Rowing The Atlantic Solo | Stu Morton

Chris Williamson 0:00 (wind blowing) Um, so Mr. Stuart Morton? Welcome.

Stu Morton 0:08 Yeah. You all right? How you doing?

Chris Williamson 0:09 Very good, thank you. How are you?

Stu Morton 0:10 Good.

Chris Williamson 0:10 Fantastic.

Stu Morton 0:11 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 0:11 So we've known each other for nearly a year now-

Stu Morton 0:13 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 0:14 ... um, through Reebok Tyneside and a few other bits and pieces as well.

Stu Morton 0:17 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 0:17 And since I met you, you've had a- an idea that I think is probably one of the- the maddest things that I've ever heard. It's the sort of- the sort of story that you hear about in the news, but you never actually know anyone who's going to go ahead and do it. So I guess, in short, what- what's your next three months gonna look like? What are you doing?

Stu Morton 0:36 Um, I'm gonna row a wooden rowing boat from Portugal to Venezuela, um, which has actually never been done before by anybody solo.

Chris Williamson 0:45 Wow.

Stu Morton 0:45 It's been done by a team of five guys before, um, but never done by someone on their own. So it'll be like a world's first and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 0:52 So you're rowing across the Atlantic Ocean-

Stu Morton 0:54 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 0:54 ... on your own?

Stu Morton 0:55 Yeah. From Mainland Europe to Mainland South America, which is important 'cause there's a race that exists where people go from the Canary Islands to the Caribbean, so it takes in sort of 80% of the Atlantic Ocean.

Chris Williamson 1:08 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 1:08 Um, and it's- long story short, it's 20 grand to enter, um-

Chris Williamson 1:13 Wow.

Stu Morton 1:13 ... and there's more kudos attached to going from Mainland Europe to Mainland South America.

Chris Williamson 1:17 Right.

Stu Morton 1:17 'Cause it's about 1,000 miles longer-

Chris Williamson 1:20 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 1:20 ... than the- the race. Um, so that's the reason for- for choosing that.

Chris Williamson 1:25 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:25 And then also the fact that no one's ever done it before, so-

Chris Williamson 1:28 Wow.

Stu Morton 1:28 ... there's not many things left that no one's ever done before-

Chris Williamson 1:32 Yeah, there's not many, uh-

Stu Morton 1:32 ... in this world, stuff, especially in exploration and stuff, and adventures. Um, so it was one of those, like, last things to grab, and it just sort of built, as it, uh, you know, as it evolved, it sort of built into what it is now.

Chris Williamson 1:45 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:46 Um, the initial intention was to just row the Atlantic. Um, and-

Chris Williamson 1:50 And is that in- in any way possible?

Stu Morton 1:53 Say again?

Chris Williamson 1:53 In any way possible?

Stu Morton 1:54 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:54 From whatever bit to whatever bit, so to speak?

Stu Morton 1:56 Yeah. And being kind of naive to it, I was just like, "Well, I want to row the Atlantic. What's the most common form of doing that? And then I'll- I'll try that."

Chris Williamson 2:03 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:03 Um, and then looking into it and peeling back the layers, you sort of figure out what's on offer.

Chris Williamson 2:09 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:10 Um, and then through a bit of sort of bucking against the rules and sort of not wanting to conform-

Chris Williamson 2:17 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:17 ... um, I ended up getting my own- my own route. So basically, there's this company called Atlantic Campaigns-

Chris Williamson 2:23 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:23 ... who run the Talisker Whiskey Atlantic Challenge, and it's the sort of, um, the standard bearer, if you like, in ocean rowing.

Chris Williamson 2:30 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:31 Um, and it's 20,000 pounds to enter that race.

Chris Williamson 2:34 Mm-hmm. Is that solo as well?

Stu Morton 2:35 Uh, yeah. They- they take on solo entries, pairs, threes, fours. Um, I think they might have done a five, but I think four is actually the highest they do. Um, and basically, I looked at what you get for the 20 grand.

Chris Williamson 2:50 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:50 Now, I'm not putting it down at all. It's a fantastic organization that does great things. But for someone that doesn't come from a particular background-

Chris Williamson 2:57 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 2:58 ... 20 grand is, like, quite a bit of cash just to find 20 other racists, especially when you spend upwards of 70 grand-

Chris Williamson 3:04 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 3:04 ... to buy the boat and the kit and all the stuff that you need.

Chris Williamson 3:06 Yeah.

Stu Morton 3:07 Um, so I- I basically, about seven years ago, um... I- I'll set the scene. So about seven years ago-

Chris Williamson 3:14 Bring yourself in a little bit for me, man. Just a little bit closer.

Stu Morton 3:15 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 3:15 Yeah, that's perfect. Thank you.

Stu Morton 3:16 Um, it's- I was living in London, uh, working in private security, um, and basically got invited to a dinner party. Um, and one of the girls at the dinner party was a film director.

Chris Williamson 3:27 Right.

Stu Morton 3:27 So I'd asked if she'd worked on anything recently, and she'd just finished a film on a guy called Charlie Pitcher-

Chris Williamson 3:32 Right.

Stu Morton 3:33 ... um, who'd rowed the Atlantic on his own-

Chris Williamson 3:35 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 3:35 ... um, independently. So I watched that film and was sort of transfixed by it. Everyone else at the dinner party didn't really want to, you know, think about doing that.

Chris Williamson 3:44 Yeah.

Stu Morton 3:44 Um, I think I was the only guy-

Chris Williamson 3:45 I don't think there's anyone that really thinks about doing that, right?

Stu Morton 3:47 Yeah. (laughs)

Chris Williamson 3:48 Like I say, it's the sort of thing that you hear other people talk about, but they-

Stu Morton 3:52 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 3:52 I don't know. It just doesn't-

Stu Morton 3:53 Well, for me, that's exactly how it was, so- but it- you know, like most things, the curiosity got the better of me, and I sort of- I emailed Charlie, um, to find out the ins and outs of ocean rowing and how someone goes about that, um, planning, that sort of thing. Um, so he sent me all the links to the Talisker race, and through that, I figured out how much it was gonna cost and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 4:14 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 4:14 So I had set aside a bit of time to save for it.

Chris Williamson 4:17 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 4:17 Um, and then like I said, in- in researching more about ocean rowing, I came across other people that done independent rows.

Chris Williamson 4:25 Right. So there's a whole community, right?

Stu Morton 4:27 Yeah. It's huge once you sort of-

Chris Williamson 4:29 Yeah.

Stu Morton 4:29 ... scratch the l- like, the layers away.

Chris Williamson 4:30 Absolutely. Over the last-

Stu Morton 4:31 Um-

Chris Williamson 4:31 Over the last year, just seeing stuff that you like on Instagram-

Stu Morton 4:34 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 4:34 ... there's guys rowing all over the place.

Stu Morton 4:36 Yeah. Um, and it's almost like- it's like when people get into training, like they've never been exposed to, like, gym life before.

Chris Williamson 4:43 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 4:43 And then as soon as they start-

Chris Williamson 4:44 This whole sub-community just explodes.

Stu Morton 4:46 Yeah. And they pick up all the- the lingo and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 4:48 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 4:49 So it's a- definitely, like, a subculture that people pick up on. And ocean rowing is that way as well. But more people have climbed Everest than have rowed the Atlantic.

Chris Williamson 4:57 Wow.

Stu Morton 4:57 Um, and then again, if you look at the Pacific or the Indian Ocean, the numbers are even smaller again.

Chris Williamson 5:02 So it's about- that's sort of 1,000 and a bit, one and a half thousand, is it, maybe, that's coming in?

Stu Morton 5:05 At the moment, I think the figure stands at about 500.

Chris Williamson 5:08 Yeah.

Stu Morton 5:08 But the Talisker race, um, it's grown in popularity. So this year, um, the race is actually happening as we speak, um, and I think there's 75 people in the race.

Chris Williamson 5:18 So it's getting exponential, the amount of people?

Stu Morton 5:19 Yeah. So maybe 50 people will complete it.

Chris Williamson 5:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 5:22 There's already been some dropouts and stuff.

Chris Williamson 5:23 No way.

Stu Morton 5:24 Um, yeah. A couple of rescues and this, that, and the other, so...

Chris Williamson 5:26 Wow. So what's-

Stu Morton 5:27 And that's quite humbling to see-

Chris Williamson 5:29 That's-

Stu Morton 5:29 ... from my position. Like, I'm setting off-

Chris Williamson 5:30 Yeah. (laughs)

Stu Morton 5:30 ... in three weeks, and I'm seeing people giving up. But as well as that, there's a guy called Damian Brown who's a former rugby player.

Chris Williamson 5:37 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 5:37 And he's basically setting an example of- of how to tackle an ocean row. Like, um...

Chris Williamson 5:43 He's got the forma.

Stu Morton 5:44 Yeah. Uh, uh, uh, a- and he thinks, like, kind of the way I like to think about things. So if you take an event or something that happens to you in your life, you can react to it one of two ways, but that doesn't change the- the fact that that event has occurred.

Chris Williamson 5:57 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 5:57 So you can lose your temper or you can laugh it off-

Chris Williamson 6:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 6:00 ... but the event's still there to deal with.So, it doesn't really matter how you react to something, you're there and you've got to get on with it.

Chris Williamson 6:06 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 6:06 But there's a few, y- you know, in the times gone by, there are people that have sort of, for whatever reason, withdrawn from the race.

Chris Williamson 6:12 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 6:14 Um, and I'm, I'm starting to, to change my, like, initial reaction to that. Like, my initial reaction on hearing that sort of news would be that, "Oh, they couldn't hack it."

Chris Williamson 6:22 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 6:22 "And it wasn't for them," and all this sort of stuff. But a few of them have raised safety concerns that they perhaps didn't think about in the lead up to the row.

Chris Williamson 6:30 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 6:30 And there's so much that goes into the planning-

Chris Williamson 6:32 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 6:33 ... that I totally understand that, from their position, they might have got to a point where they hadn't really considered what they were getting themselves into.

Chris Williamson 6:39 (smacks lips) Yeah.

Stu Morton 6:40 I know that sounds daft 'cause it's rowing an ocean-

Chris Williamson 6:42 (laughs)

Stu Morton 6:42 ... but it, it, I think it's easy to get caught up in the hype and sort of find yourself in a, a position you don't really want to be in.

Chris Williamson 6:49 You, you weren't prepared for, or...

Stu Morton 6:50 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 6:50 So, so tell us about your background. What's, what's your, what's your background?

Stu Morton 6:53 Um, so basically I, I grew up in a really, like, sort of transient lifestyle. So my father was in the Armed Forces.

Chris Williamson 7:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 7:00 Um, I was born in Germany and then ended up living all over the place. Um, and then when I was 18, I joined the Marines on a dare.

Chris Williamson 7:08 (laughs) On a dare?

Stu Morton 7:08 Um, did that for abou- yeah, so basically there was a, a TV program on-

Chris Williamson 7:12 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 7:13 ... while we were at school and everyone was talking about this TV program and sort of would they fancy doing it and all that sort of stuff. And again, another situation where I think I was the only person that wanted to.

Chris Williamson 7:23 Yeah.

Stu Morton 7:23 Um, and then later that day I was stood in the queue for some food at school and, uh, I overheard two lads talking about the fact that I wanted to give it a go.

Chris Williamson 7:32 Right.

Stu Morton 7:32 And one-

Chris Williamson 7:33 How old, how olds, how old were you?

Stu Morton 7:34 I was like 17 or 18.

Chris Williamson 7:35 Right, okay.

Stu Morton 7:36 Um, so it's like A levels.

Chris Williamson 7:37 Yeah.

Stu Morton 7:38 Um, and then I overheard someone saying they didn't think I could do it and not being sort of that academically minded-

Chris Williamson 7:44 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 7:44 ... and not knowing what I wanted to do if I got to university and all that sort of stuff, I just decided to run it by my old man first-

Chris Williamson 7:51 Yeah.

Stu Morton 7:51 ... and say, "I'm gonna drop out of school and join the Marines. What do you think?" And he was like, "Yeah, go for it."

Chris Williamson 7:55 I guess with his background that would have been-

Stu Morton 7:56 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 7:57 ... yeah.

Stu Morton 7:57 So did that, um, left the Marines, got into private security, uh, did that for a few years. Um, and yeah, just, I think you can tell from that background, I've always been a fan of, like, challenges and figuring out who I am-

Chris Williamson 8:09 For sure.

Stu Morton 8:09 ... and how I react to, like, stressful environments-

Chris Williamson 8:12 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 8:12 ... and sort of extreme situations. Um, and I just feel like it's been a few years since that's happened, so the row's sort of coming at, at a good time now.

Chris Williamson 8:20 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 8:20 Um-

Chris Williamson 8:21 So this has been a concept in your mind for about seven years?

