#1 Parenting Psychologist: What Is Over-Parenting & Are You Doing It?

1. 0:00 – 2:57

   Intro

   1. SPSpeaker0:00

      It used to be you have a baby, develop the secure attachment, and that's it. Our job is not to fix, it's to be there. She has a podcast called Raising Good Humans.

   2. SPSpeaker0:10

      Psychologist Aliza Pressman.

   3. SPSpeaker0:12

      Not only can you not be perfect, but it's actually worse for your kids. I feel like discipline is so controversial. I think of it as all feelings are welcome, all behaviors are not.

   4. JSJay Shetty0:21

      Should everyone be a parent?

   5. SPSpeaker0:23

      Whoa. [upbeat music]

   6. JSJay Shetty0:28

      We're thrilled to announce that we've reached three million subscribers. We're incredibly grateful for each and every one of you. If you enjoy this episode, don't forget to hit that subscribe button so you never miss out on any of our new releases. We're dedicated to bringing you the content you love. Our team carefully analyzes what resonates most with you to bring on board the best experts and storytellers to help you improve your life. Some of your favorite topics are sleep science, weight loss, physical fitness, navigating breakups, habit building, and understanding toxic relationships. Upcoming episodes include one of the biggest names in health and science, world-renowned relationship therapist, and your favorite manifestation expert is back to drop new findings. Hit subscribe to not miss any of these episodes. If you think of someone who would love this episode, send it to them to make their day. The number one health and wellness podcast.

   7. SPSpeaker1:26

      Jay Shetty.

   8. SPSpeaker1:26

      Jay Shetty.

   9. SPSpeaker1:27

      The one, the only Jay Shetty.

   10. JSJay Shetty1:29

       [laughs] Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose. I know that you come back here every week to become happier, healthier, and more healed, and it's my commitment to go and find experts, thought leaders, and thinkers that can help you on your journey to make better decisions, to change habits, and to transform your mindset. Now, I don't think there's potentially a more important topic than the one we're discussing today, because I think raising good humans, raising the future generation, and learning how to improve ourselves in the process is probably one of the most life-changing journeys that any of us ever go on. And today's guest is someone who has so many great insights, so many great takeaways, so many wonderful methods that we can all apply in our daily lives to become better at being a good human and raising good humans in the process. I'm speaking about Dr. Aliza Pressman. She's a developmental psychologist with nearly two decades of experience working with families and their healthcare providers who care for them. Aliza is also the host of the podcast, Raising Good Humans. If you're not listening already, go ahead and subscribe. And today we're talking about her new book that's out, called The Five Principles of Parenting: Your Essential Guide to Raising Good Humans. Please welcome to On Purpose, Aliza Pressman. Aliza, it's great to have you here.

   11. SPSpeaker2:52

       I'm so thrilled to be here.

   12. JSJay Shetty2:53

       Oh, thank you for being here. Honestly, I'm, uh, really excited to dive in, as I've been

2. 2:57 – 5:50

   Should You Be A Parent?

   1. JSJay Shetty2:57

      talking about, and I wanted to get straight into this-

   2. SPSpeaker2:59

      [laughs]

   3. JSJay Shetty3:00

      ... because I have so many questions I want to ask you, and I want to start off with what I believe is the most important one, and I feel in our society is often missed, forgotten, avoided, not even a thought. And the question is, should everyone be a parent?

   4. SPSpeaker3:19

      Whoa. [laughs] Um, I don't think we can presume to say what anybody should or shouldn't be, other than the, whatever your definition of good human is. And so if that entails bringing kids into this world, if that's your calling, I think you must do it in whatever way that works out. But not everybody wants that, and it's a, it's, you know, it's a, an assumption that we probably shouldn't be making.

   5. JSJay Shetty3:48

      Hmm. Absolutely. For those who want children or have always thought they've wanted children, what would you encourage people to think about before diving in? Because I often feel that, like so many things in society, whether it's the degree we end up studying or the job we get out of college, or getting married, or having children, it almost feels like we're on a conveyor belt, and we don't really stop to pause and reflect, which I know is one of your key principles. We don't often stop and think, "Should we? Are we ready? What are the qualifications? What's useful?" And, and we just dive in.

   6. SPSpeaker4:25

      Yeah.

   7. JSJay Shetty4:25

      And, and it's interesting that, you know, and I've heard many people talk about this. I think I spoke to Kristen Bell and Dax about this at one point, and they were talking about how, like, you just get to come back from a hospital with a baby. [laughs]

   8. SPSpeaker4:35

      I know. It's crazy. [laughs]

   9. JSJay Shetty4:37

      And there's no exam, there's no test, and like, you spend all these years studying for a degree, or you spend a couple of years practicing how to drive or whatever it may be, but all of a sudden, you have a baby without a license and nothing else.

   10. SPSpeaker4:47

       Yeah.

   11. JSJay Shetty4:47

       And so what are some of the things you'd encourage people to think about even before becoming a parent that you think would help them in the process of being a parent?

   12. SPSpeaker4:56

       I mean, ideally, we all are thinking about this before we become parents because it just, that reflection of like, "How did I get here? How do we come to be who we are?" Which I think is the sort of crux of what developmental science is, is how do we get to be who we are? And what then happened in that process that I want to bring to parenting, and what do I want to let go of? And if you take the time to reflect, then you can be intentional about your parenting.

   13. JSJay Shetty5:28

       Mm-hmm.

   14. SPSpeaker5:28

       So the idea that we can do this before we have kids, if you are in a position to talk to your partner about that and really think through that, talk to yourself about that, you can have a mission statement for how you want to be as a parent.

   15. JSJay Shetty5:43

       Mm-hmm.

   16. SPSpeaker5:43

       It's not like what your kid's gonna be like, 'cause you have no idea [laughs] what your kid's gonna be like. That's a fantasy that you can decide,

3. 5:50 – 7:15

   Secure Attachment Relationships

   1. SPSpeaker5:50

      but we, we can't. They are, whatever seed is planted is planted, and that flower blooms. But we have so much capacity to be intentional, and so that reflection before you're even- ... trying to have kids is so beneficial, and it's actually linked with secure attachment relationships.

   2. JSJay Shetty6:08

      Hmm. Oh, wow. Talk to me about that connection. I didn't realize that.

   3. SPSpeaker6:12

      Yeah, so one of the things in the research on human development is that having a secure attachment relationship with your child or with, you know, as the child has with one caregiver, and that is, you know, a whole other or probably part of this conversation, it's so deeply protective. It buffers the impact of trauma. It's so important. And not everybody grew up with that. So about 65% of us came from secure attachment relationships. If we didn't, and we reflect back, and we think through what was going on, how we came to be, who we are, how we learned how to be loved, how we experienced love, how we gave love, we then have a much higher chance of turning what could have been just an autopilot to a different kind of relationship into this secure attachment.

   4. JSJay Shetty7:06

      Hmm. Now, I know what everyone's thinking right now. They're thinking, "Aliza, I wish you had told me this-

   5. SPSpeaker7:09

      [laughs]

   6. JSJay Shetty7:10

      ... five years ago. You'd have saved me." Right? Like, I feel like a lot of our listeners may have already had children

4. 7:15 – 11:07

   Parental Guilt Explained

   1. JSJay Shetty7:15

      and, and it's natural. Again, I'm not judging anyone. It's, it's, uh, it's such a part of our community and society. And, and then I think a lot of people, especially our community, who is really smart and thoughtful and intentional and listens and goes, "You know what? Actually, I, I realize that, but I've already had children now, and I feel like I've made mistakes," what are some of the most common mistakes people come up to you with where they're feeling guilt and shame?

   2. SPSpeaker7:38

      Yeah.

   3. JSJay Shetty7:39

      And I, and I feel so sad for that because, again, you couldn't have known. You didn't know, and now that you know, as Maya Angelou said, "Now you know better, you can do better." What have you seen are some of the biggest mistakes people carry around as guilt and shame when they're par- when they have become parents?

