How To Work Out What You Want To Want From Life | Kyle Eschenroeder | Modern Wisdom Podcast 189

How To Work Out What You Want To Want From Life | Kyle Eschenroeder | Modern Wisdom Podcast 189

Modern WisdomJun 27, 20201h 34m

Chris Williamson (host), Kyle Eschenroeder (guest), Narrator

The concept of “What do you want to want?” and memetic desireDangers of default desires: fame, extreme wealth, ease, and extraordinarinessReframing struggle: wanting a meaningful life of challenge vs. an easy lifeShifting from wanting to be somebody to wanting to do somethingDeveloping a “frugal heart” and redefining wealth, money, and freedomEmbracing the ordinary, self-acceptance, and shadow work to find true desiresPractical methods to reprogram desires: community, internal scorecards, reflection

In this episode of Modern Wisdom, featuring Chris Williamson and Kyle Eschenroeder, How To Work Out What You Want To Want From Life | Kyle Eschenroeder | Modern Wisdom Podcast 189 explores designing Your Desires: Stop Chasing Defaults, Start Choosing Life Chris Williamson and Kyle Eschenroeder explore Kyle’s long-form essay, “What Do You Want to Want?”, arguing that most people live by unexamined, memetic desires rather than consciously chosen ones. They distinguish between shallow, externally programmed wants (fame, wealth, ease, extraordinariness) and deeper, self-authored desires that lead to meaning and eudaimonia.

Designing Your Desires: Stop Chasing Defaults, Start Choosing Life

Chris Williamson and Kyle Eschenroeder explore Kyle’s long-form essay, “What Do You Want to Want?”, arguing that most people live by unexamined, memetic desires rather than consciously chosen ones. They distinguish between shallow, externally programmed wants (fame, wealth, ease, extraordinariness) and deeper, self-authored desires that lead to meaning and eudaimonia.

Using philosophy, psychology, and personal stories, they show how default wants create lives of regret, like “winning at the wrong game,” and how reframing struggle, success, money, and “being special” can radically change life trajectories. Practical tools include community design, internal scorecards, journaling, and shadow work to uncover and reshape what we truly want.

The conversation is positioned as an “active” episode: listeners are repeatedly invited to examine their own lives, ask what they genuinely want to want, and recognize that programming their desires is tantamount to programming their future.

Key Takeaways

Ask yourself regularly: What do I want to want?

Most of your current desires are inherited from culture, peers, and advertising. ...

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Beware of living by default, memetic desires.

Memetic desire (wanting what others around you want) can lead you to invest your life in goals—careers, relationships, status—that you never truly chose, resulting in “winning at the wrong game” and deep regret.

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Choose a life of meaningful struggle over an “easy” life.

Research on stress, retirement, and post-traumatic growth suggests that embracing challenge makes us more alive, resilient, and satisfied; chasing comfort and ease often accelerates decline and drains life of meaning.

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Shift from wanting to be somebody to wanting to do something.

Fame and attention are fragile, addictive, and place your happiness in others’ hands. ...

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Replace the pursuit of extreme wealth with cultivating a frugal heart.

Money is like gasoline for a road trip: essential but not the point. ...

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Let go of the obsession with being extraordinary; respect your own experience.

The drive to be “special” often breeds self-contempt and disrespect for ordinary life. ...

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Use environment and practices to reshape your desires over time.

Choosing communities that embody your aspirational values, keeping an internal scorecard, journaling, and doing shadow work (examining traits you hate in others or quiet whims in yourself) help gradually align what you want with what nourishes you.

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Notable Quotes

If we don't cut to the core and program our wants, our desires, then our best-case scenario is to be the most successful, rich, or famous slave.

Kyle Eschenroeder

You can win the game and then realize you were playing the wrong game the whole time.

Kyle Eschenroeder

The modern devil is cheap dopamine.

Naval Ravikant (quoted by Kyle Eschenroeder)

My life is for itself and not a spectacle.

Ralph Waldo Emerson (quoted by Kyle Eschenroeder)

When you are so interested in your own game, you don't care about the score on a game you're not playing.

Kyle Eschenroeder

Questions Answered in This Episode

Which of my current major life goals might actually be memetic desires I never consciously chose?

Chris Williamson and Kyle Eschenroeder explore Kyle’s long-form essay, “What Do You Want to Want? ...

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If I fully embraced struggle as meaningful rather than cursed, what decisions in my life would I change this year?

Using philosophy, psychology, and personal stories, they show how default wants create lives of regret, like “winning at the wrong game,” and how reframing struggle, success, money, and “being special” can radically change life trajectories. ...

Get the full analysis with uListen AI

Am I more focused on being seen as somebody or on actually doing something that matters to me, even if no one notices?

The conversation is positioned as an “active” episode: listeners are repeatedly invited to examine their own lives, ask what they genuinely want to want, and recognize that programming their desires is tantamount to programming their future.

Get the full analysis with uListen AI

What would cultivating a ‘frugal heart’ look like in my daily routine, relationships, and financial choices?

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Which traits in others trigger the strongest dislike in me, and what might that reveal about disowned desires or fears in myself?

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Transcript Preview

Chris Williamson

(wind blowing) Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back. Kyle Eschenroeder in the building. How are you doing, man?

Kyle Eschenroeder

Very well. How are you?

Chris Williamson

Very, very well indeed. I'm happy to have you on. It's been a long time coming. First and foremost, for the listeners that don't know who you are, why, why do you think that I'm speaking to you today? Why do you think I reached out?

Kyle Eschenroeder

Oh, man. Um, that's, you know, that's a good, that's a very good question.

Chris Williamson

(laughs)

Kyle Eschenroeder

Um, (laughs) I may have had a lapse of, uh, lapse in judgment. Um, no, I, I, I actually, you know, I think it's an interesting time. I know you, you found this article, um, about asking ourselves the question, what do we want to want? Um, s- you know, has a lot to do with, with, um, reevaluating, uh, our values, um, and, and our desires. And I think, you know, a lot of us are being forced to do that, uh, throughout the, this, this COVID situation. So, um, it's s- kind of a good time to talk about, um, talk about that and, and, and see if we might be able to do it in a more strategic or skillful way.

Chris Williamson

I think you've answered my, my reasons pretty accurately there, man. Yeah, I, um, I stumbled across your blog post, What Do You Want to Want, on your blog, um, and I was blown away, man. It's a 60-minute read or so, and I absolutely adored it. And I was (exhales) 10 minutes in, and I was already scouring around online trying to find your email address, and it turned out that you already followed me on, on Twitter, which made everything an, an awful lot easier. Um, so yeah. I have got you on because I, I just wanna go through this blog post. It's one of the most, uh, fundamental concepts that I've never heard spoken about before, and I think there's an awful lot of people listening, I know a ton of audience members, who will really benefit from this. So that's, that's why we're here. We're gonna go through it. So first things first, why is working out what you want to want important?

Kyle Eschenroeder

So I think, um, mostly 'cause you don't wanna live a life that you regret at the end of it, right? Um, (laughs) uh, and I think, I think that when we, when we follow our kind of, uh, default desires, we're much more likely to, to find ourselves at a place in life, um, that we didn't really want to or, or mean to get to. Um, so, so I think, uh, I think that's, you know, that's kind of a, the, the, the big one. Um, but, but then also, I mean, there's, there's a lot of things along the way, um, it's not like, uh, that, that, that can benefit from, from asking ourselves this question.

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