Josh Johnson: Finding Meaning in a System Built to Fracture You

Speaker 0:00 Put your hands together for Josh Johnson! [cheering]

Speaker 0:03 The newest correspondent, he's an Emmy winner. Uh, he's got millions of followers online. Wired Magazine called him the funniest guy on the internet, and that's a big place.

Speaker 0:10 Josh is putting out a weekly special every single Tuesday on his YouTube channel.

Speaker 0:14 I'm gonna have to sit there listening, watching the Super Bowl Halftime Show to Spanish. I'm gonna have to sit there with my guacamole and my chips in my lap- [laughing] [cheering] ... listening to Spanish.

Speaker 0:26 His channel has gotten over 350 million views, and all this success has actually landed him a hosting spot on The Daily Show.

Speaker 0:34 He has a dream that one day he will not be judged by the content of the Epstein files. [laughing] I can't stress enough how much I'm enjoying what I'm doing and, like, how obsessed I am with comedy in general. [upbeat music]

Speaker 0:54 This is What Now? with Trevor Noah. [upbeat music]

Trevor Noah 1:06 That's a ... Do you remember you had a gag about that, Eugene, back in the day?

Eugene 1:09 About Dexter?

Trevor Noah 1:10 There was a j- What are you looking at? [laughs] What are you doing?

Eugene 1:15 I'm looking at something.

Trevor Noah 1:16 [laughs]

Eugene 1:16 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:17 Do you remember there was a joke you ... I, I feel like it was you. You had a joke about how ... It was something about, like, attempted murder.

Eugene 1:25 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:26 Ah, man.

Eugene 1:27 Tell me more.

Trevor Noah 1:28 Oh, man.

Eugene 1:28 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:28 What was ... It was ... I feel like the premise was something to the effect of you should get, like, more of a punishment for attempted murder than murder.

Eugene 1:37 Oh.

Trevor Noah 1:37 Because, like, attempted, like you're not good at what you did. It-

Eugene 1:41 It wasn't me.

Trevor Noah 1:41 It w- it wasn't you?

Eugene 1:42 No.

Trevor Noah 1:42 Maybe it was me then.

Speaker 1:43 That-

Eugene 1:44 No.

Speaker 1:44 That's so funny. That's a-

Trevor Noah 1:45 Does that ever happen to you?

Speaker 1:46 Uh, yeah. I've, I've definitely been like, "This came to me too easy. I wonder, like, is this somebody..." And then I look back at my notebook, and I wrote it and then forgot about it.

Trevor Noah 1:57 Yeah. Sometimes I think it's-

Eugene 1:58 That was-

Trevor Noah 1:59 Are you sure?

Eugene 1:59 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 2:00 Hmm. I'm gonna go look and see if I ever-

Speaker 2:02 This logic is solid, though.

Trevor Noah 2:04 I, yeah.

Speaker 2:04 'Cause, like, if somebody hits you i- if somebody try to hit you in your eye, they hit you above your eye, you get more mad. 'Cause you're like, "You tried to hit me in my eye [laughs] and you didn't."

Eugene 2:13 My one was, like, if we could figure out a way to make a body disappear, more murders would happen. 'Cause it seems like a body, once someone is dead, yo, that thing becomes very famous.

Trevor Noah 2:24 Oh, so if we just, like, if it just evaporated.

Eugene 2:26 Yes. But now a body, it's very hard to disappear.

Trevor Noah 2:30 Huh.

Eugene 2:30 There's people roll it in carpets, put it in drums, pour acid over it, put it in dustbins to get rid of it.

Speaker 2:37 Yeah. People will make

Speaker 2:39 the whole mess bigger-

Eugene 2:41 Yes

Speaker 2:41 ... or they'll make the thing they gotta get rid of bigger.

Eugene 2:43 Yes.

Speaker 2:43 'Cause you put, if you put a body in a oil drum, that's a bigger thing [laughs] you gotta move.

Eugene 2:47 Yeah, now you got a problem.

Speaker 2:48 Yeah.

Eugene 2:49 And it becomes heavier.

Trevor Noah 2:50 [laughs]

Speaker 2:50 I already-

Trevor Noah 2:50 I never thought of it like that.

Speaker 2:51 No. My squat is already bad, so then just to get the body-

Eugene 2:56 Now you've added oil drum. [laughs]

Speaker 2:57 'Cause you also don't think ... Look, if you commit a crime of passion, you don't factor in you're gonna be tired. So then now you've [laughs] killed somebody.

Eugene 3:05 I think first is regret.

Speaker 3:07 I ... Hopefully, if you're not, like, a sociopath.

Eugene 3:09 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 3:09 Yeah.

Speaker 3:09 But even sociopaths only have so much muscle. So then now you're like, "All right. I gotta move the body," and it's like trying to move a body, I imag- if you've ever caught a person, do you know what I mean? Like-

Trevor Noah 3:20 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 3:20 ... if you've ever, like, tried to pick someone up.

Trevor Noah 3:22 Especially dead weight.

Speaker 3:24 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 3:24 Like, there's a reason they call it that.

Eugene 3:25 Yeah. There's reasons why people wake their partners up-

Speaker 3:27 People-

Eugene 3:27 ... from the couch.

Speaker 3:29 Yeah.

Eugene 3:29 Like, "Eh, eh, eh, eh."

Trevor Noah 3:30 Yeah. Yeah.

Eugene 3:30 "Time to go now."

Speaker 3:31 Yo.

Trevor Noah 3:32 Gotta go to sleep. [laughs]

Speaker 3:33 Yeah. No, 100%.

Trevor Noah 3:35 Gotta go to sleep. [laughs]

Speaker 3:35 100%, because-

Eugene 3:37 Just tap me, "Eh, eh." [laughs]

Speaker 3:38 There are people that think they can pick people up because you picked someone who was excited up for sex.

Trevor Noah 3:43 If there was a crime that you had to commit, what crime would you trust yourself best to commit?

Speaker 3:48 Uh, hmm. This feels like it'll end up in a deposition. Uh, wire fraud maybe.

Eugene 3:56 Look into this.

Trevor Noah 3:57 [laughs]

Eugene 3:57 Look into that camera.

Speaker 3:58 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 3:58 Say it into that camera please, Josh. [laughs]

Eugene 4:00 [laughs]

Speaker 4:00 I ... 'Cause here's the, here's the thing about wire fraud. Here's the thing about wire fraud. Everybody already does it by accident.

Trevor Noah 4:07 Wait. What is wire fraud again? In America, it's-

Speaker 4:08 Like, like there's ... Like, to me, w- my understanding of, like, wire fraud-

Trevor Noah 4:13 Yeah

Speaker 4:13 ... is, like, misrepresenting a transaction.

Trevor Noah 4:15 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay.

Speaker 4:16 And I'm, and I'm pretty positive that that's most of Venmo. Like, mo- like most of Venmo is like-

Trevor Noah 4:21 When you say, like, what your payment was.

Speaker 4:22 Yeah. And it's like, you're lying. [laughs] It's, it's-

Trevor Noah 4:26 Do you write the real thing?

Speaker 4:28 Uh, I try to write the real thing so I remember the real thing.

Trevor Noah 4:31 Oh, no.

Speaker 4:31 I've had to, I've had to pay people before for, like, a servi- like, I'll pay someone, and it'll be, like, a studio, like a music studio.

Trevor Noah 4:37 Yeah.

Speaker 4:38 And so I'll just say studio time. I don't say sandwich.

Trevor Noah 4:41 That's boring.

Speaker 4:42 I-

Trevor Noah 4:42 You gotta say sandwich, Josh.

Speaker 4:43 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 4:44 That's what makes Venmo fun.

Eugene 4:45 What crime would you perform?

Trevor Noah 4:46 Is when you ... Who, me?

Eugene 4:47 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 4:48 If-

Eugene 4:48 'Cause I feel like crime is a performance

Trevor Noah 4:49 ... if I, if I had to pick a crime-

Eugene 4:50 It's planned. There's rehearsals.

Trevor Noah 4:52 If I had to-

Eugene 4:52 There's costumes

Trevor Noah 4:52 ... if I had to pick what I think I would be best at-

Eugene 4:54 Yeah

Trevor Noah 4:54 ... if it was committing a crime, I th- I think I've, I've, I've always thought I'd be, like, a good getaway driver. That's what I would pick.

Eugene 5:03 You love driving.

Speaker 5:04 So, like, aiding and abetting would be your-

Eugene 5:05 No, no, the getting away.

Trevor Noah 5:06 The get- like, the driver. I'd just be the driver.

Eugene 5:08 We drive in.

Trevor Noah 5:09 Drive you, drive you. You know, like The Transporter, those kinds of movies?

Speaker 5:11 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 5:11 Yeah, I'm like, I think I would, I would do that. I think I would be pr- I think I would be really good.

Speaker 5:15 I'm just, I'm just going off of the court term. Like, like, I think you'd be, like, aiding and abetting a, a heist, like a robbery.

Trevor Noah 5:22 Wouldn't you just be part of it if you, if you're the driver?

Speaker 5:24 I-

Trevor Noah 5:24 Is that what they ... They give you less of a sentence?

Speaker 5:26 I'm positive they give you less of a sentence, 'cause sometimes there are people who have the plausible deniability of, like, especially if you're, if you're just, like, like, criminals.

Trevor Noah 5:35 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 5:35 And we, we aren't boys. So then I get pulled in to do this thing.

Trevor Noah 5:38 Ah.

Speaker 5:39 I can be like, "Hey, he put a gun to my head and said drive. I was just chilling."

Eugene 5:43 But if there's four people that go, "We did not."

Trevor Noah 5:45 You could also just say, like, you were just driving these people-

Speaker 5:47 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 5:47 ... but you don't know why.

Speaker 5:48 I was just driving.

Eugene 5:49 Yeah.

Speaker 5:49 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 5:50 I'm a v- it's an Uber.

Speaker 5:51 It's a very tough-

Eugene 5:52 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 5:52 I wonder if you could get away with that.

Speaker 5:53 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 5:54 I wonder if you could, I wonder if you could be an Uber driver-

Speaker 5:56 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 5:56 ... who's planning to rob a bank with your crew.

Speaker 5:59 Yeah.

Eugene 5:59 Yeah.

Speaker 6:01 Wait outside a place, they jump in, you run, and then they catch you

Eugene 6:04 Is that F1?

Speaker 6:04 No, but if, if they-

Eugene 6:05 Oh

Speaker 6:05 ... like, you, you go like, "I thought it was my fare."

Eugene 6:08 Oh.

Speaker 6:08 Yeah. I wonder if that would-

Eugene 6:10 Oh, my.

Speaker 6:10 I wouldn't want you... I would get you excused from my jury. That's what I would do.

Eugene 6:13 Oh, my.

Speaker 6:13 That is also a thing that has happened. You're a skeptical person here ... do you know what I mean? Like, people, people have done a crime and then got in an Uber. And, yeah, taxis, Ubers. And the Uber driver was like, "Guys, I, I t- I don't know this person at all." And they- But why did he give you five stars? Nobody gives five stars. [laughs] What crime would you commit?

Eugene 6:30 I think already being a comedian, you're committing the biggest crime of them all.

Speaker 6:34 Damn. By doing what?

Eugene 6:35 Making them believe that what you say is real, you've thought about this.

Speaker 6:39 No, when did that start, by the way?

Eugene 6:41 What, stand-up?

Speaker 6:41 No.

Eugene 6:43 [laughs]

Speaker 6:43 No, no, no. No, no, no. [laughs] No, I'm saying, like, when did that start? Like-

Eugene 6:48 You know podcasting-

Speaker 6:49 Yeah

Eugene 6:49 ... to radio presenters-

Speaker 6:50 Yeah

Eugene 6:50 ... is a crime. It shouldn't exist.

Speaker 6:53 Okay.

Eugene 6:54 Yeah, 'cause they're thinking this is-

Speaker 6:55 Mm

Eugene 6:56 ... I have a boss, I got voice training, I read. Then next thing you know, "You know what the thing is? Which crime would you..."

Speaker 7:04 Mm. Oh.

Eugene 7:04 Then they go, "You know me. I work for a living." So already this, in another plan, an alternate universe, it's a crime.

Speaker 7:09 Yeah, but what I'm, what I'm going back

Speaker 7:11 to is the stand-up thing. Yeah. When did that start? I feel like- I don't know how... How long have you been stand- doing stand-up, Eugene?

Eugene 7:16 Sure. Maybe [laughs]

Speaker 7:18 [laughs] [laughs]

Speaker 9:27 Man. [laughs] This man saw me just in time. If you had seen me [laughs] a year ago-

Eugene 9:31 Two weeks before

Speaker 9:31 ... if you had seen me two weeks before-

Eugene 9:33 Getting a dead body

Speaker 9:33 ... we wouldn't, we wouldn't even know each other like this. [laughs]

Eugene 9:35 [laughs]

Speaker 9:35 Like- Wait, what do you mean? What do you mean? Because I was like, you know, you start out and you're, like, a version of yourself, but you're like, you're such a baby in the things that you like doing-

Eugene 9:43 Mm. Yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 9:43 ... and you're such a baby in, like, what you, what you even know works for you. So now, if you gave me like 10 topics and you told me to write 10 jokes off of them- Yeah ... or if you asked me if they relate to 10 stories in my life, I could find that and I could find how that-

Eugene 9:58 Mm

Speaker 9:58 ... relates to an audience. If you did it right before you met me, maybe the day before you met me, I'd be like, "Ah, um, ooh, I'ma, I'll just keep working at the grocery store because this seems too difficult." I don't know, man. I feel like maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like you've always been a... I, I can't imagine you not being, not this version of comedian, but not this pers- this version of Josh. Like, I, I'm yet to- Oh, sure ... I'm yet to meet a good comedian- Mm-hmm ... who I don't think I could meet as themselves-

Eugene 10:25 Mm

Speaker 10:25 ... as a child. Oh, that's, that's

Speaker 10:28 interesting. That's, that's very interesting. Like, what, like what- I've never heard that before ... like, what was little Josh like? You know what I mean? Yeah. It was... It... You know what it is now, to your point, is that I feel like I... It took me, if you wanna talk about, like, a journey, it took me up until now to find the place in the jigsaw where I fit in. Okay. So it's like I've changed the way that people change from kid to adult- Yeah ... but I haven't changed fully. And so, like, it was me not fitting for the entirety of my life up until, ooh, two years ago. Yeah, yeah. And now I, like, everything that... Everything I know to do that's, like, true to me makes sense now- Mm ... as opposed to, like, I was a version... Oh, I... 'Cause it... Ooh,

Speaker 11:11 the story I told you, when I was in, uh, when I was in college, I went to, like, my first bar. And I was like, "Ooh, y'all, this markup bad. Y'all know if we just buy the bottle at the store- [laughs] ... we could have a b- we could s- y- y'all could get so much more drunk." Y'all just thought I speak easy. [laughs] And so I'm not even drinking, and I'm ruining everybody's [laughs] time because I'm like, "Guys, no, y'all saw at the store where this bottle was $13, but the cocktail $13. So, like, this is crazy, right?" And then everyone's just holding their drink like, "Yeah. Yeah." And I, now I know- Mm. And now I know where to do that. I like that. And it's like- Oh, yeah. Now you've aimed it ... and it... Now, now, now I've aimed it to where it's like I'm not doing it all the time to everyone to everything. Yeah.

Eugene 11:55 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 11:55 And I've aimed it at like, "Okay, this is a thing you save for stage." [laughs] And not even every stage, 'cause when you do a comedy club, there will also be people being like, "Oh, yeah, they are making me buy two [laughs] drinks at an insane mark." This is what you save for, like, you're doing an outdoor event, you're doing a state fair. It's like your inside voice and stage voice. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's essentially what it is. 100%.

Eugene 12:17 Do you apply the

Eugene 12:18 same logic when you think of maybe you see a comedian or an actor, then you go, "You know your uncle tells the same stories, and you pay him nothing."

Trevor Noah 12:27 You mean, like, about the funniest people?

Eugene 12:28 'Cause you edited the mock-up, yeah.

Trevor Noah 12:30 You know, I used to think that.

Eugene 12:31 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 12:31 And then I started to understand, at least for me, the difference between being a comedian and being a funny person.

Eugene 12:37 Mm.

Trevor Noah 12:38 So I often tell people I'm, and I mean this genuinely, I'm not the funniest person I have known in my life ever, ever, ever. Like, by far, by far, by far.

Eugene 12:46 Mm.

Trevor Noah 12:46 There are too many people in my world-

Eugene 12:47 Don't be so hard on yourself, man

Trevor Noah 12:48 ... where I go ... Thank you, Eugene.

Eugene 12:49 I've, I've seen you. You have moments.

Trevor Noah 12:51 Thank you so much, Eugene.

Eugene 12:52 When you put on the Puss in Boots.

Trevor Noah 12:53 Man, this is why you gotta have good friends.

Eugene 12:55 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 12:55 Thank you, man. Thank you so much.

Eugene 12:56 When you're also in your insecure moments-

Trevor Noah 12:58 Oh, man, I-

Eugene 12:58 ... I think you're the funniest.

Trevor Noah 12:59 Thank you so much, Eugene.

Eugene 13:00 When you're like, "How's my Afro today?"

Trevor Noah 13:01 Oh, man.

Eugene 13:02 "Did I get the back? Did I get the back?"

Trevor Noah 13:03 That ac- that ac- that actually wasn't a joke, but okay. Thank you.

Eugene 13:05 [laughs]

Speaker 13:05 Ooh.

Trevor Noah 13:05 That wasn't-

Speaker 13:06 Actually-

Trevor Noah 13:06 That wasn't-

Speaker 13:07 While we're on the topic of the Afro, one thing I'm very jealous about with you is that ... 'Cause this is my thing. Look, look, just between us, right?

Trevor Noah 13:15 Yeah.

Speaker 13:16 I was doing-

Trevor Noah 13:17 I'm here to-

Speaker 13:17 My, I was, I was doing-

Trevor Noah 13:18 Between the, between us owls

Speaker 13:18 ... Yeah.

Trevor Noah 13:19 [laughs]

Speaker 13:19 I was, like, I was, like, doing, I was doing a Afro for a long time-

Trevor Noah 13:23 Yeah

Speaker 13:23 ... and what I was doing was, like, not correct.

Trevor Noah 13:26 Oh.

Speaker 13:26 Like, it was, it was, like, falling off of my head a little bit, 'cause it was getting so big-

Trevor Noah 13:30 Uh-huh

Speaker 13:30 ... that the right side was bigger than the left side.

Trevor Noah 13:32 Yeah.

Speaker 13:33 And it was just ... It was ... My mom would tell me I looked like a spaceship, right?

Trevor Noah 13:37 [laughs]

Speaker 13:37 And then, and then Trevor goes-

Trevor Noah 13:39 You know how bad your-

Speaker 13:40 ... all natural

Trevor Noah 13:40 ... you know how bad your hair has to be for your mom to roast it? 'Cause moms are the last people-

Speaker 13:45 Last

Trevor Noah 13:45 ... to ever see anything wrong about you in life.

Speaker 13:46 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 13:47 And your mom-

Speaker 13:47 Mm

Trevor Noah 13:47 ... was like, "Hey, what's going on spaceship boy? What's up? If the Battle Star hasn't arrived." [laughs]

Speaker 13:53 I would go, I would go home, and my mom would ask me what the plan was. And I'd just be like-

Trevor Noah 13:58 And this is how bad ... Wait. Okay, so I remember, I remember this Afro.

Speaker 14:01 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 14:01 Yeah, but what, what was the ... So-

Speaker 14:02 So, so then-

Eugene 14:02 Did it look like a spaceship?

Trevor Noah 14:03 It did

Speaker 14:04 ... when, when you, when, when you, uh, started growing out your hair, but you had, like, a plan. You were like, "Oh, okay, I'm gonna grow it out." And you, you had, you were, like, reasonable about it. That was what, like, really clued me into what I was doing.

Trevor Noah 14:17 No, no, no, no, no. I think you're being kind. I didn't have a, I didn't have ... 'Cause remember where it started. COVID was, like, the real-

Speaker 14:22 Yeah

Trevor Noah 14:22 ... the real kickoff, right?

Speaker 14:23 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 14:23 So that's the jump off. That's when my hair starts growing again.

Speaker 14:26 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 14:27 Up until then, I was like, "You gotta cut your hair. You gotta cut your hair. You gotta cut your hair. You gotta cut your hair."

Eugene 14:29 Oh, for work.

Trevor Noah 14:30 Yeah, for work.

Eugene 14:31 At the park. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

Trevor Noah 14:32 And for school, and for, like, everyone tells you, "Cut your hair. Cut your hair. Cut your hair."

