 Because there's onl- there's only... Yeah, there's only one thing, and it... And it's, it's, it's... I was tested to my limits, to my death-

Chris Williamson 48:28 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 48:29 So nothing else can... I don't care, pop both my Achilles tendons right now, like, eh, whatever.

Chris Williamson 48:34 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 48:35 I'll limp out of here or just pull, waddle out of here.

Chris Williamson 48:37 Right, because the worst thing that's happened to you is the worst thing that could happen to you.

Jeremy Renner 48:39 Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like this, it's like, all right, this is gonna be a terrible year.

Chris Williamson 48:42 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 48:42 I didn't know that already. Ba, ba, ba, baa. But, you know, they'll reattach. They can probably do it in six months now they got-

Chris Williamson 48:46 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 48:46 ... Aaron Rodgers' machine, they can do like... (laughs)

Chris Williamson 48:49 Yep, yep, yep.

Jeremy Renner 48:49 You know?

Chris Williamson 48:50 Uh, but my point being, uh, uh, with that for me, I resonate an awful lot with the loneliness. I think-

Jeremy Renner 48:57 Oh, yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:58 I think this is one of the m- one of the things I really want to get an insight-

Jeremy Renner 49:02 Yeah, patience.

Chris Williamson 49:02 ... from around you.

Jeremy Renner 49:03 Patience, yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:04 Yeah, the r- the role of patience and-

Jeremy Renner 49:05 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:06 ... how you deal with loneliness, how you remain sort of-

Jeremy Renner 49:09 Hmm. Interesting.

Chris Williamson 49:09 ... that mental fortitude-

Jeremy Renner 49:10 Yeah, interesting, yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:10 ... and you sink into that.

Jeremy Renner 49:12 That's interesting. I think, yeah, especially for, you talk about, uh, you know, the Achilles tendon, because it is such a long, ongoing thing. And then that, a- a-

Chris Williamson 49:19 12 months recovery, man. It's a real injury.

Jeremy Renner 49:20 Yeah, it's a r- it's a real damn injury, dude. It's, and it's like no joke. Like, you could break any bone and you're done in a month. And people aren't really that conscious of it and 'cause usually you're just playing sports or you're just getting out of bed and it could pop, right? It could happen anywhere. Usually you're doing something kinda athletic, just playing pickleball (laughs) and-

Chris Williamson 49:39 Mine was cricket, which is a-

Jeremy Renner 49:40 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:40 ... much more British way to do it, but yeah.

Jeremy Renner 49:41 There you go. Either way, usually it's not a sexy way to, to, to have such a gnarly injury. But anyway, so the, so people aren't caring. Like, people cared a lot about my injuries because they're very aware of what happened. Like, "Oh, yeah, you're playing cricket? You, you know," whatever. They kinda maybe make fun of you for it.

Chris Williamson 49:54 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 49:54 But there is a real loneliness in, in, in that, so I gamify recovery. I gamify my pain. I gamify that loneliness, meaning I set, set goals. I, I, uh, daily goals, was always as long as I'm better than I was the day before. And I don't, it doesn't have to be a high standard. It's just like, I moved my elbow an inch more than I can move it the day before, victory. Right? So at least it's progress. It's this, now the setbacks are fewer because you don't set such a crazy high goal. "Oh, I'm gonna start, I'm gonna run a 4.5 40 at the end of the year." You know, it's like, come on. Then you're gonna set yourself up for disappointment. But, um, so to, to gamify things and, and, and give myself confidence and self-confidence in, in my loneliness is like getting better. I, I, I'd always push myself. Even after the PT leaves, I'm doing stuff on my own. It's a 24-hour job. It's a 24-hour job. As long as I get my good sleep, then the rest of it's like, what am I putting in my body and how do I get better every day? And then I, and then I'd hit higher goals and I'd find ways to, to heal my family in me getting better. That helped immensely. I can remove myself out of the equation in my pain and my recovery 'cause I'm getting better to heal my family. If I, if I get better, my family gets better. I'm not getting better even from me. That was a huge perspective that I had as soon as I woke up from the coma. I apologized that I was in the accident. I said I was sorry and I promised my daughter, "If you wait for me, I'll get better." It was like, it was, I released myself of the duties of me wanting to get better for me. I was getting better for them to heal them 'cause I hurt them. It was easy. It was a one-way road of recovery. There's no other direction to go. I have to heal my family.

