A Lifetime of Leadership with President Joe Biden | A Bit of Optimism Podcast

Leadership is deeply personal. As people change, the way they lead has to change, too.

Simon SinekhostGreat Minds Joe Bidenguest

Oct 15, 202433mWatch on YouTube

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Transcript

30 min read · 6,499 words

0:00 – 0:44
Intro
1. SSSimon Sinek
  I really appreciate you taking the time.
2. JBJoe Biden
  My staff is crazy about you, man.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  [laughs] There's no such thing as an expert leader. The best leaders I have ever met are students of leadership, and though I've written books on the subject, I'm constantly learning from those who know more than me, which is why I'm so excited to sit down with somebody with over 50 years of leadership experience. I'm proud to sit down with President Joe Biden to hear his thoughts on leadership, inspiration, and what helps us get out of bed in the morning. This is A Bit of Optimism. Mr. President, thank you so much. This is such a treat for me, um, as a student of leadership, to sit down with somebody who, I mean, whether you know it or not, you've studied leadership for, you know, most of your
0:44 – 4:21
Advice for young leaders
1. SSSimon Sinek
  life. And so I wanna start with, um, a question that's rather timely, if I may. Um, my 13-year-old nephew, uh, Jacob, is running for class president today, actually. And so I was wondering if you have any words of advice for young leaders on what he should expect should he win the election that he's running for.
2. JBJoe Biden
  He should expect to have to do what he said he was gonna do. Look, uh, I remember the, uh... I used to stutter when I was a kid, and, uh, but I was always sort of the, sort of the leader of the pack and my, my gang, and I was elected class president in grade school and high school. And, uh, the biggest thing is I think for him to let people know that he cared about what he said. And it sounds silly to say that, but I really mean it. It doesn't matter how old you are, people know whether or not you meant what you said.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Wh- when did you learn that lesson?
4. JBJoe Biden
  Well, look, I s- I kinda won the gene pool lottery. My dad used to say, for real, "You're a man of your word. Without your word, you're not a man." From the time we were kids, from little. My mother would look at you and say, "Joey." She was 5'1" and had a backbone like a ramrod, but she was everybody's mother confessor. Said, "Joey, remember, courage lives in every heart, and someday it'll be summoned. You've gotta do what you say you're gonna do." I think of all the expressions that I grew up believing. My mother would say that, you know, "If you have to ask, it's too late." My dad would say, "Families begin in the middle and end." I mean, for real. If you ask any of my friends I grew up with, they, they can quote my, [laughs] my mom and my dad and my grandfather and others. So it was all about just... I know it sounds silly, but my dad's favorite word was dignity. He'd say, "You gotta treat everyone with dignity. Everyone's entitled to be treated with dignity no matter who they are." And people can know it. They sense it. They feel it. They can taste it.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Y- you say you won the genetic lottery, but it sounds like you won the, the lottery for parents.
6. JBJoe Biden
  That's what I meant.
7. SSSimon Sinek
  The genes of your parents, not, not yours.
8. JBJoe Biden
  Oh, no, no, not me.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  [laughs]
10. JBJoe Biden
  Not me. But, you know, I, I was fortunate that I had, uh, I, I had the benefit of a family that was... We were middle class. We didn't have any money, but it was, uh, all about how you treat everybody. And, you know, I remember when I was a young senator, I met my dad at the Hotel DuPont, which was a four-star restaurant at the time. He was in town for business. He w- he ran an automobile agency. And, uh, I remember coming down the elevator, and the chairman of the board of the DuPont company came down, and my father said, "Hello," said, "Hi," just, that was all, just nice. Then he walked over to the shoeshine guy and he talked to him. I said, "Dad, why is that?" He said, "Everybody's due. Everybody's due to be treated with dignity."
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm. Mm.
12. JBJoe Biden
  That was my fa- I mean, for real.
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
14. JBJoe Biden
  Not a joke.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Th- these are the stories that I've heard about you that I think most people don't realize, 'cause they generally happen off camera, which is you come in and say hi to the guy setting up the, the teleprompter. And, I mean, it's nice to know that you, that if your, if your parents could see you now, that you're still doing the things that your dad taught you when he went over to the shoeshine guy.
