Gwynne Shotwell, President and COO of SpaceX

1. 0:00 – 0:49

   Intro

   1. SPSpeaker0:00

      [upbeat music] [birds chirping] [dramatic music] [footsteps] [machine beeping]

2. 0:49 – 3:37

   Dragon launch audio and on-orbit moments set the stage

   1. SPSpeaker0:49

      Dragon, SpaceX Com track ground stations. Integration forward. Go for launch. Launching SpaceX.

   2. SPSpeaker0:54

      Three, two, one, zero. [rocket roaring] [upbeat music] Welcome aboard, Dragon. We got to see ISS out the window, which was pretty neat. The largest window ever flown in space.

   3. SPSpeaker1:34

      We have liftoff. [audience cheering] [upbeat music] [audience cheering]

   4. SPSpeaker2:51

      Gwynne, welcome to Stanford.

   5. SPSpeaker2:53

      Thank you very much. I'm really excited to be here, actually. I love this school.

   6. SPSpeaker2:57

      Um, I've been looking forward to this interview for a very long time, as I know have many of my classmates. I... bit of s- of a space nerd. I, as a kid, would read all the space books over the '60s. Apollo 13 was my favorite movie. I think still is my favorite movie. Gene Kranz, the mythical flight director, was a childhood hero. Um, so it's really great to have you. Um, to me, space has always been about the next frontier and testing the limits of what is possible. And today, nobody embodies that better than SpaceX and your story. Um, so with that, let's get started. One of the defining characteristics of SpaceX, uh, is, is risk-taking, but the same can be said about you joining the company-

3. 3:37 – 6:17

   Why Shotwell joined SpaceX after a stable aerospace career

   1. SPSpeaker3:37

      Mm-hmm

   2. SPSpeaker3:37

      ... 20 years ago this year after a stable career in aerospace. What led you to join SpaceX and take that risk at that time?

   3. SPSpeaker3:44

      Well, first of all, I wanna start out by saying thank goodness I took that risk-

   4. SPSpeaker3:47

      [laughs]

   5. SPSpeaker3:48

      ... 'cause I almost didn't, in fact. And when Elon asked me to be president in 2008, I almost didn't say yes. What a mistake that would have been. Um, yeah, so I was in the aerospace industry. I started, I started my engineering career, when was it? In '86. Went to Chrysler Motors. Went back to school 'cause I was unsatisfied with the level of technology that I was working on there. Um, went back to university, thought I'd get my PhD. Wacky, said I can't be in school again. I g- I'm gonna go back to work, and so I went to aerospace, and I think I started in '88. Interestingly, I d- I started on Halloween in 1988 at the Aerospace Corporation, and my boss, um, wasn't there when I started, but came back a week later, he was on vacation, and he said something about flying in on my broom in 1988, which you can't say now.

   6. SPSpeaker4:36

      [laughs]

   7. SPSpeaker4:37

      But he could say it then. So the world is changing, even if we feel like it's too slow. Um, yeah, so okay, so started my career in '88, um, in the aerospace industry and thought... Had been there for roughly 15 years, roughly. Um, and I thought, look, it's, it wasn't a, an industry that was vibrant. It wasn't innovative. We weren't moving quickly. We hadn't gotten back to the Moon. And I thought, you know, this is my last job in the aerospace industry working for Elon. If we can't do it at SpaceX, then I'd rather sell real estate or be a barista or-

   8. SPSpeaker5:11

      [laughs]

   9. SPSpeaker5:11

      ... you know, something else. I did- I wouldn't- I didn't wanna work in the industry. And so, um, I knew this would be my last job in the aerospace industry, and it will turn out to be the case, so that's super cool.

   10. SPSpeaker5:20

       All right. Yeah.

   11. SPSpeaker5:21

       Oh, but risk.

   12. SPSpeaker5:21

       Yeah.

   13. SPSpeaker5:22

       You asked about risk-

   14. SPSpeaker5:22

       I, uh-

   15. SPSpeaker5:22

       ... and I'm blabbing around. Sorry.

   16. SPSpeaker5:24

       [laughs] All good.

   17. SPSpeaker5:24

       Um, so it seemed risky, actually. I had a very stable job. I owned 3% share of the company that I was working for, which is large for, um, for, for, for a, for an employee. And, uh, it was a pretty safe job, so this was not a safe job, and I didn't know Elon well at, at all, in fact, at that time. Um, but I, I really kinda jumped off the cliff. I was dithering around. He said he, he wanted me to join the company, and I said, "Oh, you know, I'm fine. I don't need a job," and kinda dithered for about a month. And then finally I'm like, "I'm such an idiot." I was driving on the freeway in LA, like, "What an idiot. Say yes." So I called him on the phone and I said, "I've been a w- bleep idiot," and he laughed, and he said, "Welcome to the team

   18. SPSpeaker6:06

       So you got sold on the idea, right?

