The AI Spending Boom is Propping Up Wall Street — and Trump | Pivot

1. 0:00 – 7:33

   Intro

   1. SGScott Galloway0:00

      ... what I see is effectively America right now is a giant bet on AI. Uh, le- let me just get political here. If the S&P had been down 23% instead of up 23%, there's no fucking way, in my view, Trump would have the cloud cover to send troops into Portland.

   2. KSKara Swisher0:19

      (instrumental music) Hi, everyone. This is Pivot from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. I'm Kara Swisher.

   3. SGScott Galloway0:31

      And I'm Scott Galloway.

   4. KSKara Swisher0:32

      Scott, guess what I'm doing tonight?

   5. SGScott Galloway0:35

      I know what you're doing. You're interviewing Kamala Harris.

   6. KSKara Swisher0:37

      Yeah. What do you think?

   7. SGScott Galloway0:38

      What do you- what do you think she's gonna do next?

   8. KSKara Swisher0:40

      I don't know. I'll be honest with you. I- I think she wants to run for president. That's my impression.

   9. SGScott Galloway0:45

      She's still young.

   10. KSKara Swisher0:46

       She's- yeah. She is the best known one, right? Like, no matter how you slice it, she's got the most name recognition and a lot of men have failed and tried again, right? George Bush comes to mind. Lots of people do. Um, John McCain tried a number of times. So there's no reason she shouldn't necessarily.

   11. SGScott Galloway1:05

       Yeah, no. There's no reason other than she'd lose her third time and we wouldn't have a female president for 50 years-

   12. KSKara Swisher1:09

       (laughs)

   13. SGScott Galloway1:09

       ... on the Democratic side.

   14. KSKara Swisher1:10

       Okay. (laughs)

   15. SGScott Galloway1:10

       But other than that, she should have Iowa.

   16. KSKara Swisher1:12

       I'm just saying, she's just-

   17. SGScott Galloway1:13

       And that she-

   18. KSKara Swisher1:14

       ... others have-

   19. SGScott Galloway1:14

       And that she bright- and that she brightens up a room by leaving it-

   20. KSKara Swisher1:16

       Let's- let's remove her gender for-

   21. SGScott Galloway1:16

       ... and her total political victories have been not making it to Iowa.

   22. KSKara Swisher1:19

       Okay. That said, that was s- George Bush like tried it 83 times like, and that was okay, and then he got to be president. I'm just saying like, she was a senator, she was the AG, she was the A- she's-

   23. SGScott Galloway1:29

       Yep.

   24. KSKara Swisher1:30

       ... she's had a lot of big jobs.

   25. SGScott Galloway1:32

       I don't know. I- I- uh, oh God. I- th- as somebody... I- I- y- you know my view on this.

   26. KSKara Swisher1:37

       Yeah.

   27. SGScott Galloway1:38

       I'm incredibly looksist.

   28. KSKara Swisher1:39

       Mm-hmm.

   29. SGScott Galloway1:39

       The only thing I know is the Democrats are gonna nominate a white heterosexual male over six feet tall.

   30. KSKara Swisher1:44

       Okay.
2. 7:33 – 15:28

   Tesla’s Cheaper Cars

   1. KSKara Swisher7:33

      first, Tesla had people buzzing about an exciting reveal this week, possibly the Roadster that Elon has been teasing for years. But instead, the company, uh-uh, rolled out a cheaper version of the Model 3 and Model Y. The new cars run about $5,000 less than the current models, with simpler exterior, interiors, and fewer luxury features like that cool light on the front. That's gone. The cheaper cars could offset some of the hit Tesla expected to take with the end of the EV tax credit, they're hoping. But investors seem to be unimpressed so far. Tesla stock fell 4% after the announcement. Um, talk a little bit, Scott, about these cheaper cars, because, uh, you know, I, I... A lot of the things I saw online were like, "This is, this is just a shittier car," and it wasn't, it wasn't very exciting. And cars are about being excited about the cars, right? Or maybe not. I don't know.

   2. SGScott Galloway8:21

      The way to summarize it is less for more.

   3. KSKara Swisher8:23

      (laughs)

   4. SGScott Galloway8:24

      With the, the end of the tax credit, they couldn't compensate for the end of the tax credit in terms of a, uh, uh, you know, a value of product-to-cost ratio. They're, they're... The new cars are about $40,000 and $37,000 respectively, are the Model Y and the standard Model 3 or the Model 3 Standard. They're more expensive than the Model Y Premium and Model 3 Premium it cost just last month because the tax credit expired. And also, these cars are a sign- significant downgrade. Essentially, Tesla customers are paying more for less. This is... And when you compare that against... I mean, the, the, the market is, as it has... If, if you wanna understand what's happening to Tesla, watch the movie Tucker. There used to be, like, 50 or 60 automobile companies.

   5. KSKara Swisher9:09

      There were.

