Kara Swisher Explains Plan to Buy The Washington Post | Pivot

Kara Swisher 0:00 ... the cartoonist of the Washington Post has quit after a cartoon depicting, uh, billionaires, including Jeff Bezos, kneeling before President-elect Donald Trump, was blocked from publication. Ann, uh, Telnaes, I think that's how you pronounce it, uh, published a sketch of the cartoon, uh, on Subsca- Substack, saying it was the first time a work had been rejected because of who it depicted. Uh, she's a Pulitzer Prize winner, by the way. Amazing cartoonist. The Washington Post editorial page editor, David Shipley, said the cartoon was rejected because of its similarity to columns at the paper rather than the subject, although he

Kara Swisher 0:30 managed to publish many similar columns over and over again. This is, it's nonsense what David Shipley said, and now I can say it very explicitly 'cause Amanda quit the Washington Post. Uh, he is really, uh, uh, this, this was nonsense what he was, his excuse. Um, in other related news, uh, Amazon's announced that it will release a behind-the-scenes documentary on Melania Trump by Brett Ratner, who was sucked up into the Me Too stuff rather egregiously. He seems to be a really, um, problematic person. Uh, and, uh,

Kara Swisher 1:00 uh, and there's, uh, the New York Times did some really astonishing coverage on his behavior. Uh, so that was nice. Um, uh, what do you think, Scott? You wanna buy the Washington Post with me?

Scott Galloway 1:09 This is such peacocking.

Kara Swisher 1:11 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 1:11 First off-

Kara Swisher 1:11 I didn't invite you.

Scott Galloway 1:12 ... if I'm gonna spend a lot of money to be put in pain, uh, he or she better be wearing-

Kara Swisher 1:16 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 1:16 ... leather and be hot. I just-

Kara Swisher 1:19 (laughs)

Scott Galloway 1:19 (laughs) What, what are you do- uh, I, uh, anyways. No, I'm not crazy. I, I, that is literally-

Kara Swisher 1:27 Okay. All right. Good.

Scott Galloway 1:27 ... I would, I think I told you when I had an experience-

Kara Swisher 1:30 I'm waiting to hear your feedback.

Scott Galloway 1:31 Well, no. I have-

Kara Swisher 1:31 But go ahead.

Scott Galloway 1:32 I braised s- back in the heyday of hedge funds, I convinced a hedge fund manager to give me $600 million to become the largest, uh, shareholder in the New York Times, and I learned a decent amount about newsrooms and, and the collision between shareholder governance and journalism and newsrooms, and I quickly learned, or I got a very expensive lesson, these are important institutions. I even wonder at some point-

Kara Swisher 1:57 Right.

Scott Galloway 1:57 ... if they should have some sort of tax benefit 'cause I think they do a really important, they do really important work.

Kara Swisher 2:02 I agree.

Scott Galloway 2:02 But at the end of the day, these are institutions that should be owned by trusts and they should have a trust, uh, that basically hires the right guy or gal to run the thing and they just stay the fuck out of it.

Kara Swisher 2:11 Maybe I have that idea. Maybe I'm not doing it your way. God damn.

Scott Galloway 2:15 Well, I know, but what I would argue ... So just, just to bring in the viewers, uh, just to ring the listeners up, there's been a lot of rumors that you're assembling a group to make a bid for-

Kara Swisher 2:23 Yes.

Scott Galloway 2:23 ... the Washington Post.

Kara Swisher 2:24 Yes.

Scott Galloway 2:24 And what I haven't heard is that Jeff Bezos is willing to sell it.

Kara Swisher 2:28 Correct.

Scott Galloway 2:28 (laughs) And so all of this, in my view, and I, uh, you know, and, is, uh, uh, I don't know, sort of a- all chip no salsa.

Kara Swisher 2:37 Doesn't matter.

Scott Galloway 2:38 Yeah. So we can, we, or when I say we I mean you, complain about the Post and the ownership and, but if you, and I told you this on the phone the other night, if you were serious about doing this, you would've had offline conversations with Bezos and said, "Can I put together a group that includes you and gives you some shark repellent and innoculates you from this un- this, this bullshit and grief which you are probably not enjoying right now, and gives you plausible deniability where you can say, 'Oh, it's up to the ...' " It's kinda like what you, I think, if you were serious, get, you have to get Jeff on board, and-

Kara Swisher 3:10 Yes, correct.

Scott Galloway 3:11 ... and then two-

Kara Swisher 3:12 This is what I'm attempting to do.

Scott Galloway 3:13 ... try and get, um-

Kara Swisher 3:14 Because again, you're not asking if I'm attempting to do this.

Scott Galloway 3:16 Well, uh, right. And the, but the way you would do this, Kara, is quietly. (laughs)

Kara Swisher 3:21 Mm-mm. I think you're wrong.

Scott Galloway 3:22 You're not gonna-

Kara Swisher 3:23 That's where you and I-

Scott Galloway 3:23 ... shame this guy into selling the Post.