16. JBJoe Biden
  Well, look, I mean, my mother used to say, "Remember, Joey, no one's better than you. You're, you're no better than anybody else. You're the same as everybody. You gotta treat people with respect." And look, I mean, maybe if I had come from a different circumstance, we, we were the guys that would be, figuratively speaking, holding the teleprompter.
4:21 – 10:46
How to stay humble as POTUS
1. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm. But I think a lot of people forget where they come from. You know, as people gain power or rank or money, um, you and I have both met people who, they think they deserve the rank they've been offered. And, and I'm so curious because we, we both know that humility and remembering where you come from is essential. How do you stay so grounded? Like, like I mean, you're the President of the United States. They can, you know, they call you the leader of the free world, and yet you, you, you... How do you maintain the humility that you remember-
2. JBJoe Biden
  Well-
3. SSSimon Sinek
  ... where you come from?
4. JBJoe Biden
  Oh, it's easy. [laughs] Easy maybe ain't humble. Look, um, my staff jokes with me. The first two years I was president, they'd walk in the room, they'd play Hail to the Chief, and I'd literally wonder, "Where the hell is he?" You know?
5. SSSimon Sinek
  [laughs]
6. JBJoe Biden
  The people I grew up with were the people who, that I knew and liked the most, were people who just looking for a shot, just looking for an even shot. There weren't a whole lot of folks that I hung out with that were very entitled.
7. SSSimon Sinek
  You stayed friends with a lot of your childhood friends.
8. JBJoe Biden
  Yeah.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  And I, I understand that, I think it was last week, you went to a funeral for a childhood friend. Um, again, I can only imagine your schedule, and that you took the time to go to the funeral of a childhood friend.
10. JBJoe Biden
  It, it's, he's one of my oldest friends. We go back to being in St. Paul's grade school in Scranton, Pennsylvania, when I was in kindergarten. And we stayed friends throughout, uh, our entire lives, over 70 years. And, uh, I, I, how could you not go? And it was important to go for another reason. Because I'm president, it's important for his family to know- That it didn't matter.
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
12. JBJoe Biden
  That Tommy was still one of my best friends. He was smarter than I was. He was faster than I was. He, I mean, he was just... He, he w- he was a, he was just a friend.
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
14. JBJoe Biden
  It's a lucky man and a woman that has a really truly good friend. And loyal my whole life.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  You talk about friendship, and one of the things that I've sort of come to see is that there's an entire industry that's trying to help us be better leaders, an entire industry that tries to help us be better parents, an entire industry that teaches us how to eat better or exercise better, but there's precious little that teaches us actually how to be friends. And I think, I think most people think they're good friends, but if you peel the onion just a little bit, I think most people actually could be better. For example, do we cancel on work for a friend, or do we cancel a friend for work? And we usually cancel on our friends because, you know, our friends will understand. And yet here you are. I think you set a remarkable example, that you clear schedule and travel for, to go to the funeral of a childhood friend. I know that for you it seems normal and natural, but it's actually becoming... I think it's becoming something that people are struggling with. It's, it's, it's a dying art-
16. JBJoe Biden
  Well, I understand why-
17. SSSimon Sinek
  ... how to be a friend
18. JBJoe Biden
  ... but look, I have an advantage. I'm President of the United States.
19. SSSimon Sinek
  [laughs]
20. JBJoe Biden
  No, I'm, I'm not being facetious. For example, um, I have a rule. I realized when we were doing the Bork hearing, which was a very controversial hearing-
21. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
22. JBJoe Biden
  ... [coughs] the fellow who had done the most research, the most informed, this was a five-month process. This particular guy was having trouble at home with his family. And the hearing started, and I realized how trouble, how much t- and I said, "No, you can't show, you can't show up." He said, "But I'm the only one that..." "Go home. Take care of first things first." And I didn't realize my whole staff didn't know that, so I write a letter to every new staff member, "If you have a personal problem, and it's real, you don't have to tell me what it is. Just tell me you can't be in, and go take care of it because I know you're not gonna lie to me. And if you do, you're fired, but just if you need it-"
23. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm
24. JBJoe Biden
  ... "just take it. And you don't have to tell me it's because your son is dying or your wife and you are having a problem or your mother's ill. Don't give me any explanation." Because that's what I did.
25. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
26. JBJoe Biden
  After I got elected, you know, my wife and daughter were killed-
27. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm, mm-hmm
28. JBJoe Biden
  ... and my two boys were badly injured, and life was kind of upside down. To make a long story not quite so long, I, uh, um, it was one of the things that I didn't wanna stay in the Senate.
29. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
30. JBJoe Biden
  And a number of senators, five of them got together, from Teddy Kennedy to Tom Eagleton to Fritz Hollings, to convince me to stay for 10 months. And, uh, what I realized when I had... I, I have a rule. If there's something important to my children, and it wasn't a critical vote, I'd go to the parent-teacher meeting. Not a joke.
10:46 – 16:00
The decline of trust in government
1. SSSimon Sinek
  change, uh, change tacks slightly, you know, trust in government has declined precipitously over, over the years. I think in the 1960s it was something like 70% of people trusted government, and now the numbers are hovering around 20%. You were inside, uh, in government this entire time, watching, uh, what was going on behind the scenes while that trust e- eroded in the public. Looking from the inside out, could you start to see what was happening, the way that business was being done, that you could predict-
2. JBJoe Biden
  Sure
3. SSSimon Sinek
  ... that this is not gonna be good for, for government and the relationship with the general public?
4. JBJoe Biden
  I was a senator for 36 years, and, uh, so I had a lot of friends on both sides of the aisle. We'd argue like hell, but we were friends. And, um, and so when I was vice president and things really began to go south, I realized we didn't, they didn't, we weren't talking to each other very much. So what I did was, as president of the Senate, [coughs] I showed up to go to lunch in the senators' dining room. There's two dining rooms down that hall by the elevator, first floor. On one, there's a w- a, a waiting room, and then there's a big o- restaurant where I could take you as a senator, and I could take you as my guest. There's another one to the left. There's, there's a, there's a room that is, uh, you walk in, there's a big archway at the other end.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  Two large tables that can seat, I guess, 15, 20 people at each table, with a buffet. Only senators allowed in there. And so what happened was I learned from Teddy Kennedy. He used to come... He was a great friend, and really helped me out. The whole family did, emotionally helped me out. And, uh, Teddy used to come by and say, "Come on, c-," in the beginning, "Go to lunch with me, Joe." I said, "I don't wanna go to lunch."
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
8. JBJoe Biden
  So finally one day, he came to the office about six m- eight months in. He said, "You're going to lunch with me, damn it." So I got up and went over, and he said, "Just sit and listen. You'll learn more sitting and listening to these guys." And he was right because when you learn that a man has a, a, a son that has a drug problem, or his wife has breast cancer-
9. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm
10. JBJoe Biden
  ... or he just lost his mother or... It's hard to really dislike him.
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
12. JBJoe Biden
  You get to know him a little bit. We used to travel together on tr- foreign trips with our f- our fam- our wives with us, and you get to know one another. You can disagree like hell, but you don't hate them. You don't, you don't cast aspersions on them. And so I got on pretty well with most senators on both sides of the aisle. And so when I was vice president, thing, I could feel things were going bad.
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
14. JBJoe Biden
  A lot of just things that never were said before-
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm
16. JBJoe Biden
  ... to people, one another. So I went over to have lunch in the Senate because I knew a lot of these guys.
17. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
18. JBJoe Biden
  There's no place you can have lunch anymore.
19. SSSimon Sinek
  Oh, really?
20. JBJoe Biden
  I walk in, there's just armchairs and couches.
21. SSSimon Sinek
  Huh.
22. JBJoe Biden
  Can't... If you and, if you're a Republican, and I'm a Democrat, no place we can go to eat unless it was one of our offices.
23. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
24. JBJoe Biden
  There used to be 20, 25 senators, both parties, in one, in one large room, and we got to know each other. And, and so it just, people don't talk. It's easier to-
25. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
26. JBJoe Biden
  ... really dislike someone and ascribe the worst, the worst characteristic to them when you don't know anything about them.
27. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
28. JBJoe Biden
  And that's what's happened.
