Modern WisdomJ.K. Rowling, Trans Athletes & Blackfishing - Leo Kearse
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
130 min read · 26,220 words- 0:00 – 3:32
Intro
- LKLeo Kearse
It's mad that- for all the people banging on about slavery. They only bang on about transatlantic slavery that finished 400 years ago and was ended by the British. Nobody bangs on about the fact that there's more slaves now in the world than there, there was 400 years ago at the peak of transatlantic slavery. (wind blows)
- CWChris Williamson
Leo Kersh, welcome to the show.
- LKLeo Kearse
Hello. How you doing?
- CWChris Williamson
I'm good, man. I'm good. How's the UK? I'm heading back soon.
- LKLeo Kearse
Where are you now?
- CWChris Williamson
In Austin, Texas.
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, really? Yeah, them- I mean, the UK's, the UK's all right. Uh, we've got Omicron going round at the moment. I've got Omicron right now, in case you're wondering why I sound kind of blocked up.
- CWChris Williamson
You're kidding.
- LKLeo Kearse
So, everybody's got it. Like basically, you know, I'm always out doing gigs, doing shows and stuff, doing... I think- I think I might have actually got it at, um, at a TV studio 'cause I went in and everybody had a cold, and Omicron is a cold basically. So, um, yeah, I had, I had coronavirus. I had like the original and best first wave of coronavirus back in, uh, August, uh, and that absolutely floored me. You know what I mean? I was like, "I wish I'd got vaccinated." But, um, that, that was bad. Uh, and Omicron, I mean, it's still bad but it's like a, it's like a cold. It's not like, you know, it's not like making you die.
- CWChris Williamson
This is diet Coke.
- LKLeo Kearse
What? It's diet Coke?
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, it's diet Coke and paired with full fat Coke. So you've got like the big, the big full original hit, and then you've got like the new version without caffeine, without anything else in.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, which actually makes you fatter-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
... because your body thinks it's had sugar and it hasn't, so yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I don't know. I, um, I saw that Omicron seems to be a little bit more transmissible but far less deadly or something? There's only been one person that's died from it so far.
- LKLeo Kearse
Hugely more transmissible. Three and a half times more transmissible and, uh, COVID was already a very transmissible disease. So Omicron basically, you know, if you're near somebody who's got it, you're probably gonna get it except, you know, sometimes you won't. Like my fiance doesn't, doesn't have it. Um, and, um, uh, yeah, it's a lot less... Uh, it's kind of, it's kind of flat. The hos- the severity of hospitalizations is kind of flat at about 25 to 30%. Um, whereas with the original COVID, uh, the severity started off very low, uh, for like young people, uh, and then rose dramatically for, for older people. So it's up around 85, 90% for, for older people. Um, so this one's less severe overall but slightly more severe for, for young people, which is great 'cause one of the, one of the bad things about coronavirus is like it didn't affect children. So all these annoying little snotty-faced brats running about enjoying themselves. And I think if there's any justice... I mean, I did like how coronavirus went for like the, the fat and the elderly and the vulnerable. You know, it's kind o- uh, what I couldn't believe was like the Tories, uh, the Tories tried to stop it. Like coronavirus is basically enacting Tory policy-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
... or what I've been told Tory policy is. And then the Tories try and stop. Like next election I'm voting for coronavirus. It's doing a much better job at like wiping out like vulnerable people than the Tories are.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) Yeah, it's so weird 'cause, um, I learned that viruses, they tend to get more lethal, uh, sorry, less lethal over time but more transmissible and this is what we're seeing-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... right? That Omicron... Because killing the host is actually a really rubbish way to reproduce. So-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, that's why Ebola, Ebola doesn't get anywhere because, you know, everybody dies before they can give it to someone.
- CWChris Williamson
It's too lethal, yeah.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, it's a strange one. I saw, uh, J.K. Rowling got herself in bother again, eh?
- 3:32 – 9:04
What’s Happened to J.K. Rowling?
