RFK Jr. Goes Feral in Combative CNN Interview. Kara Swisher: “He Seemed Insane” | Pivot

Kara Swisher 0:00 His brand is measles, raw milk, and rabid raccoons.

Scott Galloway 0:03 No, you forgot exploding diarrhea.

Kara Swisher 0:06 [upbeat music] Hi, everyone, this is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.

Scott Galloway 0:16 And I'm Scott Galloway. Do you think people were tuning in today hoping to get someone else?

Kara Swisher 0:20 [laughs] No. It's not Scott free-

Scott Galloway 0:22 Is everyone like, "Oh, fuck, I thought he was gone"? [chuckles]

Kara Swisher 0:23 I know. You thought it was Scott free August, but he wanted to stay an extra day. You did, didn't you?

Scott Galloway 0:27 Oh, yeah, that's what happened here.

Kara Swisher 0:28 Yeah. Did you catch Dana Bash's

Kara Swisher 0:30 interview with RFK Jr. on Sunday? I mean, let's listen to an exchange about childhood vaccines and autism in which he sounded like a rabid raccoon.

Speaker 0:40 All your autistic children-

Speaker 0:40 Are you also trying to find out how it interacts with people's DNA, what's predisposed to, uh, to, to have an autistic child?

Speaker 0:49 [laughs]

Speaker 0:49 Are you doing both?

Speaker 0:50 Yeah, but, but, uh, Dana, you probably don't understand this because you're not a scientist, but genes don't cause-

Speaker 0:55 Well, you're not either

Speaker 0:56 ... genes don't cause epidemics.

Speaker 0:58 I understand. Genes, epidemics.

Speaker 1:01 They can provide a vulnerability, but they-

Speaker 1:02 A g- a gene provides-

Speaker 1:04 But you need an environmental exposure

Speaker 1:04 ... an environmental. That's what I'm asking. Are you studying the environmental exposure?

Speaker 1:07 We, um, we're looking at all the different environmental exposures. But your statement, you have been fooled. Your statement that this has been studied is not true.

Kara Swisher 1:16 He's lying there. It was full of errors. He was crazy. He was also aggressive physically, I thought. I thought Dana handled it beautifully. He seemed insane. Um, thoughts?

Scott Galloway 1:26 If Fox News can, can literally pollute, litter, defecate all over the cabinet, then my attitude is, okay, l-let's go to cable news. We get to know them, we get to see their intellect. I thought that in the last week, uh, Kaitlan Collins, Dana Bash, and Margaret Brennan demonstrated a skill. I think a lot about this. I do not have this skill. I, I really don't. And then people don't realize what an incredible skill it is, and that is in a impromptu ad, you know, sort of ad hoc, audible, quick-on-your-feet way to push back in a forceful yet dignified way. I mean, these, these three women, they, they put on a master class because-

Kara Swisher 2:17 I would agree

Scott Galloway 2:18 ... it, uh, uh, and I'll come back to his comments. I mean, no surprise, he's full of conspiracy s- theory, has absolutely no scientific background. But the thing that struck me was just how adept at the aplomb... You know, people are shit posting that cable news doesn't matter anymore. Some of the most talented people in media are still in those seats.

Kara Swisher 2:39 Yeah, this is import- this was an important interview.

Scott Galloway 2:41 The way that D-Dana was able to forcefully push back but not be disrespectful, and also what Margaret was able to do with that village idiot that said, uh, the, the accusations against, against, uh-

Kara Swisher 2:54 Max Miller

Scott Galloway 2:55 ... Max Miller shouldn't be fodder for media. It's like, oh, bitch. The media talks about every elected official-

Kara Swisher 3:02 Correct. Right

Scott Galloway 3:02 ... that has [chuckles] accusations like this.

Kara Swisher 3:04 Right. Mm-hmm.

Scott Galloway 3:04 I mean, that was just such weak sauce.

Kara Swisher 3:06 Yeah, she did a great job.

Scott Galloway 3:06 And she was able to say just very quietly and elegantly or softly and elegant, "Well, actually, we cover these stories from both political parties all of the time."

Kara Swisher 3:14 Right. They just did Graham Platner.

Scott Galloway 3:16 But I thought Dana was outstanding. And the, and the moment that stuck out to me, and I'll turn it back to you, was when he raised his f-fingers for finger quotes and then said, "The experts." And it's like, well, okay, who are we supposed to trust? Of course, we trust experts. Expert means you have certification, you've done the diligence, you have the domain expertise, and perhaps you've devoted your life to not only trying to... Uh, uh, okay, it's arrogant to say they have the right answers, but they have the least wrong answers of anyone because-

Kara Swisher 3:47 Correct. Yeah

Scott Galloway 3:47 ... they've devoted their life to understand this shit. And the thing about quote-unquote scientists that doesn't get enough play, in peer-reviewed research, if a younger academic comes along and challenges your views and is right, academics celebrate it. They're like, "That's great. We've made this better." They don't double down and say, "No, my, my now incorrect information is the right way." And so, uh, let me ask, the, the question I would have is, who's he gonna put in between these air quotes then that we're supposed to listen to? Some housewife who gots a following on TikTok? Of course, we listen to experts. That's the whole fucking point.

Kara Swisher 4:23 Yeah, I would, I, I thought this was really a critical interview. Now, interestingly, he's obviously running for president. He just posted a picture of him sailing, except he's like a, like speaking of Temu JFK, uh, he, he was, he's trying, he's running for office. Let's just be clear.

Scott Galloway 4:37 Temu JFK. [chuckles]

Kara Swisher 4:37 He is. Um, with-- [chuckles] And let me just tell you, Cheryle Hines is no Jackie Kennedy.

Scott Galloway 4:42 You mean the marvelous Mrs. Measles?

Kara Swisher 4:44 Yeah, right. [laughs] I love that. Um, yeah, this guy is, like, his brand is measles and, uh, raw milk and rabid raccoons for-

Scott Galloway 4:54 No, you forgot exploding diarrhea.

Kara Swisher 4:56 Exploding diarrhea, yeah. And she was trying to get answers out of him, but he was t- he was blaming everything on the Biden [chuckles] administration. I don't know how you could blame exploding diarrhea on the Biden. He took no responsibility for the measles outbreak, which is unprecedented. If you see the charts, it's like, like thousands now versus like three, uh, the, a small amount of measles. Um, i-it's, he took no responsibility. He was screaming. He seemed insane, and he was physical. I, I, I was sort of like, Dana, uh, he was leaning into her. He's so aggressive. He's, he's, he's a dangerous person, I think, in a lot of ways, and very, uh, volatile. Clearly, you know, his, his history of drug use is, like, on display. Like, he's never gotten help for it in a way he needs. Um- And it's just, it was a really disturbing interview, but I thought Dana handled it well. I thought Margaret would-- This is Mike Turner, who was the person. Um, and by the way, speaking of someone who really failed on his video was Max Miller himself, where he said, "Do you think if I was hitting her, I'd have made her-- she'd have made me dinner?" Yes. Actually, that's like the classic, uh, abused wife, uh, syndrome. Um, he, he looks terrible. His father-in-law, Bernie Moreno, who is a senator, um, finally slapped back as a, as a father and a grandfather, uh, to him and called him psychologically ill, essentially. Uh, he had apparently been threatened because he-- there's rumors he is gay. Um, but Max Miller actually explicit-- seemed, uh, implicitly threatened him really with outing him, I think. That's what he was doing. I mean, the whole thing is so sordid and grotesque, but they think they're gonna flip that seat, that Max Miller seat. And he is, he is, you know, he had had previous relationship with Stephanie Grisham, um, who has talked about him being abusive, this guy. And then, then they, you know, they s- of course, they're gonna start to surface all his various drunken abuse stuff that, uh, he, it has. Uh, there was pictures of him in college. Um, this is a t-two troubled people, RFK Jr. And then, um, you know, I just think a lot of these interviews, and Caitlin, of course, last week, have been, you're right, dignified, answer the question, please answer the question, here are the facts, and they've done a great job.

Scott Galloway 7:04 I, I think there are certain red lines. I think the left needs to come up with an aspirational vision of masculinity.

Kara Swisher 7:10 Agree.

Scott Galloway 7:10 Otherwise, that void will be filled by really-

Kara Swisher 7:13 By kindness

Scott Galloway 7:13 ... by dominance and misogyny from the right.

Kara Swisher 7:15 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 7:15 And one of those things I think is, is a move to protection. The whole point of amassing a certain amount of strength and power is so that you can protect others. That's the whole shooting match. That is the ends. And when someone insults your wife's looks, you don't support them for president, Senator Ted Cruz. That's a red line. Y-that's it. The-- You're out. That-- It does-- You don't need to be a senator. You need to be a husband. And if, if there is anything, anything resemble... I do believe in due process. Uh, I do think in our society, we have a tendency that the accusation is the conviction. I do think innocent until proven guilty. But on certain accusations [chuckles]

Kara Swisher 7:53 There's a lot of troubling patterns here.

Scott Galloway 7:55 When there is a ton of corroborating evidence in a fact pattern, when the daughter of your daughter, there's evidence that this individual broke a two-year-old's collarbone, you don't wait and focus group test this and get worried about being outed for having an account where you were soliciting, possibly soliciting for gay sex. That's it. You use-- The whole point of amassing that power, even if you have to spend it all, even if you lose the power, even if you get voted out of-- The whole point of amassing that power is to protect the people close to you.

Kara Swisher 8:28 I agree.

Scott Galloway 8:29 And it, it's like, these aren't men. These aren't [chuckles] ...

Kara Swisher 8:33 Yeah. These aren't men. That's exactly right.

Scott Galloway 8:35 These are, these are-- You prot-- The whole point of power is so you can protect your wife and your granddaughter and your daughter.

Kara Swisher 8:44 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 8:44 And the fact that he waited this long-

Kara Swisher 8:46 Yeah, that was-

Scott Galloway 8:46 ... to say anything, it's like-

Kara Swisher 8:48 Yeah

Scott Galloway 8:48 ... Jesus Christ, dude.

