Kara and Scott Shred Zuck’s Vision for AI | Pivot

1. 0:00 – 0:49

   Intro

   1. SGScott Galloway0:00

      If I asked AI-

   2. KSKara Swisher0:01

      Yeah.

   3. SGScott Galloway0:01

      ... to give me an image of Mark Zuckerberg that defines who he is, I feel like it would be a guy at a really sad malt shop, sucking up the world's user data through a straw, and every time he made eye contact with you, he'd apologize and look away.

   4. KSKara Swisher0:18

      (instrumental music) Hi everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher from Scott Galloway's living room.

   5. SGScott Galloway0:29

      And I'm Scott Galloway.

   6. KSKara Swisher0:30

      We got a lot to get to today here from your apartment in, uh, Manhattan. Uh, blowup tech earnings, crazy, a big shakeup on the weight loss drug market, I really am interested in what you think about this, and how much does Trump need to worry about Joe Rogan? Joe Rogan is turning rogue on Trump on several topics.

2. 0:49 – 9:35

   Manhattan Office Shooting

   1. KSKara Swisher0:49

      Uh, but first, the man who opened fire in a Manhattan office building on Monday, not, not terrifically far from here, killing four people and injuring a fifth, was targeting the NFL headquarters with a note claiming he suffered from CTE. A page, uh, in the shooter's note accused the NFL of concealing the dangers to football players' brains in order to maximize profits. This is a longtime thing. I, I, uh, I, I am, uh, lots of people are concerned. I didn't let my kids play football because I was worried about that. The shooter played high school football, but did not play professionally. And of course, what he did was heinous. Um, but pretty, uh, devastating that people, you know, same thing with Luigi Mangione, people acting out on anger. The, the level of anger in this society, and maybe, uh, well, m- you can only find out if you have CTE after you die, so I assume they'll check this and see if that's the case. But I think Sanjay Gupta said 40% of the people who claim they have CTE, uh, before they die actually have it, like of 100%, which is quite a lot. It's not nothing. So, I don't know. Any thoughts?

   2. SGScott Galloway1:50

      Yeah. I mean, well, first off, we don't know if and what role CTE played here. Um-

   3. KSKara Swisher1:55

      Right. We don't.

   4. SGScott Galloway1:56

      Um, so just distinctive whether or not it- this was- CTE played a role here, it is, you know, they, they... There was a study of former NFL players, and it found that of the 306- 76 players studied, 91% had CTE. I mean, you just have people running... It's not even the impact. I guess it's the rotation, sudden rotation, that a helmet can't solve for, right?

   5. KSKara Swisher2:18

      Yeah.

   6. SGScott Galloway2:19

      Your, your head twists, and the, the, whatever it is, the cortex or the brain spine just can't, can't respond that quickly.

   7. KSKara Swisher2:26

      Yeah.

   8. SGScott Galloway2:26

      Um, everyone's been talking about it for a while, but it's an- it, it's sort of an example of capitalism. I'm not sure for- you could really justify this sport if it didn't make billions each year, if it wasn't s- if it wasn't psychologically and economically just so ingrained in our culture. But they really are sort of modern-day gladiators, and they pay an enormous price. But the, the thing that struck me about this, Kara, or I think what the, uh, o- obviously, in addition to the tragedy of the families of the people who are-

   9. KSKara Swisher2:54

      Mm-hmm.

   10. SGScott Galloway2:54

       ... who were murdered is, you know, we're back to office mostly.

   11. KSKara Swisher3:00

       Mm-hmm.

   12. SGScott Galloway3:00

       Actually, it's interesting. The US has had kind of the most anemic return to office of almost any nation. And young people have gotten very used to... I think as the employment market is so strong here and tech is so strong, the companies have had a difficult time getting everyone to return to the office, especially five days a week.

   13. KSKara Swisher3:17

       Mm-hmm.

   14. SGScott Galloway3:17

       And something I've always noticed about, that I can't stand about going to meetings, is that from the time you get to the lobby, by the time you go through check-in, security, and all that and get up to the of- it's like 10 or 12 minutes, at least-

   15. KSKara Swisher3:30

       Mm-hmm.

   16. SGScott Galloway3:30

       ... 10 or 15 minutes.

   17. KSKara Swisher3:31

       Yeah.

   18. SGScott Galloway3:32

       And this is only gonna make security that much more complex/robust because-

   19. KSKara Swisher3:37

       Mm-hmm.

   20. SGScott Galloway3:37

       ... the last thing you wanna worry about is going to a place that is, you know, i- is less safe than the place you came from.

   21. KSKara Swisher3:45

       And it is also porous in a lot of ways. People are, um... You know, it was interesting because immediately, because there's a mayor's race, there was sort of like an on, kind of like, "Why didn't Mamdani do something about him?" 'Cause he's not mayor, you know. The, his- 'cause he's way ahead actually, among Jewish voters, a bunch of other things, which is interesting. Uh, I thought he handled it rather well. He said, "We're only as strong as our weakest gun laws across the country," and called attention to, you know, the fact that even though New York has very strict gun laws, you can't be protected, because y- this guy was in- from Nevada, and I think his boss got him the thing that made the assault, that he assembled the assault weapon. And I think it's, again, it's a, you know, it's such a complex problem. Like here we have CTE. We've got gut, the ability to create weapons of mass destruction, for people to have assault weapons. Um, what, it'll be interesting, like again, it's another thing where they'll talk about it and then do nothing about assault weapons or the ability to assemble assault weapons, um, in the country. And probably if he does have CTE, blame it on that. Um, but it does, you know, I've always- I always feel unsafe at, um, at, at buildings. I don't know why. I feel like it's- they're such, like, a place where someone who has, has mental illness, which is growing, or people that are angry, like Luigi Mangione can take it, like it's, y- you can see how easy it is in a big city like New York.

