Biden vs. Trump: Debate Strategies | Pivot

1. 0:00 – 1:30

   Debate stakes and CNN ground rules: early showdown, tight polling, muted mics

   1. KSKara Swisher0:00

      Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump are set to face off on Thursday for the earliest presidential debate in modern history, by like a lot. Usually it's September. Uh, the debate, hosted by CNN, uh, moderated by Jake Tapper, Jake Tapper, uh, and Dana Bash, uh, will be the first time, uh, Biden and Trump have gone head-to-head or been in the same room since their last debate in October of 2020. I don't think they like each other. A Marist poll from last week shows a dead heat between the candidates, and actually, uh, Biden was up a little bit. He's been going up a little bit, and including in a Fox News poll, which is making, uh, President Trump loo- former President Trump lose his mind, which is not very far to go. Um, so let's talk about strategery, Scott. Now here you are going into this debate, I talked about it a little bit on Chris- the Chris Wallace show this week, but, um, what is the strategery? Just for some more background, RFK Jr. did not make the cut for the debate, falling short in ballot qualification and polling. He's making a lot of noise. The debate rules, just for people to know, and then I'd love your thoughts on this, no live audience, no props allowed on stage, microphones will be muted when it's not a candidate's turn to speak. I believe they have two minutes. Biden won the coin toss and selected his podium position on the right side of the screen. Trump then chose to have the last word, uh, in closing statements. Um, so- so what do we think? Give me a- give me a what Biden should... This is the question we asked on Chris Wallace, I think it was a good one. Does this- does this setup help which one, from- if you were the marketing guy here figuring out sort of the optics of it, which one do you think this set helps?

2. 1:30 – 2:17

   Why the format favors Biden: stripping Trump’s ‘carnival’ advantage

   1. SGScott Galloway1:30

      Oh, it's total Team Biden, in terms of advantage.

   2. KSKara Swisher1:33

      Hmm, interesting.

   3. SGScott Galloway1:34

      Uh, Trump is so quick and outrageous on his feet and so plays to the crowd and tickles people's sensors and all that- all that. Him constantly interrupting people, it just throws the other person off, you know, off-kilter. So them shutting off the mic is totally advantageous to Biden. There would be some crazy... I- I think Democrats tend to be a little bit more civil than maybe MAGA people.

   4. KSKara Swisher1:57

      Mm-hmm.

   5. SGScott Galloway1:57

      He's not gonna show up with a bunch of people who've acc- I mean, do you remember the bullshit-

   6. KSKara Swisher2:02

      Yeah, he accused Bill Clinton-

   7. SGScott Galloway2:03

      ... with- with- with Secretary Clinton?

   8. KSKara Swisher2:04

      Yes, remember Bill Clinton's... Yeah.

   9. SGScott Galloway2:05

      So he creates a sideshow and a carnival which throws the other person off their feet. And the strategy here is really simple. Okay, let's talk about the economy. I wouldn't uh, I wouldn't- I wouldn't go to-

   10. KSKara Swisher2:16

       All right.

   11. SGScott Galloway2:16

       Sorry, go ahead.

3. 2:17 – 3:13

   Biden’s debate plan: avoid legal fights, go ‘adult’ on economy and border, land abortion message

   1. KSKara Swisher2:17

      Let me get... What is the one thing Biden should avoid and one thing he should lean into, and what is the one thing Trump should avoid and lean into?

   2. SGScott Galloway2:24

      Um, if I were- if- if I were, um, if I were Biden, I would stay away from the Trump court cases. I think that people will go there on their own and, um, I don't think he... I think he wants to talk about the economy and bodily autonomy and how he is- he is actually taking action against immigration. I'd go very, very almost conservative and hard right on immigration and say, "And now if the Republicans would only help me solve the crisis at the border." And I would talk about the economy, I would talk about numbers, I would be very kind of adult, almost like an economist. And I would end the debate with the following. Awkward pause, my last question to our viewers tonight after thanking CNN is, "Do you have daughters?" And I would just leave the air empty for a few seconds.

4. 3:13 – 3:52

   Handling the age narrative: prepared lines and turning it back on Trump

   1. KSKara Swisher3:13

      Mm-hmm. Very good. I like that. He's- be- many people think he should not... You know how Reagan did that fantastic, uh, rejoinder bite?