- CWChris Williamson
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. (laughs) Yeah, yeah. So she tweeted, um, 'cause... Oh yeah, so basically the police in Scotland... Scotland, Scotland's got a really weird, got a really weird government at the moment. So they're trying to be super woke, uh, so there's, there's sort of... And I think it's because they're, uh, propped up by the Green Party. Uh, but the SNP, Scotland's government, uh, they're trying to be super woke with all this sort of like, uh, you know... If you, if you look at any adverts for the Scottish government or anything, you'd think Scotland was like the most multiracial, cosmopolitan, e- everybody's in a, you know, dancing around with beards and makeup and, you know, in a tutu and stuff. And Scotland's not like that at all. It's a place where you can-
- CWChris Williamson
They've got one Black person.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, it's got literally one Black person. It's like Scotland is 96% white.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
You know? So it's bizarre that they're trying to push this, uh, this image of, you know, like they're a Benetton, uh, advert or like, you know, like a university prospectus-
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) << It's a tiny, tiny world. It's a >> Yep.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, it's like... If you look at the SNP, the, they, they, they think that Scotland's like a university prospectus cover. Um, it's... (laughs) But, uh, so they're, they're trying, they're bringing through all this like woke legislation and, uh, usually it's just used by them as a, uh, as a lever to, to do their dirty work. So, um, for example, they've, you know, they've brought through the Hate Crime Bill, uh, and then used, uh... They didn't use the actual bill but they used the sort of, um, the, uh, emotion or the, the momentum behind it to depose, uh, s- so one of Sturgeon's enemies, one of Sturgeon's rivals on the front bench, Joanna Cherry. Uh, she was, um, she was n- knocked off of the, the front bench, uh, b- uh, 'cause she was accused of being transphobic. And she's, she's not transphobic. She's, um, you know, she's a middle-aged lesbian. She's, you know, just a nice person. Um, but, you know, anything can be, uh, construed as transphobic. It's one, it's one of those words. It's like calling somebody a witch. Uh, if you call someone racist or transphobic it's... You know, you might as well accuse... No, n- like... I never meet any genuine racists anymore. Uh, I used to when I lived in Scotland but like, you know what, like in the '90s there were genuine racists. Now, you know, it's very hard to, to find any genuine racists. But, um-
- CWChris Williamson
There's people that say things that can be misconstrued as racism and then that slime is really difficult to get off them.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, so it's just, you know, if you accuse someone of racism or transphobia, you know, you can, you can just destroy them. But, um, but yeah, so J.K. Rowling, um... So Police Scotland have, uh, have changed the law so that, um, if-... uh, if a biological male, or a man, basically rapes someone, um, but then says that they're a woman, the police will go- will be like, "Yeah, you're a, you're a woman," and then they'll be prosecuted and treated as a woman and sent, sent to women's prison, even if, you know, they're making no effort to look like a, what we traditionally consider to be a woman. Um, and, you know, obviously there's huge issues with this. You know, women in prisons, um, are incredibly vulnerable. So if you send biological males in, then, you know, that's, that's, th- that's obviously gonna cause problems, particularly if that person's already, you know, a rapist. Uh, you can see why a rapist would want to go to a women's prison, so they can continue raping. Um, and, um, so J.K. Rowling, uh, did a tweet. I mean, you, you might have it in front of you.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- LKLeo Kearse
But it was, it was quite a clever, um, you know, it was a play on the sort of Orwellian, uh, newspeak of, uh... 'Cause what happened under communism was basically you had to say the opposite of reality was true, and every day you were forced to say the opposite of reality was true, whether it was, you know, uh, "Things are getting better. Uh, we've all got enough food to eat. Uh, Stalin's a great leader." Um, you know, you had to chant all this stuff. Just, just as you do with woke ideology, you know? You've got the-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. The tweet from, uh, the tweet from J.K. Rowling was, "War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength. The pianist individual who raped you is a woman."
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. So, I mean, quite a pithy, incisive, and clear... (laughs) You know, you can s- really see what she's saying. So obviously that's, that's denounced as, uh, transphobic when it's n- it's not transphobic. I mean, she's not, um... Obviously, you know, J.K. Rowling, obviously there's, there's transphobes out there. But I think J.K. Rowling and me, probably you, we recognize that, you know, transgender women and transgender men who really transition and really put the effort in and, you know, wanna live as that gender, um, are genuinely... You know, I, I know transgender women. They're genuinely trans- transgender. They're genuinely women, and I, I see them as women. Um, but if you're just a bloke who's saying that they're transgender using, you know, exploiting the self-identification rules to say that they're a woman, it's like, "No, you're not." You're not what it-
- CWChris Williamson
Well, I don't understand the... The thing, the thing that I don't understand is that that seems to me to undermine genuine trans people's rights more than criticizing-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... people that do that. You shouldn't want to have your movement, uh, and your identity co-opted by people who genuinely don't believe it and just see it as a, a, an opportunistic way to move themselves to a different type of prison or to get out of, um, particular types of culpability.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. No. Absolutely.
- CWChris Williamson
It's scary, man.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I don't, I don't know. So I've spent, um... Since I've been out here in
- 9:04 – 15:21
Spending Time with Blaire White
- CWChris Williamson
Austin, I've spent a good bit of time with a girl called Blaire White. Are you familiar with her?
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. So I've spent a good bit of time with Blaire, who is a, uh, trans woman. And fucking hell, man. Like, it's been, it's, it's the first time that I've spent a s- a, a significant amount of time around somebody that's trans.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
And it's really been, um, like an eye-opener to me because I s- it's easy to see her. I mean, uh, have you seen what Blaire looks like?
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. I mean, so she's, she's about as womanly as you're going to get. She looks like someone-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... who's about to step onto Love Island. And-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... it's im- it's, it would be impossible to think of her as anything else but a woman. And she, uh, is pre-op. She's not had the downstairs surgery. Um, but I mean, dude-
- LKLeo Kearse
Well, a, a lot of transgender women don't have the surgery because then you've got like a, there's a one-in-three chance you'll never orgasm again.
- CWChris Williamson
No way.
- LKLeo Kearse
It's not a... Yeah, it's not a particularly, you know, good or successful surgery to have.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay.
- LKLeo Kearse
So, um-
- CWChris Williamson
I didn't know that. Um, but-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... dude, there's no way that I couldn't see. And this is the thing. I said this to, to Michael Malice, who I was out with, and I'm like, "Look, dude, is it wrong for me to say that it is so much easier for me to treat Blaire like a woman because she looks and acts and sounds and is shaped like a woman?"