   22. SGScott Galloway5:09

       Well-

   23. KSKara Swisher5:09

       I don't know if you've noticed.

   24. SGScott Galloway5:10

       ... this one will get... I mean, there's already been dozens of mass shootings every year. And you, you said something once that struck me. You said that as a species, we're good at adapting, and that's a bad thing here. We have normalized and adapted to something that we should not adapt to. And also, this will get more attention, and I'll be interested. There'll be articles basically saying that when it's nice, white executives in Midtown Manhattan, that mass shooting gets, gets play in the media. When it's just a mass shooting of some, a bunch of nice people at a mall in Kentucky, no one gives a shit because there's so many of them. So this will be, I think you'll, this will get a lot of attention. But again, this is really basic math or science or, you know, X, Y, validate, nullify a thesis. And if your thesis is the following, that guns are the primary, or weapons of war really are the primary culprit-... you, that theory would be validated because we do not have a, we do not have a monopoly on head injuries. We do not have a monopoly on angry young men. We do not have a monopoly on mental illness. What we have a monopoly on is that all of these people have access to (laughs) weapons of war.

   25. KSKara Swisher6:16

       Right. Exactly.

   26. SGScott Galloway6:17

       And it is just-

   27. KSKara Swisher6:18

       And exa- And there's ways around it. There's w- w- one, there's ways around it. That's, that's all, the only way you can think about it.

   28. SGScott Galloway6:24

       And also this bullshit notion that you can't do anything about it, that it's too late, that, uh, Australia had a mass shooting, reasonable people, okay, we should ban assault weapons, and they have had a dramatic decrease-

   29. KSKara Swisher6:34

       Yeah.

   30. SGScott Galloway6:34

       ... in mass shootings. The UK had a deadly mass shooting back in, uh, I think it was in '96 in Dunblane, Scotland. Kids and teachers were killed. Next, you know, right away, no more assault weapons. So this is something, and I've said this before, one, one of the free gifts with purchase of moving to the UK, it's like a lot of things. If you actually look at statistically, I mean, a mass shooting, there's no reason that, it, it, there's no reason not to go out. There's no reason not to go work. There's no reason, in my opinion, not to send your kids to school. If you look at the real hard numbers, your ki- you, you and your kids are still, uh, at least mathematically pretty safe. The problem is the fear. And that is when I'm in the UK, I don't have these horror fantasies about turning on the TV and seeing my kids' school on the screen.
3. 9:35 – 18:32

   Stock Trading Ban

   1. KSKara Swisher9:35

      Um, speaking of something you've talked about a lot, Scott, a Senate committee voted to advance a bill that would ban stock trading by members of Congress, presidents and vice presidents with a convenient carve out for Donald Trump. Lawmakers would be banned from buying stocks once the bill goes into effect and blocked from selling stocks 90 days after that. But divestments wouldn't be required until the beginning of the new term. So Trump is in the clear. The bill originally called the Pelosi Act, for Nancy Pelosi who you like to give a hard time too, was introduced by Senator Josh Hawley, the only Republican who voted for it. Trump initially said he supported the ban conceptually, but later lashed out at Hawley accusing him of being a pawn for the Democrats. Uh, he wanted to put in a Pelosi thing just 'cause he's such a revenge-minded person. Um, the future of the bill is uncertain, uh, but it is moving forward. Uh, Trump has also called for an investigation in Nancy Pelosi's stock trading. But the problem for him is there's tons of Republicans doing the same. For her part, Pelosi put out a statement saying she supports the legislation. Um, you know, of course, he, he's just cutting off his nose to spite his face, but, and has attacked Hawley as a second rate senator, um, who the... and then Hawley tried to suck up to him again. But, um, the fact that they cannot get this through and, and you've talked about the idea of just paying these Co- Congress people more. Um, it's just astonishing. Uh, 80%, it's an 80/20 thing, I think. 80% of people across the country think they should do this, and they're not doing this.

   2. SGScott Galloway10:58

      Yeah. So it's some of the most popular or it has more support of any proposed legislation in a long time. It's, this is largely performative. My understanding is it's not gonna go through. But I mean, uh, one of the real advantages, uh, that the US has is that we have the deepest pools of capital. And that is, there is a giant river of capital that flows in, has arteries reaching into the deepest corners of Thailand, that if a, somebody's working there and has something like a 401 (k) or invests in stocks, 50% of that capital will ultimately end up in the US, flow to the US because of our incredible companies' IP, um, colleges, R&D, risk, you know, risk aggressiveness, but also because we have a rule of fair play. And that if someone thinks, "If I invest in an S&P or a NASDAQ fund..."... even though I'm not in the know. I d- I'm not in Congress, I'm not on a board of directors, I'm not gonna get fucked. Someone else isn't gonna make a ton of money at my expense. There's rule of fair play. And as a result, startups in the United States have five million dollars for every startup. In Europe, it's one million. We have five times the venture capital here per company. And if you... These deep pools of capital, which are just enormous l- an enormous advantage, a lot of that is because there is, quote unquote, "rule of fair play." It's not a... The reason why th- the Russian stock market is, is not worth what NVIDIA loses or gains every day is everyone assumes the game is rigged, so they're not gonna put their money in the stock market. The person at or could score in St. Petersburg is like, "No, i- this is rigged." And to be blunt, Speaker Pelosi and her husband, their net worth is estimated at $420 million. And last year, their net worth increased 54%. And Democrats managed to eke out a 31% return in 2024, and Republicans a 26%, both overperforming the S&P. This is-

   3. KSKara Swisher12:52

      And Trump's crypto. Trump, talk about someone who's really ch- cashed in, is the Trump family.