29. SSSimon Sinek
  Did it really start when congressmen and senators used to move to DC if they got elected, move their families to DC? They all went to, you know, PTA meetings together and baseball games together, and then that stopped. You know, people live on their couches now, or they get a, a, a, a temporary apartment. Was it because they weren't hanging out, you know, after work?
30. JBJoe Biden
  It's really important, I think, in public life to understand where the other guy's coming from.
16:00 – 18:30
Political division in America
1. SSSimon Sinek
  And, you know, if I look at sort of the state of America right now, we don't like to listen to people who don't look like us, sound like us. Who have different political views than us, and I thought that politicians were a reflection of us. But now I'm starting to hear from you that the, that we're a reflection of our politicians, that they were the ones who stopped reaching across the aisle.
2. JBJoe Biden
  I wasn't gonna run again after my son died.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
4. JBJoe Biden
  And he died in 2015, Memorial Day. Um, and I was gonna write another book on the inflection points in world history. I think the things that happened in a very lo- re- relatively short period of time since the 1500s determine what it looks like for the next six, seven generations.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  For example, the idea that Europe would ever have been united without Gutenberg's printing press wouldn't have happened.
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
8. JBJoe Biden
  Look, look at all the... And look what's happening now. Where do you go for the truth?
9. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm.
10. JBJoe Biden
  And look what's gonna happen with artificial intelligence.
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
12. JBJoe Biden
  Someone sent me on the, my u- my iPhone, "I'm making a speech, make me sound like a fascist."
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
14. JBJoe Biden
  I couldn't tell it wasn't me.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
16. JBJoe Biden
  I, looking at it, I could not tell. So we have to figure out how we're gonna deal with the significant... Let me put it this way. The number of people that get their news from mainstream media-
17. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm
18. JBJoe Biden
  ... is de minimis.
19. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
20. JBJoe Biden
  And the mainstream media, there are no editors anymore. Nobody's saying, "You can't print that. That's not true." Everybody's looking for a click.
21. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
22. JBJoe Biden
  And I'm not being critical because they, they, they, they, that's how they get paid. That's what-
23. SSSimon Sinek
  Well, it's a, it's a misaligned incentive structure, isn't it?
24. JBJoe Biden
  Yeah, sure is.
25. SSSimon Sinek
  You know, it's, it's, it's personal, personal gain from what I can say, and when that gets screwed up, integrity is, integrity is sacrificed pretty quickly.
26. JBJoe Biden
  Yeah, and so, uh, for example, the stuff that people are saying now about Kamala, they're just making it up.
27. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
28. JBJoe Biden
  I think it's getting harder because I really am worried. I've made three major speeches on my concern about the f- future of democracy in America. I mean, it's really very, very difficult. But if you say it enough, say it enough, say it enough-
29. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm
30. JBJoe Biden
  ... say it enough, people believe it So if you have one source of news that already has a de- a determination of outcome-
18:30 – 20:01
Growing as a leader in the Senate
1. SSSimon Sinek
  you as a leader, I mean, I can imagine when you were elected, 29 years old, you show up in the Senate, I mean, starry-eyed and, you know, sort of, um, there's some sort of disbelief, and you weren't the leader then that you are now. I'm, I'm sure you've grown. How did the Senate help you grow?
2. JBJoe Biden
  Well, look, when I showed up in the Senate right after the accident, um, there was nothing starry-eyed about any of it. I mean, I didn't have, I didn't enter the Senate happy and excited and-
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
4. JBJoe Biden
  ... and I only agreed to stay for a while. Senator Mansfield, who had a great deal of integrity, he used to tell me that it's always appropriate to question another man's judgment, but never his motive. You have, you don't know what their motive is.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  And one of the rules I've kept, and that's why I think I've been relatively successful, but the point is-
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Relatively
8. JBJoe Biden
  ... that, well, only relatively.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  [laughs] I'm being facetious. You're President of the United States.
10. JBJoe Biden
  No, no, they haven't-
11. SSSimon Sinek
  I think it's worked out okay
12. JBJoe Biden
  ... I kept thinking about what, what would my family want of me.