Chris Williamson 51:45 Isn't it strange that we find it easier to do something for us for other people than do something for us for us?

Jeremy Renner 51:52 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:53 Isn't that a strange quirk of-

Jeremy Renner 51:54 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:54 ... the way that humans work?

Jeremy Renner 51:55 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 51:55 It's the same thing, uh, you've probably been in movies where this is actually a scene. Um, eh, d- d- the bad guy wants to get the information out of you so they're torturing you and they're doing stuff and you're like, "No, it doesn't matter." Then they bring in someone you love.

Jeremy Renner 52:08 Yeah, it's like, "Aw."

Chris Williamson 52:09 And you, that always breaks everybody, right?

Jeremy Renner 52:12 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:12 And, um, there's an interesting stat around the likelihood that we ensure that we complete a course of antibiotics is around about 50%. Uh, maybe a little bit less. The likelihood that we ensure that our dog completes its course of antibiotics is like in the 90s. So, we're significantly better at looking after an animal-

Jeremy Renner 52:31 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:31 ... than we are at looking after ourselves, despite the fact that if we are not functional, the animal's fucked.

Jeremy Renner 52:37 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:37 You know?

Jeremy Renner 52:38 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:38 Um, and, eh, again, with this, uh, it's so interesting that we can use somebody else as other people, group of other people, as the motivation for our recovery-

Jeremy Renner 52:51 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 52:51 ... in that way.

Jeremy Renner 52:52 Yeah, well, I think that's, it's, it's something in the... I think it's within the limitations of, in a perspective, it seems like it's the limitations of a, of a human experience, right? But it's also an act of love. I mean, the a- the, the fuel behind that is all love. So in a spiritual f- form, that is, that is just what, you know, we are to be anyway.

Chris Williamson 53:18 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 53:18 In the human form, it's us protecting ourselves. Like, the body's trying to protect itself.

Chris Williamson 53:22 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 53:23 Right? And, you know, we try to protect each other. We're social creatures. We're

Narrator 53:27 ... ? ] we try to, right, want... Uh, ultimately, people are g- good. We're just not in situations for us to be good to each other. Right?

Chris Williamson 53:36 Even if you are, uh, doing this because you're gonna help to heal your family, you don't want this to be the, uh, defining, lingering memory of, of, of what happened, et cetera, the recovery is still on you.

Jeremy Renner 53:49 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 53:49 Finding the solutions-

Jeremy Renner 53:50 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 53:50 ... is still on you. You're gonna have-

Jeremy Renner 53:51 Yeah, and it's also still my body. Like, I don't wanna, I'm not gonna hobble around this spinning rock for the next 100 years-

Chris Williamson 53:58 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 53:58 ... 'cause now I'm, I'm Titanium Man.

Chris Williamson 54:00 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 54:00 Get out of here. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 54:01 Well, what, you know, you, you're laid awake at night a couple of weeks, a couple of months in. It's just one of those normal days. It's been an all right day of rehab. It's been an all right day of whatever.

Jeremy Renner 54:11 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:11 But you're just, you're kinda deep in the hole. And-

Jeremy Renner 54:14 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:15 ... what, where was your mind going to keep your motivation to keep driving you forward?

Jeremy Renner 54:20 I- I always focused on th- on the things that were better. Now, not every day all, all of me was better, but some part of me was getting better, and that's all I cared about.Just sitting up was, like, a giant milestone for me. Not peeing in a jar, that was a great victory for me to go bathroom on my own, right? Just whatever it was, I kept things really simple, and, and, and I made it okay .......................... That's an amazing thing. So 'cause there are days that aren't great, and there's a lot of people that might get stuck in a rut of-

Chris Williamson 54:47 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 54:48 ... you don't even have to be in, in recovery. I mean, you can just have a bad day and just like, but your brain, right, it's not ... y- y- you can't let it wallow in that. Just get up off the couch and move. Go move your body, oxygen through your s- your system. It'll help you navigate something, just to make a different choice. It had been easy for me to, like, not have any positive thoughts about things, man. There's, there's not a lot of help or, or hope to grab onto. So I just built the things that I could grab onto. Like I said, I kind of gamified things.

