The Search for Self-Love with podcaster Lewis Howes | A Bit of Optimism Podcast

1. 0:00 – 4:57

   Learning to say "no"

   1. SSSimon Sinek0:00

      When someone feels guilt or shame about their financial situation, what is the first step to address those negative feelings and start fixing the problem?

   2. LHLewis Howes0:11

      [sighs] I'm gonna say something you're not gonna like.

   3. SSSimon Sinek0:13

      Why do you, why like-

   4. LHLewis Howes0:14

      Because I'm speaking in words and terminology that-

   5. SSSimon Sinek0:17

      As long as you don't say, "Find your bliss"-

   6. LHLewis Howes0:19

      [laughs]

   7. SSSimon Sinek0:20

      ... I'm pretty much gonna be all in for anything.

   8. LHLewis Howes0:21

      Love yourself. Um-

   9. SSSimon Sinek0:23

      Loving yourself is fine.

   10. LHLewis Howes0:25

       Yeah, yeah.

   11. SSSimon Sinek0:25

       Have you ever had that thought flash through your brain, "Do people really like me? I mean, sure, they laugh at my jokes, but do they really like me?" Or, "Why haven't they texted me back? I mean, damn it, I knew I shouldn't have worded that last text the way I did." What do we do to make sure we don't fall into a spiral of self-doubt? The self-help world may have some answers, but too often it can get a little woo-woo and not, well, that helpful. That's why I sat down with Lewis Howes, former pro athlete, bestselling author, and host of the podcast The School of Greatness, to get actionable. We unpacked our insecurities and so much more. How can we all get to the place where we can say to ourselves, truly, "I really love myself"? This is A Bit of Optimism. [upbeat music] What was your question?

   12. LHLewis Howes1:25

       What's the, the biggest challenge you're facing emotionally or mentally right now?

   13. SSSimon Sinek1:29

       Okay.

   14. LHLewis Howes1:30

       In your life.

   15. SSSimon Sinek1:31

       So Lewis, what's the biggest challenge you're facing-

   16. LHLewis Howes1:33

       [laughs]

   17. SSSimon Sinek1:33

       ... emotionally or mentally right now?

   18. LHLewis Howes1:36

       Are we rolling? [laughs]

   19. SSSimon Sinek1:38

       [laughs] Yeah, sure.

   20. LHLewis Howes1:39

       Okay. Um, it's continuing to learn to say no to a lot a- and being okay with not doing everything. And for me, it's like there's so many ways that I could do things or make money or that are exciting, and reminding myself to just say no and wait until it really feels aligned.

   21. SSSimon Sinek1:59

       If you're trying to learn to say no better, why were you saying yes before?

   22. LHLewis Howes2:06

       Scarcity.

   23. SSSimon Sinek2:07

       Scarcity mindset?

   24. LHLewis Howes2:08

       Yeah. Needing validation and feeling scarce, like I don't have everything I need, so I need to go say yes to every project, everything, be everywhere, travel, accomplish, accomplish, so that I can feel more worthy and deserving and feel like I've got something saved up as well.

   25. SSSimon Sinek2:26

       So are you saying no now because now you have an abundance mindset? Are you saying no now because you have enough?

   26. LHLewis Howes2:31

       I like validation, if I'm being honest, but I don't need it a- as much. It's not that I don't need it. I still enjoy validation, but I'm not creating to get validation.

   27. SSSimon Sinek2:42

       So when you talk about validation, you're talking about likes on a post, size of an audience?

   28. LHLewis Howes2:45

       People telling you you're amazing or, "I like this thing," or whatever. Like, for example, yesterday I was at, uh, having breakfast after a workout with my, my business partner, and we were having breakfast, and I noticed someone was, like, kind of looking over at us from the side of the restaurant. I was like, "Ah, I don't know, maybe they know who I am, maybe not," but they were just kind of, like, smiling and looking over. I was like, "Ah," and nodding. And then [clears throat] I asked for the check, and they had just left, and the, the waiter came up and said, "Oh, they just paid for your meal. They're big fans." And I just thought, "That's really kind. That's really generous. That's really nice." It's a nice little validation. It's not like I was looking for that to happen.