   4. SGScott Galloway12:57

      Here's the problem, a small amount of corruption leads to big corruption. And to a certain extent, Trump said these, these con- you know, these congresspeople are playing s- s- small ball. They're, they're doing insider trading for hundreds of thousands or millions. I'm gonna do it for billions. But Speaker Emerita Pelosi, in my view... B- but let's talk specifically about the legislation. He was not serious. When you call something the Pelosi Act, you're saying, "Fuck you" to the other side, because a lot of people, understandably, have a great deal of affection for Speaker Emerita Pelosi. When you call something... W- when you're purposely being aggressive-

   5. KSKara Swisher13:30

      I think they changed the name. I think it's the Honest Act now. S-

   6. SGScott Galloway13:32

      Yeah, they did change the name, but it showed he wasn't-

   7. KSKara Swisher13:34

      S- or-

   8. SGScott Galloway13:34

      It showed he wasn't really serious about what would be required to pass this, and that-

   9. KSKara Swisher13:39

      Mm-hmm.

   10. SGScott Galloway13:39

       ... is bipartisan support.

   11. KSKara Swisher13:41

       Right.

   12. SGScott Galloway13:41

       When you come out of the gate swinging like that-

   13. KSKara Swisher13:43

       I agree.

   14. SGScott Galloway13:43

       ... the Democrats are just like, "You know, fuck you, boss. I, you just didn't need to do that." We should... The moment you are elected to office, the moment, even as I think you go through the primaries, you have to put your money in a blind trust. And i- if you're not willing to do that, what you're acknowledging is you have some sort of special access or information that other people don't.

   15. KSKara Swisher14:04

       Yes.

   16. SGScott Galloway14:05

       The not supporting this bill means that you wanna continue to, quote unquote, "engage in insider trading." The fact that you have people in intelligence briefings where they are making decisions on tens of billions of dollars that may or may not be, uh-

   17. KSKara Swisher14:16

       Can't help it.

   18. SGScott Galloway14:16

       ... spent by companies that are publicly traded, and then you can literally leave that briefing and go call someone, and you're not supposed to-

   19. KSKara Swisher14:23

       Yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway14:23

       ... but you can, the fines are b- the, the fines are such that everyone ignores it, and say, "Honey, go buy, um"-

   21. KSKara Swisher14:32

       Whatever.

   22. SGScott Galloway14:32

       "Go buy-"

   23. KSKara Swisher14:33

       Palantir.

   24. SGScott Galloway14:33

       Yeah. Uh, or DisAI. What was the one that, uh, she bought call options on in the morning that it was-

   25. KSKara Swisher14:39

       Marjorie Taylor Greene did it a bunch of times too.

   26. SGScott Galloway14:41

       But Pelosi announced, when Pelosi announced or disclosed she'd bought options, call options in a healthcare AI company, I forget the name of the company-

   27. KSKara Swisher14:48

       (laughs)

   28. SGScott Galloway14:48

       ... um, uh, the stock spiked like 10 or 15%. I mean, it's just-

   29. KSKara Swisher14:52

       Uh-huh.

   30. SGScott Galloway14:53

       Anyways, they should have to put it in a blind trust, and, and also the other side of this, we need to pay these people a lot more so they don't-
4. 18:32 – 32:33

   Joe Rogan Comes For Trump

   1. KSKara Swisher18:32

      Scott, we're back. Joe Rogan is turning into a real thorn in the side for President Trump. Let's listen to what he had to say about Trump's administration's crackdown on immigration and international students. Let's listen to a clip.

   2. GUGuest18:43

      It's an overcorrection. Right. And, and it's also like they have a mandate, I think, of like 3,000 people a day they wanna deport. Just, you know, you're gonna... A bunch of people that are totally innocent are gonna get caught up in that- Right, right. ... and they have been. Right. You know? They have been. Right. A lot of people that have, have green cards, a lot of people that are supposed to be over here, and then they're kicking students out that, like, write articles they don't like. Yeah, that's nuts. Fucking crazy. Yeah.

   3. KSKara Swisher19:07

      And that's not all. Let's listen to a clip of Rogan talking, uh, about Trump's reaction to all things Epstein.

   4. GUGuest19:12

      This one's- Yeah. ... a line in the sand. Yeah. Because this is one where th- there's a lot of stuff about, you know, when we thought Trump was gonna come in and then a lot of things were gonna be resolved. Yeah. We're gonna drain the swamp, we're gonna figure everything out. And when you have this one hardcore line in the sand that everybody had been talking about forever, and then they're trying to gaslight you on that.

   5. KSKara Swisher19:33

      So it's interesting. I'm not sure if Rogan's disapproval carries as much weight as this endorsement did. Uh, I don't know. What do you, what do you think of this? I think it's actually, you know, it's sort of late, you know, Joe. He, he, of course he was gonna do this. Um, k- he seems, seems kind of fatuous to what Trump is, but I don't know. What do you think?

   6. SGScott Galloway19:52

      I don't know. I, I think that, I, I do think it matters. Um...

   7. KSKara Swisher19:56

      Yeah.

   8. SGScott Galloway19:56

      A lot of, when I speak to young men, I, I feel like-

   9. KSKara Swisher20:00

      They love Rogan.

   10. SGScott Galloway20:00

       ... a lot of times they're reading back a script from Joe Rogan. I, I think-

   11. KSKara Swisher20:05

       Yeah.

   12. SGScott Galloway20:05

       I think arguably, Joe Rogan, in terms of young men, has more influence because he's seen as an honest broker. I think the most... I don't want to call it dangerous thing about Joe Rogan, but I think Joe is like... It's not an act. I think Joe is genuinely-

   13. KSKara Swisher20:19

       Mm-hmm. No.

   14. SGScott Galloway20:19

       He's not reading, he's not FOX News reading from a teleprompter saying-

   15. KSKara Swisher20:22

       He's not.