   6. SGScott Galloway9:10

      And it's consolidating. Unfortunately, it's consolidating not around American giants. It's consolidating around Chinese giants. Uh, the costs are coming down, and Tesla can't keep up and doesn't have the scale. GM, Nissan, and Hyundai all offer EV models that are cheaper than Tesla's most inexpensive vehicle, and-

   7. KSKara Swisher9:27

      And good-looking.

   8. SGScott Galloway9:28

      ... and in China, the BYD Seagull is now under $8,000-

   9. KSKara Swisher9:32

      Yeah.

   10. SGScott Galloway9:32

       ... and even if, even if we, you know, ring fence our econ- our, our market, you know, i- i- China's had, the Chi- the CCP has had to send a letter to Chinese EV manufacturers and say, "Please raise prices," because a lot of these EV companies are seen as national champions for the local jurisdiction.

   11. KSKara Swisher9:51

       Mm-hmm.

   12. SGScott Galloway9:51

       And they're being subsidized. But an $8,000 EV? So the amount of pressure here... So what you have is... I mean, I don't know if you saw, but he came up with this that they're, they're kind of shelving their robot plans, which was their latest attempt to distract people from the fact-

   13. KSKara Swisher10:08

       Yeah.

   14. SGScott Galloway10:08

       ... this is an automobile company, not a-

   15. KSKara Swisher10:10

       Mm-hmm.

   16. SGScott Galloway10:10

       ... not a SaaS or a-

   17. KSKara Swisher10:11

       Yeah.

   18. SGScott Galloway10:12

       ... AI company.

   19. KSKara Swisher10:13

       Yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway10:13

       But the death spiral here continues. Uh, Tesla's market share in the US dropped to its lowest level since 2017.

   21. KSKara Swisher10:19

       Yeah, but that stock keeps flying, right? Now, was there-

   22. SGScott Galloway10:21

       It's a meme stock.

   23. KSKara Swisher10:22

       I, I get, I get that.

   24. SGScott Galloway10:23

       I can't, I can't explain it, don't understand it.

   25. KSKara Swisher10:23

       But how long does that continue when there are really-

   26. SGScott Galloway10:26

       I, I have been-

   27. KSKara Swisher10:26

       ... such obvious results here?

   28. SGScott Galloway10:28

       I have been wrong about Tesla for a long time, but all I can report is Tesla sales were down 43% year-over-year-

   29. KSKara Swisher10:34

       Yeah.

   30. SGScott Galloway10:34

       ... in the EU, and they're down 6.3% year-to-date, year-to-date in China. And although September was a record-setting month for EV sales in the US because people were trying to get the tax credit-
3. 15:28 – 27:38

   AI’s Circular Deals

   1. KSKara Swisher15:28

      has now signed about $1 trillion in deals this year for computing power, partnering with NVIDIA, Oracle, and others. This week's massive deal with AMD sent the chip maker's stock soaring by more than 40%. A crazy, a crazy amount of money. Uh, au- uh, OpenAI's cash burn is probably an estimated $115 billion through 2029. And the latest valuation puts at 500 billion, making it the world's most valuable private company. We know that. Analysts are sounding the alarm about these circular deals. As we talked about previously, it feels, it feels very AOL Purchase Pro circa, you know, the last century. The small network of companies pouring money in each other's coffers, fueling an AI bubble. Um, they're all waiting to make money, you know? They're all desperate to make money to, to, to back this up. Now, NVIDIA is also investing in xAI's latest funding round. They're all sort of propping each other up with the same $5, essentially. So talk a little bit about this so people can understand. There's all, there was, there's been some great stories showing all the interconnections, you know, especially charts, and it's really quite, it's really quite something. It's like a s- You know, someone called me when I said it was a round tripping. They're like, "That's..." Someone at one of these companies said, "That's really rude." I said, "Do you, would you prefer I use circle jerk?" Uh, uh, and they were like, "No, stick with round tripping." (laughs) So anyway, there we have it, circle jerk. Your thoughts?

   2. SGScott Galloway16:50

      Well, if, what is it? Uh, well, let's just do the math. If NVIDIA invests 100 billion in OpenAI and with the, with the agreement that they're gonna turn around and buy and spend all of that $100 billion on NVIDIA chips, uh, okay, so that's, that's, uh, they're trading at $4 trillion. So it's approximately a 2.5% dilution of the stock price. So all else being equal, the stock price should go down 2.5%. That's the cost they're spending, two- they're taking 2.5% of their company or they're increasing their dilution by 2.5% for that $100 billion to invest in OpenAI. That money comes right back in the form of chip purchases. The average, the operating margin on, on the GPUs that NVIDIA sells is about 55 points. So that creates $55 billion in, um, incremental, incremental earnings or profits. The company trades at, um, the company trades at about a, uh, a, a P/E of about 33. So loosely speaking, that's about one point- that's about $1.8 trillion increase in market cap. So $1.8 trillion increase in market cap off of a $100 billion investment is a 1700% return. The problem is, so theoretically, it's a, it's a wildly accretive thing to do, but all you're doing is, I remember when we were doing this in the late '90s.