   29. SSSimon Sinek3:19

       Sure.

   30. LHLewis Howes3:19

       And I went out and I said thank you to them. I'm not just gonna let them run away.
2. 4:57 – 15:01

   Healing from trauma takes a long time

   1. SSSimon Sinek4:57

      So you said you've been on a 12-year healing journey.

   2. LHLewis Howes4:59

      Yes.

   3. SSSimon Sinek4:59

      Healing from what?

   4. LHLewis Howes5:01

      The demons inside of me that have driven me to be a accomplishing machine. Um, the, the triggers and the traumas that have made me say horrible things about myself to myself, the triggers and traumas that have cultivated me into just living a life where I don't feel peace. And I've tried to unwind and unpack all those things over the last 12 years, really when I started School of Greatness, by interviewing people like you, therapists, other people, and then doing tons of just inner work, therapeutic work, to find out how to create wholeness within me emotionally, spiritually.

   5. SSSimon Sinek5:41

      Your demons drove you to accomplish?

   6. LHLewis Howes5:43

      I think so, yeah.

   7. SSSimon Sinek5:44

      Say more.

   8. LHLewis Howes5:46

      I never felt enough.

   9. SSSimon Sinek5:47

      Mm-hmm.

   10. LHLewis Howes5:48

       And I always felt abused and, and taken advantage of. I was sexually abused when I was five years old by a man that I didn't know. I've talked about this many times publicly, but that story, that wound, drove me unconsciously, and probably consciously, for 25 years of my life until I started to talk about it and started the process and heal it when I hit about 30 years old, [clears throat] 12 years ago. And-All I wanted to do was accomplish, to kind of run away from the pain, run away from the wound-

   11. SSSimon Sinek6:18

       Mm

   12. LHLewis Howes6:19

       ... and feel worthy and deserving and enough.

   13. SSSimon Sinek6:22

       Mm.

   14. LHLewis Howes6:22

       'Cause I never felt enough, 'cause I felt like if I was enough, why would someone sexually abuse me?

   15. SSSimon Sinek6:27

       Mm.

   16. LHLewis Howes6:28

       Why would these kids pick on me? Why would they pick me last on the sports playground? Why would they steal money from me? Why would they li- all these things. And so I didn't feel enough, so I had to go prove-

   17. SSSimon Sinek6:39

       Mm-hmm

   18. LHLewis Howes6:39

       ... to others who picked on me that I was worthy and I was enough. And I don't think it was consciously like, "I'm gonna go prove this," but it was-

   19. SSSimon Sinek6:46

       Mm

   20. LHLewis Howes6:46

       ... it was the story that was driving me. And those wounds, those triggers, those traumas guided me. And some beautiful things came out of it, right? It's like I was able to accomplish, I became financially free, I got off my sister's couch that I was living on for a year and a half. It drove me to figure things out, to overcome fears, to accomplish things, to get on my own two feet, per se. But what I realized when I hit 30, that I had accomplished all these things but still didn't feel enough.

   21. SSSimon Sinek7:16

       Mm-hmm.

   22. LHLewis Howes7:16

       So what's the point of having the everything that other people want and not loving yourself and still feeling all the pain inside?

   23. SSSimon Sinek7:23

       So if I accomplish these things, then I'll feel worthy.

   24. LHLewis Howes7:25

       Yeah.

   25. SSSimon Sinek7:25

       That's a very powerful driver, right? It makes sense why you would become a professional athlete.

   26. LHLewis Howes7:29

       Mm-hmm.

   27. SSSimon Sinek7:29

       It makes sense why you would be a very successful entrepreneur. Because if I, if I just hit, win this medal-

   28. LHLewis Howes7:36

       Yeah

   29. SSSimon Sinek7:36

       ... win this co- competition-

   30. LHLewis Howes7:37

       Solve all my problems
3. 15:01 – 21:49

   Money therapy with Simon and Lewis

   1. SSSimon Sinek15:01

      One of the biggest sources of stress in people's lives, it destroys relationships.