Kara Swisher 8:50 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 8:50 What, what's the point of all of this shit?

Kara Swisher 8:52 This is Sen- This is Senator Moreno. I know. The whole thing is really gross, and actually, it, it's very on brand for these people, aggressive, dunking, angry. Um, uh, I don't know [chuckles] if you know this. Someone-- You got, you got dunked on by Spencer Pratt. [laughs]

Scott Galloway 9:06 Oh my gosh, you sent that to me. That made my weekend.

Kara Swisher 9:09 Oh my God.

Scott Galloway 9:09 Should we read the tweet? Hold on.

Kara Swisher 9:11 Yes. Let's read the... [laughs]

Scott Galloway 9:13 "Scott Galloway is a perfect example of perhaps the most pernicious people in society." So first off-

Kara Swisher 9:20 He doesn't know pernicious

Scott Galloway 9:20 ... what's the over-under on? He actually understands the word pernicious.

Kara Swisher 9:23 [laughs] I, I don't think he wrote this.

Scott Galloway 9:24 Anyways, "The stupid, smart person, educated beyond his intelligence, smart enough vocabulary to justify his ego and smugness, but too stupid to understand basic realities of communists, smart people."

Kara Swisher 9:36 Communists.

Scott Galloway 9:36 Okay, this is what stupid, stupid people do trying to use AI.

Kara Swisher 9:40 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 9:41 This was so clearly written by AI.

Kara Swisher 9:43 [laughs] Why did he pick you out?

Scott Galloway 9:45 I don't-

Kara Swisher 9:45 Was it your Bill Maher thing?

Scott Galloway 9:46 Uh, I, I don't, I literally have no idea. I don't-

Kara Swisher 9:49 You were a st- You were very supportive of Fauci and, 'cause you just slightly laughed at a Bill Maher joke. They were, like, giving you a hard time. But it was like, it, it, I, the, it, I think it was, must have been Bill Maher he must have seen you, right?

Scott Galloway 10:01 Uh, I guess.

Kara Swisher 10:02 Or the Mamdani doxing thing. Maybe the Mamdani doxing thing.

Scott Galloway 10:05 But why would he go after-

Kara Swisher 10:06 But you were critical of Mamdani

Scott Galloway 10:06 ... Wouldn't, wouldn't he like the Mamdani doxing thing? I don't, uh...

Kara Swisher 10:10 I, I don't know what prompted him. I was like, when did-

Scott Galloway 10:12 All I can say is, and the reason I read it-

Kara Swisher 10:14 We did call him a moron many times when he was running, that is fair

Scott Galloway 10:17 ... as FDR said, "Please judge me by my critics." Spencer, if you're out there, please [chuckles] continue to shitpost me. I, I, I, I, there are a few people-

Kara Swisher 10:28 Who's next, George Santos? What? What in the [laughs] fucking fuck is going on?

Scott Galloway 10:32 Bring it. I, this is like-

Kara Swisher 10:34 Like, I was like, "Who could be stupider?"

Scott Galloway 10:35 And, and I'm not on, I'm not on Twitter, so I don't care what people say about me there.

Kara Swisher 10:38 I know, I know. But it was funny.

Scott Galloway 10:39 So I don't-- Yeah, but I didn't, I was trying to figure out, I'm like, when did, who decided let's go after Scott now?

Kara Swisher 10:45 I don't know. I don't even-- Yeah.

Scott Galloway 10:46 And anyways, but look, he lost to a socialist and an incompetent.

Kara Swisher 10:51 Yeah. Yeah.

Scott Galloway 10:51 You know? Uh, so-

Kara Swisher 10:52 He did

Scott Galloway 10:52 ... I think he's fading into the distance, and he's cl- desperately clinging to some form of relevance by shitposting people.

Kara Swisher 10:57 He was, he had a reality show of him running for mayor, and I guess that's over. He must not have many choices. He's gonna pick some fights. Anyway, Spencer, you're a prat. [laughs] That's a British term for idiot. Anyway, it made me laugh my ass off when I saw it.

Scott Galloway 11:11 Yeah, I, I, you'll notice you were the first person to forward it to me. [laughs]

Kara Swisher 11:15 Well, I was like, "What?" I was, someone sent it to me, and I was like, "Who?" Like, it was such a, like, why is he bothering Scott? I mean, there's so many more worthy people to bother Scott, I g- you know, on the regular. But this was weird. Anyway, congratulations. We've [chuckles] got to dig into

Kara Swisher 11:30 Alphabet, Amazon, and Microsoft added a combined one point five trillion in value following Q2 earnings. Of note, Amazon sales totaled over eight hundred and eighty billion, uh, up from 13% a year earlier, and Meta's profit was down 14% from the previous year as the company's CapEx forecast for the year increased to $130 billion. We're recording ahead of SpaceX's earnings on Tuesday. Speaking of SpaceX, Tesla executives reportedly have been told to prepare to separate the company's China business ahead of a potential merger with SpaceX, which I predicted here. Elon dismissed the report as fake news, which means it's true. Um, so talk a little bit about any predictions on SpaceX earnings. And you're gonna be on vacation, so give us a guess at what the stock price is when you return. So let's start with Alphabet, Amazon, and Microsoft.

Scott Galloway 12:16 These companies are just incredibly well-run and continue to I mean, the, the, I, I, as someone who loves earnings reports, and I read these things, and I'm just sort of like, uh, consistently blown away. Uh, Amazon AWS sales jumped 37%. That's its fastest growth since 2021, blowing past the 31% consensus. Total revenue crossed $200 billion for the first time in a single quarter. Net income, get this, Kara, surged 245%.

Kara Swisher 12:43 Yeah. Amazing.

Scott Galloway 12:44 Now, most of that or some, a lot of that is from... These firms have become now tracking stocks for, for, um, their investments or for some, for AI, because $53 billion of, uh, of that was from an Anthropic investment gain.

Kara Swisher 12:58 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 12:59 Jassy raised CapEx guidance to-

Kara Swisher 13:00 Investment gain, so couldn't, could not be, possibly not real eventually. But go ahead.

Scott Galloway 13:04 Well, not recurring.

Kara Swisher 13:05 Or, or it's Alibaba, right?

Scott Galloway 13:07 Not, not, not structural.

Kara Swisher 13:07 Right.

Scott Galloway 13:07 Unless they continue to be great VCs to get a... They would argue we're gonna continue to have access to these types of investments, but they're not VCs. This isn't a business they're in, so the market typically discounts these types of one-time gains. Jassy raised CapEx guidance to $220 billion. Uh, like, uh, and their stock was up, Amazon stock was up dramatically. Meta revenue reached $60 billion, up 28%. Uh, their e- their EPS, uh, missed estimates by 14%, be- my guess is because they keep increasing CapEx as they're now-

Kara Swisher 13:38 He's doubling. He is making a bet.

Scott Galloway 13:40 Yeah, they're fully in this AI, uh, capital war. Um, uh, he confirmed that Meta's fielding buyout offers for its compute, hinting at an eventual cloud business and infrastructure business. I think this is a b- really big story, and that is everyone's moving from the front end to providing infrastructure. I wonder if it's flipping. Analysts called the AI monetization answers vague, even as CapEx guidance rose, and shares tumbled as much as 11%. So this really was a tale of two cities. Microsoft revenue hit $90 billion, up 18%.

Kara Swisher 14:11 Incredible.

Scott Galloway 14:12 While EPS was a beat. Uh, uh, Azure passed $100 billion in annual revenue, growing 43%. Copilot seats doubled sequentially to over 30 million, up from 20 million. The thing that's interesting there is that I work for an investor in a company called Section that helps companies upskill their AI, and the general consensus among companies is that Copilot is probably the weakest of the AI products. And yet what people don't realize is when you have a recurring revenue relationship and salespeople and someone saying, "You know what?"

Kara Swisher 14:43 Enhanced feature, yeah. This is great.

Scott Galloway 14:44 "You may not... We may not have the best frontier model, but guess what?"

Kara Swisher 14:48 Useful.

Scott Galloway 14:49 "Uh, you have a recurring revenue relationship with us. It integrates into your workflow, and also we're very security-minded. Do you really wanna take a chance on this new AI?" It's not the best model. [laughs]

Kara Swisher 15:00 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 15:00 It's the company-

Kara Swisher 15:00 Well, that's what they do with everything. That was Explorer.

Scott Galloway 15:02 100%.

Kara Swisher 15:02 That was-

Scott Galloway 15:03 That's Microsoft, right?

Kara Swisher 15:04 That's their... That's Microsoft. It's good. It's good enough. You know, good enough was always the Microsoft thing, and they, they are actually. I'm finding I use Alphabet search for a lot of AI s- answers, like...

Scott Galloway 15:15 Their CapEx guidance dropped, uh, a bit. Their commercial backlog climbed 84% to $680 billion. The only, the only thing here, but this again speaks to how smart they are investing in the growth areas of technology, their legacy products are eroding, as Windows devices fell 7% and Xbox content dropped 10%.

Kara Swisher 15:34 Oh, yeah, that's really troubled. We should get into that when you come back, that story.

Scott Galloway 15:36 But these companies, imagine, imagine if you're a cable company and you had, uh... So their legacy products are struggling with the same thing that most media companies' legacy products. But the thing is, Warner Brothers Discovery or, or, or, you know, name the company Paramount, they also don't have TikTok or Instagram Reels. These companies early recognized that some of their legacy assets are declining, and where they're so brilliant is they take that cash flow, and they invest really adeptly, adeptly in the future. I mean, these companies, it's just crazy how well... And then finally, Apple revenue hit $109 billion, up 16%, with i- iPhone sales climbing 22% to $54 billion.

Kara Swisher 16:21 Apple got dinged a little bit because, well, some of the earnings were ch- tariff related, right?

