Why Kids Lie and What to Do About It

1. 0:00 – 0:01

   Intro

   1. BEDr. Becky0:00

      [keyboard clacking]

2. 0:01 – 1:32

   Good Inside Membership: the platform and what parents get

   1. BEDr. Becky0:01

      Why is it so hard to find reliable answers to parenting questions? How is it in 2022 parents still search on Google for answers from strangers? [keyboard clacking] Well, now there's a better way. Introducing the Good Inside Membership, an expert-guided, community-powered platform redefining modern parenting. In our library, you'll find hundreds of bite-sized videos, articles, scripts, and workshops tackling the trickiest parenting topics, and it doesn't stop here. We've created a private community guided by me, Dr. Becky, and coaches trained in the Good Inside Parenting method. Here, you can ask questions, connect with other parents, or attend a live event on a topic that matters to you. This is the parenting handbook that doesn't exist. This is parenting advice at your fingertips, where you need it, when you need it the most. This is Good Inside Membership. Hi, I'm Dr. Becky, and this is Good Inside. I'm a clinical psychologist and mom of three on a mission to rethink the way we raise our children. I love translating deep thoughts about parenting into practical, actionable strategies that you can use in your home right away. One of my core beliefs is that we are all doing the best we can with the resources we have available to us in that

3. 1:32 – 2:54

   Framing the episode: “lying” vs imagination and storytelling

   1. BEDr. Becky1:32

      moment. So even as we struggle, and even as we are having a hard time on the outside, we remain good inside. Today, we'll be talking about lying. Well, I should say we'll be talking about a subset of lying that's pretty close to storytelling. So those moments where your child says to you, "I drove the bus home from school today," or you overhear your child saying to a friend, "I eat chocolate for breakfast every single day." What do we do in those moments? I know for me, as a parent, I have the urge to say, "That's not true" and then I can see the power struggle that's going to happen between me and my child, and yet if I hold back those words, I sometimes worry, am I colluding? Am I creating a child who's going to be a liar throughout their life? So what can we do in these moments, and what is really happening for our kids under these stories, and what are our kids looking for? We go into these questions and more in this episode, so let's jump in. Our first caller is Kim. [phone ringing]

4. 2:54 – 3:59

   Caller 1 (Kim): a 4-year-old’s nonstop ‘innocent lies’ and how to teach honesty without shame

   1. P(Parent 1 (unnamed)2:54

      Hi, Dr. Becky. My name is Kim, and I live in Southern California with my four-year-old and one-year-old boys. My question is regarding the four-year-old. He's been recently, um, telling stories, and what I mean by that is that he is telling outright lies. I can see that he has the most innocent and sweet intent. These lies aren't malicious at all. Most of the time it's things like, "Mommy, I saw a Komodo dragon in my house that's really far away," or, "Sometimes I go to the store by myself and buy lots of candy." I think he's genuinely just exploring his imagination and perceived control and independence. But sometimes I sit back and realize that for the last 30 minutes to an hour that we've been talking, he's been doing nothing but lie. Most of the time it's random thoughts and ideas, but other times he answers direct questions with something that is obviously not true and then gets upset if I push back on his response. So my question is, how do I encourage this hobby that he has of storytelling and creativity, but also teach him the importance of honesty without introducing any shame? Thanks so much.

5. 3:59 – 6:30

   Development lens: play is kids’ “workspace” and reality/fantasy boundaries are blurry

   1. BEDr. Becky3:59

      Hi, Kim. Thank you so much for calling in, and you're really kind of raising a topic that I think is so important 'cause you're talking about pretend play and fantasy and the role that pretend play has for kids exploring different identities, different feelings, different experiences, and then you're also highlighting, okay, I see that, but where is the line between pretend play and kind of a flat-out lie? Is there a line at all, and what do I do? So a couple big ideas that I think we can use as a foundation. The line between fantasy and reality is not as clear for kids as it is for adults, right? I think you and I know there's no way you saw a Komodo dragon. I think you and I know there's no way you could have even gotten to the store on your own, forget even buying candy. Our reality kicks in so quickly as adults, and there's somewhat of a benefit to this, right? We're all very in touch with what's actually real in front of us, and I think actually if we all pause, there's something we really lose by the time we're adults, which is the ability to kind of really get wrapped up into a world of wonder and imagination. I think it would benefit you to just kind of look at your son with awe, right? In terms of, wow, you really can get wrapped up in this whole other world. The other thing that's really important to remember about kids is that kids learn in play. This is their workspace for life. This is where they can figure out how brave they can be. This is where they can express different parts of themselves. This is where they can kind of push the limits. Kids who push the limits in play through fantasy tend not to push the limits as often with a sibling or on the playground with a friend because they have a safer space. And so what I hear from you is a kid who's exploring so many things in the exact medium we'd kind of want a kid to explore in, the safety and limitlessness of play. So what now? And I know you asked a great question.