Chris Williamson 55:20 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 55:20 And I g- you know, I guess, there's ... I was just filled with such gratitude, but I wasn't gonna ever have s- a low bar set, right? There's that duality of it. It's like I wasn't gonna, like, "Oh, as long as I can just kinda walk," or, like ... no, no. They said, "Hmm, if I walked again, if I did, I'd walk funny." They said, "You're never gonna run again." I said, "I wish you would've told me that." I heard it from my family later on. I would've been running faster earlier just through tha- at that challenge, right?

Chris Williamson 55:56 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 55:56 I'm also that guy, you know?

Chris Williamson 55:58 That "fuck you" energy?

Jeremy Renner 55:59 Yeah. Yeah. Well, that ... or the challen- challenge me 'cause I know what I can do, and I know what I can't do. And I know my limitations, and sometimes I'll, I'll try to ... I always try to exceed what, what, um, I can or can't do. You have to go to such extremes of your obsessions to really grow.

Chris Williamson 56:17 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 56:17 Like what cold plunges do for the body and, like, even h- even extreme hot does to your s- the nerve endings in your body. Use a lot of heat, vibration for pain. Let's talk about pain.

Chris Williamson 56:26 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 56:26 Heat, high heat, high vri- ve- high vibrations, great for pain.

Chris Williamson 56:30 Were you using, uh, um-

Jeremy Renner 56:32 Like power plate stuff?

Chris Williamson 56:33 ... power plate, yeah, yeah.

Jeremy Renner 56:33 Yeah, power plate stuff 'cause that gets really, really intense, um, vibration. That's great to like just numb the nerve endings, a really hot bath and then .......................... power plate.

Chris Williamson 56:41 That's the reason why when you bang, when you, uh, stub your toe, like you said earlier on, why do you rub it? It's because it's really difficult for the body to receive multiple signals at the same time-

Jeremy Renner 56:48 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 56:49 ... for that (brr) .

Jeremy Renner 56:49 Yeah, yeah. And it just n- it just confuses all the nerve endings seemingly-

Chris Williamson 56:53 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 56:53 ... 'cause then I don't feel it. It's a, it's, it's like, it's why I got off-

Chris Williamson 56:57 (sighs)

Jeremy Renner 56:57 ... the pain medication like that.

Chris Williamson 56:59 Yeah, what was your, uh, uh, uh, a relationship? You know, a lot of people have injuries way less bad than this-

Jeremy Renner 57:06 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 57:06 ... and that's the beginning of their road down-

Jeremy Renner 57:09 Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 57:09 ... the dark path.

Jeremy Renner 57:09 Look, I'm glad, I'm glad I had it. I'm glad it was there. It was, it was necessary. Um, I mean, goddamn, was it necessary. But I, it wasn't ... it, I think it was, like, when I got home, switching from epidurals and IVs and all the stuff of right in- intravenously, you know, to, to, to, to deal with your pain management.

Chris Williamson 57:29 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 57:31 Uh, and then going on just now just taking pills, taking OxyContin. You know, that, you know, you get behind on that, you're, you're kinda screwed because then you realize, oh, it's gonna take a minute to get through your system and da-da-da.

Chris Williamson 57:43 Yeah, what's the, the, the bit of advice I was given after my surgery? Uh, never chase the pain.

Jeremy Renner 57:48 Yeah. Oh, yeah, no, no.

Chris Williamson 57:49 Don't ... you've gotta get out ahead of the pain.

Jeremy Renner 57:50 Yeah, yeah. You gotta stay ahead of it.

Chris Williamson 57:52 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 57:52 Otherwise, you get behind, oh, man, it's a, it's gonna be a bad day or so. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 57:56 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 57:57 Uh, yeah, it was. So, yeah, it happened, like, that happened once, maybe twice. But, but then it was, like, maybe four weeks in when I was home and I had a night terror. My, in my, look, my mouth was broken and everything, so many breaks in my face and my head, and my, my teeth don't align so I had night terror. And then when your teeth don't align, it's easy to crack a tooth.