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. No. It's absolutely not wrong. And that's what, you know, all, um, you know, tr- I think there's such a debate over, like, you know, what is a woman? When, when does a transgender woman become a woman? And, uh, I think there's obviously a hotness rule. There's obviously a hot- like, if you reach a certain level of hotness, you can use the women's toilets. You can use the women's changing rooms. And if you're just, like, a bloke with a beard and stuff, no, you can't use the women's changing rooms 'cause you're not a woman. And I'd apply this to biological women as well. So, I mean, a lot of the TERFs who were, you know, criticizing me for, uh, for saying transgender women are women, you know, I was looking at some of them, and it's like, you're barely classifiable as a mammal. Like, how can you be sitting there like this dumpy, you know, mid-50s, like, you know, hairy-chinned harridan battleaxe being all like, "Oh, these women aren't women"? It's like, you're not a woman.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
Like, Blaire White is way more, way more of a woman than some of these TERFy old bints. You know what I mean?
- CWChris Williamson
Well, I mean, Blaire even committed, she's committed so much to being a woman that she even drives badly.
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
So that, that was... Being in her car, she's got a bright pink Mustang, um, which-
- LKLeo Kearse
Nice.
- CWChris Williamson
So I pulled out of the gym and drove past where Joe Rogan's recording studio is, which is supposed to be semi-secret but pretty much everybody in Austin knows where it is.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
And there's this bright pink fucking Ford Mustang outside. I'm like, if anyone wanted to advertise not only that Blaire White's on his show but also where the studio is-
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- 15:21 – 21:00
The Fantastic Beasts Trailer
- CWChris Williamson
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
It's all, it's all up in the air. But then JK Rowling's been written out of the Fantastic Beasts trailer. Did you see that? That's just got released today.
- LKLeo Kearse
M- man, it's r- it's, uh, ridiculous. Like, uh, it's ridiculous. And, like, obviously somebody like JK Rowling, she's got her billions of pounds. She's still making money from the Fantastic Beasts and whatever, but she's not said anything that's particularly horrific. She's said stuff... I mean, she's said stuff that maybe I wouldn't agree with, like, but other people say stuff that I, I don't agree with. I don't think they should be, like, you know, removed from, like-
- CWChris Williamson
Her own body of work.
- LKLeo Kearse
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. "JK Rowling's name has been downgraded in a trailer promoting the latest film of her Fantastic Beasts series amid a row over views on trans identification. Unlike previous adverts, uh, for the franchise, Rowling's name barely features in the two and a half minute trailer for the third installment, Fantastic Beasts" something, something, something. "The new trailer opens with the caption, 'Warner Bros invites you,' while the 2018 film said, 'JK Rowling invites you'"-
- LKLeo Kearse
Mm.
- CWChris Williamson
"... "and credit her, credited her with writing and producing her film. Kiri Tunks, co-founder of the campaign group Women's Place UK told The Daily Telegraph, 'This attempt to detach a female author from her own creative achievement is astonishing, but is just the latest episode in a long history of women being erased.'" So now you have the intersecting, uh, groups of, of concern coming in. Okay. So we're-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... actually more bothered about women and their progress? Or are we more bothered about protecting trans people and their progress and people that aren't actually trans and are pretending to be?
- LKLeo Kearse
Hmm. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
It's a difficult one, man. I don't know-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
I don't know how this ends up, uh, ends up finishing, but JK Rowling continues to get herself into hot water quite easily.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Just by saying stuff that's, you know, fairly pithy and you can see the point she's making. And it's like, we should be able to make points. We should be able to say that like, you know, if a man, uh, rapes a woman, um, he's, you know, there's an issue with him. Then saying that he's a woman going to a tra- uh, going to a women's prison. The, you know... It's, uh, it's really obvious truth. This, this is the thing that really surprises me about wokism, is how, how similar it is to communism in that you're not allowed to say really obvious truths. And everybody has to pretend that the, the lie is the truth.
- CWChris Williamson
Against the sort of party line, so to speak. I mean...
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. I don't know, man. E- especially given the fact that you don't need to have gone through legal changes. You don't need to have shown that you've been transitioning for a period of time.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
And it's like, fuck, do you know what it is? If you haven't done those things and if you rape somebody, like, the benefit of the doubt gets to go out of the window. You've sequestered any goodwill from society-
- LKLeo Kearse
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
... if that happens. And who the fuck's-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Who the fuck's supposed to be defending rapists here?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
How have we got onto a situation where rapists are being defended?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, but the ideological strength of the sort of trans rights, or a certain section of the trans rights movement, uh, I don't think they represent, I don't think they speak for a lot of trans people, but the, the ideological purity overrides, you know, any sort of real world, uh, questions or, you know, any- anything like the fact that, you know, what about her rapist? It's ridiculous.
- CWChris Williamson
What's-
- LKLeo Kearse
I mean, I was, I was, and I was talking to, um, India Willoughby, who's a, is a trans journalist. Um, so she, she called Andy Ngo a Nazi. So, you know, I, I just did a tweet about how, you know, the, the word Nazi has been devalued so much that, you know, this, this, uh, gay, BAME, uh, journalist, uh, the son of Vietnamese refugees who, you know, exposes, uh, corruption and hypocrisy and violence in, on the left, um, you know, is, is deemed a Nazi. And, uh, you know, she, she pel-... It turn- turned out somebody, somebody added to the, the thread saying that, um, India Willoughby had described, described him as an Uncle Tom, which is obviously a viciously racist thing to, to say. Um, and, but he, he misgendered India when he said it. And India was all, "You've misgendered me!" Like, as if that was the thing that we should all be paying attention to, not her racism.