   19. SPSpeaker6:08

       Yes.

   20. SPSpeaker6:08

       Um, had a lot of confidence if you thought it was gonna be your last job. Um-

   21. SPSpeaker6:11

       Last job in the industry

   22. SPSpeaker6:12

       In the... Oh, I got it. [laughs]

   23. SPSpeaker6:13

       I could always be a barista-

   24. SPSpeaker6:14

       Fair enough. Fair enough

   25. SPSpeaker6:15

       ... or sell real estate. [laughs]

   26. SPSpeaker6:15

       Last job in the industry.

   27. SPSpeaker6:17

       [laughs]

4. 6:17 – 7:21

   Selling a company before it had a product: business development in the early days

   1. SPSpeaker6:17

      Um, but your first job was vice president of the business development, so now you had to sell that idea to customers.

   2. SPSpeaker6:23

      Yes.

   3. SPSpeaker6:24

      And SpaceX was little more than a pipe dream at the time, right? You were many years away from launch. What was that selling process like?

   4. SPSpeaker6:31

      You know, it's interesting, when you, when you don't have a product, we had an ideal to sell, and it came at probably the best possible time. Um, you know, we had the events of 9/11 and rapid launch, low-cost access to space beca- it was obvious that it was gonna be very critical. And so it was great engineers, I am not gonna take away, in fact, SpaceX is the great company and does the great things that we do because of our extraordinary staff. It's not because of me, it's not because of Elon. Um, and, uh, and so I was selling the team, I was selling the ideal, I was selling the promise and the hope of reason- reasonably priced launch. I, I still don't think launch is reasonably priced, but if you go by comparison, it's much less than it was before.

   5. SPSpeaker7:20

      Nice.

   6. SPSpeaker7:20

      We're getting there.

5. 7:21 – 10:19

   Falcon 1’s make-or-break fourth flight and the emotional payoff

   1. SPSpeaker7:21

      Yeah. Uh, so let's talk about launch and about the first rocket, right? Um, the first rocket was called the Falcon 1. Uh, and you had three unsuccessful launches.

   2. SPSpeaker7:30

      Mm-hmm.

   3. SPSpeaker7:32

      It was 2008, the company was running out of money with the financial crisis. You were promoted to president CEO because of promises you had made customers at this point, so you'd already been promoted.

   4. SPSpeaker7:42

      [laughs]

   5. SPSpeaker7:43

      Um, and the company bet the entire company on this one launch, on the fourth launch of the Falcon 1. So let's watch that launch.

   6. SPSpeaker7:50

      5, 4, 3, 2, 1, 0. We're at stage one. We have lift off indication. We have lift off. SpaceX Falcon 1 launch vehicle. Falcon has cleared the tower. Plus 12.

   7. SPSpeaker8:08

      It's curious, this is a li-

   8. SPSpeaker8:09

      Thank goodness.

   9. SPSpeaker8:09

      [laughs]

   10. SPSpeaker8:10

       Right. [laughs]

   11. SPSpeaker8:10

       [laughs]

   12. SPSpeaker8:12

       So, uh, it's a life or death moment for the company, right? Um, yeah-

   13. SPSpeaker8:15

       Elon's a little more dramatic about that launch than I am actually. I figured we could pull a fifth launch off, but that was it.

   14. SPSpeaker8:23

       Right.

   15. SPSpeaker8:23

       Yeah, I thought we could get to five, he thought four was it. I'm glad we didn't have to test who was right on that one.

   16. SPSpeaker8:29

       [laughs]

   17. SPSpeaker8:29

       But, uh, yeah, it was quite a relief.

   18. SPSpeaker8:32

       And what were the months leading up to it like? What was the s-

   19. SPSpeaker8:35

       Well, this is a really f- this is a v- I think it's a hilarious story. I was in Scotland, Glasgow, the IAC, um, was having a show in Glasgow. So I was in Scotland to apologize, discuss, explain to the customers that were on the third Falcon 1 launch that we failed, kind of basically do a paper about that launch, and it was the night before my talk. I was [laughs] in a hotel room with my husband, and this is not gonna get inappropriate.

   20. SPSpeaker9:05

       [laughs]

   21. SPSpeaker9:06

       Um, my husband was sleeping, I'm in the bathroom with the shower on, typing up a proposal for the $1.6 billion con- NASA resupply to the International Space Station. We're literally writing the proposal, I'm on the phone with my f- team back in the US because we had to update our pricing. And so the w- I had the shower running so that my, you know, poor husband could sleep. I'm like punching away, talking, and then it's like, "Oh, shoot, we're, we're about ready to launch," right? And so I turned away from my proposal on my laptop to, to the launch, and, uh, was watching it. As we lifted off, I r- I ran out to the hotel room and I didn't care if I woke him up at this point, at this stage.

