What Now? With Trevor NoahMayor Karen Bass Predicts Los Angeles’ Future! - What Now? with Trevor Noah Podcast
EVERY SPOKEN WORD
55 min read · 11,044 words- 0:00 – 1:44
Why mayors matter more than national politics (and LA’s affordability backdrop)
- KBKaren Bass
Could we just make sure everyone's recording?
- TNTrevor Noah
All right. I'm, I'm recording on my side.
- SPSpeaker
I'm recording.
- SPSpeaker
I... One second. One second.
- TNTrevor Noah
I'm, I'm always recording. Please note that all calls are recorded for quality assurance purposes.
- SPSpeaker
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
[upbeat music] This is What Now? With Trevor Noah. Happy Mayor of Los Angeles Karen Bass Day everybody.
- SPSpeaker
Hey.
- SPSpeaker
Happy Karen Bass Day.
- SPSpeaker
Happy Karen Bass Day.
- TNTrevor Noah
I love speaking to mayors because-
- SPSpeaker
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
... after, after years of years of speaking to politicians I have been told by, I would say like the majority of politicians, that mayors have the most direct impact on, on your life. Like, if you live in a city, a mayor has more of an impact on your life than the president of your country does. And most people don't think this. Most people are out there in the streets, especially in America. I've noticed like in America it's all about national politics. Christiane, I feel like of all of us you have the highest stake in this conversation, 'cause you are a resident of Los Angeles.
- SPSpeaker
I do.
- TNTrevor Noah
Are you not?
- SPSpeaker
And, you know, I've had some experience with mayors. Boris Johnson was the mayor of London.
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
And then became the prime minister. So I have a lot of feeling. I've had the worst mayors. I had de Blasio.
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
I had Boris Johnson, and Karen, I have no view of it right now because, I mean, uh, is, she's currently reigning as the mayor.
- TNTrevor Noah
I, I wanna speak to her about, um, I mean, everything obviously. But, you know, LA right now, I think one of the big topics obviously is homelessness.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- 1:44 – 4:37
Homelessness stigma, criminalization, and the politics of NIMBYism
- TNTrevor Noah
I find that people are more angry at homeless people than they are at the situations that make people homeless.
- SPSpeaker
For sure.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
Like they make it, they make it seem like people leave home, kiss their family, and they're like, "All right, honey, I'm off to be homeless. See you soon." Do you know what I mean? And it's like, no one wants to be homeless.
- SPSpeaker
Listen-
- SPSpeaker
Yeah
- SPSpeaker
... that actually is-
- TNTrevor Noah
You know how you know that nobody... Yeah, you know how you, you know how you know nobody wants to be homeless? Is because all homeless people try to build homes. Have you ever noticed that?
- SPSpeaker
Yep.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah, especially like in LA. It's such an expensive city. I think I've, I've only had the misfortune and fortune of re- living in really expensive places, London, New York, LA. And this LA housing, there's an affordable housing crisis here.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- SPSpeaker
Um, and it's just like it's no surprise that there are people who have full-time jobs and they live in their cars. Like that-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah
- SPSpeaker
... that's a thing that like blows my mind.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
I'm like, you have people who are doing all the right things, right? They went to school.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
They got a job, or they went, they have a trade. Like, they are contributing to society.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- SPSpeaker
And they still can't afford an apartment. And even if you're not contributing to society, I don't believe that you should have to live on the street. You understand?
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm, yeah.
- SPSpeaker
Like, that, that's my view of the social contract. Um, and it's just ex- LA is terrifyingly expensive. LA's a place where, like, rich people [laughs] are nervous. So that makes you think, like, what is going on here? And I don't know, how does a mayor fix that? Because I think LA in many ways starts to suffer from all of the bigger problems that America has federally sometimes.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
You know? I don't know.
- TNTrevor Noah
I hear what you're saying.
- SPSpeaker
If it, if it comes up while you're talking about the homelessness and everything, I have two questions if I could sneak in two.
- TNTrevor Noah
It depends on what they are, Josh, but go ahead.
- SPSpeaker
Okay. Well, one is, uh, about how you balance, or if you can balance, making illegal something that can inevitably happen to a person. To me, the way that we've in America made homelessness illegal-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah
- 4:37 – 6:47
The “lemon thief” detour and how scarcity changes behavior
- SPSpeaker
And it's so easy to become that person, Trevor.
- TNTrevor Noah
Oh, it is. It is.
- SPSpeaker
But I'm like, "Lewis, who's that? Who's that walking down the street?"
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
C- can you go and check? [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
Like, I'm like, "H- who stole our lemons? Someone's been stealing my lemons-
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
... from my lemon tree. We have a lemon thief."
- SPSpeaker
Oh, my goodness.
- SPSpeaker
And they take them in, like, bundles. And I'm like, "Who's st- you just have to ask. Just ask me. I'd give you my lemons."