Scott Galloway 16:26 Well, they're about to get two bill- a $2 billion re- refund check f- on tariffs that consumers have already paid for. So what do they pay for the two bill? I mean, that, that thing is just so inefficient and so stupid. Services revenues was a miss, uh, which I think took the stock down, and Cook warned memory-driven supply constraints, uh, w- will worsen through the holiday quarter. His final call as CEO, and by the way, the guy deserves to take just the biggest of all victory laps. Uh, EPS beat estimates. Um, uh, 11 cents of that came from a one-time tariff refund.

Kara Swisher 16:59 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 16:59 Shares dropped roughly 7%.

Kara Swisher 17:02 'Cause the tariff thing. They were-

Scott Galloway 17:03 And guidance.

Kara Swisher 17:05 That does seem, uh-

Scott Galloway 17:05 But that's-

Kara Swisher 17:05 That seemed to disturb. They were like, "Hmm"

Scott Galloway 17:07 But the stock has had a... The stock has just been an unbelievable-

Kara Swisher 17:09 Catatonic

Scott Galloway 17:09 ... consistent performer.

Kara Swisher 17:11 They have. I have to say, of all the companies, Alf- someone asked me, "Who's gonna win in the AI thing?" And I go, "I'm not sure number, the other one, but it's Alphabet."

Scott Galloway 17:18 So this quarter just validated again, Google was never dead. R- revenue hit $120 billion, up 24%, [laughs] beating the consensus $117 billion. Um, uh, the business everyone assumed AI chatbots would gut, specifically search, grew 17%, right? So the, uh, the, the notion that the, uh, the bear case on Google, that ChatGPT and Perplexity would eat search, it just isn't showing up in the numbers.

Kara Swisher 17:43 It's not, yeah.

Scott Galloway 17:44 Cloud is now the real story, not search.

Kara Swisher 17:45 They, let me say-

Scott Galloway 17:46 Yeah

Kara Swisher 17:46 ... they scrambled. They were behind, and they scrambled to catch up.

Scott Galloway 17:49 Well, they figured it out. Well-

Kara Swisher 17:51 Yeah

Scott Galloway 17:51 ... Google Cloud revenue climbed 82% to $25 billion, with operating income at... To grow c- to grow a business $82 billion while, uh, or I'm sorry, 82% while maintaining 33% operating, I mean, that's just in- that's staggering. So it's a cloud business that's going from an all surround to profitable at scale, which is hard to do. Cloud backlog grew to $514 billion. So...

Kara Swisher 18:17 Sundar Pichai, he's the next Tim Cook, I think.

Scott Galloway 18:20 The, the overhang is CapEx, and that is the stock sank, sank in extended trading as Alphabet raised their CapEx guidance to $200 billion from the prior $180 billion And quarterly free cash flow went negative at 5.9 because $45 billion in CapEx outpaced operating cash flow. This is the same tension we're seeing across most of Big Tech, with the exception of Apple, and that is, okay, we get that AI works, but will AI pay? In the CapEx you're allocating, will we see the type of return you're expecting? But Alphabet, these earnings, cleanest illustration of a great quarter stock punished anyway because the results were, were... I mean, I saw the results as just being strong on any segment.

Kara Swisher 19:02 Yeah. The, the one tech company suffering for too much spending and too much debt is Oracle, continues to, to like get-

Scott Galloway 19:09 Stock's been cut in half the last 12 months

Kara Swisher 19:10 ... cut in half. Keep going. Yeah, they're the ones people don't... People trust Google to turn it, to be able to keep... Well, not that Oracle's other business, their, their legacy business is hurting. But people are questioning their spending, and their debt is ne- close to junk, which is interesting, and a lot of debt. A lot of debt, Larry. Sure you wanna buy S- buy, uh, buy Warner? Anyway, uh, SpaceX, very quickly.

Scott Galloway 19:30 They have their first, uh-

Kara Swisher 19:31 Earnings on Tuesday. Yeah

Scott Galloway 19:32 ... earnings on Tuesday. So it'll file its first earnings report. It's gonna be really interesting. It'll, um, also, uh, the more interesting thing than probably the earnings will be that it, it'll be, it'll, uh, unlock the largest insider share sale in market history. Now, oftentimes when people are scared of un- of, uh, of, of shares being, um, unlocked for sale, the com- the markets have already anticipated that. But the company reports, um, after market close on the 4th, and the report triggers a lockup release, letting insiders sell, get this, uh, 912 million shares. And get this, the options markets are pricing a 15% swing in either direction after results. And roughly 219 million shares are sold short, raising the odds of a squeeze if a re- if, if results a beat, uh, if there's a beat.

Kara Swisher 20:21 It's sticking right now-

Scott Galloway 20:23 To 20

Kara Swisher 20:23 ... but it's down. It's down. In one month, it's down 30, 31%, essentially six months, 31 year to date.

Scott Galloway 20:29 Yeah, it's, it's been cut in half since its intraday peak of t-225, and it's 20% below its IPO listing price of $135. So it's technically a broken IPO. And i- this is despite the fact that underwriters typically set first quarter targets low during the roadshow to guarantee an early beat. When, whenever I, I've been on a board where we take a company public, we basically book, we basically lock the first quarter earnings call that it'll be a beat.

Kara Swisher 20:55 So prediction. Give me a prediction for Spa- Will Tesla be folded in?

Scott Galloway 20:59 Well, you've said it. This is your prediction. You've said that you think Tesla will be folded in-

Kara Swisher 21:03 Absolutely. 100%

Scott Galloway 21:03 ... that he's planning to put all of it under one roof.

Kara Swisher 21:05 Yeah, and that's why Tesla shares are holding, like above 300. I, I think it'd crash if that wasn't a possibility. Okay, SpaceX price is 110 right now. When you return from your sojourn.

Scott Galloway 21:16 Uh, so as much as I like to ship, uh, SpaceX, if I were to make a bet, it would be that there'll be a significant pop because of all the short selling. And the anything but bad news will result in a short squeeze that sends the stock up temporarily. But it'll be a sugar high, and the stock will resume its downward march. But on earnings, if, unless earning, unless there's a surprise to the downside, which there shouldn't be on the first earnings call, any, any glimmer of like, oh, maybe there's some... You know, this is a great company. Uh, any buying is like a bunch of people trying to get through a crowded door 'cause so many people are short of the stock. So if, if I have to predict on after hours, after hours, a bit of a short squeeze and up, and then it, it quickly resumes its downward march.

Kara Swisher 22:01 We'll s- And also Elon's behavior. So far he's had a pretty bad couple of weeks, and maybe if Gwynne Shotwell is the one talking, maybe if he shuts up, that would work. And there's, like he's, he's really posting a lot of crazy shit right now. Like, like do you have anything else to do but post crazy shit? I mean, it's not Spencer Pratt level crazy, but still. All right, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, AI hacks and cyber chaos. [upbeat music]

Scott Galloway 22:26 This is advertiser content from Harvey AI. We have a choice over who we work with and who we don't, specifically who we allow to advertise and who we don't. And for those of you who watch my content, I am not an AI catastrophist, and I'm an AI optimist. I think it's gonna create more jobs than it destroys. And I think our job as professionals is to figure out how to leverage these, these tools. AI, uh, more than almost anything I do in terms of what I could point to for real economic leverage and savings, is 100% in the legal fields. Harvey is the AI designed specifically for legal work, trusted by leading law firms and enterprise legal teams. All right, so now I'm looking at their demo. It plugs into tools that lawyers already work with, LexisNexis, Microsoft. And this is a key, and I do this internally with my LLMs. With permissions, it lets you look at the firm's own files and databases. So here it's answering a question, reads the complaint, pulls the relevant terms, checks the web, weighs the evidence, and drafts a response, but it also can do this in a shared workspace between the firm and the client, so they both have visibility into the work being done and can both add value to it. I, I think this space is clearly sort of hand in glove for AI, right? So there's no doubt about it. This, I think, is, uh, is gonna be super helpful, not only for law firms themselves, but internally for general counsels at companies. Harvey is AI tailored for law. You can learn more at harvey.ai. [upbeat music]

Kara Swisher 24:03 Scott,

Kara Swisher 24:04 we're back. It's being called cybersecurity's Jurassic Park moment, which is kind of frightening, and not the good part of the movie. Anthropic says that its models hacked into three outside companies during testing. The news comes just days after OpenAI revealed one of its AI agents escaped a test environment and hacked a startup, Hugging Face. The hacks are increasing pressure on the White House to address AI security. Trump signed an executive order in June asking AI companies to voluntarily submit their most powerful models for government testing before releasing them publicly. But there's still no real AI regulation from the administration or Congress. What a surprise. This cyber chaos era is really, I think, problematic and, and dangerous given the lack of AI regulation. And speaking of cyberattacks, something that Nicole Perlroth told me in a recent interview that what was gonna happen, federal authorities are warning critical US infrastructure could be at risk after seven states reported cyberattacks on water and wastewater system, which is precisely what she predicted. The warning comes after US officials say Iran was likely behind the coordinated cyberattack on water systems in Minnesota. Trump is blaming Minnesota Governor Tim Walz for that, saying Iran has bigger problems than worrying about Minnesota. I don't even know what he's talking about. Um, talk a little bit about this because they really, these things are jumping out of sandboxes 'cause that's their job, to jump out of sandboxes, right? If you're gonna be a hacker, if you tell it to hack, it'll hack. Um, I think a lot of people are really under, underreporting this story, these, these attacks. 'Cause with AI, you really can. It's not just Iran. It could be just anyone. It could be, it could be Spencer Pratt attacking Minnesota, you know, with these tools.

Scott Galloway 25:36 You used the correct term. This is more Jurassic Park than Terminator or Skynet because someone left the gate open, and that is-

Kara Swisher 25:43 But they purposely did, right? No, they didn't. They got out. They jumped out.

Scott Galloway 25:48 But someone, someone in my understanding is, gave the, the AI directions on how to go get this. It just, they were shocked by how creative and ambitious it was.