   2. SGScott Galloway3:20

      Yeah.

   3. KSKara Swisher3:20

      "I'm not gonna let my age take advantaged..." He's not witty like that.

   4. SGScott Galloway3:23

      No.

   5. KSKara Swisher3:23

      And so he... Should he have a joke in his pocket, though, about his age? If, uh-

   6. SGScott Galloway3:27

      Um, I- I don't-

   7. KSKara Swisher3:28

      ... if Trump goes there? Because Trump's got some cognitive dingity-dongs happening constantly now.

   8. SGScott Galloway3:33

      Yeah, I mean, he should have a couple... He should have pre-packaged two or three, and when someone brings up age, he should come up with, you know, say like, like, "We're- we're, you know, we're- we're both probably consumers of catheters." I would- I would make jokes that-

   9. KSKara Swisher3:45

      (laughs)

   10. SGScott Galloway3:46

       ... that remind everybody that the guy across the- the stage from me-

   11. KSKara Swisher3:49

       Yeah.

   12. SGScott Galloway3:49

       ... is also really fucking old, folks. So yeah.

   13. KSKara Swisher3:51

       Yeah. Yeah.

5. 3:52 – 6:50

   Trump’s strongest lane: ‘crime and chaos’ and Democrat-run institutions/cities

   1. SGScott Galloway3:52

      You hate us both, whatever- whatever you want to talk about. But him not having a hot mic, um, if I were- if I were, um... And if I were Trump, I would talk a lot about what's happened on universities when Democrats take over institutions and what's happened in Democratically-controlled cities. That's where I would focus if I were-

   2. KSKara Swisher4:11

      Crime.

   3. SGScott Galloway4:11

      ... if I were, uh, if I were Trump.

   4. KSKara Swisher4:13

      Chaos. C- crime and chaos, sort of the Nixony kind of thing.

   5. SGScott Galloway4:16

      Well, the most Dem- I mean, he... The- the arguments they should make, and this is what media they should roll every day, is-

   6. KSKara Swisher4:21

      Mm-hmm.

   7. SGScott Galloway4:21

      ... "This is what happens when Democratically-controlled leadership takes over an institution. Look at what's happened to our elite universities. This is what happens when Democrats-"

   8. KSKara Swisher4:28

      Mm-hmm.

   9. SGScott Galloway4:28

      "... get control of a city, even if it has a ton of money, this is what happens." Is- is it-

   10. KSKara Swisher4:32

       Okay.

   11. SGScott Galloway4:32

       You go downtown San Francisco, is this where you want the country to be? I realize that's not fair.

   12. KSKara Swisher4:36

       Mm-hmm.

   13. SGScott Galloway4:36

       I realize you love San Francisco.

   14. KSKara Swisher4:38

       Yeah.

   15. SGScott Galloway4:38

       That is just from a perception standpoint.

   16. KSKara Swisher4:40

       I- I'm- you're coming with me there, okay? Yeah, go ahead. It's changed.

   17. SGScott Galloway4:42

       I- I- I live there.

   18. KSKara Swisher4:43

       But go ahead, I agree. I agree. Okay.

   19. SGScott Galloway4:44

       It might be wonderful, I'm just talking pure perception.

   20. KSKara Swisher4:46

       Okay. Good.

   21. SGScott Galloway4:46

       People-

   22. KSKara Swisher4:47

       Yeah, I got it. Yeah.

   23. SGScott Galloway4:47

       People who've never been there for some reason-

   24. KSKara Swisher4:49

       Yeah.

   25. SGScott Galloway4:49

       ... think it's a hellscape right now, unfairly or fairly.

   26. KSKara Swisher4:51

       Yeah. Yeah.

   27. SGScott Galloway4:51

       And also-

   28. KSKara Swisher4:52

       Yeah.

   29. SGScott Galloway4:52

       ... to be fair, like Portland and Seattle are really... I have been to those cities recently.