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
14. JBJoe Biden
  I was lucky. I had some real mentors who looked out for me, and so it wasn't all starry-eyed. I was all, I didn't wanna stay. I would always walk into the Senate, walk, and the last, af- a- after 5:00, go up to the, the Secretary of the Senate and say, "How many more votes?" So I knew when to catch a train to go home to be with my kids.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  There's a line in the musical Hamilton, uh, in "The Room Where It Happens," you know, "Are you there in the room where it happens?"
20:01 – 23:16
What happens with world leaders behind closed doors?
1. SSSimon Sinek
  You have met a lot of world leaders over the course of your political career, and you've had a lot of private conversations with leaders w- uh, who are friends of our nation and sometimes with leaders who there's tension between our nations. I- is there a common thread that you have found when you go into these meetings? What actually happens in those meetings?
2. JBJoe Biden
  Well, I was the second-youngest senator in history, and I'm the oldest president in history. I've probably known personally and spent time with more world leaders than any president has in American history. Not to make good or bad, just longevity.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
4. JBJoe Biden
  And you know an awful lot about the positions of these folks before you go in.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  And one of the things I find, no matter what it is, is being straightforward is always the best bet, especially to get, and when I wanna really get down with a- another world leader I disagree with, whether it's Putin or whoever, I do it alone.
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
8. JBJoe Biden
  Just he and I in the room. Because you take a measure of a man, whether you know he knows he's lying to you-
9. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm
10. JBJoe Biden
  ... or you know he's te- he thinks he's telling you the truth. You get a sense of whether or not they care about what they're, or they mean what they say, or they're just trying to mislead you.
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
12. JBJoe Biden
  And that also g- requires an awful lot of intelligence background and work and knowing these people. For example, he wouldn't mind my saying it, when I got all those prisoners freed from Russia, one of the things I had to do was get the chancellor of Germany to release a really bad guy-
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm
14. JBJoe Biden
  ... in return for getting those.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
16. JBJoe Biden
  And I, I, I trusted him. I know him, and I knew it was a hard call. He saw my wife at the Olympics, and he said, "Only reason I did it is I trust Joe. I did it for Joe."
17. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
18. JBJoe Biden
  I used to drive Barack crazy because we'd start every day together at 9:00 in the Oval Office.
19. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
20. JBJoe Biden
  And one of the things I'd always say to him, "All politics is personal." It's personal. It's a personal relationship. It matters to know who the other person is. And I think most of these guys, good, bad, or indifferent, are pretty good reads of personalities. They can tell whether or not you mean what you say, and you say what you mean, and you have, you have any empathy. So I think it, it, it really matters building personal relationships.
21. SSSimon Sinek
  S- so one of the my favorite things about America is our optimism and our idealism, and I love to joke with my friends that we celebrate our independence on July 4th, 1776, but that's not when we had independence. That's when we signed the Declaration of Independence. We didn't win our independence until September 3rd, 1783-
22. JBJoe Biden
  Good point
23. SSSimon Sinek
  ... with the Treaty of Paris, full seven years after the signing of the Declaration of Independence. But in true American fashion, you know, we celebrate our independence from the day we thought about it, not the day we actually had it. And I, and George Washington wasn't elected until, you know, many years later, six years later. And this is, this is my favorite thing about America, just, like, we just believe we can. But it seems to feel these days that our idealism and our,
23:16 – 27:26
Have Americans lost their idealism?
1. SSSimon Sinek
  our over sense of, a, a grandized sense of, of, of optimism seems to be diminished. And it seems that our leaders in politics, they don't talk about world peace anymore. They don't talk about big ideas. A lot of it is small. A lot of it's wins and losses and taking the win and making sure the other guy had lost. You know, A, is that true? Do you think that there, that, that we've lost our idealism maybe since the fall of the Berlin Wall? And if so, what do we do to get it back?
2. JBJoe Biden
  I haven't lost my idealism. I, uh, I end all my speeches by pointing out there's not a damn thing America can't do if we do it together. Nothing. And I believe that. Not a damn thing. Not a single solitary thing. And if you notice my... I get criticized. I, for example, I put together a peace plan for, for Israel and the Gaza. I got it adopted by the entire UN Security Council, all of our NATO allies. People said, and I get asked by the press, understandably are cynical, saying, "What makes you think you can make it work?"
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Right.