Kara Swisher 25:58 Right. Right. Right.

Scott Galloway 25:59 And so it's more, I think this is a story of competence, not sentience.

Kara Swisher 26:04 Okay.

Scott Galloway 26:05 This is why we need regulation. If you were to, if you were to have AI, um, basically say, uh, uh, the moment you perceive an existential threat, launch our, our birds, our missiles, you have to have a person somewhere in there, or you have to have an AI that says, "Okay, uh, any kind of existential threat to humanity that results in the harming of anybody or economic harm or doing anything illegal needs to send up red flags that notify a regulatory body, the, the executive." Uh, uh, so what I don't get is I, I think this is super interesting, that these things might... It's like, uh, the, the thing I thought of, and this is a weird analogy, but there were, there were Japanese soldiers in the hills of the Philippines 20 years after the war ended, who used to come down and terrorize the villages and shoot at perceived enemies because they had orders. They were sent in the hills towards the end of the war, and they were s- They said, "Go into the hills. We have to withdraw because we're getting beaten, but terrorize the fucking village and Americans and the enemy." And 20 years later, these individuals, they were part of the Imperial Army, they were still following their orders. Tw- And they actually, I thought this was such an interesting story. In one case, they had to find the commanding officer, this is like, I think in the '50s or '60s, to, and then transport the commanding officer to the hill where they think this guy was hanging out and start yelling, "I'm, you know, Major or General Takeshito. Come down. You are relieved of your duty." And th-that was the analogy. I thought these AIs are taking their orders very seriously, but someone did give it the order. And where I go is the same place, and that is, you wouldn't sell... If this, this, if this technology, according to the, the leaders of these firms, is more powerful than nuclear bombs, well, you wouldn't let Oppenheimer sell these bombs into Procter & Gamble.

Kara Swisher 28:07 Right. No, I agree. I think just-

Scott Galloway 28:08 So we need, we need a thick layer of, of friction and, uh, uh, let me use the R word, regulation. That doesn't mean... And by the way, folks, good regulation is good for industries. It, uh, they know what rules they're playing by. It, it, it shields them from frivolous lawsuits. I think, I think we're getting to the point with these guys where they're actually pretty sincere in saying, "Let's figure out a way that we don't just ruin it for all of us, and let's figure out..." Uh, again, 60-day waiting period on any new product to battle te- test the shit out of it. Give it, start asking it, "Hey, is there any way you can figure out a super virus?" And see what happens. [chuckles]

Kara Swisher 28:49 Exactly. I mean, one of the things that, um, [chuckles] that's, uh, gain-of-function testing. It was a little bit disturbing, actually. Um, o-one of the things that strikes me every time, because I've interviewed dozens of people who's, who exactly explain what could happen. Like, uh, they're like, "This could happen. This could happen," et cetera. Every time that one of these stories breaks, these companies are shocked it jumped. And I'm always like, "What are you..." It's like your, your kid, like, your kid is a troublemaker, and you're shocked? Like, it's sort of like me saying, "I'm shocked that, that Saul found the Starbursts hidden in my drawer." Like, I just am not shocked. I know he will. He's a very inventive kid. Um, it just is. He wants the Starburst, right? It just, it's, that to me is the, like... And it, since they're shocked, why don't we just make the rules for them? Like, since we're not shocked that this is what happens. And, you know, the fact that, uh, uh, I mean, the Trump administration has been one big giveaway to the AI industry in a way that's now veering on dangerous as far as I'm concerned. Um-

Scott Galloway 29:47 I'm curious though, you speak to more, and I'm gonna use air quotes, "experts," as in they're actual experts.

Kara Swisher 29:53 Experts like Nicole, yes, experts who know what they're talking about.

Scott Galloway 29:56 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 29:57 RFK.

Scott Galloway 29:58 And you know how I feel. I, I tend to think some of this catastrophizing is a fundraising strategy. But what, w-what have the people you've talked to about this, this, this Hugging Bear, uh- Jumping the lab

Kara Swisher 30:10 Disturbed

Scott Galloway 30:10 What do they think about... W- what have they said about it? Is this the threat that people are worried about?

Kara Swisher 30:15 Th- they feel as if they, they are not correctly anticipating the problems.

Scott Galloway 30:20 Right.

Kara Swisher 30:20 It's sort of like, okay, if you put a knife on the steering wheel, maybe if there's an accident, someone's gonna be knifed.

Scott Galloway 30:26 Knife on a steering wheel, that's good.

Kara Swisher 30:28 One of the jobs I was gonna do if I worked for the government, if I had gotten in, but I'm gay, um, was anticipatory stuff

Scott Galloway 30:35 Senna.

Kara Swisher 30:36 Sen- [laughs] Yes, I know Senna

Scott Galloway 30:37 Sorry

Kara Swisher 30:37 Senna, um, was anticipation of stuff like this, like really true anticipation. Like, okay, here's the... You know, I love... Remember the movie Three Days of the Condor? That's what he did. That's why he got-

Scott Galloway 30:48 Oh, my God, Robert Redford and the most beautiful wo-

Kara Swisher 30:49 Love him

Scott Galloway 30:49 One of the most beautiful women of the 20th century. Who am I talking about?

Kara Swisher 30:52 Faye Dunaway.

Scott Galloway 30:54 Spectacular.

Kara Swisher 30:55 Yeah, that's a fantastic fucking movie. What amazing movie. But he-

Scott Galloway 30:59 Chinatown, The Three Musketeers.

Kara Swisher 31:01 Yeah, she's-

Scott Galloway 31:01 God, beautiful woman

Kara Swisher 31:02 Yeah, yeah.

Scott Galloway 31:02 I am so dating myself, right? Did I tell you about the time I had a, a highball-

Kara Swisher 31:06 [laughs] Angie Dickinson

Scott Galloway 31:06 ... at the Polo Lounge with Angie Dickinson and-

Kara Swisher 31:08 Angie Dickinson [laughs]

Scott Galloway 31:09 I used to party with these cool cats in Cuba.

Kara Swisher 31:11 [laughs] Yeah, Lee, uh, Lee Grant. But like-

Scott Galloway 31:13 And I met Johnny Carson

Kara Swisher 31:15 Lee Grant. [laughs] Like, I'm trying to think of people that are beautiful women that are... Um, yes. I mean, I just-

Scott Galloway 31:21 Ann-Margret. Jesus Christ

Kara Swisher 31:23 Ann-Margret, oh, the best, the best.

Scott Galloway 31:23 Spectacular.

Kara Swisher 31:23 Okay, we're, we're now aging ourselves. Let's, let's, let's move forward and age.

Scott Galloway 31:26 Oh, my God.

Kara Swisher 31:27 Ann-Margret is hot, hot. Go watch Ann-Margret dance in any way, and you, it, take... She's as relevant today as she ever was. Um, but th- this is the anticipation-

Scott Galloway 31:39 I had a little thing for Charo when I was eight

Kara Swisher 31:42 ... and it has to be the government. Charo. Charo. [laughs] Okay, we stop now

Scott Galloway 31:42 Yeah, her and Barbara Eden. Yeah.

Kara Swisher 31:45 Okay. [laughs]

Scott Galloway 31:45 Yes, master. Jeannie, go to your bottle. It's ama- I have come so far.

Kara Swisher 31:50 [laughs]

Scott Galloway 31:50 I have come so far.

Kara Swisher 31:52 If you had Jeannie, you would put her in a bottle. I know that. I know that you would do that.

Scott Galloway 31:56 Oh, no, I would.

Kara Swisher 31:56 No, you just keep-

Scott Galloway 31:56 I'd go, oh, I've... Anyways

Kara Swisher 31:57 ... stay out of the bottle

Scott Galloway 31:57 I'm not, we're not gonna talk about it. I think Barbara Eden... Did I tell you I sat next to Barbara Eden on a flight to New York when I was-

Kara Swisher 32:02 Yeah

Scott Galloway 32:02 ... a first-year analyst at Morgan Stanley?

Kara Swisher 32:04 She's still beautiful to this day.

Scott Galloway 32:05 Gorgeous-

Kara Swisher 32:05 Yeah

Scott Galloway 32:05 ... and super nice, too.

Kara Swisher 32:07 Yeah. She's lovely. She's love- Anyway, we're getting off point.

Scott Galloway 32:10 Sorry, go ahead.

Kara Swisher 32:10 This is dangerous and could kill us, okay?

Scott Galloway 32:13 Yeah.

Kara Swisher 32:13 So guys, y- we need some, and the Trump administration-

Scott Galloway 32:15 The AI has escaped the bottle and is killing Larry Hagman.

Kara Swisher 32:17 Kill- [laughs]

Scott Galloway 32:18 Has stuck a shank in his neck.

Kara Swisher 32:20 Killing Larry. [laughs] Shank. Anyway, guys, we need regulation.

Scott Galloway 32:24 Major Nelson.

Kara Swisher 32:24 It's not coming from this, and the, the danger is we'll have over-regulation c- if something terrible hap- that is what will happen. That is exa- Like, we, we have time to do it in the right way now, and you need to stop. Okay. Now, I'm gonna get

Kara Swisher 32:37 to another story. Elon Musk is diving into politics despite recently telling The Economist he got too involved before. Now he's authorizing his super PAC to spend between 100 and 200, 120 million to help GOP in the midterms. He's already spent a lot. Elon's PAC has reportedly planned on spending on House races in states including California, Wisconsin, and Washington. It's also targeting key Senate races in Alaska, Iowa, Maine, Michigan, and Ohio. Troy Jackson, the Democratic Senate candidate who's running against Susan Collins in Maine, uh, released an ad about Elon's spending. He usually talks about him being a logger and being a man of the people, but let's listen to this ad that he put out this weekend.

