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ADHD Chatter Podcast

Legendary comedian CLASHES with Doctor wife over ADHD legitimacy - Paul Whitehouse Dr Mine Conkbayir

This week, Alex sits down with Dr Mine Conkbayir and legendary comedian Paul Whitehouse.

Dr. Mine ConkbayirguestAlex PartridgehostPaul Whitehouseguest

May 20, 20241h 6mWatch on YouTube

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CHAPTERS

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Chapter summaries

Nature vs nurture: Mine's traumatic upbringing and family
Alex asks whether ADHD is nature or nurture. Dr. Mine describes a violent, unstable childhood and her view that her ADHD stems from trauma. She also discusses her parents, her mum's reaction to the diagnosis, and her therapist.
- •Mine says nature and nurture are inextricably linked but that in her case it was nurture
- •Her parents couldn't self-regulate, so there was no co-regulation for her
- •She believes her dad had ADHD, but it's tangled with drug and alcohol addiction
- •Her mum responded to the diagnosis by saying it wasn't her fault
- •Mine describes a 2017 breakdown, anxiety, and OCD such as fear of contaminated water bottles
Is ADHD the wrong name? Disorder vs difference
Paul notes the history of the terminology, from hyperactive kids to ADD to ADHD. Mine says there is no evidence it's a disorder, and Alex proposes replacing 'disorder' with 'difference'. Paul questions how well they have done in a world set against them.
- •Paul traces the terms from hyperactive kids to ADD to ADHD
- •Mine says there's no evidence it is a disorder, citing the DSM-5 text revision
- •Alex suggests dropping disorder in favor of difference
- •They say the world is set up for neurotypicals
- •Alex credits privilege and self-awareness for how he has coped
Alex's alcoholism, addiction and ADHD
Alex speaks about his alcoholism as a coping mechanism for undiagnosed ADHD and hearing about ADHD at AA. Paul plays devil's advocate, and Mine responds that outcomes depend on protective factors and that poverty and the education system disadvantage many children.
- •Alex says alcohol nearly killed him and was a coping mechanism for undiagnosed ADHD
- •He first heard about ADHD in AA meetings
- •He links ADHD with addictions to alcohol, sugar, work, food and sex
- •Paul accuses them of celebrating the condition
- •Mine says ADHD hits children in poverty hardest and schools mislabel them
ADHD in comedy and The Fast Show
Alex asks about ADHD in the comedy community. Paul describes an open mic night where many acts announced their ADHD, says The Fast Show suited an ADHD-style pace, and argues the mobile phone has made everyone a bit ADHD.
- •Paul describes half the open-mic acts opening with 'I've got ADHD'
- •A friend said The Fast Show was tailor-made for ADHD
- •Mine notes there was a lot of addiction and ADHD among the people involved
- •Paul says short clips and memes resemble The Fast Show's style
- •He believes smartphones have made everyone a bit ADHD
Does Paul have ADHD? Stimming, self-regulation and anxiety
Mine says Paul has ADHD, citing humming, lip-licking and coffee. Paul resists the label, argues the definition is too broad and says he is good at self-regulation. They discuss hyperactivity, anxiety, and Paul's reasons for not seeking an assessment.
- •Mine points to humming, tics and heavy coffee drinking
- •Paul says he sings rather than hums and that he doesn't care if he has ADHD
- •Mine says ADHD is a difficulty in self-regulating that precedes executive function difficulties
- •Alex says hyperactivity can be internalized
- •Paul says he sees no point in an assessment and does well as he is
Rejection sensitivity and Mine's need for stimulation
Alex raises rejection sensitivity dysphoria in their relationship. Mine and Paul discuss her quick anger, her reaction to perceived slights, and Paul's theory that she cannot be comfortable in calm because of her childhood.
- •Mine says she relates to RSD and can't let accusations go
- •Paul says she picks up on perceived insults and escalates arguments
- •Mine says anger covers sadness and pain
- •Paul suggests she needs noise and stimulation because of how she grew up
- •Mine says she avoids emails and letters with negative content
Different ADHD presentations and a better name
