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Head of ChatGPT & Codex: agents for normal people are HERE

📌 Try the Liberty 5 Pro series by @SoundcoreAudio FREE for 30 days via this link: https://soundcore.tech/D1204_DTC_Listing_Silicon_Valley_Girl_0_505535 Thibault Sottiaux is the head of ChatGPT and Codex at OpenAI. He told me that in a few months, people who don't use AI at all will get the same benefits as those who've spent two years figuring it out. So what's actually going to be your edge in a market this competitive? Thibault opened up and shared a few of his secrets — he showed me how his own agents work and how anyone can set them up. We covered the must-have files everyone should create, the one file you should never write yourself, and the new skill that replaces prompting entirely. If you work with a computer for a living, this is the one to watch this week. *Timestamps:* 00:00 — The change nobody is ready for 00:47 — How knowledge work changes tomorrow 03:00 — The agentic workflow breakthrough 04:18 — The must-have files everyone needs 05:54 — The one file you should NOT write yourself 07:08 — Use agents vs. don't — the productivity gap 07:50 — The trap of optimizing everything 11:47 — Vibe coding: when you still need an engineer 13:38 — The future of software engineering 15:07 — A workflow you should deploy today 16:30 — Live demo: agent runs my inbox + plans a trip 21:18 — "Where am I wasting my time?" 22:48 — What Thibault personally uses Codex for 24:53 — Live demo: agent pulls my LinkedIn analytics 25:55 — He quit his PhD after 2 weeks — would he do it today 27:48 — The "personal tailor" model of AI 29:04 — The real skill that replaces prompting *Links:* 📩 Follow my Newsletter: https://siliconvalleygirl.beehiiv.com/subscribe?utm_source=youtube&utm_medium=video&utm_campaign=futureproof-sub&utm_content=Thibault-Sottiaux 🔗 My Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/siliconvalleygirl/ 📌 My Companies & Products: https://Marinamogilko.co

Thibault SottiauxguestMarina Mogilkohost
May 22, 202631mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:00 – 0:47

    The change nobody is ready for

    1. TS

      There is going to be dramatic change. Everyone is going to get their own little personal assistant on their computer that allows you to do more than whatever was possible three months ago, six months ago.

    2. MM

      This is Thibault. He runs ChatGPT Codex and the APIs at OpenAI, the tech powering most of the AI you already use every day. And he just told me that in a few months, people who don't use AI at all will get the same benefits as the ones who've spent the last two years figuring it out.

    3. TS

      Today, you have to actively prompt and be creative about what you're asking. In the future, that's not the case anymore.

    4. MM

      What's gonna make people friendly, I guess?

    5. TS

      If you're a creative person with good ideas, it's a great time to experiment.

    6. MM

      Can you show me a workflow everyone should be deploying today?

    7. TS

      One thing that I think this will mean is that-

    8. MM

      My audience

  2. 0:47 – 3:00

    How knowledge work changes tomorrow

    1. MM

      is, some of them are developers, but a lot of them are knowledge workers.

    2. TS

      Right.

    3. MM

      And they're very excited about AI, and what we've been seeing with software engineering, right? Google says seventy-five percent of their code is now AI-written, so it has been really transformed by AI. And you said something that this transformation will extend to all knowledge work over the next six months. So what do you think is gonna be changing for people who are knowledge workers?

    4. TS

      I think it's not that much that people are going to change as the technology has matured, and now agents are reliable over, you know, long horizons. It's now very capable of using many different tools, you know, Computer use being one of them, browser use. We have added over, like, a hundred different plugins that can tap into, you know, every little tool that you already use in your life. And the agent in GPT 5 is, like, extremely reliable at it. So it's more that the technology has matured and is ready, and so everyone will be able to get benefits from an agent. Whereas before, you had to be a little bit technical and, you know, get in there. If it wasn't reliable, if it was, like, struggling five minutes in, you're gonna kinda maybe have to go into the configuration. And obviously, that requires, like, a technical background. That's not the case anymore. So that's why I think it's going to be-- become, like, very widespread.

    5. MM

      What do you think is gonna change the most in, say, like, if you take a marketer, what's gonna change with their day-to-day with agents?

