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How the World's TOP Fencer Stays Unshakable Under Pressure (Use This Habit!)

In this conversation, Jay sits down with Olympic medalist and world champion fencer Miles Chamley-Watson to explore the mindset behind true resilience. Miles opens up about how fencing became his anchor through a difficult childhood, and the lessons shaped by failure, racism, family trauma, and the pressure of competing on the world’s biggest stages. Together, they unpack how confidence is earned through competence, how adversity can be turned into fuel, and why real success is staying rooted in who you are while creating opportunities for others. Throughout the episode, Miles shares the principles that helped him turn setbacks into purpose and use his platform to inspire the next generation. In this episode you'll learn: How to Turn Setbacks Into Fuel for Success How to Perform Under Extreme Pressure How to Build Resilience Through Adversity How to Stop Letting Fear Control Your Decisions How to Create a Life Bigger Than Your Achievements How to Be the Person Others Can Look Up To No matter where you are in your journey, remember that you don’t have to be perfect to move forward. Keep learning, stay true to who you are, and trust that growth often happens in the moments that test you the most. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty JAY’S DAILY WISDOM DELIVERED STRAIGHT TO YOUR INBOX Join 900,000+ readers discovering how small daily shifts create big life change with my free newsletter. Subscribe https://news.jayshetty.me/subscribe Check out our Apple subscription to unlock bonus content of On Purpose! https://lnk.to/JayShettyPodcast What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 01:39 Why Is It So Hard to Fit In? 03:28 How Fencing Changed My Life 04:47 The Power of the Right Guidance 06:59 Why Every Great Athlete Needs a Mentor 09:09 Learn to Lose Before You Learn to Win 10:28 Bouncing Back From Your Biggest Defeat 13:58 Breaking Barriers in a Traditionally White Sport 16:19 Turning Anger Into a Competitive Advantage 18:22 What It Takes to Train Like a World-Class Fencer 20:47 Preparing for Competition Day 21:57 Reading and Anticipating Your Opponent 23:06 The Tragic Incident That Changed Fencing Forever 27:50 The Road to Olympic Success 33:00 Reconnecting With an Estranged Parent 39:15 When Life Leaves You Feeling Helpless 44:50 Staying True to Yourself Through Success 46:38 The Role Models Who Shaped My Life 51:01 The Importance of Strong Male Friendships 53:20 What is Inside a Professional Fencer’s Gear Bag? 57:17 Miles on Final Five Episode Resources: Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/fencer https://www.instagram.com/jayshetty https://www.facebook.com/jayshetty/ https://x.com/jayshetty https://www.linkedin.com/in/shettyjay/ https://www.youtube.com/@JayShettyPodcast http://jayshetty.me

Miles Chamley-WatsonguestJay Shettyhost
Jun 3, 20261h 2mWatch on YouTube ↗

EVERY SPOKEN WORD

  1. 0:00 – 1:39

    Intro

    1. MC

      Fencing literally saved my life.

    2. JS

      Fencing is known for being a notoriously White sport. Talk to me about what it felt like getting to the Olympics, winning bronze.

    3. MC

      My mom always just said, "Just win, and then what can they say? I'm the best now." I'm still a 12-year-old kid, just 6'5", covered in tattoos. Winning is great, but changing a sport is bigger than any Olympic gold medal I could ever win.

    4. JS

      [instrumental music] Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose, the place you come to become happier, healthier, and more healed. Today's guest is not only a friend, but someone who I'm so fascinated to dive into his mindset. I love top performers, people who are operating at peak places and making incredible impact happen across the world in their field, and this is one of those people. Miles Chamley-Watson is an Olympic medalist redefining the sport with his style, confidence, and a vision that's pushing it far beyond what it's ever been before. Miles Chamley-Watson, welcome to On Purpose.

    5. MC

      Wow. Thank you. That was an absolute incredible intro.

    6. JS

      [laughs]

    7. MC

      It's an honor to be here, honestly. B- before I kinda got to meet you, um, it's really nice to be a fan of your work, and I think you instill some incredible ideas on people, make them feel better, which the world needs more than ever. So thank you for that, and it's an honor.

    8. JS

      Dude, we met in the best way possible. I felt like we were on a boys trip, which is what it felt like.

    9. MC

      [laughs]

    10. JS

      And it just turned out to be, like, the easiest conversation. You guys, like, invited me into the wolf pack, which made me feel really, really comfortable. We played poker from 11:00 PM to 7:00 AM three nights in a row. We were out on the water. We were hang-

  2. 1:39 – 3:28

    Why Is It So Hard to Fit In?

    1. JS

      It was, it was amazing, and I just ... You know, I know that I was kinda coming in fresh and new, and it was just you were one of those people-

    2. MC

      Yeah

    3. JS

      ... you and Spins especially.