   22. SPSpeaker9:46

       [laughs]

   23. SPSpeaker9:46

       We lifted off and we were climbing in altitude and, um, and we watched us get to orbit. And then in my like yoga pants and jammy top, ran down the hall, that's probably the most inappropriate thing I'm gonna say here today, but-

   24. SPSpeaker10:00

       [laughs]

   25. SPSpeaker10:01

       ... ran down the hall, knocked on all the doors from my s- team that was there, and we hugged and kissed and cried, and then kind of broke into the bar in the hotel 'cause it was like 2:00 in the morning.

   26. SPSpeaker10:11

       [laughs]

   27. SPSpeaker10:13

       And they, they, they let us have the champagne, but it was warm. But it was-

   28. SPSpeaker10:16

       [laughs]

   29. SPSpeaker10:16

       ... it was extraordinary. It was extraordinary.

6. 10:19 – 10:49

   Using “big moments” to build teams and morale

   1. SPSpeaker10:19

      I've always loved how emotional a b- a business this is, right?

   2. SPSpeaker10:21

      Oh, it is incredibly.

   3. SPSpeaker10:22

      There are these just incredible emotional moments, right?

   4. SPSpeaker10:24

      In fact, by the way, to future entrepreneurs, I think it's really important to have these big moments. Figure out what the big moments where you can bring your teams together, it cures a lot of ills, um, it really helps with morale, and it's incredible for team building. So launches are easy, it's an easy spectacle to do that with, but I think it's really important to find those kinds of moments in the development for your future businesses.

7. 10:49 – 12:22

   CRS-7 failure: immediate crisis response and leading the investigation

   1. SPSpeaker10:49

      Right. So let's actually move forward a few years. Your first big kind of commercial product was the Falcon 9. It was designed in part with NASA's needs in mind to replace the internat- uh, the, the space shuttle to go to the International Space Station. You had done a number of launches already, including seven resupply missions to the International Space Station with NASA, right? And the eighth one was also supposed to take critical food, supplies, medical equipment to International Space Station, but that one didn't go as well. Let's watch that video. That's, this is two minutes into flight.

   2. SPSpeaker11:17

      Data coming back shows vehicle on course, on track.

   3. SPSpeaker11:20

      [grunts] Poof.

   4. SPSpeaker11:33

      Yeah. You had made it seem routine almost at this point, right?

   5. SPSpeaker11:36

      Mm-hmm.

   6. SPSpeaker11:37

      Um, and then this happens. You're in crisis management mode. What's the first thing you do?

   7. SPSpeaker11:44

      Yeah, so I was actually at my ranch in Texas on this launch. It was the first launch that, uh, I was not, um-

   8. SPSpeaker11:51

      There

   9. SPSpeaker11:52

      ... there- therefore, yeah. Um, by the way, it was also the first and only launch that I didn't do my pre-launch, um, little routine-

   10. SPSpeaker12:02

       [laughs]

   11. SPSpeaker12:03

       ... which we can chat about later, but-

   12. SPSpeaker12:04

       [laughs]

   13. SPSpeaker12:05

       ... 'cause I was in my slippers. And, uh, so, um- Uh, it, the, I think the most important thing when you suffer something like that is you focus everybody on the job, the task at hand, right? We had failure in front of us on Elon's birthday, by the way, that was his birthday, um, which is why we don't like to launch on his birthday.

   14. SPSpeaker12:22

       [laughs]

8. 12:22 – 14:45

   Two failures, two leadership lessons: technical confidence vs. visible anxiety

   1. SPSpeaker12:22

      It just feels like bad karma, actually. Um, so, uh, you get to work. I had to do a press conference, doing it remotely of course. Um, and we started digging through data. Of course, we obviously- I f- I flew back to, to Hawthorne and pulled teams together and we figured it out. It was, it was a weird one. That one, and then... So this was in, on June 28th, 2015, and then we suffered another failure, it was not a launch failure, on September 1st, 2016, not... A little over a year later, right? Um, and we basically blew up a satellite that was sitting on the pad as we were going through a pre-launch test. Um, so two failures, not back to back, we had had an extraordinary success in December of 2015, and we can come back to that as well, but this is a, this is a point that I try to make with students for sure. So I think after the CRS-7, that first failure, that failure that you saw there, I, I felt very comfortable leading the team through the investigation, leading the team through the physics, and getting to the answer. Um, the business wasn't really at risk. Um, I mean, failures are incredibly impactful. I think every failure we've had has either cost us or delayed us about half a billion dollars. Um, but I felt like I did a pretty good job in that timeframe. I did not do a good job after the failure, uh, when we blew up on pad. I was much more worried about the business. This particular event, um, was much harder to figure out what it was, and I, I definitely showed my, n- not despair, that's probably too much, but my concern, I definitely wore it on my sleeve or, as my husband says, I have a billboard on my forehead, and I, I, I wore that badly, in fact. So my lesson there is, you know, you don't, certainly don't wanna be disingenuous with your team and with your customers, but it's not really helpful to show your anxiety when, you know, when you're suffering be- 'cause your employees are suffering worse than you are. So it's really better to keep people focused on the business, keep focused on doing great things, and they had demonstrated that they could do great work up till then too. So, um, yeah, so that's a nice little nugget.