   2. LHLewis Howes15:06

      Mm-hmm.

   3. SSSimon Sinek15:07

      Money.

   4. LHLewis Howes15:08

      Yep.

   5. SSSimon Sinek15:09

      And our relationship with money. And I know that you are now very focused on helping people overcome the stress that money sometimes-

   6. LHLewis Howes15:16

      Yes

   7. SSSimon Sinek15:17

      ... gives us.

   8. LHLewis Howes15:18

      Yes.

   9. SSSimon Sinek15:19

      Why does money cause us stress?

   10. LHLewis Howes15:22

       [sighs] I think it's all in our interpretation of money. For some people, it doesn't cause them stress.

   11. SSSimon Sinek15:26

       Right, or the relationship with money. I get that.

   12. LHLewis Howes15:28

       It's the relationship with money.

   13. SSSimon Sinek15:29

       Mm-hmm.

   14. LHLewis Howes15:29

       And it's all based on our money story.

   15. SSSimon Sinek15:30

       Mm-hmm.

   16. LHLewis Howes15:31

       So I had different stories that caused little wounds or little traumas within me psychologically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually, that created a, a nervous system or a feeling that would felt unsafe-

   17. SSSimon Sinek15:45

       Mm-hmm

   18. LHLewis Howes15:45

       ... that felt scarce-

   19. SSSimon Sinek15:45

       Mm-hmm

   20. LHLewis Howes15:46

       ... when money was involved. When I was eight years old, my brother went to prison for four and a half years for selling drugs to an undercover cop. He was 11 years older than me, so he was n- 19, fresh in college, went to prison, selling LSD to an undercover cop. This was in the '90s when the war against drugs was a big thing, and so it was like your first offense, you're in for the maximum sentence. So it was 6 to 25 years-

   21. SSSimon Sinek16:09

       Wow

   22. LHLewis Howes16:10

       ... was the sentence. He got off in four and a half on good behavior. That event was very traumatizing for our family.

   23. SSSimon Sinek16:16

       Mm.

   24. LHLewis Howes16:17

       Growing up in a small town in the middle of Ohio, we were lower middle class, so all the money and resources went to lawyers and just, like, dealing with that. Now, the traumas after that, it was like, okay, I didn't have friends really for four and a half years. Because you... Small town, everyone knows everyone's business on the block in the suburbs. Everyone knew my brother went to prison.

   25. SSSimon Sinek16:41

       So then you were treated like a pariah as, like, your family was sort of-

   26. LHLewis Howes16:43

       Just, like, their, the other kids-

   27. SSSimon Sinek16:45

       Right

   28. LHLewis Howes16:45

       ... weren't able to hang out with me.

   29. SSSimon Sinek16:46

       Yeah.

   30. LHLewis Howes16:47

       Right? It's like, "Okay, he, he must be a bad kid, too."
4. 21:49 – 26:45

   Imagine money was a person

   1. LHLewis Howes21:49

      in the door right now, imagine money was a person.

   2. SSSimon Sinek21:50

      Yeah.

   3. LHLewis Howes21:51

      Hypothetically-

   4. SSSimon Sinek21:52

      Yeah

   5. LHLewis Howes21:52

      ... it's a person. Identify money as a person, and it walked in the door. What would your first emotional reaction or what would you do if you saw money come in as a person? What would that relationship be like with you and money?

   6. SSSimon Sinek22:03

      Yeah. That... Why would you think I wouldn't like that? That is brilliant.

   7. LHLewis Howes22:07

      Okay. Well-

   8. SSSimon Sinek22:07

      I think it's brilliant.

   9. LHLewis Howes22:08

      But what that, what would that relationship be for you right now?

   10. SSSimon Sinek22:11

       Are you asking me?

   11. LHLewis Howes22:11

       I'm asking you the question.

   12. SSSimon Sinek22:12

       Um, I would say there would be slight tension.

   13. LHLewis Howes22:17

       Okay.

