Liam Neeson, Fyre Festival & Brian Cox | Catch Up 101

1. 0:01 – 1:47

   Rapid-fire catch-up banter: meditation, Mac vs PC, and minor life admin

   1. CWChris Williamson0:01

      Yeah. We went to a meditation retreat, didn't we?

   2. JOJonny0:03

      It was amazing, but it was really difficult. For anyone who is considering doing a meditation retreat, it's really fucking hard.

   3. CWChris Williamson0:10

      (laughs)

   4. JOJonny0:10

      Why did you buy a MacBook rather than a PC?

   5. YUYusef0:12

      Anyone, use a PC for three minutes and it'll answer that question.

   6. CWChris Williamson0:17

      So-

   7. YUYusef0:17

      So I've been rear-ended twice in the last month.

   8. CWChris Williamson0:20

      In a car.

   9. YUYusef0:20

      In a car.

   10. CWChris Williamson0:21

       We should clarify that.

   11. JOJonny0:22

       In a car.

   12. CWChris Williamson0:22

       Yeah.

   13. YUYusef0:22

       You know what it is? As soon as you feel that impact, the sense is, it's not like, "Ah, my neck." It's, it's just all of the admin flashes before your eyes.

   14. CWChris Williamson0:30

       (laughs)

   15. JOJonny0:30

       (laughs)

   16. YUYusef0:30

       All of the like, "Oh my God-

   17. CWChris Williamson0:32

       Like a bright light.

   18. YUYusef0:32

       ... the paperwork. Oh."

   19. CWChris Williamson0:33

       And fuss with planes.

   20. JOJonny0:34

       This is why you shouldn't be allowed on a plane unless you've got an iPhone. And everything would be much simpler, because the people who've made bad decisions would be confined to the, where they live.

   21. CWChris Williamson0:42

       You've finally got onto the life hack of getting your hair cut at home, haven't you?

   22. YUYusef0:46

       Yeah, I have.

   23. CWChris Williamson0:46

       Before the hairdresser went round to his, she texted me to say, "Hang on a second, I'm about to go round to this person's house that I've never met before. I probably should think about my own safety. Is he, is he a weirdo?" And I'm like... (laughs)

   24. JOJonny1:01

       (laughs) Ladies and gentlemen, look who's joined me again. Johnny and Yusuf from propanefitness.com. It's been a long while, welcome back.

   25. YUYusef1:12

       Welcome.

   26. JOJonny1:13

       Thank you. Welcome to us. Welcome to you, sir.

   27. CWChris Williamson1:15

       (laughs)

   28. YUYusef1:16

       (laughs)

   29. JOJonny1:16

       So, today we're doing a catch-up episode. No agenda, no topics in hand other than just what's been going on in our lives recently. So what's been going on in your life recently, Jonathan? What have you been doing? Why do you... I almost went throwing the TV at him.

   30. CWChris Williamson1:30

       Jonathan's a famous hot potato.
2. 1:47 – 2:57

   Jonny on national TV: getting onto Pointless without watching it

   1. CWChris Williamson1:47

      So why were you on TV?

   2. JOJonny1:47

      God. So I was basically put on TV-

   3. CWChris Williamson1:54

      (laughs)

   4. JOJonny1:54

      ... by someone who wanted to go on Pointless but didn't have a partner.

   5. CWChris Williamson1:56

      (laughs)

   6. JOJonny1:57

      So if you, if you don't watch Pointless, it's a, it's aired, I think it's six days a week in the UK. Have you ever seen Pointless?

   7. CWChris Williamson2:05

      No.

   8. JOJonny2:06

      You've probably seen the bit-

   9. YUYusef2:07

      I have not.

   10. JOJonny2:07

       ... that I was in.

   11. CWChris Williamson2:07

       Yeah.

   12. JOJonny2:08

       Right, yeah. So that was very much like me before I realized, like, on the train on the way down, I should probably watch an episode of this.

   13. CWChris Williamson2:15

       (laughs)

   14. JOJonny2:16

       So-

   15. YUYusef2:16

       Just find a hotspot and quickly getting up at the right part.

   16. JOJonny2:18

       Yeah.

   17. YUYusef2:18

       There was a man, he asked me a question.

   18. JOJonny2:19

       So in the, in like the, the warmup, so you arrive, I'm in the room and the woman said, "Sometimes people get to this point and they haven't seen an episode of the show." And I'm like, "Fuck."

   19. CWChris Williamson2:29

       (laughs)

   20. JOJonny2:30

       Like, I-

   21. YUYusef2:30

       So that is a common problem, then? It's not like... 'Cause I thought you would be the only person-

   22. JOJonny2:33

       No, no, no. She was making that out to be, at least it's not that bad. You know, at least it's not that ridiculous.

   23. YUYusef2:38

       And you were just like...