   30. KSKara Swisher4:57

       Yeah. Mm-hmm.
6. 6:50 – 14:08

   What Trump must avoid: relitigating 2020 and spiraling into grievance

   1. KSKara Swisher6:50

      Yeah. Yeah, the problem is, like, everywhere he goes, he's like, he's missing words now. He's doing a lot of stuff, and obviously has a family history of this, but, um, of dementia. But one of the things that I think is problematic, and I, I spoke to a lot of people in that CEO summit, they were surpri-... Now look, they're gonna back Trump 'cause it's good for them in tax cuts, let me just say, and someone who was there is saying they thought he was crazy. They're still gonna back him, right? Um, he was losing words. He was going off on tangents. This was a crowd that was welcoming to him, um, this CEO group, uh, the Business Roundtable, and, um, and were, was willing to, like, overlook the insurrection kind of stuff for, for a tax cut. And I- I- I talked to a number of people who were like, "Whoa." Like, "Whoa," like that kind of thing. So, I think that's where he... I don't know how much he has control over that or is willing to do that. I think one of the things he cannot do is talk about losing the election. That's, he-

   2. SGScott Galloway7:47

      That's a great point.

   3. KSKara Swisher7:47

      ... wh- whether it was stolen.

   4. SGScott Galloway7:48

      That's a great point.

   5. KSKara Swisher7:49

      He cannot-

   6. SGScott Galloway7:49

      I agree.

   7. KSKara Swisher7:49

      He cannot look backwards, but he can't get off of that. I, I... "You stole the election. You stole the election." That thing is-

   8. SGScott Galloway7:56

      If he does that, it's an opportunity for Biden.

   9. KSKara Swisher7:57

      ... i- i- it animates him.

   10. SGScott Galloway7:58

       Yeah, if he does that-

   11. KSKara Swisher7:59

       It animates him.

   12. SGScott Galloway7:59

       If he does that, it's a huge opportunity for Biden. Biden needs to be ready to go and go, "Okay, 43 cases, zero credibility."

   13. KSKara Swisher8:05

       Mm-hmm.

   14. SGScott Galloway8:05

       You know, just-

   15. KSKara Swisher8:06

       Right.

   16. SGScott Galloway8:06

       ... XYZ, what's the difference between every... What's the difference between us and every other nation?" (laughs) "We-"

   17. KSKara Swisher8:11

       Yeah.

   18. SGScott Galloway8:11

       "... we have people who can steal an el-" You know, i- i- and Biden-

   19. KSKara Swisher8:14

       Yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway8:14

       ... has to be ready to really, like, drive a train-

   21. KSKara Swisher8:17

       Right.

   22. SGScott Galloway8:18

       ... through that.

   23. KSKara Swisher8:18

       Tr- I think Trump can't help it. I think it inhibits-

   24. SGScott Galloway8:19

       You're probably right.

   25. KSKara Swisher8:20

       ... everything he does.

   26. SGScott Galloway8:20

       You're probably right.

   27. KSKara Swisher8:21

       And then the other thing he's saying, the last thing I'd say is, he's all saying that Biden's getting a shot in the ass, which means Trump is getting a shot in the ass, right? (laughs) Like, everything he says, I'm like, "Oh, that's what you're doing."

   28. SGScott Galloway8:31

       Mm-hmm.

   29. KSKara Swisher8:32

       Like that he's getting special drugs. I mean, Trump looks like he's taken every drug in town, like it feel... Like Ozempic, it looks like he's juicing.

   30. SGScott Galloway8:38

       But, but i- i- Biden needs to practice the age-old adage about being interviewed. Don't answer the question they ask. Answer the question you wanna ask. At some point he-
7. 8:38 – 9:28

   Biden’s pivot technique: answer the question you want and cite tangible actions (TikTok, Middle East)

   1. SGScott Galloway8:38

      But, but i- i- Biden needs to practice the age-old adage about being interviewed. Don't answer the question they ask. Answer the question you wanna ask. At some point he-

   2. KSKara Swisher8:46

      Mm-hmm.

   3. SGScott Galloway8:46

      ... needs to say the following, "Trump threatened to, tried to ban TikTok and carve it up. We have actually banned it and are investing it with a plan that will pass muster, that makes sense. Biden constantly, you know, uh, uh, you know, Trump talks about safety in the Middle East. We sent two aircraft carriers over there, and we are, we have, we have so far sequestered this from becoming a more regional conflict." He needs to say, "Okay, Trump talks a big game, but we actually, we actually, you know, we have some overlap here. You agreed, you thought TikTok was a national threat. I wanna give you credibility for it. We've actually done something about it."