   14. SSSimon Sinek22:17

       It was someone I used to hate because I was a, because I was just super judgmental and never really got to know them.

   15. LHLewis Howes22:24

       Uh-huh.

   16. SSSimon Sinek22:25

       And, um, and after I got to know them and understand that they're, they're actually not the bad person I thought they were-

   17. LHLewis Howes22:33

       Mm-hmm

   18. SSSimon Sinek22:33

       ... and my irrational hatred of them was causing me more pain than them, 'cause they don't give a shit and they weren't thinking about me at all. Um, but rather, if I could learn to be friends with that person, that they would be there to help me, um, more than I've, uh, accepted their help, would have accepted their help in the past.

   19. LHLewis Howes22:51

       Interesting.

   20. SSSimon Sinek22:51

       Yeah.

   21. LHLewis Howes22:52

       No, that's a beautiful reflection, and I would love everyone to think about that, watching or listening, or leave a comment below your video about if money walked into the room-

   22. SSSimon Sinek23:00

       It's a great exercise

   23. LHLewis Howes23:02

       ... what is the relationship to money for you right now?

   24. SSSimon Sinek23:04

       It's an excellent, excellent, excellent-

   25. LHLewis Howes23:05

       And that is going to... I asked a-

   26. SSSimon Sinek23:08

       It's excellent

   27. LHLewis Howes23:08

       ... I asked someone in their late 20s this co-... I, I said, "If money walked in... You're at a restaurant-

   28. SSSimon Sinek23:13

       Yeah

   29. LHLewis Howes23:13

       ... and money walks in, what would you do?" And they said, "I would run to the bar and hide. I would gossip about them behind their back-

   30. SSSimon Sinek23:21

       [laughs]
5. 26:45 – 29:31

   Lewis shares 2 money stories

   1. LHLewis Howes26:45

      tied to this. One, I probably would have never been in this position if two things didn't happen. One, my dad had gotten into a, a near-fatal car accident when I was 22, my senior year in college. My parents got divorced when I was a teenager. He went to New Zealand with his then fiance, and he got into a car accident where the car came on top of his car and hit him through the windshield-

   2. SSSimon Sinek27:07

      No way

   3. LHLewis Howes27:08

      ... and he was in, he was in a coma for three months-

   4. SSSimon Sinek27:09

      Wow

   5. LHLewis Howes27:10

      ... in New Zealand. And we didn't know if he was gonna live or die. And my dad always said, you know, "Go chase your dreams, and if it doesn't work out or when you're done, you can always come work for me and sell insurance." And I, like, you know, grew up learning about life insurance. But it wasn't, like, my passion. It wasn't, like, my calling. But I w- it was a safety net, though. It was like, okay, my dad has figured out how to make money after 32 years of busting his butt. The last five years before his accident, he was starting to get bigger commissions from those, you know, 25-plus years. They were like, finally it was paying off. Like, finally he could buy a car, a new car. Finally, like, he could go on better vacations. It was like all that hard work paid off, and then boom, he gets this accident. And then all the money is gone. First, the medical bills were through the roof, and he got rid of his health insurance a few months prior, so he wasn't able to cover... Health insurance didn't cover it. When they flew him back from New Zealand, he finally woke up three months later, flew him back. He was physically in this world, but it was like he emotionally, spiritually gone.

   6. SSSimon Sinek28:13

      Mm.

   7. LHLewis Howes28:13

      He wasn't the same man.

   8. SSSimon Sinek28:15

      Mm.

   9. LHLewis Howes28:15

      So it was like talking to a child-

   10. SSSimon Sinek28:17

       Mm-hmm

   11. LHLewis Howes28:17

       ... who didn't remember who you were. So the, the sadness that I felt, and our whole family felt, was worse than, like, lo- him losing his money.

   12. SSSimon Sinek28:26

       Mm.

   13. LHLewis Howes28:26

       And he lost his money essentially from the medical bills, but also his fiance at the time became power of attorney, because he wasn't able to work anymore or comm- really communicate. She took all the money out of his life insurance policies-

   14. SSSimon Sinek28:39

       Oh, no

   15. LHLewis Howes28:39

       ... that he invested in us.

