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The Diary of a CEOThe Diary of a CEO

Vanessa Van Edwards: The Weird Trick That Makes People Like You

Are you sabotaging yourself with terrible communication habits and unconscious body language? Unlock the secrets of human connection to cultivate charisma, forge deeper connections, and eliminate awkward small talk for good. Vanessa Van Edwards is a behavioral researcher and the author of Cues, Captivate, and her new book, Conversation. She returns to decode the underlying dynamics that shape relationships, providing actionable techniques to bypass social autopilot. She helps master non-verbal cues to prevent communication friction from harming your career and personal life. In this episode, she explains: ■ The Conversation Blueprint: How to navigate the three distinct psychological levels of interaction ■ The Autopilot Trap: Why socially scripted questions like "How are you?" or "What do you do?" actually destroy connection. ■ The Mechanics of Rizz: The exact science behind conversational turn taking, why speaking for more than 45 seconds creates friction. ■ Command with Body Language: How to instantly project warmth and competence by finding your maximum resonance point. ■ The Five Story Archetypes: How to decode the psychological narratives of the people around you. 00:00:00 Intro 00:02:11 How to Connect With Anyone 00:03:20 Why Great Conversation Is a Superpower 00:06:41 The 3 Questions That Build Instant Connection 00:17:59 The Fastest Way to Build a Real Connection 00:23:45 How to Get to Know Someone Fast 00:32:41 Why Genuine Curiosity Makes You More Charismatic 00:35:32 The Questions That Secretly Kill Conversations 00:40:40 What’s Worse: Talking Too Much or Too Little? 00:44:15 How to Know If You Talk Too Much 00:45:22 How to Spot a Conversational Narcissist 00:48:34 Ads 00:55:11 How to Know If You’re a Conversational Narcissist 01:08:50 The Real Reason First Dates Go Wrong 01:13:47 Can You Go Too Deep Too Quickly? 01:18:03 How to Rewrite the Story You Tell Yourself 01:22:50 The Psychology of Taking Control of Your Life 01:25:16 Ads 01:30:02 What Science Reveals About Luck and Success 01:36:04 The 5 Personality Archetypes Explained 01:42:36 Why Your Personality Changes How You Should Communicate 01:51:45 The Psychology of the “Unlucky Struggler” 01:55:43 How to Escape an Awkward Conversation 01:59:08 How to Build Aura and Rizz 02:00:30 How to Become More Charismatic 02:04:51 The Hidden Habits That Kill Your Charisma 02:08:59 What “Aura” Actually Means 02:13:21 The Eye Contact Trick That Builds Connection 02:16:11 How to Become an Exceptional Listener 02:22:23 Who This Book Was Really Written For Let Steven know if you feel “lucky” here! https://doyoufeelluckychallenge.web.app/ Follow Vanessa: YouTube - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/4sKjzqT Instagram - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/8fFNJdo TikTok - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/CWueu1F You can pre-order Vanessa’s book, Conversations here: https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/A69YXE2 The Diary Of A CEO: ◼ Join DOAC circle here - https://doaccircle.com/ ◼ Buy The Diary Of A CEO book here - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/BWjLTZK ◼ Shop The Diary Of A CEO collection: https://thediary.com/collections/shop ◼ Get email updates - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/5IB1H6E ◼ Follow Steven - https://link.thediaryofaceo.com/AGU9QP4 Sponsors: Fiverr - https://fiverr.com/diary and get 10% off your first order when you use code DIARY Shopify - https://shopify.com/bartlett

Vanessa Van EdwardsguestSteven Bartletthost
Sep 10, 20262h 26mWatch on YouTube ↗

CHAPTERS

  1. 2:14 – 6:47

    The connection crisis: why conversation skills are becoming “career insurance”

    Vanessa frames modern loneliness and tech-driven isolation as a growing “connection crisis,” arguing that conversation is a learnable skill with compounding benefits. She contrasts performative talking (trying to impress) with the more fulfilling goal of discovery and understanding.

    • Conversation as the vehicle to promotions, dating success, friendship, and wellbeing
    • Symptoms of poor conversation: dread, overthinking, leaving misunderstood
    • Shift from “impress” to “discover” to avoid performative small talk
    • Why conversation matters more as people socialize less and rely on tech
  2. 6:47 – 12:00

    What science says about better openers: ditch “What do you do?”