6. 6:30 – 8:32

   Response strategy: join the story to uncover the real theme underneath

   1. BEDr. Becky6:30

      What do I actually do? How do I respond? So I would say first, Kim, full permission to enter into this world. I think a lot of us, we see something our kids are doing now, and then we project 10, 20, 30 years from now, and we worry what that's gonna look like, and then actually respond based on the worry instead of what's right in front of us. So we think, "Oh, I don't want my 30-year-old son to be talking about komodo dragons he hasn't seen," right? Let's come back today. Your son is almost four, and entering into a world of komodo dragons is totally developmentally appropriate. So enter that world with him. "Mom, I saw a komodo dragon." "Oh, you did? Tell me more." And see where your child goes, and assume there's something in this story that's important to my child. My child's expressing something, experimenting with something. So you might ask, "What happened? Are komodo dragons kind of nice or mean? Oh, they're mean. Oh, were you, were you scared? Oh, you weren't scared. Huh, you saw this big, dangerous dragon, and you weren't scared. Tell me about that. How did you get not scared? What did you say to yourself? What happened next?" And yes, I'm entering to the world of my child and his komodo dragon, but I have to be honest, Kim, I'm wondering if your child is truly building coping skills to deal with jumping into a pool and swimming, something that feels scary, or dealing with a peer interaction or with a bully at school. Our kids create scenarios in play and often want us to enter into those scenarios with them, to work through very real-life situations and themes that they can't so easily put words to. Now, I do think there's a little trick sometimes I do with kids that helps me feel better in

7. 8:32 – 9:53

   The “whisper voice” technique: reality-checking without rupturing play

   1. BEDr. Becky8:32

      knowing, okay, my kid knows this isn't real. Because after an hour of talking about the komodo dragon or about what kind of candy they got at the store, I just wanna make sure we're on the same page. And you're right, so many kids experience it as intrusive if we say, "You know this didn't really happen, right?" And then there's a whole meltdown that ensues. I find a whisper voice to be incredibly effective in seesawing between entering into pretend play and having one kind of toe in the world of reality. So I could see talking about, "Oh, what candy did you get at the store?" And then at some point, I just say this in a whisper to my child. "Wait, you can't really go to the store on your own, right? I just wanna make sure that we're all being safe. Just making sure. Okay, tell me more about the candy." You don't even need your child to respond and confirm, and there's something about a whisper that's really less intrusive, and you're not taking your child out of pretend play. You're kind of just creating a different narrator on the outside, and children often don't react as harshly to that, again, because it doesn't take them out of the world they're currently living in. [gentle music] Let's hear from our next caller, Kaya. [phone ringing]

8. 9:53 – 12:20

   Caller 2 (Kaya): conflicting needs—one child’s stories vs an older sibling needing “the truth”

   1. P(Parent 2 (unnamed)9:53

      Hi, Dr. Becky. My name is Kaya. Um, I have three boys, five-year-old, almost four-year-old, and six-months-old. Um, I actually have two questions for you today. So firstly, [laughs] my almost four-year-old has a very active imagination. Um, I think a lot of the time it feels really real to him. Like, if there's something that he wishes were true, he'll tell me that his teacher taught him that. Sometimes it's, like, kind of important that he know it's not true or, like, it's going against something important that needs to happen in our house, or he'll tell a story that obviously didn't happen, like, "My teacher brought us to New York." Uh, I don't know, et cetera, et cetera. And then my older son will be like, "Really, Mommy?" So then I'm kind of caught in this place, like, of respecting that it feels real to him, not wanting to confuse my older son, who's very gullible and innocent and, um, believes everything everyone says. You know, sometimes when it's, "You know, my teacher told me I don't have to brush my teeth," that kind of thing, like, I don't really know how to respect that it's real to him and important to him but counter it when I need to or let his older brother know in front of him that it's not real. And I'll say things like, "I know you really wish," or, "Wow, that would be fun," or, "That feels really real to you, doesn't it?" And he gets really upset. "No, Mommy, it is real. It is real." So I'd just love if you had any scripts or ideas about that. Thank you so much. Thank you for everything.