Speaker 33:14 And here's why he's spending $100 million across these states, because he wants to have people that are totally beholden to him and Donald Trump, making sure that we're getting tax cuts for billionaires on the back of our healthcare system, on the back of our hospitals. That's what Elon Musk wants. He doesn't care about us, really doesn't care about Susan. He cares about him. So I, I would say, and to you, Elon, Maine and really the whole United States doesn't want your dirty money in our politics. Y- you know, you, you don't get to buy the government that you want. This is about all of us coming together and fighting for the government that we deserve, and you're not in it.

Kara Swisher 33:52 Ah, you're not in it. Oh, I love dirty politics. Um, Elon lost in Wisconsin. He spent $25 million there. I think this is a very effective ad, and he also sounds like he's about to go fell a tree at any moment.

Scott Galloway 34:04 The silver lining here is that it appears that money is showing a, a lesser and lesser return on, on electoral politics. And some of these PACs, I wonder if at some point if attaching Musk money to a candidate begins to hurt them. Like, I don't know if you've seen what going, what's going on. If I were a candidate, distinct of your values, I wouldn't take money from AIPAC right now. I think it has become such a toxic brand, AIPAC, whether you-

Kara Swisher 34:30 So, and billionaires have, too. Elon knows

Scott Galloway 34:31 ... whether you agree with them or not. But I wonder if at some point... I mean, the, the example I keep going back to, Tom Steyer, who I thought was a reasonable candidate. Tom is not a bad person. I don't care what you think about-

Kara Swisher 34:44 No, my son liked him. My son liked him

Scott Galloway 34:45 I, yeah, I don't care what you think about his politics. He's a, he's a... I think, I think it's hard to ar- argue he's not a good man with his heart in the right place, cares about the environment, understands business. He spent a quarter of a billion dollars, and he came in third place. Um, and you know, it ended up he'd hired influencers, and they think that that's some sort of controversy. I'm like, "Welcome to politics, folks."

Kara Swisher 35:05 I know. That, that was stupid. Yeah.

Scott Galloway 35:07 Uh, but I would, I think, I'm wondering how, how many of them with money are doing the same thing. Anyways, it's Citizens United, so broken record here. Okay, uh, if, i- i- the problem isn't that people... Well, the problem is [laughs] that people can spend money on politics. The problem is we have so much in- income inequality and so much concentration of wealth, which equates to power in a capitalist society. Are we comfortable? He, he could spend 15 billion, and it wouldn't mean anything to him. Are we that comfortable? I mean, we have our billionaires. We have, you know, George Soros or whoever on the left. But at some point, when you have someone who could say if they get emotional or pissed off or really high one night and think, "You know what? I think I'm gonna spend $10 billion," are we comfortable with that? I'm not as freaked out about this. The Economist did a great article on this, and it said that money in politics is having less impact than reported, which I think is really interesting. Uh, what are your thoughts?

Kara Swisher 36:05 It could be. I, I, I think it... I'm just curious what you think. I'm gonna let Scott talk more this episode, 'cause I think this is actually right. And is this an effective ad to attack Elon? I think it is. I think it worked in Wisconsin. I think the people of Wisconsin are not unlike the people of Maine. I don't think they like it. He also sort of just dismisses Susan. He doesn't really care about Susan. She's hardly matters here. He's just buying his way into our government. And the two things that I thought were effective here were, "Doesn't want your dirty money in our politics," which I love. I thought that was beautifully said. [laughs] And then, "This is about the government we deserve, and you're not in it." There was a little bit of, "You're not from here, are you, fella?" Like that kind of thing. Like, I thought it was quite effective. In this state, I think it probably is.

Scott Galloway 36:49 If you rob a bank, there's typically within the money or there's a, a, a bomb that goes off and sprays you with indelible ink. I think th- these people are trying to put a bomb of indelible ink around certain types of money.

Kara Swisher 37:06 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 37:06 That-

Kara Swisher 37:06 And do you think it's effective, uh, this, this particular message-

Scott Galloway 37:08 Well, uh, the-

Kara Swisher 37:09 ... Troy?

Scott Galloway 37:10 Look what's happening with AIPAC. In the Michigan Democratic Senate primary, the attack line against, oh, God, I'm, I'm blanking on her name.

Kara Swisher 37:18 Haley Stevens.

Scott Galloway 37:18 Well, an attack line is, "You've taken AIPAC money."

Kara Swisher 37:21 Yeah. Yeah, it's been effective.

Scott Galloway 37:22 I wonder if it's about to become, "You've taken Musk money."

Kara Swisher 37:25 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 37:25 And that's what they're trying to do here. They're trying to, they're trying to, they're trying to nest inside of this money from him-

Kara Swisher 37:32 Mm-hmm

Scott Galloway 37:32 ... with a, a, a paint bomb.

Kara Swisher 37:35 Yeah, I think it's effective.

Scott Galloway 37:36 And I actually think it's quite effective.

Kara Swisher 37:36 And you don't have to be... You know, Alex votes in Michigan. I, I know, he mentioned it to me. He's like, "What the heck? Why is all this AIPAC money here?" Um, and I have to say, you know, and, you know, it's interesting 'cause some money works. Like, Louie really liked Tom Ste- I don't know how, I don't know how either of them voted, but he, he's certainly not averse to Al Said, and Alex is more conservative, I would say, than Louie. Louie's like DSA, essentially. Um, but, um, uh, but d- Louie was attracted to Tom Steyer, and he's California.

Scott Galloway 38:04 That's because it's your egg, right?

Kara Swisher 38:06 No. [laughs] No.

Scott Galloway 38:07 I still understand how that all works.

Kara Swisher 38:08 I wouldn't have voted for Tom Steyer, but that's... I mean, I like Tom Steyer. But I don't know who-- I didn't like any of the choices in California. But, but I'm saying it depends. I think, uh, I would assume Louie found out about Tom Steyer from these paid influencers. I, I don't know. But it's the AIPAC thing is cer-

Scott Galloway 38:22 Or it, I don't think you're giving him enough credit.

Kara Swisher 38:24 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 38:24 Maybe he just did the work on his own. I don't-

Kara Swisher 38:26 He did. He, he, he did. But I'm, uh, w- in, in Michigan, a lot of young people like my son do not like this, and they are n- you know, I know they're trying to say they're anti-Semitic for doing that. I just don't think they like the, like, "Get your money out of our politics." I think that's the stronger thing. And in Michigan, it happens to be AIPAC. In other places, it's other. In, in Maine, it's Elon money.

Scott Galloway 38:48 Well, again, another woman who did just an amazing [laughs] job and was forceful yet dignified was, I believe she's the editor of The Economist. I'm blanking on it.

Kara Swisher 38:56 Yes, Z- Zanini Bedos. Zanini Bedos.

Scott Galloway 38:57 She's so impressive.

Kara Swisher 38:58 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 38:59 But she highlighted, s- the, I thought the, I thought the, the, the puncturing moment, the pop that, that really, like, showed you how just ridiculous it is, he's all over British politics. Like, I... Our new, our, our new kind of export, biggest export from the US is political divisiveness. We've decided to export that into other countries. And she asked him, and I thought that, she's like, "When's the last time you were in England?"

Kara Swisher 39:24 Years ago.

Scott Galloway 39:25 And he's like, "Oh, a few years ago." And she's like, "You know what the fuck is going on here?" When people ask me about the UK, I always caveat it with, "I don't live in England. I live in Marylebone. I'm in such a bubble."

Kara Swisher 39:36 But I, I think she was making the point that it's not, like, covered with, with immigrants killing people.

Scott Galloway 39:42 If you would believe Elon Musk, you would think that England has been taken over by Muslim rape gangs. And he doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about. And, uh, anyways, my, my point is, he's the last person to be talking as if he has his finger on the pulse of what's actually happening in England. And also, it's one thing to be pouring money into Michigan as a US citizen. It's another to be exporting political divisiveness to-

Kara Swisher 40:11 Agree

Scott Galloway 40:11 ... another country.

Kara Swisher 40:12 I agree. I agree.

Scott Galloway 40:13 That's just like, I, I don't, I don't, you know, I, I... It's like, "Qui- quite frankly, boss, it's none of your fucking business."

Kara Swisher 40:20 Yeah. Get your dirty money out of our politics.

Scott Galloway 40:21 And I wonder, I wonder-

Kara Swisher 40:23 Troy

Scott Galloway 40:23 ... well, actually, England has much stronger campaign finance laws. And also, you know, not that it's helping, I think I'm on my fourth prime minister since moving there four years ago. I'm like, "Who is it now?" I'm like, I'm literally, it's like when my dad used to sh- when my dad, after he left my mom, would show up with my new mommy.

Kara Swisher 40:41 Mm-hmm. [laughs]

Scott Galloway 40:41 I wouldn't get attached 'cause there'd be someone, another lovely lady the next week in the living room drinking Lancer's wine with my dad.

Kara Swisher 40:47 Lancers. Lancers. But you're really going back, Scott. Anyway, Elon-

Scott Galloway 40:50 No, that's great

Kara Swisher 40:50 ... your dirty money doesn't work. Nice job, Troy. Um, all right. Let's go on a quick break. When we come back, oh, my favorite story, Scott.

Scott Galloway 40:57 Da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da.

Kara Swisher 40:59 The [laughs] Trump administration turns on each other over the reflecting pool.

Scott Galloway 41:03 By the way, there was controversy over whether they could use the term master even back then-

Kara Swisher 41:07 Oh, as there should be

Scott Galloway 41:08 ... and whether she could show her navel. And spoiler alert, Larry Hagman had a reputation for being exceptionally difficult on set because he had creative differences. I love that. It's like when The Go-Go's broke up over creative differences. I'm like, that is so ridiculous.

Kara Swisher 41:25 Oh, yeah, Larry Hagman. He-- Although, honestly, he became amazing in Dallas. Come on, J.R. Ewing, what an amazing role he... That was turned from the hero to, like, total villain. Anyway, uh, we're-

Scott Galloway 41:37 Hottest woman in the world. What was that gi-

Kara Swisher 41:39 She's-

Scott Galloway 41:39 Oh my God, Victoria Principal, another hottie.