    6. TS

      So you're going to look at what can you automate. Oh, maybe I spent like one hour, you know, doing market research. Maybe I spent one hour, like, summarizing a whole bunch of inbound and emails. Maybe I spent, like, you know, two hours going through, like, prospects. And so a lot of the concepts that were, like, you know, advanced concepts maybe six months ago, such as, like, running something on, on a cron schedule. Like, nowadays, it's just, like, in the app, you can just say, like, "Run this every twelve hours, you know, do some market research, send me a PDF," um-

    7. MM

      And it's gonna send it to you over email?

    8. TS

      Yes. And it can send it to you over email, or you can, you know, just consume it in the app. Maybe you can print it. I did this, uh, a couple of weeks ago, where I would summarize, uh, all the news from Slack and then print it on my printer physically, like, every day, so I would have it with a coffee.

    9. MM

      Oh, wow. This is, like, very executive way of-

    10. TS

      It's a feel like, you know, maybe old school. I just say, like, I want my newspaper.

    11. MM

      [laughs]

    12. TS

      This kind of thing is just

  3. 3:00 – 4:18

    The agentic workflow breakthrough

    1. TS

      become a... Is, is going to be mainstream.

    2. MM

      You know what I was really inspired by? I was watching one of your podcasts where you were talking with, uh, Greg about having this dashboard. Basically, when you wake up in the morning, you have your coffee, and it just tells you, like, "Can you approve this?" And I'm gonna run it. "Can you approve?" So you just basically read through whatever your AI agent did while you were sleeping, and you're approving, and it's continuing its work. When do you think it's gonna be a reality?

    3. TS

      It's not that far off. The technology already exists. It's about packaging it.

    4. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    5. TS

      For example, last week we released Auto Review, which is, um, a concept. It definitely blew my mind when we did the research on it. So you have the main agent doing actions, and then you have a second agent that is verifying all the actions of the first agent-

    6. MM

      Hmm

    7. TS

      ... and verifying that they are not doing anything that could be harmful to you and, like, are low risk. And so that's an innovation that's came out of our safety team, uh, and, and alignment team, um, primarily like alignment research. And it allows you to run an agent much more, like, for a longer period of time autonomously, even handling, you know, quite sensitive data-

    8. MM

      Mm-hmm

    9. TS

      ... without risking, for example, you know, your agent, like, sending an email to a stranger with some of your personal information in there. Now that you have these pieces to make it more secure, more safe, um, and you're willing to give access to a lot of things in

  4. 4:18 – 5:54

    The must-have files everyone needs

    1. TS

      your life.

    2. MM

      How do we organize our data? [laughs] Imagine we're all getting ready to deploy our first agent, right?

    3. TS

      Today.

    4. MM

      Uh, and the thing is, uh, agent needs good data.

    5. TS

      Mm-hmm.

    6. MM

      Uh, and sometimes... You know, I've been working with mostly my tone of voice, like personal dossier, but then I realized that my agent would really benefit from knowing my strategy when it-

    7. TS

      Right

    8. MM

      ... creates content for me. So what would you say to someone who's just starting out? How do they organize this data? What are the must-have files that they have to create?

    9. TS

      I organize everything on, like, local files on my computer. So I have a folder, I have my notes in there. I keep it, like, fairly tidy, and, you know, I use my agent to organize it, and then it grows over time.

    10. MM

      What happens if you travel? That, that's my question. People who work with local computers. I have a laptop that I travel with. I have two Macs, and one in my studio-

    11. TS

      Yes

    12. MM

      ... and one in my office.

    13. TS

      Yeah. So what we're going to see over the next three months is all of this is going to come to the cloud.

    14. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    15. TS

      And you're not going to have to manage, like, local files on, you know, just your laptop, and then, you know, if you happen to travel and you're on your phone, oh, now suddenly it's not the same agent.

    16. MM

      Yeah.

    17. TS

      Um, and that's, that's annoying because you have, like, you know, two separate entities that you need to sort of like, you know, map two different things in your life. Um, so a lot of this is going to come to, to the cloud. It's going to manage its own memory. It's going to m-manage, you know, help you manage, like, files-

    18. MM

      Mm-hmm

    19. TS

      ... that are just, like, hosted somewhere. Um, there's no good solution yet, which is, you know, sort of surprising.