Kara Swisher 3:24 I'm not shaming him. I actually have praised his ownership until recently. I have been very much praising his ownership until recently. I think it's much more complex. I don't think that's what I'm doing. I think there's ways to do things and calling attention to it and b- bringing it to the conversation.

Scott Galloway 3:40 Right.

Kara Swisher 3:40 There's a lot more people than me looking at this, by the way, FYI.

Scott Galloway 3:43 Is that right?

Kara Swisher 3:43 And I think the on- yes. And the only way, and I'm meeting with everybody. This is what I, this is how I'm approaching it. I'm a reporter. I was an excellent reporter.

Scott Galloway 3:50 All right.

Kara Swisher 3:50 I certainly was a much better-

Scott Galloway 3:51 I think you still are an excellent reporter.

Kara Swisher 3:53 ... reporter than, I am. I'm more, much more so than the guy who's the CEO of the company, by the way. By, by a far.

Scott Galloway 3:58 Okay.

Kara Swisher 3:58 And I, I approach-

Scott Galloway 3:59 You are not gonna get this thing shit-posting the current CEO.

Kara Swisher 4:03 Yes, I don't care about the CEO. I, I, I think he ... Fine. Whatever. It doesn't matter.

Scott Galloway 4:05 Okay.

Kara Swisher 4:05 It's not shit-posting. I'm telling-

Scott Galloway 4:07 (laughs)

Kara Swisher 4:07 ... I'm saying what I think. And it's not shit-post-

Scott Galloway 4:09 That was the definition of shit-posting.

Kara Swisher 4:11 Shit-posting is, no it wasn't. Well, I am a better reporter. I'm sorry. It's a factual thing.

Scott Galloway 4:14 Okay.

Kara Swisher 4:15 Um, so, um, I, I think the way to do it is start the conversation and get it going rather than these-

Scott Galloway 4:21 Right.

Kara Swisher 4:22 ... I am so sick of these quiet little deals that largely white men make with others.

Scott Galloway 4:26 That get done? You mean deals that get done?

Kara Swisher 4:29 No. They don't, they get done 'cause it's, uh, so I'm doing it a different way. I'm doing it a different way. I don't think that you have to do, like, you know how you talk about try to do things differently-

Scott Galloway 4:37 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 4:37 ... try to think of new ways to do things?

Scott Galloway 4:39 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 4:39 That's what I'm doing.

Scott Galloway 4:40 Okay.

Kara Swisher 4:40 I'm talking to everybody.

Scott Galloway 4:43 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 4:43 Like, everybody. And you'd be surprised who I'm talking to. By the way, someone who was doubtful, I had a long, long conversation with a billionaire who was doubtful. Had a long, long conversation last night. Suddenly, he's very engaged in the idea-

Scott Galloway 4:55 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 4:55 ... because he'd started to listen to s- the various i- ideas.

Scott Galloway 4:58 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 4:58 I think it's okay-

Scott Galloway 4:58 What else did Mark Cuban say?

Kara Swisher 5:00 No, no. Uh, that's not what I'm talking about. So, um, but he would be, he would be great. Someone like that. I welcome-

Scott Galloway 5:06 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 5:07 ... his, his input 'cause I think he's really smart. I welcome the feedback of negativity that you are displaying.

Scott Galloway 5:12 (laughs)

Kara Swisher 5:12 That's fine. That's great. (laughs) Um, I think it's good to talk to everyone and understand what the various possibilities would be. And one of the things that I think doing this thing, and then we'll, we'll end this, is, uh, why not just talk about it explicitly? If I ran this thing, everything would be transparent. I would broadca- you know how at, how, you know, you have all these media reporters, like feeders talking about what happened at a meeting? I'd broadcast the fucking meeting. What's the, what's the secret here? It's losing money. Here's how much money we're losing. Here's why. Here's what we invested in. Like, dude, I think one of the reasons Pivot's successful is 'cause we're very transparent about what we're up to most of the time. We really are. And we say when we make mistakes. I would make it public. I'd make it a narrative. I would come up with lot, lots of ideas. And I agree with you, it's not a money-making situation.

Scott Galloway 5:58 You do an HBO series, like Drive to Survive, or-

Kara Swisher 6:00 An HBO series. (laughs)

Scott Galloway 6:00 ... Behind the Music, or-

Kara Swisher 6:02 (laughs)

Scott Galloway 6:02 ... those things where they go, they, they depict a season of a team-

Kara Swisher 6:05 You're out.

Scott Galloway 6:06 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 6:06 Survivor. Yeah, you just make, it's a great story. And, and at the heart of it, it's ... It is. It is. No, I think it is. I think ... You know. Yeah.

Scott Galloway 6:10 See, I think you think those people and that institution is more interesting than it is. I think you find it fascinating-

Kara Swisher 6:14 It is. It is. No, I think it is. I think ... and a small group of Beltway people in Kalorama find it interesting. And most of them- No. Yeah.