   2. SPSpeaker14:43

      Yeah. No, thanks for sharing that.

   3. SPSpeaker14:44

      Mm-hmm.

9. 14:45 – 16:43

   Coming back fast—and landing a booster in public view

   1. SPSpeaker14:45

      So one of the things, in particular for this first failure, that I find incredible is you had six months with- without launches, which I'm sure you had a bunch scheduled that were delayed, right? But six months later, you're launching a rocket again. Uh, but instead of simply focusing on getting that rocket and the customer's payload up into space successfully, you take a huge risk as well and try to land the booster, right?

   2. SPSpeaker15:08

      Do you have that video?

   3. SPSpeaker15:08

      And I have that video.

   4. SPSpeaker15:09

      Yay. [laughs]

   5. SPSpeaker15:10

      And I know it's your favorite.

   6. SPSpeaker15:11

      Yes. [upbeat music] The crowd goes wild.

   7. SPSpeaker15:34

      Yeah. [laughs]

   8. SPSpeaker15:37

      It was a mosh pit out there. It was so fun.

   9. SPSpeaker15:39

      [laughs] Why was this so exciting?

   10. SPSpeaker15:43

       Okay. So what's key about that is the last launch, or the launch just prior to that one, we failed. You know, and it's disappointing for the employees, it's disappointing for the company, but we failed our customer. This launch, so we, we stood down, we discovered what the problem was, we redesigned the rocket to be able to land, 'cause the previous rockets really couldn't land in that way. So we complete- we did a complete upgrade on the system while figuring out what we did to fail. Um, and then, like in complete view of the public, you go out there and you show are you, are you meant for greatness, or you need to go back to the drawing board a little bit. So that was a, a great, a great day. It was a great night. We had a lot of champagne at my house that night, probably more than I've ever drank ever.

   11. SPSpeaker16:33

       [laughs]

   12. SPSpeaker16:34

       I did not feel great the next day, but I did go to work. I went to work. Um, yeah, so that was an extraordinary moment for the company.

   13. SPSpeaker16:42

       Yeah.

   14. SPSpeaker16:42

       Just...

10. 16:43 – 19:10

    Why reusability matters: from first landing to operational reflights

    1. SPSpeaker16:43

       And share with us a little bit why it's so important to the whole business model for SpaceX.

    2. SPSpeaker16:47

       Oh, yeah, sorry. Um, well, first of all, no one had ever landed a rocket-

    3. SPSpeaker16:50

       Yeah

    4. SPSpeaker16:50

       ... before, right? That was the start and the key piece of the technology necessary to reuse rockets. So some... I know there are some space nerds out there, but there are many of you that are not. By the way, if you are a space nerd, you should wear that proudly. I certainly do. Um, but rockets, before SpaceX, and to some extent the shuttle did it, but, but there was, there's no fully reusable launch system. Rockets launch, and then they either disintegrate in the atmosphere, the second stage does, or they just get dumped into the ocean right now. Um, and so imagine what air travel would be like if you took an airplane from San Francisco to New York, and you had to toss the aircraft after that flight. Like li- life and society and the world would be so different if you couldn't reuse your aircraft. And so we take that same approach with space travel, uh, that you have to be able to reuse your rockets in order to facilitate human access to space, which I think is incredibly important. So that was the start. And we had tried many times before. Um, uh, we tried parachutes, but they rip off in the s- as it's speeding through the atmosphere. Um, so that was just an extraordinary piece of technology, guidance, navigation, and control. You know, hyper-retroactive propulsion. Crazy. Hypersonic retroactive propulsion was just amazing.

    5. SPSpeaker18:17

       Yeah.

    6. SPSpeaker18:19

       It was great.

    7. SPSpeaker18:20

       Yeah.