    20. MM

      Yeah. I'm, I'm just putting everything to my Google Drive-

    21. TS

      Yeah

    22. MM

      ... and I'm creating a Google Drive folder.

    23. TS

      Yeah, that works. That works.

    24. MM

      Uh, what are the files that everyone should, uh, come up with-

    25. TS

      Right

    26. MM

      ... for their agents?

    27. TS

      Um-

    28. MM

      And we're talking about productivity for knowledge workers.

    29. TS

      Yes.

  5. 5:54 – 7:08

    The one file you should NOT write yourself

    1. TS

      Like, tone of voice is a good one.

    2. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    3. TS

      Um, and for that, maybe surprisingly, like-I don't recommend, you know, actually trying to explain your tone of voice. I recommend, uh, just including examples-

    4. MM

      Mm-hmm

    5. TS

      ... of, you know, like, past, um, you know, n- newsletters maybe that you, you published or, you know, snippets from, you know, like, recordings, um, or, you know, like, messages that you sent, you know, to friends and, and, and, um, in different, like, maybe professional and personal settings. I have a lot of, uh, notes around, like, projects that I have. There's-- Like, each project has its own folder, um, with various files in it.

    6. MM

      Yeah.

    7. TS

      Um, and then contacts. But you don't have to maintain everything in files. You can also just rely on, you know, like, all the productivity apps that you already have, and then, you know, Codex, for example, will be able to go and pull the right information.

    8. MM

      How do you know when you stay inside a project or you want to... Codex to actually build something-

    9. TS

      Mm-hmm

    10. MM

      ... like a tool or an app?

    11. TS

      Sometimes I feel like, you know, I need, like, a dedicated app for, for, for, like, a new use case, and then I go and, like, I create a new folder, and then I just, like, experiment in there. But nowadays, more and more, I feel like I need less of static apps that j-just can do one thing, and I rely just more on my agent to do everything for me.

    12. MM

      Mm-hmm.

  6. 7:08 – 7:50

    Use agents vs. don't — the productivity gap

    1. MM

      If somebody starts using agents and somebody doesn't, what's the difference in their productivity in, say, one to three years?

    2. TS

      One to three years, that's, like, so far off, um, the technology itself, like, will change so much, um, by then. What we're going to see is, you know, like, people who are willing to adapt and discover these things are, you know, going to be quite a bit more productive, and it's going to enable to do, like, you know, all these things that you sort of, like, maybe put off. Everyone is going to, you know, get their own, like, little personal assistant on their computer, you know, doing all of the, you know, maybe filing your taxes, setting up, like, email filters, telling you and helping you, like, get more in touch with, like, you know, your loved ones. That is something that will connect a lot of people.

    3. MM

      When I started using more AI,

  7. 7:50 – 11:47

    The trap of optimizing everything

    1. MM

      I felt this responsibility dilemma. You just mentioned, like, taxes, right?

    2. TS

      Right.

    3. MM

      Yeah. AI can totally do taxes for me, and I have this automation that tells me every month how much tax I'm gonna owe and what tax strategies I could be deploying. Do I wanna be responsible for that? I don't know. Like, when it comes to these tasks, also as an entrepreneur, I totally realize if you're just starting out today, you're much more productive. But if you're an existing entrepreneur, I wouldn't really fire anyone on my team because an AI agent can run it. I would just ask that person to use that AI agent. Where, where do you see this going? 'Cause I feel like when I started running so many agents, I feel responsible that-

    4. TS

      Mm-hmm

    5. MM

      ... I need to check on them, I need to verify their output.

    6. TS

      Right.

    7. MM

      I'm like, "Oh, I'll just let somebody else handle it."

    8. TS

      [laughs] That's interesting. So at the end of the day, humans remain responsible. And then, you know, the way that we think about it is, like, just really about augmenting your own capabilities-

    9. MM

      Mm-hmm

    10. TS

      ... uh, and giving you a tool that allows you to do more than whatever was possible three months ago, six months ago, and take a lot of, like, the, the boring parts of the work as well and just do that automatically for you. It is important as we see this for, for coding is, like, for us, it's like if you, if you produce a piece of code, you know you are responsible for it.

    11. MM

      Yeah.

