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Dalton + MichaelDalton + Michael

Building A Big Company: Non-Obvious Insights

In this episode of Dalton + Michael, the two discuss the risk a startup faces when: 1) it successfully made something people want but 2) the startup is at risk of hitting a "local maximum." To build a huge company a startup often needs to change direction/strategy *post* product-market fit. D+M discuss some examples of companies that executed on strategy changes post-PMF including Facebook and DoorDash. Dalton + Michael is brought to you by ‪@Standard_Cap Dalton Caldwell on X: https://x.com/daltonc Michael Seibel on X: https://x.com/mwseibel

Dalton CaldwellhostMichael Seibelhost
Jan 18, 202622mWatch on YouTube ↗

At a glance

WHAT IT’S REALLY ABOUT

How founders scale beyond PMF with strategic, risky bets

  1. Pre–product-market fit (PMF) founders should ignore most strategy and focus on talking to users and building something people want.
  2. Post-PMF, repeating the same execution-only playbook can trap a company in a local maximum, where growth stalls despite a good product and revenue.
  3. Building a huge company often requires discontinuous, high-conviction strategic bets (expanding market scope, platform shifts, bundling, acquisitions) rather than incremental “hill climbing.”
  4. Being a mid-ranked player in a winner-take-most market is typically far worse than founders assume, because value and revenue tend to concentrate and late players can trend toward zero.
  5. Founders should set strategic targets using real “comps” from proven winners and prepare for credible competition from Big Tech once they become large enough to matter.

IDEAS WORTH REMEMBERING

5 ideas

Pre-PMF: strategy is often a distraction; shipping and learning wins.

They argue that before PMF you lack reliable customer and market models, so “high strategy” creates paralysis; the correct move is to build, talk to users, and make something meaningfully better.

Post-PMF: execution alone can trap you in a local maximum.

What gets you to the first $1M–$10M can be different from what gets you to $100M–$1B, and many companies stall by only optimizing the existing product and go-to-market motion.

Scaling to ‘huge’ often requires discontinuous bets that feel risky.

Facebook’s expansion beyond .edu, the mobile pivot, platform bets, and acquisitions (e.g., Instagram) illustrate that step-change moves—not incremental improvements—can define the trajectory to massive outcomes.

“We’re worth one-tenth of the leader” is usually a dangerous illusion.

They claim mid-tier players in concentration markets commonly trend toward negligible revenue/value because advertisers, network effects, and distribution advantages compound to the top few players.

Optimize for long-term market outcomes, not just the next fundraising milestone.

They observe founders sometimes make choices that improve short-term fundraising narratives but reduce the probability of reaching IPO-scale revenue and public-market valuations.

WORDS WORTH SAVING

5 quotes

Pre PMF you just need an idea, and you just need to make something that people want.

Michael Seibel

Post PMF, if all you do is that same pre PMF strategy, you can end up in a local maxima.

Michael Seibel

There is this false belief that if I can make $10 million, I can make $100 million, I can make $500 million.

Dalton Caldwell

If the winner is generating 500 million in revenue and we're generating 50 million... I think that the assumption is you're gonna trend towards generating no revenue.

Michael Seibel

You have a sea of public startups... Can we just talk about someone who's really put points on the board?

Michael Seibel

Pre-PMF vs post-PMF decision-makingLocal maxima and growth ceilingsStrategic bets vs incremental iterationWinner-take-most market dynamicsBundling pressures (HRIS, Slack/Zoom)Using public-company comps and “real winners”Competing with Big Tech (Google/Microsoft/AWS)Customer switching costs and stickinessCase studies: Facebook, DoorDash, Slack, Amazon

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