   16. SSSimon Sinek28:41

       Oh.

   17. LHLewis Howes28:41

       He had ownership of them, and took all the money.

   18. SSSimon Sinek28:44

       Yeah.

   19. LHLewis Howes28:44

       So there was nothing for us. If that accident... And I'm not... I mean, it was a devastating experience, but had he had something for me, I don't know if I would have been this innovative and courageous-

   20. SSSimon Sinek28:57

       Sure

   21. LHLewis Howes28:57

       ... to go figure it out on my own.

   22. SSSimon Sinek28:58

       Yeah.

   23. LHLewis Howes28:59

       Or find other mentors to help teach me.

   24. SSSimon Sinek29:01

       That makes sense.

   25. LHLewis Howes29:02

       That was one, that I would not be here, I think, without him going through that experience. And the second thing is when I was living on my sister's couch during this time for a year and a half, she was like, "You gotta pay rent." I wasn't paying anything for a year and a half, and her saying, like, "You either ha- you have to leave or pay rent."

   26. SSSimon Sinek29:18

       Yeah.

   27. LHLewis Howes29:20

       And I left and begged my brother to let me stay at his house, and he was like, "You need to pay $250 a month to have a room here."

   28. SSSimon Sinek29:26

       Yeah.

   29. LHLewis Howes29:27

       But that forced me to step up and take action and

6. 29:31 – 42:35

   Is courage external or internal?

   1. LHLewis Howes29:31

      have courage.

   2. SSSimon Sinek29:31

      I don't know if we've ever talked about this, about courage.

   3. LHLewis Howes29:33

      Mm.

   4. SSSimon Sinek29:33

      Have we, have we talked about courage, that I think courage is external, not internal?

   5. LHLewis Howes29:37

      Tell me, what do you mean by that?

   6. SSSimon Sinek29:39

      So, so I, I think courage, for the most part, is not an internal thing, where you dig down deep and find the courage.

   7. LHLewis Howes29:46

      Yeah.

   8. SSSimon Sinek29:46

      I actually don't believe that for the most part. I think courage is actually an external thing, where-

   9. LHLewis Howes29:51

      Mm-hmm

   10. SSSimon Sinek29:51

       ... you know, the reason you have the courage to jump out of a perfectly good airplane is because of the parachute on your back. Without the parashut- parachute, you don't have courage, right? A world-famous trapeze artist would never try a brand-new death-defying act for the first time without a net. The net gives you the courage to take the risk, right? Your dad saying, "Go pursue your dreams. Don't worry, you can always come sell insurance if you need to," that's a safety net, right? Gives you the courage to do-

   11. LHLewis Howes30:16

       Yeah

   12. SSSimon Sinek30:16

       ... go do crazy things. And anyone who's ever served in the military will tell you they're not running to the sound of the gun for God and country. It's persons left and person to the right. It's the relationships that give you the courage to do difficult things. And any of us that has to do, that have to do something difficult for ourselves, at work, whatever it is, entrepreneurial venture, take on, you know, address trauma, whatever it is-

   13. LHLewis Howes30:38

       Mm-hmm

   14. SSSimon Sinek30:39

       ... all you need is one person in your life... that is standing next to you who says, "I got you."

   15. LHLewis Howes30:46

       Yeah.

   16. SSSimon Sinek30:46

       "If this thing goes completely sideways, still here."

   17. LHLewis Howes30:50

       I mean-

   18. SSSimon Sinek30:50

       "I got you." And that, that is where courage comes from.

   19. LHLewis Howes30:54

       Workshop this with me then. The things I've had to have the most courage around is having challenging conversations with people where I didn't really wanna disappoint them or have them upset or reacting in a certain way, typically in previous relationships.

   20. SSSimon Sinek31:08

       Sure.

   21. LHLewis Howes31:08

       Intimate relationships. And what I realized is I was so afraid of someone else externally rather than how I felt about me.