4. JBJoe Biden
  You know what I mean? You got that done, but w- like, what's gonna happen? But we continue to work on it. I continue every day to plow away at deciding to try to change the dynamic and change the leadership in other places as well. I think we're the only country in the history of the world that has come out of every crisis stronger than we went into the crisis. I mean that sincerely.
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  Like, for example, I, uh, I spent more time with Xi Jinping than any world leader has. And I was in China with him, and he turned to me, he said, "Can you define America for me?" I said, "Yes, in one word," and I meant it. He said, "What's that?" I said, "Possibilities."
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
8. JBJoe Biden
  We think anything's possible.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  You said we can achieve anything if we work together. The problem is, this goes back to the beginning of our conversation, is we're not very good at together anymore.
10. JBJoe Biden
  Well, guess what? Remember they told me I could never get the plan done for infrastructure. I got a trillion three hundred thousand dollars-
11. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
12. JBJoe Biden
  ... trillion dollar. They told me I couldn't get the veterans' benefits done.
13. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
14. JBJoe Biden
  I got it done. They told me I couldn't get... Every single thing we passed, five major pieces of legislation, and we're now in a situation where we have the most, uh, our economy is the strongest economy in the world.
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm. Hmm.
16. JBJoe Biden
  So what, what I have been surprised about, and I will not tell you the names because I promised I wouldn't.
17. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
18. JBJoe Biden
  In my first two years, there were seven senators on the other team that I used to work with who individually called me to tell me, "Joe, I agree with you, but I just can't do it."
19. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
20. JBJoe Biden
  "I just can't do it." What surprises me is what is it that's changed in terms of the kind of... I know they don't agree with this MAGA malarkey. But why? What, uh, what, what kind of threat, uh, does Trump have holding over these people? For example, the border. We worked for four damn weeks, a month, to work out a deal on the border with one of the most conservative senators in the United States Senate. We got a deal.
21. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
22. JBJoe Biden
  We got... We were about to make, have it pass. As it was voted on, Trump picked up the phone, this is public knowledge-
23. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
24. JBJoe Biden
  ... called the Republican senators and said, "You're in trouble with me if you support it. It's-"
25. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
26. JBJoe Biden
  "All you're gonna do is help Biden-
27. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm
28. JBJoe Biden
  ... and hurt me."
29. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
30. JBJoe Biden
  Even though he acknowledges it was, it was the single most significant thing we could have done. That is a big change.
27:26 – 31:50
Biden's proudest achievement
1. SSSimon Sinek
  You, you've, you've had a remarkable career. You've achieved some amazing things over the course of your career. I'm curious, was there one thing, one project, one piece of legislation, it doesn't even matter whether it was successful, but something that you've worked on, something specific that you've worked on over the course of your entire career that you loved, loved being a part of that process, and if everything you worked on your entire career was like this one thing, it, you'd be the happiest person alive?
2. JBJoe Biden
  The Violence Against Women Act.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  Say more.
4. JBJoe Biden
  Well, you know, at the time I started to talk about it, as chairman of the Judiciary Committee, I had done a lot of research on it. And, uh, people said, "You can't, you can't do this." And, a- and even people who thought it was unfair, thought I was interfering, I was gonna break up families. I was... And I just kept at it for two years, for two years, and I wrote it with, as my daughter would say, with my own paw. And, uh, and it's the most significant thing that I've ever done because I'm of the view, the view that, uh, there's not a damn thing in the world that a man can do that a woman can't do. I mean that sincerely, nothing, number one. Number two, that the victimization and abuse of women... My father used to say, "The greatest sin of all," and he would, this is really what he'd say, is, "abuse of power."
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
6. JBJoe Biden
  "And the greatest abuse of power is a man lifting his hand to a woman or a child."
7. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
8. JBJoe Biden
  And that's what... I mean, it was rampant, but we made so much progress.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  Hmm.
10. JBJoe Biden
  Changed so many lives, given people hope, and saved the children of those circumstances, in those circumstances.
11. SSSimon Sinek
  So, so let me push you a little bit, which is you've done amazing things. What is it about this specific act, this, the Violence Against Women-
12. JBJoe Biden
  Because-
13. SSSimon Sinek
  ... that stands out amongst all the other remarkable things that you could have talked about?