Chris Williamson 58:18 Yup.

Jeremy Renner 58:18 And I cracked a tooth. Then I felt pain. I'm like, "Wait, I'm on OxyContin and this is ..."

Chris Williamson 58:24 Breaking through.

Jeremy Renner 58:24 I'm going, like, yeah, bre- b- it was breaking through.

Chris Williamson 58:27 Yup.

Jeremy Renner 58:27 So I'm like, "Well, then what do I need that, uh, OxyContin for and the gabapentin?" Like, "I'm out of here." So I went emergency extraction, put in a post, take the thing out. I'm crying (laughs) just 'cause I was so happy that my pregnant dentist would come in and do this for me. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 58:42 Wow.

Jeremy Renner 58:43 And, um, got home and said, "I'm, I'm getting off. I'm Ta- I'm not taking this stuff." I took it for the next day for the tooth, uh, and then when that felt good, I just, just said, "I'm, I'm cold turkey-ing this stuff."

Chris Williamson 58:56 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 58:57 And then I cried for, like, three and a half days straight and g- shivered in cold sweats and the whole thing's coming off-

Chris Williamson 59:04 Because of the pain?

Jeremy Renner 59:04 ... coming off, coming off the pain meds. It was-

Chris Williamson 59:06 Tell me about that time.

Jeremy Renner 59:07 It was way worse than the accident.

Chris Williamson 59:09 Why?

Jeremy Renner 59:10 'Cause how bad coming off that stuff is. It was just, like, uncontrollable crocodile tears. So emotionally just u- out of control crying, and it wasn't sad. I was just crying. I was doing PT, just doing (laughs) these bands and stuff, just (crying sound) just sobbing. I just couldn't stop-

Chris Williamson 59:27 Just dysregulated?

Jeremy Renner 59:29 ... sobbing. And, you know, I was shivering. I was so cold. They got all these electric blankets on me like I was coming off heroin or something. It's actually b- I guess what it is or something, right, OxyContin? Anyway, after the three and a half days, I talked to the, the pain management guy, the doctor, and he's like, "Yeah, you can't do that, dude. No one does that. You gotta wean off that-"

Chris Williamson 59:46 You don't just cold turkey it?

Jeremy Renner 59:46 "You need, you need two weeks at least to kind of wean off of it, well, with gabapentin as well. All your nerve endings are, like, feeling everything right now." I'm like, "Yeah, I know. I'm freezing. I'm shivering. I'm crying." (laughs) Like, "Well, why don't you ... it's okay if you, you know, do a little bit." Gah, I'm done with it now, so I'm just gonna stay off of it.

Chris Williamson 1:00:02 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:02 And thank God, I gotta shake it. But wow, what a terrible thing to, to be hooked on.

Chris Williamson 1:00:08 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:10 Wow. I mean, if you need that, 'cause your, then your body gets numb to that kind of stuff anyway, then you need more of it, which is the terrible thing to it. So it's like, you need to get the fuck off that stuff as soon as possible is my recommendation.

Chris Williamson 1:00:23 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:24 Find other ways.

Chris Williamson 1:00:25 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:25 And high heat, high vibrations do tremendous things to your nerve endings to mitigate your pain, and it allowed me to sleep. That's why I love to ... I'd take a super, super hot bath, as much as I could stand-And then, uh, vibrations, like, on my- the parts that were really kind of just giving me some achy-

Chris Williamson 1:00:43 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:44 ... achy sort of feeling.

Chris Williamson 1:00:44 Were you sitting on a power plate or-

Jeremy Renner 1:00:46 Um, no.

Chris Williamson 1:00:47 ... you would have been able to stand?

Jeremy Renner 1:00:47 I mean, I was too fragile. I was still too fragile at that time. I do it now.

Chris Williamson 1:00:50 Yep.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:51 Um, but, uh, I do it, I did like the, the, they have a roller that's a vibrating roller.

Chris Williamson 1:00:56 Okay.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:56 Super intense.

Chris Williamson 1:00:57 It just rests.

Jeremy Renner 1:00:57 I put both my knees o- on, put it under both my knees or both my ankles.

Chris Williamson 1:01:01 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:01:01 Ankles and knees. Oop, night-night, going to bed. Amazing.