    4. MC

      [laughs]

    5. JS

      Big shout out, Spins. You were one of those people that just made me feel like at home. So not only are you amazing at what you do, which we'll get into, you're, you're a great guy off, off as well, so I appreciate you, man.

    6. MC

      Thank you.

    7. JS

      I, I wanna dive in by asking you, like, what I heard from you, and I've been watching your interviews, and obviously I, I came to your event, which we'll talk about in a second. But I feel like you always felt like you didn't quite fit in. Talk to me about your earliest memory that reminds you of that feeling.

    8. MC

      I think being born in London, um, my mom was kind of the, the mom and dad. Dad was kind of in my life till I was about eight years old. So I think naturally you kind of rebel. So I think when I was playing football, running track and field, I always felt like I was just different, kind of my approach, my mindset. Um, and then we moved to America when I was about nine or 10, kind of in between those years. And those years are very important, right? All your friends are there. Your family's there. So naturally, mo- moving from London to New York, I was like, "I don't wanna be here." So getting into trouble, getting kicked out of my first school, public school. Then I got kicked out of my second school, and then my mother met someone that w- was on the admissions program for a private school, wh- which gave tuition grants, 'cause we didn't have money at the time. But as a punishment, I had to pick up tennis, fencing, or badminton.

    9. JS

      As a punishment?

    10. MC

      'Cause they considered mental sports. And I was like, "Ugh, whatever. Sports are fun." And then I was like, wait, I can pick up a sword and, like, stab you? Right?

    11. JS

      [laughs]

    12. MC

      I was like, this is, like, the kid's dream. And then immediately that was my purpose. 'Cause you put the mask on and you feel like a superhero, and I think that was the first time I realized, like, okay, this is gonna be my way out of whatever I'm kind of in. And then I was very ADD, ADHD, and then fencing b- kind of became my Adderall. And as

  3. 3:28 – 4:47

    How Fencing Changed My Life

    1. MC

      I started to get better in fencing, I started to get better in school. So that kinda ended up being a double-sided sword, which ended up being my job. I kinda got very, very lucky in finding fencing, because I don't know where I'd be now if I wasn't, you know, a professional fencer, which is a crazy thing to say, you know?

    2. JS

      I feel like sports when you're young are so important. What was the difference? Because everyone plays sports. I played a lot of sports growing older. You're obviously phenomenal at what you do. How quickly did you realize that this could be something you were actually really good at?

    3. MC

      I think it was immediately.

    4. JS

      Really?

    5. MC

      'Cause I, yeah, I picked it up right away. And Ellen Grayson, who I love her to death, hello, um, she was like, "Miles, you, you could be an Olympian." I was like, "That's in fencing. Really?" And I think immediately I felt this connection that was like nothing else in my life, and it was like my therapy. And I think nowadays it's like kids ADD, ADHD, first thing's like, "Hey, l- we should give him a pill or give him a drug." And I'm like, find them something that they, that they love. I think that's the key is ... And sports are amazing because no matter if you're rich or poor, at the end of the day it's, it's who's gonna win, right? Same sword in my hand, same mask on my head. And I think that's why sports are so incredible, because they saved my life. I never knew at that time that it would be my, you know, be all, end all, but, but fencing literally saved my life.

    6. JS

      Wow.

    7. MC

      Which is crazy to

  4. 4:47 – 6:59

    The Power of the Right Guidance

    1. MC

      say.

    2. JS

      Yeah, but I believe you. I can feel it.

    3. MC

      Yeah.

    4. JS

      Like, even just sitting with you and you saying that, I'm like, wow, that's like ... Uh, because I feel like so many parents today are wondering, "How do I get my kid to be confident? How do I get my kid to, like, just get out there?" And, and I couldn't agree with you more that you only feel confident when you have some competence. Like, when you feel like you have a skill or you have an ability, and you have something to do beyond scrolling on your phone or, you know, watching a show or playing video games or whatever it may be. For you, talk to me about what do you think life would've looked like if you didn't find fencing that early?

    5. MC

      I honestly don't know, 'cause we were hanging around the corner shops, you know, getting into trouble, stealing sweets. Just kinda ... 'Cause we didn't really know what there was for us, and I think that's also very important, having a father figure in your life. And thank God my mom, my mom found my stepdad, Colin, who I say my dad to you, 'cause he is my dad who raised me. I think that's also very, very important, is 'cause you need someone that's gonna tell you no when they can. And I honestly don't think I would be ... Definitely not talking to you, and I definitely don't know if I'd be behind the bars, to be honest with you. 'Cause I was just such a crazy little kid. My friends I grew up with, uh, you know, they're plumbers. They're happy. Um, but I was kinda the only one out of us to kind of make it out and, and create a name for myself.

    6. JS

      What area did you grow up in?

    7. MC

      First it was southwest London, and then it was EalingAnd then it was Putney and then Kilburn a little bit.