Speaker 14:34 Mm. Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 14:34 There's a certain way to look. Cut your hair. Cut your hair. Cut your hair. Cut your hair. COVID comes, can't cut your hair. Can't cut your hair. Can't cut your ... Can't cut your ... Then we're, like, deep into the pandemic. No one's cut their hair. Then, uh, restrictions started, like, calming down a little bit. People were like, "All right. Maybe you can go to a barber. Maybe you can..." But I was like, "I don't know, man. Don't wanna sit in a chair, and then people are coughing on me, and now I'm in a..." I was like, "I don't wanna risk it for a haircut."

Eugene 14:55 Why?

Trevor Noah 14:55 There's no, there's no haircut in my world that is worth dying for.

Eugene 15:00 Okay, okay.

Speaker 15:00 This is how you can tell somebody

Speaker 15:02 has a good face, 'cause they're like, "There's no haircut worth..." [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:05 Worth dying for.

Speaker 15:06 No, no, no. You don't know, man. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:09 Worth dying for.

Speaker 15:10 With, there are people where you... [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:15 Josh is like, "Some of you should die."

Speaker 15:17 No, no. I was just saying that, like, this is a person who's put together, where it's like, "Ah, it's just hair." There are some people that are hanging on-

Trevor Noah 15:25 Who depend-

Speaker 15:25 ... by a thread who are like, "My hair, my, my, my suit gotta be..." You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 15:29 No, I hear you.

Speaker 15:29 'Cause they just know they're working with less.

Trevor Noah 15:31 I hear you.

Speaker 15:32 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:32 But what I'm saying is-

Eugene 15:33 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:34 ... this was death we were talking about. Remember this. This is death.

Speaker 15:37 Yeah. No, I'm with you.

Trevor Noah 15:38 This is death.

Eugene 15:38 People were going to booty calls, my man.

Trevor Noah 15:39 Yeah, and-

Eugene 15:40 During COVID

Trevor Noah 15:40 ... and what happened to some of them? They died-

Eugene 15:42 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:42 ... because of that.

Eugene 15:43 Some of them have babies.

Trevor Noah 15:45 Okay. But some of them are dead.

Eugene 15:46 COVID babies.

Trevor Noah 15:47 Some of them are dead.

Eugene 15:48 And those, those things are wild.

Speaker 15:49 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 15:49 Ha. [laughs]

Speaker 15:51 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 15:51 So, so this is what I'm... Okay. So this is what I'm saying, is we were all on, on, in this, in this journey together, right?

Speaker 15:57 Mm.

Trevor Noah 15:59 I think the difference between you and I was that because I was, like, on camera all the time, there were more people who felt like they couldn't just let me go on with, like... It's like someone-

Speaker 16:11 Mm

Trevor Noah 16:11 ... someone along the lines randomly was like, "Hey, man, at least get a lineup."

Speaker 16:15 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 16:15 That's what someone would say.

Eugene 16:16 Oh, someone said that?

Trevor Noah 16:16 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 16:17 Mm.

Trevor Noah 16:17 Someone would be like... And same things you say to me. It'd be like, "Yo, man, at least... Yo, come on, man. At least-"

Eugene 16:20 Me now?

Trevor Noah 16:21 You know, people would be like, "Look like someone's child."

Speaker 16:23 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 16:24 "Just look like someone's child."

Speaker 16:25 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 16:25 That's what they would say to me, right?

Speaker 16:27 Yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 16:27 Now, I think the only difference between you and I is because you were not in front of the camera at that time-

Speaker 16:33 Sure, sure

Trevor Noah 16:34 ... nobody was like... You weren't shaming other people.

Speaker 16:38 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 16:38 You were just shaming yourself-

Speaker 16:39 Yes, yes, yes

Trevor Noah 16:40 ... with the spaceship box haircut.

Speaker 16:42 Because it would be like, I would do, like, a l- like, a virtual live show or, like, a whatever.

Trevor Noah 16:48 Yeah.

Speaker 16:48 And then people in the chat would be like, "Hey." [laughs]

Trevor Noah 16:53 [laughs]

Speaker 16:55 These are people who paid a dollar-

Trevor Noah 16:57 [laughs]

Speaker 16:57 ... to get into the thing. And they'd be like, "Hey, my man. Like, I know this time been rough on everybody. I know..." Like, it would, it would be like that.

Trevor Noah 17:06 Damn, Josh. You're a strong man.

Speaker 17:07 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 17:08 I would feel so inse- You ... Josh and I used to roll, and we both had... At some point, it looked like the theme of the tour that we were on was unruly hair.

Speaker 17:20 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 17:21 But Josh's hair got so big and weird that sometimes he'd be on stage, and you know when the camera's, like, got a shot of you?

Speaker 17:28 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 17:29 The background would be black.

Speaker 17:30 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 17:30 But Josh's hair was so big it had three different colors. The hair closest to his head was the darkest.

Speaker 17:36 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 17:36 And then it would get lighter and lighter.

Speaker 17:38 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 17:38 But because of the background-

Speaker 17:39 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 17:39 ... and the darkness of his hair, it looked like Josh had-

Eugene 17:42 Oh, he had a hair hat

Trevor Noah 17:43 ... there was nothing. No, it looked like there was nothing.

Eugene 17:45 Yeah. And then on top of it-

Trevor Noah 17:46 And on top of it, it was like a floating... He looked like he was wearing one of those Russian hats.

Eugene 17:49 Yes.

Speaker 17:50 Yes, yes.

Eugene 17:50 The furry hat.

Speaker 17:51 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because-

Trevor Noah 17:51 You looked like you were wearing one of those Russian furry hats

Speaker 17:53 ... 'cause I did a thing that was just out of the pandemic that was like, um... It was at The Cellar.

Trevor Noah 17:59 Yeah.

Speaker 18:00 And they did a live stream slash, like, like, taping of it. And [laughs] they had extra lights, 'cause they had cameras. And so then those extra lights, I saw it later, and I, I see what you were talking about. I was like, "Oh, this is..." And it, it-

Trevor Noah 18:16 It looked like you literally put on that hat. It was, like, your thing.

Speaker 18:18 Yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 18:19 "Josh, you're on in five minutes." "Hold on. Let me get my hat."

Eugene 18:22 [laughs]

Speaker 18:22 Yeah. Because, 'cause then I think when, when you... The first time you got a, like, a cut from how it had grown-

Trevor Noah 18:31 Yeah, yeah

Speaker 18:32 ... was when I was like, "Oh, life could be different."

Trevor Noah 18:36 Life's very different.

Speaker 18:37 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 18:38 No, for you now. I mean, like, life is very, very... Life is different in every way I can think of. It's been so much fun watching it from my perspective because I've known, like, multiple versions of Josh-

Speaker 18:51 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 18:52 ... i- in, in how life is, like, responding to you, if, if I can put it that way.

Speaker 18:55 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 18:56 Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 18:56 No, that's fair. That's fair.

Trevor Noah 18:56 So I knew the Josh who, you know, I met you... You were already working at, um, you were working at Jimmy Fallon's show when I met you, right?

Speaker 19:03 No, I had just left.

Trevor Noah 19:05 Okay, so you-

Speaker 19:05 Yeah

Trevor Noah 19:05 ... had just left. But I mean-

Speaker 19:06 So I was just, like, touring.

Trevor Noah 19:07 But, yeah.

Speaker 19:07 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 19:07 But I knew you as, like, okay, comedian who's, like, doing things and whatever. But you were this, this guy who was like, "Hey, man, I don't know what's gonna happen. I'm seeing what the world is gonna throw my way. I'm just trying to hustle. I'm writing a joke, doing a thing here." And then, you know, then you went through the hair phase and it was like, "All right, I'm still hustling, and also you see my hair."

Speaker 19:27 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 19:27 "And I don't know where this is going. Yeah, I don't know where this is going." And-

Speaker 19:31 [laughs] Not hair, it's a hair

Trevor Noah 19:32 ... and then, oh, and then Josh went through this phase. Yo, then Josh started lifting. You remember when you started lifting?

Speaker 19:37 Yeah. I-

Eugene 19:37 It was the time you had

Eugene 19:38 nunchucks.

Trevor Noah 19:38 Yo, this man-

Speaker 19:39 It, yeah, it was around then. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 19:42 Yo. Yo. [laughs] This man-

Speaker 19:49 That's, this is when it's- it's a horrible time to meet a person, 'cause he met me during nunchucks, which is also just like, "Oh, this is the guy that does the nunchucks." [laughs]

Eugene 19:56 That is one of the most random moments to meet a human being.

Trevor Noah 19:58 Two sticks with a chain. Why did you have nunchucks?

Speaker 20:01 I was like, "Look-

Trevor Noah 20:02 [laughs]

Speaker 20:02 ... you can't have, you can't have a gun, but people are crazy in New York, and I'll do..." Like, we thought... Like, a lot of people thought it was, like, low-key the end of the world.

Trevor Noah 20:10 Yeah.

Speaker 20:10 We were just being chill about it.

Trevor Noah 20:12 Yeah.

Speaker 20:12 So I was like, "I need something."

Eugene 20:13 And you thought nunchucks-

Speaker 20:14 And I don't-

Eugene 20:14 ... were the solution

Speaker 20:15 ... and I can't get a sword.

Trevor Noah 20:16 Well-

Speaker 20:16 And so, like, I'm like, "L- let me just have something that's, like, a little bit..." And then I saw the news report, 'cause there was a news report about how they had lifted... There was, like, a nunchuck ban in New York City.

Trevor Noah 20:26 Yeah, there was for a while.

Speaker 20:27 And then-

Eugene 20:28 A nunchuck-

Speaker 20:28 ... when they lifted it, I was like, I was like, "Hey, then we ride. And if I get good, then I at least get... It extends my safety one more arm."

Trevor Noah 20:40 [laughs]

Speaker 20:40 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 20:41 Oh, wait, hold on.

Speaker 20:41 I can defend myself one more arm's length away.

Trevor Noah 20:44 Just one further.

Speaker 20:45 Yeah.

Eugene 20:46 I think, I think if nunchucks worked, cops would have had them.

Speaker 20:48 Sure.

Trevor Noah 20:49 No, but they do have nun-

Speaker 20:49 Sure.

Trevor Noah 20:49 They have a version of nunchucks

Speaker 20:51 ... they, they got, they have the baton.

Trevor Noah 20:51 The baton-

Speaker 20:51 They have the stick

Trevor Noah 20:52 ... the baton is like a version of a nunchuck-

Eugene 20:53 Yeah

Trevor Noah 20:53 ... for a less skilled individual.

Speaker 20:55 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Eugene 20:56 And you know why the baton works?

Trevor Noah 20:57 Because it's, like, it's-

Speaker 20:58 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 20:58 ... it's, like, idiot sticks.

Eugene 20:59 You know why it works?

Trevor Noah 21:00 No, because it's simple.

Eugene 21:01 Let's, let's let the nunchuck expert here-

Trevor Noah 21:02 Tell us

Eugene 21:03 ... tell us why a baton... Would you want to go in a fight with me if I had a baton and then you had nunchucks?

Speaker 21:08 Here-

Eugene 21:08 Who do you think would win?

Speaker 21:09 Here's the thing.

Speaker 21:10 Here's the thing. Here's how I'll put it, okay?

Eugene 21:11 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 21:12 The baton is more practical.

Eugene 21:14 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 21:14 The nunchuck is crazier. Would you rather fight someone who maybe isn't skilled?

Eugene 21:19 This is what I'm talking about.

Speaker 21:19 Or would you ma- rather fight someone who you know bites? 'Cause nunchuck is the bite n- it's like, I might hit you, I might hit me.

Eugene 21:28 See.

Speaker 21:28 I'm, I'm crazy. You never know.

Eugene 21:30 That's why the, that's why there's a phrase called blunt instrument, 'cause anyone can use it.

Speaker 21:33 [laughs]

Eugene 21:33 What you have is, nunchuck is, requires a skill set. Me, if I'm angry enough with a baton, you are dead.

Trevor Noah 21:40 Yes.

Eugene 21:40 You-

Speaker 21:40 Yeah

Eugene 21:41 ... have to know a certain level of skill-

Speaker 21:43 Mm-hmm

Eugene 21:43 ... to manage nunchuck, 'cause nunchucks are almost like a boomerang, 'cause people never account for the fact that you have to wait for it to come back.

Speaker 21:49 [laughs]

Eugene 21:50 It'll go, whoosh. And it only comes back-

Speaker 21:51 Right

Eugene 21:51 ... if it doesn't hit anything.

Speaker 21:53 Yeah. [laughs]

Eugene 21:53 The boomerang goes, fo-fo-whoo, then it goes, goes f-

Speaker 21:56 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 21:56 Oh, man.

Eugene 21:57 Then you hold... Yeah, but nunchuck is the, hyah. Then you hope... Better believe that you're going to be hoping it hits something-

Speaker 22:04 Yeah

Eugene 22:04 ... because it can also hit you.

Speaker 22:06 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 22:07 You've experienced that, neh, when nunchucks come back.

Speaker 22:09 Oh, 100%. 100%.

Trevor Noah 22:09 Are you good at nunchucks now?

Eugene 22:11 No.

Trevor Noah 22:11 Oh, damn.

Eugene 22:12 No. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 22:12 What a waste.

Speaker 22:13 Not at all. No. No, no, no.

Trevor Noah 22:15 [laughs]

Eugene 22:15 I thought you at least got to, like, the-

Speaker 22:17 Well-

Eugene 22:17 ... like, the arm stage

Speaker 22:18 ... I got to the arm stage, but the arm stage is half... It, that's a wrist away from me.

Trevor Noah 22:23 [laughs]

Speaker 22:23 I need to be good at the... You know what I mean? If I'm good at th- when you really good at the Bruce Lee stuff-

Trevor Noah 22:29 Yeah

Speaker 22:29 ... that, somebody could still get very close to you. Like, [laughs] like-

Eugene 22:33 Yes, but here's my thing with nunchucks. While you're going whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, whoosh, that doesn't account for you hitting anyone.

Speaker 22:38 No, it does. It does.

Eugene 22:39 Wait, hold on.

Speaker 22:39 Because then, if you're in here-

Eugene 22:41 So if you hit an object-

Trevor Noah 22:41 Yeah

Speaker 22:41 ... if you're in here-

Eugene 22:42 Yeah

Speaker 22:42 ... bow. Like, you-

Eugene 22:44 You swing it out.

Speaker 22:44 Yeah. Now you can't see it, so you don't know what direction-

Eugene 22:47 Okay, thank you

Speaker 22:47 ... I'm about to swing it from under my arm.

Eugene 22:49 And let's say you hit me, bam.

Speaker 22:51 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Eugene 22:52 And then what happens to the nunchuck that left? 'Cause there's two of them, I mean, there's one that you're holding-

Speaker 22:56 Yeah

Eugene 22:56 ... and there's one that left.

Speaker 22:57 That's the one that hits you.

Eugene 22:58 So if it hits me, what happens to the part that hit me?

Speaker 23:00 The part that hit you goes down, but now that it's down, I can hit you in the back of the head.

Eugene 23:05 Oh, geez.

Trevor Noah 23:05 This gu- you see, this guy was in it.

Speaker 23:07 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 23:07 You know what I'm loving?

Eugene 23:07 I've seen Josh with those nunchucks.

Trevor Noah 23:09 [laughs] Yeah, you don't seem sold.

Eugene 23:10 I think he injured... He self-defensed himself more than he defended himself. [laughs]

Speaker 23:13 No, 100%.

Trevor Noah 23:13 Protecting himself from himself.

Speaker 23:15 100%.

Trevor Noah 23:16 I'm, I'm ima-

Eugene 23:16 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 23:16 You know what I'm imagining?

Speaker 23:17 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 23:17 I'm imagining the person who was walking through New York City, seeing you with your spaceship hair and the nunchucks, and then they were like, "I need to go to self-defense training 'cause New York is full of crazy people." [laughs]

Speaker 23:29 [laughs] No, 'cause I'll tell you

Speaker 23:32 right now, the hair saved my life, because then I'm over here practicing, and I brought, I bought two practice ones. I bought one that was, like, foam.

Trevor Noah 23:40 Okay.

Speaker 23:41 But the foam one is, like, is gonna break in a day.

Eugene 23:43 Oh.

Speaker 23:44 Like, you can't-

Eugene 23:44 That's how dangerous these things are

Speaker 23:45 ... do you know what I mean?

Eugene 23:46 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 23:46 The, the foam one you can't... So then you have to use the wooden one, 'cause I was never gonna buy the metal one-

Eugene 23:51 [laughs]

Speaker 23:51 ... 'cause the metal, the metal one you could [laughs] accidentally kill somebody. And now it's swinging from your hand, but you're like, "Uh, uh," and you wait for them to come-

Eugene 23:59 But what do you mean accidentally kill someone? Aren't you trying to defend yourself?

Speaker 24:02 Because, okay, the same way where you're trying to defend yourself and you know how to box-

Eugene 24:06 So then I must throw this one first

Speaker 24:06 ... and then you, and then you, and then you punch somebody on the chin, right?

Eugene 24:09 Yeah.

Speaker 24:09 But you end up knocking them out, and they fall, and the way they fall, they die, right? It's like that could happen. The metal nunchuck is for murder. Like, like, that, that one I still don't think should be legal. [upbeat music]

Trevor Noah 24:23 We'll be right back after this short break. This episode is presented by Whole Foods Market. Eat well for less. You know how Thanksgiving always

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Speaker 25:53 Uh-

Trevor Noah 25:54 Like, the biggest, like, the fight you remember. Did you ever fight?

Speaker 25:57 Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So, well, fight implies a length that I made the fight continue. I was, like, beat up sometimes as a kid.

Trevor Noah 26:07 Yeah.

Speaker 26:07 But, like, I would, I would, like, try to fight back.

Trevor Noah 26:11 Who was beating you up?

Speaker 26:12 Just other kids. Like, it was ... And it wasn't even like-

Trevor Noah 26:14 Hmm. Were these, like, bullies-bullies or were these just other kids?

Speaker 26:17 Two of them were, like, bullies-bullies.

Trevor Noah 26:18 Okay. Yeah, yeah, okay. Got it.

Speaker 26:19 But, like, but the thing is, it's like the same awareness that I think a kid doesn't have of, like, where their elbow is, so they knock a glass over-

Trevor Noah 26:29 Yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 26:29 ... is the awareness of, like, strength that I lacked for something I wanted to do. So, like, like, for instance, there was one time I, like, stood up to a bully. Like, I really, like, stood up to him, and it's like-

Trevor Noah 26:40 What was the ... Wait, wait, wait. W- sh- set, set the scene.

Speaker 26:41 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 26:41 What was their name? We all remember our bullies' names.

Speaker 26:45 Uh, I w- look, I won't say his name.

Trevor Noah 26:48 First name.

Speaker 26:48 Yeah, I won't, I won't say his name, but it rhymes with, uh, uh, uh, wheat.

Trevor Noah 26:53 Okay. Wheat.

Speaker 26:54 Okay. And so, so then-

Trevor Noah 26:56 Wheat

Speaker 26:56 ... you know, been picking on me. Been-

Trevor Noah 26:58 So, so Pete is the bully.

Eugene 27:00 Sweeet.

Trevor Noah 27:00 We got, we got Pete or Wheat.

Speaker 27:01 That's bad.

Eugene 27:01 Sweeet.

Speaker 27:01 You must know one.

Trevor Noah 27:02 Sweeet.

Speaker 27:03 I don't know one.

Trevor Noah 27:04 [laughs]

Eugene 27:04 [laughs]

Speaker 27:06 Anyway. But then, um-

Trevor Noah 27:06 How old are you?

Speaker 27:08 I have to be maybe eight-

Trevor Noah 27:11 Okay

Speaker 27:12 ... or, like, nine, something like that.

Trevor Noah 27:13 Got it.

Speaker 27:13 And, and I'd had enough of it, right? And I just, like ... And I even had, like, a little speech-

Eugene 27:19 Hmm

Speaker 27:19 ... planned if he, if he, like, came up on me, rolled up on me-

Trevor Noah 27:22 Oh, man

Speaker 27:22 ... messed with me, right? And so I said all the stuff, and then I, I, like, reared back, which he was also surprised by. Like, thi- and this also I could tell was a big kid 'cause m- he was more surprised than threatened.

Eugene 27:35 Hmm.

Speaker 27:35 He was like, "Wow, something's about to happen. This is crazy." And then I reared back and I punched him as hard as I could, and I managed to punch him, like, in the, in the chin a bit. Like, like, kind of-

Trevor Noah 27:45 Jaw

Speaker 27:45 ... like, like, yeah, like-

Trevor Noah 27:46 Yeah

Speaker 27:47 ... back jaw, right?

Trevor Noah 27:48 Yeah.

Speaker 27:49 And then he, like, grabbed his face. 'Cause also, when you're a kid and nobody's, like, really hit you or hit you back-

Trevor Noah 27:54 Yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 27:55 ... it's surprising. So, you know, he's like ... And then he walks away.

Trevor Noah 28:00 [laughs]

Speaker 28:00 And then as soon as he walks away, I'm like-

Trevor Noah 28:02 I like that

Speaker 28:04 ... "Gah!" Like, I'm, like, grabbing my head, 'cause I had, I hadn't, like, put it together that this would hurt.