   2. BEDr. Becky11:19

      Hi, Kaya. Thank you for calling in, and I'm really struck by your thoughtfulness in how you laid this all out. You seem really to have a really solid grasp on what's going on for your kids, and then you also note you're kind of in an impossible situation where you want to see the wish under your child's story. And yet it seems like you're sometimes caught in an impossible situation where your other child looks to you to be the arbiter of truth, and if you do assert your sense of reality, you're gonna say something that's going to really ignite or activate your other child. What a tricky situation. So two things come to mind. I have found myself in a very similar situation with my kids, where I hear one of my kids say something that, like you, I'm thinking, "There is no way this is true." And then my other child says, "That's not true, right, Mom?" And I'm looking

9. 12:20 – 13:53

   Navigating the sibling audience: tolerate the meltdown and name the conflict out loud

   1. BEDr. Becky12:20

      at my first child saying, "If I say this isn't true, I just am going to watch the meltdown ensue." Now, first of all- We don't have to change what we say to avoid a meltdown, so give yourself that freedom. There are some times we're allowed to say, "Look, I wanna be honest with both of you. I think there's something important there, and no, I don't think, sweetie, that that's actually entirely what happened." Now, my child might get upset, and I might say back to that child, "I know that's not what you wanted me to say. You and I are really going to talk later and figure this out." Right? We, we have to remind ourselves our job isn't to balance the seesaw all the time. Here's something else I can imagine saying with the example of my teacher said I don't have to brush my teeth, and then another one of my kids is saying, "Is that really true? Your teacher said that? Mom, is that true?" I could see myself just naming the conflict in front of me. It might sound like this. "Hmm, you know what? I find myself in a really tricky situation right now. I hear you. There's definitely something about not brushing your teeth and about your teacher that is real and important. Ugh, and also, I'm not ready to say, 'Yes, your teacher said that. That is true. Your teacher said you don't have to brush your teeth.'" [sighs] And

10. 13:53 – 15:44

    Teach the skill indirectly: model wishful thinking and a “recovery” process

    1. BEDr. Becky13:53

       then pausing. I'm kind of doing something complicated, but I'm kind of doing something really simple. I'm just naming aloud the conflict I'm having, and I find our kids do really well when we're willing to name what's true in that moment. Now, the other thing I would start doing, Kaya, outside of the moment is modeling some of this kind of storytelling yourself and then verbalizing a type of recovery. So okay, what would that look like? Let's say it's the end of the day and you're with your son, the one who can tell these stories. I might say out loud something like this. "Oh, I'm so glad I finished all my work and all my emails tonight. Ugh, yeah, that's definitely true, right? Yeah, that's definitely true. I definitely finished it all. It's definitely true. Ugh, wait. I really wish it was true. Ugh. Now that I'm thinking about it, I have a couple more emails. I'll probably have to stay up late after the two of you go to bed. Ugh, I really want it to be true. You know what? It's not true. That's okay. I can cope with it." What I'm really doing is I'm modeling a process for my son that I hope he gets to, but I'm not doing it in such a direct way that he's going to reject it and say back to me, "Mom, I'm not lying. What are you talking about?" That's often a go-to strategy of mine. I kind of notice something my child struggles with in a repeated way, and I think, "How can I make it my own?" And then model kind of solidarity and model also a reasonable coping mechanism that my child can slowly absorb from me. [gentle music] And now our final caller, [phone ringing] Lauren.

11. 15:44 – 18:03

    Caller 3 (Lauren): concerning ‘false accusations’ of being hurt—protect trust and avoid unfair blame

    1. P(Parent 3 (unnamed)15:44

       Hi, Dr. Becky. My name is Lauren. I'm from Cleveland, Ohio, and I have two boys, two-and-a-half years old and fifteen months old. And I first just wanna say thank you so much for all you do because truly you've helped me so much be the best parent I can to these little boys, and we're all so grateful. My question is about my two-and-a-half-year-old. Recently, he's been coming to me a lot telling me what I know to be lies about someone hurting him. So oftentimes he's upset about something. Sometimes he's not upset, and he will come to me and tell me that his dad pushed him or his brother hit him. And frequently, I'm present for the situation or I know it's not true because I've seen the interaction, or I know, like, his dad's not even home with us, so that can't be the case that his dad hurt him or something. My, my concern is how to respond to these situations. I know that lies can-- I think lies can be developmentally appropriate, so I'm not looking to stop him telling these stories. But I want to be responding in the correct way because I don't want to encourage him to tell me things that are false, and I don't want there to be negative repercussions for whoever he is accusing of hurting him. However, I don't wanna discredit his experience of coming to tell me something that is wrong. I don't want him to feel like he can't come and tell me if someone has hurt him or if something bad has happened to him. So I'm struggling with the right way to respond to what he's telling me, and I was really curious to hear what your thoughts were and if you had any advice to help. Thank you so much. I appreciate it so much.