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
"There's a lemon thief." And I'm, like, speaking to the neighbors about it. And I'm like, I'm supposed to be a socialist, and I'm getting furious about lemons. So yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
Oh, wow.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
The NIMBYism, it happens. It comes to all of us, and we just have to fight it.
- TNTrevor Noah
It does, it does come to all of us.
- SPSpeaker
It, yes.
- TNTrevor Noah
It's funny, I used to steal lemons all the time, so. Well, not steal, actually. I used to walk around neighborhoods with my mom when I was, when I was younger, and we would find all the streets where people had fruit trees. And all we would do is just take ... It was like blackberries, um-
- SPSpeaker
So you would steal people's fruit?
- TNTrevor Noah
Blackberries, apples, lemons-
- SPSpeaker
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
... limes, um, peaches, anything that we could find hanging. I, we didn't even think of it as stealing. It is a tree that is growing.
- SPSpeaker
No, no, I, if, the thing is, they take a lot of the lemons, Trevor. They take like 10, 10 lemons at a time. And if you ask me, I will give them to you. Like-
- TNTrevor Noah
Wait, wait. How do you know, wait, how do you know it's one person taking 10 lemons and not 10 people taking one lemon?
- SPSpeaker
That's a good point. But I, I, my spirit tells me it's one person-
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
... taking a bunch of lemon. I, I just, on a spiritual level. You know Nigerians. You know, uh, you know when a thief-
- TNTrevor Noah
You can feel it. You can feel something-
- SPSpeaker
I can feel a thief
- 6:47 – 9:36
Trevor’s South Africa story: wealth, walls, and the loss of community
- TNTrevor Noah
When I was growing up in the township in South Africa, nobody had anything. And what I mean by that is you, you had the very bare minimum. Everyone had a, a basic structure. Uh, you know, sometimes you didn't have running water inside the house, so there was a shared tap or faucet, you know, in, that, that connected a few houses. There were outdoor toilets, et cetera. Everyone had nothing, the bare minimum. And because of that, everyone shared everything with everyone, and what I mean by that is, like, space. Like-
- SPSpeaker
Mm
- TNTrevor Noah
... someone would walk through your yard to get to another yard, and it was just like, "Yeah, this is the shortest way possible." So you would walk through your neighbors' backyards all the time, and you'd just greet people. "Hello, hello, hello, hello."
- SPSpeaker
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
"Sanbonan, ebo, yebo, ye-" It was like, yeah, because I mean, what are you ... Of course, you need to move through my space to get to another space, and it's convenient. I get that. And there, there were all of these instances where people were, quote-unquote, "infringing" on another person's space, but it wasn't felt that way. It wasn't, it wasn't treated that way. And interestingly, you'd see one family in the neighborhood, they would start to do well. You know, a parent of theirs would get a job in the city or whatever it was, and then they would build a wall, would be the first thing they'd build around their house. The houses had no walls, and then there'd be a wall.
- SPSpeaker
Mm.
- TNTrevor Noah
And then they would put, like, spikes on the top of their wall so that you couldn't climb over the wall, and then they would get a car at some point, and then they would get ... And it's amazing how as the people got more money, they became more and more isolated from the community around them. They stopped speaking to people as much. They stopped getting the occasional weak tie that would meander through their yard and have a random conversation with them. Their children played in their yard and were never in the street, and all of a sudden became ostracized from the other kids. And it's amazing to me how in this machine that we live in, we've all been conditioned and we've all been taught to get as much as possible, but then in that, you know, like, like, the ring from Lord of the Rings, once you have your precious, you, you, you, you are terrified of sharing it with anyone or anyone taking it from you.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
And so you have to become, like, a, like, a, a Gollum that goes into a cave and hides with your precious. And we don't realize what we lose, funny enough, you know? And, and by the way, I'm, I'm guilty of it in many ways. I think many of us are.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
But you take for granted what you lose. You take for granted the fact that you're constantly not with the people around you, because you're constantly afraid that they will want to take the toasters in your garage, when in fact you don't need that toaster. You didn't care for that toaster.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
And the thing you actually need in your life is community and somebody to look after your kids who you actually like, who you didn't hire from an app, who's forced to be on that app-
- SPSpeaker
Oh my gosh, Trevor
- TNTrevor Noah
... because they also don't have ... It's just like a, it's just like a wild-
- 9:36 – 11:04
Car-centric LA and the difficulty of building real neighborhood life
- SPSpeaker
You're speaking my language. It's funny, Lewis walks with Obi every day to school.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
So he does about 10,000 steps a day, which in LA makes him a crazy person, 'cause no one walks in LA.
- TNTrevor Noah
It really does.
