Why You Feel Exhausted All The Time (It’s Not What You Think) | Pippa Grange

1. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:00

   Why is it, do you think, that so many people are struggling with burnout?

2. PGPippa Grange0:08

   I think this is an absolutely collective problem. So many people are struggling, but that's not a sort of, a large number of individuals who've randomly got there. I think it's actually a cultural phenomena as well, and I think it's because we're overperforming in too many places and in too many ways in our lives. We are living in a way that no longer suits [laughs] a human being. It's too fast. It's too revved. It requires too much mental activity from us at all times. We've forgotten how to rest and renew our energy, to regenerate, and collectively, that's leading us to a place where we're, if not just strained, where we're on the precipice of burnout and, and crashing and burning.

3. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee0:56

   Yeah. That term overperformance-

4. PGPippa Grange1:01

   Mm

5. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:01

   ... is really the, I guess, the topic of the new book.

6. PGPippa Grange1:05

   Mm.

7. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:06

   And as you just alluded to, this seems to be something that a lot of people struggle with these days-

8. PGPippa Grange1:14

   Mm-hmm

9. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:15

   ... this, this idea that they're, they can't quite get their head above water.

10. PGPippa Grange1:19

    Right.

11. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:20

    Right? And you say this right at the start, "Are you addicted to pace and pressure? Do you regularly close off your feelings and ignore your body so that you can get more done? And is the internal narrator to your daily life critical of anything that doesn't add to your progress and betterment?"

12. PGPippa Grange1:40

    Mm.

13. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee1:41

    That's a lot of people, isn't it?

14. PGPippa Grange1:42

    That's a lot of people, yeah. This is what... That's what I'm saying. I think it's, it's not just you. [laughs] It's not just an individual phenomena for one person here. It's, it's something that's really prevalent among everybody. Our pace is too high, basically. I think we have a mismatch between the way we used to do it, um, where grit and discipline and, uh, performance methods used to fit the way that the world was, and now we're in a new moment in the world where, uh, there's more strain collectively. There's geopolitical strain, there's wars, there's climate change. There's all sorts of things that are pressing down on us collectively, and I don't think we have worked out how to change our methods, and that's what the whole book, Life Reclaimed, is about, is, is how do we change our methods for this moment now so that we can regenerate our energy, regenerate our performances, rather than feel like you either have to put tools down and quit-

15. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:38

    Mm

16. PGPippa Grange2:38

    ... or, or just keep going until you crash.

17. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:42

    It's interesting you say there's a mismatch between-

18. PGPippa Grange2:46

    Mm

19. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:46

    ... the way things currently are and I guess who we are as humans.

20. PGPippa Grange2:51

    Mm.

21. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:51

    Yet you still, throughout your book and your, I would say beyond this book, your, the entirety of your work-

22. PGPippa Grange2:56

    Mm

23. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:56

    ... you still look to nature-

24. PGPippa Grange2:58

    Yeah

25. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee2:58

    ... for solutions, don't you?

26. PGPippa Grange3:00

    Yeah. Well, we are nature. [laughs] You know, it's, it's, um, what, one of the first things I talk about in the book in, in the sort of, you know, how we learn who to be, um, is this idea that we, uh, have a view of ourselves as separate from everything out there, and when we can recognize that we are part of that web of life, and it is the most extreme and incredible form of intelligence that'll ever come our way to tap into that-

27. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee3:26

    Mm

28. PGPippa Grange3:27

    ... all the lessons are already there about how to excel, how to perform, how to stay whole. You know, ecology is whole. Industry is not whole. It's compartments and efficiency and productivity and progress.

29. RCDr. Rangan Chatterjee3:42

    This idea that we're not separate from our surroundings, I very much think like that. There's many people these days who think like that. But for someone who's pushing back against that, Pippa, who's going, "What, what do you mean? Like, I'm an individual. I've got to earn my money and pay my mortgage and feed my family," what is the relevance of this idea that we're not separate? How does that apply in that individual's life?

30. PGPippa Grange4:13

    Mm. Mm-hmm. So the way I'm talking about it in the book is, um, when we see ourselves as separate from all else, we also have this idea that we can override all of the signals from the natural world-

Episode duration: 1:34:38