Nic Carter: Bitcoin Core Values, Layered Scaling, and Blocksize Debates | Lex Fridman Podcast #173

The following is a conversation with Nic Carter, who is a partner at Castle Island Ventures, co-founder of CoinMetrics.io, and previously a crypto asset research analyst at Fidelity Investments. He's a prominent writer, speaker, and podcaster on topics around decentralized finance, and especially Bitcoin. Quick mention of our sponsors: The Information, Athletic Greens, Four Sigmatic, and Blinkist. Check them out in the description to support this podcast. This conversation with Nic Carter is part of a series of episodes on cryptocurrency that is a small journey of exploration I'm on because I find decentralized finance, and especially Bitcoin, fascinating, technically and philosophically, especially because it may be the very mechanism that achieves a global decentralization of power, giving more sovereignty to the individual and making our systems more resilient to corruption, manipulation, and in general, to the darker sides of human nature. Please let me also address something for a few minutes that happened recently that's been weighing heavy on me. If you find me annoying to listen to, please skip to the actual conversation with Nic. I had a recent podcast episode with Anthony Pompliano where we spoke about Bitcoin and life in general for three hours. I was curious, inspired, positive, or at least I tried to be, as I usually do. Someone clipped out, out of context, a short segment of me mumbling (laughs) something about having a PhD, and I started getting mocked online because that made it convenient for people to mock me for being yet another, quote unquote, "expert" who learns about (laughs) Bitcoin and thinks he knows everything. I almost never mention that I have a PhD, except to make fun of myself, as I was doing, or at least trying to do, in the full context of that conversation. I brought up grad school as a random example of one of the many journeys I've taken that was hard, but where the destination was, in itself, not very useful. I was saying I enjoy exploring with a curious mind and I'm willing to be patient, to learn, to listen, to humble myself with knowledge for the sake of knowledge itself. Grad school was an example of that. A PhD means nothing, at least to me. I never call myself an expert, or at least try not to, because that would be dumb because I know how little I know. I'm not a influencer or a thought leader, or whatever else silly self-aggrandizing label people put on their LinkedIn. I try to be the opposite of what I was mocked for. I try to think deeply about the world, to look for the beautiful ideas in the minds of others, and to be inspired by them. I wanted to say all this because psychologically, it struck a bit of a blow. It made me realize that even when I approach things with love, I may be mocked, I may be derided, I may be taken out of context, or even lied about. With a growing platform, this is sadly only increasing. I now have learned that there's people who are waiting for my missteps so they can point the finger, laugh, and say, "See? I told you so. That guy's a joke. He's a fraud." As a fellow human being, the knowledge of this is painful. Yes, I know, people tell me to toughen up, and my life has been about strengthening my mind in the face of my limits, but I refuse to not be fragile and wear my heart on my sleeve. It's who I am. In some sense, this is the immune system of the internet, but let us be careful not to destroy the good ones in the process. The Bitcoin community had to endure many years of attacks from, quote unquote, "experts" and also fraudulent cryptocurrency efforts that scammed people out of their money. This created a powerful immune system that fought the attackers and the scammers. I understand this, and I also understand that one of the beautiful aspects of Bitcoin is its community of humans is decentralized. But some small part of this community has come to enjoy the us-versus-them battles, sometimes for the sake of the battle in itself. This happens in political discourse as well. I understand this, but to my limited mind, it sounds like groupthink, which has powerful defense mechanisms against bad ideas, but has dangerous consequences if taken too far, as in many periods of human history that I often talk about where the us-versus-them thinking has led to the suffering of many. Again, I understand the value of this, as many Bitcoiners explained to me, but it's not the way I, as a sovereign individual, choose to walk in this life. By the way, none of this podcast should be treated as financial advice. Before Nic kindly gifted me with $100 worth of Bitcoin in hardware form, I didn't own any. I'll probably buy some Bitcoin on Cash App, Coinbase, and other platforms, and also transfer to a hardware wallet just to learn how to do it, but other than that, I don't necessarily make wise investment decisions. Money is not a motivation for me personally. I try to avoid it actually. I'm grateful for every day I'm alive no matter how much money is in my bank account. For long stretches of my life, that number was very close to zero, and I was always fortunate to be free and happy. So, I encourage you to listen to people much smarter than me for actual good financial advice. Here, I'm just exploring ideas. And, as if this has not already gone on too long, let me please make another comment on the style of discourse among some Bitcoin maximalists on platforms like Twitter, that in my humble view, I may be wrong, but I believe is not conducive to the nuanced empathetic exchange of ideas I very much look for and enjoy. Again, I appreciate their style of discourse, I think I understand the value of it, but it's not my thing, so I don't want to engage in it. I want to hear the quiet voices in the room.I look for people to inspire each other, and when we disagree, I look for disagreement that is grounded in respect and empathy. I think that mockery and derision destroys the possibility of those nuanced conversations. It drives away the quiet, thoughtful, empathetic voices, and I try to give those voices space to be heard, to shine, to exchange ideas, whether we agree or disagree. So, if I happen to block you on Twitter, I block you with love, honestly. I will never speak poorly of you or even think poorly of you. I would love to hang out in person, give you a big old hug, and talk about life over some beers. If you see or hear me say something stupid, which I'm sure I do often, or something you disagree with, and you still respect me as a human being, please show your love, as I always do to you, but also send me some links to blogs, books, videos, podcasts, where people describe why my stated idea may be totally wrong. I love this kind of long-form disagreement. I humble myself every day by reading books and blogs by people much smarter than me. Sometimes it strengthens my ideas, sometimes it totally changes them, but I always learn. This is a too long way of saying that I'm here trying to walk with grace and with an open mind, a bit of patience, and always love. If I make mistakes, cut me some slack. Like you, I'm only human, allegedly. This is the Lex Fridman Podcast, and here is my conversation with Nic Carter. What philosopher or philosophical idea had a big impact on your life, not just in the space of cryptocurrency, but in general?