- 21:00 – 27:51
The Government’s Conversion Therapy Bill
- LKLeo Kearse
did a video about it. Um, so basically the government's, uh, bringing through this bill to, to ban conversion therapy, which so- sounds like a good, good idea on the face of it, because, you know, conversion therapy historically has involved, you know, elec- administering electric shocks to, to gay people, uh, while they watch gay porn, which obviously doesn't stop them being gay, it just introduces them to, to a fetish. Um, and, uh, yeah, like all kinds of laying on of hands, praying. Um, like Lou, Lou Reed. Lou Reed was subject to it. This, I mean, this, this only stopped in the, or, you know, stopped being administered by the, by the state or by official authorities in, I think it was about the '70s. So it's, you know, relatively a recent thing that, that stopped. Um, and, you know, in the old days they did things like transplanting testicles, um, to try and, uh, make people straight. It was, you know, crazy and barbaric. Even lobotomies.
- CWChris Williamson
What, like, the, the testicles were the, were the, the center, the epicenter of the gayness?
- LKLeo Kearse
I guess. That's, that's what the thought was. It's the, the epicenter of your, your sexuality. So, um, yeah. I don't-
- CWChris Williamson
That is fucking medieval, isn't it?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
Jesus.
- LKLeo Kearse
I think even, even lobotomies and stuff as well. So, um, it's crazy, 'cause ho- homosexuality up until like the '60s or the '70s was actually classified as a mental illness. Um, and, you know, so obviously it's barbaric, and I mean, it still goes on, you know, sometimes, particularly with, you know, religious groups and, um, you know, it's bad. But what the, what the government's conversion therapy bill does is, uh, it also bans... Uh, it classifies, um, any sort of treatment for gender dysphoria, um, other than, um, actually transitioning, classifies that as, uh, conversion therapy. So if you, if you... But a lot of transgender people, especially, you know, children, teenagers, um, they're presenting... They're confused about their sexuality or they've got, um, uh, depression or anxiety or there's other things that are affecting it. And between... The, the data we've got at the moment says that between 60 and 90% of them, uh, will reconcile to their biological, uh, gender, their natal gender, um, if, if allowed to. But the, the system we've got at the moment is, is just funneling them into, into treatment. Um, so they-
- CWChris Williamson
Because the only current procedure which is permitted is to reassign gender.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. So they're, they're put on puberty blockers, which are, you know, they say, "Oh, this is just to, to buy time." Uh, but it's, it's not. It starts a sort of cascade and they're, they're put into, into a, um, a sort of conveyor belt, um, that, um, leads them to, to be given cross-sex hormones and then surgery. And it happens surprisingly quickly considering the sort of, um, you know, how traumatic and how, you know, powerful the side effects of some of these things are. Um, so a lot of the drugs, the hormones, the puberty blockers, they, um, they can cause infertility, they can weaken bones, um, you know, cause all sorts of problems. And also the surgery, um, you know, if you remove breasts, that's permanent. Um, if you, uh, you know, transition the genitals with surgery, that's permanent and causes infertility as well. So there's a lot of, uh, there's a lot of issues with, with this. But, you know, children... And, and th- this industry has just sort of exploded. Um, just a few years ago, there was just one ge- one gender transition clinic in the States, now there's over 300. So this huge industry has, has blown up. And-... they're not allowed to have a, a sort of free and honest and open debate around it because, uh, academia and, and the medical industry is systemically woke. So any questioning of any of this is seen as, uh, as transphobic.
- CWChris Williamson
Fuck's sake.
- LKLeo Kearse
And is, is silenced and shut down. And any academics that research it, um, even if, even if they're, you know, taking a balanced look and being a, you know, sympathetic, um, to transgender people, they, they get, they get denounced and their, their books are banned and, um, they, they get, you know, thrown out of their universities. So there isn't the data and there isn't the, the debate and the sort of academic research that is really needed, um, to, you know, to judge what's best. And this, this bill sort of adds to that by, by, um, outlawing any treatment other than gender, uh, gender reassignment surgery.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah, uh, so-
- LKLeo Kearse
... and ... and drugs.
- CWChris Williamson
... what's, what's being implied there is that nobody that could suffer with gender dysphoria would want to not continue with their gender dysphoria. Like if-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... if you were to try and reverse that or if someone was to try and stress test your, uh, ideas around your own gender identity, um, that is also now put underneath trying to turn gay people straight again.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It's, it's classed as the same kind of thing which is, which is ridiculous and not based on any data.
- CWChris Williamson
Fact.
- LKLeo Kearse
And also the, you know, the, there isn't really a huge problem with the gender, um, uh, with, sorry, with conversion therapy in, in the UK. We don't have, we don't have a huge amount of, um, you know, people administering electric shocks to gay people to try and make them straight. It's something that happened in the '60s and isn't happening now.
- CWChris Williamson
I couldn't believe that that was even like still a thing.
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Even slightly still a thing. I, I mean, uh-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... when I first saw this and I didn't realize the externalities to people that are suffering with, um, gender dysphoria for their gender identity, I'm like, "What the fu- what is this?" It, it was just Alan Turing back from the dead to become medically castrated again. It feels so medieval.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Well, Al- Alan Turing is, uh, you know, a famous, um, victim of, of conversion therapy. So yeah, chemical castration. I think he chose chemical castration because the option was going to jail, uh, for, for being gay. And obviously, uh, jail is, you know, if you're gonna, if you're thinking about punishment, jail is not where you wanna send gay people. They're gonna have a great time in there.