   16. SGScott Galloway20:22

       ... "Smart manic has been weaponized by Hugo Chavez because we told you to say it." I think what he's saying, he believes. And also, the manosphere, if you will, or, m- m- you know, male-dominated or male-centric podcasts, there has been a significant...

   17. KSKara Swisher20:36

       Turn.

   18. SGScott Galloway20:36

       ... tide shift. So...

   19. KSKara Swisher20:38

       Shane Gillis, Andrew Schultz, all of them.

   20. SGScott Galloway20:39

       Andrew Schultz. Uh, all these guys-

   21. KSKara Swisher20:41

       Mm-hmm.

   22. SGScott Galloway20:41

       ... who quite frankly, if you were to point to one person, uh, who potentially put Trump in office, it would be, number one, would be Musk, right?

   23. KSKara Swisher20:52

       Musk.

   24. SGScott Galloway20:52

       Quarter of a billion dollars, great, uh, platform.

   25. KSKara Swisher20:54

       Turned on him.

   26. SGScott Galloway20:55

       Very smart. And then, probably number two is Joe Rogan.

   27. KSKara Swisher21:00

       Yeah.

   28. SGScott Galloway21:00

       And the stat I love is that if you wanna talk about how brilliant the Trump campaign was and how non-brilliant the Harris campaign was, and it kind of reminds me of Modani and Cuomo, Trump went, flew right into the manosphere, which was not only good for positioning, but by going on Rogan that one time, with 40 million YouTube videos or views and 15 million audio downloads, for Harris to get the same level of exposure, she would have needed to go on MSNBC, CNN, and FOX every night for three hours for two weeks. So quite frankly, whatever... Unless it was gonna take her two weeks to get down and back from Austin, she should have done it. So these guys carry a ton of weight, and there has been a real significant shift. And I also-

   29. KSKara Swisher21:43

       It's the combo of all of them. It's not just Rogan. I mean, Schultz has been particularly, uh, vehement about it, and Shane Gillis is now mocking, mocking him, making fun of him.

   30. SGScott Galloway21:52

       Yeah.
5. 32:33 – 41:18

   Tariff Deadline

   1. KSKara Swisher32:33

      Powell has a set, let's just say. At the time of this taping, President Trump says he will not extend the latest August 1st tariff deadline. The President reportedly plans to sign new executive orders after we tape, imposing higher tariffs on several countries that have not reached deals. He's particularly mad at Brazil. Um, the administration has managed to get only eight deals done in 120 days, but with a n- a number of partners. In the last few days, Trump has announced a 25% tariff on India with a penalty for over-reliance on Russian energy and military equipment. South Korea has made an offer to buy down the 25% it faces. He's interested in hearing it. Um, uh, one of the things that, uh, that, it's interesting is whether he's gonna extend that deadline. Uh, fear not, everyone. Treasury Secretary Scott Besson, who seems to be living his best life as Trump's favorite person, told Corporate America it's, quote, "Not the end of the world if these tariffs are on for days or weeks." Meanwhile, the Fed held interest rates steady, as I said, on Wednesday for the fifth meeting in a row, as the Commerce Department reported that the US economy grew at a stronger than expected pace. But there's lots of troubling things in the report actually, and now inflation today just ticked up a little bit. Um, and so Powell seems to be waiting till September to see the impact of the tariffs, which I think is probably a good thing to do. Um, so what do you, what do you think about what's happening? In- in some cases, some of the countries are saying what he said happened didn't happen. Obviously, a lot of these numbers are gonna be paid by American consumers in the, in the end. Um, w- any thoughts on this?

   2. SGScott Galloway33:58

      The only thing you know you're gonna get... first off, none of them, I hate it they call them deals. They're all frameworks that they can put out a press release, and in the press release is some giant number that is unenforceable, specifically the amount of money they're gonna invest in the US.

   3. KSKara Swisher34:11

      Yes. Thank you.

   4. SGScott Galloway34:12

      So I hope that, I hope we just get through this, get on it. Um, you know, I- I saw someone of Bill Maher, a very intelligent woman saying that tariffs, she's like why... Said to Bill, "Why do you want... Why are you against making American workers more productive? They're kind of like wrapping themselves in the flag." And folks, let me just remind you that free trade or tariffs are inversely correlated to economic growth. That telling American consumers that they have to pay more money for a Japanese car such that they get a shitty car for 40,000 instead of a great car for 30,000, that not only makes us consumers less prosperous, you know, paying more for shittier things, but it also makes us less competitive because we don't need to compete. So, uh, and I'm gonna talk about this, um, in, in my, uh, prediction. But Figma, this design, uh, company is going public, and it was supposed to be acquired by Adobe. The fact that it wasn't because EU regulators blocked the deal is gonna make that market much more competitive. And so when all you're doing is making things less competitive in the short run for companies because they have the advantage of taxing foreign companies, you make our companies less competitive, you make our consumers less prosperous. And it has been shown that over the medium and long term, it decreases, uh, productivity, and the, the GDP numbers were really strange. I don't know if you saw those, but the GDP numbers-

   5. KSKara Swisher35:30

      Yes, I did.

   6. SGScott Galloway35:31

      It was... So this was the strangest thing that came, came out of the GDP numbers. You subtract or you add to GDP... or excuse me, you subtract out of GDP imports because that is economic activity or production that took place offshore. Uh, imports were down 30% year on year.

   7. KSKara Swisher35:45

      Mm-hmm.

   8. SGScott Galloway35:45

      Like 34%.

   9. KSKara Swisher35:46

      Yeah.

   10. SGScott Galloway35:46

       I mean, it's not even that c- th- that, that prices are too high or that American consumers don't want them. But foreign companies that build businesses importing products into the US, making our lives more prosperous and our products less expensive and our... you know, better quality of life-... have kind of stopped because they don't know how to plan. They don't even know how to price stuff, they don't know what it means, they don't know, you know, they don't know what the demand's going to be because they don't know what these tariffs are. So I'm at the part of the program now where I just hope, for the purposes of just getting back to work, that they get a, quote unquote, a bunch of these frameworks done and- The, all these nations are learning. Yeah, agree to, agree to the tariff-

   11. KSKara Swisher36:23

       Nothing.