    12. TS

      Um, if it breaks, it's not, it's not the agent's fault. It's, it's your fault. Um, same for code review. Like, you cannot outsource, like, understanding. At the end of the day, humans, you know, are still, uh, remain in control and remain, um, the people who need to understand the entire system and how, how things work. And so if you view it under the lens of, like, you know, augmenting your own productivity as a human, it's like, you know, obviously, you know, you need humans. After all, we're building for ourselves to better our own lives.

    13. MM

      Yeah. It's just-- I feel like I become much more productive first, but then I'm like, because I want to optimize so many things-

    14. TS

      Mm-hmm

    15. MM

      ... my brain just started exploding. [laughs]

    16. TS

      There is a, there is a pitfall of, like, you know, maybe, you know, falling too much into, you know, using, using it for everything and feeling like maybe you can do things, but you're a little bit too early on the capability curve.

    17. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    18. TS

      And so, like, maybe things, you know, will be possible with future models. And that's good. That means that you're pushing and you're sort of, like, you know, discovering, you know, where, where it's reliable, where maybe it needs a little bit more work, and maybe this will be something that you can do in, like, three months, six months.

    19. MM

      Today's conversation is another reminder of how much AI has sped everything up. My calendar this year has more meetings in it than ever before, so I've been testing a lot of different things to keep up. A couple I've been using lately, the Soundcore Liberty Pro Series, Liberty 5 Pro, and Liberty 5 Pro Max. Both have the same noise cancellation and call quality. The Pro Max is also equipped with built-in AI functions designed specifically for business people, and several other features have pleasantly surprised me. First, call quality. I travel a lot and often take calls and attend meetings on the go. I take calls from planes, airports, moving cars, and around kids. With regular earbuds, people often couldn't hear me clearly. With these, the microphone picks up my voice and cuts everything else out. The earbuds hold a Guinness World Record for call clarity in noisy environments. They were tested against thirteen competitors by an independent lab and scored first. Second, the AI note-taker in the case. Tap, and it starts recording. After the meeting, I get a summary, speaker breakdown, and a to-do list straight to my phone. The whole thing lands there automatically. And you know what else caught me off guard? The noise cancellation. I put these on during a long flight and genuinely forgot there were hundreds of people around me, and their app has built-in sleep sounds and meditations too. I sleep a lot on airplanes and hotels, and this is a lifesaver for me. You close your eyes, and you actually get to properly rest. If you're running a busy lifestyle with back-to-back calls, no time to take notes, Liberty 5 Pro Series are worth trying. Thirty days free trial, easy returns if you're not satisfied. The link is in the description. Now back to our conversation with Thibault.

  8. 11:47 – 13:38

    Vibe coding: when you still need an engineer

    1. MM

      Okay, let's talk about Vibe coding in general.

    2. TS

      Mm-hmm.

    3. MM

      So I shared before the podcast that in Linguatrip, we're actually Vibe coding a lot of different apps.

    4. TS

      Yeah.

    5. MM

      And we have a technical person who can actually write code, and he's really good at it, but then it's also us who can't. And when we Vibe code somethingIt's, if it works great, but then the technical person comes in and says, "Oh, I would've structured it in a different way, because if we wanted to grow it..." Like for example, we have this app that is three hundred most useful words in English, right? And the way it was I've coded in a perfect way so it, it's usable, but if we want to extend it and make it like a thousand useful words, then the architecture is a little bit off. What would you say, like, how would you approach Vibe coding these days? If you're thinking of building something like that's gonna be a big company, should you work with a technical person or still try and Vibe code it?

    6. TS

      If the goal is to share it with, you know, a couple of people and like try something out and, you know, build it for, for the joy of it, you know, definitely like just coding it by yourself with the help of an agent is like, that's perfectly fine.

    7. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    8. TS

      If the goal is to scale it and, you know, make something that is successful, you know, for like, you know, hundreds of thousands of people or more, um, having a technical person like in the mix is still useful. I do expect that, you know, over time to go away.

    9. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    10. TS

      Um, where, you know, you will have agents which are able to like, you know, understand the long-term maintenance aspects, you know, the right structure, and be able to like, you know, handhold you all the way to scaling to like, you know, very large and successful like product.

    11. MM

      What do you think is the timeline? 'Cause it's, it's been changing so fast.

    12. TS

      We will see significant improvements towards like long-term maintainability of code, uh, over the next six to nine months. Um, in order to like not need the help of like someone more technical at all, um, that feels like quite a, quite a, quite a far off.