   4. SPSpeaker7:55

      Well, I think, uh, so importantly, attachment relationships are dynamic. So you aren't just like... It used to be we used to think, like, you're either, you know, you have a baby, you develop this secure attachment, it's like a bond, and that's it. But we know now it's dynamic. And so if you have a five-year-old or a 16-year-old or a 35-year-old, you can still grow that healthy attachment relationship. So you can change, and that's what your audience knows all the time, and it's true about f- relationships with your kids. But I think that shame is from thinking, like, "I wasn't there enough." There's shame in not being able to fix whatever your child's going through. And what I hope everybody, like, gets from certainly this conversation is that our job is not to fix. It's to be there, and that's what secure attachment is. Even in your adult relationships, it's like, "Who can sit with me through all of these experiences, through these feelings?" Because we're not... Like, the idea of being happy isn't really about always being happy. It's about knowing you can come back from whatever it is that you're going through-

   5. JSJay Shetty9:14

      Mm

   6. SPSpeaker9:14

      ... and you will be happy again.

   7. JSJay Shetty9:15

      Mm.

   8. SPSpeaker9:15

      And if our kids experience the range of things that come their way, and they know that they have someone sort of sitting by their side, they end up in this relationship that is securely attached, and it's not like one and done. And if it didn't, you know... That's the thing that I think is the trickiest is feeling like, "I'm responsible for my child's constant happiness. I have to feel ashamed if I wasn't there for every moment or if I couldn't fix that feeling," which you can't, as you know. And, um, and I think sometimes people feel like they're maybe better or worse at different stages.

   9. JSJay Shetty9:53

      Hmm.

   10. SPSpeaker9:54

       And so there's, you know, like, this assumption that we're gonna kinda know what to do. Like, the idea that you do come home from the hospital and you're just like, "Okay. I guess." [laughs]

   11. JSJay Shetty10:06

       [laughs]

   12. SPSpeaker10:07

       I just feel like in adulthood this happens all the time. Like, I remember just the first time I was, you know, in my 20s, and I had my own apartment, and I was like, "Wait, I can just decide what I'm doing? I can open a bottle of wine?"

   13. JSJay Shetty10:20

       [laughs]

   14. SPSpeaker10:20

       Like, there were things that I still was like, "I'm gonna..." It, it's bizarre.

   15. JSJay Shetty10:24

       Yeah.

   16. SPSpeaker10:24

       And now, like, that I'm the last, you know, person in charge of whatever, and there's nobody that I'm supposed to ask, and I can make a decision, I'm still kind of like-

   17. JSJay Shetty10:33

       Hmm

   18. SPSpeaker10:33

       ... "Is that okay?" [laughs]

   19. JSJay Shetty10:35

       Yeah.

   20. SPSpeaker10:35

       And so the idea that you're just, like, in charge of raising a whole human being or more is really daunting.

   21. JSJay Shetty10:44

       Mm-hmm.

   22. SPSpeaker10:45

       And we all kind of think everybody else knows.

   23. JSJay Shetty10:48

       Mm-hmm.

   24. SPSpeaker10:49

       We don't know.

   25. JSJay Shetty10:50

       Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I, and I think I... Those two things really resonated with me, this idea of, "I wanna fix all their problems, and I'm not there for them enough." And I can feel like I can obviously only relate to them theoretically from a parenting standpoint, but I can relate

5. 11:07 – 15:31

   Building Resilience

   1. JSJay Shetty11:07

      to them in my other relationships-

   2. SPSpeaker11:08

      Yeah

   3. JSJay Shetty11:09

      ... so whether it's with my younger sister or whether it's with my wife or whether it's with the people I love in my life, and I can only imagine how that is amplified with a child. That's your, uh, you know, that feeling. And so how do you carry that weight and almost loosen that control-

   4. SPSpeaker11:30

      Mm-hmm

   5. JSJay Shetty11:30

      ... that is naturally, it feels so gut instinct correct, right? It doesn't feel like that's a bad idea.

   6. SPSpeaker11:38

      Yeah.

   7. JSJay Shetty11:38

      It feels like that's the best thing, that's what you were made for, and then you're failing at it. And so how, how are you... how do you do what you just said? How do you carry that weight, at the same time as recognize that you need to put it down?

   8. SPSpeaker11:51

      I mean, I think that that's where the idea of repair and the what we know about repair comes in, is that in the same way that we build muscles, like you need tiny little ruptures in the muscles to grow stronger muscles. We have to have- ... tiny moments of disrepair, of not being exactly the right parent, of not being able to fix the feeling, of the feeling being really, really hard, of the experience being a fail, in order to grow stronger relationships.

   9. JSJay Shetty12:26

      Mm.

   10. SPSpeaker12:27

       And so I think taking the weight off is much more easy, or comes by more easily, when you remind yourself, like, "I'm actually building this muscle-

   11. JSJay Shetty12:37

       Mm

   12. SPSpeaker12:37

       ... for my child and for me."

   13. JSJay Shetty12:39

       Mm.

   14. SPSpeaker12:40

       So every mistake is, is to me this like, okay, I just, because you have this relationship, because you're invested, because you're intentional, you're gonna blow it. You're not gonna be able to fix it. You're going to feel like, "Oh my God, did I ruin my kid?" And no, you invested in resilience building because you're there. If you were like, "Oh, well," you know, like, "Rot and suffer," that's a totally different thing [laughs] but nobody listening to this is, is that.

   15. JSJay Shetty13:08

       Yeah.

   16. SPSpeaker13:09

       And so I think that lifts the weight of not only can you not be perfect, and not only can you not fix everything, but it's actually worse for your kids.

   17. JSJay Shetty13:18

       Mm.

   18. SPSpeaker13:18

       And it is important to acknowledge what you said, which is it's still appropriate to want to.

   19. JSJay Shetty13:24

       Mm.

   20. SPSpeaker13:25

       Of course. Like, you, you should... I think we all want to, to help the people we love, and, and it's, it is amplified with the people that you are raising because it's like, "I can make this better."

   21. JSJay Shetty13:39

       Mm.

   22. SPSpeaker13:39

       "I have capacity to change this, to call the school, to call the friend, to change the system, to move, to whatever." But when we can get a little bit more sort of accepting of the fact that it is so hard to watch someone struggle, but when they're struggling next to you, and you can be there for them and help them understand that that is part of being a person-

   23. JSJay Shetty14:04

       Mm

   24. SPSpeaker14:04

       ... it's not dangerous.

   25. JSJay Shetty14:06

       Mm.

   26. SPSpeaker14:06

       Feelings are not dangerous. You're giving them such a gift that that's where I think you can let go of the weight.

   27. JSJay Shetty14:13

       Wow. Yeah, I think, when I'm listening to you, I'm thinking it takes almost the same amount of energy to shame yourself as it does to shift yourself.

   28. SPSpeaker14:25

       Oh, wow, yeah.

   29. JSJay Shetty14:26

       Right? This idea of, "I'm going to sit here and keep replaying the mistake I made, and the wrong thing I said, and how I messed up in this moment."

   30. SPSpeaker14:35

       Mm-hmm.
6. 15:31 – 17:03

   The Risks Of Over-Parenting

   1. JSJay Shetty15:31

      I really want them to get-

   2. SPSpeaker15:32

      Yeah

   3. JSJay Shetty15:32

      ... this opportunity." So our life becomes this mirror projection of what I've called before the gifts and gaps in our life. So if our parents gave us gifts, we, we want them to have those same gifts, and if our parents left gaps, we wanna fill those gaps for the kids. And so in that mindset, how does that mindset create challenges and issues, and how do we actually tweak and refine that?

   4. SPSpeaker15:58

      I mean, I think we over-correct. And so if we're reflective and we can say, "Okay, this is the thing I really didn't have and I really want my kids to have, but let me be aware that that doesn't mean that I should forget about, for example, boundaries." You know, if I didn't receive a lot of affection, and love, and connection, am I going to be so worried that I'm not giving enough of that to my child that I'm scared of the limits and boundaries that are necessary for their safety? I think that happens all the time. And so it's all middle path, you know? Like, if we notice that something really, really matters to us, can we let it matter without over-correcting and forgetting about these other things?