   3. KSKara Swisher18:21

      Yeah.

   4. SGScott Galloway18:21

      We were, we were buying software from all the other startups we worked with backed by the company's-... who had backed us-

   5. KSKara Swisher18:29

      That was the AOL-

   6. SGScott Galloway18:29

      ... who wanted this to go-

   7. KSKara Swisher18:30

      That was the AOL tap dance.

   8. SGScott Galloway18:31

      And then when things start... And then when the music stops-

   9. KSKara Swisher18:34

      Yeah.

   10. SGScott Galloway18:35

       ... it, it, it's not like the music stops and they take away one share. When the music stops and one share gets taken away, a dozen chairs (laughs) get taken away 'cause everything just accelerates downward. So these deals, uh, we've talked about it, these deals feel very late-stage bubble.

   11. KSKara Swisher18:53

       C- can I ask you... C- I saw Ken Griffin talking who is, seems like a grumpy fella. Um, but he was quite-

   12. SGScott Galloway18:59

       Smart guy.

   13. KSKara Swisher18:59

       ... smart guy. Like, that's what I'm saying. So but he was talking about gold, uh, um, and, you know, the price of gold. We're gonna talk about gold in a second. But he was discussing this. He's like, "This is a real problem, the frothiness around tech stocks and that they're holding up the whole things." And he and many others are predicting this sort of market cr- collapse. I think they're not even using-

   14. SGScott Galloway19:19

       Yeah.

   15. KSKara Swisher19:19

       ... downturn. They're like, "Collapse," kinda thing.

   16. SGScott Galloway19:22

       Yeah.

   17. KSKara Swisher19:22

       Uh, and sometimes I believe those things, but he had such a cogent argument about it. How, how do you look at that?

   18. SGScott Galloway19:28

       Well, (sighs) I, uh, I'll give you a, a thesis, and then I'll tell you what I'm doing as opposed to offering financial advice. Uh, first off, just some caveats. When the experts or the most knowledgeable people are all convinced about something happening, I forget the name of the effect, but it almost... It usually doesn't happen.

   19. KSKara Swisher19:43

       Ah-huh, yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway19:44

       Like, like, experts on average... When experts have consensus, it's usually wrong. And if you look at the arc of the growth of OpenAI, it's kinda mimicking what happened to Netscape, and it's at a point where it's still two years away from the bubble bursting. So like I said, the, uh, The Economist called the dot-com implosion perfectly, but they called it in 1997-

   21. KSKara Swisher20:06

       Mm-hmm.

   22. SGScott Galloway20:06

       ... before those stocks went up another 30 or 40%.

   23. KSKara Swisher20:09

       Mm-hmm.

   24. SGScott Galloway20:10

       So do we know they're gonna come down? Yeah. The hard part is figuring out when they're gonna come down and if they're gonna d- they're, if they're gonna scream to new highs. Now, what I see is effectively America right now is a giant bet on AI. Because 40%... Uh, let, let me just get political here.

   25. KSKara Swisher20:28

       Mm-hmm.

   26. SGScott Galloway20:29

       If the S&P had been down 23% instead of up 23%, there's no fucking way, in my view, Trump would have the cloud cover to send troops into Portland.

   27. KSKara Swisher20:40

       Mm-hmm.

   28. SGScott Galloway20:41

       If he was totally distracted with, "Okay, shithead, you get into office," and all of a sudden, the market goes down, loses a quarter of its value-

   29. KSKara Swisher20:49

       Mm-hmm.

   30. SGScott Galloway20:49

       ... he would be putting out fires and not have the cloud cover to start raiding Home Depots.
4. 27:38 – 35:58

   Gold Prices Rising

   1. KSKara Swisher27:38

      gold soared past $4,000 for the first time this week. Prices are up more than 50% since the beginning of the year. Uh, gold traditionally climbs during periods of uncertainty, and it's, uh, currently on track for its best year since 19, uh, 79. That's a long time ago. Uh, this late... What were you doing in 1979? How old was I? I was still in high school. This latest rally kicked off right as the government shutdown began. Um, but the gold, gold has been up and up since Trump announced his Liberation Day tariffs back in April, obviously. Are you going for the gold, Scott? Are you wearing a gold, uh, belt right now, like in, uh, Billions where you have a little gold, little gold doubloons, et cetera? Ray Dalio said this week that people should allocate as much as 15% of their portfolios to gold. Thoughts? Thoughts about gold? Gold at best?

   2. SGScott Galloway28:23

      The first crush, the first crush I ever had-

   3. KSKara Swisher28:25

      Yeah.