Trevor Noah 28:08 Yeah. It, no one shows you. I mean, in the movies-

Speaker 28:10 Yeah

Trevor Noah 28:10 ... they don't show you that.

Eugene 28:11 And there's no sound.

Trevor Noah 28:11 For the most part. Yeah.

Speaker 28:12 And-

Trevor Noah 28:12 The, look. Shh

Speaker 28:13 ... and they're not hurt.

Trevor Noah 28:14 Yeah.

Speaker 28:14 Like, Bruce Lee never finished the fight after everybody was down, was like, "Ah, ah."

Trevor Noah 28:19 [laughs]

Speaker 28:19 Like, this never happened.

Trevor Noah 28:21 Jackie Chan did.

Speaker 28:22 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 28:23 He was the-

Speaker 28:23 That's right

Trevor Noah 28:23 ... he was the honest fighter.

Speaker 28:25 He was the-

Trevor Noah 28:25 Yeah.

Speaker 28:25 He's what got us closer to John Wick.

Trevor Noah 28:28 Yeah. I agree.

Speaker 28:28 'Cause John Wick will end the fight and be like, "Oh-

Trevor Noah 28:31 Limp

Speaker 28:31 ... oh, God." [laughs] Like-

Trevor Noah 28:33 I still don't like that he got hit by a car and carried on.

Speaker 28:36 Did he get hit by a car?

Trevor Noah 28:36 That always threw me. John Wick.

Speaker 28:38 Didn't he jump a bit?

Trevor Noah 28:40 Really? Man, I don't know.

Speaker 28:41 He jumped a bit though.

Trevor Noah 28:42 I don't know. I, you know what? I, I l- I really like John Wick-

Speaker 28:45 Yeah

Trevor Noah 28:45 ... the movies.

Speaker 28:46 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 28:46 The only thing I didn't-

Eugene 28:47 But you also like The Matrix.

Trevor Noah 28:48 Yeah, but-

Eugene 28:48 And it's the same guy.

Trevor Noah 28:49 Yeah, but the difference there is it's not the real world. So I'm ... John Wick gets hit by a vehicle-

Speaker 28:56 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 28:56 ... and then he just gets up and-

Eugene 28:57 Which one's not the real world again? Between John Wick and The Matrix.

Trevor Noah 29:00 No, The Matrix is not the real world.

Eugene 29:02 Oh.

Trevor Noah 29:03 What I'm saying is in John Wick.

Eugene 29:04 John Wick is the real one.

Trevor Noah 29:08 You know what? You know what, Josh? Let's carry on.

Eugene 29:09 So a geriatric version of Neo-

Trevor Noah 29:11 [laughs]

Speaker 29:12 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 29:12 Josh, let's carry on. Guy's trying to-

Eugene 29:14 Where instead of being led by a Black man, he's led by a dog, is more-

Speaker 29:17 But I was-

Eugene 29:18 ... much more real than-

Trevor Noah 29:20 He's in-

Eugene 29:20 ... in The Matrix.

Trevor Noah 29:20 He's in s- 'cause they, they said it wasn't... Anyway.

Speaker 29:24 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 29:24 So wait, wait.

Eugene 29:25 Hmm.

Trevor Noah 29:25 Did the, did bully ever come back?

Speaker 29:27 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Different day, but yeah.

Trevor Noah 29:30 Oh, damn.

Speaker 29:30 And then by then I was like-

Trevor Noah 29:30 So this isn't, like, a victory story. This isn't like Josh Johnson.

Speaker 29:33 No.

Trevor Noah 29:34 [laughs]

Speaker 29:34 It's, you ... I won a half a battle, and I lost the next battle. Like, it wasn't even a war. It was just, like ... I, 'cause I was just a easy target too, 'cause I think I'm openly, like, sensitive, and I am not, like, a big guy. So I didn't have a big, I didn't, I never had a big frame growing up.

Trevor Noah 29:54 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 29:54 So even in high school, the people who picked on me was like, yeah, it's, like, easy pickings. Like, I, I look like I almost don't exist in my clothes. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 30:03 Yeah, you're sweet. Um-

Eugene 30:05 Poetic

Trevor Noah 30:05 ...

Trevor Noah 30:06 you are, you're timid in your vibe.

Speaker 30:09 Sure, sure.

Trevor Noah 30:09 Like, just as Josh, like, a- as I've always known you, you're really considerate.

Speaker 30:12 Hmm.

Trevor Noah 30:13 You-

Speaker 30:13 Yeah

Trevor Noah 30:13 ... you were perfect, like, bully fodder in that way.

Eugene 30:15 Hmm.

Speaker 30:15 And it doesn't help that I was always, like, re- like, when your head is down for reading, you're a perfect target for anything.

Trevor Noah 30:23 [laughs]

Speaker 30:24 I'm, like, read- I'm, like, reading all the time.

Trevor Noah 30:26 [laughs]

Speaker 30:26 I'm, like, reading for fun. And so now I genuinely don't know what's about to happen-

Trevor Noah 30:30 [laughs]

Speaker 30:30 ... until a book gets slapped out my hand. And then I look up, and I'm sure any bully that saw me was looking at me, and I was looking at them like Like, it just, 'cause I'm, the shock of like, "The book's on the floor. What's about to happen?" Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? So, and I, and I don't think I, like, carried an awareness for defense enough ever really until, until maybe, like, I really became an adult. Hmm. Even being in Chicago, I was like, look, apparently, you know, especially when you go to, like, some, some clubs were, like, on the South Side and people would either, you would either know something happened or people would say something had just happened- Yeah ... at some point. And so I was like, "All right. Like, I'll be fine. I'll just run, and then whatever bullet hits me was meant for me." Do you know what I mean? You were never about that life. You were never like, "I'm gonna stand up, fight, do a thing, handle it," no? No. Even when I tried to, like, roll with other kids that were, like, tough, they were even like, "You're too sweet for this thing. Like, you're not like a tough..." Like, even kids in my neighborhood would be like, "Yeah, but you're not." Like... I like that for you. You know what I mean? No, I, I genuine- Look- You know? I look, I, I, at the time, I looked back on it as like, "Why is everybody, um, so..." What is it? "Why, why is everybody so, uh, like, patronizing?" Yeah, yeah, yeah. And now I look at it as, as if, like, almost, and, m- m- you know, whatever, this is gonna sound however it sounds, but it's

Speaker 31:55 like almost by, like, some truly, like, divine design, everybody that was in my life was put in my life for a reason, helped keep me on the right path. Even when I wanted to do something bad, they, like, they, like, made it so it's like I didn't even have the opportunity. Like, I d- like, like, the, all these things came together. Even the people who, like, pushed me out of their life, it's like their life went in, like, a horrific direction, so it's like they pushed me, they li- they, it's almost like pushing someone out of the way of a car. Oh, yeah. I know what you mean. 'Cause I'm like- Yeah ... I'm trying to, like, roll with this kid or, or be like this kid, and then this kid is like, "Hey, this is, like, not for you," and then, and then something even ends up happening to that person or, or, or they go down a worse path or something. Hmm. So now everything that's happened, like, I can be nothing but, but grateful because, like, at the time I'm sure, especially when I used to... This is gonna sound self-deprecating, and it's not meant to be. Yeah. But, like, the realization that I've, I've come to about myself, and especially over time, is that, like, all of the things about me that I like and that people like are because I'm not, like, conventionally cool. Like, I'm not like a cool guy who is like, um, wow, I wanna be like that guy the way you wanna be like James Dean. Yeah. Like, I'm not that- Yeah, yeah, yeah ... I'm not that type of guy. Right. Okay. So if I, if I stop trying to be that type of guy and I just like, "Hey, look, I like Rubik's Cubes, I like comic books, I like..." And you just, you just become... It's, it's things we've been taught since we were little,

Speaker 33:24 the best version of yourself, the best, like, the most honest version of yourself. That's where all of your, like, cool will come from because everyone who likes those things will be like, "Wow, you openly like those things." Like, I'm like, I'm over here doing the Rubik's Cube what it used to get slapped out your hand, and now people on the internet are like, "He did it in, do a .4 seconds." Like- Yeah, now it's become a- Yeah. But it's like- Hmm ... if you're, like, an O- if you're, like, an OG of that thing... And don't get me wrong, I wasn't even good. So now me, watch, watching me do the Rubik's Cube was a waste of time 'cause it wasn't like I was like, "Hey, Trevor, you wanna see something cool?" It'd be like, "Hey, Trevor, you wanna see something cool?" [laughs] Ah. Ah. Can you mess it up again? I can't, can I restart? [laughs] It's like, it's like that, but then, like I said, everything in life led me to the point, at least in the feeling- Hmm ... of about two years ago where everything fits into place. I f- I felt like I fit in at different points in my life. When I lived in Chicago, I f- and started doing comedy- Yeah ... I finally had the, like, conduit. I finally had the vehicle for all these things I had ever been and ever done- Mm-hmm ... and ever talked like and ever- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay ... and then found my people. And then moved into New York felt like, it did feel like a mistake for the first, like, six months. It did, like, genuinely it felt like maybe I had made a mistake until I got hired at Fallon. But every, everyone that I was meeting, I used to do storytelling open mics, comedy open mics. I used to do variety shows, like, all the stuff like that. Were you working at that time doing, like, a job job, as they

Speaker 35:04 say? Yeah, I was, like, working at a grocery store. In New York? Yeah. Yeah. What type of grocery store? Uh, the Trader Joe's variety. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What were you doing there? What, uh- Everything. Like, I was a cashier. I did everything but fill orders 'cause I was like, "Y'all, if you make me..." [laughs] 'Cause they would try. Anytime you have a good attitude and, like, you're on time and stuff like, people start trying to give you more responsibility 'cause they're like, "This is the person that won't mess it up." But I'm like, "Y'all, I know my limit, and if you put me on freezer, y'all are gonna have 6,000 ice creams and no frozen turkey. Like, I'm just, I'm telling you that right now. I don't have that attention to detail," you know? And so I was, like, cashier, didn't wanna become a manager, didn't wanna become an assistant manager. Why not? Because in my head, I was like, I thought I had found, and I'm glad I was wrong 'cause I wouldn't be here now, but I've worked at a couple grocery stores, and I've worked, you know, odd jobs and stuff like that, and I found that, like, m- at least in most situations, I can be happy. And so I was making enough to live, but I hadn't met any of my goals yet, but I was still doing standup at night, and so I was, like, happy. Like, like, even in unhappiness happy, you know what I mean? Like, you deal with terrible customers or you, like, you're low on money, so you gotta eat. Dude, I've talked about this before, but I knew I was broke. In Chicago, when they put the door knocker thing for the pizza on there, my roommates and I, we see it's a deal 'cause this place just opened. Yeah. It's five, no, it's three pizzas for $15, so it's like every pizza $5, whatever. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. We each order a pizza. We get violently sick. And I knew I was broke, 'cause I was like, next day I'm like, "I'm gonna eat one more slice-

Trevor Noah 36:45 [laughs]

Speaker 36:46 ... and then I gotta be done with this place." But like in the off chance I was just sick.

Trevor Noah 36:51 [laughs]

Speaker 36:51 And then my roommate's even like, "What do you mean you were just sick? We all threw

Speaker 36:55 up." And [laughs] I was like, "Yeah, but look, maybe this slice will be different," and then I throw the box away.

Trevor Noah 37:01 [laughs]

Speaker 37:01 But like I don't have money to just waste.

Trevor Noah 37:03 I gotta give this slice a chance, man.

Speaker 37:04 Yeah. Yeah. And so I, I just found that I was happy. I w- I was so happy in Chicago literally just making ends meet, like [laughs] could not even save money, but I was doing standup at night and figuring myself out and everything. And I feel like now it's just a reminder to like stay in that place-

Trevor Noah 37:27 Mm

Speaker 37:27 ... even as circumstances change.

Trevor Noah 37:29 Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 37:29 Because now it's like, okay, like, I'm not, I'm not, um, um, completely broke, but like what do I need? And it turns out I don't need much. If I can take care of my mom, and take care of my aunt, and just take care of like myself and my girlfriend, put on good shows, nothing else really matters, so that I don't really need that much money. Like, and so now if you don't need that much money, you don't need to do whatever, whatever, whatever.

Trevor Noah 37:57 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 37:57 So now some of that noise gets like shut out a little bit. Because, like, yeah, sometimes you, you'll, you'll be in a situation where somebody wants you to do this thing, somebody wants you to do this thing, and if you don't really know what you want, you might end up doing it and not liking it or looking back on it and not liking it. And I'm not saying I love everything I've ever done completely, but like the, the path that the internet and the people that I'm meeting along the way have allowed me is to like do things that are completely consistent with how I feel about how my career should go and building a catalog that I think will like stand alone, like, like-

Trevor Noah 38:36 Yeah, yeah

Speaker 38:37 ... by itself.

Trevor Noah 38:37 Some- something that you're proud of because you wanted to do it for the reasons that you wanted to do it.

Speaker 38:43 And-

Trevor Noah 38:44 Which, which is a unique moment to get to-

Speaker 38:45 Yeah

Trevor Noah 38:46 ... a- as an artist, but I think as any, any human on this planet. I was, I was thinking about it this morning, exactly what you're saying. I was, I was in the shower and I was going-

Speaker 38:56 Hm? Hm?

Trevor Noah 38:57 Are you picturing me in the shower now?

Speaker 38:59 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 39:00 So I was in, I was in the shower, and I, I had this thought genuinely where I was going, it's hard for people to understand, it's hard for any of us to understand this, because money is oftentimes the thing that connects you to all choice, power, um, whatever it might be.

Speaker 39:20 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 39:22 But pursuing money is almost the worst direction you can ever take, right? If you say to yourself in life, "I'm going to pursue money," you could just take money out of an old lady's wallet, then you've ... The money is there now.

Speaker 39:37 Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 39:38 Right?

Speaker 39:38 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 39:39 I think what we haven't been taught for the most part, because society doesn't oftentimes tell us enough, is that money, especially in a well-functioning society, money's a byproduct of a job well done.

Speaker 39:50 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 39:51 You know? And so if you have the luxury of doing the thing that you love doing and you get to do it well, you'll find that money somehow slips into your ether. It, it, it, it starts to come in. And that's, like I say-

Speaker 40:04 Mm

Trevor Noah 40:04 ... in a well-functioning society.

Speaker 40:06 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 40:06 As capitalism goes extreme and, uh, it, it-

Speaker 40:08 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 40:08 ... deteriorates in its late stage, people now can only earn money from certain things.

Speaker 40:14 Hm.

Trevor Noah 40:14 But when I look at you, I go, it's, it's the perfect example. Like, you'll tell me if I'm wrong, but I feel like this version of Josh Johnson, like the person we know you as today, you couldn't exist the same if the internet wasn't what it is now.

Speaker 40:33 No, no. I think-

Trevor Noah 40:34 Do, do you know what I mean?

Speaker 40:34 I know exactly what you mean, and I think about that a lot, because I had found some, um, some mainstream and, like, legacy media success, but not enough to live the way that I'm living or make the choices that I make.

Trevor Noah 40:50 Yeah.

Speaker 40:50 You know what I mean? Like, I had done Fallon, I had done Conan, I got like a Comedy Central half-hour. I've done the route. Like, I got New Faces for JFL. Like, I did a lot of the route stuff you're supposed to do-

Trevor Noah 41:02 Yeah, you went-

Speaker 41:02 ... as like an up-and-comer

Trevor Noah 41:03 ... yeah, because all the stations along the way.

Speaker 41:05 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 41:05 Yeah.

Speaker 41:05 And then there's a place that you end up, for some people it's after they do JFL New Faces, for some people it's after they get their half-hour, and for some people it's, like, even after they've been on a sitcom or something like that, where now there's like, there is no more up-and-coming. You're, you've, you've come.

Trevor Noah 41:22 Yes. Mm.

Speaker 41:23 And so what does that-

Trevor Noah 41:24 Yeah.

Speaker 41:24 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 41:25 Yeah. You, you can't-

Speaker 41:25 Yeah, you're just here

Trevor Noah 41:26 ... it's like you, you can't win Best New Artist

Trevor Noah 41:28 anymore.

Speaker 41:28 You're just like ... Yeah.

Trevor Noah 41:28 It's like, there's a, there's a point-

Speaker 41:29 They give it to you one time.

Trevor Noah 41:31 Yeah.

Speaker 41:31 And if you lose the time you're up for it-

Trevor Noah 41:33 That's it. You're done

Speaker 41:33 ... you're also not gonna ... You're just ... Look, I'm new to people.

Trevor Noah 41:36 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 41:36 But I'm saying, like, the ways in which an industry could-

Trevor Noah 41:40 Elevate you

Speaker 41:40 ... pro- could, could elevate a person along the way, I had got a lot of that stuff, and then there was a gap between does he have his own show-

Trevor Noah 41:50 Mm

Speaker 41:50 ... is he writing a show? Is he selling shows?

Trevor Noah 41:53 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

Speaker 41:53 Is he a touring headlining comedian? Is he ... And so there was a gap there. The internet closed that gap, the people closed that gap, and that's why I have a bit more confidence. Because one thing I'll say about the era that we live in now versus even 25 years ago-

Trevor Noah 42:08 Mm-hmm

Speaker 42:09 ... is that the industry used to be able to close that gap for you. They're like, "You are, um, this A-list star, and we're gonna treat you like this A-list star when you're actually really young, just 'cause we, like, as a studio believe in you."

Trevor Noah 42:21 Yeah.

Speaker 42:21 And you used to just be signed to, like, one studio.

Trevor Noah 42:24 Yeah.

Speaker 42:24 And so anyway, the industry used to close that gap, but then if industry betrayed you, blacklisted you, you'll, you'll see C- McCarthy stuff, whatever.

Trevor Noah 42:33 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 42:34 Once that thing happened, you didn't have connection to the people. So even if the people liked you, they'd be like, "Oh, why haven't you been in a movie in forever?"

Trevor Noah 42:41 Yeah. You've been blackballed.

Speaker 42:42 It's like, because no one picked up my calls and no one's calling me. But that can never happen again, because, like- If you, if you have connection to people and if you've

Speaker 42:52 built community, then you'll always be a version of what you're doing now, especially if you're not doing it to be number one. And the thing that we're lucky about, th- what makes us different from sports, is that, like, there can really be no number one.

Trevor Noah 43:05 Yeah.

Speaker 43:05 And so it's like, because there's no number one, you can just be, like, your number one. You can be, like, the best you.

Trevor Noah 43:10 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 43:11 And for some people-

Trevor Noah 43:12 Hmm

Speaker 43:12 ... like, that... Like, for, for plenty of people, Trevor Noah is, like, the GOAT of comedy, right? And the... And it, it taps into their sensibility. Your timing is their timing of how they think. Your humor, it connects with everyone that, um, that follows you, that believes that you are, like, the best of all time. There's gonna be a Chris Rock is the GOAT, Dave Chappelle is the GOAT. Like, GOAT, GOAT, GOAT, GOAT, GOAT, GOAT, GOAT. But because it's not a foot race-

Trevor Noah 43:40 There is no clock

Speaker 43:41 ... as, as long as you don't... There, there's no clock.

Trevor Noah 43:43 Yeah.

Speaker 43:43 So as long as you don't convince yourself-

Trevor Noah 43:46 Uh-huh

Speaker 43:46 ... that there's a clock, you can just carry on. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 43:49 Yeah. It-

Speaker 43:50 And so it's like, I wanna be the best, like, comedic writer ever. I also know that's not gonna happen, but I know that it will happen in someone's mind that connects with my work, and that's enough. And I really want it to happen, and I want it to happen in the way where everybody says it. It's not gonna happen. But, like, at the same time, chasing that, now, like, money is, like-

Trevor Noah 44:11 But that's what I mean. You, you-

Speaker 44:12 You know what I mean? Like-

Trevor Noah 44:13 It sounds to me like you fell in love with the process, essentially.

Speaker 44:15 Yeah. Yeah.

Trevor Noah 44:16 Because the process, the process is, like, the reward that will always yield a return, right?

Speaker 44:22 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 44:22 If you fall in love with the process in your life, then the outcome just becomes the bonus at the end of it, you know?

Speaker 44:28 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 44:28 And I've seen this with friends who like cooking. Like, they try to get me into cooking because I like food. I like eating food.

Speaker 44:35 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 44:36 And then they would go like, "You should learn how to cook." And then when I would try to learn how to cook, e- even if it came out right at the end, I was like, "I don't like this."

Speaker 44:44 Mm. Yeah.

Trevor Noah 44:44 I like eating the food.

Speaker 44:46 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 44:46 You know what I mean?

Speaker 44:47 'Cause when you eat the food and you didn't cook it, you're not sweaty.

Trevor Noah 44:50 Yeah, that's what I'm... That... You see-

Speaker 44:51 Now a sweaty version of me is eating the food.