   5. JSJay Shetty16:48

      Mm. Yeah, and that's so hard [laughs] .

   6. SPSpeaker16:51

      I know.

   7. JSJay Shetty16:51

      It's such a challenge. Like, I feel like that controller inside of us... And, and I feel that there's such a experience that we're having of what we're trying to heal in our children

7. 17:03 – 26:31

   You Need A Parenting Mission Statement!

   1. JSJay Shetty17:03

      is what we're trying to heal in ourselves. And so there's this constant belief that I think I'm trying to heal them, but really I'm just preaching to myself-

   2. SPSpeaker17:12

      Yeah

   3. JSJay Shetty17:12

      ... and processing something internal. But our self-awareness is so warped sometimes or hidden that we can't see that. We think we're doing it just for the benefit. How do you break that veil? Like, how do you kind of... Well, how do you reflect effectively? I think that's the question I'm asking is-

   4. SPSpeaker17:27

      Effective reflecting?

   5. JSJay Shetty17:28

      Yeah. What is effective reflection? Because I think we can all ponder, and maybe our reflection takes us as far as, "Yeah, you know, my parents, like, always forgot my birthday. I won't forget my kid's birthday. I'll, I'll do it," right? Or, "Yeah, you know, my, my dad never turned up to my sports games, and so if my kid's sports," like, I-

   6. SPSpeaker17:45

      I'm not gonna miss a thing, yeah.

   7. JSJay Shetty17:46

      Yeah, so, like, that's good, but, but what is the most effective version of reflection that makes it such a big part of your five principles?

   8. SPSpeaker17:56

      So I think if you can write down, like set a timer and for five minutes, and write down the story of who you are as a parent that your child's gonna explain to their grandchildren.

   9. JSJay Shetty18:09

      Oh, wow.

   10. SPSpeaker18:10

       Just five minutes. Who are, who are they describing? And then circle the words that really keep coming up-

   11. JSJay Shetty18:18

       Mm

   12. SPSpeaker18:19

       ... and make that- ... your mission.

   13. JSJay Shetty18:22

       Mm-hmm.

   14. SPSpeaker18:22

       Like, this is my mission statement as a parent, and I now know sort of my North Star, and within that framework, I'm going to reflect and decide if it's still working or am I overcorrecting? So, like, for example, if one of the things that keeps coming up is, "I wanna be present, I wanna be present, I wanna be present," and the way you're translating it is you're not missing a game, to the point where your child doesn't know how to enjoy themselves without the audience, to the point where it feels like they are so the center of your universe that they are worried that you are not a person without them-

   15. JSJay Shetty19:06

       Mm

   16. SPSpeaker19:06

       ... then you would wanna pivot-

   17. JSJay Shetty19:09

       Mm

   18. SPSpeaker19:09

       ... and say, "I can be present without being invasive," [laughs]

   19. JSJay Shetty19:17

       Mm.

   20. SPSpeaker19:17

       You know? But I think that that's the, the easiest way is to check into how is this... I mean, in a scientific paper you'd say, "How's this operationalized?"

   21. JSJay Shetty19:27

       Mm.

   22. SPSpeaker19:28

       And in life, I would genuinely do that exercise-

   23. JSJay Shetty19:32

       Mm-hmm

   24. SPSpeaker19:32

       ... regularly, like kind of every year, and check in. And the other thing that I think is very interesting about it is if you figure out kind of what your mission statement is, like, in this, as this parent or in this household if you're doing it with your co-parent, or again, you can keep it to yourself, but as your kids get older, if you say to them, "My mission in this as a parent is this, you know, these three things were really important to me. What do you think my mission or our mission statement is?"

   25. JSJay Shetty20:04

       Mm.

   26. SPSpeaker20:04

       And if your kids come back to you as they're older and they're, and you're like, "Kindness, empathy, and presence," [laughs] and they're like, "Education, per- persistence, and money"-

   27. JSJay Shetty20:15

       [laughs]

   28. SPSpeaker20:16

       ... that's okay.

   29. JSJay Shetty20:17

       Yeah.

   30. SPSpeaker20:18

       But then it's a moment to say, "Huh, there's one of two things happening here; either I'm not parenting in the way that I mean to, 'cause the messaging is clearly not getting across, or I'm not honest with myself-
8. 26:31 – 31:14

   Embrace Parental Failure

   1. JSJay Shetty26:31

      up, where it's like, "Oh, that's the lesson I learned. I don't need to go to any games. They'll learn independence because that's what I learned."

   2. SPSpeaker26:36

      Right.

   3. JSJay Shetty26:37

      They are a different, they're an orchid or whatever else it may be, and that lack of sensitivity and that lack of connectivity with them and noticing their temperament and noticing their environment that they need is, is often what happens. And I also find that there's this, kind of what you were saying w- this idea of when we're noticing these things in them, when we notice inadequacies or lacks in a child in what we perceive to be an inadequacy, it's because we're having this feeling of we're inadequate because we haven't been able to have them not have that issue.

   4. SPSpeaker27:15

      Yeah.

   5. JSJay Shetty27:16

      And I find that we're trying to solve it so that we can solve that inadequacy inside of ourselves, and then when it doesn't solve, and then we keep thinking, "Well, it must be me, it must be me."

   6. SPSpeaker27:24

      What's me? Yeah.

   7. JSJay Shetty27:25

      What's me? W- w- how do, how do you process that thought? What's a, what's a healthy practice to have when that seems to be a recurring theme?

   8. SPSpeaker27:33

      You know, it's really interesting because as you were saying that, I was thinking about what really pisses me off [laughs] . Like, what, what, when do I get, when do I disappoint myself as a mother? And it's when my kids are doing something that I feel is hard for them, or they get hurt, or something is, like they should be better at this because of my parenting, and I was the one who blew it.

   9. JSJay Shetty28:01

      Mm. Mm.

   10. SPSpeaker28:02

       And so my anger is not at all at them, but it comes out, it can come out at them, which is the only thing that sort of motivates me to deal with it. Because we, we just feel like such failures. And a lot of the time, it's just like, wait a second. Can I also look at what, what's the benefit of having something different going on-

   11. JSJay Shetty28:26

       Mm

   12. SPSpeaker28:26

       ... for this child? Like, maybe it means that they're going to see things in a clearer way, or maybe it means that because this is bothering them, they're gonna pay attention now. I don't know what this is.

   13. JSJay Shetty28:41

       [laughs]

   14. SPSpeaker28:41

       But, like [laughs] because, you know, this is a silly example, but let's say itchy tags bother them, and there are sensory issues and all sorts of things, but we're not getting into that. But because itchy tags bother them, and they really like soft clothing, and there's, you're like, "I've raised this kid who can't function in the world, and now I'm mad at myself 'cause I'm like, 'Just deal with it.'" But if you could say, "I wonder if this is go- what, what strength will this bring for them?"

   15. JSJay Shetty29:09

       Mm.

   16. SPSpeaker29:09

       Instead of looking at it as a weakness.

   17. JSJay Shetty29:12

       Mm.

   18. SPSpeaker29:12

       Is it possibly just different than you? Because one of the things about temperament is also, like, what kind of flower are you?

   19. JSJay Shetty29:19

       Mm.

   20. SPSpeaker29:20

       'Cause there's something that, um, researchers have long looked at, which is, it's called goodness of fit, and when a parent and a child has a good fit, their temperament matches well, they tend to do better.

   21. JSJay Shetty29:34

       Mm.

   22. SPSpeaker29:34

       And so they're not gonna change, but we have more capacity to sort of pay attention to that. And so another thing that we can think about is, like, what is my temperament? How do I respond to the environment? And why is that bothering me?

   23. JSJay Shetty29:48

       Mm.

   24. SPSpeaker29:49

       And, and also, if you feel like... 'Cause I, I would say an example that's, that happens a lot is if you have a kid who's more sensitive, and you're just, like, kind of a dandelion, it's annoying.

   25. JSJay Shetty30:01

       Mm.