    8. SPSpeaker18:20

       And it started our ability to re-fly rockets. We didn't re-fly that one. That one is sitting outside the front of our building in Hawthorne, California. You can drive by it and see it, in fact. It's kind of a neat monument. Um, but we have, I don't wanna say perfected, because we have not perfected, but we have operationalized the ability to land rockets-

    9. SPSpeaker18:38

       Mm

    10. SPSpeaker18:38

        ... refurbish them, and re-fly them. Our goal is to be able to do that like an airplane. Like I was saying in the back room, you know, they said something, s- someone asked something about, you know, rocket efficiency, and we're not very efficient. We, we actually aspire to be as efficient as the airline industry, and that's probably horrifying to many of you in the audience, 'cause you probably don't think that the airline industry is particularly efficient. But it's way better than we are. Um, so it's still a nice model to use.

    11. SPSpeaker19:05

        Right.

    12. SPSpeaker19:05

        Yeah.

    13. SPSpeaker19:06

        So after this in 2015, this really became routine.

    14. SPSpeaker19:09

        Yes.

    15. SPSpeaker19:09

        SpaceX was-

    16. SPSpeaker19:10

        Yes

11. 19:10 – 21:08

    Crewed Dragon missions: responsibility, routines, and psychological safety

    1. SPSpeaker19:10

       ... launching dozens and dozens of trips up into space every year. Um, in May 2020, at the beginning of the pandemic, you took another huge leap, and it involved humans, right? You launched two astronauts to the International Space Station, the first astronauts to launch on a private vehicle, and the first to do so from American soil on any vehicle in 40 years, right? We were doing it with the Russians. Um, how did you carry that responsibility, and how do you prepare the team for it?

    2. SPSpeaker19:35

       So first of all, keep your head high. Don't show your anxiety. But I honestly hate crew launch days. I just don't like them. Uh, it's nerve-wracking. It's one thing to, you know, to have a pa- have a failure when you've got a satellite, even a billion dollar, $3 billion satellite on top. You can't put a price tag on the two to four people that are sitting on top of that rocket, and it's hurtling through the atmosphere. So it's quite anxiety producing. Um, it's always a huge relief to get, get Dragon to orbit, get Dragon to the International Space Station, and then say, "Okay, NASA, they're yours now," until we have to bring them back downhill six months later. Um, so keep people focused on the work for sure. Don't let them show your anx- you know, don't let them see my anxiety, even though I've talked about this enough, they all know I'm, like, scared to death during launch days on this.

    3. SPSpeaker20:28

       [laughs]

    4. SPSpeaker20:29

       Follow your routine. Be keenly aware. Make sure you've got employees that feel very comfortable talking about, "Hey, s- I, I might have screwed this up. Can we go back and look at the data and make sure that I didn't screw this up on the rocket or the spaceship?" So, um, yeah. Keep them focused on the business, don't show how nervous you are, and pray.

    5. SPSpeaker20:51

       Great. So even this has become routine now. I think you've launched four trips to the International Space Station, something like that?

    6. SPSpeaker20:57

       So we did Bob and Doug, and then we just flew CRS-4, and then we also flew Axiom.

    7. SPSpeaker21:03

       Yeah, interesting.

    8. SPSpeaker21:04

       And then we did Jared and his team.

    9. SPSpeaker21:06

       That's true.

    10. SPSpeaker21:06

        Yeah.

    11. SPSpeaker21:07

        Okay, so.

    12. SPSpeaker21:07

        So seven.

12. 21:08 – 23:01

    Starship’s leap: making the second stage reusable and aiming for rapid turnaround

    1. SPSpeaker21:08

       So let's talk about the future then-

    2. SPSpeaker21:10

       Okay

    3. SPSpeaker21:10

       ... 'cause, you know. Um, and let's talk about Starship, which is the big bet you have-

    4. SPSpeaker21:14

       Yep

    5. SPSpeaker21:14

       ... as a future. Or as it, this rocket was previously called the Big Falcon Rocket.

    6. SPSpeaker21:19

       BFR.

    7. SPSpeaker21:19

       BFR. Um-

    8. SPSpeaker21:20

       [laughs]

    9. SPSpeaker21:24

       [laughs] Who, who chose to rename it?

    10. SPSpeaker21:28

        Well, Elon named it the first time.

    11. SPSpeaker21:29

        [laughs]

    12. SPSpeaker21:30

        [laughs]

    13. SPSpeaker21:31

        And Elon named it the second time.

    14. SPSpeaker21:32

        Got it. Um-

    15. SPSpeaker21:34

        It w- there was one in between, too, ITS, I think.

    16. SPSpeaker21:37

        Interstellar or something like that?

    17. SPSpeaker21:38

        Yeah.

    18. SPSpeaker21:38

        Yeah, exactly.

    19. SPSpeaker21:39

        Yeah.