- SPSpeaker
Every time we walk in, we run into friends who are driving. They're like, "Why are you walking?" And Lewis is like, "Well, this is the way we see people, and we see the world"
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah. Mm-hmm
- SPSpeaker
... "and we get to know our neighbors." And in a car-centric city like this that, where your friends can live completely across town-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes
- SPSpeaker
... it's really isolating, and there aren't many ways to actually find that community you're talking about. You know what I mean?
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- SPSpeaker
'Cause you're always in your car, or you're always at work, and then you go and buy something from the supermarket, and then you come home.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes.
- SPSpeaker
And I, I, it's something I've been like, "Oh, I'm in LA. I know all these people, but I never get to see them." And it's 'cause, like, everyone's in their own mini fortress [laughs] and if you want to go-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah
- SPSpeaker
... on a date you have to hire a babysitter through an app who may quit two weeks later. Not that that happened to me.
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- SPSpeaker
But it happened to me. [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah. But yeah, okay. We're gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna jump, get ready for the mayor. We're gonna talk about, uh, homelessness, crime, and what it is like being the first woman, I think, and then the second African American mayor in LA, which is pretty wild. It's crazy that in 2023 there are still first anythings.
- SPSpeaker
Yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
But let's get into it. Mayor Karen Bass. [upbeat music]
- 11:04 – 14:13
One year in office: what the LA mayor can (and can’t) control
- KBKaren Bass
Mr. Trevor Noah.
- TNTrevor Noah
Well, well, well.
- KBKaren Bass
How are you?
- TNTrevor Noah
She is good.
- KBKaren Bass
Good.
- TNTrevor Noah
Thank you for the time. Good to see you. We're rolling? Oh, okay, then, then we can, we can jump into it. I guess, um, jumping straight into it in, in the most, uh, apt way possible, congratulations. You just celebrated one year-
- KBKaren Bass
Yes
- TNTrevor Noah
... of being the mayor of Los Angeles.
- KBKaren Bass
Yes. It ha- has been an exhilarating year.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
Really has. Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
How, how many moments have you regretted taking the job?
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs] You know what? I haven't.
- TNTrevor Noah
You haven't?
- KBKaren Bass
I really haven't, no.
- TNTrevor Noah
Not even once?
- KBKaren Bass
No.
- TNTrevor Noah
I don't know if I believe that.
- KBKaren Bass
No, but I will tell you, though, I wake up some mornings going, "I'm a mayor?" [laughs] But, but no regrets, no.
- TNTrevor Noah
It's, it's a massive job.
- KBKaren Bass
It is.
- TNTrevor Noah
Being a mayor of any city is, is a monumental task. Being the mayor of Los Angeles is, I mean, is akin to being, you know, a governor in some places-
- KBKaren Bass
Right. That's right
- TNTrevor Noah
... and a president in other places-
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs] That, that's true
- TNTrevor Noah
... because, because of how much your job entails. Let's, let's get into that aspect of it-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... to help me understand, and I think for many people who'll be listening to this. What, what is the mayor of Los Angeles tasked with doing? What is, what, what is under your scope?
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
What are you capable of doing?
- 14:13 – 17:36
Bass’s origin story: civil rights era activism and returning home to organize
- TNTrevor Noah
Your, your journey is, in many ways, almost, it's almost perfectly designed for you to be at this moment in your life. You know-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... I was, I was, I was reading through your history and through your life and, I mean, it's, it's quite a story journey. When, when you were a young girl, your, your father really, I guess, inspired you and, and, and, you know, through the things that he showed you, inspired you to become an activist.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
You wanted to be part of changing your world. That's not what most kids want.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs] It's not.
- TNTrevor Noah
That's not what most kids dream of. What was it about activism that made you think, "I wanna get involved in that"?
- KBKaren Bass
Oh, you know what? I think it was the time period, the historical time period when I grew up, where change was happening all over the country-
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm
- KBKaren Bass
... and really all over the world. So it was the civil rights movement, and as a kid, I was watching it on TV with my father. And he would explain to me what the South was like because he was from the South.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
He was part of that generation that came post-World War II.
- TNTrevor Noah
And so you thought to yourself, "This is it."
- KBKaren Bass
Absolutely. All I wanted to do was hurry up and grow up so that I could be a part of a movement. That's what I wanted to do.
- TNTrevor Noah
What was the first movement you were a part of?
- KBKaren Bass
Uh, really at school. You know, working as a, um, a middle school activist, and then the first campaign I worked on was Bobby Kennedy's presidential campaign.
- TNTrevor Noah
Wow.
- KBKaren Bass
And I was in the ninth grade.
- TNTrevor Noah
Wow.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
What were you doing as part of the campaign?
- KBKaren Bass
Oh, you know what I did? I signed up my mother to be a precinct officer.
- TNTrevor Noah
Really?
- KBKaren Bass
But I did it. She never knew. [laughs] Not until many years later.
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- KBKaren Bass
So I went up and down my block, I knocked on the doors, and I told them why I thought Bobby Kennedy would be the best president.