Trevor Noah 44:52 This is what I'm talking about, man.

Speaker 44:53 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 44:54 I'd just be, I'd just be like, "Yo man, I get to the end of this journey."

Eugene 44:56 What are you guys cooking?

Trevor Noah 44:57 But if you... What do you mean?

Eugene 44:58 It makes you sweaty.

Eugene 45:00 Oh, it's just process.

Trevor Noah 45:01 You know how it is, man.

Eugene 45:03 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 45:03 If you, if you can't handle the heat-

Eugene 45:04 Yeah

Trevor Noah 45:04 ... get out of the kitchen.

Eugene 45:05 Oh.

Speaker 45:06 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 45:06 You don't sweat when you cook. Maybe that's why I'm not-

Eugene 45:09 What are you guys cooking?

Trevor Noah 45:10 Just anything. Hot food.

Eugene 45:11 No, give me an example of what you made that made you go, "Yay."

Trevor Noah 45:14 Okay, one, one day I was trying to make a stew.

Eugene 45:16 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 45:16 I've only tried it once.

Eugene 45:17 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 45:18 And one time I was trying to make a stew, and it just involved me with a pot, with water, with ingredients, with a thing. I had to keep-

Eugene 45:24 Did you close the lid?

Trevor Noah 45:24 I, I... No, I had to keep opening the lid to see what was bubbling. I had to keep closing the thing, opening it.

Eugene 45:28 That's normal. That's part of cooking.

Trevor Noah 45:29 Yeah. And in that process-

Eugene 45:30 How close were you to this lid?

Trevor Noah 45:32 I, I wasn't measuring, Eugene. I wasn't measuring my distance to the-

Eugene 45:35 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 45:35 Maybe this is why I'm not a good cook.

Eugene 45:36 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 45:37 I was just, like, opening and closing, opening and closing.

Speaker 45:39 It would be very funny if you were later there too close.

Trevor Noah 45:41 Yeah. [laughs]

Speaker 45:41 And you were like, "Man, cooking is hot."

Trevor Noah 45:44 [laughs] I'm like going, "What?"

Speaker 45:46 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 45:48 No, but I, but what I mean is, like, I don't think there's anything wrong with liking or not liking certain things.

Eugene 45:54 Mm.

Trevor Noah 45:54 But I think people take for granted that the... If you fall in love, if you find a passion for the process, then the outcome just becomes a bonus.

Speaker 46:05 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 46:05 And if you love the outcome, then your, your joy is always going to oscillate between-

Speaker 46:12 Yeah

Trevor Noah 46:12 ... good and bad, good and bad, good and bad.

Eugene 46:13 But that's also... That, I think that point of view is a privilege. We've had this conversation, but in another form.

Trevor Noah 46:18 Yeah.

Eugene 46:18 I'm always, like, that point, uh, making that point, you can only make it from a point of privilege. So if-

Trevor Noah 46:23 Yes

Eugene 46:24 ... pe- people with a skill, a rare skill, a talent, like a surgeon who earns hundreds of thousands of dollars a month can say, "You know, I just like operating on people," but you're like, "No, no, no. I don't know what I'm gonna eat tonight."

Speaker 46:36 Mm.

Eugene 46:36 So you can pursue your passion.

Speaker 46:38 Yes. When you talk about money, for sure.

Eugene 46:39 No, yes. I'm talking about money versus when people say, "No, yes, just I love the process" and-

Trevor Noah 46:44 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Eugene 46:45 So the average person, I think, this is my opinion, does not have the luxury to think about their passion.

Trevor Noah 46:51 Yes.

Eugene 46:52 But they're thinking about, what am I gonna do now? What am I gonna eat now?

Speaker 46:56 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 46:56 And obviously when you tell the story about how you grew up and when you were eating the pizza that made you throw up, if someone would have walked into that dorm room

Eugene 47:03 while you were eating $5 pizza and told you, "Just enjoy, just enjoy the process, not about the money."

Speaker 47:08 Yeah.

Eugene 47:08 My man.

Speaker 47:09 No, that is what people said.

Eugene 47:10 Yeah.

Speaker 47:11 They were like, that's, like, that's-

Eugene 47:12 And what did you feel? [laughs]

Speaker 47:13 No, but I'm, I guess I'm, I'm thinking also, one- once again from privilege.

Eugene 47:18 Mm.

Speaker 47:18 It's either privilege or experience. 'Cause I think saying fall in love with the process is a thing that comes from the experience of, like, if you have... Sometimes it's just good advice from somebody who did it the other way. So yes, it's from, like, a point of privilege to say, like, "Don't worry about money." And I'm not saying don't worry about money. I'm saying people have put me in a position where I don't worry about money the same way.

Eugene 47:39 Mm.

Speaker 47:39 So I'm, I'm not-

Trevor Noah 47:39 And I'm, and I'm also saying-

Speaker 47:40 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 47:40 I'm also saying-

Eugene 47:41 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 47:42 ... I don't necessarily... I think it might be a luxurious way of experiencing your own mind, but I don't think it's an unattainable luxury, right? And here's, here's why I'll say this. When you started comedy, if you remember your journey, it was not paying anything.

Eugene 47:57 Mm.

Trevor Noah 47:57 Comedy literally paid us no... There wasn't even an idea of the possibility. When we were doing comedy in South Africa, starting out, the, the concept of getting paid by anyone or anything-

Eugene 48:08 We paid to do comedy.

Trevor Noah 48:09 Yeah, we paid to do comedy.

Speaker 48:10 Mm. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 48:11 There wasn't even, like, a, "20 bucks, well done, k-..." No.

Speaker 48:13 Mm.

Trevor Noah 48:14 That came over time.

Eugene 48:15 Mm.

Trevor Noah 48:15 Right? But we fell in love with the process, and I... What I mean by that is I don't think everything has to be contained in one space.

Eugene 48:25 Right.

Trevor Noah 48:25 Right? So when you look at somebody who likes knitting, mm, I would always, I would always be fascinated watching somebody knit.

Speaker 48:36 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 48:37 Mm.

Trevor Noah 48:37 And I'll go like, "What, what are you doing?" And they're like, "I'm knitting." And I'm like, "Oh, are you trying to make something?" And they go like, "Well," sometimes they even go, "I'll see what it is. I'm just starting with this block for now."

Eugene 48:45 Mm.

Trevor Noah 48:45 "And then it will grow into something else, and it'll become something, and then I'll decide what I wanna make." But they go, "I like knitting." Knitting is the thing that they actually enjoy.

Speaker 48:53 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 48:54 On the other side of knitting is the garment that you've created.

Eugene 48:57 Right.

Trevor Noah 48:57 Do, do you get what I'm saying?

Eugene 48:57 Yeah.

Speaker 48:58 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 48:58 And so what I'm saying is- It, it, it's, it's, it's, it's noisy. That's why I completely agree with you.

Speaker 49:05 Mm.

Trevor Noah 49:05 It's noisy. It is hard to appreciate process, it is hard to appreciate passion when you're hungry.

Speaker 49:11 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 49:11 Right? But it's, it is those people

Trevor Noah 49:15 sometimes who are the ones that'll make you... The ones who can do it in those moments, they're sometimes the, the, the people who inspire me the most because they can and they do. Like, when my family was at its worst, you know, my mom loved gardening. We didn't have anything. We did, like, literally, I remember nights where it's like we're eating mopane worms because it was, like, the cheapest thing-

Speaker 49:34 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 49:34 ... we could buy. It's like a dried caterpillar type. Or how would you... Is it caterpillar?

Speaker 49:37 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 49:37 Yeah. That's, like, the only thing we could afford for a moment. Then at some point, we, it, we couldn't even get mopane worms. All we could get was morogo.

Speaker 49:42 Mm.

Trevor Noah 49:42 That was, like, it. And this isn't, like, a long, it's not years in my life, but, like, a few months. I just remember we couldn't afford meat, and we couldn't afford a, a certain type of protein.

Speaker 49:52 Mm.

Trevor Noah 49:53 And so now we're buying, like, grass essentially, is how it seemed to me as a kid.

Speaker 49:57 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 49:58 Because when you introduced this to me late in life, I'm just like, "This is-

Speaker 50:02 Oh, yeah, they're eating kale and quinoa all day.

Trevor Noah 50:04 It's ironic, by the way.

Speaker 50:05 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 50:05 'Cause I remember the first time someone came with kale in America, then I was like, "I'm not going back. I, I escaped this trap. I'm not going back to this."

Speaker 50:12 It's so good. Mm.

Trevor Noah 50:13 But morogo and kale are very... I still think, like, a, you know what I mean?

Speaker 50:16 Yeah. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 50:17 But the thing that amazed me was she still found joy in her processes. Just doing something in a garden.

Speaker 50:25 Mm.

Trevor Noah 50:25 Going and, and, and, and I, and I think, like, that's, that's what you're talking about. Like, when I listen to you-

Speaker 50:30 Yeah

Trevor Noah 50:30 ... there's an element of Josh Johnson that's just like, you're just, like, obsessed and in love with the process-

Speaker 50:37 Yeah, 'cause-

Trevor Noah 50:38 ... that you're pursuing

Speaker 50:39 ... 'cause then it's like the thing, I gue- I guess if you were to put yourself back in different moments, right? Because don't get me wrong, I am never, I am never, it's never lost on me

Speaker 50:49 that, like, I am the exception and not the rule. And so I even tell people, I'm like, "Look, everybody's on their own journey. I don't want you to think that, like..." There's, there's some aspect of, "If I can do it, you can do it," and then there's also an aspect of, "If I can do it, you can do it," being weaponized to keep people in a bad position.

Trevor Noah 51:07 Yeah, I, I hate that if I can do it-

Speaker 51:08 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 51:09 Yeah, yeah. I agree.

Speaker 51:09 Because it's like, 'cause people have said that to me who were tall.

Trevor Noah 51:13 [laughs]

Speaker 51:14 And now I'm like, "What do you mean, dunk?"

Trevor Noah 51:17 [laughs]

Speaker 51:17 And they're like, "Look, you work hard enough."

Trevor Noah 51:20 [laughs]

Speaker 51:20 "You work on your game. If I can do it, you can do it." Swish. And then I'm like, "All right, I believe you." And then brick, brick, brick, brick, brick, because I, because I actually-

Trevor Noah 51:30 Mm

Speaker 51:30 ... can't. And I also, to be fair-

Trevor Noah 51:33 Mm

Speaker 51:33 ... don't love basketball enough to, like, learn and fall in love with process enough-

Trevor Noah 51:36 Yeah

Speaker 51:36 ... to even see if I can, right? But now if you're talking about, if you're-

Trevor Noah 51:40 Mm

Speaker 51:40 ... if you're talking about a, a, a system where people can make their money or just have, like, a life, there's just, it's-

Trevor Noah 51:47 Have what they want

Speaker 51:48 ... it's so much more profitable to keep that as a carrot that you hang in front of someone than it is to just let them have it. Because if everyone's okay, less people are, are rich, which is, like, a side note thing.

Trevor Noah 52:01 Mm.

Speaker 52:01 But the process thing that I'm fall in love with and that I think is, like, so important, is that it started so much longer before anything was working out. The same way that, like-

Trevor Noah 52:11 That's the best, yeah. That's the best, man

Speaker 52:12 ... I've been my, like, the way that I've been myself and, like, weird, and it didn't, oof, didn't work for, like, all of life until, like, a little bit of college it worked. 'Cause a little bit of college I'm finally meeting people who are also kind of like me. Then it worked in Chicago. I started doing comedy. That's the, that's the thing I should've been doing this entire time. Then it worked for a little while in New York, and then, like, I had my ups and downs, and now it works in a big way because I'm finally, like, doing everything I think that I was meant to do.

Trevor Noah 52:42 Yeah.

Speaker 52:42 And so the s- reason I say-

Trevor Noah 52:44 There's that word, meant to do. Yeah.

Speaker 52:45 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 52:46 Yeah. Mm.

Speaker 52:46 'Cause, 'cause then I think that it started in Chicago when I started doing comedy, but I'm working at the grocery store, and I'm, like, working on bits all day, but then also having conversations all day. 'Cause you, okay, so you would be on register for, like, two hours.

Trevor Noah 53:01 Okay.

Speaker 53:02 They do a two-hour block. So now I'm talking to people, and I'm not necessarily, like, running bits by people. But I am, like, getting to know p- you get to know your regulars.

Trevor Noah 53:12 Yeah.

Speaker 53:12 You get to watch stuff.

Trevor Noah 53:13 Yeah.

Speaker 53:13 And now it's like-

Trevor Noah 53:14 It's your audience

Speaker 53:14 ... you're just, yeah, you're just f- you're just feeding off of, like, all these interactions that are so interesting, and especially if you decide to be personable. Because I worked with plenty of people who decided to, like, be miserable in that moment, but in my head I'm like, "Guys, I'm here. I'm, like, there's nowhere else I can be. And so

Speaker 53:31 I, this is either a waste of my time, which means it's a waste of my life, or it's my life. So now I'm, I'm just here. So then let me talk to this person, ask them how their day is. Let me, like, like, have you had these? 'Cause I haven't had these. I know that's bad to say 'cause I work here, but, like, are these good? 'Cause I'ma get them if they..." And now I've become the person that's personable enough that people got in my line.

Trevor Noah 53:49 Mm.

Speaker 53:49 And so now you build a, a, a rapport with these people, and then when I'm over here stocking the freezer, stocking the fridge, I'm thinking about bits or I'm thinking about what people said to me.

Trevor Noah 53:58 Yeah.

Speaker 53:59 So now when I go up in Chicago, everyone's like, "Oh, you don't ever repeat," or, "You don't have..." And it's like, 'cause I'm excited about, like, I'm excited about what this thing is that happened today, or I'm excited about building on this idea that I had last week but now I've reworded it.

Trevor Noah 54:14 Mm.

Speaker 54:14 Or, like, whatever. And so it seems like a wealth of, like, "Oh, you must just be writing all day," and in my head I was like, "I am, but I'm not." Like, it just came from such a genuine place. It didn't become more, like, proper, proper writing until Fallon. 'Cause I was a monologue writer at Fallon.

Trevor Noah 54:30 That's when you had to get into the craft of it.

Speaker 54:32 And that's when. Now it's, like, 150-

Trevor Noah 54:33 Yeah

Speaker 54:33 ... jokes a day-

Trevor Noah 54:34 Yeah

Speaker 54:34 ... or, you know, like, or you're just, you're even writing... W- when I was at Fallon, I was try- I was so thirsty to get a joke on. I was writing jokes in the hope that, like, Jimmy got lost in the building and then, like, wandered in my office and was like, "Hey, what-" How you doing? I'm like, "Oh, I'm great. I got a whole page of jokes." You know what I mean? Like, I'm, I'm like going crazy. 'Cause also it's like your first job, so you're extra and like-

Eugene 55:00 And it's a major job. I mean, that one, yeah

Speaker 55:00 ... major job, yeah. And then I got hired at Daily Show. Like, when you hired me, I was like, okay, this is a chance, especially because of how collaborative the process is, this is a chance to take everything I've been writing, all the ideas I'm always having, all the conversations that I have, and like hopefully apply them in real time

Speaker 55:17 to whatever the news of the day is.

Eugene 55:19 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 55:19 Do you know what I mean?

Eugene 55:19 Right. Right.

Speaker 55:20 And then it like ... Yeah, I was writing at Daily Show, which then taught me how to tell stories better of things that people had no context for. So, like, watching you, I was able to be like, "Oh, you know what? Like, there's this thing that happened to me that people won't, um, have any frame of reference for."

Eugene 55:38 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 55:39 How do I tell them about that? So when you would talk about South Africa or when you would talk about your travels, and you're talking to Americans, who are the perfect audience of, like, untraveled people.

Eugene 55:49 [laughs]

Speaker 55:49 Like, everything is new.

Eugene 55:51 [laughs]

Speaker 55:51 They'll be like, they'll be like-

Eugene 55:53 [laughs]

Speaker 55:53 ... "Malta? Is it chocolate?"

Eugene 55:55 [laughs]

Speaker 55:55 They like, they ... You know, we don't know, 'cause it's like ... 'Cause also you, you were the first person that, like, showed me how big the world was in a way. And like, talking to you, talking to Sela Boho, talk, talking to all these people showed me how, how [laughs] well the world gets on in spite of and sometimes without the U.S. Because grow-

Eugene 56:20 Damn

Speaker 56:21 ... 'cause growing up here, you're like, this is the, this is the lie that keeps things the way they are-

Eugene 56:26 Mm

Speaker 56:26 ... maybe forever, is that you are taught that the U.S. is number one. It ... We're number one because we deserve it. We're number one on merit, but we're also number one in everything. And so if anything is bad here, best believe it's worse somewhere else in the world, 'cause they're not even as good as us. So if you, if you are hungry in America, imagine how hungry you'd be in Mexico. Imagine how hu- ... And you could even point at other Western countries. It's like they would do ... Uh, like I had teachers that would do this-

Eugene 56:51 Yeah

Speaker 56:51 ... where they'd be like, "Australia nice and everything, but what did they build? What did, what, what inventions do they have?"

Eugene 56:56 Yeah.

Speaker 56:56 Like, because it teaches you to have, like, like, being ... I don't even know where you learn it, but, like, being the center of entertainment especially, and entertainment being such a strong, um, like a strong conveyor

Speaker 57:09 of stories-

Eugene 57:10 Yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 57:10 ... and stuff like that, it teaches you a sort of American excellence that probably even used to be earned but then has slowly been slipping away over time.

Eugene 57:18 Mm.

Speaker 57:18 And now your assumption is that no matter how bad things get here, we could have, like, a civil war, and you'd still point at another country and be like, "Well, they're having a coup." And it's like, yeah, but look at the 99 other countries that are fine today-

Eugene 57:33 Mm

Speaker 57:33 ... on, like, a regular Wednesday.

Eugene 57:35 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 57:35 And so rather than teaching you out of your supposed, like, excellence and number one ... 'Cause it's also a very inconvenient truth that, like, the number one title comes from, like, just like a boxer who's number one and has a team that's built up of people from all sorts of backgrounds with disciplines, there's a number one-ness that gets lost in that, oh yeah, well, we needed the scientists to come here. We needed the engineers to come here.

Eugene 57:58 Yeah.

Speaker 57:59 We taught some of our people, but then they went over and learned from other people and then came back.

Eugene 58:03 Yeah.

Speaker 58:04 Number one is just number one 'cause we're number one. And so then that keeps people in the thing of, like, you'll see where s- another country, another Western country as well, so you don't even have to worry about, like, communism, socialism, whatever. Another Western country will figure something out, and we still won't change, because the idea of looking at someone else as an example is unacceptable. And so being around you and being around people who had, like, a different experience of life, being around Joe Opeio, being around all these people was the first time that

Speaker 58:32 I was like, not only is, like, the world obviously much bigger, but, like, comedy is so much bigger. 'Cause now I ... Like, it made me curious enough to, like, start watching comedians where I just needed the subtitles, 'cause I was just like-

Eugene 58:46 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 58:46 ... I was like, let me just, like-

Eugene 58:48 Yep, Joe Opeio subtitles.

Speaker 58:49 [laughs]

Eugene 58:49 I'm with you.

Speaker 58:52 [laughs]

Eugene 58:53 We gotta get a dig in at Joe. Come on, man. [laughs]

Speaker 58:57 But that's ... But like, so every ... Uh, I said all that to say that, like, it's not-

Eugene 59:01 All of that?

Speaker 59:02 It's not ... No, no.

Eugene 59:03 [laughs]

Speaker 59:03 It's like, it, it's not lost on me that not only have I been incredibly fortunate-

Eugene 59:06 Yes

Speaker 59:06 ... I've been given a lot of opportunities, and then even within those opportunities, I was, like, put in the right place at the right time to have the right experience to-

Eugene 59:12 Yeah

Speaker 59:12 ... make what I'm doing now possible. You know what I mean?

Eugene 59:15 And that's the pa- ... See, that's the part where whenever you get great advice about pursuing your passion, the ... No one ever says at the end, "That's the long way of saying do the thing that you can when you can, then someone might select you to be the person that can-

Speaker 59:33 Yeah, yeah. Yeah

Eugene 59:33 ... and ends up becoming-

Speaker 59:34 Yeah

Eugene 59:34 ... the person that will." And also what I realized was when you are telling your story, 'cause I worked in retail for a long time, and I realized I had the most amount of fun doing comedy when I was in retail before I knew it was comedy.

Speaker 59:45 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 59:46 There was no pressure.

Speaker 59:47 Yeah, no industry.

Eugene 59:47 You had to refresh your jokes. Yeah, there's someone coming in, in and out all the time, but they've seen you so many times, and you-

Speaker 59:52 Mm-hmm

Eugene 59:52 ... you can't say the same thing to them. And there you are now at Fallon. Now you're doing this thing for a living.