    8. JS

      Yeah, yeah.

    9. MC

      And then we moved to New York. Yeah, and a really, really funny story, 2012 Olympics, my three friends, Aaron, Adam, and Blake, they're all brothers, they were plumbers, and they actually built the Olympic Village.

    10. JS

      No.

    11. MC

      So yeah, first time I remember saying that, yeah, they literally built the village.

    12. JS

      That's so cool.

    13. MC

      And they were calling like, "Hey man, I'm building your village." I was like, "What do you mean?" And they're like plumbing it and making it, and then they kind of got to see me compete-

    14. JS

      Wow

    15. MC

      ... in 2012 and they all came. So that was a full circle moment for me.

    16. JS

      That's amazing.

    17. MC

      Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    18. JS

      That's so good, man.

    19. MC

      Yeah, it was crazy.

    20. JS

      And that just happened by chance. There was no connectivity or anything.

    21. MC

      By chance. And I think life is obviously about timing's everything in life, and I really believe that. And I think some things might be not the right time, relationships, partners, sports. But sports I think are the number one thing. If I have children, I would put them in right away. I'm not gonna tell you to be a fencer, but I think just sports teach you how to lose, what it feels like, integrity, listening, and I think that's what fencing taught me.

    22. JS

      I told you this before,

  5. 6:59 – 9:09

    Why Every Great Athlete Needs a Mentor

    1. JS

      I don't think we had a proper conversation about it. So I did fencing at school.

    2. MC

      Yeah.

    3. JS

      And I won some super amateur championships at like 14, 15, 16. I don't, I don't, I, you know, maybe, I'm joking. I could never have been good enough to, to compete with what you do. But I loved it as a sport, actually. I thought it was pretty, it was really strategic, it was tactical. The fitness level was, you know, it was challenging. I still remember it actually really well. We'd do it in the gym at school. Talk to me about the importance of a mentor though, 'cause it sounds like you gave a shout-out to someone there, and I was like, I think that's the difference. Like, when I played a lot of sports at school, you've gotta have someone who kinda takes you under their wing and, like, invests in you and makes you feel like you could go far. And I've found them in life, I've found them in business, I've found them in spirituality and meditation and other areas of my life. But sports is somewhere where I think a coach or a mentor is just the most important person. Talk to me about how you found yours.

    4. MC

      100%. I think Ellen Grayson and, um, Eric Rosenberg, they worked at the school at the time, and they saw my potential, and they actually were the first person to say, "Get your citizenship." But I didn't realize I was gonna be who I am to this day. Without them, I would never probably seen my potential and seen how far I could take fencing. And then my coach, Simon Gershon, um, became like my dad. I can tell him everything. He's kinda teaching me that, you know, that you must learn how to lose before you can learn how to win, which is a tattoo I have, which I think is so important. Because understanding the feeling of losing as an athlete is the hardest thing to, you know, to kinda understand and swallow, but then you have to understand what that feels like so when you do win, you appreciate that more than ever. I talk to him every day. If I'm not feeling good, he, he can sense it. So to me, having a coach and a mentor and a role model is so important. And I think now it's why I love being that for the kids now, which is one reason why I started this league. But I love seeing kids look up to me, parents ask me questions, and I think if I can be a little bit of a catalyst or a kind of a helper for them, then that's probably bigger than winning any medal I could ever win.

    5. JS

      That's such great advice. Where's your tattoo? Is it, can you-

    6. MC

      Yeah, yeah, it's somewhere on here.

    7. JS

      [laughs] Yeah.

    8. MC

      It's somewhere on here.

    9. JS

      How many tattoos do you have?

    10. MC

      150.

    11. JS

      Really?

    12. MC

      Yeah.

    13. JS

      That's mad.

    14. MC

      Yeah, 'cause I tattooed my hands-

    15. JS

      Yeah, yeah

    16. MC

      ... because in fencing we're all in white.

    17. JS

      Yeah.

    18. MC

      So I was like, "You know what? I wanna stick

  6. 9:09 – 10:28

    Learn to Lose Before You Learn to Win

    1. MC

      out." And my mom hated it 'cause she's, you know, a British lady.

    2. JS

      Now, I remember when we were traveling as well, you got these crazy ones on your shin as well.

    3. MC

      Yeah.

    4. JS

      On your legs, yeah. When did you start?

    5. MC

      2012, I got my first one in London.

    6. JS

      Oh, that's late.

    7. MC

      At the Olympics, yeah. And it says, "From London to London." And then I won world championships, and I got the, the dates, and then I was like, "I really like it." And then I just kinda went crazy with it. But they're all very, very purposeful. Like, they're not just random ones I've gotten for just for the sake of it.

    8. JS

      What's the lose and win one again? Say that again.

    9. MC

      So you must learn how to lose before you can learn how to win.

    10. JS

      I really like that.

    11. MC

      Yeah.