   24. JOJonny2:39

       Mm-hmm.

   25. YUYusef2:40

       (laughs)

   26. JOJonny2:40

       'Cause, 'cause when you're there, you're in their world and everyone's there taking it very seriously. And the fact that you think it's all pointless and stupid-

   27. CWChris Williamson2:46

       Yeah, yeah.

   28. JOJonny2:46

       ... pointless, isn't funny. And it's not funny to you either because you're about to go on national TV and potentially be made to look like an absolute prick. But it actually went all right. It actually went all right.

3. 2:57 – 4:19

   The wardrobe continuity crisis: the forbidden jumper and name-tag logistics

   1. CWChris Williamson2:57

      Can you tell us about your jumper? This jumper.

   2. JOJonny2:59

      Oh, yeah. No.

   3. YUYusef3:00

      No, so-

   4. JOJonny3:00

      Oh, the j- oh.

   5. YUYusef3:01

      So, so I called Johnny-

   6. JOJonny3:02

      (laughs)

   7. YUYusef3:03

      ... the day, the day before he had to go down and he was like, "Yousef-"

   8. JOJonny3:05

      No, it was the day of.

   9. YUYusef3:06

      ... "Yousef, I, I can't talk. I'm in Primark. I'm having a nightmare."

   10. JOJonny3:09

       (laughs)

   11. YUYusef3:09

       I wasn't allowed to wear any of my jumpers and I have to get a plain orange, green or blue jumper.

   12. JOJonny3:15

       It couldn't be-

   13. YUYusef3:15

       Oh, it couldn't be green.

   14. JOJonny3:16

       So it, the blue had to be a specific-

   15. YUYusef3:19

       But you can't, he was like-

   16. JOJonny3:19

       ... a very specific blue.

   17. YUYusef3:21

       ... "Obviously it can't be green." Oh, okay.

   18. JOJonny3:22

       Which is why it was the blue that I was wearing.

   19. YUYusef3:23

       And you only have navy jumpers.

   20. JOJonny3:24

       So you're not allowed, the biggest problem is you're not allowed anything with a logo.

   21. CWChris Williamson3:27

       Yeah. And Yusuf-

   22. JOJonny3:28

       'Cause that's obviously-

   23. CWChris Williamson3:28

       ... had an embroidery that's three centimeters tall.

   24. JOJonny3:31

       Mm.

   25. CWChris Williamson3:31

       Like, visible only from up close, but was too much.

   26. JOJonny3:35

       Not allowed, yeah.

   27. CWChris Williamson3:35

       So that, that's all my clothes. You can't-

   28. YUYusef3:36

       You had a name tag, didn't you?

   29. JOJonny3:37

       Yeah.

   30. YUYusef3:38

       So can they not just stick that on top of the logo?
4. 4:19 – 7:36

   Yusuf’s “work cave”: finals, becoming ‘doktor,’ and sofa hip pain

   1. CWChris Williamson4:19

      So go and watch. Yusuf, what's been going on in your life? What's been happening?

   2. YUYusef4:21

      I've just been deep in the work cave. Unfortunately there's not... You can see from my pasty complexion, I'm racially Arab and-

   3. JOJonny4:29

      (laughs)

   4. YUYusef4:29

      ... you wouldn't know.

   5. JOJonny4:30

      It's all being sucked out of you.

   6. CWChris Williamson4:31

      Yeah.

   7. YUYusef4:32

      Um, so I've got my finals coming up, so, uh, in three months' time, if I pass, then-

   8. JOJonny4:38

      Doktor.

   9. YUYusef4:39

      ... doktor.

   10. CWChris Williamson4:40

       You could be, you, you could be looking at someone's ailments.

   11. YUYusef4:43

       Yeah.

   12. JOJonny4:43

       So it's, it's the semifinals now?

   13. YUYusef4:46

       So these are the semifinals.

   14. JOJonny4:47

       Right, and then you get, you qualify into the finals.

   15. YUYusef4:48

       Into the tournament and the-

   16. JOJonny4:49

       Yeah.

   17. YUYusef4:50

       ... the premiership.

   18. CWChris Williamson4:50

       You've... There's a rou- there's a round robin, isn't there, at the start?

   19. JOJonny4:52

       Into, into a league.

   20. YUYusef4:53

       That, that's all the football words I know-

   21. CWChris Williamson4:55

       (laughs)

   22. YUYusef4:55

       ... in, in five seconds.

   23. CWChris Williamson4:56

       Offside.

   24. JOJonny4:57

       Premiership.

   25. YUYusef4:57

       Probably offside. Premiership.

   26. JOJonny4:59

       Premierships. Yeah.

   27. CWChris Williamson5:01

       (laughs) Are you showing off? You're showing off with your double pigeon hand.