    20. SPSpeaker21:40

        Um, so-

    21. SPSpeaker21:40

        Starship is better

    22. SPSpeaker21:41

        ... what's so different about this bet, and what does it mean for humanity?

    23. SPSpeaker21:44

        So the difference here, for those of you that are not space geeks, this first stage goes up, it delivers the second stage to carry on its way to orbit, comes back, so we reuse the first stage, but the second stage is now reusable. It goes to orbit, it drops off the payload, takes people around the Moon, takes people to Mars, whatever it is, and then it comes back and lands. Our second stage right now is not reusable on the Falcon program. Our third stage, if you look at a Dragon, is reusable. Not very operationally, right? It lands in the ocean, get helicopters and ships to go get it out of the water, take it back, clean off the saltwater, refurbish it, and re-fly it. But a Dragon takes currently, like, 90 days. We're trying to get it down to 45, and then even faster, but that's not very operationally efficient. Starship is meant to launch, land on the pad, on the pad, the arms come and pick up another s- another Starship, pick it up, put it back on the pad, and launch within an hour. So like an airplane. That's the plan.

    24. SPSpeaker22:45

        [laughs]

    25. SPSpeaker22:48

        And it's supposed to take us either to Shanghai or to Mars, right?

    26. SPSpeaker22:51

        That's correct.

    27. SPSpeaker22:52

        Yeah.

    28. SPSpeaker22:53

        Right.

    29. SPSpeaker22:53

        Um-

    30. SPSpeaker22:53

        But hopefully some version of this would take us to another star system.
13. 23:01 – 25:58

    Why prototypes explode: optimizing the production system, not just the rocket

    1. SPSpeaker23:01

       Um, so I wanna talk about the development of this, because there's something m- remarkable about that. Uh, as you mentioned, it's supposed to be fully reusable. I saw many estimates online, but each one of these costs somewhere around $200 million to build. That might be a wild guess. Um, but your product development strategy seemed to be to blow one of these up every few months, right?

    2. SPSpeaker23:20

       [laughs]

    3. SPSpeaker23:21

       So let's take a look at Starship number 9.

    4. SPSpeaker23:23

       [laughs]

    5. SPSpeaker23:24

       We're preparing, we're preparing to restart two engines, flip the vehicle vertical, then transition to one engine for the landing burn. [rocket roaring]

    6. SPSpeaker23:43

       So that seems expensive and completely different to how traditional rocket technology works. Like, they make the whole rocket as perfectly as possible. They wind test it, and they say, "Once it's perfect, we'll try to, you know, flight test it." These are prototypes that you just keep going. Um, w- what's behind that way of thinking about rocket technology?

    7. SPSpeaker24:00

       So a- and this isn't very well understood publicly. I'm a little surprised we don't talk more about it. We are much more focused for the Starship program on production, building the system that will build the system, than we are on the rocket technology itself.

    8. SPSpeaker24:15

       Okay.

    9. SPSpeaker24:15

       I didn't touch anything.

    10. SPSpeaker24:16

        No, you didn't.

    11. SPSpeaker24:16

        [laughs]

    12. SPSpeaker24:17

        All right. [laughs] I break hardware by walking by-

    13. SPSpeaker24:21

        [laughs]

    14. SPSpeaker24:21

        ... so this makes me nervous. Um- So we know how to get rockets to orbit, we know how to do that. Um, this is a completely different one, but we, we're very confident in our ability to figure out how to do that. We were much more focused on can we produce a rocket that can get to orbit, like really produce. Falcon, we produce, you know, between seven and 11 Falcon first stages per year. We're producing a, a second stage every week right now. Um, but what we wanna be able to do is produce a rocket a day or come much closer to automotive. Um, because if you are gonna take people to Mars, you're gonna go in a flotilla or a swarm, I don't even know yet right, the, what the right term is yet for a group of Starships to head to Mars. Um, you're gonna need a bunch of them. Um, and producing five a year isn't gonna get you there. You really wanna launch hundreds-

    15. SPSpeaker25:16

        Wow

    16. SPSpeaker25:16

        ... on that synodic period with Mars when you're taking people there. Um, so we need to have a production system to build rockets, much like a production system to build cars. Maybe not quite so many, I don't think we need a million a year, but, uh, we need more than a couple hundred.

    17. SPSpeaker25:33

        So it's all about the-

    18. SPSpeaker25:34

        Yep

    19. SPSpeaker25:34

        ... production system. Wow.

    20. SPSpeaker25:35

        So we will get this to orbit. I'm not saying that it's easy, 'cause it's very different. You'll see the way... Well, not the orbital part, but the, the landing part is very different. You know, we belly flop to dissipate the heat and then come vertical right at the last second.

    21. SPSpeaker25:48

        Yeah.