   4. SGScott Galloway28:25

      ... and the first woman I ever remember registering as pretty was a woman named Carson Evans. And her and her husband, Charlie, who owned a printing company, were, were the first people I ever observed who were rich. They used to have big parties where people would drink, and they lived up in the hills, and they'd hire these bands. And I thought, "These people are so cool." And Carson was just beautiful. And her husband, Charlie, I was gonna go to work for his company after high school 'cause I didn't think I was gonna go to college, and really good man, my godfather, and his company went out of business, uh, very depressed. She told him he was leaving him, and, um, he went into his room and killed... or went in the garage-

   5. KSKara Swisher29:02

      (laughs)

   6. SGScott Galloway29:02

      ... and killed himself. Anyways, that's not the moral of the story.

   7. KSKara Swisher29:04

      (laughs) Okay, thanks, Scott.

   8. SGScott Galloway29:05

      She was a very... She was... I'm gonna come back to gold.

   9. KSKara Swisher29:08

      Okay.

   10. SGScott Galloway29:09

       She was a very good friend of my mom, and when my mom was dying-

   11. KSKara Swisher29:11

       Mm-hmm.

   12. SGScott Galloway29:12

       ... uh, out of nowhere... She was, by this time, a raging alcoholic in her 70s, addicted to opiates 'cause of back pain-

   13. KSKara Swisher29:17

       Is this gonna get better? Okay. All right. (laughs)

   14. SGScott Galloway29:19

       It ends on a funny note.

   15. KSKara Swisher29:20

       (laughs)

   16. SGScott Galloway29:21

       Uh, she'd become addicted to opiates and Johnny Walker Black (laughs) because of the back pain she has from failed surgeries.

   17. KSKara Swisher29:26

       Oh.

   18. SGScott Galloway29:26

       She showed up. She called me and said, "I'm gonna come take care of your mom." I'm like, "We're fine." I didn't want an alcoholic there. A canary yellow Corvette shows up with a dog and 12 bottles of, of-

   19. KSKara Swisher29:37

       (laughs)

   20. SGScott Galloway29:37

       ... Johnny Walker. And she's like, "I'm here." And every night she would make Hot Pockets for us and keep my mom company.

   21. KSKara Swisher29:44

       Oh, my God.

   22. SGScott Galloway29:44

       And anyways, so my mom, my mom passes. Carson goes back to San Diego.

   23. KSKara Swisher29:49

       Yeah.

   24. SGScott Galloway29:50

       Uh, Carson dies four years later.

   25. KSKara Swisher29:52

       Okay.

   26. SGScott Galloway29:52

       And I got a call-

   27. KSKara Swisher29:53

       Yeah.

   28. SGScott Galloway29:53

       ... from, uh, a lawyer in San Diego saying, "You're the sole beneficiary of Carson Evans."

   29. KSKara Swisher29:57

       What?

   30. SGScott Galloway29:58

       Yeah.
5. 35:58 – 43:58

   Apple’s Succession Plans

   1. KSKara Swisher35:58

      Uh, Tim Cook may step down as Apple's CEO in the near future, and clear front runner for his replacement is emerging hardware engineering chief John Ternus. Ternus has already been in the Apple spotlight unveiling new Macs and iPads in the past. He's 50 years old, really interesting guy. Uh, the same age as Cook was when he took the role and has a strong technology background as opposed to operations or sales. There was a other, there was, uh, what's his name? The guy who left, just recently left, uh, was thought to be the CEO, uh, person, but he's left. I think it's Jeff Williams was supposed to be the CEO, but now it looks like this guy. Um, talk about the, the shifting o- over this. I think they'll probably do a very smooth transition at Apple. I don't think it'll be sort of ugly like many, many others like Disney or whatever. Not ugly, but just slow or confusing as many companies when they do these transitions. I suspect they'll, they'll, um-... they'll do it pretty smoothly. The, the, the thing that I'm sort of shocked by is that Cook has been so acquiescent to Trump if he's leaving. Like, what does he have to lose to have some dignity? But go ahead.

   2. SGScott Galloway37:00

      Well, (sighs) Apple is arguably... I mean, if you kind of just consistently for the last 20 or 30 years has been the best run-

   3. KSKara Swisher37:08

      Yes.

   4. SGScott Galloway37:08

      ... you know, best run company in the world.

   5. KSKara Swisher37:10

      And kudos to Cook, by the way. Everyone thought it was gonna fall apart when Jobs died, and he's made it bigger and better and stronger.

   6. SGScott Galloway37:16

      It was $300 billion-

   7. KSKara Swisher37:17

      Yeah.

   8. SGScott Galloway37:17

      ... when he took over, and now it's 3 1/2 trillion.

   9. KSKara Swisher37:19

      Yeah.

   10. SGScott Galloway37:19

       And, uh, look, there's a real le- The biggest lesson people can take away from Apple, specifically, right now, and it's a really important lesson that our elected leaders and Bob Iger need to learn, fucking leave.

   11. KSKara Swisher37:34

       (laughs)

   12. SGScott Galloway37:34

       Leave.

   13. KSKara Swisher37:36

       (laughs)

   14. SGScott Galloway37:36

       You are too fucking old.