   28. JOJonny5:03

       I've got a slightly tight left hip-

   29. CWChris Williamson5:05

       Has it?

   30. YUYusef5:05

       (laughs)
5. 7:36 – 9:00

   Monastery meditation retreat: beautiful setting, hard reality

   1. CWChris Williamson7:36

      We went to a meditation retreat, didn't we?

   2. YUYusef7:38

      We did. We did a one day in Harnam Monastery, called-

   3. CWChris Williamson7:43

      Harnam?

   4. YUYusef7:44

      Harnam Arunagiri.

   5. CWChris Williamson7:46

      Mm-hmm.

   6. YUYusef7:47

      In-

   7. CWChris Williamson7:47

      Bel-say.

   8. YUYusef7:48

      Bel-say. Beautiful place.

   9. CWChris Williamson7:49

      It was amazing, but it was really difficult. For anyone who is considering doing a meditation retreat, it's really fucking hard.

   10. JOJonny7:55

       (laughs)

   11. YUYusef7:55

       (laughs)

   12. CWChris Williamson7:56

       Like, yeah.

   13. YUYusef7:56

       It's the physical part of it that's hard, isn't it?

   14. CWChris Williamson7:58

       Well, it's just staying awake. Like, do you know what I mean?

   15. JOJonny8:00

       Really?

   16. CWChris Williamson8:00

       Being, being sedentary but also staying awake, but having your eyes closed.

   17. JOJonny8:04

       Yeah.

   18. CWChris Williamson8:04

       Like, it's an odd blend of-

   19. JOJonny8:06

       For that long period of time.

   20. CWChris Williamson8:06

       It's an odd blend of, uh-

   21. JOJonny8:08

       So where did you sit?

   22. CWChris Williamson8:09

       On the floor.

   23. JOJonny8:10

       Yeah. Outside? Inside?

   24. CWChris Williamson8:11

       So we did fi- pretty much 50/50 of either walking or feel out, as in outside meditation versus, uh, feel in sitting. So I was sat on a beanbag or walking around a lake, which was pretty beautiful.

   25. JOJonny8:23

       Basically like a room in the monastery that you go to?

   26. CWChris Williamson8:25

       There was a number of rooms.

   27. JOJonny8:27

       Is there?

   28. YUYusef8:27

       So we went to sit in the Dahmer Hall, where they've got sandalwood burning and a big, big Buddha statue.

   29. JOJonny8:33

       Oh, nice.

   30. YUYusef8:33

       And just a rack full of different cushions, and you can choose, like, the cushion based on your preference.
6. 9:00 – 13:32

   Rory Sutherland stories: boiler repair chaos, precise speech, and the ‘bum spray’ argument

   1. CWChris Williamson9:00

      A lot of podcasting. Podcasting with Rory Sutherland, which you enjoyed.

   2. JOJonny9:03

      Excellent.

   3. CWChris Williamson9:03

      Anyone who has not listened to the episode with Rory Sutherland, go and check it out now. It will be in the show, shownotes below.

   4. JOJonny9:08

      Listen for Chris getting absolutely pied when he has something-

   5. YUYusef9:10

      Railroaded.

   6. JOJonny9:11

      (laughs)

   7. YUYusef9:11

      Yeah. (laughs) It is excellent. Good episode.

   8. CWChris Williamson9:13

      So, during the podcast with Rory, the British gas man came round to fix his boiler, 'cause he'd had a problem. And Rory's a little bit like, kind of like Brian Blessed from Blackadder. And he's a b-big sort of gruff British man, and he, he speaks like this, "And everything's a bit fucking shit, isn't it?"

   9. JOJonny9:28

      (laughs)

   10. CWChris Williamson9:29

       And he, uh, (laughs) the British Gas guy came round. Obviously, I've cut bits out, but I had to, or I endured the entirety of the exchange, and it was just hilarious. This British Gas guy comes back after he's sent him away, and we're still podcasting. Now, I left this bit in. Sure enough, he comes back into the room, and he's like, "Uh, mate, it's, uh, it's all done in there now." "Uh, b- b- well, Chris, one second." "W- w- what's that?" "Uh, it's, uh, uh, it's all, all f- uh..." "Bloody hell, already?" "Yeah, well, he had a, he had three leaks, actually, coming, one at the top, one in the, one in the middle, one at the bottom." "Uh, uh, I'm, I must give you, I must give you 20 pounds, instead of ten."

   11. JOJonny10:05

       (laughs)

   12. CWChris Williamson10:05

       (laughs)

   13. YUYusef10:05

       (laughs)

   14. CWChris Williamson10:05

       And he goes, "No, m- mate, mate, it's, it's absolutely fine." And he says, "No, no, no, no, no, I insist, I insist."