Stu Morton 8:24 Yeah, I think six or seven years. It's either 2010 or '11 I watched that, that video at the dinner party.

Chris Williamson 8:30 Yeah.

Stu Morton 8:30 And since then it's just sort of evolved.

Chris Williamson 8:32 Yeah.

Stu Morton 8:32 But obviously with the amount of money involved, um, and obviously with the age I was, like, buying houses and, you know, getting a car and all that good stuff.

Chris Williamson 8:40 Getting yourself settled, yeah.

Stu Morton 8:41 70 grand's, like, hard to come by when you're doing all that stuff.

Chris Williamson 8:43 Seventy, 70,000 pounds is the cost of it?

Stu Morton 8:45 I've probably spent so far about 70,000. I say so far 'cause there's still more stuff to get.

Chris Williamson 8:49 For sure.

Stu Morton 8:49 Yeah. So i- it's just, it's little things, like there's probably a kit list with two or 300 items on that you need to do the row.

Chris Williamson 8:57 Wow.

Stu Morton 8:58 And most of the items cost a couple of hundred quid.

Chris Williamson 9:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 9:00 So you can, you know, gather from that how much stuff it costs.

Chris Williamson 9:02 And in, in amongst that is a boat.

Stu Morton 9:04 In amongst that is a boat, yeah.

Chris Williamson 9:05 Or a ve- is it a vessel? Is it a boat?

Stu Morton 9:07 Either or.

Chris Williamson 9:07 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 9:07 Like, it's a rowing boat or a vessel 'cause they're the things... I think 'cause of the stuff attached to it, it gets called a vessel.

Chris Williamson 9:12 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 9:12 'Cause it's got like a radio and a GPS and a map, but-

Chris Williamson 9:14 I got you.

Stu Morton 9:14 ... it's basically a wooden rowing boat with a, a cabin to sleep in.

Chris Williamson 9:17 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 9:18 So it's pretty good.

Chris Williamson 9:19 So you've got... You've gone through the Marines, you've gone through your private security, and you've come out the other side now.

Stu Morton 9:24 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 9:24 Um, I've seen you, just over the last year, I've seen you run coast to coast of Hadrian's Wall.

Stu Morton 9:30 Yeah, that was, um... So that, that wasn't really a big thing for us. I know does that, does that sound really big-headed?

Chris Williamson 9:37 (laughs)

Stu Morton 9:37 And it's not meant to sound that way at all, but-

Chris Williamson 9:38 It was the equivalent of somewhere in the region of three marathons back to back in 24 hours.

Stu Morton 9:41 E- exactly what... Well, it, it's actually three 28 mile runs back to back. So I'll set the scene again. Josh Rose and I did a run in November just off the cuff to see how, like, fit we thought we were.

Chris Williamson 9:53 Yeah.

Stu Morton 9:53 And it was a trail run in Wooler which was 28 miles.

Chris Williamson 9:56 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 9:56 And then we literally finished it and 10 minutes afterwards we're talking about people that do ultra marathons and stuff like that. And I just-

Chris Williamson 10:03 Which is 100, 100 and over.

Stu Morton 10:04 I think ultra's anything over a marathon to be honest.

Chris Williamson 10:06 Is it?

Stu Morton 10:06 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 10:07 Oh right, okay.

Stu Morton 10:07 So people who do a 50K and call it an ultra.

Chris Williamson 10:09 Okay.

Stu Morton 10:09 Or they'll do a 100K and call it an ultra or whatever.

Chris Williamson 10:11 Yeah.

Stu Morton 10:12 Um, so Josh and I were basically saying, "Do you reckon you could do that back to back?" And I was like, "Oh, I don't know." And then just off sort of Googling and flying around Facebook and stuff, I found s- two guys that had ran Hadrian's Wall and it was 84 miles and it just jumped into my head that that's pretty much there, back again, and there again-

Chris Williamson 10:31 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 10:32 ... of the run we just did-

Chris Williamson 10:33 Yeah.

Stu Morton 10:33 ... which was the biggest distance either of us have at e- had ever done-

Chris Williamson 10:36 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 10:37 ... I think up to that point. Uh-

Chris Williamson 10:38 And only 10 minutes after it you were already looking for the next adventure.

Stu Morton 10:40 Yeah, so I just jokingly said to him, "What do you reckon about doing this?" And he was like, "Yeah, that sounds pretty good." And then I'll, I've always been a fan of if you tell people about it, then it's happening.

Chris Williamson 10:49 Yeah.

Stu Morton 10:49 So I think we posted that on Instagram that day, um, and then just sort of trained towards it.

Chris Williamson 10:55 That external accountability-

Stu Morton 10:56 Um-

Chris Williamson 10:56 ... coming in a little bit there.

Stu Morton 10:57 Yeah, and it's just sort of like, I think it's good to test yourself now and again on stuff that you don't know-

Chris Williamson 11:02 (laughs)

Stu Morton 11:02 ... you might be able to do. Otherwise it isn't a challenge.

Chris Williamson 11:04 Yeah.

Stu Morton 11:04 Too many people these days do like a marathon, which no offense to anyone that's proud of what they've done, but it's not hard to run 26 miles-

Chris Williamson 11:11 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 11:11 ... no matter what your background is.

Chris Williamson 11:12 But even if the training... I suppose with the training for a marathon, I've seen some of the training protocols and people are working up towards 20 miles, like 10 and 20 mile-

Stu Morton 11:20 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:20 ... runs beforehand. Unless something goes wrong, the, the race is alre- you've already run it. Which is-

Stu Morton 11:25 Exactly, yeah, that's my point.

Chris Williamson 11:26 ... which is the point of the training, right?

Stu Morton 11:27 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:27 The point of the training is that you should be able to complete the run comfortably.

Stu Morton 11:31 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:31 But I think there's a difference in trying to complete an event which you've prepared for and trying to test yourself in a way that you can only prepare up to as well as you can do for.

Stu Morton 11:40 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:40 Does that make sense?

Stu Morton 11:41 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 11:41 Yeah.

Stu Morton 11:41 And I think also if you apply a time frame to the marathon, then it becomes a challenge.

Chris Williamson 11:46 Yeah.

Stu Morton 11:46 But for most people they just want to do it-

Chris Williamson 11:47 Yeah.

Stu Morton 11:47 ... and it's more possible than people think it is.

Chris Williamson 11:50 Yeah.

Stu Morton 11:51 And I think there's loads of stuff in life that's like that. It's way more possible than you think. You just nev- you haven't tried it before.

Chris Williamson 11:56 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 11:56 And the run, the Hadrian's Wall run was definitely that. Like in February we failed it. Well, I failed it-

Chris Williamson 12:03 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 12:03 ... 'cause I got a shin spl- uh, uh, what do you call it, a stress fracture in my shin.

Chris Williamson 12:06 Right.

Stu Morton 12:07 Um, so that stopped us at about the 65 mile point.... um-

Chris Williamson 12:11 Which is still-

Stu Morton 12:12 Which is a long way, but it's not-

Chris Williamson 12:13 Absolutely. That's, that's almost exactly double two marathons.

Stu Morton 12:16 Yeah. And, um, so that was that. Uh, but then because of k- kind of people Josh and I are, we were like, "Well, we've got to go back and finish it." So-

Chris Williamson 12:23 I think that day, the Instagram post that you put up It was the day after, I think. Yeah. ... upon, upon announcing that it hadn't happened-

Stu Morton 12:30 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 12:31 ... this, uh, pretty much straight after was the announcement, like, "We're coming back for you," so to speak.

Stu Morton 12:34 Yeah. And the date was good, because it was, uh, the re-run was in August just gone. Um, and it basically, for me, was more of a test of, like, where I was physically and mentally. 'Cause it, it was a tough test, in that, like, you had to apply a bit of mental fortitude to get through it, 'cause it's a long way to run.

Chris Williamson 12:51 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 12:51 Um, most people aren't happy driving that distance, but to run it, we set off at, like, 4:00 in the morning and finished at 10:00 at night.

Chris Williamson 12:58 Wow.

Stu Morton 12:58 And that's, like, coast to coast of the country, so it was-

Chris Williamson 13:00 Yeah.

Stu Morton 13:00 ... quite a deal. Um, but also, for me, it was good, because on the row, I'm probably going to be working out for up to 18 hours a day.

Chris Williamson 13:08 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 13:09 And the run took around about the same time.

Chris Williamson 13:11 Right.

Stu Morton 13:12 So the thought of getting up the next day and doing that all over again, it was more preparation than-

Chris Williamson 13:18 Give you a good idea.

Stu Morton 13:18 ... I gave it credit for. 'Cause I, I, I could turn around and go, "Well, it's possible, but it's going to be bloody hard."

Chris Williamson 13:22 Yeah.

Stu Morton 13:23 And to string 100 days like that together-

Chris Williamson 13:25 Yeah.

Stu Morton 13:25 ... is really gonna be the test.

Chris Williamson 13:26 So going back to the row-

Stu Morton 13:28 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 13:29 ... you've, you've got your prep. You've started to get towards it. So, I mean, what's the next step? In terms of you've, you've started to think about the idea, where do you go from there? You need to find a route. You need to find someone with specialist information that-

Stu Morton 13:40 Yeah. Th- exactly that. It's sort of, it's like most ideas that, you know, you don't think you're gonna be able to achieve. It just, as soon as you start on the row, it just starts to evolve.

Chris Williamson 13:49 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 13:50 And I've never really been someone that, like, plans everything to an absolute T and then goes and executes it.

Chris Williamson 13:55 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 13:55 I sort of, I train myself up to a point where I think I've got all the skills I need to, you know, be able to take on the challenge.

Chris Williamson 14:02 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 14:02 Which involves the whole planning phase as well.

Chris Williamson 14:05 Yeah.

Stu Morton 14:05 Um, and then I'll just react to the situations as they, as they come.

Chris Williamson 14:09 Yeah.

Stu Morton 14:09 Um, and as I'm going down that road. So basically, I, like I said, I emailed the guy, Charlie Pitcher. Found out about costs and, you know, required courses, and, like, navigation that you need to be, like, pick up, and all that sort of stuff. Um, and then just slowly started going about doing it.

Chris Williamson 14:25 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 14:25 Um, but the real, sort of, the impetus was, like, injected into the, the project back in 2016.

Chris Williamson 14:32 Right.

Stu Morton 14:32 'Cause a team of five guys had completed that route that I was on about-

Chris Williamson 14:35 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 14:35 ... and three of them were friends of mine from the Marines.

Chris Williamson 14:37 Right. No way.

Stu Morton 14:38 Yeah. So I, I called one of them up and just said, "Look, what's, what's the score with this? How did you go about planning it?" And he said, "We just picked the route and did it."

Chris Williamson 14:44 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 14:45 So I, basically, the same sketch as the run. I told everyone I was doing it, and it kind of, like, forces you into making it happen, then.

Chris Williamson 14:51 For sure.

Stu Morton 14:52 And also picking a date was important, um, 'cause it's something to work toward, and it's something that, like, you're then accountable for. 'Cause people know you're, like, it's January, Stu Morton's gonna be going off on his rowing bike.

Chris Williamson 15:03 Absolutely, yeah.

Stu Morton 15:04 So-

Chris Williamson 15:04 It's Parkinson's Law, the work expands to fill the time that's given for it, and if you just, at some point in the future, it would be five years, 10 years, and then before you know it-

Stu Morton 15:13 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:13 ... you can't do it anymore.

Stu Morton 15:14 Exactly.

Chris Williamson 15:14 So, no, that's, I mean... So moving on to the actual row itself, am I right in thinking, I read that it's 1.5 million oar strokes?

Stu Morton 15:23 Around that, yeah. I mean, it all depends on, like, the distance it takes me, but-

Chris Williamson 15:28 Yeah.

Stu Morton 15:28 ... as a rule, it's gonna be about one and a half million oar strokes, yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:32 Which just sounds like-

Stu Morton 15:33 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:34 ... the sort of thing that would take you to space, or do you know what I mean?

Stu Morton 15:36 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:36 Like, million, millions of anything.

Stu Morton 15:38 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:38 Millions of repetitions of anything just sounds absolutely insane.

Stu Morton 15:42 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 15:42 (laughs)

Stu Morton 15:43 It's nuts. There's-

Chris Williamson 15:43 (laughs)

Stu Morton 15:44 It's one of those weird things. Like, the closer you get to it, and the more people I know that have actually done the row, the more you realize that it's, it's everything you think it's gonna be. It's, like, incredibly monotonous and boring-

Chris Williamson 15:55 (laughs)

Stu Morton 15:55 ... and testing, and all this. And you can have music and sort of films to keep you company and everything-

Chris Williamson 16:00 Yeah.

Stu Morton 16:00 ... but at the end of the day, there's, there's no getting away from the fact that you've just got, got to get on the oars and pull.