    22. SPSpeaker25:48

        It's different from the way we're doing it on Falcon, but, uh, we, I mean, we, and we did it, we stuck a landing bringing-

    23. SPSpeaker25:54

        You did, I know

    24. SPSpeaker25:54

        ... the Starship back. N- no, it wasn't from orbit, it was just from altitude, it was not from orbit.

14. 25:58 – 31:07

    Ambitious timelines, breaking problems down, and leadership principles under pressure

    1. SPSpeaker25:58

       So you're trying to do really hard things, and I wanna talk about, well, that a little bit, right? SpaceX has the most ambitious goals on the tightest of timelines. And actually, quick question, what's our latest timeline on getting to Mars?

    2. SPSpeaker26:10

       Getting to Mars? Oh, I think we'll put people down within a decade.

    3. SPSpeaker26:13

       Right. So you're in charge of-

    4. SPSpeaker26:16

       I know, I'm crazy.

    5. SPSpeaker26:17

       [laughs]

    6. SPSpeaker26:19

       You're in charge of executing on that goal to get human beings to Mars within a decade, right? How-

    7. SPSpeaker26:24

       That's more Elon than me, but I'm here to help.

    8. SPSpeaker26:27

       Right.

    9. SPSpeaker26:27

       [laughs]

    10. SPSpeaker26:29

        But how do you balance those ambitious goals, right? Which, like, maybe Elon comes out and says, and getting the team comfortable that it's possible.

    11. SPSpeaker26:39

        So there's a couple of strategies to do that. First of all, y- you always aim high. W- we have achieved everything we have wanted to, never in the timeline. We fail on timeline, but that feels like the right fail to make as opposed to not achieving what you're trying to achieve technically. Um, so y- you demonstrate that you've been able to do these crazy, insane, absurdly ambitious things in the past. You can contin- you know, pump people up to do it again, and you try to pull apart these, this seemingly impossible situation and how are we gonna design and develop this, and you pull it into smaller pieces, you build a prototype, you test it, you put prototypes, you know, subsystems together and you test that, and you kinda use a building block approach to reach your goals.

    12. SPSpeaker27:26

        And the team, so-

    13. SPSpeaker27:27

        They're very enthusiastic about it. Like-

    14. SPSpeaker27:30

        It's the biggest of goals-

    15. SPSpeaker27:31

        It's, yeah

    16. SPSpeaker27:32

        ... in whatever, right?

    17. SPSpeaker27:32

        Rockets are super cool. [laughs]

    18. SPSpeaker27:34

        Yeah.

    19. SPSpeaker27:34

        [laughs]

    20. SPSpeaker27:36

        So you've been at SpaceX for over 20 years now, right?

    21. SPSpeaker27:39

        This year. Yep.

    22. SPSpeaker27:40

        Yeah. And now you lead a team basically of 12,000 people. Um, what have you learned about your leadership style, um, over the years?

    23. SPSpeaker27:47

        Geez.

    24. SPSpeaker27:47

        What do you wish you knew now that, uh, you knew then that you know now?

    25. SPSpeaker27:52

        Oh, l- l- let me answer-

    26. SPSpeaker27:54

        Yeah

    27. SPSpeaker27:54

        ... the other stuff first.

    28. SPSpeaker27:55

        Yeah.

    29. SPSpeaker27:55

        Um, I'm not a regretter, so it's really hard for me to kinda go back and say, "Oh, I wish I did this thing." Um, I'm a very collaborative leader. Actually, I've got some employees here, you can tell me if I'm a BS artist or not.

    30. SPSpeaker28:10

        [laughs]
15. 31:07 – 39:24

    Feedback culture, long-term aspirations beyond Mars, and closing lightning round

    1. SPSpeaker31:07

       So speaking of mistakes, I've heard that SpaceX has a culture of feedback.

    2. SPSpeaker31:11

       Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

    3. SPSpeaker31:12

       That's something we take very seriously here at the GSB as well. We have a whole class where we learn how to give feedback. Uh, feedback is a gift, is a continuous motto of the school almost. Um, I'm wondering how SpaceX operationalizes that in the day to day.