- CWChris Williamson
Didn't he end up (laughs) ...
- LKLeo Kearse
Uh, um ...
- CWChris Williamson
Well, wasn't it something that you said about, um, some of the conversion therapy things were just putting loads of boys in a room with priests for a couple of weeks?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The Pray The Gay Away camps. One of my mates went to, got sent to one and it's, it's ridiculous. I mean, like, you know, like (laughs) if you take like 200 gay teenage boys and put them at a camp together overseen by priests, there's not gonna be less anal sex going on in that camp. You know what I mean?
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- 27:51 – 33:25
Jesy Nelson’s Blackfishing Controversy
- LKLeo Kearse
- CWChris Williamson
Okay. So, uh, Jesy Nelson, former Little Mix singer addresses music video controversy.
- LKLeo Kearse
Hmm. Yeah. I did see this. So she's, she's been accused of, um... And this has happened to a few people in popula- it's happened to Louisa Ormiston, the comedian. So they, they get accused of, um, appropriating black culture to try and be cooler.
- CWChris Williamson
Yes. Which, which really, I mean, it is cooler. Black culture is a fair bit cool.
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Like white people, white people culture isn't exactly the coolest thing on the planet and-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... I don't think that any Black person would say that it is either. You stick to your own cool culture. Former Little Mix singer Jesy Nelson said she never intended to cause offense after being accused of blackfishing in her debut solo track. The singer, 30, was criticized by some people in social media for her appearance in the video for Boyz. Nelson was accused of blackfishing, a practice of non, of a non-Black person trying to appear Black but has denied using fake tan (laughs) during ...
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) I can't believe that they're like, "Well, get the Dulux color chart out, Jesy. Have you gone below an eight here? Because that nine, that is not to be used by you at all." Uh, also-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... Nicki Minaj has got like based over the last couple of months, hasn't she?
- LKLeo Kearse
I haven't seen anything by Nicki Minaj. But I do know that like if you go, like the whitest cities like Glasgow, uh, Newcastle as well, uh, you know, where we, we are from, you go there, people are, people really put on the tan and they go to tanning salons in, you know, Glasgow. Man, you'd think your, uh, everybody's like Oompa Loompa color.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- LKLeo Kearse
It's insane.
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I think that another problem isn't just the way that... Because she didn't have dreads. It wasn't like-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... how would you say? Uh, archetypal ancient sort of the, the, the commonly held desires of Black people and the way that their grandparents would have dressed. It's like wearing a pair of Air Force 1s and-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... and baggy tracksuit bottoms. It's hardly what I see as the crux of Black culture.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah. Uh, absolutely. Absolutely. There's no do-rag. You know, there's no, um, you know, feathers-
- CWChris Williamson
She's-
- LKLeo Kearse
... or anything.
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, here we g- Here was another one actually. Uh, Nelson said she's fortunate to easily tan when in the sun and told Mina-
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
So she did a live... I can't believe that you need to go and do an Instagram live with Nicki Minaj to try and rehabilitate your public image. Told Minaj that-
- LKLeo Kearse
Is that what she did?
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. Pretty much. (laughs) Uh-
- LKLeo Kearse
That's hilarious.
- CWChris Williamson
Uh, somebody had previously commented on her propensity to tan. Okay. So she's got an alibi to how easily she tans. Uh-
- 33:25 – 42:29
Leo’s Debate with Kate Smurthwaite
- CWChris Williamson
What happened there?
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, yeah. Yeah, with Kate Smurthwaite. Do you know Kate Smurthwaite?
- CWChris Williamson
No. She's got very standy-outy neck veins. Uh, that I-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
... noticed that, that you managed to cause some serious neck vascularity to happen-
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
... during that (laughs) debate. That was the main thing I took away from it.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah, I, uh, it was, uh, it was hilarious. Basically she, um... So it was on Sunday, it was on GB News and we were debating freedom of speech in comedy. And she came up with all these bizarre claims, like, she says she hears racist jokes. Every month she hears racist jokes, uh, told by other comedians at gigs she's doing. And, like, I, I don't hear racist jokes. I, you know, I gig most nights and, um, you know, I do working men's clubs and all the rest of it. You know, I do shows in London, I do do anyth- anything I'm booked for, Butlins, whatever, and I don't hear any racist jokes. And, uh, I'm considered, uh, to be a, you know, far-right Nazi, racist, homophobe, transphobe, and all the rest of it. So I'd, I'd think that I'd be put on bills with the racist comedians if, if there were any. Um, I never hear any and I, I know why I don't hear any, because if you told a racist joke, uh, on stage at a comedy club, um, people wouldn't like it because it's 2021, um, and we're performing in front of... You know, every time we perform, we're performing in front of a group of people, uh, who are just, you know, members of the public. So if you say anything that's socially unacceptable they won't accept it because that's how socially unacceptable works. Um, but yes, K- and Kate said she's... You know, and she's doing all these, like, woke... The only, the only gigs she, she does are, like, you know, super woke.
- CWChris Williamson
Well, she's a comedian.