   12. SGScott Galloway36:23

       ... and then announce, uh, uh, a trillion dollars in investment in the United States over-

   13. KSKara Swisher36:29

       Which will never happen.

   14. SGScott Galloway36:29

       ... the next 10 years, which will, is not enforceable-

   15. KSKara Swisher36:30

       That's what happened with all the tech companies, remember? They were like-

   16. SGScott Galloway36:33

       Oh, yeah.

   17. KSKara Swisher36:33

       ... "We're gonna invest." And then they never did.

   18. SGScott Galloway36:35

       Yeah.

   19. KSKara Swisher36:35

       That's the thing. And so Trump can tout a deal. One of the things, Richard Quest, who I like, on CNN, was so frustrated by Trump's plan-

   20. SGScott Galloway36:42

       Oh, really? That guy?

   21. KSKara Swisher36:42

       (laughs) I love him. Yeah, that guy. He's great. But he, the point he was making is the 15% is getting eaten by these companies. They're just gonna take the cost and you'll see-

   22. SGScott Galloway36:52

       Mm.

   23. KSKara Swisher36:52

       ... numbers like Ford or GM. They had, first time since 2023 Ford is losing money, which it wasn't. It was doing well. Um, they'll start, they'll eat the cost because it's low enough, but eventually they won't. Second thing is, consumers will pay for this in the end. Like not the money that's going to-

   24. SGScott Galloway37:08

       Oh, 100%.

   25. KSKara Swisher37:08

       ... the Treasury. And, uh, and it just, it just, it literally these, and he's like these are, he said the same thing you did. These are frameworks. They are not the thing.

   26. SGScott Galloway37:17

       They're not deals.

   27. KSKara Swisher37:17

       And so you'll never, how are you gonna know if they're gonna invest? Like just saying they're gonna invest, they will not do it. And so it's all nonsense and, and kind of unnecessary, um, shaking of the economy for, for no reason. Now, that's not to say that being tough on people or sort of playing a game of chicken with some of these countries where it's not a synchronous trade is not a bad idea, right? Like we always say that. Um, but one of the things that's i- important to understand is that they're n- it's not in place. It's just not... Like a lot of things with Trump, it's a lot of vaporware, and that's a, that is the real problem. And so when Jerome Powell comes in and says, "We're just gonna wait about cutting interest rates."

   28. SGScott Galloway37:57

       Yeah. We wanna see what happens.

   29. KSKara Swisher37:58

       We'll see what happens. That's the adult thing to do. And of course, Trump attacks him because it doesn't work without an acquiescent Fed, right? To, to try to feed this thing. Um, and, and he's not gonna be acquiescent. And interestingly, with the Fed meeting, two of the Trump appointed-

   30. SGScott Galloway38:16

       Yeah.
6. 41:18 – 46:07

   Microsoft and Meta Earnings

   1. KSKara Swisher41:18

      break. When we come back, we'll talk about Microsoft and Meta's earnings, which were blockbuster. Scott, we're back with earnings news. Microsoft just reported a blockbuster quarter with total revenue surging 18% year over year to $76 billion. But as Microsoft doubles down on AI, the capital spending is climbing up 27%. Meta also had a huge Q2 with $47 billion in revenue, up 22%, and 18 billion in profit, up 36%. Meta's AI hiring spree also acknowledged in the earnings with compensation for technical talent in priority areas cited as the second-largest driver of cost growth. These big deals, they're paying all these AI researchers. Um-... ye- y- what... How do you look at this? Are these AI bets paying off or it's, it's advertising for Meta that it's their old business that's doing well, probably helped by AI, but not in the way, mm, M- Zuckerberg is spending. Um, any thoughts on, on this? They're really, they're really doubling down on AI, obviously, whether it's, it's research costs or, uh, talent costs, or just simple investment and compute. Um, any thoughts on these two earnings?

   2. SGScott Galloway42:21

      So you forwarded me an article from The Wall Street Journal that was really fascinated, and it said basically, this is the weirdest GDP report we've seen in a while, 'cause when imports go down 30%, it sort of artificially juices GDP. And, um, if you're thinking about... I mean, these numbers... Well, one, okay, so the numbers of traditional business is just staggering. It's just, uh, they continue to perform, they're using AI for better targeting, and I think every media planner in the world is just throwing up their arms and saying, "Just spend more money on Meta-"

   3. KSKara Swisher42:54

      Yeah. Right.

   4. SGScott Galloway42:55

      ... um, or, or on Alphabet. They also have the benefit of the market has decided that it loves CapEx in AI. The market has decided that AI is going to be enormous, and whoever wins the war, it's going to be a function of brute force and that is as represented by CapEx. So Oracle, when Oracle went public, Larry Eli- Ellison, I think, owned about f- 24%. He now owns closer to 41%. Well, how is that possible? They would use their cash flow to buy back shares, thereby decreasing the amount of shares and increasing the relative ownership of people who own shares. Except about two years ago, he decided, nope, it's now a capital war on AI. We need to be a distant number two of infrastructure to NVIDIA. We're going to massively spend in CapEx. Arguably, that was one of the better business decisions of the last 10 years. And Larry Ellison, you want to talk about elephants can dance, is now the second wealthiest person in the world. And the most crazy stat from that article, and I still can't believe it's true, but it stated in that article that there was more spending last quarter on AI investments than there was consumer spending.

   5. KSKara Swisher44:04

      Yeah.

   6. SGScott Galloway44:05

      So think about this-

   7. KSKara Swisher44:06

      It is.