    12. JS

      That's dope.

    13. MC

      And I, and I really understood that when I lost at the Olympics. Um, we got, we got fourth and I was like, "I gotta wait four years?" And then I kinda changed my whole mentality. And then 2013 is when I made history, and I was the first ever Black American world champion in the history of, of fencing. And I think if I didn't lose, I don't know if I'd ever win, which is a weird thing to kinda say, but I think it's, it's pretty poignant, and I think it is very important for just your character. And just trying to be as humble and even-keeled as you can, 'cause I never understand some athletes who reach a certain peak and they just change who they are. And I think if you can keep, you know, that little kid in you, then I think you'll, you'll be able to go through life with a lot more wins than, than losses.

    14. JS

      It's such powerful advice. I remember I had, obviously I never competed at any, any level, but I remember having a football coach

  7. 10:28 – 13:58

    Bouncing Back From Your Biggest Defeat

    1. JS

      who'd always say to us, he was like, "If you win, celebrate for a night, and then get back to training. And if you lose, cry for a night, and then get back to training."

    2. MC

      Yeah.

    3. JS

      And he was like, "All you have to do is get back to training."

    4. MC

      Yeah.

    5. JS

      He said, "Everything else is irrelevant. You can celebrate for one night, you can cry for one night, but get on with it." Because his whole point was like, when we lose, we cry for a month, and when you win, you celebrate for a night. And that's why you remember the bad times more than the good times, because when you lose, you get so deep into it. Talk to me about that loss that you had, the details of, like, what it felt like to lose in that way.

    6. MC

      Well, it felt like your life was over at that time. My nan was there. You know, she's African. My, my aunts, my uncles, they were supporting me and I'm like, "I feel like I let everybody down." And they don't care. They love me for who I am. But at that time, that was my biggest moment in sports is making the Olympics in 2012 in London, and I just felt like, "Oh."

    7. JS

      Yeah, hometown as well.

    8. MC

      Hometown, ashamed of myself. And a really, really beautiful moment for me was I'm in the village, and the basketball team walks in, and Kobe walks in. And he's like, "Hi, how are you?" And I'm like, "Hi, how you doing?" He's like, "I'm Kobe." I'm like, "I know who you are."

    9. JS

      [laughs]

    10. MC

      I'm like, "I'm Miles. I'm a fencer." And he told me this quote, I'll never forget it. I got it tattooed on my leg. He says, "The best athletes have the shortest memory. You win, you forget about it. You lose, you forget about it. When you're done your career, you can celebrate all you want." And I stood there and I was like, "Wow." And immediately that grin turned into a smile, and then I changed my whole mentality, and then I won the next year. And I was able to tell him, which was really, really beautiful. But I think when you meet someone like that who you look up to and they're just even more incredible in person, and he's just very humble and told me that from, from his coach, and I'll never, ever forget that. And I have it tattooed on the back of my leg with his face.So I think those moments are priceless to me. And I think if I would've won, would I have had that time with him or would I have been able to do more in my sport? So I think everything has a reason to come into your life, whether it's positive or, or, or negative. And I'm grateful for these moments in life that, you know, are incredible. Um-

    11. JS

      That's such a great story, man

    12. MC

      ... yeah, and I never forget it.

    13. JS

      I love it. Kobe came on the podcast the first year of the podcast.

    14. MC

      Wow.

    15. JS

      It was brand new. We just started out, and he did exactly what you said. He walked into the room and he introduced himself as Kobe to my whole team, and everyone's like, "Yeah, we know exactly who you are." And my favorite memory from that day was that when we walked in, he was in his office, and you could just see the silhouette of his head, and his team was saying that he was meditating in there before he came to do the interview. And he said, they said he did that every morning. When we finished the interview, this was a little clip. I still have this clip. I've never put it out there because I feel it would be disrespectful. But at the end of it, he goes, "I can see why you're number one." And I was just like, that will, like-

    16. MC

      Wow

    17. JS

      ... stay with me forever.

    18. MC

      Wow.

    19. JS

      He gave me the biggest hug and yeah, I was so grateful to, and that was like three months before his tragic passing, so it was like right then. But yeah, what, what an incredible role model, amazing energy, like so present, really humble. Everything you just said.

    20. MC

      Yeah.

    21. JS

      Like, just meeting someone at that level, that caliber, who was just so down to earth.

    22. MC

      I don't want to talk too much about it because obviously r- respect to him, but I was on set with Nike talking about him the day it happened.

    23. JS

      Oh.

    24. MC

      The day it happened.

    25. JS

      Wow.