   26. SPSpeaker30:02

       You know, you have to take a lot more care and a lot more time. But you could have one parent who's like, "I'm so sensitive. They're so sensitive. I'm gonna be so attuned that maybe it's too much. Maybe, maybe they won't learn."

   27. JSJay Shetty30:15

       Mm.

   28. SPSpeaker30:15

       You know? So it's again back to paying attention, then coming to the middle of it and saying- Okay, one of us, [laughs] let's say you have two parents, and w- you can say one of us is able to notice those sensitive moments. We- we're able to sort of be attuned. So I'm going to pay less attention to that skill that I have so naturally, and I'm gonna focus on not panicking when my kid is uncomfortable. But maybe the more dandelion-like parent is gonna say, "I think I've got the not worrying so much about them and thinking they can handle it, so I'm gonna focus on being more attuned to what's going on for them."

   29. JSJay Shetty30:56

       Mm. Mm.

   30. SPSpeaker30:56

       And so we just... Like, it's this, you know, constant sort of... It's not hard, though. It's, I think it's interesting. I think if you look at it as curious and interesting, it's not like, "Oh, my God, how much is there to think about?"
9. 31:14 – 35:10

   Communication Styles For Every Age Stage

   1. SPSpeaker31:14

      that capacity to give attention to things, it's l- it- it's not that hard. It's, what's hard is that we just want it to be right all the time [laughs] and not hard. But the, like, when you let go of it and you're just like, "All right, my tendency is this. I'm gonna, I'm gonna go on the other side of it and challenge myself," more often than not, 55% of the time, I think you can really develop incredible relationships with your partner, with your kids, because you're basically saying, "I'm not gonna assume that you and I are the same person."

   2. JSJay Shetty31:51

      Mm.

   3. SPSpeaker31:51

      "I'm not telling the same story. I'm gonna let you unfold as you are, and I'm gonna give you a little bit of my, you know, like, what I can offer."

   4. JSJay Shetty31:59

      Mm. Are there different forms of communicating with children that work at different ages in their journey? Like, are there certain types of communication or forms of communication that are more effective between zero and five, five and 10, 10 and 15, or, or anything like that? Or how, how do you see that communication evolving over ages, I guess?

   5. SPSpeaker32:20

      I think the first five years, there's a lot more physical communication, even though, of course, we wanna use our words, because the more exposure to language you have, the more likely you are to have, you know, sophisticated language. But physical touch is so effective, and a lot of times, we try to talk young children, like, out of feelings, and those are the times that I really wanna encourage people to let their nervous system do the talking. So you just kind of put your hand on your heart, take a breath, remind yourself that whatever's going on for them, they're safe. They're just upset. And so you're lending them your nervous system, but you're not telling them.

   6. JSJay Shetty33:02

      Mm.

   7. SPSpeaker33:02

      You're not like, "You're safe. You're gonna be okay. You're just upset that you didn't get a blue cup, and you really wanted it" [laughs] . You're more, like, reminding yourself of that quietly. You don't need to use words. And then over time, you can use more words, but in general-

   8. JSJay Shetty33:19

      Mm

   9. SPSpeaker33:19

      ... we use too many words.

   10. JSJay Shetty33:20

       Mm. Interesting.

   11. SPSpeaker33:21

       I say, I say using so many words.

   12. JSJay Shetty33:23

       Wow, that's interesting. And, and the reason for that is?

   13. SPSpeaker33:27

       Because our kids only have so much capacity to listen, and a lot of the things that, that they're learning from us are watching and borrowing our nervous system. So rather than saying, you know, whether or not something is worthy of freaking out about or telling them how to feel, they can just see that it's not scaring you.

   14. JSJay Shetty33:51

       Mm.

   15. SPSpeaker33:52

       So instead of saying, "Don't be scared," they can be scared, but they're watching you not be scared. And like a flight attendant, I mean, this is, this shows you my issues, but, like, I am not a great flyer-

   16. JSJay Shetty34:03

       Right

   17. SPSpeaker34:03

       ... though I fly a lot, and I always choose the seat close enough to the flight attendant [laughs] because I just wanna see how they're doing. And then if there's turbulence, I feel like I- they have enough experience in this world-

   18. JSJay Shetty34:17

       Mm, mm

   19. SPSpeaker34:17

       ... in this gig of flying, that if it were worrisome, I would pick up on it, and it's the same thing. If our kids are looking at us-

   20. JSJay Shetty34:24

       That's so interesting

   21. SPSpeaker34:24

       ... come on. Like, so we don't have to say so many words, but we do have to pay attention to what's going on inside of us.

   22. JSJay Shetty34:30

       That's such a good example. That is so interesting.

   23. SPSpeaker34:32

       [laughs]

   24. JSJay Shetty34:32

       I'm like, I, I don't... I fly a lot. I, I'm not afraid of flying, but if there's bad turbulence, that's the first thing I do-

   25. SPSpeaker34:40

       The first thing you do, right?

   26. JSJay Shetty34:41

       ... is I try and look at how they're doing. And, and it doesn't matter whether they turn on the thing and say, "Hey, there's turbulence. Put your belts on."

   27. SPSpeaker34:48

       Yeah.

   28. JSJay Shetty34:48

       I'm watching them.

   29. SPSpeaker34:49

       You're looking at their face.

   30. JSJay Shetty34:50

       Yeah, you're looking at their face.
10. 35:10 – 39:10

    Is There A 'Right' Way To Discipline?

    1. SPSpeaker35:10

       have to believe them, too.

    2. JSJay Shetty35:11

       Mm.

    3. SPSpeaker35:12

       Like, if you said, "No, no, no, I'm not upset,"-

    4. JSJay Shetty35:14

       Mm

    5. SPSpeaker35:14

       ... but you're upset, it's a mixed message. And so over time, your kids aren't quite... They're not gonna believe that they can read people properly-

    6. JSJay Shetty35:24

       Mm

    7. SPSpeaker35:24

       ... 'cause it's like, what's really going on?

    8. JSJay Shetty35:27

       Mm.

    9. SPSpeaker35:27

       So I think part of it is fewer words, and then when you use words, tell the truth.

    10. JSJay Shetty35:32

        Mm. Mm.

    11. SPSpeaker35:33

        I mean, within developmental reason.

    12. JSJay Shetty35:35

        Yes. I asked a couple of people around what questions they'd be interested in asking, and I think the two big things that came up, which I'm sure you hear a lot of, were, were discipline and encouragement. Like-

    13. SPSpeaker35:45

        Yeah. [laughs]

    14. JSJay Shetty35:46

        ... the, the two opposite things. It's like, this seems like two common parents' activities are disciplining and, and trying to encourage or, or nurture. And so I wanna talk about each of those. Let's start with disciplining.

    15. SPSpeaker35:59

        Okay.

    16. JSJay Shetty35:59

        What is the, what is the right approach to discipline in a way, as you talk about, creates resilience-

    17. SPSpeaker36:06

        Yeah

    18. JSJay Shetty36:06

        ... as opposed to, I guess if we had a mission statement for disciplining traditionally, it would be to get things right, to do things well, to know what is good and bad. I feel those would be traditional metrics of discipline.

    19. SPSpeaker36:22

        Yeah.

    20. JSJay Shetty36:22

        What would you say are the new metrics, and, and how does- Healthy, what does healthy disciplining look like to lead to resilience?

    21. SPSpeaker36:29

        Okay. [laughs] I feel like discipline is so controversial. Um, but I think of it as all feelings are welcome, all behaviors are not. So if I had to sum it up, and I think we do think of discipline as punishment versus teaching, and it's teaching. And, um, if we're teaching how to move through the world, and if we're teaching kind of what's expected, what are boundaries, and they're real, like, they are for your emotional and physical safety-

    22. JSJay Shetty37:00

        Mm-hmm

    23. SPSpeaker37:00

        ... and you're not just doing them to control, but you actually are like, "No, this is a big deal, because it actually influences your growth and development. It's not just for my entertainment."

    24. JSJay Shetty37:11

        Mm-hmm.