   4. KSKara Swisher9:20

      Right.

   5. SGScott Galloway9:20

      "You talk a big game about being an ally to Israel. We're actually the real ally here. One of us has, has deployed"-

   6. KSKara Swisher9:26

      Yeah.

   7. SGScott Galloway9:26

      "... an aircraft carrier there."

   8. KSKara Swisher9:28

      Right. Yeah.

   9. SGScott Galloway9:28

      You know?

8. 9:28 – 9:59

   Money and momentum: fundraising totals and ‘felon bump’ after verdict

   1. KSKara Swisher9:28

      Yeah, yeah, I think that's true. I think one of the interesting things going into this is the money raising. Now Trump is, they're, they thought this would happen, but he's raised 141 million in May. Biden raised 85 million. Um, he was way ahead, Biden. Um, uh, 53 million came in from Trump 24 hours after the hush money verdict, of course. He's really done very well by being a felon. Um, there's also, uh, I think that'll ultimately even out and depends on where they spend it. I don't know what else to say. I don't think there's gonna be a big deficit between them.

9. 9:59 – 10:48

   Trump VP ‘circus’: contenders, Burgum as a leading guess, and Noem fading

   1. KSKara Swisher9:59

      Um, Trump VP s- uh, r- speculation, he's making a circus of it. He revealed this weekend he knows who his pick will be, although he hasn't told the person yet. The future VP candidate will most likely be at the debate, according to Trump. Um, top contenders, JD Vance, Marco Rubio, Tim Scott. I think I've settled on Burgum at this point. Uh, you know, he's managing to carry the water for him and seems not as nuts as the others. Uh, so, I think he doesn't like Marco Rubio. I think he thinks JD Vance will take attention from him. Tim Scott looks like a toady, so, so much so. So, I suspect it's Burgum. South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem appears to be out of the running. She indicated on Meet the Press over the weekend-

   2. SGScott Galloway10:35

      'Cause Trump has a dog.

   3. KSKara Swisher10:36

      ... she's not been formally vetted. Yeah. (laughs) No, he doesn't have a dog.

   4. SGScott Galloway10:38

      He doesn't, no. That makes sense.

   5. KSKara Swisher10:40

      He doesn't have any pets.

   6. SGScott Galloway10:41

      That makes sense.

   7. KSKara Swisher10:41

      Um, so, uh, so w- any... Just make a guess, and then, uh, I'll ask you a last question about-

   8. SGScott Galloway10:46

      Well, I, I-

   9. KSKara Swisher10:48

      ... the Supreme Court's decision.

10. 10:48 – 11:10

    VP line of attack on Biden: ‘You’re voting for President Harris’

    1. SGScott Galloway10:48

       ... I, I don't know. I, I think it's probably gonna be Burgum, but just one last thing. If I were on the Trump team-

    2. KSKara Swisher10:52

       Mm-hmm. Sure.

    3. SGScott Galloway10:53

       ... I would hammer over and over, uh, just to be snarky, I would go-

    4. KSKara Swisher10:56

       Kamala.

    5. SGScott Galloway10:56

       I would go, "Uh, 100%." I'd be like, "Well, President Harris." And he's like, "You better get used to that." If he really wants to go gangster, he'd say the following, "You're not voting for Joe Biden. You're voting for President Harris. Just wrap your head around that."

    6. KSKara Swisher11:08

       Yeah.

    7. SGScott Galloway11:08

       "Because she's deeply unpopular."

11. 11:10 – 12:42

    Supreme Court timing and the Trump immunity case: court dynamics speculation

    1. KSKara Swisher11:10

       Yeah. Yeah, I think you're right. I hate to say it, but I think that would work really well. We'll see if he comes up with it. Uh, meanwhile, we're still waiting for the Supreme Court's decision on the Trump immunity case. What in the world are they doing over there at the Supreme Court? The next batch of opinions will be released on Wednesday. They've got a lot to go, and they've got a very short term to do it in. Uh, the day before the debate, so we get a decision then. Um, the immunity decision, I think they're probably, like, wrangling over it, right? I think Alito's been hurt probably with the flag situation. Um, but, uh, i- in terms of power, but I suspect they're trying to come t- I have this feeling that Amy Coney Barrett's just not going along with the boys at this point on this kind of thing. But who knows? Um, she seems to have formed relationships with the other women on the court, which is interesting. Um, what do you think of this? Not on abortion obviously, but, um...What do you think? Does this affect it?