    26. MC

      And then Lewis actually texted me, "I love you, brother." I was like, "Love you too." But my phone was in the green room and I was talking about him, his impact on me, and everybody just stood in silence and it was just like-

    27. JS

      Oh, wow

    28. MC

      ... it was, you know, and I think larger than life these people and life's a, a brutal reminder and I think it's just

  8. 13:58 – 16:19

    Breaking Barriers in a Traditionally White Sport

    1. MC

      enjoy every moment you can, negatives or positives, and I think that's all we can do in life and just live with love and everything else will take care of itself. But that man was so special.

    2. JS

      Yeah, one of a kind. He was, he was one of the few athletes I knew that was peaceful in retirement.

    3. MC

      [laughs] Yeah. Yeah.

    4. JS

      And he was really happy because he was getting, he won the Oscar for the short film that was teaching lessons-

    5. MC

      Yes, Dear Basketball

    6. JS

      ... from basketball. Yeah, exactly. But, uh, I was thinking about it. You mentioned something there. You said that you're the first Black person in the sport to win. I mean, that just first of all, that is a huge accomplishment. Congratulations. I just want to-

    7. MC

      Thank you

    8. JS

      ... acknowledge and honor just what a big deal that is. But fencing is known for being a notoriously white sport.

    9. MC

      Yeah.

    10. JS

      Like that's what it's always been, I assume. You can fill me in on the history a little bit. Talk to me about even breaking into something like that, because I don't, that's not normal. That doesn't sound easy. I'm sure there's a lot of things to navigate. Like walk me through that experience.

    11. MC

      I was in this group class and, you know, they pick who you want on a team. We did like our first team event. It was like, so three people on one team versus other three. And every time I was picked last knowing I was not the worst one. And at the time you're kind of like, all right, this is, this is weird. I'm the only one that kind of looks like me in it. And then I started to realize that no one in the sport really made a mark on them that was my color, besides Peter Westbrook, who I have to give some homage to. And then my first ever Junior Olympics, I never forget it. I got five red cards for no reason, and I knew it was because the color of my skin, because the next day I won the under 17. I knew it. And now I, I've seen the referees still to this day and I still have this, this, I was like a little kid and it's just, you don't know why things are happening to you. But then as I got older, I started to realize it was just because the color of my skin, because no one in that sport had broken that mold. And there's been countless times of referees and, and coaches that have just racial gestures that I've never really talked about because my mom always just said, "Just, just win, and then what can they say?" I've had many, many occasions from probably 14 till 17, 18, then I was like, "I'm the best now." And it's unfortunate because now there's still racism in the sport, right? It happened with this kid in Amsterdam and I messaged him right away, like, "You know, I have your back" and I'll talk about it in a post about it because it's, you need someone that's gonna have your back because it's a very lonely feeling when you're the only one that

  9. 16:19 – 18:22

    Turning Anger Into a Competitive Advantage

    1. MC

      has felt this way. Once I started to realize that, I, I made it like a positive chip on my shoulder and I was like, okay. And I never look at life as anything negative, whether it's, you know, being racially profiled or losing. I always have a positive outlook on everything because it's never a loss. It's always a lesson. And I think that was something that I was like, okay, this is gonna be change in the sport and I will leave fencing in good hands because I know I've changed the sport for the best.

    2. JS

      How did you handle it at the time when you didn't have someone reaching out to you?

    3. MC

      The good thing about fencing is I can take my aggression out on my opponent.

    4. JS

      [laughs]

    5. MC

      So it's a positive thing for the sport.

    6. JS

      To channel it.

    7. MC

      Yeah. You know, you're crying in the locker room. I never cried in front of my mom. You know, luckily you have a mask on, you, you know, shake your opponent and put the mask back on. But I think at that age it's, it's, it's okay to cry and it's okay to let things out because there are coaches and parents who I've seen who have actually shunned their kids for showing emotions. I've seen parents leave their kids at competitions because their kid lost to me, and actually the kid is actually m- my friend now, and it's just a shame that, that parents don't realize like how much pressure there is on, on, on us to just win. So I think now seeing kids that look more like us, Brown, White, whatever, girls, I just want to make them feel comfortable and happy and safe, and I think if I can be this beacon for them, then that's what I want to do in the sport.

    8. JS

      Well, that was what was so incredible when you launched the World Fencing League.

    9. MC

      Yeah.

    10. JS

      I just got to attend in LA. I felt like you had people from different countries, different cultures, different backgrounds. I mean, that was pretty epic, man. That was amazing.

    11. MC

      It was honestly a dream come true. We sold out. We broke records. I think over a million people live watching, which is more than the Olympics, and I think just seeing kids so happy that their sport is on the map was the best feeling I've ever felt in my life. So seeing all the little kids on the red carpet to all the fencers inside telling me"Mate, I think you've done it." And that was, to me, the greatest day of my life because it was just, we really changed the sport on one day because now there's an audience of people that have never seen it, like yourself, like

  10. 18:22 – 20:47

    What It Takes to Train Like a World-Class Fencer

    1. MC

      people in tech, people in sports, people that I've looked up to. To the fencing fans, to get the love that, that they deserved was incredible. Even as I'm smiling 'cause I'm generally-

    2. JS

      [laughs]

    3. MC

      ... so happy that-

    4. JS

      Yeah, yeah, yeah

    5. MC

      ... it happened, and now the response has been so positive, so we can keep growing and growing. I just wanna get fencing on a mainstream, you know, channel and, and platform, which is gonna happen, but it takes someone like myself to know that it's gonna be tough, but I can handle it.