   15. KSKara Swisher37:38

       (laughs)

   16. SGScott Galloway37:38

       Leave. Two-thirds of Congress will be dead in 25 years-

   17. KSKara Swisher37:42

       Maybe.

   18. SGScott Galloway37:42

       ... 'cause they're so fucking old. You really think they're worried about debt or climate change? You really think a 74-year-old Bob Iger can read the room right now? Leave. Tim Cook added more shareholder value than any individual in history, with the exemp- exception of Jensen Huang. He's 64, and you know what he's doing? He's realizing it's probably time for someone else.

   19. KSKara Swisher38:05

       Yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway38:05

       And if you were to... And I know I say this a lot, but if you were to reverse engineer the world's biggest problems-

   21. KSKara Swisher38:11

       Mm-hmm.

   22. SGScott Galloway38:11

       ... they reverse engineer to some dude who won't fucking leave.

   23. KSKara Swisher38:14

       Yeah, yeah.

   24. SGScott Galloway38:16

       (sighs) Some guy who won't get out of the way.

   25. KSKara Swisher38:18

       Cook does not strike me as that person. I have to-

   26. SGScott Galloway38:20

       That's my point.

   27. KSKara Swisher38:21

       Yeah, yeah.

   28. SGScott Galloway38:21

       Kudos to him.

   29. KSKara Swisher38:22

       Yeah, yeah.

   30. SGScott Galloway38:23

       Kudos to him.
6. 43:58 – 47:30

   Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac IPO

   1. KSKara Swisher43:58

      more news. Major banks are schmoozing with the Trump administration for a role, of course they are, for a role, as you noted last week at How Do You Work with the White House, for a role of the IPO of the Fannie Ma- Fa- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. CEOs of the country's six largest banks have made visits to the White House in an attempt to become the favorite. All six banks are expected to play a part, but all are pushing to have the two lead roles. The administration is looking for an IPO combined value of $500 billion, raising roughly $30 billion, which could make it the largest IPO offering in history. What is, what is... This is like another big payoff, this time for the banks versus tech companies, correct?

   2. SGScott Galloway44:32

      Yeah. It's, it's the reason why Jamie Dimon, who I think is a leader, or, or, or, um, David Solomon, who I also think is a great CEO, um, are less inclined to speak their mind and say, "The Fed needs to be independent," although they have said that, or, "These tariffs make no fucking sense," because they're all hoping to get a part of that underwriting, underwriter's fee for this. Uh, first off, this shouldn't happen. Uh, anything like this where the government has input, which it probably shouldn't, he should recuse himself from the decision and have a panel of thoughtful, smart people who say, "Who... What is the best syndicate?" And the reality is, the syndicate for s- an offering like this should be just everyone, because they want to get as much distribution as possible, and then competitively bid it out to try and get the lowest fees possible. But instead, like TikTok and everything else, he's gonna decide who are his political allies, and who will say things and show up to the White House, and, "Jamie, will you say nice things about me?" Because if these guys come out and actually say, "I don't know, I'm worried about stagflation, and these policies don't make any sense."

   3. KSKara Swisher45:37

      Which Dimon has been doing, compared to others, more, more so.

   4. SGScott Galloway45:41

      I think Jamie, I think Jamie, to his credit, has been a leader on this. And, and also I think Jamie right now, he has a lot of power, and he's also very powerful. In addition, the banks are rocketing right now because of this M&A Lollapalooza, 'cause of a lack of FDC oversight on these incredible-

   5. KSKara Swisher45:57

      Do you have any insight of who's gonna get the two, the two lead roles?

   6. SGScott Galloway46:01

      Oh, it'll be, it'll be the big guys. It'll be JP Morgan, Goldman, it'll be everybody.

   7. KSKara Swisher46:06

      Right.

   8. SGScott Galloway46:07

      I don't know-

   9. KSKara Swisher46:07

      Right, right, they're all gonna be in it.

   10. SGScott Galloway46:07

       ... who the bookrunner will be.

   11. KSKara Swisher46:08

       But there's two, there's two lead roles.

   12. SGScott Galloway46:10

       I gotta think it's gonna ... I, uh-

   13. KSKara Swisher46:12

       It's gotta be Dimon.

   14. SGScott Galloway46:12

       It's, it's-

   15. KSKara Swisher46:12

       He's not stupid.

   16. SGScott Galloway46:13

       It's two of three. It's... The two... I don't know who the two are. I know who among... It'll either be JP Morgan, Goldman, or Morgan Stanley, because, because, uh, Trump is very brand-sensitive, and the... Also, these companies have the largest networks and probably the best research, and they're probably the most capable. But this will end up being a syndicate for everyone, because it'll be such a massive offering.

   17. KSKara Swisher46:36

       Yeah, it will. Yeah.

   18. SGScott Galloway46:36

       But the whole thing... The president shouldn't be influencing-

   19. KSKara Swisher46:39

       No.