Chris Williamson 16:06 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 16:07 And also, it's so much more different to anything I've done before, where on the run that Josh and I did-

Chris Williamson 16:14 Yeah.

Stu Morton 16:14 ... if we failed that, it was like, our friend Ben was driving the car next to us-

Chris Williamson 16:17 Yeah.

Stu Morton 16:18 ... so we could jump in, or we could, like, get our iPhones out and call someone, and they'd come pick us up. But this is not like that.

Chris Williamson 16:24 So what's the support structure that you've got?

Stu Morton 16:27 There's no support. It's completely unsupported. Um-

Chris Williamson 16:30 (laughs)

Stu Morton 16:30 ... In absolute emergency, I can set off one of the many beacons that I've got on board-

Chris Williamson 16:34 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 16:35 ... um, and through the different coastal agencies around the world, they'll sort of try and effect a rescue.

Chris Williamson 16:40 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 16:41 And the majority of the time these rescues are from passing ships, 'cause there's quite a few shipping lanes on my route.

Chris Williamson 16:46 Okay.

Stu Morton 16:47 So, um, there is the opportunity to be rescued, but that's if you're in a, an emergency situation.

Chris Williamson 16:54 Yeah.

Stu Morton 16:54 Um, it wouldn't be looked upon very well if you set off your beacon just 'cause you're a bit tired-

Chris Williamson 16:59 Have a cramp or something like that.

Stu Morton 17:00 ... or whatever, yeah.

Chris Williamson 17:00 Yeah, exactly.

Stu Morton 17:01 Or you feel a bit sorry for yourself. Um, and then failing that, there's a life raft, a grab bag of emergency kit, and then the current to take me to the Caribbean.

Chris Williamson 17:10 Bloody hell.

Stu Morton 17:11 Which will take probably about 150 days, maybe.

Chris Williamson 17:14 Okay.

Stu Morton 17:15 Um, but someone's done that before, so-

Chris Williamson 17:16 I mean, that's, that's last, that's definitely last resort.

Stu Morton 17:18 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 17:19 (laughs)

Stu Morton 17:19 It's last resort, but it is a resort.

Chris Williamson 17:20 Yeah, for sure.

Stu Morton 17:21 So you've got to

Chris Williamson 17:22 (music) I guess you've got to have planning for every eventuality. Like you said, there's a lot of things that could occur that you wouldn't know.

Stu Morton 17:27 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 17:28 So when do you set off? What time of day and what date, and where from exactly?

Stu Morton 17:31 Uh, well, it's all weather dependent. So-

Chris Williamson 17:33 Right.

Stu Morton 17:33 ... you set, like, a general date that you're aiming at, which for me is the 18th of January.

Chris Williamson 17:37 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 17:38 Um, for no other reason. I just plucked it out of the air.

Chris Williamson 17:40 Yep.

Stu Morton 17:41 Um, and then through the, the weather routing guy, um, my friend Foxy, we're just gonna look at the weather around that week and see-

Chris Williamson 17:48 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 17:48 ... if it's a viable option.

Chris Williamson 17:49 But generally January's a good time, right?

Stu Morton 17:52 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 17:53 Because of something going on with currents?

Stu Morton 17:55 Yeah, the Talisker Race sets off in December, um, and I'm gonna set off in January, basically for the same reason that the trade winds come from Africa towards South America.

Chris Williamson 18:03 Right.

Stu Morton 18:03 Um, they're at their strongest point at that time of the year.

Chris Williamson 18:06 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 18:06 Um, and also the hurricane season stops in around November, December time. So if you set off, obviously after the hurricane season, it's gonna be-

Chris Williamson 18:15 Do not want to be-

Stu Morton 18:15 ... quite a few favors.

Chris Williamson 18:16 ... caught in hurricane season. Yeah, for sure.

Stu Morton 18:17 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 18:17 So you're gonna get an assist with the wind, right?

Stu Morton 18:19 Uh, yeah.

Chris Williamson 18:21 At, at least a little bit.

Stu Morton 18:23 Yeah. So there's, um-So not to get too much into it, but there's two classes of boats. There's the Pureclass and the Conceptclass. Um, the Conceptclass is basically, like, the newest design, which is an incredible design. And not to sound like I'm sort of, like, hating on it-

Chris Williamson 18:39 (laughs)

Stu Morton 18:40 ... um, it is an, a p- phenomenally designed bit of kit and the people that make them, Rannoch, are definitely the best boat builders out there.

Chris Williamson 18:47 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 18:47 But it's widely known that they get huge wind assistance because they're designed for that.

Chris Williamson 18:52 Yeah.

Stu Morton 18:52 So the entrance to the cabin is at the front of the boat, for the main cabin.

Chris Williamson 18:58 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 18:58 Whereas, mine's at the back of the boat.

Chris Williamson 18:59 Yeah.

Stu Morton 19:00 So if, as the wind comes over the back of the boat-

Chris Williamson 19:02 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 19:02 ... it doesn't hit anything on mine.

Chris Williamson 19:04 Yep.

Stu Morton 19:04 It just drifts off into the ocean.

Chris Williamson 19:05 Yeah. Whereas, it's a flat surface on that. Yeah. Yeah.

Stu Morton 19:07 Yeah. So it acts like a sail.

Chris Williamson 19:08 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 19:09 Um, and because of that, Rannoch have set these blistering fast paces across the ocean, and any of the world records that are held are currently held by Rannoch boats.

Chris Williamson 19:18 So is there now two classes of world records?

Stu Morton 19:19 Yeah. So Guinness were like, "Well, it's not fair now, we have to have two classes." So I looked at who holds the record for my row-

Chris Williamson 19:25 Yeah.

Stu Morton 19:26 ... and it's an old-fashioned Pureclass boat.

Chris Williamson 19:28 Right.

Stu Morton 19:28 So I only thought it's fair, if I'm gonna try and beat the, like, the record that already stands-

Chris Williamson 19:33 Yeah.

Stu Morton 19:33 ... then I've got to do it in a Pureclass boat.

Chris Williamson 19:34 Has the route that you've been... A d- so the route that you're doing has never been done before?

Stu Morton 19:38 No.

Chris Williamson 19:39 And that would... So irrelevant of which side it was in, of b- which boat you were in-

Stu Morton 19:43 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 19:43 ... you were gonna be-

Stu Morton 19:44 Well, specifically for country to country, I'll be the first person.

Chris Williamson 19:47 Yep.

Stu Morton 19:48 But for continent to continent-

Chris Williamson 19:49 Yeah.

Stu Morton 19:49 ... uh, someone's done it before.

Chris Williamson 19:50 Okay.

Stu Morton 19:51 Um, and the guy's called Seenhof, a Norwegian that set it in 96 days.

Chris Williamson 19:56 Right.

Stu Morton 19:56 And so if, if I beat 96 days, uh, I get the record.

Chris Williamson 19:59 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 19:59 As well as being the first person to go from Portugal to Venezuela, and the first British person, and all those sort of-

Chris Williamson 20:05 Yeah.

Stu Morton 20:05 ... other ones that come with it.

Chris Williamson 20:05 All the sub, all the sub ones as well.

Stu Morton 20:07 Yeah. First man.

Chris Williamson 20:08 (laughs)

Stu Morton 20:10 And all that sort of stuff. So it's quite good.

Chris Williamson 20:11 I mean, it's just, i- it just boggles the mind really to sort of think about this sort of stuff. Like I can't, I can't imagine what the experience is gonna be like to go across. So you, I mean, what's the estimated time? You, hopefully, setting off January 18th.

Stu Morton 20:24 Yeah. Well

Chris Williamson 20:24 Is it-

Stu Morton 20:24 ... I mean-

Chris Williamson 20:24 ... a morning, a morning thing? Is it the sort of thing where you're gonna be able to have anyone to see you off other than a support crew, like?

Stu Morton 20:29 Yeah. So, um, Foxy, uh, the weather routing guy, he's gonna come out to Portugal with me.

Chris Williamson 20:34 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 20:35 And then my friend, Pierre, is gonna help me drive the boat down.

Chris Williamson 20:38 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 20:39 Um, and then those two... Basically, I want as little time as possible in the marina in Portugal.

Chris Williamson 20:43 Right. Why is that?

Stu Morton 20:44 Just, like, as a mental thing, I think it's way better to, like, say your goodbyes to everyone at home-

Chris Williamson 20:48 Yeah.

Stu Morton 20:49 ... drive down, put the boat in the water, jump in

Chris Williamson 20:51 the journey almost begins as you set off in the car from-

Stu Morton 20:53 Exactly, yeah.

Chris Williamson 20:53 ... from the UK.

Stu Morton 20:54 Yeah. And also, you know, like I said, 'cause we're guessing the weather and all that sort of stuff, you don't want to miss your weather window.

Chris Williamson 21:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 21:00 So if I dillydally when I get down there-

Chris Williamson 21:02 For sure.

Stu Morton 21:03 ... a two-day, like, delay might end up being a four-week delay, which I can't really afford.

Chris Williamson 21:07 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 21:08 So for me, I just wanna get the boat in the water and, and set off. Plus it isn't, like, a challenge that I've ended up doing that I don't want to do. Like, I've been, this, uh, like a dream of mine for six or seven years, so I'm, like, champing at the bit to get out there and test myself and all that sort of good stuff.

Chris Williamson 21:23 Yeah.

Stu Morton 21:23 Um, and I think, like, the solitude is something I'm gonna enjoy. Like, the, the adventure side of it, the, you know, putting yourself at the mercy of something you can't control isn't something people do very much these days.

Chris Williamson 21:34 Absolutely not.

Stu Morton 21:35 And I think that's where the test comes from is that I, I'm not in control of my environment and I can only react to it.

Chris Williamson 21:41 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 21:42 So it's much the same as, like, when we're in operations in the Marines. Like, it's a good test of who you are and what you're about, especially in this world where people are so bothered about sort of money and status and celebrity and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 21:54 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 21:55 Like, that stuff doesn't really impress me. I like... Th- any idols I have have, you know, they've got the work done and then they get the plaudits for it.

Chris Williamson 22:02 Right.

Stu Morton 22:02 Rather than telling people what they're gonna do and expecting some sort of-

Chris Williamson 22:05 For sure.

Stu Morton 22:06 ... mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 22:06 Well, I mean, you know, a lot of people, I think, would be primarily chasing the titles and the, th- they want to do it the quickest. They want to do it-

Stu Morton 22:15 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 22:15 ... the fastest, the best and-

Stu Morton 22:16 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 22:16 ... and h- and get the most renown out of it. But-

Stu Morton 22:18 For me, they're bonuses. The, the true test is the test itself.

Chris Williamson 22:21 Yeah.

Stu Morton 22:22 Um, and if it takes me 120 days-

Chris Williamson 22:24 Yeah.

Stu Morton 22:24 ... I'm not really bothered.

Chris Williamson 22:25 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 22:26 The, the record's, like, are nice to have for the sponsors and stuff like that.

Chris Williamson 22:29 Yeah.

Stu Morton 22:29 It's something that they can sing about and say that they were involved with.

Chris Williamson 22:31 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 22:32 But for me, I, I don't really care about that. It's nice to know that, you know, you've, you've earned something and you've achieved it 'cause you outworked the other guy and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 22:41 Yeah.

Stu Morton 22:41 But for me the, th- the big test is can I deal with what's thrown at me? Like, the conditions will probably be different to the other guys as well.

Chris Williamson 22:49 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 22:49 And the distance is so vast that you can't do the exact same route anyway.

Chris Williamson 22:54 Right.

Stu Morton 22:55 So the parameters of, like, "Well, he did it in this time and he did it in that time."

Chris Williamson 22:59 Yeah.

Stu Morton 22:59 They're hard to sort of, you know, create-

Chris Williamson 23:00 There's no direct comparison, right?

Stu Morton 23:02 Yeah. And you can't create, like, that level playing field where it's like-

Chris Williamson 23:04 Yeah.

Stu Morton 23:04 ... a football match where there's two goals in 90 minutes and off you go.

Chris Williamson 23:07 For sure.

Stu Morton 23:08 Um, so yeah. It's just, it's a weird one 'cause the records mean a lot in the build-up, you know, getting funding and sponsorship and all that.

Chris Williamson 23:16 Yeah.

Stu Morton 23:16 But, uh, when it comes down to it, like, getting from A to B safely is-

Chris Williamson 23:19 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 23:19 ... number one.

Chris Williamson 23:20 Well, I think-

Stu Morton 23:20 And the record.

Chris Williamson 23:20 ... and that's what, that's what grabs attention, isn't it?

Stu Morton 23:22 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 23:22 It's that this is potentially going to be a world record.

Stu Morton 23:25 Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 23:26 Um, but as you say, that for you is s- below secondary.

Stu Morton 23:30 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 23:30 Um...

