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Building Hardware and Taking on the Phone Giants with Carl Pei

People often say that building a hardware company is like “playing on hard mode”. Building a hardware company during a global pandemic, with the unpredictability of supply chains and markets, is harder than hard. Trying to penetrate the phone market in particular – where only a few players own almost all the market share – is REALLY hard. In today’s episode we chat with Carl Pei, founder of Nothing. Between Nothing and previously co-founding OnePlus, Carl has twice managed to do what many others have failed to do. Nothing has sold over 1m units and built a team of over 400. In this episode, Carl chats with us about why he’s at it again, what it takes to successfully build hardware, and how he thinks about making technology fun again. Topics Covered: 00:00 - Introduction 02:30- The hardware market 03:12 - Breaking into the phone market 05:42 - Securing factories and stakeholders 08:08 - Differentiating products 11:14 - Hardware design 12:37 - Strengthening software proposition 17:04 - Table stakes 19:01 - Marketing and Youtube 20:51 - Underestimating the value chain 23:15 - Manufacturing 24:56 - Supply chain 27:24 - Remote work 29:19 - The future of hardware 32:39 - Breakthrough hardware 34:42 - Making tech fun again Resources: * Nothing website: https://us.nothing.tech/ * Nothing’s Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/@NothingTechnology * Find Carl on Twitter: https://twitter.com/getpeid * Find Nothing on Twitter: https://twitter.com/nothing * Nothing’s recently launched Ear (2): https://us.nothing.tech/products/ear-2 Stay Updated: * Find a16z on Twitter: https://twitter.com/a16z * Find a16z on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/a16z * Subscribe on your favorite podcast app: https://a16z.simplecast.com/ * Follow our host: https://twitter.com/stephsmithio Please note that the content here is for informational purposes only; should NOT be taken as legal, business, tax, or investment advice or be used to evaluate any investment or security; and is not directed at any investors or potential investors in any a16z fund. For more details please see a16z.com/disclosures.

Carl PeiguestSteph Smithhost
Apr 6, 202339mWatch on YouTube ↗

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At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

Carl Pei on Building Nothing and Challenging Phone Giants

  1. Carl Pei says the phone market is dominated by a few incumbents, startups have repeatedly failed there, and Nothing decided to attempt it because he believes nobody else will.
  2. Nothing began with earbuds as an easier product to earn credibility with factories, supply chain partners, and investors before moving to smartphones, a strategy Pei describes with an iceberg model.
  3. Pei says the company differentiates first on transparent, coherent hardware design, then software design, then user experience, with technology as the only real long-term moat.
  4. He describes hardware's hidden difficulties, including long value chains, prepayment demands from suppliers, a failing factory, the semiconductor shortage, and bulk component ordering mistakes.
  5. Pei argues for in-person work at a young hardware company, values community involvement including shareholders and a board observer, and wants Nothing to invent a breakthrough category within ten years, likely at the intersection of hardware, software, and AI.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Startups can start with an easier product to earn credibility

Pei says previous failed phone startups cost factories money, so Nothing launched earbuds first to prove design, manufacturing, and sales ability before pursuing smartphones.

Design is a wedge, but not a strong moat

Pei says design is the only thing a small company can differentiate on early, and users cite it as the top reason to buy, but long-term defensibility has to come from technology funded by free cash flow.

Hardware punishes underestimating the value chain

Pei says a project depends on about ten teams working together, and a break in any link breaks everything, while cash flow is especially hard for young companies.

Small companies face harsh supplier terms

Without a track record, suppliers demand prepayment, sometimes months ahead, and convincing them to work with you is almost like pitching investors.

Marketing is about finding the next arbitrage

Pei says early adopters of a channel such as Facebook ads gained an edge before prices rose, so Nothing seeks channels like YouTube where it can show behind-the-scenes content that other phone makers don't.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

I think it might sound a little bit pretentious, but I think if I don't do this, and if we don't do this, then nobody will.

— Carl Pei

Technology is the only real moat for a tech company.

— Carl Pei

For me, it's always about finding what's next, uh, what's the next arbitrage opportunity so that we can have an unfair advantage compared to the, the bigger companies.

— Carl Pei

We really had to swallow our pride in the beginning, and just, like, with our tails between our legs, just go and beg, just beg everywhere.

— Carl Pei

There's a lot of people like us who are tech fans out there and who remember being Apple fanboys and fangirls, and now just feeling like the magic is lost and just wanting to recreate the magic.

— Carl Pei

Breaking into the phone marketIceberg strategy and starting with earbudsTransparent hardware design differentiationSupply chain and cash flow challengesMarketing as arbitrage and YouTubeCommunity ownership and shareholdersFuture of hardware and AI

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