- TNTrevor Noah
And what, what were you saying at this age?
- KBKaren Bass
I was saying-
- TNTrevor Noah
Why, why did you think he'd be the best president?
- KBKaren Bass
Well, you know, there were two things that were happening then. It was 1967, '68.
- 17:36 – 20:10
From organizing to governing: why purpose matters and how homelessness exploded
- TNTrevor Noah
You know, making change is, is a, a task that I think oftentimes sounds a lot easier than it is.
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
Because I think many people want to make change.
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
Most people do not want to put the work in f- for that change to actually take place.
- KBKaren Bass
Yeah. That's true.
- TNTrevor Noah
If I say to an activist, "What is the hardest part of being an activist?" They will say to me, "It's realizing how slow change actually is-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... on the ground."
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
"How slow it actually is." People talk about Karen Bass before she was Karen Bass working in state office or in, on a, on a federal level or as, as mayor. Everyone says you were, you were connected to the people.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
You had this affinity for the people-
- KBKaren Bass
That's right
- TNTrevor Noah
... for, for, for what was happening on the ground. I guess my question is, is two parts. One, do you think that has led to or that has been part of the reason you've been able to be successful politically? And secondly, what do you think other politicians miss by not being on the ground before they get into politics?
- KBKaren Bass
Well, I think what, uh, a lot of people miss is their purpose. Like, why are they running for office? Why are they there?
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm.
- KBKaren Bass
I think a lot of people look at it as a career, or they say, "Well, I'm running for this because I'm gonna run for that." To me, I've always been driven by the issues, and I think it's always critical to leave your ego outside and stay focused on what you're trying to do. But Trevor, you hit it, uh, on for why I've been happy now, because I'm back on the ground. [laughs] And I'm back doing things that I was trying to do, really, 30 years ago.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
But I was, you know, I was a community activist running a community organization, but I didn't have the authority or the power. We were trying to deal with homelessness in 1993. We were trying to take over motels, and everybody thought we were crazy.
- TNTrevor Noah
Was it, was it worse back then? Or-
- KBKaren Bass
No. No, no, no.
- TNTrevor Noah
No. It's, it's-
- KBKaren Bass
No, homelessness then was in South Central and Skid Row.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay.
- KBKaren Bass
And it was probably, we didn't, we didn't count, but I could guess it was probably maybe 3,000 or 4,000. And just think now in the city, not the county, in the city it's 46,000.
- TNTrevor Noah
46,000-
- KBKaren Bass
46,000
- TNTrevor Noah
... in the city alone.
- KBKaren Bass
That's right. If you add the county, you gotta add another 20,000. That's why you see tents everywhere. Before, we didn't have tents. There were shopping carts.
- 20:10 – 22:20
Money in politics: the Caruso race and the imbalance of self-funded campaigns
- TNTrevor Noah
When, when your campaign launched, it very quickly became a national campaign-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... that was about a local, you know, race.
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
I, I, I don't think I've ever seen a mayoral race get the, the amount of attention that this race did.
- KBKaren Bass
Oh.
- TNTrevor Noah
You know, you were running against Caruso.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
And it, it was this race where I think he was spending, I think in total he spent $100 million, $104 million, if my numbers are correct-
- KBKaren Bass
That's right
- TNTrevor Noah
... on the ground.
- KBKaren Bass
That's right.
- TNTrevor Noah
Your campaign spent $5 million.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs] A little more.
- TNTrevor Noah
A little more?
- KBKaren Bass
Yeah. [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
How much was it exactly?
- KBKaren Bass
I raised 9 million.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay, okay.
- KBKaren Bass
And then other people contributed 5, so it was, uh-
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay, so the, okay, so the external contributions were 5, and then-
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay. But I mean, still, that's, that's-
- KBKaren Bass
Exactly right
- TNTrevor Noah
... that's a huge return versus the spending. Let's start with that. Do you think there is too much money in political races now?
- KBKaren Bass
Oh, gosh, yes. And the problem is, is that if you have personal wealth, there are no limits at all. I was subject to limits. I mean, I could only ask somebody for $1,500. So my $1,500 and he could write a $40 million check, and it was ... You know, he's worth 5 billion, so.
- TNTrevor Noah
Wow.
- KBKaren Bass
You know, 100 million is, I don't know, tip money.
- TNTrevor Noah
Wow.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- 22:20 – 26:23
What causes homelessness: economic fragility, seniors, foster youth, veterans, and policy failures
- TNTrevor Noah
What is causing this rise in homelessness? Why is it that you have, just as you said, in the city alone, 40,000 homeless people?
- KBKaren Bass
That's right. Well, you know what? Um, it's important to look at the categories of people that wind up unhoused.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
They might not be able to be in a house because their wages aren't high enough. But it also might be that they've been evicted before, their credit is bad, they were incarcerated. They might be a teenager. You know, there's 9,000 children who are unhoused with their parents.