  9. 13:38 – 15:07

    The future of software engineering

    1. MM

      Yeah. Well, what do you think in general about the future of software engineering? I was just moderating a panel, uh, around it, uh, with, uh, you know, deep learning AI.

    2. TS

      Mm-hmm.

    3. MM

      Uh, and we're talking about like how we all had a consensus of six people on the panel that you just, you still need technical knowledge, but you also need to become a generalist. And because everyone is Vibe coding apps, like as a creator, I would've never thought of building an app ten years ago because I knew how expensive it was. Now I would build an app, but then I will see thousands of people using it, and I will experience some bugs-

    4. TS

      Mm-hmm

    5. MM

      ... and I will need a technical person.

    6. TS

      Yeah.

    7. MM

      Are we gonna need more software engineers or less with this?

    8. TS

      Yeah, I think we're going to see an explosion, um, in the amount of, you know, infrastructure and apps that we built, and nowadays it's, it's just, it's awesome because if you just have an idea, you can, you can build it.

    9. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    10. TS

      Or at least in some shape you can build it. Uh, if you're a creative person, you know, with good ideas, it's a great time to experiment, and then you can, you know, quickly prototype, iterate, and get to something that you feel, you know, like might be successful out there. And then it's hard to like put a limit and, you know, how much software is enough? How much demand is there for more software in the world? Like, how many more problems can we solve? It feels like we're at the very beginning of-

    11. MM

      Feels like we keep coming up with problems we can solve. [laughs]

    12. TS

      Yeah. Exactly, right. So it's like, you know, as long as that continues to be through and, you know, we are able to continue technological like advancement-

    13. MM

      Mm-hmm

    14. TS

      ... um, it feels like, you know, there will be demand for a lot of technical folks.

  10. 15:07 – 16:30

    A workflow you should deploy today

    1. MM

      Yeah. Can you show me a workflow that everyone should be deploying today to maximize their productivity? Can you think of something?

    2. TS

      It really varies. Um, it depends. Like, you know, one, one of the things that I do is I use it to stay in tune with what the world thinks, for example, about Codex.

    3. MM

      Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

    4. TS

      And so I receive like a daily summary of like the highlights.

    5. MM

      Can, can we build something from this like that?

    6. TS

      Yes. Yes. So let's do a new chat. So for example, you know, I am on a podcast, uh, talking about AI and Codex. Um, find relevant, uh, emails in my inbox, uh, and, uh, prepare draft replies, uh, based on what you know about my priorities, uh, from memory. So you haven't, uh, you haven't built, uh, memories yet.

    7. MM

      Uh, yeah.

    8. TS

      But if you use, if you use Codex a lot, it will learn about, it will learn about you from-

    9. MM

      But it's gonna make a memory from ChatGPT as well, right?

    10. TS

      Yeah. Another one is, uh, you know, go through popular internet sources and give me a breakdown of what Codex shipped over the last two weeks. And we can go back to email. Um, I have

  11. 16:30 – 21:18

    Live demo: agent runs my inbox + plans a trip

    1. TS

      a messy inbox in, for Gmail, um, set up filters for it to keep-

    2. MM

      Oh, I, you know, I remember it. I think it was like twenty nineteen or something.

    3. TS

      Keep clean.

    4. MM

      I spent a couple days just organizing my emails and folders, and then I realized such a waste of time. [laughs]

    5. TS

      [laughs]

    6. MM

      I spent so much time on it.

    7. TS

      I want to plan a trip, you know, to like where, where should we go? And then-

    8. MM

      Based on my calendar availability, right?

    9. TS

      Yeah.

    10. MM

      Or something. [laughs]

    11. TS

      Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. For calendar availability.

    12. MM

      'Cause it, it connects to my calendar.

    13. TS

      Yeah. Uh, a trip plan, um, and use my calendar availability to plan it, for example. And so it's going to go, like here it's, you can see it's gone through your email. So this one is like on a podcast to talk about AI and Codex. It's already gone through your email, found several live threads related to today's, uh, thing.