   20. SGScott Galloway46:39

       ... these decisions-

   21. KSKara Swisher46:40

       No.

   22. SGScott Galloway46:41

       ... because it creates an unfair market-

   23. KSKara Swisher46:43

       Mm-hmm.

   24. SGScott Galloway46:43

       ... and it creates an ecosystem that, that withers away and erodes democracy.

   25. KSKara Swisher46:46

       Yes, smells like TikTok. Smells like TikTok. Have you got the piece yet, Scott?

   26. SGScott Galloway46:49

       Well, it stops people... Uh, uh, there's a downside to ano- The downside to autocracy is you punish your enemies. The flip side is, and just as important to autocracy, is over-rewarding your allies.

   27. KSKara Swisher47:02

       Yeah.

   28. SGScott Galloway47:03

       And the problem is, if you're not in the president's ear every day, you're just a small or a medium-sized business which is responsible for two-thirds of the job creation-

   29. KSKara Swisher47:10

       Yeah.

   30. SGScott Galloway47:11

       ... those companies suffer and the economy suffers. So you're not supposed to... The president shouldn't be... The president, not even a cabinet-level decision should be involved in this. It should be, it should be an independent committee of really smart people that includes bankers but don't have a vested interest or own shares in these companies picking who the syndicate is.
7. 47:30 – 58:48

   National Guard in Chicago

   1. KSKara Swisher47:30

      Really briefly, 500 National Guard members are currently in Chicago despite a lawsuit challenging their deployment to the city. They're s- outside the city, apparently. President Trump has said several times a week that he would invoke the Insurrection Act if necessary. The federal law from 19 oh- uh, 1807 grants the president powers to deploy the military domestically and federalize national troops, but only in certain cases. Um, President Trump also took, uh, took to... I think it was used during the, the riots in LA l- last time, I believe. Um, President Trump also took to Truth Social this week to further attack the city, saying governor J.B. Pritzker, who you just had on, Scott, and Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson should be in jail for failing to protect ICE. Uh, 58% of Americans, including half of the Republicans, think armed troops should only be sent for external threats. Uh, what is ha- This just goes on, and then there's these photos from Portland where people dressed as, as frogs.

   2. SGScott Galloway48:18

      (laughs) That was hilarious.

   3. KSKara Swisher48:19

      I mean, it's like-

   4. SGScott Galloway48:20

      As dinosaurs.

   5. KSKara Swisher48:21

      Dinosaurs and frogs. It... Like-

   6. SGScott Galloway48:22

      Yeah.

   7. KSKara Swisher48:23

      ... you know? It, it, it's crazy. And then you have, you know, uh, Kristi Noem doing cosplaying, like... Talk about Ice Barbie. Like, what is she doing? Like, what do you think about this? Nobody likes this. I, I... On any spectrum, it's sort of organically hateful from... for everybody, what's happening. I don't... Very briefly, from a marketing point of view, Scott, besides-

   8. SGScott Galloway48:44

      It's per-

   9. KSKara Swisher48:44

      ... the fantastic frog.

   10. SGScott Galloway48:47

       I mean, just a couple observations. Uh...I don't, I, I think we're gonna look back on this era, and we're, we're gonna be all, even those of, uh, uh, those of us who think we liked it, that we're, somehow we understand what's happening to us, we're gonna just be horrified when we realize how much mind control, profit-seeking people who aren't concerned with the well-being of our emotional and financial health, how much influence and how far they have taken us to really ugly places.

   11. KSKara Swisher49:13

       Right. We'll be embarrassed.

   12. SGScott Galloway49:14

       And when I go online-

   13. KSKara Swisher49:15

       We'll be embarrassed for ourselves.

   14. SGScott Galloway49:17

       ... and it is... And, and when I go online and I see all of these images around, these horrible images of what's happening in ICE raids, I feel so bad about America.

   15. KSKara Swisher49:26

       Yeah. You said that last week.

   16. SGScott Galloway49:27

       And the rest of the world looks at us and goes, "Wow." And also they say, "They're distracted, let's fly attack drones over-"

   17. KSKara Swisher49:34

       Yeah.

   18. SGScott Galloway49:34

       "... over Estonia."

   19. KSKara Swisher49:35

       Yeah.

   20. SGScott Galloway49:35

       And it's bad for the brand. It takes our eyes off of real problems. It makes, it f- it's really dividing America. I mean, it's like liberal cities, you know, versus the federal government. And not only that, it's incredibly fraught with risk. What happens-

   21. KSKara Swisher49:51

       Someone's gonna die.

   22. SGScott Galloway49:51

       ... if someone loses it and starts firing on these troops?

   23. KSKara Swisher49:54

       Yeah, they are. Or opposite, the troops start firing on them.

   24. SGScott Galloway49:57

       Or the troops start firing. It's just-

   25. KSKara Swisher49:59

       That's the more likely situation.