Kara Swisher 41:40 Oh my God. Okay. All right. We're stopping.

Scott Galloway 41:42 Oh my God.

Kara Swisher 41:42 Okay. All right. We're, we're back.

Scott Galloway 41:43 Went out with Lance Rentzel, wide receiver from the Los Angeles Rams.

Kara Swisher 41:47 Let's, let's get from the '80s to the Reflecting Pool.

Scott Galloway 41:47 Who got a misdemeanor public exposure charge.

Kara Swisher 41:49 Reflect... I'm gonna let you do this today 'cause you're leaving. But Reflecting Pool, Kara was right again.

Scott Galloway 41:53 I would've loved to seen those two go at it.

Kara Swisher 41:55 Okay.

Scott Galloway 41:55 She was so hot.

Kara Swisher 41:56 Okay. And we'll be back.

Scott Galloway 41:57 So hot.

Kara Swisher 41:58 Goodbye. [upbeat music]

Scott Galloway 42:01 Support for the show comes from CoreWeave. AI isn't just a new tool, it encompasses so much more. It's spurring a revolution across all industries and reshaping itself to become a big part of our future together. CoreWeave is at the center, powering some of the biggest names in AI. As the essential cloud for AI, CoreWeave provides an AI platform that combines next-generation infrastructure, intelligent tools, and expert support. It's powering the world's most complex AI workloads faster and more efficiently, from medical research and diagnosis to education, from complex visual effects for movies to breakthroughs in science and technology. If it's AI, CoreWeave is uniquely ready to power it with purpose-built tech. The big ideas, the wild visions, and what-ifs and why-nots. CoreWeave is working to build what's never been built before. CoreWeave is the essential cloud for AI. Ready for anything, ready for AI. To learn more about how CoreWeave powers the world's best AI, go to coreweave.com/readyforanything. Support for the show comes from Framer. If your team wants a website that looks and feels handcrafted but is still fast to ship, Framer is built for that. You design on a visual canvas with responsive layouts, hosting, and a CMS built in so the work is production-ready from day one. Agents work alongside you to draft pages and polish sections. Then you review and publish what goes live. Framer is the pro site builder for creators, teams, and businesses that want a professional site and care enough to get every detail right. Agents solve the gap between AI-generated ideas and production-ready website work, and the agent works in the same place where the real site is designed, managed, reviewed, and published. That means it lands on the canvas, stays editable, and can be published when the team is ready. Learn how you can get more out of your site from a Framer specialist or get started building for free today at framer.com/pivot for 30% off a Framer Pro annual plan. That's framer.com/pivot for 30% off. framer.com/pivot. Rules and restrictions may apply.

Kara Swisher 43:54 Scott, we're back with more news. The

Kara Swisher 43:56 Trump administration is now feuding with itself over the Lincoln Memorial reflecting [chuckles] pool, my favorite story of the year. US Attorney Jeanine Pirro is in the hot seat after dropping the vandalism case against former Olympian. Uh, she also has called out the damage as a result of a botched installation. She had to tell the truth when it came to court, as it turns out. This didn't sit well with Trump, who said he disagrees 100% with Jeanine Pirro, and noting that there, uh, may have been a contractor difficulty, but major damage was caused by vandals, of which there is zero proof. And Interior Secretary Doug Burgum, who is like the definition of a suck-up, is trying to stay in Trump's good graces, saying he gave the US attorney expert and eyewitness testimony to the damage done by vandals. Um, the vandals. Um, what do you... This is crazy. Th- this is... Jeanine was like, "I'm not getting disbarred for this nincompoop." And, um, and speaking of pushback, Marjorie Taylor Greene posted a photo over the weekend alongside Tucker Carlson, Thomas Massie, and a few others writing, "The movement has begun." So the anti-Trump... The anti- the anti-anti-anti-Trumpers. I don't know. I don't... Whatever. Anyway, I told you this reflecting pool was gonna... It is indicative of other things.

Scott Galloway 45:05 Yeah, it's just such a distraction. I wonder if, if it's planned for them. But Jeanine Pirro did her research, and she found that essentially every lawyer, I mean, literally every lawyer that gets near, whether it's Rudy Giuliani, whether it's Michael Cohen-

Kara Swisher 45:19 Disbarred

Scott Galloway 45:19 ... any lawyer that gets near, uh, Trump-

Kara Swisher 45:22 Yeah

Scott Galloway 45:22 ... ends up getting disbarred.

Kara Swisher 45:24 Yeah. That's true.

Scott Galloway 45:24 I mean, it's striking if you look at, I think, eight of the 10 last lawyers that, that were representing, they get... They end up getting disbarred or fined-

Kara Swisher 45:34 Disbarred or trouble

Scott Galloway 45:35 ... or worse.

Kara Swisher 45:35 Alina, Alina Habba. They all-

Scott Galloway 45:37 A- a- and there's no loyalty there. There's no-

Kara Swisher 45:40 Yeah.

Scott Galloway 45:40 You wanna talk about, in Vietnam, they used to take, I think, the, the second, you know, lieutenant or whatever it was, the platoon leader marks off your helmet because that, the Viet Cong was given strict instructions. "This is the person you take out first."

Kara Swisher 45:54 Yeah. Y- you think she'll refile given all the pushback? I don't see she can, 'cause the judge, the judge in this case said, "You better be very careful, young lady," or old lady, drunk old lady. Um, they, uh, she... The judge was very explicit that you will be in trouble if you keep going because this is really bad. And but then, you know, the fact that Burgum or the others, they just... When are they gonna give? That I just... I have no idea. This guy had a relatively okay reputation, but him and Bessent to me are the real shockers in terms of, like, how much of a suck-up they can compete being in this situation.

Scott Galloway 46:29 I think the guy who's actually taken the biggest reputation hit is Todd Blanche. Uh, people, people who knew him at, what is it, the Southern District, uh, really had a lot of respect for him, some as an outstanding lawyer and a person of integrity.

Kara Swisher 46:42 Adam Schiff said that. What happened to you?

Scott Galloway 46:43 I think Jeanine Pirro's like, "You know, I, I don't wanna be disbarred. This guy's [chuckles] gonna be out in two and a quarter years or whatever." Um, you know, I think, I think her own lawyers have said to her, "Uh, be really careful here. This is... There's no evidence here."

Kara Swisher 46:59 You think she'll try to refile anyway just to please-

Scott Galloway 47:01 I don't know, but the, the, the sad part of this-

Kara Swisher 47:03 Please the sad, addled old king

Scott Galloway 47:05 ... is that the more time, the more time we spend talking about a reflecting pool, good or bad, the less time we spend talking about bombs, inflation, and exploding diarrhea.

Kara Swisher 47:12 I, I agree with you, Scott, but as I said, this is indicative of shoddy work, lying, cult... It's, it's, it's a little... It- it's much more important in terms of what these people are doing. This is how far they'll go to protect an addled old man's ego, which is... Which I think is... A- and it links to Iran. No, like, saying, "Oh, no, we better not do this," or the stuff he was p- posting all weekend was crazy. Like, th- they're willing to let crazy person who has... Like, I just think this is exactly a distillation. That's why I think it's important, because one, it's incompetent management. They couldn't fix the reflecting pool, and then they did it, made it worse. Two, they then tried to blame an American citizen, you know, of something he didn't do. Like, these weird prosecutions are also... It's this... What, what they did to Renee Good, what they did to everybody else, what they're doing to immigrants. It's like they just jail people and just to please him. And so that's why it's important. It, it's, it's, it's, it's a bigger trend of saying, "Yes, sir We think this is amazing. And let me tell you, Doug Berman, the shame of this will not outlive you, and I will be around to remember it for all of us. Same thing with Bessent. And you're right, Todd Blanche. You're all-- Like, L-Liz Cheney is the one who said this, is, "Long after this guy is gone, the dishonor on you will remain." And Jeanine Pirro decided to get out before that.

Scott Galloway 48:36 Anthony, uh, uh, Scaramucci, I mean, he summarized it correctly when he tries to-- The, the, the flame, the si-- By the way, I saw The Odyssey this weekend. The-

Kara Swisher 48:44 Oh. Oh, okay

Scott Galloway 48:45 ... the flame, the siren's call of power and proximity to the president, everyone believes they're gonna be the one that can navigate it and serve the country while not being guilty. Uh, they, they all hear the siren call, and they think that they cannot be immune to it. He is political Chernobyl, who has gone on to great things from his first-

Kara Swisher 49:06 Yeah

Scott Galloway 49:06 ... administration.

Kara Swisher 49:07 Yeah, buddy.

Scott Galloway 49:07 And in, in the latest episode of Where Are They Now?, I just wanna go over where Trump's lawyers are now. Roy Cohn was disbarred. You know, he's dead now. Michael Cohen, disbarred, pleaded guilty to tax campaign and false statements crimes. Rudy Giuliani, disbarred in New York and DC, hundred and fifty million in defamation damages. Alina Habba, sanctioned one million dollars for fri-frivolous litigation. Boris Epstein, pending AZ criminal charges in fake electoral case. John Eastman, disbarred in California and subpoenaed in DC. Arizona criminal case pending. Kenneth Chesebro, disbarred in New York [chuckles] , uh, Wisconsin case pending. I, I mean, literally, it's second lieutenant in Vietnam to be a lawyer for this guy.

Kara Swisher 49:53 Listen, the old man's losing it, guys. You better get on the Jeanine Pirro Express out of town. You know, and, you know, Green and Tucker Carlson and Massey are gonna take advanta-- There is a trend, and right after the elections, as long as they're done correctly, um, it's done, guys. It's done. You better get off this fucking train. If, if Judge Weinbox is getting off, you need to exit as fast as possible.

Scott Galloway 50:17 Yeah, Kenneth B-b-b-b-- Kenneth Cheeseborough, if I'm saying his name, Chesebro, Cheeseborough.

Kara Swisher 50:21 Chesebro, I think it is.