    6. JS

      Big news. Juni just launched at Kroger, and we're celebrating with a free can for you. Because most of us hit that point in the afternoon when our energy dips and our focus starts to fade. Well, that's exactly why we created Juni, a sparkling drink crafted with natural ingredients to lift your mood, sharpen your focus, and give you smooth energy, all without the crash. Now available at Kroger stores, including Ralph's, Fred Meyer, King Soopers, Smith's, and Fry's, where you can grab a free Juni on us. So head to drinkjuni.com/kroger to claim your free can in store so you can feel better and live better. For anyone who doesn't really know that much about fencing or is new to it, walk us through, like, what the regime is, what the fitness training is, what the skill is, what the art is, like how you train. It's almost like when people watch Drive to Survive, that was when people realized what F1 drivers did.

    7. MC

      Yeah.

    8. JS

      I'm sure you're working on a version of that for fencing. I see it.

    9. MC

      Yes.

    10. JS

      And, and I feel like getting inside your mind is interesting to me because I'm like, I love knowing how people who are performing at the highest levels figured that out because that's what I'm obsessed with, is knowing how you perform at that level and that peak. So what's the training? What's the focus? What's the patterns? What are the things that you have to do that might surprise us?

    11. MC

      I would say fencing's like physical chess, right? Where it's mentally just as taxing as physically 'cause I have to think what you're gonna do ahead and then react to what you're gonna do as well. So I'd say the three main things would be being explosive, your reaction, and your timing. So if I have to react to you, and then my timing of hitting you before you can hit me, I would say is very, very important. But then it becomes a beautiful dance as well, where I'm more of a feeling type of fencer, where I like to see what you're gonna do. I like to look at your feet. I like to look at your mannerisms. But then there's guys that are very good too that are very mental, and they'll just sit kind of more defensive and kinda pick you apart. I would say fencing's like if boxing,

  11. 20:47 – 21:57

    Preparing for Competition Day

    1. MC

      taekwondo, and 100 meters had a baby.

    2. JS

      Wow.

    3. MC

      'Cause you have to be very explosive right off the gate. You have to be very, very reactive, but then you have to have a feeling of kind of, if things go bad, how do I change right away? So it's kind of like there's no real sport like fencing because it's so unique, and then once you see it in person, you're like, "Oh my God, they're real athletes." I'm like, "'Cause don't let The Parent Trap," you know?

    4. JS

      [laughs]

    5. MC

      Great movie, but I'm like-

    6. JS

      The Parent Trap [laughs]

    7. MC

      ... you know, people are like, "Oh, yeah." It's like, I'm like, "No, no, no. People died 50, 60 years ago," because it's an actual sword, right? I do the foil discipline, but so I'd say it's, it's like physical chess is what I tell people, where it's just as taxing mentally as it is physically. It's such a unique sport because it is grip strength as well as core and your legs 'cause you're in a squat the entire time. And I think, you know, as you saw, it's so explosive, and it, it can be over in five minutes-

    8. JS

      Mm-hmm

    9. MC

      ... or 40 minutes, so you have to have great VO2 as well. Get your heart rate from, you know, 160, 170 back to the low 70s, 80s. So yeah, it's a, it's a crazy sport.

    10. JS

      When you're training for a big tournament, what does your regime look like for how long?

    11. MC

      So I would say, uh, pre-season,

  12. 21:57 – 23:06

    Reading and Anticipating Your Opponent

    1. MC

      we're doing a lot of cardio, and it's, like, s- similar to boxing, right? So we'll do 10 rounds on the assault bike. It's, you know, 20 seconds on, 40 seconds off 10 times, and we'll do the SkiErg. I'll do sprinting. We don't necessarily need too much distance work, but it's more, like, high intensity, get the heart rate down, get that right, right back up again. And then I like to train four to five times a week. So Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday is big fencing, which is sparring, kinda get the, the fencing stamina. And then Tuesday, Thursday, if you wanna do Friday as well, it's more of a lesson, which is one-on-one with your coach, which is how do I wanna get better in this tactical movement. Um, and I'd say that's kind of the building block for most fencers.

    2. JS

      Got it.

    3. MC

      Yeah. Whether you're 12 or whether you're my age, it, it's pretty intense at a young age.

    4. JS

      And then how much are you fencing... Like, how much are you training different moves and-

    5. MC

      Yeah

    6. JS

      ... is that, if that's even the right word [laughs]

    7. MC

      Yeah, no, no, it's good.