    25. SPSpeaker37:11

        Then your kids trust you a little bit more, and the relationship is stronger. But I think the key with discipline is not being afraid of how our kids react to it, and having the strength of purpose and belief that if they do have a negative reaction to it, we can love them all the way through it, but we're not gonna change our minds about it. 'Cause that's where it gets messy, is that, and I th- I, I think this is partly my whole field and industry, if we're talking all about how important the relationship is, and then you have this limit that you set, like, this is my expectation of you, and your child doesn't like it. The s- simply, like, I, you know, I take the phone away at night, or the iPad or whatever, and your child is freaking out about it. Then you go, "Well, now I've messed with the relationship, and so I guess I should... They're crying and I need to, like, get back in there. So okay, I'll give you more time," or whatever it is. And that's where we get confused. I think if parents really understood that feelings aren't dangerous, that kids aren't gonna say thank you for the boundaries and limits that we set, and that we set them with the intention of physical and emotional safety, about not just them, but other people. Like, we're not just raising kids in a vacuum. They have to move through the world and think about community and other humans. And so what's comfortable for them might not be thoughtful to other people. And so it's that balance between be there for yourself, but also not to the extent that you can't, you know, that you're entitled and don't respect that there are other people in the world.

    26. JSJay Shetty38:50

        Yeah. It's, I, I remember, and I think my, my mom got that right from what I can, or at least followed that advice. Because I remember in my time it was a bit easier, 'cause we were just playing video games. Like, that was the closest thing we had to a mobile phone, right? And it's, I remember I'd get home from school, and I was allowed to watch TV for 30 minutes and play video games for 30 minutes, and after that to do homework.

11. 39:10 – 41:36

    3 Types Of Parenting Styles

    1. SPSpeaker39:10

       Mm-hmm.

    2. JSJay Shetty39:10

       Then we'd have dinner, and then whatever that, you know. And I remember that that hour [laughs] was, like, something I looked forward to every single day, 'cause I'd get to watch whether it was The Simpsons or, when I got older, like, Fresh Prince of Bel-Air, or whatever it was. And then, and, and those rules kind of changed over time, where it's like, okay, now you get a bit more PlayStation time, or whatever else it may have been as I got older. But I now look back and really value the fact that I had these limits and rules and discipline, 'cause it's created a healthy level of discipline that I value today in me. And yeah, of course when I was a kid I didn't enjoy it.

    3. SPSpeaker39:47

       Right.

    4. JSJay Shetty39:48

       Like, I didn't want to do my homework and turn off the T- like, who does wanna do that? But I feel like it was, it's interesting how, yeah, my, I don't think my parents negotiated with me or bargained-

    5. SPSpeaker40:02

       Right

    6. JSJay Shetty40:02

       ... with me with that stuff. It was just like, no, that's just how it is.

    7. SPSpeaker40:06

       Yeah.

    8. JSJay Shetty40:06

       And as uncomfortable as it probably was for them that, that I hated them at that time, they were will- you know, at the time-

    9. SPSpeaker40:12

       Yeah

    10. JSJay Shetty40:12

        ... they were willing to live with that. And, and I guess that-

    11. SPSpeaker40:15

        Because it was for your benefit.

    12. JSJay Shetty40:16

        Correct. And I guess that's the hard part, right? It's like we want [laughs] you want your kid to love you and like you, and, and it, it's not fun not being liked by someone, especially when you're trying to help them-

    13. SPSpeaker40:26

        Yes

    14. JSJay Shetty40:26

        ... and you're trying to do good for them.

    15. SPSpeaker40:28

        No, it's true, 'cause it's like you, I mean, there's three kind of parenting styles outside of neglectful, which is not, you know, that's a whole other thing. But there's, like, the permissive, which is best friend parenting, and it is so sensitive and they do like you, and you can play as many video games as you want, and all that's great, except for you have no- nobody's steering the ship.

    16. JSJay Shetty40:49

        Mm-hmm.

    17. SPSpeaker40:49

        And so it actually can lead to anxiety and depression, and a sense that you are res- too responsible for things. And the other side of it is authoritarian, where it's fear-based, and it's just rules, and it's just because I said so. But without the, like, "I know you really love doing this-

    18. JSJay Shetty41:05

        Mm

    19. SPSpeaker41:05

        ... and I wouldn't stop you from doing it if I didn't know that it was better for your brain," or whatever. So that's the middle path of, like, authoritative, where you're sensitive, but you stick with your limits and boundaries because you know that that's going to benefit your kids. And then you start to, 'cause it's about our comfort. Like, how much can I handle of you being upset with the boundary that I set, set? It's not like anything else. It's really just looking at ourselves and saying, "What

12. 41:36 – 45:34

    How Rejections Leads To Independence

    1. SPSpeaker41:36

       is my capacity for handling the discomfort, knowing that I've made this choice because it's for my child's benefit?" 'Cause they're definitely not gonna be like, "Thank you so much." [laughs] And so when people say, like, "This strategy isn't working," I'm like, that's not the goal. The goal isn't for your kids to say, "Oh, thanks for explaining-

    2. JSJay Shetty41:56

       Yeah

    3. SPSpeaker41:56

       ... now I'm just gonna listen." [laughs]

    4. JSJay Shetty41:58

       Right. [laughs] That's so interesting, isn't it? It's like, as, as humans and as adults, we believe that getting something right means knowing the right thing to say and getting the right response-

    5. SPSpeaker42:11

       Response

    6. JSJay Shetty42:11

       ... which is a response we want or agree with. And the truth is, half the time when you're doing the right thing, you rarely get a response in that moment-

    7. SPSpeaker42:20

       Yeah

    8. JSJay Shetty42:20

       ... that is aligned with what you want. Like, I, I always say to, for me, I feel like, you know, up until 11 I was a pretty good kid and obedient, and then 11 to 21 I was totally the opposite and my parents were wrong about everything, or maybe 14 to 21. And then when you're kind of like 25, you're like, "Yeah, you know what? My parents were good." Like, "My parents were right about so many things, and I'm so grateful to them" and, and all the rest of it. Like, that kind of overarching feeling comes out, which, yeah, as a 15-year-old, you know-

    9. SPSpeaker42:49

       I mean-

    10. JSJay Shetty42:49

        ... you didn't have. And, and it's almost like we want them to display this, like, if, if my parents wanted me to display gratitude at 15, it was never going to happen.

    11. SPSpeaker42:59

        Right.

    12. JSJay Shetty42:59

        But-

    13. SPSpeaker42:59

        No, that's a great example, actually.

    14. JSJay Shetty43:01

        Yeah, right? But we all, we all believe that we're the exception, that our kids will do that.

    15. SPSpeaker43:05

        Yeah. God. [laughs]

    16. JSJay Shetty43:06

        And yet we were also the ungrateful kid, right? It's almost... I find it, uh, because I'm not a parent, I find it better to reflect on what I was like as a kid.

    17. SPSpeaker43:14

        Yeah.

    18. JSJay Shetty43:14

        I know my parents had good intentions. I know they tried their best. I still chose to do things they would never agree with, and I still chose to behave in ways, and it wasn't because they did anything wrong. It was just because I was a kid.

    19. SPSpeaker43:25

        You were being a developing human. Your description of yourself mapping with brain development-

    20. JSJay Shetty43:30

        Mm

    21. SPSpeaker43:30

        ... and it tracks, right? Like, 11 to 14, maybe you were just beginning to experiment with pushing them away, and push back and rebellion, and then, you know, that's like puberty happens, hormones change. Then there's, you know, 14 to till you were in your 20s, your prefrontal cortex doesn't fully develop till 18 to 28, and in boys it's later, so it's, it's usually not the 18. Um, and so you are more, you know, they say all gas, no brakes. Um, and so all of the things you're talking about are mapping with where your brain was at the time. And as an adolescent, you're about to leave the nest, and so you're supposed to start to-

    22. JSJay Shetty44:14

        Mm

    23. SPSpeaker44:14

        ... learn how to reject.

    24. JSJay Shetty44:16

        Mm.

    25. SPSpeaker44:16

        And so it's this like push, pull.

    26. JSJay Shetty44:19

        Mm.