    2. BEDr. Becky17:32

       Hi, Lauren. I really appreciate you sharing all of this with us. This is a really good example of, again, where our kids share stories. They're trying to communicate things. They're trying to work through things, and yet they're doing it in a way that's childlike, right? That doesn't have a coherent story the way we might, but where they're putting different pieces out there, where they're using play. And so I have a couple ideas

12. 18:03 – 20:04

    Information-gathering inside the story: investigate themes and possible real-world sources

    1. BEDr. Becky18:03

       of how to respond, and like you said, meet your child where they're at and also kind of separate the dynamics around the play from the reality of what's happening. So the first thing I think that's important to establish is just to explore the idea, is any of this happening maybe somewhere else, right? Is there something at daycare? Is there something on a p-... playground. Has my child one time been pushed by a bigger kid in a sandbox, and it's going over and over and over in my child's mind, and they're playing around with it in play to get mastery over it? So I think that's important to establish, because the themes our kids hold onto, there may be a place that's actually playing out, but again, our children don't have the language to explain it to us in that way. This is a reason I think at first we enter into the play. When your child is saying, "Oh, my brother hit me," I'd say this: "Oh, where was that? Where on your body did you get hit? How much did it hurt? This much? This much? This much? As big as something can hurt? Wow, does it still hurt now? Huh, what happened next? What happened before the hit? Tell me more about that. Where were you?" Right? So I'm collecting information, not only because I'm trying to be a detective in case something, quote, "actually did happen," but either I am learning more about an experience that might have happened, or I'm learning more about the role or identity my child is looking to explore. So for example, I've seen kids explore this kind of victim or helpless role when they're in a stage of hitting, of biting, of kind of getting in trouble. That can be really, really common. I'm always the kid who feels like they're doing something wrong, and now here comes the stories of

13. 20:04 – 22:05

    Validate the disclosure process (not the facts) and use pretend play to work the theme

    1. BEDr. Becky20:04

       being hit, of being hurt. They're kind of exploring the other side of that equation, and we want them to understand that side of the equation, what it is to be cared for, what it is to feel hurt. So when I'm asking questions, I'm actually allowing my child to learn more about that role. The other thing I would say to your child, and this speaks to your desire to keep lines of communication open, is kind of words like this: "I'm so glad you're coming to talk to me about this. Everything you tell me, we can talk through." Now if you notice, I didn't say, "I know that happened," or, "Oh, I'm going to get your brother in trouble for hitting you." I'm not actually speaking to the content of what my child said. I'm speaking to the process of coming to talk to me about something that feels vulnerable, and that's what we really want to reinforce. One more idea. I think when you're playing with your child, you can introduce these themes in pretend play. So let's say you have a pig and a horse character, and you're playing, and the two animals are clearly separated. Maybe your son has the horse and you have the pig. I'd say something like this: "Ooh, horse just hit me. It hurts so bad." Right? When clearly these two farm animals had plenty of space, and this didn't, quote, "really happen." Just watch what your son does. Right? Maybe your son will say, "That didn't happen." "Yes, it did. It really, really did. I know it did." Right? And again, if you're resonating with, yeah, my son does kind of get in trouble, maybe you explore that. "I think horse needs to go into the corner and wait while I play alone." Again, you're kind of introducing themes into play that your child is trying to work through in real life. Or

14. 22:05 – 25:24

    Wrap-up takeaways: play as learning, whisper voice, and identifying the ‘role’ beneath the lie

    1. BEDr. Becky22:05

       you can do it this way: "Ooh, horsey hit me," and whisper to your child, "Huh, did horse really do that? What do you think should happen next?" And you're letting your child direct play, but you're actually working in the same circuit that comes up with you around the storytelling. [instrumental music plays] Let's tie this all together with three takeaways. One, kids learn in play. Play is where kids explore and try on new roles and literally play around with themes that feel scary or unfamiliar in their real lives. So often this means storytelling or pretending. When we use this framework, we think more about how to help kids figure things out in play and less about how to reprimand them for lying. Two, I love using a whisper voice in play. Whispering is a way to narrate or direct play or ask your child important questions around their play without interrupting play or intruding on the important processes that are happening. It's okay if whispering in this way feels awkward. Remember, anything we do that feels uncomfortable is a sign that we're doing something new in our bodies, and new is a sign of change, and that's often a really great thing. Three, think about the role your child is exploring in the stories they tell that feel like lies. Are they taking on a helpless, faultless role? An all-powerful, in total control role? When we're willing to look beneath the content on the surface, we can learn so much about what our kids are trying to figure out and develop inside themselves. So give yourself permission to put the lying label to the side, and tell yourself instead, "There's important information here that my child is trying to communicate." [instrumental music plays] Thanks for listening to Good Inside. Let's stay connected. At goodinside.com, you can sign up for workshops and subscribe to Good Insider, my weekly email with scripts and strategies delivered right to your inbox. And for more ideas and tips, check out my Instagram, drbeckyatgoodinside. Good Inside is produced by Beth Rowe and Brad Gage, and executive produced by Erika Belsky and me, Dr. Becky. Please rate and review our show. Let us know what you think and what resonated. I actually do read each and every review, so please know that your feedback is meaningful to me. Let's end by placing our hands on our hearts and reminding ourselves, even as I struggle, and even as I have a hard time on the outside, I remain good inside. [instrumental music plays]

Episode duration: 25:37