   26. SGScott Galloway50:00

       It, it's just not, it, uh, and also it totally feeds into the juice, the mojo, the creatine of fascism, and that is that the enemy is within.

   27. KSKara Swisher50:08

       See, Scott, I don't think everybody... It doesn't divide us. It's the Trump administration doing this. I don't, I have not run into anyone who, who, including conservatives, who thinks it's a good thing. Like, m- nobody, nobody, except for the occasional Fox person who's like, "Cities are crazy war grounds," which are so ridiculous. Um, people who've never been to cities. So I just, I, I think polling shows that most people do, m- l- largely do not like this. Everybody.

   28. SGScott Galloway50:34

       I think there's actually, Kara, I think there's an uncomfortable number of people who are angry and have been convinced by Fox and Trump that these, these immigrants are disproportionately criminal and that they've hurt their economic well-being.

   29. KSKara Swisher50:50

       It's true. 100%.

   30. SGScott Galloway50:50

       And that these democratic, these cities are so poorly run by virtue-signaling, uh, democrats that they're, they don't like it but they're willing to tolerate it.
8. 58:48 – 1:07:31

   Predictions

   1. KSKara Swisher58:48

      Okay, Scott, we're gonna do predictions slightly differently. You and I are gonna do guesses and see who's right on two predictions, okay? So-

   2. SGScott Galloway58:54

      Okay.

   3. KSKara Swisher58:54

      And you can make another prediction if you want.

   4. SGScott Galloway58:56

      I don't know if we've done that.

   5. KSKara Swisher58:56

      But Nobel Peace Prize, we're recording this ahead of the Nobel Peace Prize announcement which is tomorrow, I, or today or later today. Trump has been so thirsty for this prize, um, the committee reportedly made their decision about this year's award on Monday, so before the Gaza deal was announced. I think Navalny's, uh, uh, what's her name, um-

   6. SGScott Galloway59:15

      Spouse.

   7. KSKara Swisher59:15

      ... spouse is going to get the Nobel Prize, and in his name, both of them, right? I think he's gonna get it. I think it's gonna be, she's gonna accept it on his behalf. That's what I think. Your thoughts?

   8. SGScott Galloway59:27

      Um, I like that one. I'm not, I'm gonna go with other. I think it's been so politicized. Um, I think they're gonna (sighs) I think they're gonna pick an organization like the, uh, I don't know, Sudan's Emergency Response Rooms.

   9. KSKara Swisher59:50

      Yeah, that's a top in poly market, yeah, that's the top one.

   10. SGScott Galloway59:53

       Um, I, because I think this whole thing's been so politicized that I think they want to avoid it and they're gonna pick something that's gonna be hard to criticize that's not an individual.

   11. KSKara Swisher1:00:01

       Oh, okay. All right.

   12. SGScott Galloway1:00:02

       So like, something like the International Criminal Court, the ICC.

   13. KSKara Swisher1:00:05

       Yeah, maybe. Well, they'll-

   14. SGScott Galloway1:00:06

       'Cause if I'm on the, if I'm on the fucking committee, I just, there's, it's so charged, it's so ugly.

   15. KSKara Swisher1:00:11

       Yeah, except look at, the pope is doubling down on politics, I think they will. I think they, they're like, "Fuck this guy." That's what I think.

   16. SGScott Galloway1:00:17

       Yeah.

   17. KSKara Swisher1:00:18

       And if he does the Gaza thing, next year. He can have it next year. If he does it and it sticks, he deserves it. Right? So.

   18. SGScott Galloway1:00:25

       You think Trump deserves it?

   19. KSKara Swisher1:00:26

       Uh, if he, if he gets in Gaza, if he ends the conflict in Ukraine and Gaza, yes. Yes. I, I can't stand him but if he, if he is the critical person-

   20. SGScott Galloway1:00:36

       Oh, I think you're giving him way too much credit.

   21. KSKara Swisher1:00:37

       Well, I-

   22. SGScott Galloway1:00:38

       I think if we'd had a better president, both of those conf- I think we would've had-

   23. KSKara Swisher1:00:41

       Fair, fair.

   24. SGScott Galloway1:00:41

       ... a peacekeeping force already and I think-

   25. KSKara Swisher1:00:41

       Oh, that he caused the problem. Okay, all right, I'm just saying.

   26. SGScott Galloway1:00:43

       ... we would have tomahawk missiles destroying the oil-

   27. KSKara Swisher1:00:45

       Yep.

   28. SGScott Galloway1:00:45

       ... infrastructure and they would've already come to the table.

   29. KSKara Swisher1:00:47

       Yep, you're right, you're right, you're right.