14. JBJoe Biden
  Because there were so many people, millions of women, who were in a situation where they couldn't get out. They didn't have any options. And we changed the law. We changed the rules. We changed everything-
15. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
16. JBJoe Biden
  ... from providing housing to providing opportunities. And what it's done, it's also created a generation of women who don't put up with it anymore, who, who are able to step back from it. And, but the biggest thing it's done, in my view, is see the incredible change and opportunity it presents for the children of these marriages.
17. SSSimon Sinek
  And what is it that you loved about it? Again-
18. JBJoe Biden
  Because I was a runt. I was a, you know, I was a skinny guy who stuttered and... But, um, the abuse of power-
19. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah
20. JBJoe Biden
  ... was the worst thing anyone could exercise. And for example, I remember that, uh, I was, uh, we're, we lived in Scranton, Pennsylvania, we're, had lived in Scranton, but we would go home for the summers and be at my, live in my grandpop's house, all holidays and everything. And one day we're up there, and there was an area in Scranton, I lived in a place called Greenwich. It was a middle-class neighborhood. And there was a place called The Plot down by the Lackawanna River, and the guys in The Plot had some tough gangs, and they'd come up on, up our way. I was 13 years old or 14 years old, and one of the guys, one of the, a group of guys came up from The Plot on Dimick Avenue, which is behind my house. And, uh, my mother's looking out the window in the pantry. You looked out through the small backyard, and sees this one guy, he's a little older than me, smack me and really hit me in the face, knocked me down.
21. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
22. JBJoe Biden
  And I got up, and I came walking in, and my grandfather's at the kitchen table, retired. "What's the matter, Joe?" I told him. He said, "Oh, that's a shame," honey. Walked in, my mother said, "Come here, Joe."
23. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
24. JBJoe Biden
  "I just watched what happened. You go back out there and smack him."
25. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
26. JBJoe Biden
  I said, "Mom, he'll kill me." She said, "I'll give you a quarter if you do."
27. SSSimon Sinek
  Mm-hmm.
28. JBJoe Biden
  She said, "Because if you don't, you'll never be able to walk out there again. But one thing, Joe, when you do, when you walk out, you've got to make sure, wait till he comes up to you, and you gotta hit him right in the nose as hard as you can." I said, "He'll kill..." I said, "Joey, I'm telling you." So I went back out. Had... I was more afraid of my mother than I was... Hit him in the nose, started bleeding. Went, "Ah," and every- and ran. The point was, my mother would say, "You just can't yield to a bully."
29. SSSimon Sinek
  Yeah.
30. JBJoe Biden
  You can't do it. I was scared to death. I wasn't, wasn't I was so brave. I st- that's what Tommy Build and I were talking about before he died. [laughs] Um-
31:50 – 33:09
Protecting those who protect others
1. SSSimon Sinek
  I've loved, uh, talking to you about and the, the pattern that I see over this entire conversation from the, um, the, the legislation that you're proud of and, and, and the conversation about friends and, and, and the losses you've had as a, uh, i- in your, in your personal life, and, and, and this story as well, is you always provide protection for people so that they can do the thing that they need to do to protect others. But just like your mom s- was, gave you top cover, uh, you know, for you to go fight the bully, and you p- passed legislation so people could go protect other people. And even what you, what you do with your staff, you give them safe space to go look after their families. And, and, and it seems like through your whole career you've offered, you've offered people the safety and protection and backup so that they can do that thing for others, the, the people that they love.
2. JBJoe Biden
  Everyone, everyone deserves a fair shot, and there's so many ways we can do it.
3. SSSimon Sinek
  It's beautiful. Mr. President, thank you so much for taking the time.
4. JBJoe Biden
  I'm not sure this is worth your time-
5. SSSimon Sinek
  Such an honor
6. JBJoe Biden
  ... but thank you for it.
7. SSSimon Sinek
  And such, so inspiring. Thank you so much, sir.
8. JBJoe Biden
  Well, thank you. Appreciate it.
9. SSSimon Sinek
  Thank you. If you enjoyed this podcast and would like to hear more, please subscribe wherever you like to listen to podcasts. And if you'd like even more optimism, check out my website, simonsinek.com. Until then, take care of yourself, take care of each other.