   15. JOJonny10:10

       (laughs)

   16. CWChris Williamson10:11

       "So, have a, have a good, uh, have a, a wh- what day is it? Uh, uh, it's Friday. Have a, have a, have a good weekend!" And then he (laughs) comes back on the podcast, and he hasn't put his headphones in yet, and I didn't realize, and I said, "Rory, is that a smartwatch you're wearing?" "Right. So, Asia."

   17. YUYusef10:28

       (laughs)

   18. JOJonny10:28

       (laughs)

   19. CWChris Williamson10:28

       And I'm like, "Oh, fucking..." (laughs) Like, for anyone who's listening, it just sounds like you've had the biggest cream pie ever.

   20. JOJonny10:35

       Yeah.

   21. CWChris Williamson10:36

       But-

   22. JOJonny10:36

       So, so I was gonna ask you did whether he tipped him, 'cause I just heard the, "No, no, no, no, I insist, I insist." And I'm like, he's-

   23. CWChris Williamson10:40

       Yeah, I think he got, he got 20 quid out of his wallet and gave it to him.

   24. JOJonny10:43

       He, uh, the, the thing that I really liked about him is the way he swears.

   25. YUYusef10:50

       Very tactical.

   26. JOJonny10:50

       Yeah.

   27. CWChris Williamson10:51

       (laughs)

   28. JOJonny10:51

       'Cause you know when sometimes people use swearing as, as filler?

   29. CWChris Williamson10:54

       Mm-hmm.

   30. JOJonny10:55

       The way he swears really makes it sound better. It's a better, it's a better sentence-
7. 13:32 – 18:54

   Rear-ended twice: dashcam failures, admin dread, and asymmetric-risk decisions

   1. YUYusef13:32

      So, speaking of which, that's another ... So I've been rear-ended twice in the last month.

   2. JOJonny13:37

      In a car?

   3. YUYusef13:38

      In a car.

   4. JOJonny13:38

      We should clarify that.

   5. CWChris Williamson13:39

      In a car.

   6. JOJonny13:40

      Yeah.

   7. YUYusef13:40

      Um, one was my fault, one wasn't. So the guy whose ... was my fault paid for the one who wasn't, so I'm break even.

   8. JOJonny13:48

      (laughs)

   9. CWChris Williamson13:48

      And you've had two great experiences in the m- in, in the middle of it all.

   10. YUYusef13:50

       Two incredible experiences. It's, you know what it is? As soon as you feel that impact, the sen- the sense is it's not like, "Ah, my neck." It's, it's just all of the admin flashes before your eyes.

   11. CWChris Williamson14:00

       (laughs)

   12. JOJonny14:00

       (laughs)

   13. YUYusef14:00

       All of the like, "Oh my God-

   14. CWChris Williamson14:02

       Like, the bright lights.

   15. YUYusef14:02

       ... the paperwork. Oh."

   16. JOJonny14:04

       (laughs)

   17. YUYusef14:04

       Like, it's so ...

   18. JOJonny14:08

       (laughs)

   19. YUYusef14:08

       It's such a ... That's way more painful than any whiplash could, could do, 'cause you're like-

   20. JOJonny14:12

       There is certainly something afoot here. There's ... I, I think, I-

   21. CWChris Williamson14:17

       Things come in clusters like that.

   22. JOJonny14:18

       I, well, I, I'd love to know. So I have a theory that people with dash cams get in more accidents (laughs) than people without dash cams.

   23. YUYusef14:24

       So ironically, my dash cam, I got a crap one and it didn't record-

   24. JOJonny14:28

       (laughs)

   25. YUYusef14:28

       ... when it actually needed to work. So got rear-ended the first time, tried to take my dash cam out, plug it into the computer, and it records, like, 30-second clips of journeys that I've done five years ago.

   26. JOJonny14:40

       (laughs)

   27. CWChris Williamson14:40

       (laughs)

   28. YUYusef14:41

       Nothing, nothing about the accident that I'd had. And because it was still at home, I was trying to get the footage from it, and I got rear-ended a second time-

   29. CWChris Williamson14:48

       It wasn't

   30. NANarrator14:48

       Whoa.
8. 18:54 – 20:09

   Self-driving cars and moral panic: tiny edge cases vs everyday human danger

   1. YUYusef18:54

      So with automated car ... uh, what's it called? Self-driving cars, apparently there's, like, a, it's like a hundred or a thousand-fold less risk to die by a self-driving car than it is-

   2. JOJonny19:05

      Mm-hmm.

   3. YUYusef19:05

      ... to die from it This is- ... than it is a human. This is- But people prefer to be, um, that, like, they're scared of self-driving cars because they would prefer to die by their own hand, even if it's 100 or 1,000 times more likely.

   4. CWChris Williamson19:14

      This is me and me and you both quote-tweeted the same thing, that we would-

   5. YUYusef19:16

      Ah.

