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Peter Attia MDPeter Attia MD

#140 - Gerald Shulman, MD, PhD: Insulin resistance—molecular mechanisms and clinical implications

Gerald Shulman is a Professor of Medicine, Cellular & Molecular Physiology, and the Director of the Diabetes Research Center at Yale. His pioneering work on the use of advanced technologies to analyze metabolic flux within cells has greatly contributed to the understanding of insulin resistance and type 2 diabetes. In this episode, Gerald clarifies what insulin resistance means as it relates to the muscle and the liver, and the evolutionary reason for its existence. He goes into depth on mechanisms that lead to and resolve insulin resistance, like the role of diet, exercise, and pharmacological agents. As a bonus, Gerald concludes with insights into Metformin’s mechanism of action and its suitability as a longevity agent. We discuss: 00:00:00 - Intro 00:04:30 - Gerald’s background and interest in metabolism and insulin resistance 00:08:30 - Insulin resistance as a root cause of chronic disease 00:12:00 - How Gerald uses NMR to see inside cells 00:19:15 - Defining and diagnosing insulin resistance and type 2 diabetes 00:31:15 - The role of lipids in insulin resistance 00:40:15 - Confirmation of glucose transport as the root problem in lipid-induced insulin resistance 00:50:00 - The role of exercise in protecting against insulin resistance and fatty liver (50:00); -Insulin resistance in the liver 01:17:15 - The evolutionary explanation for insulin resistance—an important tool for surviving starvation 01:22:30 - The critical role of gluconeogenesis, and how it’s regulated by insulin 01:32:15 - Inflammation and body fat as contributing factors to insulin resistance 01:41:15 - Treatment approaches for fatty liver and insulin resistance, and an exciting new pharmacological approach 01:58:15 - Metformin’s mechanism of action and its suitability as a longevity agent Show notes page: https://peterattiamd.com/geraldshulman/ About: The Peter Attia Drive is a weekly, ultra-deep-dive podcast focusing on maximizing health, longevity, critical thinking…and a few other things. With over 30 million episodes downloaded, it features topics including fasting, ketosis, Alzheimer’s disease, cancer, mental health, and much more. Peter is a physician focusing on the applied science of longevity. His practice deals extensively with nutritional interventions, exercise physiology, sleep physiology, emotional and mental health, and pharmacology to increase lifespan (delay the onset of chronic disease), while simultaneously improving healthspan (quality of life). Learn more: https://peterattiamd.com/ Subscribe to receive exclusive subscriber-only content: https://peterattiamd.com/subscribe/ Sign up to receive Peter's email newsletter: https://peterattiamd.com/newsletter/ Connect with Peter on: Facebook: http://bit.ly/PeterAttiaMDFB Twitter: http://bit.ly/PeterAttiaMDTW Instagram: http://bit.ly/PeterAttiaMDIG Subscribe to The Drive: Apple Podcast: http://bit.ly/TheDriveApplePodcasts Overcast: http://bit.ly/TheDriveOvercast Spotify: http://bit.ly/TheDriveSpotify Google Play: http://bit.ly/TheDriveGooglePlay

Peter AttiahostDr. Gerald Shulmanguest
Dec 7, 20202h 8mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Gerald Shulman Explains Insulin Resistance From Muscle Lipids to Liver

  1. Shulman describes using NMR spectroscopy to measure metabolic flux inside living human cells, showing that muscle insulin resistance stems from a block in glucose transport caused by diacylglycerol activating novel PKC isoforms.
  2. He lays out a progression in humans from muscle insulin resistance to hyperinsulinemia, increased liver de novo lipogenesis, fatty liver, hepatic insulin resistance and ultimately fasting hyperglycemia driven by accelerated gluconeogenesis.
  3. Exercise can bypass the muscle transport block, likely via AMPK-driven GLUT4 translocation, and a single bout reduced liver fat synthesis in insulin-resistant young people.
  4. Shulman proposes insulin resistance is an evolutionarily conserved protection during starvation that preserves glucose for the brain, but becomes harmful in an overnutrition environment.
  5. On treatment, he favors a liver-targeted mitochondrial uncoupler to burn liver fat safely, and argues metformin works through a redox mechanism at glycerol-3-phosphate dehydrogenase rather than complex I, leaving its use for longevity an open question.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Flux, not static concentration, reveals metabolic disease

Shulman says blood tests give only a snapshot, whereas NMR with isotope labeling lets researchers track glucose into glycogen and see where biochemical roadblocks occur inside human muscle and liver.

The muscle defect in insulin resistance is at glucose transport

Measuring both glucose-6-phosphate and intracellular glucose as reduced pointed to transport rather than hexokinase or glycogen synthase, even in lean young insulin-resistant volunteers.

Diacylglycerol, not triglyceride, is the culprit

Triglycerides are an inert storage form and merely a marker, while DAGs activate PKC theta and epsilon to block insulin signaling; knockout and overexpression studies in animals supported this.

Muscle insulin resistance may drive fatty liver in humans

In young insulin-resistant volunteers, ingested carbohydrate that can't enter muscle glycogen is diverted to liver fat synthesis amid portal hyperinsulinemia, raising triglycerides and lowering HDL before glucose becomes abnormal.

Gluconeogenesis is regulated largely indirectly via fat cells and acetyl-CoA

Shulman argues insulin suppresses gluconeogenesis mostly by braking peripheral lipolysis, lowering acetyl-CoA and glycerol delivery, while inflammation-driven lipolysis pushes diabetics into fasting hyperglycemia.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

If we're gonna be serious about the business of delaying the onset of death, we have to be serious about the business of delaying the onset of chronic disease. And if we want to do that, we must fix our metabolisms.

— Peter Attia

Biochemistry is the same thing. You have a roadblock, and traffic builds up behind it.

— Dr. Gerald Shulman

In my view, insulin resistance was a protective mechanism throughout evolution that allowed us to survive all species during starvation, which was probably the predominant environmental exposure we've had for the last many, many millennia.

— Dr. Gerald Shulman

If I had to pick two molecules that are driving metabolic disease, it's acetyl-CoA driving pyruvate carboxylase and again, the diacylglycerols activating epsilon.

— Dr. Gerald Shulman

Triglycerides are neutral, so I want to emphasize this. So even though triglycerides often track with insulin resistance, we've dissociated it inside the muscle cell and liver cell from insulin resistance.

— Dr. Gerald Shulman

NMR to measure metabolic fluxMuscle insulin resistance and glucose transportDiacylglycerol and PKC epsilon/thetaExercise, AMPK and GLUT4Fatty liver and de novo lipogenesisGluconeogenesis and acetyl-CoA regulationLiver-targeted mitochondrial uncouplers

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