Speaker 59:58 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 59:58 And they've said to you, "You don't have to worry about the money now. Just, just do this thing." And then all of a sudden it becomes difficult. And I thought there was a phase where comedy was making fun of people

Eugene 1:00:07 that are doing their best to try and survive. You know, there would be times where we'd be like, "Hey, imagine if you, you guys coming back from work. Hey, work. How's work? Ooh, every day, traffic." And I'm like, yo, when did we get here?

Speaker 1:00:18 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:00:19 Like, I started hating the way I was doing some comedy, 'cause I would ... And I'd realize it was all about, for me personally, it was about fitting in. Because even in retail when you're working there, you realize that you're not fitting in here. Then when you get out, you're like, "How shitty was that job?"

Speaker 1:00:33 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:00:33 But it came with how people measure success maybe. You know, someone-

Speaker 1:00:37 Yeah. Yeah

Eugene 1:00:37 ... you know?

Speaker 1:00:37 And it also just comes from a place of, like, this is how you're supposed to feel.

Eugene 1:00:41 Yes.

Speaker 1:00:42 And it's like if you keep falling for how you're supposed to feel-

Eugene 1:00:45 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:00:45 ... I mean, that's, that's very convenient for someone. You'll keep buying what you're supposed to buy. You'll keep, you'll keep-

Eugene 1:00:50 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:00:50 ... voting for who you're supposed to vote for. You'll keep ... And then you, you just have to ... It, it, there's a level of curiousness that I understand that when you're hungry-

Eugene 1:00:58 Yeah

Speaker 1:00:58 ... 'cause I've been hungry.

Eugene 1:00:59 Yep.

Speaker 1:01:00 When you're hungry, you're thinking about hungry. So you're not thinking about-

Eugene 1:01:04 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:01:04 ... some of this, like- The hoity-toity stuff. And it doesn't make you a bad person, it doesn't make you a dumb person-

Eugene 1:01:08 Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1:01:08 It doesn't make you less than. It's just literally that's wh- that's why it's so convenient and so important to keep, to keep you, like, n- not just down, but, like,

Speaker 1:01:20 to keep a controlled... I, I started working on this bit a long time ago, and I did not, like-

Eugene 1:01:24 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:01:24 ... finish it in a way that's, like, worth it. Maybe I'll get there one day. But I'm like, you don't get paid to do your job. You get paid not to riot. They pay you just before a riot.

Eugene 1:01:36 Yes, but you-

Speaker 1:01:36 If they paid, if they paid you any less, you'd riot, and they know that.

Eugene 1:01:40 Yeah.

Speaker 1:01:40 So they're like... Because you gotta remember, e- especially in the US, we did have slavery, and they've slowly been trying to get back. As s- like, as soon as they lost it, they were like, "That was some good stuff."

Eugene 1:01:50 Mm.

Speaker 1:01:50 That's crazy. It's like, it's like having adamantium in the, uh, in, in, in Black Panther.

Eugene 1:01:55 In Wakanda, yeah.

Speaker 1:01:56 Yeah. And so it's like imagine they took all of it away, you gotta use regular metal now. And you're like, "Guys, I'm getting shot."

Eugene 1:02:01 [laughs]

Speaker 1:02:01 Like, this is, this ba- it's getting through, right? So now-

Eugene 1:02:04 Mm

Speaker 1:02:04 ... so now I'm, I'm coming from a place of, like, I understand that even e- even if the... We're not even gonna get, like, conspiratorial with it, right?

Eugene 1:02:13 Mm.

Speaker 1:02:13 Even in the way that we say left and right works as a function to keep us at the, the tug of war and the, and the middle of the rope in the middle. Because the fact that, like, there's... It can't be lost on us that, like, somehow every one, as in one person-

Eugene 1:02:31 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:02:32 ... is a full representative of the right. And every one person, just one person-

Eugene 1:02:36 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:02:36 ... is a full representative of the left.

Eugene 1:02:37 Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:02:38 So based on algorithms, after something happens, something, something, uh, what- what- whatever, whatever you wanna picture, you are, by algorithm and by who you've chosen to follow, either served contempt or compassion.

Eugene 1:02:52 Yeah.

Speaker 1:02:53 And you are served contempt or compassion, as in that is the way it is. This is your window into the internet.

Eugene 1:02:57 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:02:57 And your window isn't wrong, but it's not the full picture.

Eugene 1:03:00 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:03:00 So then you'll say, "Everyone on the left is doing this. Everyone on the right is doing this,"

Speaker 1:03:05 and then someone who argues with you, they saw a different mix. They saw a different cocktail of compassion-

Eugene 1:03:09 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:03:09 ... and contempt. So now they are being like, "No, that's not happening. This is what's happening." Both are happening. Everyone is everything. You can have QAnon or Bluenon or whatever, and I'm not making, like, false equivalencies. I'm just saying that, like, we're all capable of, of, like, everything. That's what makes a person-

Eugene 1:03:26 Yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:03:26 ... a person. And so I think that keeping you there keeps you broke. Keeping you there keeps you, like, you know, complying without realizing you're complying. Or, like... And so when someone especially is trying to, like, follow a passion, and someone says, "Don't necessarily worry about the, the money," you're gonna be worried about something. 'Cause now that I'm not worried about the money, I worry about the quality. You know what I mean?

Eugene 1:03:49 Yeah. There's always gonna be something that you want to do.

Speaker 1:03:51 Yeah, but so, so, like, so-

Eugene 1:03:52 Mm

Speaker 1:03:52 ... that, that is a thing that, like, pops out at me where I'm like, I don't know when I'll be like... Because you don't... Like, your body tells you when you get old. You're not, you don't say a number and go, "I'm old now."

Eugene 1:04:06 [laughs]

Speaker 1:04:06 You get out of bed and you pop.

Eugene 1:04:08 Okay, let's go-

Speaker 1:04:08 And you're like, "I'm not used to popping."

Eugene 1:04:10 Let's, let's go back to com-

Speaker 1:04:10 And that's what quality does.

Eugene 1:04:11 There we go. Let's go back to complying. You said-

Speaker 1:04:14 Mm-hmm

Eugene 1:04:14 ... say that thing you said again about complying. We don't, we're trying to resist to comply?

Speaker 1:04:18 No. It's just what keeps you complying is that, like, it's very easy. If, like, if Trevor wants something, right?

Eugene 1:04:24 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:04:25 And what he, and what he wants is t- the, the last slice of pizza, right?

Eugene 1:04:28 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:04:29 It's very easy for him to get that last slice of pizza that we could all three have if he keeps us distracted fighting about the pizza.

Eugene 1:04:36 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:04:37 Me... Now I'm looking at you, you're looking at me, and he's eating.

Eugene 1:04:39 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:04:40 Right?

Eugene 1:04:40 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:04:40 And I feel like that's how a larger portion of every political game and every, uh, like, socioeconomic game works. And I think that by me being, you know, left and you being right, and us arguing and only focusing on each other, you forget that, like, we were initially fighting over the pizza. And now where's the pizza? It's gone. Well, it's gone 'cause it's your fault. No, it's your fault.

Eugene 1:05:03 You know, I think-

Speaker 1:05:03 Do you know what I mean?

Eugene 1:05:04 I think society made that argument very easy for politicians and people who run countries after COVID, 'cause we got to see what class really is.

Speaker 1:05:14 Yeah. Yeah.

Eugene 1:05:14 It, it happened

Eugene 1:05:15 in real time. Uh, rich people did not die in droves. Um-

Speaker 1:05:18 'Cause we also saw Madonna in that bathtub, and I was like, "That's gonna radicalize somebody."

Eugene 1:05:23 Yeah. Some countries and some people-

Speaker 1:05:24 Madonna being in that bathtub [laughs] -

Eugene 1:05:27 During COVID

Speaker 1:05:27 ... and then her being like, "Ugh, we're all going through it."

Eugene 1:05:30 [laughs]

Speaker 1:05:30 I'm like, "Not the bathtub."

Eugene 1:05:31 Oh, man. Oh, man.

Speaker 1:05:32 [laughs] That's... Guys, if I-

Eugene 1:05:35 Where was Madonna?

Speaker 1:05:36 I need you, I need... I'm telling you right now-

Eugene 1:05:38 [laughs] Oh, man

Speaker 1:05:38 ... if we're ever having a global crisis, and I post a video in a bathtub talking about how we all struggling, I need you to call me.

Eugene 1:05:45 There were a lot of people-

Speaker 1:05:45 I need you to call me and-

Eugene 1:05:46 Yeah. There were a lot of people who were out of touch in that moment. Yeah, but, but I'm saying that in a grand scale, that's what you're-

Speaker 1:05:52 Yeah

Eugene 1:05:52 ... experiencing as inequality and someone having to look at the other side and go, "I'm stuck here."

Speaker 1:05:58 I'll even pitch you this.

Eugene 1:05:59 Mm.

Speaker 1:06:00 Take, take, uh, like, any sort of, like, Hollywood example, acting, comedy, whatever, right?

Eugene 1:06:05 Yeah. Mm.

Speaker 1:06:06 [laughs] This is, this is also how it happens. I'm not speaking to the merits of anyone's talent. I'm just saying what I've noticed-

Eugene 1:06:13 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:06:14 ... is that there will be a certain amount of positions. There'll be, like, the DEI positions, right? And you can also tell that the DEI position... But as people get at DEI, this is the thing that tells people, like, "This is how many we're gonna do." [laughs]

Eugene 1:06:29 It's like a quo- it's the quota.

Speaker 1:06:30 Yeah. It's like, this will be the quota.

Eugene 1:06:32 Yeah.

Speaker 1:06:32 So I don't even know why you get mad at DEI, 'cause they've already basically said, "We'll only get 20. So, like, you won't have to worry about them taking your job. Maybe you, but, like, as a large swath of the industry, we're gonna let 20 in," right? So now people are mad at these, like, DEI jobs, jobs only established to try to, like, find some sort of base. All the stuff. All the stuff we already know. But then people are mad at them. These people now feel like they have to prove themselves. They're mad at the, you know, the other people coming at them and everything.

Eugene 1:07:01 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:07:01 Meanwhile, there is no quota,

Speaker 1:07:03 and there is no, um, there is no number that is capped For the amount of, like, legacy kids that get into the right colleges or nepo babies that get the job-

Trevor Noah 1:07:15 No, absolutely

Speaker 1:07:15 ... or whatever. And it's like, it's like that thing, obviously some, some people are waking up to that fact and being like, "Oh yeah, why are there only 20 spots for anybody?"

Trevor Noah 1:07:24 Yes.

Speaker 1:07:24 Forget DEI.

Trevor Noah 1:07:25 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

Eugene 1:07:25 Yes.

Trevor Noah 1:07:25 Right, right.

Speaker 1:07:26 And it's like that, but that's also part of the game.

Eugene 1:07:28 But that's what-

Trevor Noah 1:07:29 So-

Eugene 1:07:29 ... a quota does. A quota exposes how many spots are no longer available to those it was available to before.

Speaker 1:07:35 Yeah.

Eugene 1:07:36 That's why we have affirmative action.

Trevor Noah 1:07:36 That's true. That's true, actually.

Eugene 1:07:36 So now you can quantify it, you can count. Oh, 20 people used to be there, now they're not anymore because these people are there. Quotas are never about if the person can do the job or not because I'll tell you this much, people who are put in because of affirmative action will never outnumber the people that were there already. It will never be 50/50. It will never be 50 you were here legacy, 50 you are new, we're just putting you in. 'Cause then you could measure how did the quality of work drop since the new people came in. But if you put 20% in and the other 80%, they stop performing their duties because they're disgruntled by the people that they feel like they don't deserve to be there, then that's when the quality of work drops, then you can always blame it on the new guy.

Speaker 1:08:16 Sure. Sure.

Trevor Noah 1:08:17 You know, you know what I love listening to this-

Eugene 1:08:19 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:08:19 Like, these are always the moments when somebody, like, walks into a room and there's comedians talking, and then I'll always hear them say, "I, I thought you guys told more jokes."

Speaker 1:08:31 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:08:31 No, no, no. I've always wondered. I, I was just listening to you guys now-

Eugene 1:08:34 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:08:34 ... and I was like, it's, it's really interesting to me how comedians, no matter where they are in the world, will always get into the ...

Trevor Noah 1:08:45 Is it the anomalies? Is it the inconsistencies? Is it the ... D- do you know what I'm saying?

Speaker 1:08:49 Yeah, yeah.

Eugene 1:08:49 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:08:49 Maybe it's just like-

Speaker 1:08:49 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:08:50 No, I was just listening to this now-

Eugene 1:08:51 Mm

Trevor Noah 1:08:51 ... and I was going, it's, it's funny how ... Because comedy ... Let, let's think of it this way. Because comedy is like the icing on a cake, it's sweet.

Eugene 1:09:02 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:09:03 It's generally very delicious. It's, it's easy to consume and people often think that the raw ingredient for it is also that in that way, and I know sugarcane is. Please don't get me wrong.

Eugene 1:09:14 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:09:14 But I'm just saying, I'm watching this right now.

Speaker 1:09:16 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:09:16 And, and ... No, no, forgive me. It, it made me wonder. It's like, I wonder if, like, you get into comedy because you're seeing an inconsistent world, or if part of comedy helps you process the inconsistency of the world.

Speaker 1:09:31 Maybe. I mean, I imagine-

Trevor Noah 1:09:32 Mm

Speaker 1:09:32 ... it's like if you, if you're a singer, right? And you're like, "I can do something real weird with my throat."

Trevor Noah 1:09:38 Yeah.

Speaker 1:09:39 "I can do something real weird with my voice." And then you do it to drums, and people are like, "I think I'd pay to see that." It's like, it's like you-

Trevor Noah 1:09:45 No, but I mean the, I mean the think-

Speaker 1:09:46 ... you fall into the thing sometimes

Trevor Noah 1:09:47 ... No, but I mean the thinking of it. Like, okay, let me ask you this question. When, when was the first time in your life when you can remember thinking, "This didn't make s- this doesn't make sense"?

Speaker 1:09:58 Uh, okay. So [laughs] you know how [laughs] ... This is ... Two moments that stick out to me. Uh, you know how the dentist gives you a lollipop?

Trevor Noah 1:10:10 Yeah.

Eugene 1:10:11 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:10:11 You see? There you go.

Speaker 1:10:12 And I was like, "Hey, my man."

Trevor Noah 1:10:14 It's related.

Speaker 1:10:14 "My man, what you doing? What are you ... You trying to catch me slipping? I didn't have any cavities, and now you're giving me sugar?"

Trevor Noah 1:10:20 [laughs]

Speaker 1:10:21 "This is crazy."

Trevor Noah 1:10:21 How, how old were you when you had this thought?

Speaker 1:10:23 Uh, ooh, maybe 10. I don't know. Like, yeah, yeah, somewhere like that.

Trevor Noah 1:10:29 Yeah, but that's ... But you see what I mean?

Speaker 1:10:30 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:10:30 It's like something like that. What was your ... What was the first, what was the first thing you can remember thinking, "This does not make sense"?

Eugene 1:10:37 I think it was when I was watching my grandfather and my parents watching the news and believing all of it.

Trevor Noah 1:10:44 You ... Wait, you were watching them watch the news?

Eugene 1:10:47 Yes, and they were believing all of it. Because in my head, I was like, "This, this what they're saying here didn't happen here."

Trevor Noah 1:10:53 [laughs] Wait, what?

Eugene 1:10:54 Wherever this happened, whatever they were saying in the news-

Trevor Noah 1:10:56 Yeah

Eugene 1:10:56 ... like, in Soweto, in wherever-

Trevor Noah 1:10:58 Yeah

Eugene 1:10:58 ... I was like, "Yeah, where we are, everything is fine."

Trevor Noah 1:11:01 So, oh, so you were going-

Eugene 1:11:02 Yeah, so it was burning on TV-

Trevor Noah 1:11:04 Okay, got it

Eugene 1:11:04 ... at, at that place. And I'm sure by now they've extinguished the fire.

Trevor Noah 1:11:07 Okay.

Eugene 1:11:07 Because the 7:00 news-

Trevor Noah 1:11:09 Jeez, okay

Eugene 1:11:09 ... it's dark outside.

Speaker 1:11:10 That's so funny.

Eugene 1:11:10 But when they shot the news-

Trevor Noah 1:11:12 [laughs] This is actually really funny

Eugene 1:11:12 ... the sun was out.

Speaker 1:11:14 That's so funny.

Eugene 1:11:14 And I was like-

Trevor Noah 1:11:14 This is actually really funny

Eugene 1:11:15 ... "Yeah, but why are we, why are we worried about the emotions as if it's happening outside and if it's happening now?" Then I'd watch them getting emotionally invested

Eugene 1:11:22 at 7:00 about, "Oof, it's so bad out there."

Trevor Noah 1:11:26 That's fascinating. So you-

Eugene 1:11:27 Mm

Trevor Noah 1:11:27 ... you were thrown by the fact-

Eugene 1:11:29 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:11:29 I mean, it's ... You see, it's extremely logical as well.

Eugene 1:11:31 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:11:32 Because you're going, "It's not burning outside."

Eugene 1:11:34 No.

Speaker 1:11:34 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:11:34 It's not even, it's not even ... The sun is not even out anymore.

Trevor Noah 1:11:36 Yeah, it's daytime in the news.

Eugene 1:11:38 Yes.

Trevor Noah 1:11:38 But it's n- it's nighttime now.

Eugene 1:11:39 Yes. And everyone who was supposed to do their job did it. The firetrucks were there. The cameras were there. The reporter filed the story.

Trevor Noah 1:11:46 And so you were sitting there-

Eugene 1:11:47 They put on a jacket. Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:11:50 That's a crazy-

Eugene 1:11:50 In fact, in fact, in my head, I was like-

Speaker 1:11:51 That's so funny

Eugene 1:11:51 ... "The reporter that reported on the story is also home watching the news now."

Speaker 1:11:55 You know what's so funny about this-

Eugene 1:11:57 Mm

Speaker 1:11:57 ... is that it's the third level of the thing. I thought you were just gonna say-

Eugene 1:12:01 Mm

Speaker 1:12:01 ... "Why they believing everything? 'Cause people lie sometimes." That's just even much more of a child thing.

Trevor Noah 1:12:06 Yeah, no, no.

Speaker 1:12:07 You're like-

Trevor Noah 1:12:07 He's like-

Speaker 1:12:07 You're like, "No, no. The car that was on fire has clearly been extinguished by now," like [laughs]

Eugene 1:12:13 Long ago. Insurance has been contacted.

Speaker 1:12:16 [laughs]

Eugene 1:12:16 The claim is being processed. Now we're just waiting for opening hours for tomorrow so you can look at another car if you really want one.

Speaker 1:12:23 Mm.

Eugene 1:12:23 But I would watch the real emotion, uh, and my parents being invested on some, "Yo,

Eugene 1:12:28 it is bad out there." And I'm like, "No, it's great in here. We're watching these people. Our car is not burning."

Trevor Noah 1:12:32 And that's when your-

Eugene 1:12:33 "Our house is not on fire."

Trevor Noah 1:12:33 So your brain at that point is just going, "This doesn't make sense."

Eugene 1:12:36 Yes. And also because I think when I started exploring comedy, I realized that's what people are doing. They're reacting to something that I say that's not real. I say things, and then they're like, "Yeah, neh." Then I'm like, "Yeah." And I think that's why maybe we see comedians unable to, uh, fight extremism, uh, when people are being extreme about their views and ideas and rallying people and filling up arenas and domes, and people are just coming to listen to them in social media. We can't say anything. We can't fight that because we're essentially doing the same thing, but we're doing it on a happy side. We're galvanizing people to come into a room to laugh, but there's, on the other end of it, it has never been like it is now, where you find in the other side of things, the same arena-

Trevor Noah 1:13:17 Oh, that's, that's-

Eugene 1:13:17 ... two weeks from now-

Trevor Noah 1:13:18 I, I would agree with that, actually

Eugene 1:13:19 ... there's someone who's going-

Trevor Noah 1:13:19 Yeah

Eugene 1:13:19 ... "We are getting the guns. We are going to fight. Yeah, yeah."

Trevor Noah 1:13:23 Yeah, yeah, yeah. There, there's a, there's a, there's a different type ... It's ... Oh, man, that's an interesting thought. There is, like, a- It feels like at least more and more places in the world have an economy or there's like a, a circuit around anger-

Speaker 1:13:40 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 1:13:41 ... and hatred in a way that it didn't exist-

Speaker 1:13:43 Yes, because tro-

Trevor Noah 1:13:43 ... for a long time

Speaker 1:13:44 ... troublemaking, thanks to stand-up, has become performative. So if you look at all the rallies of all people stirring up what we call trouble.

Trevor Noah 1:13:50 Yeah.

Speaker 1:13:51 They also have a stage.

Trevor Noah 1:13:52 Yeah.

Speaker 1:13:53 They don't have-

Trevor Noah 1:13:53 And they tell jokes, by the way.

Speaker 1:13:54 They-

Trevor Noah 1:13:54 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:13:54 ... and now they don't have paper anymore in their hand.