Stu Morton 23:31 It will be cool. I mean, like, the, the whole ego side of things, it'd be nice to be the first person to, uh, have ever done anything 'cause you, you'll never reach-

Chris Williamson 23:39 Yeah. For sure.

Stu Morton 23:39 ... that record.

Chris Williamson 23:40 Absolutely.

Stu Morton 23:40 Um, whereas if you're... obviously, you're the fastest, you're the fastest until someone beats you.

Chris Williamson 23:44 Yeah.

Stu Morton 23:45 And-

Chris Williamson 23:45 Until the next fastest. (laughs)

Stu Morton 23:46 Yeah. And with the way the, the, uh, boats are going as well, it'll come to a point where the Pureclass boats no longer, uh, are no longer built-

Chris Williamson 23:53 Yeah.

Stu Morton 23:53 ... or they're too old to be recycled.

Chris Williamson 23:55 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 23:55 So it's only Conceptclass boats. So then it would be nice to be the last person to have done something and all that sort of thing.

Chris Williamson 24:02 For sure.

Stu Morton 24:02 Um, but definitely I'm open to the thought of after the first one's done, maybe doing it again in a Concept boat or-

Chris Williamson 24:09 Right.

Stu Morton 24:09 ... you know. But I've obviously got to do it first and see if I like it.

Chris Williamson 24:12 You feel let's, let's get the first one out of the way.

Stu Morton 24:13 Then get that out of the way.

Chris Williamson 24:14 Yeah. For sure. So you're gonna set off January 18th. And then I'm right in saying that you don't actually steer, is that right? It's GPS that, uh, that does the, the majority of the steering in terms of direction for the rudder?

Stu Morton 24:26 Yeah. So you can have what's called an auto helm, um, and it basically attaches to the rudder.... and it's a, a digital steering device.

Chris Williamson 24:34 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 24:34 So you type in your bearing to the GPS, and then you can get it done automatically or you can sync it yourself as well.

Chris Williamson 24:41 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 24:41 You'll put the bearing into the auto helm-

Chris Williamson 24:43 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 24:43 ... and then it basically steers for you.

Chris Williamson 24:45 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 24:46 So you-

Chris Williamson 24:46 And you just get on and you just pull?

Stu Morton 24:47 Yeah, and you just pull. But if that breaks, you then go to foot steering or hand steering.

Chris Williamson 24:52 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 24:52 Which is as bad as it sounds. Um-

Chris Williamson 24:54 Yeah, whilst, whilst also trying to-

Stu Morton 24:56 To pull your oars, yeah, and you're constantly, like-

Chris Williamson 24:59 Readjusting.

Stu Morton 25:00 ... adjusting it and sort of making sure you're on the right bearing and all that stuff.

Chris Williamson 25:02 So are y- have you set your course now? Do you know the exact course?

Stu Morton 25:05 Yeah, so I, I went through it with, um, Foxy, um, we sort of sat down the other week and spent about eight hours picking the, the course. Um-

Chris Williamson 25:14 So you've only done it, only done it recently?

Stu Morton 25:16 Yeah, I mean, the-

Chris Williamson 25:17 You've had a lot of good idea-

Stu Morton 25:19 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 25:19 ... for a long time, but-

Stu Morton 25:19 I mean, everyone knows that I'm going from Portugal to Venezuela, so-

Chris Williamson 25:22 (laughs)

Stu Morton 25:22 ... it's pretty obvious-

Chris Williamson 25:23 Yeah.

Stu Morton 25:23 ... I just head west.

Chris Williamson 25:24 Yeah. (laughs)

Stu Morton 25:25 Um, but the intricacies of sort of getting out of Portugal and, like, breaking away from the land-

Chris Williamson 25:30 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 25:30 ... so you, you can afford to get your head down without, like, drifting into anything.

Chris Williamson 25:34 Yeah.

Stu Morton 25:34 So the first sort of day will be ... the first week's gonna be hell, 'cause you're-

Chris Williamson 25:39 Why's that?

Stu Morton 25:39 You're adjusting to everything. Um, it's the first week where you're, like, aware of what the routine is gonna be like.

Chris Williamson 25:45 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 25:45 It's the first week where your body's getting used to that workload, um, or your han- like, the blisters and stuff on your hands are gonna form and all that-

Chris Williamson 25:52 Yeah.

Stu Morton 25:52 ... sort of thing. Like, you can train to a certain extent in, like, the nice comfy confines of a gym and what have you.

Chris Williamson 25:58 Yeah.

Stu Morton 25:58 But when you actually get on it, you can't really train for an ocean row unless you're on the ocean.

Chris Williamson 26:04 Yeah, for sure. So you've to-

Stu Morton 26:05 So-

Chris Williamson 26:05 You've touched on it there, so I'm gonna segue off.

Stu Morton 26:07 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 26:07 Just take us through your training. Take us through what the training has consisted of.

Stu Morton 26:11 Um, I think that's always a hard question to answer because there's a, you know, chunk of society that trains all the time and they have goals outside of these big projects.

Chris Williamson 26:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 26:21 So, uh, like, I, I train most days and have done since I was 16 or 17. Um, but the row-specific stuff, I knew I had to get fat, I knew I had to get strong, and I knew I had to have a pretty good engine.

Chris Williamson 26:35 (laughs)

Stu Morton 26:35 Uh, luckily I've had a good engine for a while, um, so that kind of took care of itself.

Chris Williamson 26:39 Yeah.

Stu Morton 26:39 And that run was, like, confirmation of that.

Chris Williamson 26:42 Yeah.

Stu Morton 26:42 Um, and then just-

Chris Williamson 26:44 How, how about getting fat?

Stu Morton 26:45 Getting fat's been really weird. Really weird.

Chris Williamson 26:47 (laughs)

Stu Morton 26:47 It's gone really well, um, but it's been really strange. Obviously most people that train are training to achieve a goal.

Chris Williamson 26:55 The exact opposite, the exact opposite.

Stu Morton 26:56 Whether it be looking good or being nice when you're look, uh, looking good when you're naked and all that-

Chris Williamson 27:00 Yeah.

Stu Morton 27:00 ... sort of stuff. Um, and I've had to do the opposite of that.

Chris Williamson 27:03 Yeah.

Stu Morton 27:04 I've had to eat for a purpose, which goes against everything that like-

Chris Williamson 27:08 (laughs)

Stu Morton 27:08 ... I and people I stay with, like, stand for.

Chris Williamson 27:11 (laughs)

Stu Morton 27:11 So that's been really weird. But, um, it's, it's doing ... I'm getting better at it now because I know that it's gonna, like, su- uh, it's gonna-

Chris Williamson 27:19 Getting better at being fat?

Stu Morton 27:21 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 27:21 (laughs)

Stu Morton 27:21 Well, I'm getting better at putting the food in and not being that bothered by it.

Chris Williamson 27:24 Right.

Stu Morton 27:24 'Cause I know it's gonna, like, serve me well when the, the time comes, but ...

Chris Williamson 27:28 Yeah.

Stu Morton 27:28 No, it is, it's really weird. And it's-

Chris Williamson 27:30 And how about, how about strength? So this will probably ... I'm gonna guess that this will be the heaviest you've ever been?

Stu Morton 27:34 Yeah, 112 kilos at the moment.

Chris Williamson 27:36 From?

Stu Morton 27:37 85 in August.

Chris Williamson 27:39 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 27:40 So that's quite a, quite a gain.

Chris Williamson 27:42 Very sharp as well.

Stu Morton 27:42 And it's not, like, uh, you know ... Obviously you can judge for yourself, but a lot of people have said that I'm carrying it pretty well, like, I don't look like I'm super fat.

Chris Williamson 27:50 I wouldn't ... I wouldn't ... Absolutely, yeah, yeah.

Stu Morton 27:51 Um, but I think that comes from the strength training that I've been doing.

Chris Williamson 27:54 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 27:54 So I've added bulk as well as fat.

Chris Williamson 27:56 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 27:56 Um, definitely with my top off and stuff I'd look flabby, and I've got curves where I don't want them and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 28:01 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 28:02 But, um, working with Tim Briggs who does We Dominate Nutrition-

Chris Williamson 28:07 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 28:07 ... we were like, "Well, the first pa- the first pars- uh, part of getting fat is just eating more than you need to burn off," sort of thing.

Chris Williamson 28:15 (laughs) I can't, I can't, I can't believe that you've got like-

Stu Morton 28:17 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 28:17 ... howtogetfat.doc-

Stu Morton 28:18 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 28:19 ... has been emailed over-

Stu Morton 28:20 Exactly, yeah.

Chris Williamson 28:20 ... at some point.

Stu Morton 28:21 So we just overloaded on carbs and like, ate, ate a, a diet where my body got all the nutrition it needed.

Chris Williamson 28:27 Yeah.

Stu Morton 28:27 Like, so a lot of the stuff that Lauren cooks, I'll eat the same as her.

Chris Williamson 28:30 Yeah.

Stu Morton 28:30 And then on top of that it's been, like, pizzas and ice cream and chocolate.

Chris Williamson 28:34 Okay.

Stu Morton 28:34 Whatever you wanna do to get your calories up.

Chris Williamson 28:36 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 28:37 Um, and then recently, maybe three or four weeks ago, we switched to, like, a keto diet.

Chris Williamson 28:42 Okay.

Stu Morton 28:43 Um, so the idea is that my body now is gonna be better at burning fat.

Chris Williamson 28:47 Right.

Stu Morton 28:47 Um, and the transition happens now rather than on the row.

Chris Williamson 28:51 Okay.

Stu Morton 28:51 So I've already experienced sort of, like, headaches and, like-

Chris Williamson 28:54 Are you ... Would you say you've, you've dropped into ketosis now, then?

Stu Morton 28:57 Um, I'd s-

Chris Williamson 28:58 You-

Stu Morton 28:58 ... probably say so, yeah. I'm-

Chris Williamson 28:59 On the cusp, in and out of it?

Stu Morton 28:59 I'm feeling better in, on it now.

Chris Williamson 29:01 Yeah.

Stu Morton 29:01 Um, I did get sort of quite a few headaches and was feeling, like, dreary and a bit hungover in the mornings and stuff. Um, and then also ... Yeah, I've just, you know ... It, it, it's been nicer on the, the fat-based diet rather than, like, the carby, sugary stuff 'cause it makes you feel awful.

Chris Williamson 29:18 Oh, does it really? Really?

Stu Morton 29:19 Yeah, and now I'm coming out of the transition as well. It feels ... I'm feeling-

Chris Williamson 29:23 Almost all-

Stu Morton 29:23 ... a lot more energetic and sort of healthier, if that makes sense.

Chris Williamson 29:25 I think that's ... I mean, for a lot of, a lot of people who have had to suffer the pain of a fat and protein diet, th- that's, for most people, really uncomfortable.

Stu Morton 29:34 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 29:34 They don't like the fact that they don't have that starch, that-

Stu Morton 29:37 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 29:37 ... kind of bulky, satiated feeling that you get that comes along with having carbs.

Stu Morton 29:42 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 29:42 Um, so that's the, that's the diet side, so-

Stu Morton 29:44 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 29:44 ... in terms of training, what have you been doing to prepare your b- a, a lot of time on a Concept Two, I'm gonna guess.

Stu Morton 29:49 Yeah, there is that. I mean, it doesn't really cross over that much to ocean rowing, so-

Chris Williamson 29:53 Really?

Stu Morton 29:53 Yeah, so i- uh, in a two-hour set on a Concept Two I can pull 30 kilometers, which is a good pace.

Chris Williamson 29:59 Oh my God. (laughs)

Stu Morton 30:00 But then when I first got my boat, I rowed it from the Tyne Bridge to the Royal Quays, which is eight miles-

Chris Williamson 30:05 Yeah.

Stu Morton 30:05 ... and it took me two hours.

Chris Williamson 30:06 Oh, wow.

Stu Morton 30:07 So the weight of the boat, how slow she goes in the water and all that sort of stuff-

Chris Williamson 30:11 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 30:11 ... like, it makes it so much different to the Concept Two. But you're not gonna do any damage being on a Concept Two.

Chris Williamson 30:17 Yeah.

Stu Morton 30:17 So it's the nearest you can get to it without-

Chris Williamson 30:19 Yep.

Stu Morton 30:19 ... getting on the boat. So, um, a lot of two-hour sets, one-hour sets.

Chris Williamson 30:24 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 30:24 Uh, rowed through the night one time, did like 70K in one sitting.

Chris Williamson 30:27 Wow.

Stu Morton 30:28 Um, that was at, at the gym, at CrossFit Tyneside.

Chris Williamson 30:31 Yeah.