- TNTrevor Noah
Wow.
- KBKaren Bass
And then there's also a lot of foster children, that when they term out of foster care at 18-
- TNTrevor Noah
They have nowhere to go
- KBKaren Bass
... or 21, they have nowhere to go, or you don't have first and last month's rent. So there's the economically unhoused. But you know, the fastest growing sector of, of homeless people are senior citizens who are in their late 60s and 70s. Maybe they worked in a shopping mall all their life. No 401 [k] , no pension. You can't live here on Social Security-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes
- KBKaren Bass
... if you even have it.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes.
- KBKaren Bass
And then they get priced out of the rental market, and they are homeless.
- TNTrevor Noah
That has to be one of the scariest stats I've read, and in many ways one of the most pertinent, I feel, because when people have conversations about homelessness, I, I've, I've noticed that there is oftentimes a, i- it's almost like a resentment that people have towards the homeless themselves.
- KBKaren Bass
Well, because they believe that they're homeless because of their own fault or bad decisions.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right. But, but when-
- KBKaren Bass
And they don't look at the circumstances.
- TNTrevor Noah
I mean, that says something about a situation that's larger than just, like, people who wanna take drugs and not live anywhere.
- KBKaren Bass
Exactly. And that is a common viewpoint, that everybody who is unhoused is either a drug addict or mentally ill.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
And of course, that does comprise some people. But you know, if I was out on the street for a couple of weeks, I can't tell you I wouldn't use drugs, and I can't tell you that my mental health wouldn't be compromised.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
A lot of times it's the chicken and egg. You know how some people get addicted, they take meth to stay awake at night so they don't get assaulted. You have women w- uh, suffering from domestic violence. You know, there's a lot. You have veterans, and listen to this one. This one's crazy. A veteran winds up homeless because he or she might take veteran benefits.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
Then that means they make too much money to qualify for veteran housing. So they have to choose between their benefits or housing. So all of these reasons are why people wind up homeless. You have a lot of people who were formerly incarcerated.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
And they can't go home because their brother might be a felon.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
And they don't have any place to go, and nobody's gonna rent to them, and no one's gonna hire them. So, you know, it's a lot of circumstances that have led to the explosion. And what I describe is is that number one is the evisceration of the social safety net that we used to have.
- TNTrevor Noah
Which was?
- KBKaren Bass
Really bad ... Well, we had better healt- healthcare in terms of substance abuse and mental health. Um, there were programs that people could be in. And, and LA used to be a heck of a lot cheaper. This city used to be affordable.
- 26:23 – 31:37
Inside Safe and the emergency declaration: motels as interim housing plus fast-tracked construction
- TNTrevor Noah
We're gonna continue this conversation right after this short break. [upbeat music] On day one after winning the race, you, you, you stepped into your role, and the first thing you did was declare a state of emergency.
- KBKaren Bass
Correct.
- TNTrevor Noah
Um, now, as I understand, that, that gives you, uh, a breadth of power that you don't necessarily normally have.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
And it enabled you to do things that you felt needed to be done immediately.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
One of those, which was controversial, and I understand why, is you wanted to get as many people off the streets and into hotels. Help me, help me understand this, and help, help the listeners understand this concept of taking people who don't have homes, you know, unhoused people, homeless people, and then putting them into hotels. Whose hotels are these?
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
Who's paying for the hotels? And why is that even considered a part of a solution?
- KBKaren Bass
Sure. Well, you know, the interesting thing was because we all went through COVID, that's exactly what happened in COVID. So we didn't invent anything new.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
We learned from that experience, and guess what? Nobody was going to hotels or motels during that time, so it was fine. So we're not putting people up in the Four Seasons. We're putting people up in the Snooty Fox. I mean-
- TNTrevor Noah
Right, right
- KBKaren Bass
... in, in motels that are in the community. And I think that the motel owners that didn't want anything to do with us years ago realized this was a pretty good deal. They didn't have to rent their rooms by the day or in some places by the hour.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
They didn't have to do that. They had guaranteed customers, guaranteed tenants all month because we try to rent out the entire motel.
- TNTrevor Noah
Uh-huh.
- KBKaren Bass
And then we contract as the city with a community-based organization. They provide the meals and the social services. So people aren't just left there on their own. Uh, they have counseling, they have, uh, services, and they have three meals.
- TNTrevor Noah
Is this, is this a viable long-term solution?
- KBKaren Bass
No.
- TNTrevor Noah
I, I ... Okay.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
Right, 'cause in my head, I don't think putting people in a hotel forever seems like it's gonna, it's gonna work long term-
- KBKaren Bass
No
- TNTrevor Noah
... even just as a, on a, on a cost level.
- KBKaren Bass
Right. I think it's gonna work for a few years.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay.