Trevor Noah 1:13:56 Yeah, yeah, no, they tell jokes as well.

Speaker 1:13:57 They mess around, play music a little bit, mess around, and get people worked up.

Trevor Noah 1:14:01 Yeah.

Speaker 1:14:01 And all of this-

Trevor Noah 1:14:01 Some of them tell the same jokes.

Speaker 1:14:03 I mean, they do.

Trevor Noah 1:14:03 Yeah.

Speaker 1:14:03 They work it like a set.

Trevor Noah 1:14:04 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:14:04 You remember back in the day, and I mean, he still sort of does it now, but not as much.

Trevor Noah 1:14:07 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:14:08 I feel like now he's, like, retired.

Trevor Noah 1:14:09 Mm.

Speaker 1:14:09 Trump used to work out bits-

Trevor Noah 1:14:11 Yeah

Speaker 1:14:11 ... on the campaign trail.

Trevor Noah 1:14:12 Yeah.

Speaker 1:14:13 So he would say something, he would do it, and then he'd go, "I

Speaker 1:14:16 used to say that, and it didn't work. I used to say it. Didn't work."

Trevor Noah 1:14:18 Yeah.

Speaker 1:14:18 "Now it works."

Trevor Noah 1:14:19 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:14:19 The one that he had was, um, I'm trying to think of which one he had. It, I think it was Crooked Hillary.

Trevor Noah 1:14:25 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:14:25 Or one of those. But he had a previous version.

Trevor Noah 1:14:27 Yeah. Cricket Hillary. [laughs]

Speaker 1:14:28 And he had a, and he had a version that was like, it didn't hit.

Trevor Noah 1:14:31 Mm.

Speaker 1:14:31 But he found the one.

Trevor Noah 1:14:32 And then he found, like-

Speaker 1:14:33 The hook

Trevor Noah 1:14:33 ... a switch.

Speaker 1:14:34 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:14:34 And he changed it. But he said, which was interesting to me, he said-

Speaker 1:14:38 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 1:14:38 ... at a rally.

Speaker 1:14:39 Yes.

Trevor Noah 1:14:39 "I used to say it like this, and people didn't respond."

Speaker 1:14:43 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:14:43 "Now I say it like this, and they do respond."

Speaker 1:14:45 Yes. But stand-up was the original research and development of how to become extreme in an idea. When people say, "Okay, there's no paper, just a microphone, just stage."

Trevor Noah 1:14:54 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:14:54 "Just give me a group of people."

Trevor Noah 1:14:55 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:14:55 "Don't sit down, even. Just stand up. Let's do this thing." Because music did not have the same impact as now when you have a singular person trying to convince a horde of people to take action, but the action now is the other way around. It's no longer just go home and be happy.

Trevor Noah 1:15:09 It's not, it's not an action to happiness.

Speaker 1:15:11 Yes.

Trevor Noah 1:15:11 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:15:11 Because also-

Trevor Noah 1:15:12 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:15:12 ... stand-up did a lot to remind people how great their lives are. But this form of extremism, which is performative as well,

Speaker 1:15:18 is doing a lot to remind people how shitty their lives are. Whilst we would make fun of a, of someone who has a normal 9 to 5 job, these people are saying, "Why do you have a normal 9 to 5 job?" [upbeat music]

Trevor Noah 1:15:28 Don't press anything. We've got more What Now? after this. [upbeat music] It's amazing how-

Speaker 1:15:41 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:15:41 ... powerful it is when you switch it. I, you know, it's funny. I, I, I, just, you know, because you, you, you are in a moment right now, um, that, that's amazing, and it's new, and it's, it's, it's obviously being looked at from so many different places. You know?

Speaker 1:15:56 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:15:56 So, like, it's Josh Johnson, the magazines look at you, the, the entertainment industry looks at you. And then people often phone me, and they go, "What do you think of what Josh is doing?" And they all have a different lens through which they wish to see it.

Speaker 1:16:06 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:16:06 You know, "What do you think it means for the entertainment industry? What do you think it means for comedy? What do you think it means for..." And I remember once, I was trying to think of this for myself, and I went, one of the things you're doing with your stand-up, like the sets that you're doing now every single week on YouTube, is, in a crazy way, I was like, you're also just, like, establishing a bit of reality. I don't know if you've noticed that, and I, I don't know if you're doing it on purpose.

Speaker 1:16:34 I mean, some people say that. What I'm trying to do is be like, this thing, like, what we have become-

Trevor Noah 1:16:44 Mm

Speaker 1:16:44 ... I think is a problem.

Trevor Noah 1:16:45 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:16:46 Like, as comedians.

Trevor Noah 1:16:47 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:16:47 And what we mean to people.

Trevor Noah 1:16:49 Yeah.

Speaker 1:16:49 And what we, and, and, and how we, like, structure our careers around that thing. I think that people are playing games right now that are gonna, gonna bite them eventually,

Speaker 1:17:02 where you play with people who are struggling.

Trevor Noah 1:17:04 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:17:04 You play with people who are, like, based on, like, even no fault of their own, but a, a, a systemic level, they are mentally unstable. You play with people-

Trevor Noah 1:17:14 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:17:14 ... whose only hope is something that is, like, you know, in the ether as a conspiracy.

Trevor Noah 1:17:19 Yeah.

Speaker 1:17:19 You play with all that. You make your money, and then you think you go home. But especially if you're chasing money, especially if you like money, and especially if you can't stay at home, you keep doing it, and you keep doing it, and you keep doing it. And then you, you become a different thing to them than you can ever get back.

Trevor Noah 1:17:36 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:17:36 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:17:37 Oh, wow.

Speaker 1:17:37 And so, so, like-

Trevor Noah 1:17:38 Yeah

Speaker 1:17:38 ... I think if I stay as, as much of a stand-up as I can, and obviously sometimes I talk about politics, but my thing is that I talk about everything. So the people who think that I talk about one thing, I can tell what videos they've watched. I've been told by people that I only talk about Black culture. Then I've t- been told by other people I only talk about Trump. Then I've been told about, from other people-

Trevor Noah 1:17:59 Yeah

Speaker 1:17:59 ... that I d- I do, like, regular jokes again.

Trevor Noah 1:18:02 Yeah.

Speaker 1:18:02 Then I g- am told by people that they're like-

Trevor Noah 1:18:04 Mm

Speaker 1:18:04 ... "I love your stories. I love this story," whatever.

Trevor Noah 1:18:06 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:18:07 And it's like, I, I don't think, and this is, I'm not upset about or whatever, but I don't think that people are fitting into the picture that I am trying to-

Trevor Noah 1:18:14 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:18:14 ... and as a result, talking about everything.

Trevor Noah 1:18:16 Yeah, but you see, this is, this is-

Speaker 1:18:18 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:18:19 I do get upset about it, not just on your behalf-

Speaker 1:18:21 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 1:18:21 ... but on society's behalf.

Speaker 1:18:23 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:18:23 Mm-hmm. One of the best things I ever learned was from a friend who was a computer scientist, and he taught me about a concept known as the Second System Effect. And he said, "Whenever you're programming, one of the things you learn as a coder is when you change one aspect, you might think you're fixing one thing."

Speaker 1:18:45 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:18:46 "You don't realize the second system effect that is created by that. You've created a second system, and the effect of that is something that you may not have been aware of." You know?

Speaker 1:18:55 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:18:56 I think of that with algorithms. We used to live in a world where the broadcast was decided by a few-

Speaker 1:19:07 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 1:19:07 ... and it went to the many. So one news network, 100 million people would watch it. One journalist, 50 million people would know them. You know?

Speaker 1:19:19 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:19:19 One newspaper could define a whole country's trajectory. And then over time, that, that started diminishing. Like, their, their power started going down, but what also started happening is it started diffusing. So there'd be more newspapers More news agencies, more television shows, more movies. So there's more who have less power, more who have less power. This is a good thing because reality shouldn't be defined by one person or one small group.

Trevor Noah 1:19:49 But then we get to the point of the algorithm, and the algorithm does this on steroids.

Speaker 1:19:55 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:19:56 It becomes super, super, super tuned to getting as few people as possible, or rather as many people as possible, an opportunity to talk to as many people as possible, and you, you, like, cut down where the message goes from and who it goes to. It's like every- it's diffused, you know what I mean? It's like everyone can say it to everyone everywhere. But then what it also does is it says, "I'm just gonna give you this slice of the reality." You know what I mean? So now Josh Johnson's out there trying to be the full human being who is Josh Johnson.

Speaker 1:20:32 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:20:33 The algorithm goes, "I notice, Trevor, that you really like Josh Johnson's stories about hair. I'm gonna just go give you all of his hair stuff. Just you and, you and him, afros. That's all I'm giving you."

Speaker 1:20:42 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:20:43 And then it goes, "Eugene, I notice you, you like the thing when Josh Johnson was talking about working in a grocery store. I'm just gonna give you his retail stuff."

Speaker 1:20:50 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:20:50 And now you extrapolate this into politics and views on the world.

Speaker 1:20:54 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:20:54 And what's crazy and terrifying to me is that there's a person out there who only knows one slither of Josh Johnson, and as you said, they either have contempt or compassion for that person or that side of you.

Speaker 1:21:09 Right.

Trevor Noah 1:21:10 And I go f- as we get to the second system effect of everything going to everyone in the most perfect way, you don't have one big broadcast-

Speaker 1:21:19 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:21:19 ... you have a billion small broadcasts.

Speaker 1:21:21 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:21:22 But those billion small broadcasts are only your world now. And where before you had to s- share a world where a car was burning for everyone, your family's watching the news.

Speaker 1:21:30 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:21:31 Now you watch the news, you watch the news, you watch... Everyone in the house is watching different news, but they're all living in the same house.

Speaker 1:21:37 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:21:37 And I, I, I genuinely, the reason I'm upset about it is, not like anger, I'm like, I'm almost terrified-

Speaker 1:21:41 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:21:41 ... 'cause I go, "What does, what does that do to us when we don't see the full complexity of each other?" Like, you and I talk about this all the time. I go, "I, I wanna live in a world where more people see friends disagree."

Speaker 1:21:53 Hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:21:54 Because we make it seem like people disagree because they don't live in the same world. You know, like when you walked in-

Speaker 1:22:01 Mm

Trevor Noah 1:22:01 ... today, we were watching videos on the internet about mediums and psychics and all of that stuff. And I said to you as my friend, I was like, "Emma, I don't believe this, but there's also something here that I don't get."

Speaker 1:22:12 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:22:12 "There's something I don't get, and I, I'm not, I'm not gonna say it's not real, but I this, but I, I'm letting you know my current position is I don't believe this." And then you're going, "I do believe this, and let me tell

Trevor Noah 1:22:21 you why," and we're sharing this. We, but we don't exist on, you know, like opposite ends of anything.

Speaker 1:22:27 Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:22:27 There are some parts of you that are far away from me.

Speaker 1:22:30 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:22:30 And there are some parts of you that I can't separate from my own skin.

Speaker 1:22:33 Right.

Trevor Noah 1:22:33 We are the same in that way.

Speaker 1:22:35 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:22:35 And that, that's a big thing that worries me is I go, imagine if somebody like Josh Johnson, who in my opinion is one of the kindest, most caring, most considerate people, imagine if they could slice you into slithers of an idea. What are they doing to the rest of everyone in a society? Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 1:22:50 Sure, and also through the structure of, like, what keeps you on, they follow behavior.

Trevor Noah 1:22:55 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:22:55 So because they follow behavior, we assume that everyone always wants to be agreed with.

Trevor Noah 1:23:00 Yeah.

Speaker 1:23:00 Some people actually, and the algorithms have already figured this out, 'cause it happens to me, it's like some people through being curious about what other people think are served nothing but b- bad, like, I would just say bad stuff that I don't agree with.

Trevor Noah 1:23:15 Oh, man, that, that happens to my Twitter.

Speaker 1:23:17 So then-

Trevor Noah 1:23:17 Yeah

Speaker 1:23:18 ... it's like, it's like, I, it, it then makes me feel like, oh, everyone's so angry and hateful-

Trevor Noah 1:23:25 Yeah

Speaker 1:23:25 ... and every-

Trevor Noah 1:23:26 Yeah

Speaker 1:23:26 ... and then, then this, okay. No one, no one's on board with this idea. I've talked about this idea with friends.

Trevor Noah 1:23:32 Can you app-

Speaker 1:23:32 I did this idea at a show, right?

Trevor Noah 1:23:34 Cool. All right, cool.

Speaker 1:23:35 I was like, "Guys, well, they found now, it's, it's like, it's like a, they finished a study that half the internet is bots. Isn't that great?" And then everybody's like, "Why would that be great?" I'm like, "Guys, there's way less Nazis than we thought."

Trevor Noah 1:23:47 [laughs]

Speaker 1:23:47 There's like, there's, imagine if you thought there was a room with 100 Nazis in it, and it's two. Two's still bad, but two's not 100. And then, then one of my friends was saying, "But yeah, isn't it horrible, though, that somebody would go to the trouble of engineering the, the troll farm to make us think there's more Nazis?"

Trevor Noah 1:24:04 Yes. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:24:05 Yes. That's still not as bad as 100 actual Nazis. If you had, if you had 100, 100, uh, cakes at your door that say the N-word or two Nazis, you'd be way less scared than if there were 100 Nazis at your door. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:24:22 With two cakes.

Speaker 1:24:23 Yeah, with two cakes.

Trevor Noah 1:24:24 Yeah, we gotta keep the cakes.

Speaker 1:24:25 We gotta keep the cakes. But, like, the fact that this bot problem is actually so big, it both means that, like, to me at least, I could be wrong about this-

Trevor Noah 1:24:34 I like this. No, I like this view. I'm actually on board with this, actually

Speaker 1:24:37 ... this-

Trevor Noah 1:24:37 It's, it's an optimistic way of looking at it

Speaker 1:24:38 ... it also means that the companies also, like, are artificially propping themselves up. We think that they are, like, the full, um, purveyors might be the right word, but that they are the full end-all be-all of human connection now, and they, and that would, that would be, um, advantageous for us to believe that because they, we would then go to them for the communication.

Trevor Noah 1:24:59 Yeah.

Speaker 1:25:00 First of all, everyone forgets outside. If you, if you guys, if... The fact that people, even in New York, people talk about New York, most people are so much more polite than any internet comment section would ever have you believe.

Trevor Noah 1:25:12 Yes, definitely.

Speaker 1:25:13 People bump into me, they apologize. People-

Trevor Noah 1:25:15 'Cause you're carrying nunchucks. Of course.

Speaker 1:25:17 Yeah, 100%.

Trevor Noah 1:25:18 [laughs]

Speaker 1:25:19 Let the hair get frizzy.

Trevor Noah 1:25:20 [laughs]

Speaker 1:25:21 But, like, but I just find that that thing clued me in that, okay, now I already try to take a beat. I already, I already to my detriment don't get angry enough about bad things happening in real time-

Trevor Noah 1:25:35 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:25:35 ... even when they happen to me. Sometimes someone's rude to me, and then they walk away, and then I'm like Actually, that wasn't okay, right? I already try to take a step back as my, like, personal-

Trevor Noah 1:25:45 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:25:47 Now I take a second step back, especially

Speaker 1:25:50 when I'm online, 'cause I'm like, "Is this person real?" Now, that sort of, like, that sort of thing could drive a person crazy, but to me, because I'm also being [laughs] served so much, like, hateful stuff, and because hateful stuff is more engaging than love-

Trevor Noah 1:26:04 Yeah. Yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:26:05 ... it does then make me go, "Okay, what's the likelihood that people spreading love are bots and people spreading hate are bots?" This is a hateful thing that I see, and it also isn't, like, original. This is how I feel like I'm getting good at picking out the bots. Because then when something racist happens and they're like, they're like, "We should get him fired from his job," and then they're like, "Pfft, probably doesn't have a job to fire from," and then the next three people are like, "Probably doesn't have a job to fire from. Probably doesn't have a job to fire from," I'm like, all right, maybe this is, like, one angry person.

Trevor Noah 1:26:36 That's just being multiple-

Speaker 1:26:38 And maybe-

Trevor Noah 1:26:38 Yeah, that's just being-

Speaker 1:26:38 And maybe no racist people. Who knows? 'Cause the comments are racist. The other person's just angry. They're like, "We should get him fired from his job. This is insane."

Trevor Noah 1:26:45 Yeah.

Speaker 1:26:45 Right? And so now it's like, it changed my w- like, outlook on the world in a way that might be naive, and it might be a little bit like, um, um, wishful thinking.

Trevor Noah 1:26:59 Hm.

Speaker 1:27:00 But it still is, like, information that I'm basing my, my worldview off.

Trevor Noah 1:27:03 No, I, I think it's, I think it's the right way to see it, actually, is like finding... Y- you know, we've had a lot of conversations on the podcast with, with different pe- I mean, everyone from, you know, doctors who are here to talk about how to, how to find the best in your kids. We talk to world leaders. We t- One of the common threads I find is, like, finding the hope, you know?

Speaker 1:27:23 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:27:24 And what you're saying ties back into that,

Trevor Noah 1:27:27 is finding... You, you have to find that thing. You gotta find... You were hopeful enough to eat that second slice of pizza.

Speaker 1:27:34 The fourth.

Trevor Noah 1:27:35 And desperate.

Speaker 1:27:36 Yeah. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:27:36 Fourth?

Speaker 1:27:37 Yeah, fourth.

Trevor Noah 1:27:37 The three were-

Speaker 1:27:38 No, but-

Trevor Noah 1:27:38 ... the night before.

Speaker 1:27:39 Yeah, but I, I like this.

Trevor Noah 1:27:40 [laughs]

Speaker 1:27:41 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:27:41 What type of pizza was it, by the way?

Speaker 1:27:42 It was a pepperoni pizza. There's no reason for this to be poisoned.

Trevor Noah 1:27:44 Can you still, can you eat pepro- pepperoni pizza today?

Speaker 1:27:47 Yes, because, okay, I've been poisoned many times.

Trevor Noah 1:27:50 [laughs]

Speaker 1:27:50 But there are certain types of poisoning-

Trevor Noah 1:27:52 This man said it like a badge of... That's how-

Speaker 1:27:54 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:27:54 When Josh was like, "I have been poisoned many times."

Speaker 1:27:56 There was a time in my life where if food was 2.50, I would eat it no matter what. That was the most adventurous I've ever been. Now, when I actually go places and someone's like, "Oh, try this, it's a delicacy," but it look a little bit like-

Trevor Noah 1:28:08 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:28:08 ... like squid guts, I'm like, "I think I'm okay."

Trevor Noah 1:28:11 Yeah.

Speaker 1:28:11 But if you had, if it had been 2.50 in 2014

Speaker 1:28:14 in Chicago-

Trevor Noah 1:28:15 You would be eating everything

Speaker 1:28:15 ... I'd be like, "Hey, bottoms up," right? And so the b- the time I got poisoned at the Chinese place, it took me years and years and years to eat Chinese again.

Trevor Noah 1:28:24 Huh.

Speaker 1:28:24 Because everything about the feeling, everything about the smell-

Trevor Noah 1:28:28 Oh, yeah, no, I mean, that happens

Speaker 1:28:30 ... everything about the violent, whatever. Now it, it got to a point for a year, any time I passed, like, any sort of Szechuan place, I was, I was like, I could feel it coming.

Trevor Noah 1:28:39 Oh, man, I'm so hungry now. You just got me hungry.

Speaker 1:28:41 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:28:42 You just said Szechuanese food, I started thinking of pig trotters. Are you in, Eugene? [laughs]

Speaker 1:28:49 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:28:49 I don't even think you understand. You just... Oh, man. Sorry, your pain. Tell us about your pain again.

Speaker 1:28:53 [laughs] But it's just, it's the-

Trevor Noah 1:28:54 I apologize, Josh.

Speaker 1:28:55 I've never drank in my life, but it's the closest-

Trevor Noah 1:28:57 Wait, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Speaker 1:28:59 No, what?

Trevor Noah 1:29:00 Whoa.

Speaker 1:29:00 What?

Trevor Noah 1:29:00 Can't just-

Speaker 1:29:01 I thought you knew.

Trevor Noah 1:29:02 You can't just drop bombs like that in, in your life?

Speaker 1:29:04 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:29:04 I knew you don't drink.

Speaker 1:29:06 No. No, I never drank.

Trevor Noah 1:29:07 You have never consumed alcohol?

Speaker 1:29:08 No, no.

Trevor Noah 1:29:09 Nothing, even in church, nothing?

Speaker 1:29:11 No, no, we didn't go to that type of church.

Trevor Noah 1:29:12 Church.

Speaker 1:29:13 We had grape juice.

Trevor Noah 1:29:14 Yeah, bro, some, there's some churches that give you-

Speaker 1:29:15 Some, some are wine

Trevor Noah 1:29:15 ... the blood of Jesus and it's wine.