- LKLeo Kearse
She's a comedian, yeah, although
- CWChris Williamson
You are kidding me.
- LKLeo Kearse
... I'll, I'll... Well, I've never... Um-
- CWChris Williamson
I could have sworn that she was some sort of, I don't know, journalist, editor lady. I didn't know that she was a comedian.
- LKLeo Kearse
Well, I haven't, I haven't actually gigged with her in a comedy club since, uh, like, we did the Jersey Comedy Festival in like 2012 or something. Um, so yeah, it's been like eight or nine years since I've actually performed with her. Um, and so may- maybe she's not really a comedian. I look- I looked on her, um, gigs list online and there's no gigs booked in. So, I don't know, I don't know where she's, I don't know where she's performing that other people are doing racist jokes. But I think, you know, she might have been lying. Um, and yeah, she said, uh, yeah, the, the women's football thing, 'cause, you know, 'cause people... She was, she was saying it was right that Roy Chubby Brown should have been canceled and people were right to write in letters and stuff. So Roy Chubby Brown is du- due to perform in Sheffield and he was canceled by, uh, Sheffield Council 'cause they said he doesn't reflect the values of Sheffield Council. And it's like, yeah, he's not supposed to reflect the values of Sheffield C- He's not the mayor, he's a fucking comedian and, like, I don't want to go and see some, like, uh, council value show. That sounds shit. That sounds so boring. I don't want... Like, man, I used to work in local government and they're all so wasteful and boring and shit we should just do away with them. Just get, like, you know, a small council that, like, collects the bins and keeps the, keeps the roads in good nick. Um, but yeah, so they canceled Roy Chubby Brown and she was saying it's right that they canceled, canceled him and, uh, I was just saying, like, I just don't think... You know, like, if, if you don't want to go see a comedian, if you don't think a comedian's good or funny just don't go and see them. I did a show at one of my favorite clubs in London, um, and somebody wrote a letter...... into the club, I wrote an email into the club saying that, "Oh, I came to see Leo Kearsey's show in July at your venue and it was horrifically offensive and horrible. Um, and I came back to see it again in November and it was still horrifically offensive and horrible. Please cancel him from your, you know, your club." It's like, instead of canceling me, why don't you stop coming to the show?
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
You know what I mean? Like, uh, it's absolutely ridiculous. I don't even think they were, uh, at the show, 'cause they said I was, like, homophobic and all the rest of it. I didn't say anything. Like, the, the club film everything because you've got to these days to, you know, cover yourself. And they reviewed the footage and realized I hadn't said any of the stuff that she said. And I'm always-
- CWChris Williamson
What did you, what did you mean that they need to film everything to cover yourselves? What's that?
- LKLeo Kearse
So if somebody says, "Oh, you, you know, this person said something misogynist," they need to be able to review the footage and see-
- CWChris Williamson
No way.
- LKLeo Kearse
... what the person said.
- CWChris Williamson
And that's happening-
- LKLeo Kearse
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
That's common practice in the UK?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, yeah. It seems to be now. I, I record everything. Every show that I do, I record the audio so, you know, if anybody complains then I've got that as a, as a backup-
- CWChris Williamson
No fucking way.
- LKLeo Kearse
... to defend myself. Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
That's wild.
- LKLeo Kearse
And yet people wonder why comedy is becoming incredibly bland and comedians are self-censoring so much, you know? (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
That's wild.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- 42:29 – 50:37
Trans Athletes in Women’s Sport
- CWChris Williamson
trans swimmer? You seen this one?
- LKLeo Kearse
No.
- CWChris Williamson
Okay. So, um, it-
- LKLeo Kearse
'Cause this is, this... Trans athletes, uh, that's an area where it does kind of, um, you know, a lot of the arguments do break down. You've got, like, Laurel Hubbard who, uh, you know... Transition means she was in her 30s. Tr- competed as a male athlete previously. So it's like, that's not fair. You know what I mean? That is not fair.
- CWChris Williamson
No, I mean, this was-
- LKLeo Kearse
And Fal- Falon Fox in, in UFC, you know, like the, uh, women that fought her said, you know, "I've never experienced strength like that." And obviously, because th- that's like a man who's like, you know, totally hulked out and stuff. So you've got like, you know, going through male puberty conveys certain advantages to transgender athletes. You get like, um, you know, bigger skeleton, stronger bone structure, greater muscle mass, it's easier to power park inside the stadium.
- CWChris Williamson
Being on a, a course of testosterone, a high course of testosterone compared with your gender for 35 years-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... and then decided to pivot out. So yeah, um, it's impossible to-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, imagine if you're doing steroids for 30 years and then-
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah.
- LKLeo Kearse
... like, you know ...
- CWChris Williamson
Cycled off and said, "Right, I'm now going to compete."
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, yeah. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
Yeah. "It's impossible to beat her: despondent female rivals say swimming against trans Lia Thomas is 'intimidating' and 'discouraging'" (coughs) ... after teammates spoke out and said, "Everyone knows it's wrong." She beat her next closest opponent by a full 38 seconds, uh-
- LKLeo Kearse
Whoa-ho-ho-ho.