   6. CWChris Williamson19:16

      ... prefer to die by our own volition than live at the behest of a machine.

   7. JOJonny19:20

      Hmm.

   8. YUYusef19:20

      Unbelievable.

   9. CWChris Williamson19:21

      You're like-

   10. JOJonny19:21

       So s- suppose it's when, it's when the machine goes wrong, it's the destroying-a-planet-to-make-paperclips scenario, isn't it? It's-

   11. CWChris Williamson19:28

       But, so the problem, the problem that people have with it is that for some reason, they're prepared with a huge amount of, uh, real risk that comes from humans, a h- huge amount of human risk, but this tiny ... and then they obsess about, "Well, what if it's a mother of three versus a, a pram with a baby?" And you're like, "When f- "

   12. YUYusef19:46

       Like, when is that ever gonna happen?

   13. CWChris Williamson19:48

       Well, d- even if, even if it does, like-

   14. JOJonny19:49

       But I'm, like, how do you make that decision?

   15. CWChris Williamson19:50

       Yeah. Okay, so it's a utilitarian outcome.

   16. YUYusef19:52

       Isn't that better to leave that decision in the hands of a human, who's just gonna be like, "Argh!"

   17. CWChris Williamson19:56

       Kill them both.

   18. JOJonny19:57

       Or crash into a sh- shop and kill 10 people.

   19. CWChris Williamson19:59

       Yeah.

   20. JOJonny20:00

       (laughs)

   21. CWChris Williamson20:00

       I'd let, just let Tesla just make a, like- A judgment call?

   22. JOJonny20:03

       ... value cost of life and just make the best decision.

   23. CWChris Williamson20:05

       Yeah. Outsource-

   24. JOJonny20:06

       That's all you can do anyways.

   25. CWChris Williamson20:07

       Outsource everything to Elon Musk.

   26. JOJonny20:08

       Yeah.

9. 20:09 – 24:06

   Media consumption extremes: 3x podcasts, Iceland illness, and the ‘single egg’ breakfast

   1. CWChris Williamson20:09

      Um, I'll tell you what else I've been listening to recently, The End of the World with Josh Clark.

   2. JOJonny20:14

      That sounds cheery.

   3. CWChris Williamson20:15

      Link will be in the show notes below. It is the most, um, advanced and clever use of the podcast platform that I've listened to so far. So if you can imagine a 10-episode podcast series where he is talking about different existential threats, um, as asteroids, AI risks, physics experiments, uh, all sorts, everything, very, very comprehensive. And the entire show has been engineered by very, very clever, uh, sound engineers. And there's soundscapes going on in the background, so as he's talking about traveling through space, there's, like, whooshing space sounds and kind of low-level music and rumbling when he will talk about asteroids.

   4. YUYusef20:56

      It's gonna be great on three times speed.

   5. CWChris Williamson21:01

      (laughs)

   6. JOJonny21:01

      (laughs)

   7. YUYusef21:01

      Just white-knuckling the steering wheel.

   8. JOJonny21:04

      (laughs)

   9. CWChris Williamson21:05

      (laughs)

   10. JOJonny21:05

       See, here's, here's the thing-

   11. CWChris Williamson21:05

       That is such a unique problem to have.

   12. JOJonny21:08

       ... I, I don't listen to po- so I do listen to audio books in two times speed. I listen to podcasts as they are.

   13. CWChris Williamson21:14

       Really?

   14. JOJonny21:14

       I think I see a podcast as f-

   15. CWChris Williamson21:16

       Leisure.

   16. JOJonny21:16

       ... leisure. But an audio book is like, "I'm reading this for work to gain information."

   17. CWChris Williamson21:21

       Ah, okay. I-

   18. JOJonny21:21

       But you just see all audio as wasting your time.

   19. YUYusef21:23

       How do I consume it as rapidly as possible?

   20. JOJonny21:25

       Yeah.

   21. YUYusef21:25

       To be honest, three times pushes my limit a bit.

   22. JOJonny21:27

       (laughs)

   23. YUYusef21:28

       But using-

   24. CWChris Williamson21:28

       'Cause it's like (imitates fast forwarding) .

   25. JOJonny21:29

       (laughs)

   26. YUYusef21:29

       (laughs)

   27. CWChris Williamson21:29

       You can't even get ... so the only way that you can get, um, three times speed is by going onto specific kinds of apps. So if, even if you-

   28. JOJonny21:36

       So hacked scone apps.

   29. YUYusef21:38

       Yeah.

   30. CWChris Williamson21:38

       If you're listening now on, uh, Apple Podcasts, I implore you to try this out. If you press the multiplication thing, it will go one, 1.5, two, nought points five, so-
10. 24:06 – 27:36

    Home haircuts and forced small talk: when your podcast taste is the problem

    1. CWChris Williamson24:06

       So, um, one of my favorite, to segue before we go on Fyre Festival, one of my favorite things is where you say you can have a five-pound discount on massages that you give people. So you're a trained masseuse.