Speaker 1:29:16 Yeah, some are wine. We had-

Trevor Noah 1:29:18 Yeah

Speaker 1:29:18 ... we had Welch's.

Trevor Noah 1:29:20 Oh, the, the grape juice.

Speaker 1:29:20 Grape juice.

Trevor Noah 1:29:21 Okay, okay, okay, okay.

Speaker 1:29:21 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:29:22 All right. Never consume- I'm not, we're not talking about never drunk. Never consumed alcohol.

Speaker 1:29:28 No.

Trevor Noah 1:29:29 Is there a reason for this?

Speaker 1:29:31 Uh, yeah, it, it... So initially, I was definitely, before I was, like, of age, too scared to get in trouble.

Trevor Noah 1:29:38 Okay, cool.

Speaker 1:29:38 Then I was, like, not, um... Then, then I really went to this transition where I became known as, like, the sober guy.

Trevor Noah 1:29:48 Okay.

Speaker 1:29:48 Like, I'll, that would be the guy who, like, walks you back to your dorm whatever.

Trevor Noah 1:29:52 Yeah.

Speaker 1:29:52 Then-

Trevor Noah 1:29:53 Sober Josh

Speaker 1:29:53 ... I w- I was broke.

Trevor Noah 1:29:54 [laughs] Yeah, yeah, yeah, Josh. [laughs]

Speaker 1:29:55 So then I was broke.

Trevor Noah 1:29:56 Yeah.

Speaker 1:29:56 But then this is also what made me useless, though-

Trevor Noah 1:29:58 Yeah. [laughs]

Speaker 1:29:58 ... is that I can't drive. So then I couldn't even be the designated driver.

Trevor Noah 1:30:02 Oh, man.

Speaker 1:30:02 I would just be in the car with the designated driver-

Trevor Noah 1:30:04 With a book [laughs]

Speaker 1:30:04 ... and everybody else sitting in the back sick, and I'm like, "Y'all, y'all paid too much for this."

Trevor Noah 1:30:10 [laughs]

Speaker 1:30:10 You know what I mean? So then, um, then I moved to Chicago. I didn't have money.

Trevor Noah 1:30:13 Yeah, that story, can I just say, that story takes on a whole new complexity of annoying.

Speaker 1:30:19 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:30:19 It's one thing for somebody to be hanging out with you at a party, drinking with you, being like, "Have you guys noticed how much we pay for this alcohol?"

Speaker 1:30:27 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:30:27 "We could be paying way le-..." No. Sober Josh is just standing there pointing at your drink being like, "You could've saved $50. You could've saved $25.

Trevor Noah 1:30:37 You could've saved $17. All right. All right. Shotgun shotgun." [laughs]

Speaker 1:30:44 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:30:44 This is so wild.

Speaker 1:30:45 Yeah. And then when I moved to Chicago, I didn't have money to afford to like a new thing. And then after-

Trevor Noah 1:30:51 Yeah

Speaker 1:30:51 ... I moved to New York, I felt like, even though I was still in, like, my mid-20s, I felt like I had missed a little bit of the boat, and that if I were to find out... 'Cause you, the, the way you find your drink and the way you find out how much you can drink-

Trevor Noah 1:31:05 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:31:05 ... is through trial and error.

Trevor Noah 1:31:06 Definitely.

Speaker 1:31:07 And the errors get less and less cute the older you get.

Trevor Noah 1:31:09 This is true. I completely agree.

Speaker 1:31:10 And so now I'm like, ah, yeah, I missed it. Because now also-

Trevor Noah 1:31:14 So there's no, like, curiosity even that makes you... And I'm, I'm not advocating-

Speaker 1:31:17 Not, not really

Trevor Noah 1:31:18 ... for it, by the way.

Speaker 1:31:18 No, no, not really.

Trevor Noah 1:31:19 I'm just, I'm, I'm intrigued by this.

Speaker 1:31:20 The other reason was that I was like, I don't think I can do anything, like smoke or, or drink-

Trevor Noah 1:31:26 Mm

Speaker 1:31:26 ... or any of that. Um, especially, like, it, it was, like, a focus thing as well, 'cause I was like, I wanna be able to take care of my mom, take care of my aunt, and like, you know, just, like, make sure that they're good.

Trevor Noah 1:31:38 Yeah.

Speaker 1:31:38 Right? 'Cause, like, and, and especially after, like, my dad passed and everything. And so then anything like that just seemed like- Um, a potential distraction. And just from the outside looking in, I had never seen anyone be their best self drunk, even the happy drunks.

Trevor Noah 1:31:56 Right, yeah.

Speaker 1:31:56 There were some people that were like, "Oh, he's so fun when he's drunk." And I'm like, "Y'all know he's, like, fun regular, right?"

Trevor Noah 1:32:01 Yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I hear what you mean.

Speaker 1:32:02 But you gotta ask him the right questions. And so, um-

Trevor Noah 1:32:04 How, how, how old were you when your dad passed?

Speaker 1:32:06 Um, 26. I think 26.

Trevor Noah 1:32:09 Yeah.

Speaker 1:32:09 I could've been 25.

Trevor Noah 1:32:10 Did you feel like that, um ... 'Cause I, I'm, I'm listening to you and it sounds like to me it jolted you into, like, a different type of manhood or responsibility than, than you felt before.

Speaker 1:32:21 Yeah, especially because I was, I was now going to, like, hopefully live longer than my dad.

Trevor Noah 1:32:27 Damn.

Speaker 1:32:28 And so now it's like I already had ... What felt crazy to me is that I, my dad pretty much, if I have the math right, I was the age my dad was when he had me when he died. So if I'm, like, 25, 26-

Trevor Noah 1:32:46 Yeah

Speaker 1:32:46 ... I'm pretty sure he had me at 25, 26.

Trevor Noah 1:32:49 Wow.

Speaker 1:32:49 So just as I was, like, gaining an appreciation for what my dad must've been going through and have a kid-

Trevor Noah 1:32:55 Yeah

Speaker 1:32:55 ... I, like, lose my dad. And so these are conversations I n- never end up getting to have with him of, like, "Hey, just so you know, like, I get, I get, I get you a little bit more now."

Trevor Noah 1:33:06 Oh.

Speaker 1:33:06 I know what I, I c-

Trevor Noah 1:33:06 Yeah, the, the evolution

Speaker 1:33:07 ... I can't know what it was like to be a baby with me.

Trevor Noah 1:33:09 Yeah.

Speaker 1:33:10 I can't know what it was like to have, like, annoying cries that are like eh. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:33:14 Yeah.

Speaker 1:33:15 'Cause I'm inquisitive. I, like, I can't go back in time and, like, really get it, but I'm starting to get it. 'Cause I can't imagine having to, like, deal with y- what you and my mom dealt with when you were, um, my

Speaker 1:33:29 age-

Trevor Noah 1:33:29 Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:33:30 ... me being this now. Then losing my dad, I was like, "Oh, yeah, like, anybody can go." So now I make sure, or at least do my best to, like, I'm still not perfect at it, but, like, everyone that I love, I let them know all the time and I don't worry about being embarrassed. 'Cause it's like I, I told my dad I loved him the last time and, and wasn't feeling sure that he heard me. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:33:55 Mm.

Speaker 1:33:55 And I had the opportunity to tell my dad that I loved him plenty of times before he got sick.

Trevor Noah 1:34:01 Mm.

Speaker 1:34:01 And so it's like I never wanna waste that again on anybody. And, like, I've lost people since then, and got to feel at least somewhat better because every time ... I'm not saying this to, like, to, to freak you out, but it's like every time I leave someone I'm like, "They could die-

Trevor Noah 1:34:20 Yeah, that does freak me out

Speaker 1:34:21 ... or I could die." So, like, I'm, I'm sorry.

Trevor Noah 1:34:23 Don't put that juju on me, Ricky Bobby.

Speaker 1:34:24 But I'll tell you I love you all the time-

Trevor Noah 1:34:26 Thank you, Josh. I love you, too

Speaker 1:34:27 ... just so you know.

Trevor Noah 1:34:27 Man, you know I love you, too.

Speaker 1:34:28 Yeah. And-

Trevor Noah 1:34:28 But don't put that juju on me.

Speaker 1:34:29 No, 100%.

Trevor Noah 1:34:30 All right.

Speaker 1:34:31 Look, look.

Trevor Noah 1:34:32 [laughs]

Speaker 1:34:32 We're gonna live forever. That's literally why I say it all the time.

Trevor Noah 1:34:35 Oh, man.

Speaker 1:34:35 I say it every time. I'll be ... People will be like, "Are you, are you hurt?" I'm gonna live forever.

Trevor Noah 1:34:40 [laughs]

Speaker 1:34:40 When I fall, people are like, "Ooh, that looked bad." I'm gonna live forever.

Trevor Noah 1:34:43 It explains a lot of your, like ... I don't know, man. You, you've always had, um, a beautiful appreciate ... Like, we used to come back from shows and you would look at me and you'd be like, "Hey, man, thank you for that." And I was like, "Oh, okay." And that's why I'm shocked that you don't drink 'cause

Trevor Noah 1:35:03 I genuinely thought some of those times-

Speaker 1:35:06 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:35:06 I, I don't mean this in a shitty way. I swear on my life.

Speaker 1:35:08 No, I'm with it. I'm with it. I'm with it

Trevor Noah 1:35:09 ... you had the sincerity of a slightly inebriated person.

Speaker 1:35:13 And I also stopped talking.

Trevor Noah 1:35:15 Yeah.

Speaker 1:35:15 And I realized I do the same thing to Colin Kaepernick. When I met Colin Kaepernick, I was like, "Hey, man, you and me."

Trevor Noah 1:35:21 Yeah, and that's what you do.

Speaker 1:35:22 And it's like-

Trevor Noah 1:35:23 So Josh will, Josh will look at you-

Speaker 1:35:25 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:35:25 ... say something, not finish a sentence, but his in- his intonation will make it seem like something was coming. So he'll look at me and be like, "Hey, man, I just wanted to say thank you." [laughs]

Speaker 1:35:41 Then I'll be like, "Oh, uh, for, for what?"

Trevor Noah 1:35:44 You know. [laughs] Do you know?

Speaker 1:35:50 No, I do know.

Trevor Noah 1:35:50 No, and, and then like-

Speaker 1:35:51 I'm like-

Trevor Noah 1:35:51 ... it, it's ... I mean, I've known you for years now, but-

Speaker 1:35:54 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:35:54 ... back then I was just like, "Oh, man." I was like, "My mans is, you know, he's had a few. It's been a night. It's been a journey, and I appreciate him still." And so, so, I mean, it must be ... I can only imagine what it must be like for your mom, though, seeing this.

Speaker 1:36:09 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:36:09 'Cause there's no mom who doesn't enjoy seeing their child fly.

Speaker 1:36:17 Especially when you quit the grocery store. Especially when you're like-

Trevor Noah 1:36:21 [laughs]

Speaker 1:36:21 ... you're like, "Mom, I think I got this."

Trevor Noah 1:36:23 [laughs]

Speaker 1:36:23 And she's like, "Are you sure?"

Trevor Noah 1:36:24 Yeah.

Speaker 1:36:25 Like, 'cause n- it's not m- my mom never ... Like, she, my mom was very supportive, believed in me, all the things, but any mom is gonna be ... Especially any Black mom is gonna be pragmatic.

Trevor Noah 1:36:34 Yeah.

Speaker 1:36:34 Do you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:36:35 If your mom supports you going into comedy, you ... I don't know if you've got a great mom. I'm gonna be honest.

Speaker 1:36:39 [laughs] Because it's like-

Trevor Noah 1:36:40 Your, your mom should support you doing comedy as, like, a side ... But if your mom-

Speaker 1:36:44 That's what I'm saying, yes, yes

Trevor Noah 1:36:45 ... if you go like, yeah, if you go, "Mom, I'm quitting my job to do comedy," and your mom's like, "Good for you," I don't know if your mom actually likes you.

Speaker 1:36:50 I-

Trevor Noah 1:36:50 I'm gonna be honest. Most moms, all moms should just be like, "Do that for fun and-"

Speaker 1:36:56 I told my mom that I got the job at Tonight Show, and she, she was even still like, um, "Okay, and that's enough money to..." Like, like, she, like, she was still like-

Trevor Noah 1:37:07 Yeah, she, like, is this still like a-

Speaker 1:37:07 ... "And this is, this is good-

Trevor Noah 1:37:09 You can, you can survive

Speaker 1:37:10 ... this is like ..." You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:37:10 You can-

Speaker 1:37:10 "You'll, you'll be taking care of yourself." And so it's like even for something that she knows, 'cause I watched The Tonight Show with Johnny Carson when I was little. Like, I don't, I don't even remember some of this stuff, and she will tell it to me, that she's like, "You would, you cried. You cried so hard." I think I was, like, late to school when, when it, when they announced on, like, the Today Show that Johnny Carson wasn't gonna, or whatever morning show.

Trevor Noah 1:37:32 Wait, really?

Speaker 1:37:32 Yeah. I watched Johnny Carson. I loved Johnny Carson so much. And so I, like, cried. And I'm like, "I don't remember this at all." And she's like, "Yeah, you were like four or whatever." Like, like, I was, like, little. And I don't even know if it was the announcement so much as me finding out, but it was like, it was just ... It w- Johnny Carson and Big Bird got, like-

Trevor Noah 1:37:53 [laughs]

Speaker 1:37:53 ... tear me up, right?

Trevor Noah 1:37:54 [laughs]

Speaker 1:37:55 And so, so then I think that for her, seeing me do well, and especially seeing what we've built, like, like, we have a- Real community of people who come to the show, like, to laugh, take a break, and, like, people really take care of each other and everything. And people are like, um, you know, obviously, like, Internet's Internet, so there's gonna be, like, mean comments, whatever.

Trevor Noah 1:38:16 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:38:16 But for the most part, like, people are, like, um, so kind. They, they, they're very kind towards me, and they're kind towards each other. And it's like everything... I'm hopefully making everything that would make her, you know, happy when she sees it. And she's seen it a few times now, and now she's seen

Speaker 1:38:35 it a couple times as my show. And so then she sees, like, what I'm doing.

Trevor Noah 1:38:39 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:38:40 And so even though she'll still, whatever, if I, if I swear, I... Bro, when I tell you I don't even, like, curse like that. I don't even cur- But if I let anything slip, she's like, "I heard that, uh, that B word. You think that that's-

Trevor Noah 1:38:55 Banana?

Speaker 1:38:55 Do you know what I mean? Like, yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:38:57 [laughs]

Speaker 1:38:57 It'll be... Like, it, any cursing is just, like, is, is, like, um, uh, she clocks it, right?

Trevor Noah 1:39:04 Right.

Speaker 1:39:04 And but I think that now for her, seeing that I'm doing well, seeing I'm okay. And, like, once again, I just, I can take care of her, I can take care of my aunt, and, like, they can ask me for things, and it's not a huge deal.

Trevor Noah 1:39:16 Yeah.

Speaker 1:39:17 'Cause that's been, like, the dream. Like, people would say... Like, even when people said I was, like, good at comedy, I'd be like, "I'm not good at comedy till, like, my mom is taken care of."

Trevor Noah 1:39:26 Man, that's beautiful.

Speaker 1:39:26 Because then it's like-

Trevor Noah 1:39:27 Yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:39:27 ... now, now you've, now you've g- reached some sort of goal, right? Like, now you're like... 'Cause funny is like, this is the, the thing about, like, the hubris behind comedy sometimes that I think even gets comedians trapped in, I think why so many comedians leaned into politics in the way of wanting to be attached and not just wanting to comment.

Trevor Noah 1:39:46 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:39:47 'Cause wanting to comment is, like, what we're supposed to do. Being attached is like, now you're entering a weird... Now you're like a mouthpiece.

Trevor Noah 1:39:53 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:39:54 When you're, like, in with them, in with them, you gotta be very careful. 'Cause now you're talking about your friend.

Trevor Noah 1:39:59 'Cause you have to know them.

Speaker 1:40:00 Yeah. Now, you know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:40:01 No, but that's, that's actually true.

Speaker 1:40:03 Now-

Trevor Noah 1:40:03 You're talking about your friend, and now you can't tell the truth.

Speaker 1:40:05 Now you can't tell the truth, 'cause you're like, "No, I was there-

Trevor Noah 1:40:08 Yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:40:08 ... and he didn't, he didn't mean it that way-

Trevor Noah 1:40:10 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

Speaker 1:40:10 ... that it came out." So I know it's ridiculous, but, like-

Trevor Noah 1:40:12 The funny thing is they're not your friend.

Speaker 1:40:14 They're not your friend.

Trevor Noah 1:40:14 That's the thing I think a lot of people don't realize in these situations.

Speaker 1:40:17 That, yes.

Trevor Noah 1:40:17 Is like, you'll cozy up to a politician, right? They'll cozy up to you, but they're not your friend.

Speaker 1:40:24 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:40:24 Unless they are, but they, most of the time, they're not.

Speaker 1:40:26 They, and, you know-

Trevor Noah 1:40:27 But you, you're so, you're so enjoying the proximity to power-

Speaker 1:40:31 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:40:31 ... that you're quick to go like, "They're my friend." And it's like, "They're your friend?" It's like, "Yeah, I love them. They're cool. They're this, they're that."

Speaker 1:40:37 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:40:38 And then when the power does something that you don't agree with, people are like, "Why is your friend doing this?" Now you're like, "Well, I mean, they're not my friend-friend. I don't, like, know them."

Speaker 1:40:44 No, not, yeah, exactly.

Trevor Noah 1:40:45 [laughs] "I don't, like, know them like that." I mean-

Speaker 1:40:48 Mm

Trevor Noah 1:40:48 ... [laughs] but it's like, but you told us. You vouched for them, and you said they were great.

Speaker 1:40:51 I'll even tell you this right now. You, if you want a politician to be your friend, you gotta find a powerless politician.

Trevor Noah 1:40:58 [laughs]

Speaker 1:40:58 That person

Speaker 1:40:59 being genuine. That person, the person who's like, "Y'all, they blocked me. I can't" [laughs] Like, like, a alderman, city council, they probably your friend. They like-

Trevor Noah 1:41:07 That's like your friend-friend

Speaker 1:41:08 ... you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:41:09 Yeah.

Speaker 1:41:09 But, like, once you get to, um, uh, high up, once you get to prime minister, once you get to, like, president-

Trevor Noah 1:41:15 Yeah

Speaker 1:41:15 ... once you get to people with, like, real power and a stake and an image that they use to, like, catapult them to the next thing-

Trevor Noah 1:41:22 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:41:22 ... you gotta be very careful. Because look, look, uh, what's his name? I'm sure Rodney Dangerfield was friends with Reagan or who... Like, you know what I mean? Like, like-

Trevor Noah 1:41:31 They might've been. You never know

Speaker 1:41:31 ... might, might've been buddies.

Trevor Noah 1:41:32 They might've been.

Speaker 1:41:32 You know? So then he does whatever, um, I don't think it was White House Correspondents' Dinner back then, but he does whatever roasting thing, and then, like, the president at the time's eating it up. It's like, they might be friends.

Trevor Noah 1:41:44 Mm.

Speaker 1:41:44 And then you also have to factor in, like, celebrity to it, too, of, like-

Trevor Noah 1:41:48 Yeah

Speaker 1:41:48 ... maybe this president just... That's what's happening with the, with the fighters now. Like, now these fighters will go to a country and hang out with, like, the country's dictator.

Trevor Noah 1:41:57 Yeah.

Speaker 1:41:57 And then they'll be, like, friends. And then the fighter gets back to the U.S., and he's like, "Hey, you know he skins people, right?"

Trevor Noah 1:42:04 [laughs]

Speaker 1:42:04 It's like, what? He just wanted to take the picture and go, like, like, "That's, that's why I went." And it's like, why would you go? "Well, he paid me $100,000."

Trevor Noah 1:42:13 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:42:13 It's like, oh. You know what I mean?

Trevor Noah 1:42:14 Yeah, you didn't, you didn't, you didn't check. So, so when you, so when you're building this world of yours, what are you, what are you building towards, and you, what are you trying to build away from?

Speaker 1:42:25 I think, I think the... And I've,

Speaker 1:42:27 I've said this before, and I'll, I'll keep saying it on stage, is, like, I think the, the, when, when your life is over, when everything is done, the only real measure of a man is, like, what you build and what you break. And so it's like, I'd like to, um, build up a lot of, like, goodwill things that I think that people still have in them, but they just don't exist as much just for free in the ether.

Trevor Noah 1:42:49 Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:42:49 And I'd like to, like, break some ideas that people have of each other, even though that's gonna be hard. Because, like you said, it's like the, the, the algorithm doesn't aid in those things. The same way you think you can use a politician, and they're using you-

Trevor Noah 1:43:03 Yeah

Speaker 1:43:03 ... I think algorithms work the same way.

Trevor Noah 1:43:04 Oh, no, definitely.