    14. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    15. TS

      Um, you know, it went through the calendar. It's all still going through, um, you know, so it's found like a bunch of things. Um, apparently you have like, you know, uh, nine-

    16. MM

      Yeah, I work with Codex, which is why. [laughs]

    17. TS

      [laughs] And then, you know, here you have another one. So, you know, you can see like we're doing, um, a lot of things, you know, in parallel. You can just like run-

    18. MM

      Yeah

    19. TS

      ... you know, little agentic threads. Uh, here you could say like, "I am making a presentation, uh, put this in a Google Slide." And it will go and it will just prepare like, you know, a, a Google Slide for all of the content.

    20. MM

      The editing is gonna be within the app, or I will have to leave and go to Google Slides?

    21. TS

      So there is an in-app browser as well.

    22. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    23. TS

      Um, I don't know if you've set up your pet, no, not yet. So we also ship like this cute little feature.

    24. MM

      Oh, I just saw it on your X.

    25. TS

      So now, you know, you can move this a- across-

    26. MM

      Uh-huh

    27. TS

      ... uh, and you can see, like, you know, which, which threads it's still working on. So for example, like, it's still summarizing Codex updates. It's currently setting up, uh, some, some email filters. Um, I don't wanna make changes to your inbox, so I'm just gonna-

    28. MM

      [laughs] Okay

    29. TS

      ... you know, stop this one.

    30. MM

      Uh-huh.

  12. 21:18 – 22:48

    "Where am I wasting my time?"

    1. MM

      like, s- the most sophisticated use case or maybe, like, the, the use cases that are very sophisticated in terms of workflow but that change productivity tremendously for, for people day to day, something that everyone could get inspired by?

    2. TS

      So you can say, like, you know, go through, um... You can, you can tag a lot of different plugins. So you can say Gmail-

    3. MM

      Mm-hmm

    4. TS

      ... Calendar, if you have, like, uh, Docs, yeah, and, um, and be my chief of staff-

    5. MM

      Hmm

    6. TS

      ... and give me a breakdown of my day, a summary of what is important, and prepare me. And then you just run this at the start of the day, and then you can be more specific than the, the, the example prompt that I, I gave here. Like, some, some people that I've seen, like, you know, have, like, fairly sophisticated, you know, requests for, like, you know, how to be prepared.

    7. MM

      Yeah, and, like, where am I wasting my time? Should I be hiring someone to fix something where you see I'm spending most of my hours-

    8. TS

      Exactly

    9. MM

      ... or building an app that's gonna-

    10. TS

      You know, you can, you can-

    11. MM

      Like optimization.

    12. TS

      You can really discuss, you know, with, with Codex then and start to brainstorm, you know, about how you can streamline things.

    13. MM

      [laughs]

    14. TS

      Your calendar says it is sparse but high consequence-

    15. MM

      [laughs]

    16. TS

      ... so it seems like you're doing good.

    17. MM

      [laughs] Okay.

    18. TS

      [laughs]

    19. MM

      Yeah. 'Cause I only put important stuff in the calendar. [laughs]

    20. TS

      Yeah.

    21. MM

      I don't put, like, day to day.

    22. TS

      That's good.

    23. MM

      Okay.

  13. 22:48 – 24:53

    What Thibault personally uses Codex for

    1. MM

      Cool. What do you, uh, personally use and in what order for, for which tasks?

    2. TS

      So I use it for coding a lot. Uh, I use it to help, uh, strategize for the different pieces that we're planning to put out, like, you know, in what order, like, the narrative to, to, to construct. So it's, like, it's a great thought partner. Use it to, like, organize all my own notes throughout the day.

    3. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    4. TS

      So instead of taking notes in, like, a separate notes app, now I just take them, like, straight into Codex.

    5. MM

      Oh, interesting.

    6. TS

      And it just builds up memories.

    7. MM

      Like, you just start a new chat for anything you wanna say.

    8. TS

      Yes. And I'm just like, "Hey, this is what I'm thinking." Yeah.

    9. MM

      And then at the end of the day, does it automatically summarize it, or you have to prompt it?

    10. TS

      Um, n- I prompt it to, like, then, you know, dump everything into a doc.

    11. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    12. TS

      Um, but also it, like, builds up memories. I use it to, uh, often stay on top of unanswered, like, important unanswered, uh, emails or Slack messages.

    13. MM

      Are you seeing the shift from more code work being done with AI to more productivity stuff, or has it been equal?