Stu Morton 30:32 Uh, and then most of the time it's just sort of general prepared fitness with, uh, Lauren, so training most days together in the mornings, um, we're just doing like crossfit-y sort of stuff, so-

Chris Williamson 30:41 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 30:42 ... a lot of functional movements and sort of, like-

Chris Williamson 30:44 I thought... I, I hones- I honestly thought there'd be a lot more row-specific stuff. I genuinely thought it would just be, "Yeah, I've just spent the last six months sat on a Concept2-"

Stu Morton 30:53 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 30:53 "... and I've done some accessories work." But it would appear that-

Stu Morton 30:55 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 30:56 ... the crossover from doing more functional stuff actually appears to be more beneficial in progression.

Stu Morton 31:00 Yeah, I think so. And looking at, like, that Talisker race that I keep, like, going back to, people take that pretty seriously.

Chris Williamson 31:06 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 31:06 And people train for it, or have trained for it, um, with this, like, the l- thing you've just said there, like sat on a Concept2-

Chris Williamson 31:14 Yeah.

Stu Morton 31:14 ... most of the time.

Chris Williamson 31:15 Just going, yeah.

Stu Morton 31:16 And then doing a little bit of accessory stuff. And it hasn't really worked as well-

Chris Williamson 31:19 Really?

Stu Morton 31:20 ... as people that have come in recently with like a- an endurance sports background, who have done more sort of functional training, and then they've done a bit of Concept2 (...)

Chris Williamson 31:28 A little bit more well-rounded as athletes.

Stu Morton 31:29 Yeah. So I think it's more like training for the Marines was. You're like, you're sort of ready for anything. Like, you're a good sprinter, you're strong, you're gymnasty, and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 31:38 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 31:38 Um, and I think, you know, it, that, that's definitely worked well, being as robust as you can possibly be.

Chris Williamson 31:45 I suppose it must make the training as well, building up to something that is going to be a bit monotonous. The fact that you can go in and one day do rope climbs, and one day do pull-ups, and one day do Concept2, and then...

Stu Morton 31:54 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 31:54 Do you know what I mean? Like, it...

Stu Morton 31:55 Yeah. Well, my, my thought is to save the monotony for the actual (laughs) the event itself.

Chris Williamson 32:00 It sounds like-

Stu Morton 32:00 Like-

Chris Williamson 32:00 ... it's going to be a little bit, yeah.

Stu Morton 32:01 Yeah. I'm happier that I could sit on a rower for four- like, 14 hours or whatever. I've done it before.

Chris Williamson 32:06 Yeah.

Stu Morton 32:06 Um, I'm happier I can work out for 18 hours-

Chris Williamson 32:09 Yeah.

Stu Morton 32:09 ... having done it before. Um, and like I said, the row is more mental than it is physical. Like, it's gonna be debilitating and hard work and all that sort of stuff.

Chris Williamson 32:19 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 32:19 But I think, like, the overriding rule or mantra in my life is there's always someone worse off than yourself.

Chris Williamson 32:24 Yeah.

Stu Morton 32:25 And it's, I think whatever situation you're in is not that bad, if you keep that in mind, so-

Chris Williamson 32:30 I'm not sure there's gonna be very many people on the planet that are gonna be doing as many hours per day-

Stu Morton 32:34 No.

Chris Williamson 32:34 ... as yourself during that period.

Stu Morton 32:36 (laughs) Yeah.

Chris Williamson 32:36 Which again is a crazy, a crazy thought, when you think 7 billion people on the planet and you will be easily in the top 0.1% of people working out for three months-

Stu Morton 32:47 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 32:47 ... on the boat. So... (laughs)

Stu Morton 32:48 No, it's mad. Well, there's a famous... Brad Wiggins explains the Tour de France by saying, "It's the only sporting event on the planet where you need a hair- haircut halfway through."

Chris Williamson 32:57 (laughs)

Stu Morton 32:57 And I'll need, like, maybe three or four-

Chris Williamson 32:59 Actually, yeah, you're gonna have t- you're gonna have to do all sorts.

Stu Morton 33:00 Yeah. So, um, but it's... And also, apart from the working-out side of things, like, I have to be a carpenter, an electrician, um, a water maker specialist, um, all these different things.

Chris Williamson 33:11 Yeah.

Stu Morton 33:11 'Cause if anything breaks on the boat, there's no one to fix it but me.

Chris Williamson 33:14 You'd, you'd said to me, the... one of the first things that you said about the race was you need to be able to take apart and put back together every single element that's on the boat.

Stu Morton 33:20 Yeah, upside down and in the dark. So...

Chris Williamson 33:22 Wow.

Stu Morton 33:23 It's pretty...

Chris Williamson 33:23 So talk us, talk us through the vessel, or the boat. Talk us through what's on it.

Stu Morton 33:26 Yeah. So she's 24 feet long. Um, there's a cabin at the front and at the back that are both enclosed and airtight.

Chris Williamson 33:33 Right.

Stu Morton 33:34 Um, the one at the back is the one I sleep in.

Chris Williamson 33:37 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 33:37 Um, so it's about, it's basically coffin dimensions. It's like six foot by two foot.

Chris Williamson 33:42 Built for you, pretty much, obviously. So...

Stu Morton 33:43 Um, built for me, pretty much. Yeah. And in, in, in the cabin I've got sort of food, a memory-foam mattress, and a sleeping bag.

Chris Williamson 33:50 Okay.

Stu Morton 33:50 Um, and then I've got, like, the GPS, the radio, uh, the- a thing called AIS, which is like an indication system that tells me and other ships who each other are.

Chris Williamson 34:00 Right. (laughs)

Stu Morton 34:01 So you can get in touch and say, "Stay away from me, you're about to run me over."

Chris Williamson 34:03 Please, yeah.

Stu Morton 34:03 Or whatever. Um, then the forward cabin at the front of the boat is where I'm gonna have... it's mainly s- for storage. You can't really get in there.

Chris Williamson 34:11 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 34:12 Um, and it's just gonna store things like the parachute anchor and all that sort of thing.

Chris Williamson 34:16 Right.

Stu Morton 34:16 And then the deck itself has got two rowing positions and six oars. Um, and then-

Chris Williamson 34:22 Why?

Stu Morton 34:23 That's it.

Chris Williamson 34:23 Wh- why two rowing positions and six oars?

Stu Morton 34:25 Just, uh, basically so my boat can be rowed by one person or two people.

Chris Williamson 34:29 Right.

Stu Morton 34:29 Um, and there was an opportunity to, like, condense the two positions into one, just for the sake of, "I'm a solo rower, so I don't need two."

Chris Williamson 34:36 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 34:37 But then we talked about, the- with the project manager, that when they, um... as I get halfway through and I've eaten half of the food-

Chris Williamson 34:43 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 34:43 ... and obviously half of the, the weight of the boat has disappeared-

Chris Williamson 34:46 Yeah.

Stu Morton 34:47 ... um, it would be nice to have the opportunity to either row more forward or more back of the boat, so I can affect the boat's stability in the water.

Chris Williamson 34:54 Yeah.

Stu Morton 34:55 Uh, 'cause ballast's like a big thing with those boats.

Chris Williamson 34:57 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 34:57 Um, so that's the reason we kept the two positions. And also just to break up the monotony a little bit.

Chris Williamson 35:03 Yeah.

Stu Morton 35:03 I know it sounds weird. They're only, like, a foot apart from each other, but-

Chris Williamson 35:06 Just a little bit-

Stu Morton 35:07 ... if I spend one day in the front and one day in the back, it might help things go a bit quicker.

Chris Williamson 35:10 It, it'll look a little bit different.

Stu Morton 35:11 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 35:11 So I remember one of the first questions that I asked you, and I'm sure that some of the listeners are thinking this as well, the guys... the boats that have two or three or four people in them you would think would be able to get across quicker-

Stu Morton 35:24 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 35:25 ... than a boat that only has one person in them.

Stu Morton 35:26 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 35:26 There's more people, more horsepower, right?

Stu Morton 35:28 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 35:28 But you said that that wasn't strictly the case.

Stu Morton 35:31 No, and it's been proved in the last two Talisker races. So it's all, like, power-to-weight, uh, ratio. So they can go faster, but they're carrying more weight, and they're doing it in two-hour sort of sessions. So if we were doing it as a pair, for example, like, I'd be rowing while you're asleep-

Chris Williamson 35:48 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 35:48 ... and vice versa. But the pace is pretty much the same, 'cause our boat would... it would weigh what it would weigh for two people.

Chris Williamson 35:57 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 35:57 Whereas my boat's only gonna have 100 days worth of food instead of 200 days.

Chris Williamson 36:01 Yeah.

Stu Morton 36:01 So-

Chris Williamson 36:02 Only one person.

Stu Morton 36:02 Yeah, I've got to shift less weight. So effectively, I can keep the same sort of speed-

Chris Williamson 36:06 Yeah.

Stu Morton 36:06 ... over a 24-hour period, as we could do in two-hour, you know-

Chris Williamson 36:10 Sprints.

Stu Morton 36:11 ... sort of segments.

Chris Williamson 36:11 Yeah.

Stu Morton 36:12 So in the last two Talisker races, last year my friend Gavin Hennigan came third overall as a solo rower-

Chris Williamson 36:18 Right.

Stu Morton 36:18 ... and beat teams of two and three and four.

Chris Williamson 36:21 Wow.

Stu Morton 36:21 And there's a guy, Mark Slats, who's doing it this year, and he's third.

Chris Williamson 36:26 As a solo rower.

Stu Morton 36:27 As a solo in a team, you know, in a race full of fours and th- threes and f-

Chris Williamson 36:30 Which is true.

Stu Morton 36:31 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:31 Which just seems so counterintuitive-

Stu Morton 36:33 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:33 ... I suppose, but-

Stu Morton 36:34 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:34 ... yeah, when you've got the amount of food for that many more people-

Stu Morton 36:36 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 36:37 ... and, and all the rest of it.

Stu Morton 36:37 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:38 So, I mean, that's just...

Stu Morton 36:38 And they're rowing probably 20 hours a day, those two solo guys I just mentioned.

Chris Williamson 36:42 ... 20 hours a day?

Stu Morton 36:43 They row in about 20 hours a day, yeah.

Chris Williamson 36:45 So what's the logic behind ... 'cause obviously that's gonna cause, I guess, a little bit more burnout. You're gonna be more-

Stu Morton 36:49 Yeah, huge burnout.

Chris Williamson 36:50 ... more tired the next day.

Stu Morton 36:50 But I mean, Mark at the moment, they've been going two weeks, he doesn't seem to have slowed down any yet.

Chris Williamson 36:55 Wow.

Stu Morton 36:55 But obviously, you can't keep that up forever, so-

Chris Williamson 36:58 Yeah.

Stu Morton 36:58 ... everyone's sort of-

Chris Williamson 36:59 Get out ahead and then-

Stu Morton 37:00 ...

Narrator 37:00 (overlapping dialogue)

Stu Morton 37:00 ... when it's gonna stop. Yeah. Um, so for me, for example, I- I'll- I'm just gonna row and see how I feel and judge everything off, off that. There's no point in me making like a, a schedule now that I'm gonna have to change when I get on the row. So I'm just gonna sort of row for an hour or two and see how I feel.

Chris Williamson 37:17 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 37:18 Um, if I feel like I should rest a little bit, I will and get some food down me and the water and stuff.

Chris Williamson 37:23 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 37:23 And then if I feel like I want to carry on and do a, a big stint, then I will.

Chris Williamson 37:28 So in ... for the rowing aficionados out there, have you got an idea of sort of cadence and stroke rate and stuff like that? What is-

Stu Morton 37:35 Yeah. So, as a very basic sort of measure, you'd be doing around 18 to 20 strokes a minute.

Chris Williamson 37:41 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 37:42 Um, and to be honest with you, that's all that really counts for, f- for the aficionados out there.

Chris Williamson 37:47 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 37:47 'Cause the boats ... like I said before, if I do two hours on a, a Concept 2 and two hours on my boat, the distance is like halved basically.

Chris Williamson 37:56 (laughs) Yeah.

Stu Morton 37:56 So, um, it was ... that was a big eye-opener 'cause obviously you spend the whole time looking at your little screen on the Concept 2-

Chris Williamson 38:02 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:02 ... and you're thinking, "Right, if I pull 130 per 500, that's awesome."

Chris Williamson 38:06 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:06 "I'm doing really good."

Chris Williamson 38:07 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:07 Even if it's 2... blah, blah, blah. And you're doing all this math in your head and then as soon as you get on the boat, it just all goes-

Chris Williamson 38:12 All out the window.

Stu Morton 38:12 ... out the window. So it's just efficiencies, um, guided by your stroke rate. Um, and 18 to 20 is s- sustainable for 100 days.

Chris Williamson 38:21 And that feels about right for you as well?

Stu Morton 38:23 Yeah, it feels nice. And also because it's an ocean and not like a river boat, uh, a lot of river rowers have talked to me about sort of how it feels and how I'm training and all this sort of stuff, and it's, it's different again from those guys.