- KBKaren Bass
But we are also fast-tracking the building of housing. So that's the big problem here in LA, is that for so many years, the no growth or slow growth movement-
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm
- KBKaren Bass
... restricted building housing, and so we didn't build the housing that we need. For example, the state requires us, has required us, to build half a million units of housing in the next 10 years. Now, I don't know how we're gonna make that happen, but literally we're required to do that, and we will be fined if we do not accomplish that.
- 31:37 – 35:32
Results and bureaucracy: moving people, fixing voucher hurdles, and resisting criminalization
- TNTrevor Noah
How many, how many people have you moved, by the way?
- KBKaren Bass
Uh, in our program of Inside Safe, it's been, and that's where we're getting you in a tent and moving you into a motel.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay.
- KBKaren Bass
It's been close to 2,000, but this year as a whole, we've moved 21,000 off the street, and there's a variety of ways we have done that.
- TNTrevor Noah
21,000 people-
- KBKaren Bass
Right
- TNTrevor Noah
... moved off the streets?
- KBKaren Bass
Right. Uh, so they've moved off the streets because we were given vouchers.
- TNTrevor Noah
Uh-huh.
- KBKaren Bass
And we were able to get people, uh, in housing with those vou- vouchers. That's been one of the problems. Years past, including like last year, LA turned back thousands of vouchers to the federal government because they couldn't figure out how to use them. Some of the red tape has been insane. I'll give you two examples-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah, please
- KBKaren Bass
... made crazy. One is, [laughs] I can't let you use a voucher unless you prove income. Well, you've been on a, in a tent for five years. How do you prove nothing?
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
And then, I can't let you use a voucher because you don't have a government-issued ID. Well, if you gave me a motel, I'd have an address where I could have a government-issued ID. So I went to the federal government, to HUD, and fortunately, our great HUD secretary, Marcia Fudge, who I served in Congress with, uh, spent months talking to them, and now they've waived that. They said, "Well, you know what? I'm gonna assume you're poor enough because you've been living on the streets."
- TNTrevor Noah
Right. Right.
- KBKaren Bass
So that barrier went away, so that allowed people to, uh, to get housed. So-
- TNTrevor Noah
It's, it's so crazy how often you hear that as a story in America. It's like, it becomes the, the cycle. It's, it's really just chicken and the egg, chicken and the egg.
- KBKaren Bass
Yep.
- TNTrevor Noah
Egg and chicken, chicken and the egg. You know, I, I remember hearing a story of a, a man who was living out of his car, and he was sleeping in the car in Santa Monica. And then because he was sleeping in the car, he got fined.
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
Because he got fined-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... he now had to pay the fine. He couldn't pay the fine-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... and so then he got a summons.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
He got a summons to appear in court.
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm.
- TNTrevor Noah
He couldn't go to court because he was gonna either lose his job or go to court, and so then there was a warrant out for his arrest. And then now he had a warrant, and now here you, you have this person who's now basically gonna go to jail possibly, when all they were trying to do-
- KBKaren Bass
Well-
- 35:32 – 42:27
Crime narratives, policing vs prevention, and investing in youth like gangs do
- TNTrevor Noah
It's a, it's a tightrope to walk as mayor, I always think, you know, because you're in this interesting position where on the one hand you have to deal with everything that is happening.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
On the other hand, you have to deal with everything that people think-
- KBKaren Bass
Exactly
- TNTrevor Noah
... is happening.
- KBKaren Bass
Yes. Yes.
- TNTrevor Noah
And the think is oftentimes more powerful than-
- KBKaren Bass
Yes
- TNTrevor Noah
... the what is.
- KBKaren Bass
Yes.
- TNTrevor Noah
If people feel like there's more crime-
- KBKaren Bass
Right
- TNTrevor Noah
... then they, they think there's more crime.
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
So they act accordingly, even if the crime hasn't gone up. And-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... and I, I, I wonder how you deal with that.
- KBKaren Bass
The way I view it is crime is an emotional issue, and if your car was stolen, there's a crime crisis.
- TNTrevor Noah
Oh, yeah. Definitely.
- KBKaren Bass
And you do not care about the data. Or if you go back to what you were saying a few minutes ago in terms of democratic cities, well, the reason why crime is up, it's because we've been too liberal and we don't enforce the law.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes.
- KBKaren Bass
But you could look at Republican-led cities, and the crime is even higher or definitely no difference, regardless of the laws that have been passed. So people right now-
- TNTrevor Noah
Why, why do you think, why do you think, then, the narrative is around Urban cities and democratic cities. What, what, what do you think that is?
- KBKaren Bass
Well, I mean, I think part of it is race. Absolutely. So you ask me the pressure I feel as the nation's second-largest city, absolutely I feel the pressure because the perception is, and, and it is a deliberate narrative that Republicans are good at pushing. So look at New York. 100,000 migrants sent to New York?