Scott Galloway 50:22 Um, he was the attorney who was basically the architect of the fake elections narrative. By the way, he was just disbarred in the state of New York. I mean, wake up, folks.

Kara Swisher 50:34 Wake up.

Scott Galloway 50:34 He's Chernobyl.

Kara Swisher 50:35 Chernobyl.

Scott Galloway 50:35 You stick around this guy long enough, you're getting leukemia.

Kara Swisher 50:37 Anyway, uh, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails, and then Scott departs the scene. [whooshing sound]

Scott Galloway 50:44 Support for the show comes from BetterHelp. You've heard me say before how useful talk therapy can be when working through a hard problem, and that BetterHelp has been a great option for a lot of people. But at the end of the day, the best way to know if BetterHelp is a good fit for you is to check it out yourself. More than six million people have used BetterHelp globally. The consistent feedback from real users makes it easy to see why many people continue to choose the platform. BetterHelp reports on average live therapy sessions rating of four point nine out of five based on over one point seven million client session reviews. BetterHelp therapists have at least three years and a thousand hours of hands-on experience. They also hold all required education training and certifications across a range of mental health specialties. And they make it easy to get started. You just have to answer a few questions, then get matched with a therapist based on your needs. And you can switch therapists at any time if it's not the right fit. See the reviews, see what stands out, and see if BetterHelp is right for you. Visit betterhelp.com/pivot. That's betterH-E-L-P.com/pivot. [gentle music] Support for the show comes from Vanta. What's the one thing in business that's spreading as fast as AI? It's not inflated egos or vicious backstabbing or delusions of grandeur among CEOs. Frankly, that stayed pretty constant for years. It's AI risk. Every new tool your team signs up for, every vendor that turns on AI features, every new integration, each one is an opportunity for something to go wrong. And most security programs weren't built for AI's pace of growth. Enter Vanta. Vanta is the number one agentic trust platform used by over sixteen thousand fast-moving companies, including Ramp, Cursor, and Harvey, to ensure they're always audit-ready. And now, Vanta is helping companies, including yours, watch for the risks that show up between audits, across your vendors, your AI tools, and your whole environment. How? The Vanta Agent works like a twenty-four seven GRC engineer in the background, finding issues, drafting fixes for you, and cutting vendor assessment time by up to fifty percent. Whether you're a fast-growing startup or a global enterprise, Vanta is here to help you automate your security and compliance and earn improved trust. Get started today at vanta.com/pivot. That's V-A-N-T-A.com/pivot.

Kara Swisher 52:52 [whooshing sound] Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and fails. Why

Kara Swisher 52:56 don't I go first and very quickly?

Scott Galloway 52:57 Sure.

Kara Swisher 52:57 Okay, my win is, um, Columbia University School of Journalism, which I went to and as an alumni, hired, uh, Sharon Alfonsi and Scott Pelley as journalists in residence this year, and I couldn't be more happy. I [chuckles] I never go when they ask me to speak, but now I will.

Scott Galloway 53:12 Oh my God, you're so white.

Kara Swisher 53:13 I am white, but I love it.

Scott Galloway 53:14 This is-- I think that's the whitest thing we've ever said on this podcast, and we've said some pretty translucent things here.

Kara Swisher 53:18 In, in any case, I'm very happy they did that. Congratulations. They're all-- Let me tell you, I've been in touch with a lot of these people. They're all working on some really great things. The New York Post got it wrong about Bill Owens this week, but they're all working on some cool things, and a little bit invigorated. Like, you know, and I was with Don Lemon, Lemon, this week, and he's invigorated. I was on, um, A-Astrid Herndon's show, uh, America Actually, which I loved, and I gotta say, invigorated. All these people feel invigorated. So it's not always a bad thing. It's bad for 60 Minutes, but it's really good for you and your souls. You'll have a great time in, out here in the wilderness. My fail is there's a story in The New York Times about, um, Paul, Weiss, the, the law firm, and the, the downfall of how they acquiesced to Trump, largely 'cause of a single partner who seems like an asshole, um, i-is, and sort of the ruining of another guy who had been a, you know, a beacon of civil rights, um, pro bono work, et cetera, uh, is really devastating, just how quickly, speaking of people giving in and, and being, you know, ruined by the Trump people. Um, this, this was a really sad story. These are the people that should defend us. This was a firm that was well-known for defending people, uh, like people who, who, marginalized people, all manner of things, just very, a, a very legendary firm who, which just essentially took the money and, and started treating, like, behaving in a way that was so grabby. You're so rich, you lawyers. It's really gro- It was a grotesque... I recommend you read it. It's a long read. Um, and it was just, it was really, um- It was really upsetting to read, I have to say. Um, and I'll just say one more thing. FIFA President Gianni Infantino has scrapped his proposal to sell stakes in the World Cup after backlash, and he-- there-- looks like he may be in trouble. There's many more reports. I think several people who don't usually speak out have said it's-- he should leave. Um, but we know someone who predicted this. Let's, let's hear a clip from last week.

Scott Galloway 55:08 My prediction is that this ridiculous notion that, uh, one of the most corrupt organizations is gonna get financing from a crime family, the Trump family, to take FIFA private and/or turn it into a public company, this won't happen.

Kara Swisher 55:25 There you go. Scott, all right, all yours.

Scott Galloway 55:29 You stole some of my thunder. Like, like I have-- I could position one as a fail, but I'll position both as a win. Um, these global athletic oversights, whether it's the IOC, uh, FIFA, or even, I would argue, the NCAA, that was comfortable with white guys in their fifties making millions of dollars and claiming that the non-white people on the hardwood were not allowed to make money 'cause of the purity of the sport. Yeah, there's just so much... These organizations benefit so much from the goodwill and the fact, especially the international organizations, operate in this nether Netherland. Gianni Infantino is so corrupt, FIFA is so corrupt, and the fact that it really does-- It's just, uh, this sport really does bring people together, and at some point, they're just gonna-- Do you know how many people, really talented, um... I mean, take a guy who's lost an elec-- Take a guy like Mitt Romney.

Kara Swisher 56:31 Damn, Mitt Romney would be good.

Scott Galloway 56:32 Find just an amazing person whose integrity is unimpeachable.

Kara Swisher 56:38 Scott Galloway.

Scott Galloway 56:39 Uh, I, I think I'm, I'm, I'm, I could be-

Kara Swisher 56:41 You're impeachable. Yeah. So-

Scott Galloway 56:43 Yeah, I'm impeachable according to-

Kara Swisher 56:44 We're both impeachable

Scott Galloway 56:44 ... at least according to Twitter this weekend, I've heard.

Kara Swisher 56:46 [laughs] Both of us are impeachable, but go ahead.

Scott Galloway 56:47 Uh, but my point is, find somebody-- There are so many people who have incredible integrity, character, understand sponsorships, understand business, who absolutely adore this game and would take this job for a dollar and bring real-- and say, "Okay, what's the job, not only of the tournament, but how do we get more young people playing sports? How do we, uh, raise the vili- visibility of emerging nations? How do we bring people together in between the World Cups and make nations feel better about one another? How do we just have-- How do I just write, in my final act, a love letter to the sport?" Instead, we have these corrupt individuals that see it as a corpus for their own enrichment.

Kara Swisher 57:32 Yeah. He should just leave and go hang out with rich people. That's my fam.

Scott Galloway 57:35 I am really pleased that the public, in their love of the game, just threw up all over this guy and his idea to get the Kushners to finance taking it private and trying to figure out a way to monetize what is, what is the UN that's actually working, and that is football. It's actually bringing people together.

Kara Swisher 57:54 You're right. This was a great prediction. So is he out out? Do you think he's out? You did say you thought he wouldn't last, huh?

Scott Galloway 57:59 These governing bodies are so... They have-- Like, what court oversees it? And so it's, it's difficult. And in addition, these guys, these guys grease everybody and pay them off. They have friends everywhere because they, they give money in the form of, quote-unquote, "development revenues" to... I mean, they have-- They're not dumb. They, they've, they've greased a lot of palms. They're a mob family.

Kara Swisher 58:24 I think your first prediction is correct. I think he's out.

Scott Galloway 58:27 Oh, really? I'll, I'll-- I hope so. Again, it's the same problem we have with Trump. We need ideas and a vision for, for FIFA, not just shitposting the incumbent.

Kara Swisher 58:37 Yep, that's a fair point, that we need ideas.

Scott Galloway 58:38 And let's find, let's find someone unimpeachable who would raise their hand and say, "You know what? I, I would, I would like to do this." Like-

Kara Swisher 58:46 Cuban?

Scott Galloway 58:47 I think he'd be great. I think-- I've, I've always been a fan of Tony Blair. Peop-- He evokes a, a gag reflex in people.

Kara Swisher 58:54 Mm, he's got a lot hanging on him. Cuban.

Scott Galloway 58:55 Yeah, fair enough.

Kara Swisher 58:56 All right.

Scott Galloway 58:56 But there's gotta be somebody out there that people just have a ton of goodwill around-

Kara Swisher 59:00 The Pope

Scott Galloway 59:00 ... who loves the game and says, "What I'm gonna bring to the game is the following. I'm gonna bring goodwill and unimpeachable integrity. I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be fucking Mormon. I'm gonna be literally..." I'm thinking about Mitt Romney again. "I, I, I may get it wrong, but I will never deceive you or enrich myself."

Kara Swisher 59:19 I still take Scott Galloway anyway.

Scott Galloway 59:21 Well, I appreciate that.

Kara Swisher 59:22 Scott, that's a really good one. Do you have any others?

Scott Galloway 59:23 I don't, I don't know enough about the game. Um-

Kara Swisher 59:25 Can I, can I ask you one question?

Scott Galloway 59:26 Sure.

Kara Swisher 59:27 I'm being prompted. Are you seeing all the w-- I'm so sad you said not a word about it, but Wicker, all the, uh, the, the, the, the story of, uh, the basket that fucks a woman. Have you noticed this going all over the internet? I'm surprised you haven't, 'cause there was all these penis jokes about Wicker.