- CWChris Williamson
... and won pretty much everything basically.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
She broke two national records when she competed. She'd competed up until 2019 and then had a little break and come back. There's something, I don't know how you feel about this, man, there's something that feels particularly ... I, I, I really don't know where I stand on the, the trans women in, in sports discussion because it is ... You, you do want people to be able to compete in their chosen pursuit and if they're good and so on, but then also you know that there's this unfair advantage. But then making a trans women only division also doesn't really feel like a particularly good outcome. Making them com-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... continue to compete with men also doesn't feel like a particularly good outcome. I, I kind of struggle to see a good way to put this.
- LKLeo Kearse
Well, what, what about, what about if we put them in the, uh, Paralympics and then instead of, uh, women getting beaten by 38 seconds, it was somebody with Down syndrome getting beaten by like four hours and 12 minutes? Would that be a, a good solution?
- CWChris Williamson
No. (laughs) No, we can't do that either. That's ... Good suggestion, but I'm not convinced that that's going to work. Um.
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
But there's something that, that feels particularly egregious about it being college athletes or like kids-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... because you know that at that stage, there's more branches of life open to them, right? There's more paths that they could go down to sponsorships, scholarships, paths to go to university and move into professional sport and stuff like that. I don't know, there's something about that. Do you get that sense as well that there's just something like extra unfair about trans athletes in college that are taking spaces from other athlete... I don't know.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah, I mean, like the whole thing about athletes is I feel like they've got an unfair advantage through some trick of biology anyway. Um, so I'm kind of, you know ... And also, I'm not, I'm not a feminist. I'm delighted to see, uh, women upset that they've been beaten by a biological male. So, um, yeah, I mean, I can't really see, I can't really see the downside. It's, um, you know, (laughs) like ... And you look at also, look at the women weightlifters that Laurel Hubbard was competing against. They weren't like dainty little, like, maid- maidens. They're like, they look like, you know, big old lumps as well. Um, I mean, obviously if I was a woman or I, you know, cared, then I'd think differently. But, um, I, I genuinely, um, I genuinely just quite enjoy watching feminists and, uh, and, and transgender rights activists tear each other apart on, on things like that.
- CWChris Williamson
I don't know what's gonna happen as you continue rolling forward with the intersecting ideologies of whoever's the, got the most grievance. Like-
- LKLeo Kearse
Mm-hmm.
- 50:37 – 1:03:24
Why Wokeism is Harming the Black Community
- CWChris Williamson
There was a, um, a Denver elementary school that put a, a sign outside advertising Families of color- of Color Playground Night. So they've essentially created a racially segregated playtime for equity.
- LKLeo Kearse
(laughs) They do this a lot. Sainsbury's did it as well. They had, uh, they had safe spaces, um, for, for ethnic employees, um, which, you know, the thing with any sort of separation by, by race is, you know, it's, it's separating people by race. It's, whether you say you're doing it for a- an altruistic or a positive reason doesn't matter because you're separating by race. And then it, then it gives, um, it gives sort of ammunition or validates anybody who wants to separate people by race for, for nefarious reasons, for racist reasons.
- CWChris Williamson
There was a, was it a 12 days, uh, 12 Weeks a Slave workout that was released.
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, God.
- CWChris Williamson
Was that last year? Was that by Sainsbury's as well? Because... And, and it was something like-
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, God, yeah. Sainsbury's are terrible.
- CWChris Williamson
... being, because being a slave was hard and so is this workout?
- LKLeo Kearse
Oh, yeah, yeah, I remember that. That wasn't Sainsbury's. That was a personal trainer, who-
- CWChris Williamson
Was it?
- LKLeo Kearse
... then, then had a, had an internet pile-on.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
Uh, which is kind of unfair because, I mean, I think, I think he was Black, um, and he had this pile-on. Uh, he just hadn't thought it through, but he's a personal trainer. If he could-
- CWChris Williamson
It is poor, it is poor marketing. Yeah, he's thinking with his muscles.
- LKLeo Kearse
If, if he could, but if he could think things through, he wouldn't be a personal trainer.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
You know what I mean? Getting paid like 12 Pound an hour to like help housewives do sit-ups. Like, obviously he's not going to be the brain of Britain.
- CWChris Williamson
Ah. I don't know, they, they-
- LKLeo Kearse
But Sainsbury's, Sainsbury's-
- CWChris Williamson
The whole racially segregated thing is, is kind of a little bit of a weird one because...
- LKLeo Kearse
Mm-hmm.
- CWChris Williamson
I think one, one argument that I saw to do with Denver, I don't know much about Denver, apparently not a lot of Black people. Uh, so-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... it, you're f- f- finding a way for people to be able to create a community. But it feels like anything that's bureaucratically forced, top-down, anything that's dictatorial and not just, look, if you want to hang together in the schoolyard or after school or when you collect people, like who the f-
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah.