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
Well, we have buses coming into LA, but not to the extent of Chicago or New York. You can't tell me that's not done to destabilize those cities. In Chicago, you have a brand-new mayor. He's been in less time than I am. He has to hope to host the Democratic Convention in the next few months. Imagine that pressure. So some of it has been orchestrated and pushed. It's a Republican narrative, and what's, uh, what do we have in common with the large cities? They're predominantly people of color. And so regardless of what the crime rate is, they will say the crime is out of control in-
- TNTrevor Noah
Right
- KBKaren Bass
... Democratic-led cities. Their mur- murder rate is higher. Their crime rate is higher.
- TNTrevor Noah
Well, generally, where there's more guns, there, there are more people being shot.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs] Yeah, you think?
- 42:27 – 47:26
What she can’t stand: inertia, ‘we’ve always done it this way,’ and rebuilding mental-health care
- TNTrevor Noah
When, when you talk about enjoying an exhilarating year of being mayor- I wonder what your most frustrating moments have been. I know you're a very-
- KBKaren Bass
Yeah
- TNTrevor Noah
... positive person.
- KBKaren Bass
Yeah.
- TNTrevor Noah
But I, but I'd love to know what you wish you could have done more of or what you wish you could have done. Like, are there, are there aspects-
- KBKaren Bass
Oof
- TNTrevor Noah
... of your job where you go, "I, I wish I could do this, but I can't"?
- KBKaren Bass
Every day, but I will tell you, um, I wished I knew, uh, what I know now about the bureaucracy, and I'm afraid-
- TNTrevor Noah
Oh
- KBKaren Bass
... that there's so much more [laughs] I don't know. So in other words, I gave you two a- two crazy examples, three if you include the veterans who-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes. Yes
- KBKaren Bass
... don't qualify.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right, the vouchers. Right.
- KBKaren Bass
But there's a lot of internal bureaucracy that is just done because it's always been done, and that's one thing, that's one statement that makes me crazy. We do it this way because we've always done it this way. Well, how's that working out for you? 46,000 people on the street. So d- doesn't it make you think that maybe there's a better way of doing things?
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
So just the inertia of, "Well, this is the way it's always been done," or for people who think, "Well, I can't do something differently."
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
That's where it's been helpful that I never worked for the city before, so I feel like I just parachuted in and this stuff looks crazy. [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- KBKaren Bass
And so, and I'm, I don't believe... I mean, to me, I'm not gonna violate the law, but if it's not a law, then don't tell me I can't do it. If there's people dying on the street, don't tell me I can't get them off the street.
- TNTrevor Noah
Hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
But what our policy basically had been up until now is you have to stay on the street until we build you a house. That's insanity. You asked me whether or not, uh, we would do the motels forever.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
No, it's way too expensive. But what our city did that New York, uh, didn't do, or rather I should say what we didn't do and New York did, New York years ago invested in long-term interim housing.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes.
- KBKaren Bass
And New York also passed a policy that says you have a right to housing. So we never developed long-term interim housing. We said we don't want anybody in interim housing. We want them permanently housed. Well, that's just wonderful, but then you have this bureaucracy that it takes five years to build something. So I've been trying to dismantle all of these bureaucratic hurdles.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
But I had to learn them, and I wished I would've come in knowing about them.
- TNTrevor Noah
What's, what's the one thing you wanna do now? Like, if... I know there's something on your list-
- KBKaren Bass
Yes
- 47:26 – 51:01
Health as the missing lever: how illness drives homelessness and the for-profit shift in care
- TNTrevor Noah
Don't go anywhere, 'cause we got more What Now? after this. [gentle music] If there was one part of your job that you could include, like one thing that you currently don't have-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... under your umbrella but you wish you did, what would it be?
- KBKaren Bass
Health.
- TNTrevor Noah
What would you love to work on?
- KBKaren Bass
Health.
- TNTrevor Noah
What aspect of it?
- KBKaren Bass
It would be the health department. [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- KBKaren Bass
It would be my ability to control the health department and some of the county agencies. Um-
- TNTrevor Noah
But would you, what would you change?
- KBKaren Bass
Well, I, I would definitely infuse, uh, healthcare in much bigger ways. So for example, health is at the root of a lot of homelessness. But right now, homelessness is just viewed as a housing problem. And it's, a- and the disconnect, because, you know, my background, by the way, I have a lot of lives. One of my other lives was working in the emergency room-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes, yes
- KBKaren Bass
... as a nurse and all that.
- TNTrevor Noah
Right.
- KBKaren Bass
PA nurse. And so, uh, I do not understand, it does not compute to me that you don't see the relationship between health and homelessness.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
I met a woman, uh, in a, um, temporary housing who became homeless because she had cancer. So she was sick. She didn't understand why she was sick. She kept missing work. She got fired. She went to the doctor, discovered she had cancer. She didn't have healthcare either.