    8. JS

      Yeah. [laughs]

    9. MC

      Well, I'm very creative, so I like make up my own moves by myself. I li- I like to spend an hour on my own in the gym when no one's there.

    10. JS

      Well, that's what I find so hard about fencing, is that when I saw it at the World Fencing League, to me,

  13. 23:06 – 27:50

    The Tragic Incident That Changed Fencing Forever

    1. JS

      I was like, how do they predict anything? 'Cause you could do anything. Like, the, obviously, the target mark is only the upper part of the body, right?

    2. MC

      Yeah, exactly.

    3. JS

      You can't get someone's face, you can't get someone's legs, you can't get someone's feet. But even with that, I was like, the way the fencers were moving their foil, I was like, how would you know what they're about to do? Because it's so unpredictable. It's not like, it's not obvious. It's not like, oh, there's this move and this move and this move.

    4. MC

      Some opponents have, like, specific mannerisms where, like, say Italians are very good at putting pressure on you. You know, Russians are more tactical. French kinda have both.

    5. JS

      Oh, it's by country.

    6. MC

      Kind of, yeah, I would say, yeah.

    7. JS

      There's a style in each country.

    8. MC

      And then the Asians have incredible footwork. Like, it's, it's insane. So you can kind of know that with a fencing a Korean, you have to move your legs like crazy. Italians, you have to think a lot and react. French, they kinda have everything in one. And then Americans are kind of unpredictable as well. We have our own styles, but I would say for the most part, actually, yeah, it is actually by-

    9. JS

      [laughs]

    10. MC

      ... by country. Now I'm like, yeah, it is.

    11. JS

      [laughs]

    12. MC

      Yeah, it is.

    13. JS

      When, when you said people died in the sport-How long ago?

    14. MC

      I would say 67, 65, 70 years ago.

    15. JS

      What? Because they didn't have the-

    16. MC

      Yeah. So back in the day it, it was dry. So Smirnov and Béart were fencing, and unfortunately the foil broke off and went through his eye, and it killed him immediately. So nowadays if it breaks, there's a light that comes on right away. But back in the day it was dry, so you just have to hope it doesn't break. [laughs]

    17. JS

      Wow.

    18. MC

      So it was real, real, like, some warrior stuff back in the day, and then now it's obviously progressed and now we've added new tech, which we did in the, in the whole league. But it is a cr- it is, we're literally sword fighting, and I think people don't understand how hard it is until you see it. Like, it's really, really tough.

    19. JS

      Yeah.

    20. MC

      And I played, you know, football, I ran track, I played tennis, but I think you do realize it is an intense sport. So if I can give that n- n- you know, kind of knowledge to the people that don't know to understand it more, I think that's a massive key.

    21. JS

      Yeah. I also feel like you bring your swag to fencing. You just mentioned-

    22. MC

      Yeah

    23. JS

      ... the Met Gala. Like, I'm like-

    24. MC

      [laughs]

    25. JS

      You can go from, like, fencing outfit to Met Gala to streetwear. I'm like, I'm sure you don't see that a lot in fencing either.

    26. MC

      Yeah. I, I think-

    27. JS

      You've got your own Nike-

    28. MC

      Yes

    29. JS

      ... swag that people can get.

    30. MC

      Second one, you know.

  14. 27:50 – 33:00

    The Road to Olympic Success

    1. MC

      is kind of crazy.

    2. JS

      Why?

    3. MC

      Because one time I, I knew and I couldn't sleep, and then I'm, I'm envisioning in my head and I wake up and I'm tired. 'Cause at the end of the day, if I don't know what I'm gonna do fencing, how the hell could you plan for me?

    4. JS

      Yeah.

    5. MC

      Right? So I realized that. So now I don't ever, ever t- talk about fencing, think about fencing. I don't wanna know. I don't even go to the venue the night before. I just w- whatever city I'm in, I kind of walk around.

    6. JS

      That is definitely unique for an athlete.

    7. MC

      Oh, it's crazy.

    8. JS

      Yeah. [laughs] Yeah.

    9. MC

      People are like, "Why are you doing that?"

    10. JS

      [laughs]

    11. MC

      I be like, "That helps me."

    12. JS

      Yeah.

    13. MC

      And then that's, like, how I deal with, with pressure. 'Cause at the end of the day, pressure is a privilege, but it also comes with a lot of pressure. But also understanding now that, like, if you can have this understanding that, like, you're supposed to win a competition, that's a gift. So if you can lean into that, like, most people don't, aren't supposed to win, so they've got no real pressure.

    14. JS

      Yeah.

    15. MC

      So I think now understanding that's actually a gift has helped me be like, all right, like, just l- you know, lean into this. So I think just learning more about myself has given me more understanding of the sport of fencing.