    4. SPSpeaker31:26

       So critically important, feed- 360 feedback, and immediate. The sooner you get feedback, the better off you are. That's a golden nugget of data on how you are impacting your coworkers, your company, the, the project. So that feedback is so critical. So give feedback as quickly as you can, and we always try to tell people to do it. Our review system, we require that you get reviewed 360 feedback from at least three. You know, sometimes in, you know, if you've got employees that have, you know, that are really great in some areas and really not great in other areas, you try to solicit more feedback to figure out what's going on in those areas, and try to work with them to figure out how you can get people to this place where it's all contribution all the time. Um, so, so it's in our review system. Uh, we talk about it at the first day of work, please, you know, give feedback. Um, but engineers and... Well, uh, you know, and it's not really human nature to be willing to s- look someone in the eye and say, "Hey, that was not helpful. Not super helpful. Um, could you do it this way?" You know, be objective. Um, try to not personalize it. In almost every case, it, it, and it, uh, feedback could be technical. It doesn't have to be like, "Hey, you were a total jerk to me, and I'm really mad about it." Um, uh, but in almost every case, the person, at least in my experience, person is not malintent- not intending to do bad things. They either made a mistake, they were unaware. Um, so I think approaching it as not per- taking it not personal, but just talk about how this situation impacted you or how this person's work caused your work to not be great, you couldn't finish your project or whatever. It's just really important.

    5. SPSpeaker33:14

       Yeah. That's exactly what we, we preach here as well.

    6. SPSpeaker33:17

       Yep.

    7. SPSpeaker33:18

       Um, before we go to Q&A, and I know there are a lot of great questions in, in the audience, I have two questions again about the future. First, and you already made a reference to this, what comes after Mars?

    8. SPSpeaker33:29

       Yeah. So, um, we are not working on a ship that yet has the propulsion technology to take us to other star systems. But I certainly hope that Mars is that example that shows that humans can live beyond planet Earth, uh, and that we will focus on propulsion technologies or some way of getting to a place that would otherwise take 4,000 or 5,000 years. So I'm very excited about that. It will not happen in my lifetime, but I hope that some of the work that we're doing will kick off the, the aspiration to go do that. Like, the shows that you watch, you know, we, we can't... And they're always about war, by the way. Star Wars-

    9. SPSpeaker34:11

       Right

    10. SPSpeaker34:11

        ... like, what is that? I don't... Star Trek is not necessarily about war, but it's still military. I don't know why it is that way. But, um, hopefully we can go there in a civilian way and, uh-

    11. SPSpeaker34:20

        [laughs]

    12. SPSpeaker34:21

        ... meet other sentient beings, and that would be great.

    13. SPSpeaker34:26

        Yeah, that would be quite something. So for-

    14. SPSpeaker34:28

        [laughs]

    15. SPSpeaker34:28

        [laughs] Uh, for the, for the s- for the second question, I actually wanna bring us back to Earth, to this auditorium, because many of us are thinking about our very immediate futures. I checked this morning, I graduate in two and a half weeks, as do many of my classmates here. You're our last View From The Top speaker of the year. You have the stage. What advice would you have for us as we embark on the next chapter of our lives?

    16. SPSpeaker34:52

        So it's a very simple statement, and I'll follow it up with a couple of examples. Um, you want to take risks in your career. You absolutely wanna take risks. Yeah, maybe in your life too, although you have to balance, right? You gotta balance it. Um, I almost said no to Elon when he asked me to join SpaceX. Would've been so... I would look back. Uh, I'm not a regretter.

    17. SPSpeaker35:13

        Right.

    18. SPSpeaker35:13

        That is the one thing that I would go back and regret. I almost said no when Elon asked, um, me to be president.

    19. SPSpeaker35:20

        Right.

    20. SPSpeaker35:20

        'Cause I really loved my job. My colleagues, my brother and sister VPs were great compatriots, and I thought it might be weird to be the boss. So I almost said no. Um, and I'm so glad that I didn't, but it felt like a risk to, to, to, to say yes there. And then this is a more personal risk. Um, so when I first met my current husband, husband number two, sorry, um-

    21. SPSpeaker35:48

        [laughs]

    22. SPSpeaker35:49

        ... we had our first date, and I thought he was roughly my age, roughly my age. And then he said something about the Gulf War and, you know, wanting to have been a pilot. I was like, [laughs] "Gulf War? Like, how?" And I, we were in the car, and I looked over, I'm like, "How old are you?"

    23. SPSpeaker36:05

        [laughs]

    24. SPSpeaker36:09

        And he, he was about eight years younger than me, and I was like, [blows raspberry] "Not interested."

    25. SPSpeaker36:14

        [laughs]

    26. SPSpeaker36:14

        Why would I go out with this infant? No way."

    27. SPSpeaker36:17

        [laughs]

    28. SPSpeaker36:20

        [laughs]

    29. SPSpeaker36:20

        And, and luckily, luckily, I, I didn't take that little voice in my head, and I took the risk and dated a much younger man, and happily married. So it's, uh- Not really silly, but a little personal. But I almost said, "I am not gonna date someone that's eight years younger than me. That is weird." Anyhow, took the risk, paid off.

    30. SPSpeaker36:44

        What, what a, what a great note to end on. So with that, um-

Episode duration: 39:30