    14. TS

      Uh, so it is interesting to think about, you know, what is, what does an engineer, what does a programmer do all day? And, like, already there the majority of the time is not spent on coding, actually. So we saw, we saw a shift over time, you know, even including in our technical user base. Over, way over, like, 50%, uh, of the tasks done on Codex are, like, non-technical tasks today.

    15. MM

      Hmm, already.

    16. TS

      Yes.

    17. MM

      And it's been, what? A year since you-

    18. TS

      Uh, the app has only been three months.

    19. MM

      Okay.

    20. TS

      So we, we launched the app-

    21. MM

      Cod- Codex has been around for-

    22. TS

      ... three months. The Codex CLI, which was-

    23. MM

      Mm-hmm

    24. TS

      ... definitely for programmers, that was a year ago.

    25. MM

      So what are people using it for? What do you see? What are the use cases?

    26. TS

      There's a lot of, like, help me plan, help me organize, thinking through trips. Um, now with computer use and browsers, it can, you know, do things such as, like, order on DoorDash for you, like order your shopping, um-

    27. MM

      Does it take long?

    28. TS

      -do research.

    29. MM

      I haven't tried it on the browse yet, but sometimes the agentic browsers are like-

    30. TS

      No, we have the fastest computer use implementation out there.

  14. 24:53 – 25:55

    Live demo: agent pulls my LinkedIn analytics

    1. TS

      So for example, I can, um-

    2. MM

      Can, can we ask it to go and download-

    3. TS

      Yes

    4. MM

      ... my LinkedIn analytics?

    5. TS

      Okay. So let's do, let's do at computer-

    6. MM

      Okay

    7. TS

      ... um, and then go to LinkedIn and download my analytics, um, and in the format we said, a spreadsheet.

    8. MM

      Excel spreadsheet, yeah.

    9. TS

      And, um, uh, and create a spreadsheet. There we go. So let's, let's see what it does. It'll use the desktop controls. This might take five to 10 minutes.

    10. MM

      So, so the difference from ChatGPT is that it's, it can use your computer?

    11. TS

      Yes. It can use your computer. It's a full agent that works and has access to your browser, can, you know, click around on your apps as well.

    12. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    13. TS

      And you, you can look at it here, so it's, it's already... It's visiting, um-

    14. MM

      Yeah, it's, it is. It is already on my LinkedIn page.

    15. TS

      Yes. Uh, so let's, let's see what it does over time.

    16. MM

      I think it's navigating.

    17. TS

      Here you can see it's like navigating here.

    18. MM

      Oh, it's saving.

    19. TS

      It's exporting something.

    20. MM

      It is already saving stuff. That's amazing. While we

  15. 25:55 – 27:48

    He quit his PhD after 2 weeks — would he do it today

    1. MM

      wait, wait for him to finish, I wanted to ask you something. You dropped out of your PhD, right?

    2. TS

      Yes.

    3. MM

      After two weeks?

    4. TS

      After two weeks, that's right.

    5. MM

      To start a company. Would you recommend to someone who's doing their PhD or bachelor's or master's now-

    6. TS

      [laughs]

    7. MM

      ... and feel bad, they're just hating it, is it a good time to quit, or are you-

    8. TS

      I, this was a long time ago. This was almost 15 years ago, so I'm not sure if, uh-

    9. MM

      But now it is seeming like, I feel like-

    10. TS

      ... it's relevant

    11. MM

      ... uh, but, but it's interesting how the meaning of education has changed-

    12. TS

      Mm-hmm

    13. MM

      ... in these 15 years. What, what do you think from, like, seeing all the innovation inside OpenAI, DeepMind, should people be still pursuing, like, very deep education, or should they just go out and start building?

    14. TS

      The reason I dropped out of my PhD is, uh, I just actually, after starting it, I felt like I was committing four years of my life to that specific subject was actually not what I wanted to do.

    15. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    16. TS

      And, uh, I had more ideas and more things that I wanted to try.

    17. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    18. TS

      Uh, and so I felt like a startup, startup environment was, like, right for me.

    19. MM

      Yeah.

    20. TS

      I think it's very important to, like, time and time again, like, you know, in my own life, you know, I've realized, like, it's important to follow your instincts-

    21. MM

      Mm-hmm

    22. TS

      ... um, and do things that give you energy.