Scott Galloway 6:19 ... find that the reporters in the newsroom are amazing at reporting and they brighten up a room by leaving it. I just don't think-

Kara Swisher 6:24 No. (laughs)

Scott Galloway 6:24 ... it's that dramatic a story.

Kara Swisher 6:26 I, I think it's a great story. I think it's a g-... it's got a, it's a, it has its whole... The Washington Post has a particular hold on this country in a way that's really wonderful in many ways. By the way, you don't think Ben Bradlee was interesting? That was so fantastic. He was such a fantastic chara-... Katharine Graham. I have all kinds of re- th- ideas to make it interesting and it is actually inherently interesting. And the idea that there's one newspaper though, The New York T-... and also you could do all kinds of things with papers around the c-... Just, uh, like what's the fresh idea here is all I'm going for, is let... I'm open to the fresh idea of how you could save this institution in a way that is really interesting and it doesn't, you don't have to have a foregone conclusion of every single thing. I agree, it's easier to start it from scratch, it's easier to do it by yourself, it's easier to do it very lightweight, you run all over the country without a lot of things, but this is a percu- particular and peculiar institution I think is important. And I obviously have an emotional connection to it 'cause I started there in the newsroom. I have an em-... But there really is something about there cannot just be The New York Times and... By the way, something's gonna happen with The Wall Street Journal when Rupert goes, who knows what goes on with that institution, right?

Scott Galloway 7:36 Mm-hmm.

Kara Swisher 7:36 Um, and then over in the West Coast, you got Looney Tunes, uh, the guy who's running, uh-

Scott Galloway 7:40 New York Times. Yeah.

Kara Swisher 7:41 That guy, who seems to have, uh, he started off a liberal, now he's a Trumper. It's like, and he's got, like, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Scott Galloway 7:47 Yeah, but you're, you're defining media-

Kara Swisher 7:49 (laughs)

Scott Galloway 7:49 ... by the fact that it's printed on dead trees. You're defining media-

Kara Swisher 7:52 I don't, I... Listen-

Scott Galloway 7:53 There's a lot of competition.

Kara Swisher 7:54 ... I don't-

Scott Galloway 7:54 There's a lot of other players in ...

Kara Swisher 7:55 I agree.

Scott Galloway 7:55 ... New York.

Kara Swisher 7:56 I, I told Don Graham when I left, "Why are you even printing it?" This was back in the '90s. I was like, "I don't even understand why you print it." I don't, I don't actually. I still don't. So, I'm just saying I think this is interesting. I find it to be... Like, it's a, it, it's an interesting puzzle to Kara Swisher. And I, I, and I have a million other things I'm doing that are much more lucrative-

Scott Galloway 8:16 Just-

Kara Swisher 8:16 ... that are much more promising.

Scott Galloway 8:17 ... enjoy-

Kara Swisher 8:18 I-

Scott Galloway 8:18 ... just be, uh, uh-

Kara Swisher 8:19 (laughs) I love this.

Scott Galloway 8:19 You're so good. You're leaning... Just be a billionaire, just be a wealthy lesbian. Buy like a, buy like a roller derby team-

Kara Swisher 8:25 (laughs)

Scott Galloway 8:25 ... or something. Just do something-

Kara Swisher 8:28 (laughs) I wanna do breath work.

Scott Galloway 8:28 (laughs)

Kara Swisher 8:28 I want... This is my breath work.

Scott Galloway 8:30 Be like-

Kara Swisher 8:31 This is my breath work.

Scott Galloway 8:31 ... Bezos gets it, you don't. He's on a fucking yacht with a, with a woman in a, in a G-string in St. Barts and you're talking about all this pain, self-inflicted pain. You're about to go into a dentist office and say, "Hold off on the novocaine." Have you been... I mean, you've been in newsrooms, I'll give you that.

Kara Swisher 8:47 (laughs) Arlo, I've been in all of them.

Scott Galloway 8:49 Ugh, I can't believe-

Kara Swisher 8:50 I've been in all of them.

Scott Galloway 8:50 ... you would subject yourself to that bullshit. Anyway-

Kara Swisher 8:52 I think there's a new way. I think there's a new... Let me just tell you, this is my breath work and I'm gonna fucking do it.

Scott Galloway 8:57 Okay.

Kara Swisher 8:57 You, you literally hired someone to teach you to breathe today and you're giving me-

Scott Galloway 9:00 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 9:00 ... a hard time about something that is actually slightly noble even, and that's not why I'm doing it. I think it's fun. I actually... But, anyway, we'll see what happens. But I predict in 2025, I will meet with Jeff Bezos-

Scott Galloway 9:10 (laughs)

Kara Swisher 9:10 ... or my name isn't Kara Swisher. Okay? I'm going t-

Scott Galloway 9:12 I, I wouldn't-

Kara Swisher 9:13 He's gonna meet-

Scott Galloway 9:13 ... I wouldn't put it past you. I wouldn't put it past you.

Kara Swisher 9:15 I'm doing it. He's gonna do it. And you know what? He's gonna like it.