    2. SGScott Galloway12:01

       I think that's ho- wishful thinking, that she's siding with-

    3. KSKara Swisher12:04

       I, I know, I know. But lately, she has been... mm, I don't know. It's just interesting.

    4. SGScott Galloway12:09

       Yeah.

    5. KSKara Swisher12:09

       I think she's gotten, uh, hanging around other people, and she's so smart. Like, let's be honest-

    6. SGScott Galloway12:14

       Yeah, she's-

    7. KSKara Swisher12:14

       ... godly or not-

    8. SGScott Galloway12:15

       ... she's a, she's a-

    9. KSKara Swisher12:16

       ... she's as smart. Sharp as a tack.

    10. SGScott Galloway12:16

        Yeah, she's a legal scholar.

    11. KSKara Swisher12:18

        Um, it'll be... Uh, I do- I don't know. I just think it's, she's probably with, uh, uh, Judge Jackson who's also, oh, Jesus, what a brain. Um, I suspect that's the thing that appeals to her. Even religious gals who are brainy love the brainy part-

    12. SGScott Galloway12:33

        Mm-hmm.

    13. KSKara Swisher12:33

        ... more than anything, ultimately. I don't know. That's my wishful thinking is that they're all having, like they're like, hanging and, and, and squatting up or something. I don't know.

    14. SGScott Galloway12:42

        By the way-

    15. KSKara Swisher12:42

        Wishful thinking.

12. 12:42 – 14:08

    Fantasy ticket talk: Tapper-Bash, Mark Cuban, and the 2028 reset

    1. SGScott Galloway12:42

       ... you said something that sort of, that strikes me. Uh, b- uh, so try and clear your mind in this first answer.

    2. KSKara Swisher12:47

       Okay. Mm-hmm.

    3. SGScott Galloway12:48

       Uh, Biden-Harris...

    4. KSKara Swisher12:52

       Mm-hmm.

    5. SGScott Galloway12:52

       ... Trump-Bergen-

    6. KSKara Swisher12:54

       Mm-hmm.

    7. SGScott Galloway12:55

       ... or Tapper-Bash, who would you rather be president and vice president?

    8. KSKara Swisher12:59

       (laughs)

    9. SGScott Galloway12:59

       Seriously.

    10. KSKara Swisher13:01

        Dana-Bash, are you kidding?

    11. SGScott Galloway13:02

        I think Dana's fantastic. I think Jake-

    12. KSKara Swisher13:04

        Yeah.

    13. SGScott Galloway13:04

        ... is fantastic. If- I'm not-

    14. KSKara Swisher13:06

        Uh...

    15. SGScott Galloway13:06

        I'm not exaggerating.

    16. KSKara Swisher13:07

        Good hair.

    17. SGScott Galloway13:07

        Who would you think would do a better job?

    18. KSKara Swisher13:09

        I know, younger. Uh, younger probably.

    19. SGScott Galloway13:11

        Uh, i- i- if, if, if... and maybe I'm being sexist because I immediately thought of Jake Tapper as the president and-

    20. KSKara Swisher13:17

        Yeah.

    21. SGScott Galloway13:17

        ... Dana as number two.

    22. KSKara Swisher13:18

        Yeah, he looks like... mm-hmm.

    23. SGScott Galloway13:19

        But quite frankly, I think they're both super impressive, thoughtful people who know how to... Uh, uh-

    24. KSKara Swisher13:25

        Jake Tapper for president.

    25. SGScott Galloway13:27

        If, if they were on the ticket-

    26. KSKara Swisher13:28

        He would like that.

    27. SGScott Galloway13:29

        ... if they were on the ticket-

    28. KSKara Swisher13:31

        Mm-hmm. Yeah.

    29. SGScott Galloway13:31

        ... uh, that, they got my vote. That, those are the two-

    30. KSKara Swisher13:34

        I'd vote for Cuban. I told you I'd vote for Cuban.

Episode duration: 14:08