   8. SGScott Galloway44:06

      ... 355 million people in the US-

   9. KSKara Swisher44:09

      Mm-hmm.

   10. SGScott Galloway44:09

       ... everything they're spending money on, their, their Netflix, their Starbucks, going to see F1, all the, all consumer spending was less-

   11. KSKara Swisher44:18

       Yep.

   12. SGScott Galloway44:18

       ... than the investments in AI. I mean, my God, that is-

   13. KSKara Swisher44:23

       I know. The numbers are that-

   14. SGScott Galloway44:25

       ... that is just-

   15. KSKara Swisher44:26

       ... massive.

   16. SGScott Galloway44:26

       ... that is just staggering. But, uh, g- Meta up 12% in pre-market, earnings beat of a massive earnings beat, 714 versus 589, revenue of 47.5 billion, eh, expected 44.8, a 22% year on year. And one of the things that was so impressive is they grew their customer, they, they, uh, grew their customer base or their users by 6%, which may not sound like a lot, but when your-

   17. KSKara Swisher44:51

       No.

   18. SGScott Galloway44:51

       ... base is 3.5 billion, that's two hund-

   19. KSKara Swisher44:53

       There's no other game in town. There's no other game in town.

   20. SGScott Galloway44:55

       They added, they added the population of Brazil to their user base, uh, year on year. So it-

   21. KSKara Swisher45:02

       And more products.

   22. SGScott Galloway45:02

       ... and in addition, the market loves this CapEx. They, their CapEx's spending was $17 billion, by the way.

   23. KSKara Swisher45:09

       Right.

   24. SGScott Galloway45:10

       That's double what it was last year. It is an-

   25. KSKara Swisher45:12

       Yep.

   26. SGScott Galloway45:13

       And the market just loves it. They, they-

   27. KSKara Swisher45:15

       Well, someone has to pay for all those, those young men that they're hiring. (laughs)

   28. SGScott Galloway45:19

       (laughs)

   29. KSKara Swisher45:19

       I mean, billion dollar deals. Uh, they, uh, you know, whatever you say about Marco Zuckerberg, he goes for it, right?

   30. SGScott Galloway45:25

       Oh, no doubt.
7. 46:07 – 54:30

   Zuck’s AI Manifesto

   1. KSKara Swisher46:07

      all the other companies at the expense of these people. Now interestingly, Zuckerberg, uh, he had to put out one of his essays. These people love to put out essays and letters and vision manifestos. Um, he loves to do this. And, and they're always long and badly edited. But, um, he said AI superintelligence is now in sight. He put out this letter and video, uh, uh, outlining his vision for it. It was described by one outlet as a mini manifesto. Uh, let's listen to Mark Zuckerberg if we have to.

   2. MZMark Zuckerberg46:33

      A lot has been written about the scientific and economic advances that AI can bring, and I'm really optimistic about this. What I think an even more meaningful impact in our lives is going to come from everyone having a personal superintelligence that helps you achieve your goals, create what you want to see in the world, be a better friend, and grow to become the person that you aspire to be. This vision is different from others in the industry who want a direct AI at automating all of the valuable work.

   3. KSKara Swisher47:00

      Blather. This is his tip, this-

   4. SGScott Galloway47:01

      Grow to the person you-

   5. KSKara Swisher47:03

      Uh.

   6. SGScott Galloway47:03

      ... aspire to be.

   7. KSKara Swisher47:04

      Ugh. It's so... He did this before-

   8. SGScott Galloway47:06

      (laughs)

   9. KSKara Swisher47:06

      ... on his-

   10. SGScott Galloway47:06

       That's the guy that's gonna-

   11. KSKara Swisher47:07

       ... social media will bring up-

   12. SGScott Galloway47:08

       ... "I'm gonna be the person I-

   13. KSKara Swisher47:09

       (laughs)

   14. SGScott Galloway47:09

       ... aspire to be-"

   15. KSKara Swisher47:11

       Honestly, let me just say-

   16. SGScott Galloway47:11

       "... because of Mark Zuckerberg." (laughs)

   17. KSKara Swisher47:12

       Ugh. One time, he called me when he wrote-

   18. SGScott Galloway47:14

       Oh, God.

   19. KSKara Swisher47:14

       ... one of these ridiculous manifestos. He called me and asked me what I, when he was speaking to me, what I thought of it. And I said, "One, you need an editor. Two, I, I don't understand this, this whole thing about community." He just was like, "Social media will bring us together." Like, such fucki- And it, of course, it didn't. And I, I was, at the time, I was like, "This is such bullshit." Just s- just say you just want to make money on automating all our valuable work, I'm fine with that, right? But th- this is, these people just aspire to be these visionaries, and they are the smallest intellects, they have the smallest intellects and the least amount... They just love to put these things out. You know, Jamie, you don't hear this from Jamie Dimon much, right? And who is... Uh, by the way, he's been meeting with President Trump, which is a good thing. Like, you don't hear this nonsense from our smarter people in, on our society because they don't feel the need to do th- Remember when Gates put these essays, The Road Ahead? It was so nonsensical, like, to do this. Now, o- one thing Zuckerberg did say, which I agreed with, but I didn't think he had to put on such, such thing, is he said smart glasses will be the primary way people interact with AI. Of course he said that 'cause he has a smart glass business. Um, and without them, people will be at a cognitive disadvantage. Do you think you're gonna be at a cognitive disadvantage without, you know, AI glasses? What do you think?

   20. SGScott Galloway48:31

       Well, (sighs) I mean, uh, the, the idea...So these LLMs, I've always said that the LLM is just a function of who we are, but unfortunately, who we are in a certain medium, and I wish the LLMs could crawl the real world, 'cause I think, generally speaking, in the real world, that people are lovely. But the fact is, they're crawling our complexion, our personality online, and it gets really ugly, really fast. And if this AI... I've always said that companies were the closest thing I had to kids before I had kids, and that is, you conceive of them. They look, smell, and feel like you. They're sort of a corporate embodiment of the personality. And if, if LLaMa, the LLM from, from Zuck ends up being anything a- anything like him, it'll be emotionally stunted, brilliantly efficient, and constantly urging you to reconnect with your ex. I mean, it's just gonna be such a weird...