Chris Williamson 38:34 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 38:34 'Cause they're generally racing on really flat, sort of glass-like-

Chris Williamson 38:38 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 38:38 ... rivers or lakes.

Chris Williamson 38:40 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:40 Um, and they don't have to deal with weather all that much.

Chris Williamson 38:43 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:43 Whereas I'm constantly moving. The oars very rarely go in the water super clean and come out super clean. So you might put two oars in and one, you know, you're catching crabs straight away or the-

Chris Williamson 38:55 Yeah.

Stu Morton 38:55 ... the oar gets pulled out your hands or pulls down onto your thighs or whatever.

Chris Williamson 38:59 'Cause I think for a lot o-

Stu Morton 38:59 It's just rough.

Chris Williamson 39:00 A lot of people that have seen rowing on water before, it'll be Oxford-Cambridge boat race, stuff like that.

Stu Morton 39:05 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 39:06 Which is like glass.

Stu Morton 39:07 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 39:07 Like, as flat as fla- flat water can get.

Stu Morton 39:10 Yeah. And guys displaying-

Chris Williamson 39:11 (clears throat) .

Stu Morton 39:11 ... like amazing balance and their boat's super rigid and they don't move around at all, but-

Chris Williamson 39:14 Yeah, and I've seen a video of one of your friends recently, I think he's out on the water at the moment.

Stu Morton 39:19 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 39:19 And I saw a video that he'd uploaded from the cabin looking at him.

Stu Morton 39:22 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 39:23 And it, it just looks like hills. It just looks like a crazy golf course that-

Stu Morton 39:26 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 39:26 ... he's, that, that he's rowing over the top of behind him.

Stu Morton 39:28 Yeah. It's nuts. So for instance, the ... to like, to describe the conditions, he recently woke up in his cabin with his eye sort of all blackened and cuts all over his face.

Chris Williamson 39:38 Right.

Stu Morton 39:39 'Cause while he was asleep, he capsized. And it's like a washing machine inside the cabin most of the time. So-

Chris Williamson 39:44 And it's ... uh, you said it was sealed, right? So-

Stu Morton 39:46 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 39:47 You-

Stu Morton 39:47 So he was just battling around (phone notification) in this sort of coffin, um, and woke up with his eye in sort of bad order.

Chris Williamson 39:53 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 39:53 Um, but he's, he's the guy I mentioned before, Damian, who's just sort of an example of how to tackle it. So he just sort of laughed it off, took it for what it was.

Chris Williamson 40:01 And he was just cracking on?

Stu Morton 40:01 He's just cracked on, yeah.

Chris Williamson 40:03 Wow.

Stu Morton 40:03 And then later that day, I think he was on the deck and it capsized again.

Chris Williamson 40:06 Capsized twice in a day, right? Yeah.

Stu Morton 40:07 Um, and he said he just sort of ... you know, he's prepared for that 'cause he'd heard of it before. So ...

Chris Williamson 40:11 Wow.

Stu Morton 40:12 But he's, he's like ... uh, he's how I'd sort of like to tackle it.

Chris Williamson 40:16 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 40:16 And like y- you look at him and it really sets you up well for, for what's coming 'cause he doesn't like sugarcoat it and make out it's easier than it is.

Chris Williamson 40:25 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 40:25 And at the same time, he's just honest. Like he just says what it is.

Chris Williamson 40:28 Not sort of glorifying anything.

Stu Morton 40:29 Yeah, and he's not saying, "Oh, this is the hardest thing I've ever done in my life," and all this sort of thing, but you're gonna ... if you go into it thinking it's not gonna be the hardest thing you've ever done, you're an idiot.

Chris Williamson 40:38 (laughs)

Stu Morton 40:39 So I think as long as you're aware of how difficult it's gonna be, there's not gonna be that many nasty surprises.

Chris Williamson 40:44 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 40:44 Um, but also, I think the amount of people that get into this sort of thing, they're not gonna do it lightly. You-

Chris Williamson 40:49 'Cause you've already filtered out an awful lot of people just through the madness of saying that you're gonna do it, I think.

Stu Morton 40:55 Yeah, I think ... yeah. Th- that, that video scenario I always explain in, in Fulham is a good, a good like litmus test I think for the general-

Chris Williamson 41:04 No one, no one in the room even thought about it.

Stu Morton 41:05 No one wanted to even think about it, and I was just sat on my own thinking, "Ah, that sounds-"

Chris Williamson 41:08 Going crazy, right?

Stu Morton 41:09 And I don't f- like I know I'm not normal. Like I'm against the grain of what most people think is, you know, normal or whatever like that. But I just ... like I said before, I, I find value in other things that some people don't.

Chris Williamson 41:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 41:22 And I think that sort of, you know, as much as people want to progress in business and see how much money they can make and all that sort of stuff, that's admirable in its own world.

Chris Williamson 41:30 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 41:30 But I- I'm not made of that sort of stuff. Like I want to see what I can put up with and what I can achieve in, in other worlds.

Chris Williamson 41:38 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 41:38 Um, and it's just sort of how I'm bred, I suppose.

Chris Williamson 41:42 (laughs)

Stu Morton 41:42 And other people are bred differently.

Chris Williamson 41:43 Yeah. So going back to the race, so you've got yourself out of Portugal. Hopefully you've managed to pull yourself away so that you can't drift into things.

Stu Morton 41:50 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 41:50 So it's gonna be finding your feet for the first week to 10 days or so?

Stu Morton 41:53 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 41:54 And then what happens 10 days in? Where are we there?

Stu Morton 41:56 Um, 10 days in is hopefully set a rhythm. Um, I know what my scenario, uh, what my schedule on the boat is gonna be more like. So maybe rowing three hours and resting for one hour or rowing two, resting two.

Chris Williamson 42:08 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 42:09 Um, and you know, all the, all the jobs on board that you're doing while you're not rowing, so like cooking and cleaning and maintenance and all that sort of stuff. Um, hopefully on top of all of that by 10 days in. Um, and yeah, and just sort of, you know, making good chunks into the, the distance.

Chris Williamson 42:27 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 42:27 So the guys on the Talisker Race, for example, they've been rowing for like two weeks now and they're still only halfway through.

Chris Williamson 42:33 Right.

Stu Morton 42:33 Uh, no one actually has passed the halfway mark.

Chris Williamson 42:36 Right.

Stu Morton 42:37 Um, so it's just that. It's knowing every day ... let's ... it's breaking everything down into small chunks. So if you can cover 60 miles in a day, you're doing well as a solo.

Chris Williamson 42:45 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 42:46 Um-So that's, you know, you break that target 60 miles down to 30 miles for every half day.

Chris Williamson 42:52 Yeah.

Stu Morton 42:52 Um, I just keep on going through it like that.

Chris Williamson 42:55 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 42:55 Um, so yeah, hopefully by day 10 I'll be sort of, you know, a good chunk into the race, couple of hundred miles down.

Chris Williamson 43:02 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 43:02 Um, I'm just sort of not really looking at the miles to go-

Chris Williamson 43:06 No. (laughs)

Stu Morton 43:06 ... because that'd be a little bit disheartening seeing 3,000 and odd miles.

Chris Williamson 43:08 (laughs) Oh, wow.

Stu Morton 43:09 Um, and yeah, and then just enjoying the experience is the main thing for me. I think too many people come back from the race and they've treated the whole thing as a, you know, a, a pressurized race-

Chris Williamson 43:19 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 43:19 ... where they, they're not really appreciating where they are and what they're doing. Um, there's a book I read recently by a guy called John Fairfax who rowed solo in 1969.

Chris Williamson 43:30 Right.

Stu Morton 43:30 So he did it basically, like compared to me, on the bones of his ass.

Chris Williamson 43:34 (laughs)

Stu Morton 43:34 Like, he didn't have any kit. Um, none of the electrics that I've got.

Chris Williamson 43:37 Totally hand- hand and foot steering, right?

Stu Morton 43:38 No radio. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Um, and he had no food. He caught most of his food that he ate on the row.

Chris Williamson 43:44 No way.

Stu Morton 43:45 Um, so all that sort of stuff. I've got, like, fishing rods and a spear gun and-

Chris Williamson 43:49 (laughs)

Stu Morton 43:49 ... as much as possible, I'll sort of try and enjoy the experience.

Chris Williamson 43:51 Yeah.

Stu Morton 43:52 Um, rather than just treating it as a sort of-

Chris Williamson 43:54 You haven't got a volleyball, have you?

Stu Morton 43:56 (laughs) Yeah.

Chris Williamson 43:57 (laughs)

Stu Morton 43:58 That's come up a few times.

Chris Williamson 43:59 Yeah, the Wilson thing.

Stu Morton 44:00 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 44:00 That would be quite cool. Uh, so one thing that I, I didn't understand was how you secure yourself when you can't touch the floor of the ocean for sleeping, so you don't drift away.

Stu Morton 44:10 Okay, yeah. Um, so you've got a thing called a para anchor, which is like a 12-foot parachute, um, and it's set out on, like, a 100-meter line.

Chris Williamson 44:20 Right.

Stu Morton 44:21 So you've got a big, thick rope-

Chris Williamson 44:23 Yeah.

Stu Morton 44:23 ... that you attach to the boat. And then you put the para anchor out so that the current, obviously, that's going underneath the boat-

Chris Williamson 44:28 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 44:30 ... um, the para anchor harnesses that current.

Chris Williamson 44:32 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 44:32 And it keeps the nose of the boat basically into the, the swell.

Chris Williamson 44:35 Yep.

Stu Morton 44:36 So that your position is held.

Chris Williamson 44:38 Yes.

Stu Morton 44:38 Um, you won't gain much distance while you're on the, on a para anchor.

Chris Williamson 44:43 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 44:43 But ideally, you're not gonna lose much either.

Chris Williamson 44:45 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 44:46 Um, and then also, in bad weather, you can deploy the para anchor and it'll keep the f- front of the boat pointing into the, the bad weather.

Chris Williamson 44:53 Yeah.

Stu Morton 44:53 So that you're going sort of up and down rather than side to side.

Chris Williamson 44:56 For sure.

Stu Morton 44:56 Um, and it- (laughs) it's meant to, um, eliminate the possibility of capsize, but it doesn't.

Chris Williamson 45:03 But your friend's proven in-

Stu Morton 45:04 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 45:04 ... twice in 24 hours

Narrator 45:05 that maybe that's-

Stu Morton 45:05 Yeah, so the general rule of thumb is if you've got a boat that's, say, three meters wide-

Chris Williamson 45:09 Yeah.

Stu Morton 45:09 ... if you get hit side-on by a wave more than three meters, you're gonna-

Chris Williamson 45:13 You're going over.

Stu Morton 45:14 ... turn over. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 45:14 Yeah.

Stu Morton 45:15 And it's the At- Atlantic Ocean, so most of the waves are sort of eight or nine meters.

Chris Williamson 45:19 Right. Okay.

Stu Morton 45:20 So if you- if you hit one side-on, you're going over.

Chris Williamson 45:22 Wow.

Stu Morton 45:23 So I think it's important as well for, uh, if anyone's thinking of doing it is to understand it's how many times you're gonna capsize rather than if you're gonna capsize.

Chris Williamson 45:31 (laughs)

Stu Morton 45:31 And being comfortable with the fact that it's gonna happen.

Chris Williamson 45:34 Wow.

Stu Morton 45:35 So, yeah.

Chris Williamson 45:35 So in terms of the route that you're taking, and you've, you've spoken about the, the streams and the, um, the wind-

Stu Morton 45:42 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 45:42 ... that you're going to catch, am I right in saying what you said to me, that there's gonna be some times where you may be on the crest of a, a wave going in the right direction, so to speak, and you can kind of almost surf that a little bit?

Stu Morton 45:51 Yeah, definitely, yeah.

Chris Williamson 45:52 You can pull at the right pace to ride that down.

Stu Morton 45:55 Yeah. So in what normal people would consider bad weather, um, in certain situations for ocean rowing it's, it's really good for you, because you'll get picked up by a wave as you're rowing.

Chris Williamson 46:03 Yeah.

Stu Morton 46:04 And then the c- the common thread is to ditch the oars, just let go of them, and they'll sit in the gates and they're not gonna go anywhere. And then you grab your hand steering, uh, ropes-

Chris Williamson 46:13 Yeah.

Stu Morton 46:13 ... and you basically steer yourself down the wave. And you'll pick up maybe, like, between sort of 6 and 10 knots.

Chris Williamson 46:19 Right.

Stu Morton 46:19 Which isn't very fast walking from A to B, but surfing down a wave on a-

Chris Williamson 46:23 It's sort of free money, so to speak.

Stu Morton 46:25 Yeah, exactly, yeah.

Chris Williamson 46:26 I guess.

Stu Morton 46:26 So you're flying along. And then anyone that understands surfing, obviously waves come in sets.