Paul questions how Mine and Alex can both have ADHD while behaving so differently. Alex says anxiety is the common core, and they debate renaming it. Mine argues that children are being over-medicated and that self-regulation depends on early co-regulation.
- •Paul says one narrow definition covers a wide range of behavior
- •Alex says if you've met one person with ADHD you've met one
- •Alex sees anxiety as the middle of the Venn diagram
- •Paul jokes about 'hyperactive anxiety condition' and Mine rejects it
- •Mine says the limbic system can't be bypassed and children are being medicated unnecessarily
Managing dysregulation and the positives of ADHD
Mine describes how she manages emotional dysregulation, including daily gym sessions, and lists her ADHD strengths. Paul and Mine discuss C-PTSD and its overlap with ADHD, and the way her nervous system makes calm hard.
- •Mine uses candles, deep breathing, walking and long gym sessions to stay calm
- •She names ideas, a deep sense of injustice, loyalty and passion as positives
- •Paul points out the gap between her work on self-regulation and her own difficulty
- •Mine says C-PTSD and ADHD overlap and the link is poorly understood
- •She describes panic on a voodoo tour in New Orleans
Social battery, cancelled plans and friendships
Alex describes his social battery running out suddenly. Mine explains how anxiety and a need for routine led her to cancel trips, costing her a friendship. Paul says he keeps long-standing friends but values time alone.
- •Alex leaves parties without saying goodbye and feels guilty afterward
- •Mine cancelled holidays at the last minute and lost a 20-year friend
- •She describes strict routines, packing her own food and avoiding socializing
- •Mine says she now finds it safer to stay away from people
- •Paul has friends going back decades but likes his own company
Paul's creativity, comedy and masking
Paul explains where his creativity comes from: musical parents, moving from Wales to London, and comedy influences. They discuss characters versus personas, Gone Fishing as his closest show to being himself, and whether comedians use performance as a mask.
- •Paul's parents sang, and his accent change led him to do voices
- •He names Harry Enfield, Monty Python and Vic and Bob as influences
- •Characters give performers many lives, while personas are lived continuously
- •Gone Fishing is unscripted and grounding for him
- •Alex suggests comedians mask feeling different, and Paul and Mine agree it is plausible
The ADHD item: Mr. Dynamite and a sense of justice
Alex asks for the ADHD item, and Mine chooses a stick of dynamite for her ability to explode from zero to a billion. The conversation turns to whether her strong sense of injustice is an ADHD trait and Paul praises how she defuses tense situations.
- •Mine says dynamite represents going from zero to a billion in milliseconds when prompted
- •Paul says she and her mum go from nought to fury in seconds
- •Mine wonders whether her sense of injustice is ADHD or early trauma
- •Paul says she calms mothers who are about to hit a child by asking if they need help
Washing machine of woes: a husband who doesn't believe in ADHD
A listener who was diagnosed at 45 says her husband doesn't believe in ADHD. Mine, Paul and Alex offer ideas on explaining it. The discussion leads Paul to voice his skepticism about the definition, with anxiety as the common thread.
- •Mine suggests explaining that people with ADHD process things differently and a bit of understanding helps
- •Paul suggests she say she isn't using it as an excuse and acknowledge his frustration
- •Alex says ADHD is an explanation but not always an excuse
- •Mine says the diagnosis helps her work on behaviors
- •Paul argues hyperactivity can be useful while anxiety is the key problem
Catering to ADHD in schools and closing questions
Mine describes how she let students learn comfortably, ignored behavior rules and met them with relational care. She and Paul answer final questions about admiration, humor, and their most impulsive acts, including late invoices and a herbal remedy containing deadly nightshade.
- •Mine let students wear hoods, chew gum and learn outdoors
- •She says nobody was excluded and her approach was relational
- •She would tell a child with ADHD to celebrate their differences
- •Her most impulsive act was rushing to cash year-old invoices and being late for a webinar
- •Paul's was drinking Dr Potter's Herbal Asthma Remedy containing deadly nightshade

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