    Vanessa shares her speed-networking research with 500 participants, showing that scripted questions produce awkwardness and dead ends. She explains why “What do you do?” performs worst, and why questions that spark emotion and story create immediate engagement.

    • Speed-networking experiment ranking conversation starters
    • Worst openers: “What do you do?” and “How are you?” (autopilot + facts)
    • Best openers: “Highlight of your day,” “Working on anything exciting?” and “Fun plans coming up?”
    • Facts are ‘stop signs’; stories are ‘doorways’
  3. 12:00 – 18:04

    The 3-level conversation blueprint (Level 1): traits, story, and ‘conversational confetti’

    Introducing a three-tier framework, Vanessa explains Level 1 as essential groundwork—basic traits—but upgraded with story and emotion. She adds tactics for competing with distraction, including creating ‘information gaps’ that pull attention away from phones.

    • Level 1 = general traits; you can’t skip it, but you can do it better
    • Swap fact-checking for story prompts (passion projects, exciting work, plans)
    • Competing with the feed: dopamine-worthy prompts and ‘conversational confetti’
    • Information-gap technique (Howard Stern-style ‘weirdest/most surprising’)
  4. 18:04 – 36:48

    Conversation shortcuts for leaders and teams: reducing communication friction at work

    Steven challenges the practicality for busy founders and introverts; Vanessa argues great Level 1 banter reduces friction and increases productivity. She offers a simple team ritual to build connection fast without derailing meetings.

    • Connected employees collaborate better; friction costs money
    • You don’t need Level 3 with everyone—work thrives on strong Level 1
    • A weekly ‘tell me something good’ meeting opener (time-boxed)
    • Avoiding toxic positivity while still inviting real emotion and story
  5. 36:48 – 41:21

    Answering boring questions better: breaking scripts and crafting a compelling ‘what do you do’

    Vanessa explains how to handle inevitable scripted questions by reframing them into curiosity-generating answers. She introduces a clear formula and cautions against jargon or vague complexity that burns ‘conversation calories.’

    • ‘Been busy?’ as a conversation killer and how to break the script
    • What people are really asking when they ask ‘What do you do?’
    • Simple formula: ‘I do X for Y by Z’ + a small curiosity hook
    • Multi-hyphen and career-pivot answers as hero stories
  6. 41:21 – 45:22

    Conversation mechanics: turn-taking, overtalking, voice notes, and tech’s impact

    Shifting to mechanics, Vanessa cites research on ideal speaking-turn length and how monologues derail connection. She argues podcasts, asynchronous voice notes, and speaking to AI are warping our conversational ‘muscle.’

    • Ideal turn length: ~15–30 seconds; 45+ becomes monologue
    • Under-talking as ‘conversational scarcity’ vs over-talking risks
    • Why voice notes are ‘selfish conversation’ (no turn-taking)
    • Societal decline in daily socializing and rising loneliness
  7. 45:22 – 48:34

    Do you talk too much? spotting cues and fixing conversational narcissism with curiosity

    Vanessa gives practical diagnostics for overtalking, including reviewing Zoom recordings and watching for nonverbal ‘open fish’ cues. They discuss conversational narcissism, its insecurity roots, and how assertive curiosity and turn-taking repair dynamics.

    • How to self-audit: timing your speech in recorded calls
    • Nonverbal signs: ‘open fish’ mouth cue, checking out, lack of feedback
    • Conversational narcissism often driven by insecurity and fear of silence
    • Antidote: assertive curiosity + inviting reciprocity (‘Is it my turn?’)
  8. 48:34 – 1:12:31

    Level 2 connection: motivations, dream-building, and avoiding dream-killing logic

    Vanessa defines Level 2 as personal concerns—goals, values, worries—and introduces ‘dream building’ as a way to deepen connection. Steven explores how hyper-logical, truth-driven styles can accidentally ‘dream kill’ and reduce warmth.