Chris Williamson 1:01:04 Wow.

Jeremy Renner 1:01:05 If you have any ankle or knee issues, as long as they're not breaks, as long as, uh, if you're healing from a break, you can do it. But, um, great for, for nerve endings, tendons, to get blood flow, circulation for your, for your things that are hard to get blood flow through, like tendons, you know. Right? Um, pretty tough. You know, all the cartilage areas, um, all our joints, you know, are all gonna fail us anyway. But I just got every joint screwed (laughs) early on.

Chris Williamson 1:01:30 What were the, uh-

Jeremy Renner 1:01:31 So, that's how I really did it.

Chris Williamson 1:01:31 ... take

Chris Williamson 1:01:32 me through the big recovery modalities, sort of what contributed to your, to your rehab and... 'Cause you seemed to recover very, given how intense-

Jeremy Renner 1:01:39 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:40 ... and, and, and sort of-

Jeremy Renner 1:01:41 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:41 ... catastrophic the injuries are, you recovered really quickly.

Jeremy Renner 1:01:43 Yeah. I, I, I be- I became obsessed. I had to become obsessed at recovery. It had to be, it was my main focus. And it was awesome because my life was freed from any other obligations, even parenting. Sadly. So, I have to get this so then I can go back to being a parent. So I can go back, right? So I became obsessed at, it's a, like I said, it was 24 hours a day. That's all I focused on. That's all my brain energy went to. That's all my thoughts went to, were all recovery, healing, getting better, even dreaming of my bones growing over this metal pipe, and that they... All this stuff. It was just all that was, I was all in with every part of my body, even in my damn dreams, about recovering. So, the obsession. And then, it got to a place maybe of just a few weeks later. I didn't have the, the, the le- the plastic pla- suitcases for my lungs. And then I'm sitting up in a thing and I'm in a wheelchair and I'm moving around. And it's like I'm mobile. I'm getting more blood flow in. Ah, that's now I just getting better faster. And now it's maybe 16 hours a day of obsession, and then it reduced to 12, and it's just ke- kept getting less. By the summertime, it was eight hours a day. I had to start my morning, dah, dah routine, and dah, dah, all the things and just keep going, keep going.

Chris Williamson 1:03:02 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:03:02 And then my, what my body allowed me to do that was just sort of like not recovery stuff, I would do life stuff that was like recovery stuff. I'd go walk in the sand. Great for your ankles and stability in my hips and knees and all that stuff. But at least I'm outside in the sunshine at Lake Tahoe, breathing in the air, getting my feet cold. That's the biggest cold plunge in the world. That, that thing is freezing. And just go in that and it's awesome, right? So I can do the... So now I'm just doing eight hours, and I reduce it to maybe four hours by the time I started going back to work. I'd have to commit to four hours a day. Hyperbaric chamber, put O2 throughout my body.

Chris Williamson 1:03:33 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 1:03:33 Red light therapy was huge. I, I still do these to this day.

Chris Williamson 1:03:37 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:03:37 Um, and all the th- I mean, between the high heat stuff and the vibration, the red light, infrared beds, and the hyperbaric chamber, I'll do those for the rest of my life.

Chris Williamson 1:03:47 Mm-hmm. What peptides were you using? Thymosin alpha, thymosin beta-

Jeremy Renner 1:03:52 Yeah, it was-

Chris Williamson 1:03:52 ... BPC?

Jeremy Renner 1:03:53 ... thymosin, BBC 157, there's um, eh- eh- MOTS-c, some, some-

Chris Williamson 1:03:56 I love MOTS-c.

Jeremy Renner 1:03:57 Huh?

Chris Williamson 1:03:57 MOTS-c's great.

Jeremy Renner 1:03:58 Yeah, yeah. And there's TB 500. There's, uh, gosh, there's a, a long, long list of stuff. I s- I had to do, I had to, I had to do, had to do hormone replacement stuff 'cause my testosterone was at 200.

Chris Williamson 1:04:09 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:04:09 I had to get that up 'cause I was gonna get some energy so then I could get in the gym instead of falling asleep in the gym. Um, so that helped getting, regulating that 'cause again, I'm 54 and at th- at that time, you know, I didn't... No one tells you how to get old, but I guess my testosterone (laughs) was super low. And, uh, that affects a lot of things in your body.