   21. KSKara Swisher49:26

       (laughs)

   22. SGScott Galloway49:26

       Eh, i-i-if this thing ends up like... He... W-w-when you heard that, didn't it sound AI generated? It's like the-

   23. KSKara Swisher49:34

       No, it just...

   24. SGScott Galloway49:34

       ... non-human human.

   25. KSKara Swisher49:35

       No, 'cause he's done it before. It's like so anodyne. It is so... I, like, literally had this bad memory for... I was at my ex's house, like, sleeping on a couch, and he called me, and he was talking about-

   26. SGScott Galloway49:46

       You got kicked out on the couch? Talk to me about that.

   27. KSKara Swisher49:48

       No, 'cause we were broken up, but I was staying-

   28. SGScott Galloway49:49

       Lesbians do that too? (laughs)

   29. KSKara Swisher49:51

       No. We were... No. So, it was just so fucking ridiculous. It was like, I remember going, "Oh my God. How can I get off this fucking phone call with this idiot who just thinks, who just thinks he's a visionary?" Like, literally no... There's so many visionaries. Like John Malone's recently written a book. He's a visionary. Like, he doesn't talk that much, and what he says is choice. These guys can't stop fucking talking and giving you their predictions of the future.

   30. SGScott Galloway50:16

       I don't know. The f-... Look, it's-
8. 54:30 – 59:25

   Novo Nordisk’s Slump

   1. SGScott Galloway54:30

      scale.

   2. KSKara Swisher54:30

      It's working for them. It's a, it's a machine. Anyway, speaking of things that aren't a machine, let me, let's finish up. Novo Nordisk shares are plummeting after the company slashed its full-year guidance, citing weaker-than-expected US growth for Ozempic and Wegovy. The stock dropped 30% at one point on Tuesday, wiping out nearly $93 billion in market value. Novo Nordisk is blaming the downturn on increased competition from Eli Lilly's Mounjaro and Zepbound, as well as, I think more significantly, cheaper GLP-1 knockoffs, and which are not going away. They thought they were going away when the, when the, um, when things got settled in terms of manufacturing. The company also named a new CEO, replacing previous CEO who was ousted by the board in May as the stock was sliding. This is incredible. W- a p- a product that is going to be so big, and the company at the top of it is just losing it. Th- this, to me, is just one of these amazing stories, um, because of all kinds of, you know, pressures from... Of course competition was gonna get here. It's only gonna get bigger in the GLP-1 market. But, uh, very quick thoughts on this, 'cause it's the opposite here, right? Uh, an amazing opportunity that's been blown, I guess.

   3. SGScott Galloway55:35

      Well, speaking of tariffs, the number one, um, import into United States from Europe is pharmaceuticals. And I said two years ago, and I was mocked for this, that I thought the more important technology in terms of on-the-ground change to society was not AI, it was GLP-1.

   4. KSKara Swisher55:49

      You did.

   5. SGScott Galloway55:49

      And what's happened here is that because of a shortage and kind of a loophole, some companies have been able to offer compounded GLP-1, which is basically like-

   6. KSKara Swisher55:57

      Mm-hmm.

   7. SGScott Galloway55:57

      ... saying generics. And HIM's stock went crazy because they were able to basically sell GLP-1 drugs for a fraction of the price. And then, as you mentioned, Eli Lilly's, uh, GLP-1 offering, Zepbound, um, uh, is now more popular than Wegovy. I absolutely love this. I still think the category is gonna grow like crazy. Only 8% of Americans have taken a GLP-1, but about-

   8. KSKara Swisher56:20

      Agreed.

   9. SGScott Galloway56:20

      ... but about, um, a third of them are interested. I think if you want it, I think the most accretive thing you could do for our economy right now would be to offer, um, access to GLP-1 drugs to everybody. I think if you look at the obesity industrial complex that wants people to buy a sugar bomb, eat shitty food, take advantage of the lowest, like, calories to cost that, uh, uh, people have to turn to in food deserts, and then hand these people over to the companies producing statins, hip replacements, knee replacements, knee-, uh, kidney dialysis, they would... Effectively, we're monetizing people's health, and so much of it is obesity-related.

   10. KSKara Swisher56:56

       It is.

   11. SGScott Galloway56:56

       Especially the obesity-related-

   12. KSKara Swisher56:58

       Heart disease.

   13. SGScott Galloway56:58

       ... uh, healthcare costs-

   14. KSKara Swisher56:59

       Strokes.

   15. SGScott Galloway56:59

       ... are one to one and a half trillion a year.

   16. KSKara Swisher57:01

       Yeah. Yeah.

   17. SGScott Galloway57:02

       So similar to what the equivalent of the FDA did in the UK, I think it's the UK Health Ministry, they said, "If you are smoking, we'll send you for free an electronic nicotine delivery service, because while that is not good for you, it's much less bad for you than tobacco."

   18. KSKara Swisher57:15

       Mm-hmm.

   19. SGScott Galloway57:16

       I think, uh, over the medium and long term, if you really wanted to have an impact on healthcare costs, you would make GLP-1 drugs accessible to absolutely everybody.

   20. KSKara Swisher57:24

       Correct. So what did this company, which is the front, forefront of it, do wrong?

   21. SGScott Galloway57:28

       Well, the, the honest answer is I don't know. I don't know if it's distribution or branding, but, uh, I would argue right now, it's a great value because this is-

   22. KSKara Swisher57:36

       Mm-hmm.