    • Level 2 = motivations and worries: what gets you up and keeps you up
    • Dream-building prompts: ‘What are you learning?’ ‘Biggest goal right now?’
    • Pet vs pest projects (pride vs shame) and the need for safety
    • Dream-killing via premature fact-checking/logic; warmth builds credibility
  9. 1:12:31 – 1:17:46

    First dates and social media: why too much pre-knowledge makes conversations awkward

    A debate on asking for Instagram vs a phone number becomes a case study in skipping Level 1. Vanessa argues curated feeds create a false sense of knowing someone, pushing dates unnaturally into Level 2 and increasing awkwardness.

    • Instagram as performative context that steals the joy of discovery
    • Skipping Level 1 makes first-date banter harder and more forced
    • Dating apps are limited-context and can still work for connection
    • Using a ‘YAP challenge’ to practice concise, turn-friendly answers
  10. 1:17:46 – 1:26:21

    Level 3 self-narrative: contamination vs redemption and rewriting your story

    Level 3 is reserved for close relationships and focuses on the story you tell yourself about your life. Vanessa explains contamination vs redemption narratives, how they shape wellbeing, and how conversation can help people re-author their frame.

    • Vulnerability regret: why Level 3 must be gated and contextual
    • Contamination narrative: hardship as permanent, victim-of-circumstance framing
    • Redemption narrative: resilience, agency, and meaning-making
    • Narrative hints: ‘always/never’ language, silver-lining framing, luck talk
  11. 1:26:21 – 1:35:09

    The ‘Are you lucky?’ question: revealing locus of control, optimism, and safety

    Vanessa introduces ‘Are you lucky?’ as a deceptively casual Level 3 ‘sneaker’ question that reveals deep traits. They unpack the three typical response types and connect luck to behavior patterns shown in Wiseman’s research.

    • Three response types: yes/no/hesitant and what each signals
    • How to respond without toxic positivity—curiosity over correction
    • Wiseman’s findings: ‘lucky’ people behave differently (openness, lower anxiety)
    • Luck as frame vs facts; using questions to predict behavior patterns
  12. 1:35:09 – 1:55:43

    Five narrative archetypes: how story patterns shape work, love, and communication

    Vanessa shares five self-narrative archetypes that influence behavior and relationship dynamics. She explains how each archetype communicates and what motivates them, from ambitious heroes to unlucky strugglers.

    • Ambitious hero: progress-driven, shiny-object risk, burnout tendencies
    • Contented pragmatist: tradition, stability, ‘if it’s not broken’ mindset
    • Selfless helper: service-based identity, boundary struggles, attracts takers
    • Creative disruptor & unlucky struggler: contrarian challenge vs victim framing
  13. 1:55:43 – 1:59:08

    Graceful exits: ending awkward conversations using the peak-end effect

    Vanessa emphasizes that endings matter as much as first impressions due to the peak-end effect. She offers a practical script combining a future cue with a compliment/action plus nonverbal disengagement to exit cleanly.

    • Peak-end effect: people remember the peak and the ending
    • Exit formula: future cue + compliment/action + ‘exit voice’ tone
    • Nonverbal cues: step back, angle toward the door, physical disengagement
    • Avoid lingering awkward endings that damage charisma
  14. 1:59:08 – 2:19:19

    Building aura, rizz, and charisma: warmth signals, voice resonance, eye contact, and listening

    They define aura/rizz as being easy to talk to and powerfully present, rooted in warmth plus competence. Vanessa details practical charisma levers—clear liking signals, taking up space, vocal resonance, nuanced eye contact, and responsive listening cues.

    • Charisma = clearly broadcasting liking + competence you can rely on
    • Winner energy: posture/space, slower cadence, calm presence
    • Voice: ‘maximum resonance point’ (speaking on the out-breath)
    • Eye contact nuance (60–70%); listening cues like lower-lid flex and head tilt
  15. 2:19:19 – 2:26:25

    Preparing for better conversations + who the book is for + closing reflection

    Vanessa’s final advice is to prepare for recurring questions with generous, story-forward answers that invite ‘me too’ moments. She closes by describing the book’s audience—people dreading small talk—and reflects on personal sacrifices and loneliness as a new mom.

    • Pre-write better answers to the questions you get asked most
    • Design answers that create openings, not dead ends (conversational generosity)
    • Book is for anyone who dreads small talk, networking, or first dates
    • Closing tradition question: sacrifices, loneliness, and choosing community

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