Chris Williamson 1:04:28 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:04:29 Especially your energy.

Chris Williamson 1:04:30 Mm.

Jeremy Renner 1:04:30 So, um, yeah. And there's, there's a, a whole list of, of different peptides, and I rotate them in and out. It's not like I do, uh, them all the time. I, I just kinda rotate them, just like supplements. I do the same thing with supplements. I rotate them in and out of my life. I'll go for a stretch of two months or three months on, three months off, or that kind of thing, you know. Just to get your body to regulate, challenge it, let it try to produce its own HGH, its own testosterone, all those type of things. Um, really, really great to work on your body from a cellular level, uh, out.

Chris Williamson 1:05:02 Using the NAD? Any-

Jeremy Renner 1:05:04 Yeah, yeah. I do that every day.

Chris Williamson 1:05:05 Wow.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:06 Every day.

Chris Williamson 1:05:06 Uh, sub-Q?

Jeremy Renner 1:05:07 Ingestion. Yeah, sub-Q, and also IM, and I don't do it through the, uh-

Chris Williamson 1:05:12 IV.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:12 ... IV 'cause it just takes too long-

Chris Williamson 1:05:14 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:14 ... to go through that suck (laughs) you know.

Chris Williamson 1:05:16 It's not nice.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:17 (laughs) It's not nice.

Chris Williamson 1:05:17 I- uh, sub-Q NAD is like a-

Jeremy Renner 1:05:21 I feel that, dude.

Chris Williamson 1:05:22 I- it's like a shot of coffee. It's really interesting.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:24 Dude, yeah, yeah. And you- I also feel like the light version of it, uh, in the st- uh, can do your stomach.

Chris Williamson 1:05:29 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:29 Like, oh, gosh. But it's only t- for 10 seconds.

Chris Williamson 1:05:33 It's nice-

Jeremy Renner 1:05:33 Not for like-

Chris Williamson 1:05:33 ... it's nice once it goes.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:34 ... 25 minutes, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:05:35 I had this, I had this theory about NAD that one of the best parts of NAD was it finishing. It wasn't actually the effect.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:40 (laughs) Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:05:40 It was like, I've just been in so much-

Jeremy Renner 1:05:41 It's over.

Chris Williamson 1:05:41 ... discomfort. Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:42 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:05:42 Exactly, precisely, precisely.

Jeremy Renner 1:05:44 Yeah, exactly.

Chris Williamson 1:05:45 Yeah, it's not-

Jeremy Renner 1:05:45 Yeah, 'cause I don't know many things that you put in your body that immed- immediately make you feel good. Like, an IV, or like a, like a- an IV, you know, it's an instant thing. You're getting hydrated pretty instantaneously. You're getting great vitamins. You could smell the vitamins, vitamin C in your vein when-

Chris Williamson 1:06:02 And when they do that push.

Jeremy Renner 1:06:03 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:06:03 Yep, yep.

Jeremy Renner 1:06:03 So that, you feel pretty instantly and you feel good. Not much else I can think that I've done, and I do everything. Everything. Maybe a hot bath, and that's only 'cause you get out of it and you're like, "Okay, I'm not in pain."

Chris Williamson 1:06:16 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:06:16 Like a cold plunge. I love it when they say like, "Oh, yeah, dude, you feel so good getting out." Yeah, you feel good getting out of that 'cause you're not dying anymore. That's why it feels good. It doesn't feel good ever. Does it feel good? No, it feels like hell. So by getting out, you're just not dying anymore. Your body's screaming, "I'm dying, I'm dying." Cold proteins released, cold shock proteins, all this, right? (laughs) We all know this. They, they'll do it. Um, I don't do a lot of, uh, cold plunges 'cause I think you have to kind of... I do those, um, when needed.I do. There's, uh, the cryo chambers. You know, I'd rather do that.

Chris Williamson 1:06:48 Hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:06:49 Cryo chamber, I felt, um, being a little bit more effective. You know-

Chris Williamson 1:06:52 You like the hyperbaric?

