JRE MMA Show #81 with Dave Leduc
Joe Rogan (host), Dave Leduc (guest), Jamie Vernon (host), Guest (second in-studio guest or friend) (guest)
In this episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, featuring Joe Rogan and Dave Leduc, JRE MMA Show #81 with Dave Leduc explores bare-Knuckle King: Dave Leduc Brings Brutal Lethwei To America Joe Rogan interviews Lethwei world champion Dave Leduc about his unlikely journey from Quebec baseball player and grappler to the global face of Myanmar’s ancient bare-knuckle fighting art. Leduc explains Lethwei’s extreme ruleset—headbutts, no gloves, suplexes, injury timeouts after KOs, and KO-only wins—and contrasts it with Muay Thai, MMA, and bare-knuckle boxing. They dig into his early hardships, prison fights in Thailand, dethroning Burmese legends in front of tens of millions of viewers, and becoming a national celebrity whose wedding was broadcast across Myanmar. The conversation also touches on training methods, neck and hand conditioning, career plans, psychedelics, obsession, lifestyle choices, and the future of Lethwei in the U.S. via UFC Fight Pass.
Bare-Knuckle King: Dave Leduc Brings Brutal Lethwei To America
Joe Rogan interviews Lethwei world champion Dave Leduc about his unlikely journey from Quebec baseball player and grappler to the global face of Myanmar’s ancient bare-knuckle fighting art. Leduc explains Lethwei’s extreme ruleset—headbutts, no gloves, suplexes, injury timeouts after KOs, and KO-only wins—and contrasts it with Muay Thai, MMA, and bare-knuckle boxing. They dig into his early hardships, prison fights in Thailand, dethroning Burmese legends in front of tens of millions of viewers, and becoming a national celebrity whose wedding was broadcast across Myanmar. The conversation also touches on training methods, neck and hand conditioning, career plans, psychedelics, obsession, lifestyle choices, and the future of Lethwei in the U.S. via UFC Fight Pass.
Key Takeaways
Lethwei is one of the world’s most permissive and brutal striking arts.
It features bare knuckles, legal headbutts, throws and suplexes onto the head, elbows to the back of the head, limited ground strikes, and traditionally no decisions—only a KO wins, otherwise it’s a draw.
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Cultural immersion and respect helped Leduc gain acceptance in Myanmar.
By learning and performing traditional rituals like the ‘Leh Kamun’ eagle-wing challenge gesture and wearing local dress, he turned an initially hostile crowd into fans despite beating national heroes.
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Strategic adaptation can overcome large experience gaps.
Facing vastly more experienced Burmese champions, Leduc adjusted mid-fight—changing his teep targets, using his reach, and emphasizing elbows and headbutts—to neutralize their strengths and win the golden belt.
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Bare-knuckle fighting demands specialized conditioning.
Leduc emphasizes knuckle and finger push-ups, wrist work, bare-knuckle bag work, plus heavy neck and trap training (to absorb headbutt impact and reduce concussion risk) as critical for Lethwei longevity.
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Traditional Lethwei’s ‘injury timeout’ after knockouts is both iconic and dangerous.
In classic rules, a fighter can be revived for up to two minutes after being KO’d—via water, slaps, even ear-biting—and allowed to continue and potentially win, a practice modern promotions like WLC are phasing out for safety.
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Career success followed Leduc’s willingness to abandon safe paths.
Leaving baseball, conventional work, and even Canada, he chose uncertain moves—Thailand, prison fights, a low-paying Muay Thai circuit—that eventually positioned him perfectly when a Lethwei opportunity appeared.
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Lethwei is poised for greater international exposure.
With World Lethwei Championship partnering with outlets like UFC Fight Pass and targeting U. ...
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Notable Quotes
““Nothing good comes out of comfort… hardship.””
— Dave Leduc
““I don’t wanna be champion anywhere. I wanna be champion in the most brutal shit in the world.””
— Dave Leduc
““Welcome to the world of Lethwei.””
— Dave Leduc
““To acquire excellence in anything, it requires a real, genuine obsession.””
— Joe Rogan
““The real answer is we don’t know.””
— Joe Rogan
Questions Answered in This Episode
How sustainable is traditional Lethwei’s KO-only, injury-timeout format for fighters’ brains over a full career?
Joe Rogan interviews Lethwei world champion Dave Leduc about his unlikely journey from Quebec baseball player and grappler to the global face of Myanmar’s ancient bare-knuckle fighting art. ...
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If headbutts were legalized in MMA, how would Leduc’s approach to clinch fighting translate against elite grapplers and wrestlers?
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What are the ethical implications of prison fights where inmates can reduce sentences by winning violent bouts against foreigners?
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Can Lethwei grow globally without losing its cultural identity and extreme rules that make it unique?
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How should a modern professional fighter balance quality of life (where they live, family, health) with access to elite training environments?
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Transcript Preview
3, 2, 1. What's up, Dave? How are you, brother?
And we're live, bitches.
Yes, indeed.
(laughs)
(laughs) You wanted to say that, huh?
Yeah. I- I just thought about it.
Just playing on it?
No.
Uh, thanks for doing this, man. I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me.
Dude, I've watched you fight a bunch of times online and, uh, Lethwei is probably one of the most brutal combat sports in the world.
Yeah.
And it's so interesting watching a guy like you. Uh, uh, are you Que- Quebecois, is that what you said?
Quebecois. You're good.
Yeah, um, from-
How's your French?
It's not bad.
Okay.
It's terrible.
(laughs) It doesn't matter.
It's way worse than I- um, I don't know anything in French.
(laughs)
But y- how do you, how do you go from Montreal to being the king of Lethwei?
Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's, it's a crazy journey, man. And, uh, like, like in a way too, it was, uh, it wa- should we go there right away?
Yeah, let's go there right away.
Yeah, basically, uh, when I was... I, I used to play baseball. I was a baseball... I was a pitcher in Pennsylvania. I was, like, doing a bunch of, uh, uh, like, university baseball, um, traveling team. And then I got into, uh, uh, like, a fight with my father. Uh, shout out to my father, uh, but-
A fistfight with your father?
No. Th- i- it never went physical.
Oh.
But it was, like, going very hard and they said, like, my par- both my parents said, "Dave, please le- please leave." Like, the, "You're," like, "you're kicked out of the house." And he goes s-
Whoa. How old were you?
17, 18.
Wow.
So, like, I had no money and I was, like, uh, like, almost, like, in the str- it was minus four Fahrenheits, so f- for, for you guys, like, minus 20 degrees Celsius. It was like, uh, like... Okay, I call my friend, like, "Come pick me up." And I, I couch surfed for a few months, and, uh, finally got a place. Got my shit together, but then I had, like, a fire. You know, we didn't, we didn't speak for many years. Now, uh, we actually have a good relationship now. But, so then, like... And I believe that nothing good comes out of comfort, right? Like, hardship.
Yes.
So I was, I was... I had a lot of, like, I said, "Fuck baseball" (laughs) . That's wh- like, I wanted to fight.
Because of that?
Yeah, I guess.
That's so crazy.
I told-
So because of getting angry at your dad, that's what made you want to learn how to fight?
It's like... Yeah, resuming maybe like that a little bit.
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