Chris Williamson 46:31 Yeah.

Stu Morton 46:31 So if you're doing that every sort of 10 to 12 seconds-

Chris Williamson 46:35 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 46:35 ... you're making up some really, really good distance, so.

Chris Williamson 46:36 Uh-huh. So a lot of this, uh, uh, I guess a lot of the ease of the journey's going to be dependent on Mother Nature.

Stu Morton 46:45 Yeah, and also it depends on my, for want of a better term, my balls.

Chris Williamson 46:49 Yeah.

Stu Morton 46:49 'Cause l- my friend Lieven, um, is doing weather routing for the t- like, five teams that are on the Talisker Race right now.

Chris Williamson 46:56 Yeah.

Stu Morton 46:56 And I was at Lieven's house the other night, and as we were speaking, he had to keep on dashing away to, like, phone people on the race and give them their weather options.

Chris Williamson 47:03 Right.

Stu Morton 47:04 Um, and one of the teams he spoke to were on para anchor 'cause the weather was, uh, "bad".

Chris Williamson 47:09 Yeah.

Stu Morton 47:09 In inverted commas. Um, so they were just gonna sit there and ride it out. And then he spoke to a four-man team, um, a group of boys, uh, from up here actually, um, and they were, they wanted more wind, they wanted more speed, so they were, like, surfing down the waves as we've just described there. So it's, it's, it's understanding what bad weather is, 'cause there's a fine line between free speed and putting yourself in a dangerous position.

Chris Williamson 47:32 Yeah, for sure.

Stu Morton 47:33 Um, but it's, you know, it's understanding what bad, bad weather is.

Chris Williamson 47:35 Where do you think, where do you think that you rank on the scale? Would you say that you're sort of-

Stu Morton 47:38 I'm pretty happy 'cause, I mean, at the risk of sounding too confident, I've worked on the Indian Ocean for sort of two or three years.

Chris Williamson 47:46 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 47:46 Um, and, you know, witnessed some pretty bad weather.

Chris Williamson 47:50 Yeah.

Stu Morton 47:50 And that was when we were on sort of cargo cr- um, cargo carriers and tankers and oil rigs.

Chris Williamson 47:56 Yeah.

Stu Morton 47:56 And we were a little bit worried.

Chris Williamson 47:57 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 47:58 So that was pretty bad weather.

Chris Williamson 47:59 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 47:59 So if I experience anything like that, then definitely that would be, like, a case of battening down the hatches and, you know, surviving.

Chris Williamson 48:05 Yeah.

Stu Morton 48:06 Um, but I think in most scenarios it's gonna be sort of harnessing what you've got and-

Chris Williamson 48:11 And just going for it.

Stu Morton 48:11 ... making the best use of it, yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:12 Yeah. So, I saw something online that you posted about a sheepskin seat cover?

Stu Morton 48:18 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:19 And then someone asked why you had a sheepskin seat cover.

Stu Morton 48:21 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 48:22 And what are you wearing to row in?

Stu Morton 48:24 Uh, so generally, I think 80% of the time, people will row naked. Um-

Chris Williamson 48:29 Completely naked?

Stu Morton 48:30 Completely naked, yeah. So the idea is that if you... You could probably test it at home if you've got that much time on your hands-

Chris Williamson 48:36 (laughs)

Stu Morton 48:37 ... but if you, say, dip it... Y- if your T-shirt gets covered in salt water-

Chris Williamson 48:41 Yeah.

Stu Morton 48:41 ... and then it dries out in the sun-

Chris Williamson 48:42 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 48:43 ... the water evaporates but the salt crystals stay in the material.

Chris Williamson 48:46 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 48:46 And they're abrasive.So obviously, if the T-shirt's rubbing on your skin, especially with rowing, you're gonna end up with like sores on your armpits.

Chris Williamson 48:53 Really bad, really fast.

Stu Morton 48:54 Yeah. And because you're at sea, the salt gets into the wound and it makes it harder to heal.

Chris Williamson 48:59 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 48:59 Um, and then obviously because you're d- debilitated and malnourished and all that sort of stuff, your body's slower at fixing itself anyway.

Chris Williamson 49:05 It's a bad environment-

Stu Morton 49:07 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:08 ... for healing.

Stu Morton 49:08 Yeah. And that's gonna happen anywhere you've got clothes on or anywhere where there's friction.

Chris Williamson 49:11 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 49:11 Whereas the sheepskin, because it's soft and fluffy and it's, like, more of a natural fiber-

Chris Williamson 49:16 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 49:16 ... it, it's better at not retaining the salt crystals-

Chris Williamson 49:19 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 49:20 ... than sort of manmade fibers are.

Chris Williamson 49:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 49:21 So the idea is that you clean it out as often as you can with s- uh, fresh water.

Chris Williamson 49:27 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 49:27 Um, and then sitting on that naked is basically gonna provide less friction than rowing in a pair of shorts.

Chris Williamson 49:33 So someone goes past you on a boat.

Stu Morton 49:35 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:36 They're gonna see this-

Stu Morton 49:37 A naked guy.

Chris Williamson 49:38 ... 100, 110 kilo-

Stu Morton 49:40 Yeah. Yeah. But bear in mind-

Chris Williamson 49:40 ... bearded man rowing.

Stu Morton 49:41 Yeah. For the first part, uh, you'd, you'd wear shorts for that reason.

Chris Williamson 49:45 (laughs)

Stu Morton 49:45 But for the middle of the ocean, there's not many people gonna come past.

Chris Williamson 49:48 For the sum of, someone on holiday-

Stu Morton 49:49 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 49:49 ... a family holiday on a yacht just coming round the corner to Portugal and-

Stu Morton 49:51 Exactly, yeah. And, but I'll be in a position where I'm that tired, I don't really care who sees me or-

Chris Williamson 49:55 That's absolutely fine.

Stu Morton 49:56 ... what I look like, so.

Chris Williamson 49:57 So in terms of avoiding sunburn and stuff like that, like even just, like, the volume of sun cream that you're gonna have to take.

Stu Morton 50:02 Yeah. So I use, like, these zinc stick things.

Chris Williamson 50:05 Yeah.

Stu Morton 50:05 Um, so I just stick that on. But I generally, through, like, uh, jobs I've done in the past, I've spent a lot of time in the sun and exposed to it in sort of big chunks.

Chris Williamson 50:14 Yeah.

Stu Morton 50:15 Um, so I get used to it pretty quick.

Chris Williamson 50:17 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 50:18 Um, um, like I said before, uh, when I was in Tanzania for a few years, um, it was, you know, something I put up with all the time there.

Chris Williamson 50:26 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 50:26 So you get used to that pretty quick. Uh, but definitely for the first part, I'll be covered up and, you know

Narrator 50:31 (cries)

Chris Williamson 50:31 After 100 days in the sunshine, you're gonna come back with a wicked tan as well.

Stu Morton 50:34 Yeah. I'll be quite leathery, I think, as well.

Chris Williamson 50:38 (laughs)

Stu Morton 50:38 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 50:39 Man. So fresh water as well, like, water's a very, very heavy-

Stu Morton 50:43 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 50:44 ... object to take with you. How's that working? Have you got a-

Stu Morton 50:47 So-

Chris Williamson 50:47 ... a, something that you can distill on, on board as well?

Stu Morton 50:50 Yeah. So on board, I've got a, um, a desalinator or a water maker. Uh, and basically it's plumbed into the boat, so there's a valve underneath the hull, like, the bottom of the boat-

Chris Williamson 51:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 51:01 ... and it sucks up seawater, and then through loads and loads of different filters at mega high pressure, turns it from salt water into drinkable water.

Chris Williamson 51:10 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 51:10 Um, doesn't taste particularly great, but, you know, keeps you, keeps you going when you need it.

Chris Williamson 51:15 Yeah.

Stu Morton 51:16 Um, and then also, because of the type of boat I have, it needs ballast.

Chris Williamson 51:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 51:21 To sort of set it down in the water and again reduce the, the chance of, uh, capsizing.

Chris Williamson 51:25 Yeah.

Stu Morton 51:26 So the ballast is gonna come in the form of about 120 kilos of fresh water.

Chris Williamson 51:30 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 51:31 Um, just in plastic bottles that you'd get from a shop sort of thing.

Chris Williamson 51:34 (laughs)

Stu Morton 51:35 Uh, and then if the water maker breaks, and my handheld water maker breaks as well-

Chris Williamson 51:40 Yeah.

Stu Morton 51:40 ... I've got emergency water to last me sort of, you know-

Chris Williamson 51:44 Sufficient time.

Stu Morton 51:44 ... however long it could.

Chris Williamson 51:45 Yeah.

Stu Morton 51:45 Um, and the idea with that would be if you drink any of the fresh water in the bottles, you can just replace it with seawater and mark the bottle so you don't drink it.

Chris Williamson 51:53 Yeah.

Stu Morton 51:53 And that way you don't lose any ballast-

Chris Williamson 51:54 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 51:54 ... but you're able to drink the emergency water.

Chris Williamson 51:56 So that's hydration. What about food?

Stu Morton 51:59 Food comes in the form of freeze-dried meals. Um, the sponsor that I've got, uh, Firepot, um, it's a company called Outdoor Food that make that brand.

Chris Williamson 52:09 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 52:09 Um, they basically cook their meals and then, uh, dehydrate them.

Chris Williamson 52:15 Right, okay.

Stu Morton 52:16 So they're way healthier than some of the other ones out there on the market.

Chris Williamson 52:19 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 52:19 So I won't obviously mention their names, but they're super sugary.

Chris Williamson 52:22 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 52:23 Um-

Chris Williamson 52:23 So you're actually having fully cooked meals that just happen to have had the water taken out.

Stu Morton 52:27 Yeah. Yeah, and then you just pour boiling water back in.

Chris Williamson 52:29 Vacuum, vacuum pack, foil bags, or whatever it is.

Stu Morton 52:31 Yeah. You leave it for, like, 15 minutes and that's rehydrated. And it's all, like, uh, chili con carne and spag bol and-

Chris Williamson 52:37 It's like the ultimate cup-a-soup.

Stu Morton 52:38 Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And they're, they're like 1,000 calories each meal and stuff like that, so.

Chris Williamson 52:42 So how much are you gonna be eating every day?

Stu Morton 52:44 So I've got four of those every day, um, as well as a snack pack, and the snack pack's got about 3,000 calories in it. Um-

Chris Williamson 52:51 A snack pack with 3,000 calories in.

Stu Morton 52:52 Yeah, so it's like-

Chris Williamson 52:53 What's, what's a, what's-

Stu Morton 52:54 I've got loads of, uh, nut butter, some biltong, 'cause apparently people say that you miss chewing 'cause all the freeze-dried food's, like, quite sloppy and soft.

Chris Williamson 53:02 Yeah.

Stu Morton 53:03 So the biltong is just basically for chewing.

Chris Williamson 53:05 Nice, nice and tough.

Stu Morton 53:05 Yeah. And it's obviously, like, mega stacked with protein. Um, and then I've got sort of, uh, energy gels that are fat-based-

Chris Williamson 53:13 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 53:13 ... rather than sugary ones.

Chris Williamson 53:14 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 53:15 Um, and then Batlout spars and flapjacks and stuff like that, so.

Chris Williamson 53:18 Full works. So you're gonna be eating sort of moderately well, I suppose.

Stu Morton 53:21 Yeah, I think I'm gonna be hitting about 7,000 calories a day, and then the argument is you burn about 10,000.

Chris Williamson 53:27 Yeah.

Stu Morton 53:27 So I'll be in a 3,000 calorie deficit every day.

Chris Williamson 53:29 So that's about a pound a day of weight-

Stu Morton 53:31 Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

Chris Williamson 53:32 ... not far off that you'll be, that you'll be losing. So what if we say it's around about 100 days, in 100 days from January 18th-

Stu Morton 53:40 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 53:40 ... what's your weight gonna be?

Stu Morton 53:41 I think the, the, um... What do you call it? The vast majority of people that do it say they lose about a quarter of their body weight. So-

Chris Williamson 53:49 Oh my God.

Stu Morton 53:49 ... that's why I took the jump from 85 to 112.

Chris Williamson 53:52 (laughs)

Stu Morton 53:52 I aimed at 115, I think.

Chris Williamson 53:54 Yeah.

Stu Morton 53:54 Um, but I think I'm about 112 at the minute, so I'm there or thereabouts.

Chris Williamson 53:58 Yeah.

Stu Morton 53:59 Um, and then (laughs) hopefully I'll lose all that, um, by the time I get to Venezuela.

Chris Williamson 54:04 If you, if you come back and you're at 120-

Stu Morton 54:05 I'll be really annoyed, yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:07 (laughs)

Stu Morton 54:07 Super annoyed.

Chris Williamson 54:09 Fuck bollocks.