   30. GUGuest1:00:48

       ... but, you know, I'm biased. So you're going for the other and I'm going for the Navalny's? I'm going for a non-person- Okay. ... I'm betting on a non-person. I'm going for an organ- Okay. ... I'm betting on an organization- Okay. ... as opposed to a person. Smart. That's smart too but I'm gonna go for her 'cause I- I- Okay, good. ... I think he's a hero. Um, uh, the second is the government, uh, shutdown, the length of the government shutdown. Odds are currently at 62% for a shutdown going longer than 20 days, uh, but if these flight delays get worse, by the way, I had one yesterday when I was taking some flights from the Midwest. Um, do you predict it will end sooner or can people just hitch a ride on your plane, Scott? Uh, what- Um- Which, which, what do you think? Pick a number. How many days in are we, Kara? I don't know, like, a week and a half? Seven? Eight? Aren't I those things nine or ten days in? Eight? Nine? Um, I'll go... I'll take, I don't know, it's the over or the under. I'll go longer just because shit takes a while. I do think that they're gonna come... By the way, I thought Kaitlan Collins did a fantastic- Oh, amazing. ... interview with Representative Jordan. Yeah, amazing. I thought she was great. She's killing it. She's killing it. Great getting back- I wrote her a note about that question- ... getting back in the space. ... she asked about, uh, Ghislaine Maxwell. I thought she was great. Yeah, I thought, I thought she was great with Representative Jordan. I think that they, and again, I- I'm in my filter bubble so I see the stuff that the algorithms think I want to see. I think the Republicans are going to come up with something that gives the Democrats the ability to, to, to say, to claim victory here. Okay, do you see- Because- ... Marjorie Taylor Greene going all Democrat? Well, okay this is... You wanna talk about a statement on our society? Yeah. What does it mean when Marjorie Taylor Greene is the sane one in the Republican Party right now? I know, right? She's very articulate about it. And she's also been very effective. She personalized it. She said, "My kids, the premium-" Right. "... for my kids is about to double." Yeah, yeah. I was like- So- ... "Who is this person who..." And to- "Who is she?" I- I've been, I've been openly critical of Leader Jeffries and, uh- Mm-hmm. ... Senate Minority Leader Schumer. They have been very- They've done a good job here. ... smart going after healthcare. They have, actually. Very smart, pointed- Did you see him go after Lawler, on... L- L- Lawler came and tried to, like, thirsty up the situation. Jeffries ............................ That was his best social media post yet. You posted it. Yeah, that was Schumer. That was Schumer. They- Yeah. He s- he definitely looked old as dirt but actually it was effective looking old as dirt. Well he is old as dirt. Yeah, but it worked. He, he worked in his favor in that regard. He's- All right, so wait, you're picking what time? What, what- He's slightly younger than Tim Cook's father. (laughs) What? Um, anyways. You're... I'm picking 47 days, just like those Trump people told me. 47? Yeah, that's what they want it to be, the number of his presidency. If it's four- Once. I'm not exaggerating. If it's 47- Yeah. ... that'll ruin our Pivot tour because I think you're gonna- Yeah. ... have a shutdown in the- Yeah. Oh. ... FAA or the air traffic controllers. All right. Okay. All right. I've heard Nashville Airport is pretty much almost closed. It was okay. It was, actually, no. It wasn't. We- No? I got in. Yeah. It, you know, I talked to all the TSA people. They were lovely, I have to say. Shout out to the TSA people working yesterday 'cause they're not- Did you get caught making out at the passport? (laughs) Oh, God. God, I love that. One time at TSA I bought a- a- a set of handcuffs in New Orleans and it was in my bag and I didn't... forgot I had bought them. I bought them for a friend. You're a total gangster. I- I do not like handcuffs but I bought them for a friend. I put 'em, threw 'em in the bag, because they have all that stuff in New Orleans, and someone pulled them out and just dangled them in front of me, in front of everybody. That was... Oh, God! Jesus! I'm a terrible person. You, uh... literally- (laughs) ... you were arrested for sex and drugs. All we're missing is rock and roll here. No drugs. No drugs. Well, they, they thought you were a drug dealer. Although- Yeah. ... I gotta be honest- Yeah. ... I don't think you looked much like a drug dealer. I don't. That's probably a racist statement. That's why I got all testy. That's... Anyway, whatever. I was in a jail. I was jailed. I was jailed. Actually, you're like the Gus Fring that's selling 2C or ketamine to all your sorority sisters- Yeah, I wouldn't do that. Let me just say- ... in exchange for sexual favors in a park. You know, sending a lesbian to jail is not that scary for a lesbian, just so you know. Anyway, uh, I saw Orange Is The New Black. It looked kind of fun. Um, anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind, go to- Gold coins and lesbian- (laughs) ... sex in parks. That's why they come here, Kara. (laughs) That's why they come here. Sorry. Okay. We want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech, or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com/pivot to submit a question- This is not CNN! ... for the show. (laughs) This is not CNN! Call 855- Oh, my God. ... 51-PIVOT. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe, on... this week on Property Market, Scott spoke with Catherine An Edwards, economist and columnist for Bloomberg News. Let's listen to a clip. This was a terrific interview, by the way.

Episode duration: 1:07:31