    23. MM

      Was it the right decision for you?

    24. TS

      Oh, absolutely.

    25. MM

      I guess so. [laughs]

    26. TS

      Absolutely. I had such a great time.

    27. MM

      Turned out well, yeah.

    28. TS

      Uh, you know, I built, I built that company for, like, a year, and then I went on-

    29. MM

      Mm-hmm

    30. TS

      ... worked, worked for Google.

  16. 27:48 – 29:04

    The "personal tailor" model of AI

    1. MM

      look at what it's created, uh, one final question. What do you think is gonna happen to our lives in three to five years from all the innovation that you've seen? Do you think we're gonna see this dramatic change that a lot of people are talking about, or are they exaggerating? [laughs]

    2. TS

      I think there is going to be dramatic change. I think it's important, you know, for, for us, uh, and, and for me personally, to just really bring the benefits to everyone. And one thing that I think this will mean is that you will have the benefits, you know, whether, whether you're actively engaging with this technology or not. Um, today you have to actively prompt and sort of, like, you know, be creative about what you're, what you're asking, and, you know, it's almost like the, the benefits that you get are definitely, like, you know, proportional to, like, you know, how good your prompting is.

    3. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    4. TS

      You know, in the future, that will not be true.

    5. MM

      Mm.

    6. TS

      So, you know, sort of like it will, to me, you know, be very similar to going to a nice tailor who sort of, like, instantly looks at you and gets you and is like, "Oh, this is the kind of clothes that would, you know, make you shine," and that is, like, you know, just, like, right for you. Um-

    7. MM

      So what will it depend on then? If it's not your prompting, what's gonna make people brilliant, I guess? [laughs]

    8. TS

      Yes. You know, it will be much more, like, benefiting from, you know, good advice from a friend or, like, you know, having a natural conversation-

    9. MM

      Mm

    10. TS

      ... like the conversation that we have

  17. 29:04 – 31:07

    The real skill that replaces prompting

    1. TS

      right now.

    2. MM

      So, so, like, the, the ability to ask the right questions, not to necessarily prompt them.

    3. TS

      It will, it will, it will be about engaging, you know, as your authentic self in a conversation and then getting the appropriate help in the right, at the right time.

    4. MM

      Mm-hmm.

    5. TS

      Um, and, you know, having... benefiting from this, you know, ambient intelligence that is just, like, supporting the society.

    6. MM

      Okay.

    7. TS

      Um, it has created a spreadsheet.

    8. MM

      Oh, there we go.

    9. TS

      So it has downloaded all the analytics from, uh-

    10. MM

      Oh, that's amazing. Well, it's... Okay, uh, we, we need to... But this is okay. Like, uh, if I ask it to do more specific, 'cause it did, like, one screenshot, but we can-

    11. TS

      What else would you like it?... We can run it again.

    12. MM

      Uh-

    13. TS

      So I need more data-

    14. MM

      Impressions per post. Per post

    15. TS

      ... you know, for example, impressions, uh, per post. Okay. So I am very lazy now with Codex, and I just do everything through voice. So I need more data, impressions per post.

    16. MM

      Yeah, same. Same. I just use Whisper Flow across all my... Yeah.

    17. TS

      [laughs]

    18. MM

      Okay, let us end this daily brief. It did it. Yeah. Oh, this is getting better. See?

    19. TS

      And then you can continue to go and, uh, you know, you can, you can get more advanced. If you... There is a workflow then that you like, then, you know, you can, you can use, uh, a, the skill creator. Uh, this is a skill by itself, and then you can say, like, "Create a skill to capture, uh, this workflow, um, such that, uh, I can run it every day." And then it will create a, a bespoke skill for you that you can then invite-

    20. MM

      So we can scale up analytics-

    21. TS

      Yes

    22. MM

      ... and add it to File. Okay. This is fascinating. Thank you so much. Uh, I feel like I have some work to do when I come back home tonight. Uh, this is really fascinating. Thank you for building it.

    23. TS

      Of course. Yeah, it was a pleasure.

    24. MM

      Thank you.

    25. TS

      Thank you.

    26. MM

      I also write a newsletter where I go deeper on AI tools that I use, career strategies, and things I can't fit into a 30-minute podcast. It's free. Link is in the description.

Episode duration: 31:07

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