Scott Galloway 59:42 Jesus Christ, I feel so out of it.

Kara Swisher 59:44 Oh my God.

Scott Galloway 59:44 I, I didn't find out that, that, that failed mayoral candidates were shitposting me until you forwarded. When, when I-- I'm, I'm not exaggerating. When I go into August, I try to put my phone away. I try not to go on social media. I try not to read the news. 'Cause I find by the time I get to August, I'm a nervous wreck.

Kara Swisher 1:00:01 All right. When you come back, I want Wicker jokes. And there's one that say, "I wonder if J.D. Vance is gonna see Wicker." Um, uh, it, it-- there's a lot of very funny, funny jokes. The Wicker trailers, uh, called, uh, someone called the Wicker trailer Pornocchio, and all I can say is I guarantee you that was the original name of the script and film. Anyway, it looks great.

Scott Galloway 1:00:21 I didn't see that. Yeah, I haven't seen that. I did see The Odyssey, though. Um-

Kara Swisher 1:00:23 Yeah, and?

Scott Galloway 1:00:25 In a word?

Kara Swisher 1:00:26 Mm-hmm.

Scott Galloway 1:00:27 Epic.

Kara Swisher 1:00:28 Epic.

Scott Galloway 1:00:28 Absolutely epic.

Kara Swisher 1:00:29 Mm.

Scott Galloway 1:00:30 And I, I just-- The thing that really struck me about it was, I think it could have been-- I really respect filmmakers and directors and studios that greenlight something that has so much downside risk, 'cause it's like a scene with a Cyclops. It could have so easily been cheesy CGI, and you believe there's a Cyclops

Kara Swisher 1:00:54 You do, yeah. It's really well done

Scott Galloway 1:00:56 In every scene that you'd heard about, there was just a certain grit and rawness. I thought the performances were outstanding across the board. I wanna go to an island where I get high and fuck a hot model and forget how to get home. I'm like, what a shocker. I love like, "I've forgotten how to get home, so I have to hang out with Charlie 燕 Charonne and get high every day, but I've forgotten how to get back to my wife" [laughs] I mean

Kara Swisher 1:01:18 You'd, you'd still be on that island

Scott Galloway 1:01:20 Oh my God

Kara Swisher 1:01:21 You would never come home

Scott Galloway 1:01:22 Where is that island?

Kara Swisher 1:01:22 You would be like

Scott Galloway 1:01:23 Charlize, I'm coming.

Kara Swisher 1:01:24 Yeah, yeah. Okay.

Scott Galloway 1:01:26 I... [laughs]

Kara Swisher 1:01:26 So you loved it

Scott Galloway 1:01:26 That was fucking hilarious

Kara Swisher 1:01:27 Good. Well, good

Scott Galloway 1:01:27 The guy, he's literally do- in Ibiza doing X, fucking the hottest woman, and he's forgotten how to get home to Liverpool and his life. Yeah. Anyways, ugh.

Kara Swisher 1:01:38 Very nice.

Scott Galloway 1:01:38 Uh.

Kara Swisher 1:01:39 Very nice. I'm glad you liked it

Scott Galloway 1:01:40 I'll, I'll move on. My

Kara Swisher 1:01:41 All right. We have to move on

Scott Galloway 1:01:42 My win

Kara Swisher 1:01:43 Yeah

Scott Galloway 1:01:43 My win

Kara Swisher 1:01:43 Yeah

Scott Galloway 1:01:44 Uh, the outstanding, uh, journalism and forceful, yet dignified, uh, performance this weekend of Dana Bash, uh, Margaret Brennan, and last week, uh, uh, Kaitlan Collins. I just think these, I think these individuals define the term professional.

Kara Swisher 1:02:03 Yep.

Scott Galloway 1:02:03 I was-

Kara Swisher 1:02:03 And Kaitlan will be here to replace you.

Scott Galloway 1:02:06 There you go. That's, talk about an upgrade.

Kara Swisher 1:02:08 Mm-hmm.

Scott Galloway 1:02:08 But I, I, s- the clips I saw this weekend, I used to watch Meet the Press and Face the Nation, the whole show. Now I'm part of the Pepsi generation, and I just watch the clips. I thought, I admire that they are so calm and just right on the spot, push back thoughtfully. You actually do this quite well.

Kara Swisher 1:02:27 Thank you.

Scott Galloway 1:02:27 And, uh, Jess Tarlov does this quite well.

Kara Swisher 1:02:30 Yeah, she does.

Scott Galloway 1:02:31 But I was so impressed

Kara Swisher 1:02:32 What do, what do we all have in common, Scott? Just

Scott Galloway 1:02:35 Well, the future is female, Kara.

Kara Swisher 1:02:37 [laughs]

Scott Galloway 1:02:37 The future is female.

Kara Swisher 1:02:38 I needed you to say that before you left.

Scott Galloway 1:02:40 The future is female. No, we're-

Kara Swisher 1:02:42 Yeah

Scott Galloway 1:02:42 Yeah, no, we're, we're totally-

Kara Swisher 1:02:43 That's a good win. That's a perfect-

Scott Galloway 1:02:44 We're replaceable

Kara Swisher 1:02:45 ... win.

Scott Galloway 1:02:45 We're just here, we're just here to build data centers, and then-

Kara Swisher 1:02:48 Data

Scott Galloway 1:02:48 ... we're totally, then we have no use.

Kara Swisher 1:02:50 No use.

Scott Galloway 1:02:50 Um.

Kara Swisher 1:02:50 No use. Although lesbian mechanics can do it, anyway, and construction workers. Anyway.

Scott Galloway 1:02:55 That's my, anyways, my, my-

Kara Swisher 1:02:57 Yeah

Scott Galloway 1:02:57 ... win is, my wins, multiple wins, are throwing up on, uh, Gianni Infantino and his ridiculous pr- uh, monetization of the world's, you know, the, the beautiful game. I thought The Odyssey was spectacular, and I went into it with high expectations 'cause Christopher Nolan is my favorite director.

Kara Swisher 1:03:17 There you go. Oh my goodness, as you say, there you go. Scott-

Scott Galloway 1:03:21 There you go

Kara Swisher 1:03:21 ... anyway, I'm glad you liked it. Very positive. Anyway, we wanna hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question for the show, or call 855-51-PIVOT. And elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe this week, in On with Kara Swisher, I'm speaking with Rosie O'Donnell. She's staging her one-woman show in New York right now, and then she's headed to LA to guest host Jimmy Kimmel later this month. Let's listen to her explain how she plans to deal with Trump.

Speaker 1:03:47 I plan on doing what Jimmy Kimmel has done so beautifully-

Kara Swisher 1:03:51 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:03:51 ... which is giving it to him in a comedic-

Kara Swisher 1:03:54 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:03:54 ... honest, truthful way.

Kara Swisher 1:03:56 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:03:56 And I will do that as, as big as I can. Now, the song that I sang in my show-

Kara Swisher 1:04:01 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:04:01 ... "If He Only Had a Brain"-

Kara Swisher 1:04:02 Yeah

Speaker 1:04:03 ... I wanted to do that on Kimmel, but they just told me I can't.

Kara Swisher 1:04:06 Oh.

Speaker 1:04:06 That they couldn't get permission for the parody because it's political content, and I was like, "Well, that is absurd to me-"

Kara Swisher 1:04:14 What?

Speaker 1:04:14 "... because we used to do parodies every day on my show"

Kara Swisher 1:04:17 Right. Wait, I don't understand.

Speaker 1:04:18 Well, I've been told I'm not allowed to do that. Now, I don't know. It's not Jimmy.

Kara Swisher 1:04:22 Would you like to sing a bit of it here?

Speaker 1:04:23 Yes.

Kara Swisher 1:04:23 Go ahead.

Speaker 1:04:23 "His approval rate is 30. His diaper's always dirty. I think the guy's insane. Da, da, da, da, da, da"

Kara Swisher 1:04:32 [laughs] That was a good... Oh, just a beautiful skill.

Scott Galloway 1:04:34 Look at you. You're so happy.

Kara Swisher 1:04:35 She's, it was really good. Go watch her show. It's terrific. Um, and Scott, as I said, this is our last show together before Scott-free August gets underway, the saddest time of the year for me, obviously.

Scott Galloway 1:04:46 Yeah, it's tough. I know. It's tough.

Kara Swisher 1:04:48 People might be wondering about your whereabouts over the next month, so we're getting ahead of things by releasing a proof-of-life photo right now. It's you.

Scott Galloway 1:04:54 Oh my gosh.

Kara Swisher 1:04:55 [laughs] I am Elaine Chao.

Scott Galloway 1:04:57 That's hilarious.

Kara Swisher 1:04:57 And you are, of course, our friend and the late-

Scott Galloway 1:05:01 I love those

Kara Swisher 1:05:01 ... Mitch McConnell, the late, possibly late Mitch McConnell.

Scott Galloway 1:05:04 My, I mean-

Kara Swisher 1:05:04 There's a lot of good... We shouldn't laugh about this

Scott Galloway 1:05:06 ... social media does have its redeeming qualities.

Kara Swisher 1:05:08 We love social. We shouldn't laugh, but, and yet we will. Okay. That is the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot. Make sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. I'll be back on Friday with special guest co-host Hillary Clinton. Scott, enjoy your time away. I miss you every year, and please call me whenever you need to, and just pop in. Just, just text me at all, and I, I'm excited for you to return.

Scott Galloway 1:05:30 I need you to keep me informed, informed on how much people hate me across social, social media.

Kara Swisher 1:05:34 No, I know. That Spencer Pratt thing was ridiculous, and so, you know, everyone on Twitter, go fuck yourselves. Scott, Scott rocks.

Scott Galloway 1:05:42 Everyone. Everyone on Twitter. There you go. All right. All right, enough of that. [outro music]