   22. SSSimon Sinek31:17

       Mm-hmm.

   23. LHLewis Howes31:17

       And I didn't have the courage to know that I was safe with me, no matter what happened with some o- other relationship.

   24. SSSimon Sinek31:24

       Mm-hmm.

   25. LHLewis Howes31:24

       That I was communicating or not doing something or doing something that they wanted or didn't want me to do.

   26. SSSimon Sinek31:28

       Mm-hmm.

   27. LHLewis Howes31:29

       That's where I struggled around the courage. It was always around, [lips smack] you know, having the courage to speak on stage for years was terrifying 'cause I didn't feel safe with me.

   28. SSSimon Sinek31:39

       Mm-hmm.

   29. LHLewis Howes31:39

       Sure, I didn't wanna be humiliated by others-

   30. SSSimon Sinek31:41

       Mm-hmm
7. 42:35 – 51:39

   Where to look for self-worth

   1. SSSimon Sinek42:35

      You know?

   2. LHLewis Howes42:35

      What did you think you measured your self-worth to, then, if it wasn't, like, your grades or your, your-

   3. SSSimon Sinek42:41

      As a kid?

   4. LHLewis Howes42:41

      Yeah.

   5. SSSimon Sinek42:42

      In junior high school, so what's that? Like, seventh-

   6. LHLewis Howes42:46

      Seventh and eighth grade

   7. SSSimon Sinek42:46

      ... seventh and eighth grade-

   8. LHLewis Howes42:48

      Yeah

   9. SSSimon Sinek42:48

      ... my best friend was Adam. He was the leader. He was the alpha of our little posse, right?He was the alpha dog

   10. LHLewis Howes42:56

       Physically or emotion-wise?

   11. SSSimon Sinek42:58

       No, just like there's always a leader of the group

   12. LHLewis Howes42:59

       Yeah, yeah

   13. SSSimon Sinek42:59

       And he was the leader

   14. LHLewis Howes42:59

       Energetically, he was, yeah

   15. SSSimon Sinek43:00

       You know, he was, he was the leader of our group, right? We all, like, we all wanted to be like Adam

   16. LHLewis Howes43:04

       Follow him. Yeah, yeah.

   17. SSSimon Sinek43:04

       Yeah. We all followed Adam, right? And Adam and I, you know, as kids do, young, young boys, like, we had a fight over who knows what, something stupid, and the next day I got on the bus and nobody sat next to me. None of my quote-unquote "friends" from the posse sat next to me. They all sat in different seats.

   18. LHLewis Howes43:18

       Ouch.

   19. SSSimon Sinek43:18

       And I had no friends because I had a fight with Adam-

   20. LHLewis Howes43:20

       Oh, man

   21. SSSimon Sinek43:20

       ... and he instructed them not to sit next to me.

   22. LHLewis Howes43:22

       Oh.

   23. SSSimon Sinek43:23

       So I got punished, right? And that loneliness and that, like, you gotta be kidding me, right? And so at a fairly young age, I was able to say, "How the hell is my happiness that who I sit next to on the b- who will sit next to me on the bus is conditional if I, like, kiss the ring, if I'm, like, have to be nice to Adam otherwise I have no friends? This is ridiculous that I'm relying on somebody else, like, for my friends."

   24. LHLewis Howes43:51

       Mm.

   25. SSSimon Sinek43:52

       And so at a pretty early age, I started experimenting with being my own self and taking responsibility for my own, like, whatever it was. But baby steps, right?

   26. LHLewis Howes44:03

       Yeah.

   27. SSSimon Sinek44:03

       And so, like, I went to American school, so, you know, jeans, sneakers, T-shirts was, you know, what we wore to school, and I started wearing shoes. Like, black shoes. Nobody wore shoes. Everybody wore sneakers.

   28. LHLewis Howes44:17

       Like dress shoes, like nicer-

   29. SSSimon Sinek44:18

       Yeah, like nicer shoes

   30. LHLewis Howes44:19

       Yeah.

Episode duration: 51:42