Thomas Tull: From Batman Dark Knight Trilogy to AI and The Rolling Stones | Lex Fridman Podcast #259

The following is a conversation with Thomas Tull, founder of Legendary Entertainment, known for producing blockbusters like Batman's Dark Knight Trilogy, the Hangover franchise, Godzilla, Inception, Jurassic World, 300, and many more. He runs Tulco, which is an investment company that focuses on how artificial intelligence can revolutionize large industries. He is part owner of the Pittsburgh Steelers. He's the guitarist for the band Ghosthounds and tours with the Rolling Stones. But most importantly, he's humble, down to earth, and someone who has quickly become a mentor and friend. This is the Lex Fridman Podcast. To support it, please check out our sponsors in the description, and now here's my conversation with Thomas Tull. In 2004, you founded Legendary Entertainment, known for producing blockbusters like Batman's Dark Knight Trilogy, that includes Batman Begins, Dark Knight, and Dark Knight Rises, the Hangover franchise, Godzilla, Inception, Jurassic World, 300, and the list goes on. It's just some of the biggest movies in history. What does it take to make an epic movie like that? What does it take to make it happen from start to finish?

Well, (sighs) look, I, I have been enamored with movies since I was a kid as a fan, and I think what you need is to, is to be able to tell a great story. And if you're gonna tell a great story, you need a great director, you gotta start with a fantastic script, um, that, you know, is able to take some of these iconic characters that we did and put your own stamp on it while still respecting, uh, the mythology. And, uh, I had zero experience in movies and television before I started Legendary, so it was, it was a very interesting trip. Total luck, uh, that, uh, we had the opportunity to make five movies at the time with, uh, Chris Nolan, who turned out to be one of the greatest filmmakers of all time. But it's, uh, each one is its own little startup company, uh, and I don't think there's any formula to get there, but I know that if you don't have a great director and a great script, if you don't have that foundation, it, it's hard to pull off.

Who's the CEO of that little startup company? Is it the, the director? Who would you say kind of defines the success or the failure of a movie?

Well, when you build a big movie like that, it's an enormous effort 360 degrees. I mean, from digital effects, m- certainly the actors. I mean, if you have an amazing script, an amazing director, but you don't believe anybody playing the parts, that's a problem. So the reason I think it was so difficult to pull off is I always used to say you start with a stack of papers with words on it called a script, bring that to life, and you're asking an audience to believe in everything that you're trying to put out there, and you've got to cast that even if they're immensely talented individually, they have to mesh together and they have to have chemistry together. Um, and, you know, the director is kind of the general on the, the battlefield, but if you have a strong, uh, producer who's very hi- hands on, but it truly to me is each one had its own story and its own sort of how it came to be and why it, why it worked or didn't work.