- TNTrevor Noah
Oh, no.
- KBKaren Bass
So she wound up living in her car, and then she lost her car, and then she wound up living on the street, and I met her as she was on the men, you know, she was in a temporary housing.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
So a lot of health conditions out there. Everybody thinks about substance abuse and mental health.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
But I've seen diabetes. I've seen heart disease. I've seen high blood pressure. I've seen a lot of different health issues.
- TNTrevor Noah
Especially living in a country where people cannot afford to get sick, you know?
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- TNTrevor Noah
That's, that's one of the biggest things I've noticed people terrified of in America. You know, when I, when I speak to random people, when I listen to stories, people will say, "My greatest fear is that I will get sick-
- KBKaren Bass
Right
- TNTrevor Noah
... in this country, because the first thing I need to do is go see a doctor. I don't know if I can afford to do that."
- KBKaren Bass
Right.
- 51:01 – 52:50
The future of LA: proving homelessness is solvable and using mega-events as a catalyst
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah, you, you, you have a, you, you, you take pleasure in, in, in solving the puzzle. Um, before I, I let you go, I'd love to know what now. I mean, we, you know, we've talked a little bit a- about, um, uh, working with the homeless crisis. We, we've talked about, you know, law enforcement and, and its, its broader state right now. But if we look at year two-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... going into year three-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm
- TNTrevor Noah
... and then your final year as, as mayor, what would you hope the people of Los Angeles, and maybe the people in other parts of America would see? Because I think many of the issues in LA-
- KBKaren Bass
Mm-hmm
- TNTrevor Noah
... are mirrors or different versions of issues that you see all across the country. So what would you hope to now do going from year to year?
- KBKaren Bass
Well, I want, at the end of my, uh, term, I want people to believe, to believe that the problem is solvable, meaning it won't be solved, but that they can see the way out of it.
- TNTrevor Noah
Hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
And by the way, I mean, we have the World Cup coming in 2026-
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes
- KBKaren Bass
... a Super Bowl in 2027, two Olympic Games in 2028. So I am hoping that that will serve as a catalyst. I mean, the reason we're getting the Olympics is because we don't need to build any major stadiums.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
So I'm trying to run around and get everybody to say, "When the Olympics comes, we can't hide 70,000 people."
- TNTrevor Noah
[laughs]
- KBKaren Bass
'Cause then you're talking about the county.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yes, yes.
- KBKaren Bass
We can't hide them. The games aren't gonna be for one day.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
So we either solve this now, or what the news coverage is gonna be, wonderful games, wonderful venues, and then they're gonna cut away and show the contrast. In this city, people are living like this.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
They're left to live in destitute.
- TNTrevor Noah
Mm-hmm.
- KBKaren Bass
So I'm trying to get all of the movers and shakers to see this is our alternative, and I actually believe that we can get there. I really do.
- 52:50 – 54:20
Last elected title: why Bass plans to leave office after another term
- TNTrevor Noah
I really, I, I really hope so. Wow. Okay. Well, um, Mayor Karen Bass, it's funny, every time I speak to you, you have a different title in front of your name-
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
... which is, which is really fun for me.
- KBKaren Bass
This is the last one.
- TNTrevor Noah
Um, oh, it is?
- KBKaren Bass
Yes.
- TNTrevor Noah
What, what does, what does that mean?
- KBKaren Bass
This is the last one. That means I'll run for re-election. I'm done with elected office after that.
- TNTrevor Noah
Huh. Oh, now I have to ask why before I let you go.
- KBKaren Bass
Because it, it's enough.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
I mean, I think it's, you know, I think it's, it'll be time. It'll be time, but I will always be involved in change.
- TNTrevor Noah
Okay.
- KBKaren Bass
I'm not somebody that ever planned to do this all my life.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah.
- KBKaren Bass
I was doing a lot before this, so I'll always be involved in change, but I don't need to be an elected official until I die.
- TNTrevor Noah
Huh, I like that for you.
- KBKaren Bass
[laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
I like that, and you know what? You, you, you deserve it.
- KBKaren Bass
Thank you.
- TNTrevor Noah
You deserve it.
- KBKaren Bass
Thank you. Thank you.
- TNTrevor Noah
Well, thank you so much. Congratulations.
- KBKaren Bass
It's great to talk to you.
- TNTrevor Noah
Yeah, congratulations on the year.
- KBKaren Bass
Really appreciate it. [laughs]
- TNTrevor Noah
It's, it's really wonderful seeing you again, and, you know, I hope when we're chatting in a year we'll be celebrating the next achievement and the next one and the next one, and I wish you the best of luck-
- KBKaren Bass
Thank you
- TNTrevor Noah
... because I think everybody wins if you win.
- KBKaren Bass
Thank you. Thank you, thank you.
Episode duration: 54:22
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