Stu Morton 54:10 (laughs)

Chris Williamson 54:10 I've gotta go on a fucking cut now. (laughs)

Stu Morton 54:12 Exactly. Getting the watt back and just sitting on that for another six months.

Chris Williamson 54:14 You have got the tan though. You have already got the tan.

Stu Morton 54:17 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:17 Um, so tell us about the Rock2Recovery then 'cause the, everything that you're doing here is-

Stu Morton 54:22 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 54:22 ... based around a charity, right?

Stu Morton 54:23 Yeah. So to get a bit candid and maybe a little bit sort of controversial, um, I generally, you know, and, and a lot of other people, um, wanna bring to the fore how much PTSD is ignored.

Chris Williamson 54:37 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 54:38 Um, I think people that come back from Afghan and Iraq and all that sort of stuff with injuries, physical injuries, are pretty well looked after now. Um, they don't get the, the best care that they could possibly wish for.... but it's, it's pretty good. So if you lose a leg, for example, you're gonna get a prosthetic and it's gonna be of, of a very good sort of standard.

Chris Williamson 54:59 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 55:00 Um, but unfortunately, uh, the same can't be said for mental health. Um, if you come back with a brain injury or with post-traumatic stress or anything like that, you're just not well looked after at all. It isn't clear what avenues you should be going down to seek help. Um, it isn't clear what kind of signs and symptoms to look out for in people. So like-

Chris Williamson 55:18 Do you think, do you think that this is across US, UK? Is this-

Stu Morton 55:22 Yeah. It's ac- like, you, like, the suicide rate for sort of veterans is sky-high. And a lot of it is because of, you know, p- post-trauma sort of incidents that they've experienced. Or if they've, you know, been in high-pressure situations for huge chunks of their lives-

Chris Williamson 55:39 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 55:39 ... which Afghan and Iraq provided, um, you basically leave the service and you don't have any, um, transitionary sort of support.

Chris Williamson 55:47 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 55:47 You're just, you know, one day you're flying around jumping out of helicopters and shooting people and stuff, and the next day, you're in Waitrose getting annoyed at people.

Chris Williamson 55:54 Mowing the lawn.

Stu Morton 55:55 Yeah. Getting in your way when you're trying to buy tomatoes or whatever.

Chris Williamson 55:57 Wow.

Stu Morton 55:57 So, it's a really hard thing to come to terms with, especially with the fact that there's no help out there. Um, and Rock to Recovery is a charity that's sort of changing the face of that. So they're providing help for veterans and their families, um, who have to deal with PTSD and sort of brain trauma injuries and stuff like that. Um, and it's like a fast action charity as well. So if anyone, for example, if you had a friend or a relative or whoever that was in the forces that you were worried about, you could call Rock to Recovery and they'd literally fly up to see that friend or relative-

Chris Williamson 56:31 Oh, nice.

Stu Morton 56:31 ... and give them like immediate one-to-one support, like there and then.

Chris Williamson 56:34 Good Samaritans, but for-

Stu Morton 56:36 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 56:36 ... for really serious (overlapping)

Stu Morton 56:37 Yeah. And obviously, it costs a fortune. So, the, raising money for a, a charity like that and trying to raise the or- uh, awareness of them as well is like really important. So-

Chris Williamson 56:48 I mean, I, I, I think I've, I've got a friend, BT Rella, who, uh, started VetSports in America.

Stu Morton 56:53 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 56:53 Which is a, a wounded and PTSD-

Stu Morton 56:56 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 56:57 ... uh, support and sports league. So they play like baseball and a whole bunch of other stuff.

Stu Morton 57:00 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 57:01 And, um, he gave probably one of the most moving talks I've ever heard about a year and a half ago.

Stu Morton 57:05 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 57:05 And he went through all of the different bits that, all of the problems that his friends have had with PTSD. And he, he said that he was one of the guys who'd come out physically injured quite badly. Um, but given the choice between being physically injured and mentally injured-

Stu Morton 57:21 Mm-hmm.

Chris Williamson 57:21 ... he was glad that he was able to, that he'd lost a leg. That was, was his analogy that he'd used.

Stu Morton 57:25 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 57:26 Um, and I think it just sounds so alien, the concept of PTSD. And, uh, obviously being in that high pressure situation, the level of adrenaline that they'll have experienced, that soldiers will have experienced in one day of combat will be more than most people will experience in a lifetime.

Stu Morton 57:41 Yeah. And like, not only that, even getting away from the trauma side of things, just looking at something as simple as transitioning from one career to another.

Chris Williamson 57:48 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 57:49 For most people, it's quite stressful. But for people like in the backgrounds that I've sort of encountered, you go from this sort of high level, like, you know, where the, the level of octane and the adrenaline and all that sort of stuff that you're experiencing-

Chris Williamson 58:03 Yeah.

Stu Morton 58:03 ... on a day-to-day basis. Um, it goes from like 100 to zero.

Chris Williamson 58:07 Yeah.

Stu Morton 58:08 And you're expected just to deal with that.

Chris Williamson 58:09 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 58:10 Um, and what you're used to and the people that, like people around you, their behavior that you're used to, that changes all of a sudden as well.

Chris Williamson 58:17 Yeah.

Stu Morton 58:17 So you can't rely on people to, you know, treat you the same way or anything like that. So you've got to, you've got to transition your head and like the way you act. And everything you've ever known completely changed now, without any support whatsoever.

Chris Williamson 58:29 It's a new life.

Stu Morton 58:29 Yeah. At least, and like if you're joining the military, um, and you're, you know, you're doing that role reversed, so you're going from a very sedentary lifestyle and all that sort of stuff, and then joining the military. They take almost a year to train you up to a standard that they can then send you to war.

Chris Williamson 58:46 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 58:46 And then when you come back from war, and you want to go back into like civvy street-

Chris Williamson 58:49 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 58:50 ... you're just sent there. You don't get any transitionary support whatsoever.

Chris Williamson 58:52 So they, they, they die you down, but they don't reverse die you back up, so to speak.

Stu Morton 58:55 Yeah. Exactly. So like, that has a massive effect on how people act, on their reactions to things, like how they process stuff in their heads. Um, and there needs to be help for that. There's like, at the moment, there's no prosthetics for the mind. But if people lose legs or lose arms or something, they can get those limbs replaced.

Chris Williamson 59:12 Yeah.

Stu Morton 59:12 They're obviously nowhere near as good as having your original leg or whatever.

Chris Williamson 59:16 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 59:16 But there's, like I said, there's no prosthetic for the mind. So the, the more help that people can provide by using these charities like Rock to Recovery and, you know, ones like it, it's, it's super important to get to a point where people aren't running out of options-

Chris Williamson 59:30 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 59:30 ... and they're r- arriving at the door of suicide.

Chris Williamson 59:32 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 59:33 People are losing their families and loved ones sort of thing, so.

Chris Williamson 59:35 S- so that's the, the goal is to raise as much money as possible. Where are you up to?

Stu Morton 59:39 Yeah. So we've, I've raised about five grand for them so far.

Chris Williamson 59:42 Yeah.

Stu Morton 59:42 Um, the bulk of the money that's gonna come from the, the row itself will be while I'm away.

Chris Williamson 59:47 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 59:47 Um, I've experienced in the build-up to the event itself that you're taken far more seriously when you sort of, you know, you tell people you're gonna do it. And then that sort of dies off a bit. Then you buy a boat.

Chris Williamson 1:00:00 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:00:00 And that like thing makes people think, "Jesus, he's actually gonna go through with this. He bought a boat."

Chris Williamson 1:00:04 Yeah. That's actually, yeah.

Stu Morton 1:00:04 Um, and then all the training and all that sort of stuff. Yeah. Um, so I think as soon as I set off then that'll be a big thing.

Chris Williamson 1:00:11 Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:00:12 Um, and then also, one of the founders of the, the charity, uh, Foxy, um, he's on TV quite a bit with the SAS program.

Chris Williamson 1:00:19 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 1:00:19 On Channel 4. Um, and then he's got another program coming out about, uh, drug cartels and stuff like that in Venezuela. So-

Chris Williamson 1:00:26 No way.

Stu Morton 1:00:27 ... he's obviously gonna use his-

Chris Williamson 1:00:28 You're not gonna, you're not, you're not gonna meet him at, at one of them, are you, when you're over there? (laughs)

Stu Morton 1:00:31 No. Yeah, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:00:31 (laughs)

Stu Morton 1:00:31 Well, he gave me a load of, uh, heads up about what Venezuela's like at the moment 'cause it's basically a failed state. So-

Chris Williamson 1:00:36 Pretty lawless. Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:00:37 Yeah. So getting there is gonna be interesting to see if they've got a-

Chris Williamson 1:00:39 Yeah. You might just jump back in the boat and turn around. "Right. Give me some, give me some more food and I'm going back."

Stu Morton 1:00:43 Mm-hmm. Yeah. But he's, he's basically gonna help sort of, um, you know, spread the message and all that sort of stuff. And-

Chris Williamson 1:00:49 Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:00:50 ... I think, like I said, when I'm actually out on the row, that's when the sort of, the money will come trickling in then.

Chris Williamson 1:00:55 For sure.

Stu Morton 1:00:55 Um, the BBC are gonna do an interview on the 5th of January.... um, and then one of the main sponsors is making a, a documentary. So-

Chris Williamson 1:01:02 No way.

Stu Morton 1:01:03 ... I think in terms of raising money, there's about sort of the next six months is gonna be the big-

Chris Williamson 1:01:08 Big deal.

Stu Morton 1:01:08 ... the big, the big push, yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:10 Yeah. So in terms of, you've got Rock2Recovery on there, I know that you've got MyProtein as well. Who else have you got on there that are this sort of

Stu Morton 1:01:20 Yeah. ... thing? Yeah. So the, the two main sponsors are True Potential.

Chris Williamson 1:01:23 Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:01:23 Um, they're an investment firm based in Newburn, so they're a northeast-based company.

Chris Williamson 1:01:27 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 1:01:28 Uh, and then the other one is Airfare, um, and they're basically a flight claim-

Chris Williamson 1:01:32 (laughs)

Stu Morton 1:01:32 ... flight delay compensation company.

Chris Williamson 1:01:34 Uh-huh.

Stu Morton 1:01:34 Um, both owned by friends of mine.

Chris Williamson 1:01:36 No way.

Stu Morton 1:01:36 Uh, and they're both northeast-based sort of companies as well, so-

Chris Williamson 1:01:39 So you're taking a, a good sort of local base

Stu Morton 1:01:41 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:01:41 ... thing.

Stu Morton 1:01:41 So that's like, that's an important thing for me. I wanted to get sort of people in the local area involved in it.

Chris Williamson 1:01:46 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:01:46 Um, there was a story in The Chronicle and all that sort of stuff. And then like I said before, BBC Look North are gonna come do a, a feature on it, so-

Chris Williamson 1:01:53 Have, have you found it difficult? Because you've said that you're a little bit averse to kind of putting yourself on a pedestal, and, and, uh, searching the accolade that's a little bit more extrinsic and stuff like that.

Stu Morton 1:02:03 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:03 Have you found it uncomfortable to have to be the Instagram story guy, the, the constant update guy?

Stu Morton 1:02:09 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:09 'Cause obviously as you've said, when you, when you publicize these milestones and the build-up to it, and presumably throughout as well, when you do those, you're kind of battling against two things there. One of them is it will raise more money for the charity, and generally-

Stu Morton 1:02:24 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:24 ... notoriety about the race is good. But on the flip side of that, you're maybe doing something that naturally you wouldn't have a preclusion to do.

Stu Morton 1:02:31 Yeah.

Chris Williamson 1:02:32 Do you-

Stu Morton 1:02:32 Um, it's really ... I, I did a blog post about it recently, 'cause it's sort of, you know ... It's one of those things. I, I don't berate anybody that does it and that builds their profile and all that sort of stuff, 'cause generally they're doing it for good reasons. Um, and I do understand that the more people I tell about the Row, the more exposure the charity gets and the more money that we raise and all that sort of stuff. But also at the same time, I've chose to do the Row solo for a reason. Like I like my own company.

Chris Williamson 1:02:59 (laughs)

Stu Morton 1:02:59 I like my own space, and I like being able to do things without any sort of fuss and stuff like that.

Chris Williamson 1:03:04 Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:03:05 And I also strongly feel that in terms of like raising money before the Row and telling people what's gonna happen before the Row, to me it's sort of ... It's not important until I've completed the task.

Chris Williamson 1:03:16 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:03:16 It's one thing to say you're gonna do it, but actions are remembered long after words are forgotten.

Chris Williamson 1:03:21 Mm-hmm.

Stu Morton 1:03:21 So actually completing the challenge and coming back and having a story for me is way better than going around telling everyone you're gonna do it.

Chris Williamson 1:03:28 Yeah.

Stu Morton 1:03:28 There's ... Obviously seven years worth