    2. JOJonny24:17

       (laughs)

    3. CWChris Williamson24:17

       But you offer people a five-pound discount if they allow you to listen to whatever podcast or audio book you're listening to at the time. But obviously, if you flip that on its head, what you could look at is there is a five-pound surcharge if you don't want to listen to whatever you're listening to at the moment. (laughs)

    4. JOJonny24:33

       (laughs)

    5. CWChris Williamson24:34

       That's a good point. And five pounds is so arbitrary as well, isn't it? It's like, it's, it's enough that you'd probably sit and think, like, "Do I want that?" Because also someone will say yes, because I remember, uh, Gibo saying he, he was having a... He was like, "Yusuf's going to be a massive." He goes, "Something about funnel marketing." And it's- Metastasizing in his skin cancer. I didn't, I didn't really understand it, but I... It was okay, I suppose. If someone-

    6. YUYusef24:58

       Something about straddle options in the Russian equity market or something.

    7. CWChris Williamson25:05

       (laughs) It's actually, you should charge people for that.

    8. YUYusef25:07

       For things like my-

    9. CWChris Williamson25:07

       That's free content, the stuff you've got access to.

    10. YUYusef25:09

        I will curate excellent educational content for you, while-

    11. CWChris Williamson25:12

        But a lot of it's paid.

    12. YUYusef25:14

        As in-

    13. CWChris Williamson25:14

        Like, it's either part of a nine grand a year degree-

    14. YUYusef25:16

        Not if you're on-

    15. CWChris Williamson25:16

        ... or a paid program, or-

    16. YUYusef25:17

        That's, that's a good point, actually. Like, it is value adding.

    17. CWChris Williamson25:19

        Yeah.

    18. YUYusef25:20

        It, but it's just-

    19. CWChris Williamson25:21

        Very specific.

    20. YUYusef25:22

        ... whether they recognize the value.

    21. CWChris Williamson25:22

        Yeah. Not if you're on LSEND. Not if you're on LSEND, yeah. Um- Yeah. And then to, to f- bookend that conversation, when, uh, you finally got onto the life hack of getting your hair cut at home, haven't you?

    22. YUYusef25:35

        Yeah, I have. Thank you.

    23. CWChris Williamson25:37

        Um-

    24. YUYusef25:37

        Excellent recommendation.

    25. CWChris Williamson25:38

        But before, before the hairdresser went round to his, she texted me to say, like, "Hang on a second, I'm about to go round to this person's house that I've never met before. I probably should think about my own safety. Is he, is he a weirdo?" And I'm like... (laughs)

    26. YUYusef25:55

        (laughs) 'Cause I think you said, like, "No more than I am."

    27. CWChris Williamson25:59

        Yeah.

    28. YUYusef25:59

        But absolutely so much.

    29. CWChris Williamson26:00

        Like, if the, if the canary in the coal mine is me-

    30. YUYusef26:03

        (laughs)
11. 27:36 – 37:48

    Fyre Festival autopsy: hype, operational reality, fraud, and ‘seduced by success’

    1. CWChris Williamson27:36

       So Fyre Festival. Tell me what you think, 'cause I'm absolutely fucking amazed to find out what you, you thought about it.

    2. YUYusef27:43

       So for anyone that doesn't know, I suppose, Fyre was a really impressively... Um, it was a festival-

    3. CWChris Williamson27:49

       It was an app.

    4. YUYusef27:50

       Oh, okay. So it started, started off-

    5. CWChris Williamson27:52

       Yeah, I suppose.

    6. YUYusef27:52

       ... as an app, and then they decided to launch a festival off the back of it. Very good at hype. They hired a lot of, uh, supermodels and high, high definition, like, high production value stuff to go and film the promo for a festival out in the Bahamas, buying one of, uh, Pablo Escobar's old islands.

    7. CWChris Williamson28:13

       (laughs)

    8. YUYusef28:13

       And they were gonna host it there.

    9. CWChris Williamson28:14

       So they said, yeah.

    10. YUYusef28:15

        And so they, they made it look like an amazing experience. Got a lot of high profile people, like, a bit weird. Like, Blink-182 and Ja Rule, like, all, like, captains of 1996.

    11. CWChris Williamson28:25

        (laughs)

    12. YUYusef28:25

        Um, and, and so they then... But-

    13. CWChris Williamson28:29

        Do you know, it's amazing that you would have looked at that lineup and gone-

    14. YUYusef28:33

        "I've heard of them."

    15. CWChris Williamson28:33

        "And? What the fuck's going on?"

    16. YUYusef28:35

        "Sounds about right, that sounds okay. Think I'll book my ticket." Oh, it was £10,000 pound each ticket.