Jeremy Renner 1:06:53 Hyperbaric I love. I love it because it does take a little bit more time, but I can do my s- yeah, I can do emails, a cup of coffee. I g- 'cause I can sit in a chair just like this and, um, not just sit there and be like I'm in some treatment. I'm like, "Forget it." I would never do it.

Chris Williamson 1:07:09 Hm.

Jeremy Renner 1:07:10 But I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll just bio stack in there. I'll do red light mask in there. I'll, I'll do whatever I can to do multiple things 'cause I do many things all throughout the day, you know?

Chris Williamson 1:07:19 Mm-hmm. How, uh, how is it that-

Jeremy Renner 1:07:21 Like, again, I would have these things on right now. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:07:23 Yeah, well, look-

Jeremy Renner 1:07:24 But as you know, mess up the mics.

Chris Williamson 1:07:25 Um, how is it that your face looks like your face? Why does your face look like your face if it- if so much destruction happened?

Jeremy Renner 1:07:32 The, well, i- i- interestingly enough-

Chris Williamson 1:07:33 Was it reconstructed?

Jeremy Renner 1:07:33 ... interestingly enough, nothing. The only skin that broke was on the back of my head, and that's where all the blood was gushing, because it, it w- it, when it got ran over, it went to my cheekbone pressure and the back of my skull here, that was where the roll over pressure went. So that's why I broke this cheekbone and it floating around, it broke my orbital and then my jaw. So this and then my jaw broke in three places.

Chris Williamson 1:07:56 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:07:56 And then the crack here. A- all the other marks on my body are scars from the surgeries. They put the metal in. So it was more, it was more the, the insides of my body that were crushed. And i- luckily, like, the, one of my ribs poked my liver, but, uh, that, 'cause it broke in two spots, so there's a couple of gaps. There's like, there was, uh, like 14 breaks and, and only six ribs. So several pieces of my (laughs) rib cage were just gone.

Chris Williamson 1:08:23 Floating.

Jeremy Renner 1:08:24 Yeah, just missing around. So, um... What, what was it we were talking about? I can't remember. Oh, yeah, my face.

Chris Williamson 1:08:31 Why does your face look like your face?

Jeremy Renner 1:08:31 My face, yeah, yeah. So i- i- once the swelling went down, they can see where, like, the, the real damage is really just to my jaw 'cause it's hard to fix your jaw apparently. And also my teeth got pushed in, the molars, so nothing sits right. Um-

Chris Williamson 1:08:47 That's still the same case now?

Jeremy Renner 1:08:49 Yeah, yeah, forever.

Chris Williamson 1:08:50 Wow.

Jeremy Renner 1:08:50 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:08:51 They can't palate expand? Are, you're-

Jeremy Renner 1:08:53 Uh, I, I think, uh, I, I think what we risk losing is losing the teeth.

Chris Williamson 1:08:57 Yeah.

Jeremy Renner 1:08:57 Yeah. I'm n- I'm gonna lose them all anyway from all that trauma.

Chris Williamson 1:09:00 Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Renner 1:09:01 Um...

Chris Williamson 1:09:02 Hold onto them for-

Jeremy Renner 1:09:03 So I'm gonna hang onto them while I can. And I still got a decent smile. Everything's fine. It's just when I bite down, it's like chewing, eating is just not that enjoyable.

Chris Williamson 1:09:10 You gotta be careful with what foods you eat, then? No hard things?

Jeremy Renner 1:09:13 Uh, I'm only careful with the foods I eat just, um, just what I wanna put in my body. You know? And I'm not really s- a stickler about things, you know. I'm, I'm just, I'm just conscious about what it is. But, yeah, I l- I likes, I like eating steak. But, uh, you know, I don't try to chew on stuff too much. Like gum, I'll never chew gum. Like, I put a gun to my mouth.

Chris Williamson 1:09:31 What a price that you're gonna have to pay.

Jeremy Renner 1:09:32 Yeah, yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 1:09:33 Um-

Jeremy Renner 1:09:33 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:09:33 ... I- I'm interested in how you-

Jeremy Renner 1:09:35 But, so anyway, the swelling, i- it was your eye, that, how does that go back in? There was so many ways that, that I should have an eye patch or a glass eye or something at this point, right? Because of, the