- CWChris Williamson
... who the fuck's the elementary school to say that this is the way that we should exist in the world?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. And it's, it's terrible. It's drawing attention to racial differences rather than sort of, you know, because I was, I was always brought up, you know, school taught us that, you know, race is only skin deep. And obviously, it's not. There's cultural differences and all the rest of it. Um, but we were taught to sort of be friends with each other. We're, we're in Scotland, so it didn't make any difference. There weren't any Black people. But, um, but yeah, cer- and certainly, you know, I've got Black friends who say, you know, things are regressing, things are getting worse, uh, because it used to be that everybody would just hang out together and now we're having this sort of top-down enforced, um, separation of people. And, you know, Sainsbury's, companies are exploiting it and exploiting the division. Sainsbury's had that, that terrible tweet that was, uh, they basically said, um, you know, anybody is welcome to shop in, in Sainsbury's no matter what their, what their race. Uh, and if you don't like it, go and shop somewhere else. And it's like, it's fine to say, you know, everybody's welcome to shop in Sainsbury's regardless of their race. I mean, I'd a- I'd assume that was the case anyway. I wouldn't assume Sainsbury's was racist even though they're owned by the Qatari royals which, you know, they run a extremely racist country with a, you know, genuinely, objectively racist regime, um, that actually uses slaves. Uh, the slavery, you know... It's mad that for all the people bang on about slavery, they only bang on about transatlantic slavery that finished 400 years ago and was ended by the British. Uh, nobody bangs on about the fact that, you know, there's more slaves now in the world than there, there was 400 years ago at the peak of transatlantic slavery.
- CWChris Williamson
No way.
- LKLeo Kearse
And, uh, yeah, yeah. Like, and, and China. So you've got like, um, uh, companies like Nike, uh, and Apple using the Uyghur Muslim, uh, slaves. So they, they contract to the Chinese government. The Chinese government has, uh, around about a million Uyghur slaves, uh, held in, in work camps. So basically slave labor. Basically concentration camps, um, but slave labor and they, they have to, um...... you know, work for the Chinese government. Um, so, you know, Nikes get- get made there. And Nikes that are then sold by Colin Kaepernick as a, you know, this is, we're standing up for minorities. It's the most fucked up, most fucked up world. It's- it's great being a comedian now because there's so much stuff to talk about. In the '90s, all I could talk about was airline food. But now, there's a- all this like, you know, genuinely horrific, uh, you know, fascistic stuff going on.
- CWChris Williamson
And Sainsbury's-
- LKLeo Kearse
But see-
- 1:03:24 – 1:05:29
What’s Next for Leo
- CWChris Williamson
up next? What's next on the plate for you?
- LKLeo Kearse
So, yeah, hopefully I'm gonna get over Omicron soon. Uh-
- CWChris Williamson
Oh, fuck. Have you had to rearrange a ton of dates?
- LKLeo Kearse
Uh, yeah. Just, I canceled a ... But I was supposed to headline for this Free Speech Union gig last night. Um, and I was supposed to be up in Blackpool and, uh, Liverpool in Burscough, or whatever it's called, um, this weekend. But I've had to cancel those. Um, so yeah, I'm just, I'm, I'm just taking the, the opportunity to write stuff for my YouTube channel. So I'll be doing a new video. I'm gonna do a, a video next about woke sportspeople, 'cause we've got the Sports Personality of the Year competition coming up on the 19th, so I'm gonna do it. And all these people are like, "Man, Marcus Rashford, you know, he's all, 'Oh, the government needs to, you know, government needs to, um, provide free school meals to all the children and stuff.'" Then he's dodging his taxes. He's paid himself with a loan. So he, you know, you don't need to pay tax on a loan. Uh, you can just not pay the loan back. So, you know, if he paid his taxes, the government... If all these people, all these woke people... Woke people are always like, "The government needs to do this." It's like, man, you can give the government more money if you want. I don't want to give the government any more money, but you can, seeing as you think it's so important. Then the government can afford to give a, you know, all the kids can get a free school meal and a Faberge egg or whatever the hell they want.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
Like, you know what I mean? It's ridiculous. Gary Lineker. Gary Lineker is always, like, swanning around Twitter being all like, you know, criticizing Laurence Fox or whoever for, for being terrible people. And it's like, Gary Lineker makes his money from the BBC, which is basically taxpayers' money. And then he, like, he decides he doesn't have enough money from all the hundreds of thousands of pounds he gets each year from the BBC, so he sells crisps. He markets crisps to obese children who are at risk of diabetes. Uh, so he's basically, he's basically deliberately killing children for money. It's like you can't... He's basically like Gaddafi's son.
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs)
- LKLeo Kearse
Gary Lineker is an absolute... You know what I mean? For these people to then try and take the moral high ground. It's like, how about you stop killing children, Gary? It's like, he'd be selling cigarettes at a playground out of the back of a van if it were his choice, but instead, you know, he's, he's selling Walkers crisps instead.
- CWChris Williamson
Woke Personality of the Year, then, so that's done. Where can people go if they want to check out the YouTube channel?
- 1:05:29 – 1:06:11
Where to Find Leo
- CWChris Williamson
- LKLeo Kearse
Yes, I've got a YouTube channel. Just Leo, Leo Kearse, um, that's, that's how you find it. Or my Instagram's scottishcomedian, all one word.
- CWChris Williamson
No way, you've got scottishcomedian on Instagram?
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. Yeah, I couldn't believe it was available either. It's amazing.
- CWChris Williamson
Fuck you, Daniel Sloss. Fuck you.
- LKLeo Kearse
Yeah. (laughs)
- CWChris Williamson
(laughs) Man, it's been really good to speak today. Uh, I hope that you get over your Omicron and you have a good Christmas and, uh, I will catch you-
- LKLeo Kearse
Thanks, bro. You too.
- CWChris Williamson
... in the new year. What's happening, people? Thank you very much for tuning in. If you enjoyed that episode, then press here for a selection of the best clips from the podcast over the last few weeks. And don't forget to subscribe. Peace.
Episode duration: 1:06:11
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