    27. SPSpeaker44:19

        Ideally there's still moments of connection and, you know, maybe they didn't, you know, it's possible, I don't know, but it's possible that they felt rejected by your rebellion, and then you, you know, y- your pushing away then worked, and so they didn't come toward you and say like, "Despite all of this," like, "we love you very much," or maybe they did. Um, but those are times of tension, and you're supposed to, by the time you're, you're ready to go out into the world, you have to feel like you sh, you know, you should and can. And if it was just like cozy and delicious at all times at home, and there was none of that tension, you wouldn't be motivated to grow up and go on. So it all makes sense.

    28. JSJay Shetty45:04

        That is so... I've never heard it put that way, and I've never thought of it that way. That is such a fascinating point, that in order to leave the pack, you have to have a, a sense of rejection, autonomy, and independence just in the idea of development.

    29. SPSpeaker45:20

        Yeah.

    30. JSJay Shetty45:20

        Like, there has to be that feeling of, "I can do it on my own, and I will figure it out." And-
13. 45:34 – 51:46

    Tools To Help Your Child When They're Struggling

    1. JSJay Shetty45:34

       was able to be that person who I always feel, even till this day, is always there for me, but never smothering or controlling in that way. And so it's, uh, it's been a re- Like, I know that if, no matter what was to happen, I could always, that my mom would-

    2. SPSpeaker45:48

       Go to her

    3. JSJay Shetty45:49

       ... my mom would catch me. Yeah. As in I know that, but that's what's given me the confidence to not have to rely on it-

    4. SPSpeaker45:55

       Yeah

    5. JSJay Shetty45:55

       ... because it's, it's there, and I know that deeply, and that's-

    6. SPSpeaker45:58

       It's just there.

    7. JSJay Shetty45:59

       Yeah. Yeah, it's just there. And, and with my dad, he's, he was a lot more aloof, but like I said, that worked good for me, because it helped me chart my own path and, and, you know, build that, which is interesting. I wanted to dive in a couple of things that stood out to me from the book that I've dog-eared here, because got so many little parts that I loved, uh, that I wanted to talk about. One of the things I was thinking about was you talk about here the idea of having a parent who's helping us through hard times, and I was thinking, I think one of the hardest thing about a young person going through a hard time is they don't have the vocabulary to talk about it. Even, even adults, but kids especially.

    8. SPSpeaker46:36

       And even adults.

    9. JSJay Shetty46:36

       Yeah, even adults. [laughs] Like, you know, it's hard even to ask your partner when they're going through a tough time, let alone a child there. And, and I think with our children, we try harder often than we try with our partners. But with your child, you're like, "Tell me what's going on. Like, I wanna know. I'm here to help you." And they're like, "I don't know." Like, "Go away." Like, "I don't know what I'm going through," right? Walk us through that path and that process, because, again, we feel so rejected and so distant-

    10. SPSpeaker47:02

        Yeah

    11. JSJay Shetty47:02

        ... and it almost feels like we're failing. But the real issue here is we can't get them to open up, and therefore we can't help.

    12. SPSpeaker47:09

        Yeah. I mean, it's so hard, because if you push, and for a lot of... Some kids are like disclosers. Like we-

    13. JSJay Shetty47:17

        Yes

    14. SPSpeaker47:17

        ... there, there are people, I was, like, "Let me tell you, [laughs] let me tell you everything, Mom," to the point where she was probably like, "I, I really don't need to know this much." [laughs]

    15. JSJay Shetty47:26

        [laughs]

    16. SPSpeaker47:27

        But, um, but then there are the more closed-in, closed-up kids, and also it just depends on your vocabulary that you've grown up with, which is I think that going back to, like, even when you have limits and rules, you want your kids to know, as you're describing your mom, that they have you. So if you do mess up-

    17. JSJay Shetty47:50

        Yep

    18. SPSpeaker47:50

        ... you can still go to them-

    19. JSJay Shetty47:51

        Totally

    20. SPSpeaker47:51

        ... instead of being terrified. And so that's this weird thing where it's like, "Here are my expectations. Also, I wanna s- name the fact that you're gonna blow it sometimes, and I wanna be the person you come to."

    21. JSJay Shetty48:04

        Yeah.

    22. SPSpeaker48:05

        And that's something to say not when they're struggling. And I think part of the reason why it's hard to get kids to open up is 'cause we try to get in there when they're in the center of the struggle-

    23. JSJay Shetty48:14

        Yes

    24. SPSpeaker48:14

        ... instead of, like, building the vocabulary and connection outside of it.

    25. JSJay Shetty48:18

        Mm.

    26. SPSpeaker48:18

        So you have the conversations, and you give the language when nobody's in the heat of the moment-

    27. JSJay Shetty48:25

        Mm

    28. SPSpeaker48:26

        ... so that when the heat of the moment comes, they already know that they can come to you. And you can just say to them, "I can tell something's going on. I'm here whenever or if ever."

    29. JSJay Shetty48:37

        Mm-hmm.

    30. SPSpeaker48:38

        And then just leave space. A lot of times doing something with a kid who's not opening up, like- Going for a drive even, so that you're not looking at each other. And, you know, I can't think of any sport right now 'cause I'm not-
14. 51:46 – 57:12

    Having The Social Media Talk

    1. SPSpeaker51:46

       them and look in their eyes. And you can have a conversation in a different kind of way than if you're sort of like, "I'm out. You're out. I- you're older. You, you know, take an Uber. Don't drive drunk. I'll see you tomorrow." So I think your presence is important, but the, the, the sense that you're, like, kind of all over them verbally-

    2. JSJay Shetty52:08

       Mm

    3. SPSpeaker52:08

       ... has, you have to pull back a little bit, and it's terrifying. But if you've cultivated the relationship and you've set the expectations from, you know, about substances and social media and whatever, it's easier. But when something's really bothering them, what they need is to know that they don't have to explain it, and they can just come to you and be sad.

    4. JSJay Shetty52:31

       Mm. What's a good way to have that social media substance conversation? Because that sounds like the worst nightmare for any parent.

    5. SPSpeaker52:39

       I know. It's so-

    6. JSJay Shetty52:40

       Like, how do you have that conversation? And again, it's like you can't define whether you're gonna get the right answer back or whatever. So w- what, what kind of communication around those two specific things have been effective for parents or that you've seen?

    7. SPSpeaker52:56

       Okay. So one of the things, the most protective thing, is that you just have the conversations, the relationship. And so you're like, over time, it's never one conversation, and hopefully before they're teenagers, you're starting to talk about what these things are and what they do to your brain. And with substances, for example, we know that before certain ages, your brain is so... It, it's in such a growth mode that you don't wanna mess with that growth by putting substances in it. So if they have any thoughts about future and hopes and goals, now's the time to talk about that, and explain that, like, at a certain point, you're gonna be able to drink. At a certain point, depending on what state you're in, you're gonna be able to smoke pot. [laughs] But right now, your brain is at a vulnerable stage, and so it's a bigger decision now, and in this household, it's not on the table. And also, if you make a mistake, I'm the person you come to, because your safety matters more to me than anything in the world, so I'm never going... You're never gonna regret that.

    8. JSJay Shetty54:04

       Mm.

    9. SPSpeaker54:04

       So I think it's one of those things where it's both a, a limit, a boundary, and a relationship, and you're paying attention, and so that's one. The best friend parenting thing can be problematic because you're like, "Well, I'd rather them drink at home," or, "I'd rather them get their drugs from me." And this is, we know from the literature, it's just not so. You don't want them to feel like... You know, we've sort of created a world where we want our kids to ma- it's so easy that they don't even have to push back. You're, like, handing them... Did you see Mean Girls, the movie?

    10. JSJay Shetty54:40

        I haven't seen the new one, but the original, yes.

    11. SPSpeaker54:42

        Oh, the original.

    12. JSJay Shetty54:42

        Oh, yeah. I love the original. Yeah.