Speaker 1:43:05 Where you're like-

Trevor Noah 1:43:05 Yeah

Speaker 1:43:05 ... "No, I've gamed it, 'cause I'm always nice." And it's like, well, you, first of all, no one is always nice.

Trevor Noah 1:43:11 Mm.

Speaker 1:43:12 And sometimes you're willing to be nasty about someone who's being nasty, or sometimes you have a very human moment.

Trevor Noah 1:43:19 Yeah.

Speaker 1:43:19 Now, just like, the, the problem that we have now that we, that we refuse to accept, because as soon as the thing becomes about you, it takes you out of the game a little bit, is that you watch reality TV.

Trevor Noah 1:43:34 Mm.

Speaker 1:43:34 And now we know enough to know these people have been coached or these people are being produced-

Trevor Noah 1:43:38 Mm

Speaker 1:43:38 ... to be the most entertaining version of themselves. Sometimes the most entertaining version of themselves is the worst version of themselves. And now algorithms and platforms are doing all of that to us. We are not, we are not our worst moment. We, we are also not our, like, like, Marriage Proposal. No one is as cute as, as sweet as, as nasty as, as whatever.

Trevor Noah 1:43:58 Yeah.

Speaker 1:43:59 Even if you put a bunch of that stuff out, no one is one thing, right? Whatever it is, good or bad. And so I think that now you could look at every person, we literally call them channels. You have a YouTube channel.

Trevor Noah 1:44:11 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:44:11 You have a Instagram page. You have, you have a book about you being written. You have a TV show about you being produced.

Trevor Noah 1:44:16 Mm.

Speaker 1:44:17 And those things work the same way. Even if you're like, "Well, no, I control it, 'cause it's mine," you don't control who it goes out to and how it goes out.

Trevor Noah 1:44:25 Yeah.

Speaker 1:44:25 And then I, one thing that I've noticed is, like- The favorite things that people say they're the favorite that I've done are never

Speaker 1:44:35 the thing that ... Not only never the thing I think it would be, never the thing that is the most popular.

Eugene 1:44:40 Hmm.

Speaker 1:44:41 The one of the, one of the favorite, favorite, favorite, like, videos I've had that people have ever put out i- ... Like, I mean, that I've ever put out that people come to me about is this one that I did, that I just did, like, on a whim just to put it out for fun.

Eugene 1:44:54 Yeah.

Speaker 1:44:55 It wasn't even a Tuesday video. It was, like, I think it was extra.

Eugene 1:44:57 It was like a Thursday video.

Speaker 1:44:58 Yeah.

Eugene 1:44:59 Yeah.

Speaker 1:44:59 And I was like, there, there was a, the ... It's called The Priest and the Pickle, and it's just a time in my life where I had a conversation with a priest and a guy who was, like, a, like, a, a pickle/pickle juice thief. And it's like, that thing is, for a lot of people, some people say you talk about Trump, you talk about Black culture, you talk about, talk about, talk about. But if we talk about favorite, for whatever reason, that thing peers through. I think anything that I put out that people connect to is hopefully, and I think by virtue of what people tell me, is the thing where I'm being hopefully, like, the most human. And so I'm not interested in being right. I'm not interested in being, like, um, into bringing the country into, like, whatever political form. I just, like, wanna remind everybody that, like, at least in this aspect, and to real-world consequence, you are being produced. So whatever you watch, whatever you do, take it with a grain of salt. Could this be a bot? Also, am I being served something because of how I'm feeling?

Eugene 1:46:03 Yeah.

Speaker 1:46:04 The same way that, like, y- if you, if you're, if you're with your girl and your girl knows what you, that you're upset, and she also knows what you're upset about, she's gonna bring you a different thing. So sometimes it's like you just had a bad day.

Eugene 1:46:15 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 1:46:16 I'll, I'll make you a little something. Or if someone did something to you, "Hey, we need to talk-

Eugene 1:46:20 Mm-hmm

Speaker 1:46:20 ... 'cause I can tell you need to talk it out."

Eugene 1:46:22 Yeah.

Speaker 1:46:22 Algorithms are serving you the same way. We do not give ... We give AI, and AI that doesn't even exist yet, all the credit of intelligence and manipulation that we should be giving the algorithms that already serve us.

Eugene 1:46:35 Mm.

Speaker 1:46:35 And so

Speaker 1:46:36 I just, like, hopefully even in being manipulated by it, even in, even in serving the machine to hopefully, like, serve the people, some good can come out of that. But, like, there's so much more that I need to do. Like, I think I should just be, like, writing a lot of this down and, and making it-

Eugene 1:46:54 [laughs]

Speaker 1:46:54 ... making it, like-

Eugene 1:46:55 A manual

Speaker 1:46:55 ... hopefully a book.

Eugene 1:46:56 Yeah.

Speaker 1:46:56 'Cause then a book is, like, harder to ... You only saw the snippet of the book.

Eugene 1:47:01 Yeah, that's true.

Speaker 1:47:01 You know what I mean?

Eugene 1:47:01 That's true. People don't clip books.

Speaker 1:47:03 Yeah, yeah. And it's like, and even when you do, it's like, "All right. That's boring."

Eugene 1:47:07 [laughs]

Speaker 1:47:08 Like, even when somebody tries to, like, clip, like, a-

Eugene 1:47:10 Yeah, it does- it doesn't hit the same.

Speaker 1:47:11 It doesn't hit the same.

Eugene 1:47:12 It never hits the same.

Speaker 1:47:13 Even when it's, like, a slam dunk.

Eugene 1:47:14 It does not hit the same.

Speaker 1:47:15 It's like, all right.

Eugene 1:47:17 You gotta read it in your head.

Speaker 1:47:18 Yeah.

Eugene 1:47:19 It's not the same.

Speaker 1:47:19 Yeah, and then now I said it.

Eugene 1:47:21 See?

Speaker 1:47:22 That's the most annoying

Speaker 1:47:23 thing. I don't know if you've seen that, but, like, that is a real phenomenon that's happening. Somebody finally reads anything, and they go ... It's like when someone repeats your idea back to you, 'cause they weren't listening, but they were listening enough to, for it to go in.

Eugene 1:47:37 And then they say it.

Speaker 1:47:38 And then they say it. That's what people do. You should do that with reading, but people do it with reading like they're the expert.

Eugene 1:47:44 [laughs]

Speaker 1:47:44 They're like, "Actually, now that I think about it, my whole eighth grade science book was really my idea. I don't even know why you teaching the class."

Eugene 1:47:52 [laughs]

Speaker 1:47:52 Like, that, like, that's the huber- Like, that's the crazy attitude that people have now, and it's why people are like, "Yeah, don't trust experts sometimes," 'cause it's like, "Well, I also am well-read about this."

Eugene 1:48:02 Yeah.

Speaker 1:48:02 And it's like, you're not well-labbed about it. You haven't clocked the hours.

Eugene 1:48:06 I think-

Speaker 1:48:07 You know what I mean?

Eugene 1:48:07 ... on- only when you speak to comics do you realize that, one, we're privileged in more ways than we can ever imagine. And I think right now we're living in a world where we've over-ordered from the menu, and now we don't know what to eat first, 'cause I think-

Speaker 1:48:20 [laughs] Yeah

Eugene 1:48:20 ... I, I think

Eugene 1:48:21 of social media, I'm like, you know you can erase all the apps and just leave the one that you like-

Speaker 1:48:25 Yeah

Eugene 1:48:25 ... to communicate with people.

Speaker 1:48:26 Yeah.

Eugene 1:48:27 And also, it's social media, not interactive media.

Speaker 1:48:29 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:48:30 If you're not using it to socialize with people that you wanna socialize with, you are the one opening up the door for people that you don't want in your life.

Speaker 1:48:36 Yeah, now it socializes you.

Eugene 1:48:38 Yes.

Speaker 1:48:38 Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:48:38 But I also think the more time you have in your hands, the more you earn, the more time we have ... And this, this debate has been going around since the beginning of time. Well, it was big with fast food. Remember when people would say, "Yeah, you eating junk food. Yeah, you eating unhealthy."

Speaker 1:48:53 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Eugene 1:48:53 And then people were like, "Maybe I like it, and maybe that's all I can afford."

Speaker 1:48:56 Yeah.

Eugene 1:48:57 And it's also the same with what people call trash television.

Speaker 1:49:01 Yeah, you're not wrong. It's the same trend.

Eugene 1:49:02 It's an escape. Pe- people just wanna-

Speaker 1:49:03 Yeah, yeah, you're not wrong

Eugene 1:49:04 ... Yeah, they just wanna watch that. They just... When if you feel like you know that Kim Kardashian doesn't look like that all the time, that's good for you, but they just wanna wa- they wanna watch shows about marriages not working out because theirs is probably not working out as well, so they don't wanna feel alone.

Speaker 1:49:18 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:49:19 But I also feel like the m- people... I feel the same about sport, organized sports the same way some people feel about social media and the comments and the bots and reality television, because if all sports was real, why is it that when match fixing happens, it's a scandal?

Speaker 1:49:35 W- what sport? Like, what match fixing-

Eugene 1:49:37 For example-

Speaker 1:49:37 ... for what sport?

Eugene 1:49:38 ... w- we had a case in South Africa where it was a huge one, South African cricket team.

Speaker 1:49:42 All sports real. Say that statement again.

Eugene 1:49:44 So here, on, in reality television, you and I can always say it's overproduced. There's some acting going on over there.

Speaker 1:49:51 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:49:51 So but for someone else, it's, it's reality.

Speaker 1:49:54 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:49:54 Kim Kardashian looks like that all the time.

Speaker 1:49:56 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:49:56 People who love sports, organized sports-

Speaker 1:49:58 Yeah

Eugene 1:49:58 ... think those people show up at that time, they get paid this much. At 8:00, they're gonna play for 90 minutes, right?

Speaker 1:50:04 Yeah.

Eugene 1:50:04 And it's real. The tackle was real.

Speaker 1:50:06 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Eugene 1:50:06 The goal was, the dive was real.

Speaker 1:50:08 Yeah.

Eugene 1:50:08 Until match fixing happens, and then someone realizes that that match that they spoke about with their friends with such conviction-

Speaker 1:50:15 That players-

Eugene 1:50:16 ... two years ago

Speaker 1:50:16 ... yeah, yeah.

Eugene 1:50:17 All of that-

Speaker 1:50:17 Yeah

Eugene 1:50:17 ... yeah, someone was paid to take a dive-

Speaker 1:50:20 Yeah

Eugene 1:50:20 ... or to pretend that they were hurt.

Speaker 1:50:22 Mm-hmm.

Eugene 1:50:22 So if in that reality we go s- real organized sport is real-

Speaker 1:50:26 Yeah

Eugene 1:50:27 ... same way someone feels about reality television.

Speaker 1:50:30 It is their reality, but-

Eugene 1:50:31 It is their reality.

Speaker 1:50:32 I think the diff- the ... I'll just pitch you this. I do think the difference, though, is that even in a fixed match, nobody, like- ... flies. Like, like this, all the-

Trevor Noah 1:50:41 [laughs]

Speaker 1:50:41 No, no, no, no ... all the, all the stuff that would happen in a match still happened.

Trevor Noah 1:50:45 [laughs]

Speaker 1:50:45 There are people, there are people who

Speaker 1:50:47 literally get- Oh, man ... there are people who literally get- Oh, goodness ... pissed off and produced- This guy just said nobody flies. Yeah, 'cause, like, if you were like, the- Oh, man ... "Oh, sports isn't real the way reality TV is real-" No, we're comparing the Kardashians and a soccer match. Yes, exactly. Yes. So, so with the Kardashians, right? Mm-hmm. There's a, there's a chance that Kim's not even that mad at Khloe, but she's now been produced to almost come to blows with her sister, which is not, like, real, because it's not based off a real conflict, and it's not something- Okay ... that would have happened if we weren't looking. Yes. Everything that happens, even in a fixed match, even if you just paid the ref, they

Speaker 1:51:20 still shot the ball, they still kicked the ball, they still did the stuff. So it's like, yes, it's r- it's still, to me, it's just as real because whether someone takes a dive or not is, like, it almost doesn't factor into the equation. 'Cause you also don't know who's, like, if the keeper's girlfriend broke up with him, and now he's, like, distracted, so he's not playing at his best. It's like, it's still, all the stuff that was gonna happen still happened, in a way that in reality TV, you can tell. Sometimes they pick the sweetest people, and then they get them to yell things that they would, like, they mess with your mind to the point. And I think that with sports it's at least like, "Nah, he was always gonna try to kick it in. He just tried less 'cause, like, somebody paid him." I think, I think-

Trevor Noah 1:52:02 What I'm, what I'm hearing you both say, funny enough, I know we're gonna have to wrap up soon anyway, but, like, I don't think you're saying something too different. And I think, you know what it is? It's, it's-

Speaker 1:52:13 Choreographed

Trevor Noah 1:52:14 ... no, but more than that. It's, it's, it's just, it goes back to the question I asked you about, like, your first experience as a young child doing what you sort of now do as a stand-up comedian. And it's the challenge that we all face in the world.

Speaker 1:52:29 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:52:31 You have to watch the people around you watch the news.

Speaker 1:52:34 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:52:35 And you have to deal with the paradox of what they're experiencing-

Speaker 1:52:38 Mm-hmm

Trevor Noah 1:52:38 ... versus the reality that's actually outside.

Speaker 1:52:40 Mm-hmm.

Trevor Noah 1:52:41 Right? You have to find a way to bridge that divide. And then on the other side, in a similar world, it's like, go to the dentist, go to the dentist, but also ask yourself why they gave you a lollipop.

Speaker 1:52:56 Mm. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, that's, that, you did it. You brought it on home. That's very, that, that, I feel like is what we should all do.

Trevor Noah 1:53:07 Josh Johnson, this was dope, man.

Speaker 1:53:09 This was great, man. I miss you.

Trevor Noah 1:53:11 I miss you, too. I-

Speaker 1:53:12 It's good to see you

Trevor Noah 1:53:12 ... I don't miss you as much as you miss me, 'cause I see you all the time on the internet, which is great for me.

Speaker 1:53:16 Oh, well, thanks, man.

Trevor Noah 1:53:16 But it's bad because then I don't get to hang out with you like this.

Speaker 1:53:19 Yeah, yeah. We can hang out any time I'm in town.

Trevor Noah 1:53:22 Yeah, that's never.

Speaker 1:53:24 No, no, it's like-

Trevor Noah 1:53:24 That's a traveling comedian way of saying, like-

Speaker 1:53:26 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:53:26 ... "See you, sucka."

Speaker 1:53:27 No, no.

Trevor Noah 1:53:28 "We can hang out any time I'm around." [laughs]

Speaker 1:53:31 Never. I'm, I'm, I'm here four days a week.

Trevor Noah 1:53:33 I, I, I still need to go to a UFC match with you. That's all I want. I still say this is the, this is the channel that the world deserves.

Speaker 1:53:38 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:53:39 Josh Johnson commentating on UFC.

Speaker 1:53:42 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:53:43 This man single-handedly got me into UFC.

Speaker 1:53:45 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:53:45 And I've n- I have never enjoyed a match as much as I have when, when he... You should, have you ever tried doing one of those, like, s- um, second screen type things?

Speaker 1:53:54 Oh, no. No, I haven't.

Trevor Noah 1:53:55 I mean, maybe don't 'cause you love UFC. I don't wanna spoil the thing that you love, but-

Speaker 1:53:58 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:53:58 ... let me tell you something, man. The-

Speaker 1:54:01 Especially in 2020, man

Trevor Noah 1:54:03 ... let me, let me tell you something. This guy, UFC.

Speaker 1:54:08 Mm.

Trevor Noah 1:54:08 You don't even understand.

Speaker 1:54:09 I would have never imagined.

Trevor Noah 1:54:10 Josh would make me think I know-

Speaker 1:54:13 UFC

Trevor Noah 1:54:13 ... by the time the fight starts, I would be like, "Khabib, oh, let me tell you about Khabib."

Speaker 1:54:19 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:54:19 "You don't even understand, man. Oh, so here's the thing you gotta understand about Dagestani, uh, wrestling, right? So you see the Dagestani technique." And I'd be like, "Where did this come from?"

Speaker 1:54:27 [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:54:28 And then Josh is just there in the corner, like, "Yeah." [laughs]

Speaker 1:54:31 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:54:31 No, I'm serious. You gotta do it. You really do.

Speaker 1:54:32 No, dude, I'm telling you, especially in 2020, that was a good time to get in because, because there were no crowds-

Trevor Noah 1:54:40 Oh

Speaker 1:54:40 ... you got to see what, like, a fight was like because you could hear them. Yes.

Trevor Noah 1:54:43 Oh, dude, yeah.

Speaker 1:54:43 No, you could hear the punch. You could hear them. Yes. Yeah. So not only could you hear them, you could hear when they were surprised about what was happening. I'll never forget when Kevin Holland fought, and I don't remember who grabbed him. Somebody grabbed him, and he went. Like, he's not on mic. The cameras are over the cage. So the cameras pick him up going, "Ooh, you strong."

Trevor Noah 1:55:02 [laughs]

Speaker 1:55:03 Like, as a... But you're like, "This is a professional elite fighter."

Trevor Noah 1:55:06 Do you remember the other one?

Speaker 1:55:07 Yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:55:07 Wait, there was another one that we, you showed me. Oh, man, it was, it was similar to this. Someone turns to their corner in the fight during... It was the same time. There's, like, no crowd.

Speaker 1:55:15 Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:55:15 And he, like, turns, and he's like, "I, I don't know what to do."

Speaker 1:55:18 [laughs] Yeah, yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:55:20 Like, in the middle of the fight.

Speaker 1:55:20 Yeah. He's, like, in the middle of a fight. He's like, he's like, "Hey, hey. Like, y'all, y'all said..." [laughs] Like, he was, it was so good. And then the other one that we, we were laughing, we were, like, crying about is this... 'Cause heavyweight fights are also, like, these are the biggest, most dangerous men in the world.

Trevor Noah 1:55:35 Yeah.

Speaker 1:55:36 Mm. But they're also scared of each other. Yes. So it's like now they- 'Cause they also see a big man- Yeah, th- now they're like- ... trying to fight them. Yeah [laughs] ... "That's a big guy." And remember when we were in the car, and we, we had missed the actual fight, 'cause we were, like, traveling for it, and it was in, I think, uh, Abu Dhabi, so it was a different time and everything. And anyway, the heavyweight dude kicked, uh, like, did, like, whatever, uh, kick, like oblique kick. Mm. And the other guy went, "Ah. Ah."

Trevor Noah 1:56:01 [laughs]

Speaker 1:56:01 And then he started walking away.

Trevor Noah 1:56:03 He just walked away.

Speaker 1:56:04 And he just walked away.

Trevor Noah 1:56:05 In the opposite... Like, he was like, "I'm going home."

Speaker 1:56:07 Even the ref is like ru- Like, the ref starts running to try to stop it, 'cause you're like, you know, you gotta intelligently defend yourself and everything.

Trevor Noah 1:56:13 Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1:56:13 But even the ref was like, "What is he doing?" [laughs] And then the dude, like, hit him once, and then he, you know, like, f- but he was still holding his side. And it, you would never hear the like, "Ah." Like, and now because of COVID, they've actually brought back a lot more, like-

Trevor Noah 1:56:28 Oh

Speaker 1:56:28 ... ringside-

Trevor Noah 1:56:30 Ringside

Speaker 1:56:30 ... coach corner.

Trevor Noah 1:56:31 There it is. Oh.

Speaker 1:56:31 Like, they had some of it before- I've seen that video ... but now they're like-

Trevor Noah 1:56:33 You can kind of know it now

Speaker 1:56:33 ... they're bringing, they're bringing it more in

Trevor Noah 1:56:35 I'm telling you, Josh-

Speaker 1:56:36 Yeah

Trevor Noah 1:56:36 ... you gotta do it, man.

Speaker 1:56:37 But yeah.

Trevor Noah 1:56:37 Josh Johnson, UFC commentator.

Speaker 1:56:40 And part-time nunchuck user. [laughs] Ow. Ow. [laughs] Ow. Ah, ah. [laughs] He works, walks the streets at night. [laughs] His afro casting a menacing silhouette. "Hello?" [laughs] "Who is that? Hello? Hello?" [whooshing] "Ow." [laughs] "Are you the guy from the grocery store?" [laughs] [whooshing] Josh Johnson is Nun Chuck. [laughs]

Trevor Noah 1:57:08 [upbeat music] Thank you so much for watching the episode. If you enjoyed it, pass it on to a friend. If you didn't enjoy it, pass it on to your friend still. Let them suffer for a change. And don't forget to engage with us in the comments. Uh, if you wanna, uh, suggest a guest, maybe there's questions you want, maybe there's ideas that you have, you can chat to us. We will read through the comments, and we'll get into it. Either way, I appreciate you taking the time. Thank you for hanging out with us on What Now? And remember, we do this for you, so we would like to hear from you. Till next time. Thank you.