    17. CWChris Williamson28:38

        Sum 41, I've heard of those people.

    18. YUYusef28:40

        (laughs) Um, so the, the, the... Obviously, it all fell down when they actually went to implement it and realized that the island had no infrastructure, the organization was a complete mess, and just seeing the whole thing progressively fall apart. The way that the documentary is made is so impressively stressful as well.

    19. CWChris Williamson28:58

        Yeah.

    20. YUYusef28:58

        Did you find this? Where, like, you're sat there and you're like, "Oh."

    21. CWChris Williamson29:02

        Well, my, my empathy a- as a business person just had me... Like, I was white knuckling along with it.

    22. YUYusef29:08

        I was thinking it's right up your street because it's like-

    23. CWChris Williamson29:11

        Yeah.

    24. YUYusef29:11

        ... the full promo.

    25. CWChris Williamson29:11

        Well, I mean, for any of the club promoters that are listening, it is just... It's all of our worst nightmares rolled into one.

    26. YUYusef29:17

        At what point could you tell that it was gonna go wrong?

    27. CWChris Williamson29:19

        Game over.

    28. YUYusef29:20

        I realized that the whole premise-

    29. CWChris Williamson29:21

        Pretty soon.

    30. YUYusef29:21

        ... of the show was kind of-
12. 37:48 – 46:25

    True-crime rabbit hole: Bundy, Abducted in Plain Sight, and why it’s so infuriating

    1. CWChris Williamson37:48

       Um, have you seen the, the Ted Bundy Tapes yet, Johnny?

    2. JOJonny37:50

       No.

    3. CWChris Williamson37:51

       Have you seen it?

    4. JOJonny37:52

       Oh, my God.

    5. YUYusef37:53

       Yeah. Oh, it's highly recommended.

    6. JOJonny37:53

       You should've seen something that you would've seen.

    7. YUYusef37:55

       So I, I nearly ... I started watching it but I was like, "Uh, this is fucking serious."

    8. CWChris Williamson37:57

       I'm pretty fucking good.

    9. JOJonny37:59

       Is it good?

    10. CWChris Williamson37:59

        Yeah, yeah, yeah. I thought it was pretty good.

    11. JOJonny38:01

        Great. That's exciting

    12. YUYusef38:02

        Yeah. He's just, he's just a very charismatic, good-looking guy that-

    13. CWChris Williamson38:06

        Happens to be a systemically killer.

    14. JOJonny38:08

        (laughs) Systemically naughty.

    15. YUYusef38:10

        Although, there, there is still a divide between, I think, the person that he thinks he is and wants to try and be.

    16. CWChris Williamson38:14

        Right.

    17. YUYusef38:14

        Very much like the Billy thing, actually. It's quite, quite scary how it's, uh-

    18. CWChris Williamson38:16

        There's a lot of power. That's what, that's why my mind, yeah.

    19. YUYusef38:18

        There's another one that James Bailey recommended me to watch-

    20. CWChris Williamson38:21

        Yeah.

    21. YUYusef38:22

        ... which I've seen, called Abducted in Plain Sight.

    22. JOJonny38:25

        So I've watched that. That's fucking weird.

    23. YUYusef38:27

        Did you?

    24. JOJonny38:27

        Oh, Christ. You should watch that.

    25. YUYusef38:30

        (laughs)

    26. CWChris Williamson38:30

        Is Maddie McCann in it?

    27. JOJonny38:31

        No, no, no.

    28. YUYusef38:31

        Similar.

    29. CWChris Williamson38:32

        Oh, okay.

    30. JOJonny38:32

        Oh, my God. Like, why?
13. 46:25 – 56:08

    Liam Neeson controversy: revenge fantasy, accountability, and the cost of admitting dark thoughts

    1. CWChris Williamson46:25

       Tip of the dildo. Uh, Liam Neeson. We were gonna talk about Liam Neeson.

    2. YUYusef46:28

       Yeah.

    3. JOJonny46:28

       Mm-hmm.

    4. CWChris Williamson46:28

       This is a fucking minefield for us two.

    5. YUYusef46:31

       Mm-hmm.

    6. JOJonny46:31

       Mm-hmm.

    7. CWChris Williamson46:31

       So-

    8. YUYusef46:31

       So can we get some background on, on Liam Neeson?

    9. CWChris Williamson46:33

       So, um, for the people who don't know, Liam Neeson has-

    10. JOJonny46:37

        Has a very particular set of skills.

    11. CWChris Williamson46:39

        Yes, he does. Well r- he does and that's the issue. Um, Liam Neeson... (clicks tongue)

    12. JOJonny46:45

        Oh.

    13. CWChris Williamson46:45

        That's the first sound video guy Dean has ever made-

    14. YUYusef46:47

        (laughs)

    15. CWChris Williamson46:47

        ... but he's not in the room.