    13. SPSpeaker54:43

        You, you know Tina Fey walks... Not Tina Fey. Um, Amy Poehler walks in, like, with a, with cocktails-

    14. JSJay Shetty54:48

        Yes, yes, yes, yes

    15. SPSpeaker54:48

        ... for all the girls when they're getting ready, and they're just like, "Ew"?

    16. JSJay Shetty54:51

        Yeah.

    17. SPSpeaker54:51

        It's like you don't... You, you might crave connection and desperately want to give them the thing so that they're sticking with you, but you're still the parent, and there needs to be... They need to Know that it's hard to do those things. You know? Like, there are barriers so that you don't break the rules, um, overtly. So let's say they do end up drinking. There's a difference between if your kid eventually ends up drinking because you've really made it clear they can't, so maybe they've pushed it off, so now instead of at 14, they're 17, and there's a difference between drinking, where they're just taking some sips of a White Claw, and binge drinking. And you talk about that with them. Like, I can't... If I can smell it on you or see it, that's a problem. But there's, there's a message in there, which is like, if you're gonna make a mistake, make the mistake moderately. [laughs] And those are all the different ways to sort of help lay the groundwork for them to do as best they can to keep safe. But like, you're not giving them the, you know, the permission and the carte blanche to just kind of do whatever.

    18. JSJay Shetty56:02

        Yeah. It's, it's such a challenging balance. It's just-

    19. SPSpeaker56:05

        It's so hard

    20. JSJay Shetty56:05

        ... it's so hard. Like, I was thinking about it. When I was a kid, if anything was off the table, that was the most attractive thing in the world.

    21. SPSpeaker56:11

        Yeah. And I think that's very important to acknowledge, is like, it's still gonna be attractive, so if you set no limits, the, the, the other side of it-

    22. JSJay Shetty56:20

        Interesting, yes

    23. SPSpeaker56:21

        ... is there needs to be something for a teenager to push back on. So if you're like, I'm gonna use a, an example that's less fraught: clothing. If you're like, "You can wear whatever you want, I don't care," and y- you see that your child is going out to a party in like something very revealing and you don't say anything, then they're like, "I'm gonna try... I'm gonna... I, I'm not even getting pushback? This must not be revealing enough. I'm gonna now wear something ridiculously, like s- so revealing that it's offensive even to me, but I'm gonna do it 'cause let's see what happens."

    24. JSJay Shetty56:57

        Interesting.

    25. SPSpeaker56:57

        And your parent says nothing. And at, at a certain point, it's like the parent is... You're supposed to put on a sweatshirt and hide it from your parents, take the sweatshirt off-

    26. JSJay Shetty57:07

        [laughs]

    27. SPSpeaker57:08

        ... and like know that this is not something that is like their dream,

15. 57:12 – 1:01:40

    Raising Confident Kids

    1. SPSpeaker57:12

       but that you can call them if you need them.

    2. JSJay Shetty57:14

       Yeah.

    3. SPSpeaker57:15

       And if we make things... So it's a balance because you need to be rejecting of your parents. So make the limit tight enough that there's, you know, something to reject and there's something to do that's not dangerous.

    4. JSJay Shetty57:28

       Mm.

    5. SPSpeaker57:29

       But also know your kid's temperament, and there are some kids where you have to frame things differently because they're just like, "Oh, the, your no is my yes."

    6. JSJay Shetty57:38

       Mm.

    7. SPSpeaker57:39

       And I think that that's something to just pay attention to 'cause everybody's different and every kid is gonna be different.

    8. JSJay Shetty57:44

       Of course. Yeah, no, but that, that's a really interesting point about needing to reject something-

    9. SPSpeaker57:50

       Mm-hmm

    10. JSJay Shetty57:50

        ... and needing to have tension around something, and it's almost like if you remove the tension completely-

    11. SPSpeaker57:54

        Yeah. What is there-

    12. JSJay Shetty57:55

        Yeah

    13. SPSpeaker57:55

        ... what's there to do?

    14. JSJay Shetty57:56

        What's there to do? Yeah, no, that's, that's fascinating. I wanna talk about the flip side. We were talking about discipline. Talking about encouraging, and I feel like the biggest thing people wanna do, at least at the root, I find, is wanting to raise a confident child, right? We don't... You don't want your children to feel insecure about the way they look, the way they think, the way they act, and that seems to be the biggest challenge of the day with social media and everything else. And so there's, there's a real sense today of insecurity, envy, comparison, feeling less than. How do you raise a confident human?

    15. SPSpeaker58:35

        Well, I think there are two parts of confidence that we can really cultivate, and then there's separately like behavior patterns that we can help along, like turning off social media, like taking it away if it's really just like harming you. So if you notice that you have a 15-year-old and they're fixated on how certain things... [laughs] I don't know why I'm holding my hand up.

    16. JSJay Shetty58:59

        [laughs]

    17. SPSpeaker59:00

        They're fixated on w- naturally they're going to be, but like some are more inclined than others, and it's really starting to get them down. Say to them, "How's this making you feel? 'Cause what I'm noticing is you're feeling worse and worse when you look at this. So let's figure out a limit, and I'll help you 'cause I'll just take the phone away even when you're feeling like, 'Ugh, I really wanna look at this.'" But it comes from this real compassion. And then the two things for confidence that we can do. The first is remember that competence builds confidence-

    18. JSJay Shetty59:33

        Mm

    19. SPSpeaker59:33

        ... not praise.

    20. JSJay Shetty59:35

        Mm.

    21. SPSpeaker59:35

        Like telling your kid-

    22. JSJay Shetty59:36

        So well said

    23. SPSpeaker59:36

        ... they're amazing is not going to make them feel like they're amazing. It's the competence, like helping them develop the skills.

    24. JSJay Shetty59:45

        Yes.

    25. SPSpeaker59:45

        And those skills don't have to be that you're like a star violinist or tennis player. It can be that you know how to cook or put the dishes away. [laughs] You know, just, just a functioning individual. And so we tend to do everything for our kids, even if they're capable of doing it.

    26. JSJay Shetty1:00:03

        Mm-hmm.

    27. SPSpeaker1:00:04

        But then praise them as if that's building the confidence.

    28. JSJay Shetty1:00:08

        Mm-hmm.

    29. SPSpeaker1:00:09

        And so I think that's one thing, and the other thing is helping them understand how they feel and how they are reading the room.

    30. JSJay Shetty1:00:17

        Mm.
16. 1:01:40 – 1:05:53

    Reward Your Child’s Achievements

    1. JSJay Shetty1:01:40

       wife has this skill of, she's really good at, like, techy stuff around the house, which I'm horrific at, and she, like, can fix the TV and fix this and that. And, like, she, she can do that because her and her dad used to do that, and she has a competence around it, and that, as a kid, was something she knew she was good at. And I think it's so interesting how we often think that even bonding time with our children has to be social. Uh, and, and of course, that's awesome. And I, and I wonder, actually, I want to ask you about that. Like, how... It- because you're- it's interesting what you said, and, and obviously my parents outsourced the skill development, because my dad would hate teaching me math, because that was not a good [laughs] good-

    2. SPSpeaker1:02:19

       [laughs]

    3. JSJay Shetty1:02:19

       ... good, good, uh... My dad's really good at math, and I'm not so good. Um, so it was great to outsource it to another teacher, but how do you see that parent-child relationship based on social versus skill development, and what, what's good to outsource, what's good to in, in-house?

    4. SPSpeaker1:02:35

       Well, I think if you- you have to know yourself. Like, if you're gonna get frustrated with your kid because they are not, uh, as easy to explain math to, you're probably not the best person to-

    5. JSJay Shetty1:02:44

       Yeah

    6. SPSpeaker1:02:44

       ... to help them along with the math. But if you have something that you see, a- even a kernel of interest in your kid, like they're interested in seeing how you fix the TV, spend the time helping them learn how to do that. Like, you're- it's a shared experience together. It's a shared skill-building moment.

    7. JSJay Shetty1:03:02

       Even if you're terrible at it, learn how to do it so you can... Yeah.