   23. SGScott Galloway57:36

       ... if not the market leader, one of the market leaders in what is a, a, an unbelievable, uh, business and category. And it's trading at a PE because it's been hammered because it's not performing well.

   24. KSKara Swisher57:50

       Well, interesting, they did a deal with Him and Hers, right? And then they continued to sell the knockoffs, so then they got in a fight with Him and Hers, right? So Him and Hers were selling the knockoff. Then Novo Nordisk did a deal with them, and then it fell apart because they were al- they, the continued selling of the compounds, which need to be regulated by the way, um, i- i- is really something, that loophole really has... You know, these guys should have been riding off into the sunset because they kind of... but they don't because of these GLP-1 knockoffs.

   25. SGScott Galloway58:17

       The market has a tendency to over-punish and over-reward, and the momentum right now is against these guys. So where their five-year average PE has been 33, it's been as high as 50, today it's gonna open at 14.6. And when you think about the average S&P company trades at a PE of 26, to get the market leader, even though it is underperforming expectations in GLP-1 at 14.6 times earnings, I actually think the stock is a buy right now. But there's no doubt about it, this is a national champion for Europe that is, quote unquote, "faltering" or not living up to the expectations. But I actually think the stock has been over-punished, and I have... Uh, of all the technologies of the last 10 years, the one I'm most-

   26. KSKara Swisher58:56

       Absolutely.

   27. SGScott Galloway58:57

       ... excited about is GLP-1.

   28. KSKara Swisher58:58

       Absolutely.

   29. SGScott Galloway58:59

       I think it's a game changer.

   30. KSKara Swisher58:59

       In fact, in doing this secret documentary, one of the things that every doctor said is... I asked them what they think the most important developments, technology and pharmaceutical, and they're always like, "MRNA vaccines," um, CRISPR-
9. 59:25 – 1:10:31

   Predictions

   1. KSKara Swisher59:25

      more quick break. We'll get, uh, we'll be back for predictions. Okay, Scott? Uh, let's hear a prediction. I have a very quick one very quickly. Kamala Harris announced this week she's not running for governor of California. She also revealed she's written a book about her campaign called 107 Days. I'm not so sure she's gonna run for president. I didn't think... As I told you, I didn't think she was gonna run for governor. I, I don't think she's gonna run for president. I think she knows that she can't win and she has enough responsibility to understand that. And, um, and so I predict she will also not run for president.

   2. SGScott Galloway59:57

      Well, I'm good at running other people's lives.

   3. KSKara Swisher59:59

      Yeah.

   4. SGScott Galloway59:59

      If I was the vice president, I would go be the chairman of a hedge fund, make a shit ton of money, and just wait for the next Democratic administration and be a Supreme Court justice.

   5. KSKara Swisher1:00:07

      Yeah. That's what-

   6. SGScott Galloway1:00:08

      I don't think-

   7. KSKara Swisher1:00:08

      That's what I want to see. Yeah.

   8. SGScott Galloway1:00:09

      I don't think she needs the risk of potentially lose... I'm not sure she'd win governor, uh, and-

   9. KSKara Swisher1:00:13

      Mm-hmm.

   10. SGScott Galloway1:00:13

       She just doesn't need that, and does she really-

   11. KSKara Swisher1:00:15

       She has to win by a lot if she wins, right? So if she even, if she wins and doesn't win by enough, she'll be, she'll be tart.

   12. SGScott Galloway1:00:22

       And Cal- a lot of people describe California as ungovernable. That- that it's just, uh, that special interest groups are so entrent. Uh, people say this is a v- even, even Republican governors will say, "I would not want that job." Right? That it's a very difficult, uh, I think it, I think it's the right move, and also-

   13. KSKara Swisher1:00:38

       I don't think she wanted to do it. I don't, I think she'd, uh, as a, as an executive, she didn't want, uh, she don't, she didn't have the fire. When I talked to her, you could tell. Like, "Mm-mm." But th- it was like she's supposed to versus she wants to. So, um...

   14. SGScott Galloway1:00:50

       She's probably sick of running.

   15. KSKara Swisher1:00:51

       ... I don't think she wants to run for president.

   16. SGScott Galloway1:00:52

       I, I, I hope... Yeah, I don't, I don't think she should. And, and, uh, you know, I thought she did a, uh, you know, s-

   17. KSKara Swisher1:00:58

       Good try. She did. She had a good try.

   18. SGScott Galloway1:00:59

       Given the hand she was dealt, I think one of the greatest performances in history by any athlete or person.

   19. KSKara Swisher1:01:05

       Mm-hmm.

   20. SGScott Galloway1:01:05

       When I saw her walking into that debate with the president-

   21. KSKara Swisher1:01:08

       Mm-hmm.

   22. SGScott Galloway1:01:08

       ... and the amount of pressure on her shoulders, and the way she handled herself, I thought-

   23. KSKara Swisher1:01:14

       Good job. Great job.

   24. SGScott Galloway1:01:14

       ... y- yeah. She (laughs) deserves a lot of credit for trying to run a US-style, uh, race hamstrung by what was, uh, you know, British election.

   25. KSKara Swisher1:01:25

       Old man Biden. Yeah.

   26. SGScott Galloway1:01:26

       Yeah. British election cycle time... I mean, she had what? 111 days or something to try to pull this off.

   27. KSKara Swisher1:01:30

       And she had to, she had Biden hanging around there.

   28. SGScott Galloway1:01:32

       I hope she's happy. I don't, I don't know.

   29. KSKara Swisher1:01:33

       Yeah, I hope so too. I think she's a, she's been a great public servant. And I don't, I just don't think she's gonna run for president.

   30. SGScott Galloway1:01:37

       But she, she'll be a sup- sh- she's literally the first Supreme Court justice appointee of a Democratic presidency.

Episode duration: 1:13:24