    16. JOJonny46:48

        (laughs)

    17. CWChris Williamson46:48

        Um, so Liam Neeson, uh, is promoting a new film, which I think is actually a dark comedy. I don't think it's actually an action film. It's a dark comedy about revenge, and during an interview, he is asked, "How do you understand the emotions that are going through this?" And in his very sort of dark, slow, uh-

    18. YUYusef47:10

        Gravelly kind of way.

    19. CWChris Williamson47:11

        ... I-Irish voice, he says, "Well, uh, I, I have a personal experience with this. A close friend of mine was raped, and I asked her did she know the person and she said no. And I said, 'Well, what ethnicity was she?' And she said it was a Black man. So for the next few nights, I went out with a cosh," which is like a small baton.

    20. YUYusef47:36

        (laughs)

    21. CWChris Williamson47:36

        "Walking the streets of Ireland in Black neighborhoods looking for a Black man to start on me so that I could kill him. And after a little bit of time, I sort of caught myself and a lot the emotions had drained a little and I was able to be shocked at my own degree of behavior. Nothing had occurred, but that's how I'm able to embody or understand this particular degree of revenge."

    22. YUYusef48:04

        He al- he talks about the shame that he felt on himself and said-

    23. JOJonny48:07

        Oh.

    24. YUYusef48:07

        ... "I realize that even th- this was me feeling this in the context of living in Northern Ireland and, um, seeing all of the, the atrocities that are, that are done." And yet still having fallen prey to that same thought loop and then realizing that, "Actually, I'm just as bad as them." And, and then, yeah, so I guess he said he had that thought 40 years ago, was it?

    25. CWChris Williamson48:28

        Yeah.

    26. JOJonny48:29

        (laughs)

    27. YUYusef48:29

        And so people were slating him now-

    28. CWChris Williamson48:31

        They called him a racist.

    29. YUYusef48:32

        ... for having a thought 40 years ago that he's recognized and corrected.

    30. CWChris Williamson48:37

        Well, he, he acted on it. He did act on it.
14. 56:08 – 1:11:20

    Apple ecosystem loyalty: iPhone-on-planes jokes, Alfred, AirPods, and PC skepticism

    1. CWChris Williamson56:08

       Have you seen as well, you, you will have done 'cause you get on flights all the time to weddings, don't you? Um-

    2. JOJonny56:11

       Constantly.

    3. CWChris Williamson56:12

       Um, have you seen now that if you drop your phone in between the seats of a plane, you're not supposed to move your seat or try and get the phone yourself? You need to, bing, and wait for the-

    4. YUYusef56:23

       The man with the forceps to come.

    5. CWChris Williamson56:24

       ... attendant to come.

    6. JOJonny56:24

       Why?

    7. CWChris Williamson56:25

       Because their concern is if you have like a Samsung Galaxy Note7 or whatever the fuck it is-

    8. JOJonny56:29

       A mistake on the phone.

    9. CWChris Williamson56:30

       ... and you move, you move your seat back, crack it-

    10. JOJonny56:33

        All right and it won't work.

    11. CWChris Williamson56:34

        ... and the lithium battery goes, th- everyone's up in fucking flames.

    12. JOJonny56:36

        This is why you shouldn't be allowed on a plane unless you've got an iPhone.

    13. CWChris Williamson56:40

        (laughs)

    14. JOJonny56:40

        And everything would be much simpler, because the people who've made bad decisions would be confined to the, where they live.

    15. CWChris Williamson56:46

        That is true.

    16. JOJonny56:47

        We're gonna get a lot of hate for that.

    17. CWChris Williamson56:48

        (laughs)

    18. YUYusef56:48

        (laughs)

    19. JOJonny56:48

        Rory, Rory Sutherland says the same. He's like-

    20. CWChris Williamson56:51

        (laughs)

    21. JOJonny56:51

        ... "You know, af- af- after a while, people don't care about clock speed or-"

    22. YUYusef56:55

        (laughs)

    23. CWChris Williamson56:55

        Yeah.

    24. JOJonny56:55

        ... "megapixels for the, for the front-facing camera. After a while, they just want something that looks nice."

    25. CWChris Williamson57:00

        Mm-hmm.

    26. JOJonny57:00

        And you're like, "Well, that's it. That's exactly why-"

    27. YUYusef57:02

        So the fact that you have an iPhone and you have a MacBook is, is that is the explanation of why it's a better decision.

    28. CWChris Williamson57:11

        You are canary in the coal mine for-

    29. JOJonny57:12

        But you, you, you shop on features. You don't care about the fact, like AirPods-

    30. YUYusef57:16

        I do have this, though. This is like, okay, f- quite an old iPhone at this point.

Episode duration: 1:27:05