    8. SPSpeaker1:03:04

       That teaches them growth mindset. Like, I'm not really good at this, but it looks like you... Fir- first of all, it's great. If your kids actually have a skill, like mine are obviously better at tech than I am because they're in a, they- this is their native tongue. So my 17-year-old is for sure the chief technology [laughs] officer-

    9. JSJay Shetty1:03:21

       [laughs]

    10. SPSpeaker1:03:22

        ... of the family, and, like, anything tech that happens, I'm like, "Please fix this." But it's interesting for her, and if that's interesting for her, what I could do, I don't, but what I could do [laughs] is say, "Teach me how to get better at this."

    11. JSJay Shetty1:03:38

        Yeah.

    12. SPSpeaker1:03:38

        "Tell me what you know." And one other way-

    13. JSJay Shetty1:03:41

        Yeah

    14. SPSpeaker1:03:41

        ... to get really confident-

    15. JSJay Shetty1:03:42

        That's brilliant

    16. SPSpeaker1:03:42

        ... is to teach.

    17. JSJay Shetty1:03:44

        Mm.

    18. SPSpeaker1:03:44

        Like, teach what you know. That's why it's great when y- you know, older kids in school teach the younger kids. It's so awesome.

    19. JSJay Shetty1:03:50

        Mm.

    20. SPSpeaker1:03:50

        So that is the, the other side of skill-building, is, like, allowing them to then, you know, show you what they've learned, and really pay attention to it. And, you know, checking in to- with what they're interested in. The way attention works is you have to care. You have to be interested. So if you're trying to get your kid interested in something and skilled at violin, and they just are not interested-

    21. JSJay Shetty1:04:17

        Mm

    22. SPSpeaker1:04:17

        ... it's not gonna... It's- the thing that you're looking for is for them to know, whether it's bead-making or tennis or violin, it doesn't matter. It's the act of working on something and getting better at it that builds-

    23. JSJay Shetty1:04:32

        Yeah

    24. SPSpeaker1:04:32

        ... the confidence.

    25. JSJay Shetty1:04:32

        Yeah, and it doesn't matter what it is.

    26. SPSpeaker1:04:33

        It doesn't matter, so we have to, like, let go of that investment.

    27. JSJay Shetty1:04:36

        Yeah.

    28. SPSpeaker1:04:37

        I mean, certainly there are gonna be some things, 'cause that's just what we're going for. Like, I didn't know how to play tennis growing up, and I am so annoyed.

    29. JSJay Shetty1:04:44

        [laughs]

    30. SPSpeaker1:04:45

        Like, it just bothers me so much. Socially, it bothers me. As a grown woman, I'm like, "I can't hang. I can't do the fun things my friends are doing."
17. 1:05:53 – 1:07:23

    You Can’t Control Your Kids, You Can Control Your Actions

    1. JSJay Shetty1:05:53

       I keep coming back to is this. A few things that keep coming to me are humility, releasing control, and the acceptance that I don't always know what's best or right, and allowing for someone else to evolve and grow, just as I've had to, despite my parents' best interests. And that sounds like the most beautiful lesson and the biggest challenge at the same time, because-

    2. SPSpeaker1:06:20

       [laughs]

    3. JSJay Shetty1:06:21

       ... it's the thing you'd want to control the most, yet can't.

    4. SPSpeaker1:06:23

       Ugh, I know. It's the thing you want to control the most, 'cause it's the most important thing. And it's like, if we can accept that we can only control ourselves-

    5. JSJay Shetty1:06:36

       Mm

    6. SPSpeaker1:06:36

       ... our parenting flourishes.

    7. JSJay Shetty1:06:37

       Mm. And, and that-

    8. SPSpeaker1:06:40

       [laughs]

    9. JSJay Shetty1:06:40

       ... in one sense is the harder answer, because we always think we can change things outside of ourselves-

    10. SPSpeaker1:06:47

        Mm-hmm

    11. JSJay Shetty1:06:47

        ... quicker than we think we need to change.

    12. SPSpeaker1:06:50

        Yeah. That's, that is the, the, the craziest thing about my job, is that so much of it is... And, and psychologists in whatever area of psychology they're in, 'cause there are so many different branches, and I'm not a clinical psychologist, but even clinical psychologists who are sitting, you know, a, a lot of times they're, they're meant to be working with children, but what, what ends up happening is they're working with the adults. I'm only working with the adults. But, um, but I think it's because-

18. 1:07:23 – 1:10:55

    Aliza On Final Five

    1. SPSpeaker1:07:23

       Adults can work on themselves and control themselves, and we have this inclination to wanna control our kids. Again, it's all with the most love and hope, but we can't. And so that's not, you know, like, that's not the best use of our energy

    2. JSJay Shetty1:07:43

       Hmm. Aliza, it's been such a joy talking to you today. Honestly, I feel like I've learned so much, I've reflected so much, and I want everyone who's listening and watching to know we have simply skimmed the surface of some of the insane-

    3. SPSpeaker1:07:56

       [laughs]

    4. JSJay Shetty1:07:56

       ... and incredible topics and methods that are inside this book. If you've been listening and watching so far, make sure you go and order The Five Principles of Parenting by Dr. Aliza Pressman, host of the Raising Good Humans podcast as well. Aliza, we end every On Purpose episode with a final five, and these have to be answered in one word to one sentence maximum.

    5. SPSpeaker1:08:18

       Whew. [laughs]

    6. JSJay Shetty1:08:18

       So these are your final five. Uh, the question, the first question is, what is the best parenting advice you've ever heard, received, or given?

    7. SPSpeaker1:08:27

       All feelings are welcome, all behaviors are not.

    8. JSJay Shetty1:08:30

       Hmm. What is... Second question, what is the worst parenting advice you ever received or heard?

    9. SPSpeaker1:08:36

       You just want your kids to be happy.

    10. JSJay Shetty1:08:38

        Hmm. Question number three, what's something you used to believe to be true around parenting, but recently you've changed your mind about?

    11. SPSpeaker1:08:49

        That I would be better. [laughs]

    12. JSJay Shetty1:08:53

        [laughs] Wow, that's beautiful. That's beautiful. Question number four, if you could encourage every parent to build one skill that would help them become a better parent for good humans, what would that one skill be?

    13. SPSpeaker1:09:10

        One of the five that makes you the most uncomfortable-

    14. JSJay Shetty1:09:15

        Hmm

    15. SPSpeaker1:09:15

        ... of relationship reflection-

    16. JSJay Shetty1:09:17

        Yes

    17. SPSpeaker1:09:17

        ... regulation, rules, and repair.

    18. JSJay Shetty1:09:18

        Yes. Love that. And fifth and final question, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be?

    19. SPSpeaker1:09:29

        Hunt for the good.

    20. JSJay Shetty1:09:31

        That's beautiful. I love that. Dr. Aliza Pressman, everyone, The Five Principles of Parenting is the book. Go and grab your copy right now. We'll put the link in the comment section, and please tag me and Aliza on Instagram, on TikTok, on Twitter. Let us know... Sorry, X.

    21. SPSpeaker1:09:48

        [laughs]

    22. JSJay Shetty1:09:48

        Let us know what is resonating with you, what you're trying, what's working for you. I think as you saw today, Aliza's really giving us a lot of stuff to play with, a lot of stuff to interact with. There's no right or wrong way. There's no good or bad way here. It's about figuring out how sensitive you can be, how close you can get to the human in front of you, how you can learn to balance and play that middle path. And so as you are trying all of this great insight out, please do share it with us. We'd love to see it. I'd love to thank you again, Aliza, for doing this, for being present here with me today. I really enjoyed sharing this energy with you, and I really believe this is gonna help a lot of people, so thank you so much.

    23. SPSpeaker1:10:27

        Oh, my gosh. Thank you so much. This has been incredible.

    24. JSJay Shetty1:10:30

        Thank you. If you loved this episode, you'll enjoy my interview with Dr. Daniel Amen on how to change your life by changing your brain.

    25. SPSpeaker1:10:39

        If we want a healthy mind, it actually starts with a healthy brain. You know, I've had the blessing or the curse to scan over 1,000 convicted felons and over 100 murderers, and their brains are very damaged

Episode duration: 1:10:56