    16. JS

      Yeah. Talk to me about the road to your favorite tournaments, whether it's the Olympics, winning bronze, world champion. Like, talk to me. Let's talk about the Olympics first because, I mean, and you brought us the Olympic medal, which was incredible-

    17. MC

      Yeah

    18. JS

      ... which we're gonna... That's, I mean, I've never seen one in real life. L- like you said, everyone's wearing the fake ones when they're out-

    19. MC

      [laughs]

    20. JS

      ... or whatever in the pictures.

    21. MC

      Yeah.

    22. JS

      Talk to me about what it felt like getting to the Olympics, winning bronze.

    23. MC

      I would say getting there, you know, .001% of the population gets to go to the Olympics. I think it's, like, .001 get a medal, right? So unless you're Phelps, who's got s- 2,000 of them.

    24. JS

      [laughs]

    25. MC

      But I think when you get there, at least my first one, I changed everything. I was serious. I didn't see my friends, which ended up being the wrong decision. And then, and then the next year I was like, "You know what? I'm gonna enjoy this. I'm gonna get dinner with my friend the night before," and I won. That was me realizing that not everybody is the same athlete, and yes, there's rules and techniques and routines, but, like, I'm not like the next person, so why should I prepare like them? So then once I started to understand that I'm different, th- then that kinda led me up to Rio, and I'd actually lived in Korea for a little bit and I trained with Jung-ho Kim and I won the first Grand Prix of the season. People were like, "Why is he going to Korea?" I'm like, "Why not?" And I won the first Grand Prix of the season, and I was like, "That's why'Cause I wanted to, to learn something new. And I think-

    26. JS

      Yeah

    27. MC

      ... as athletes, change is okay, but sometimes it's hard to f- to take that leap, right? And then I m- made the Olympics, and I had the best team fencing of my life. And I was able to, to enjoy the moment, the process, be in Rio, you know, meet the other athletes. And I think that was when I realized you need to enjoy the journey because when you're done, besides a medal, memories to me are more important. And if you lose those memories, then you've lost, I think, the coolest part of the journey. So I think leaning into, like, the understanding and having fun was ultimately why I was able to, you know, go to three Olympics and have success. And, you know, now I'm like, there's kids like, "I'm so stressed." I'm like, "What are you stressed about? 'Cause you wanna win? That means you care. Next thing." So I've been able to go through each of these ebbs and flows and have answers to most of them, which I think is the key to, to success, right? Everybody can be really, really good. If you can unlock the mind, that's when you become a legend, and that's what I'm learning from people who are legends of, of, you know, taking those risks and being crazy. 'Cause, you know, it takes one person to change the world, right? It takes one person to change a sport. And I think if I can be that person, then I've created a whole new roadmap for the next kids to, oh, wow, this is a different approach for me, which has been a blessing.

    28. JS

      I love that. I love the idea of you get a career learning a new school of thought. I love the idea of being this multifaceted individual because you're so right that whether it's sports or whether it's business, whatever it is, everyone thinks that there's only one way to do it right. And then you speak to all these founders and you're like, no, they all did something different. They discovered their idea differently, they built teams differently, and they took their human experience and put it into what they were doing, and that's what made it as good as it was. I've really been on this hype of wanting anyone, whatever industry you're in, whether it's sports, media, business, whatever it is, finance, tech, to find what it is that makes you different and lean into that, and not lean into thinking, "How do I look like that other guy who's doing it as well?" Because I think that time is gone. I think that time existed. Back in the day, you had to wear the suit like that guy wore, and you had to wear the shoes that he wore, and you had to play golf like him or whatever it was. And I was like, that's changed now. It just doesn't work that way.

    29. MC

      Exactly. You said it perfectly because there's always this stigma like I have to do- I can't have a tattoo 'cause I'm not gonna get a job. I told my mom, I'll be the first ever, not that money matters, but I was like, "I'll be the first ever millionaire fencer." It's like saying I'm gonna see a unicorn 'cause it's never existed. But I knew if I was just myself, it would figure itself out, right? And then I have tattoos, and then now these kids are getting tattoos because it's such a still elitist, uppity sport and you can't do these things. And I'm like, "No, why not?" You know? Oh, I won't be in a meeting with CEOs. I'm actually sitting with the guy that made your phone and I'm myself.

    30. JS

      [laughs]

  15. 33:00 – 39:15

    Reconnecting With an Estranged Parent

    1. MC

      but I think people are still so scared to take a risk, and I think that's the difference. There's so many people that are the same nowadays, which is I think the issue. And I think if you can just honestly be yourself, you'll figure out what, what life is for you. And I think I never wanted to be like anybody else in sports or life in general. And there were those times when I was like, "Was this the right decision?" But I knew keep your head down, keep being you, and things will happen for you. And they did. I used to think that fencing was like my kind of anchor. Oh, he's a fencer. But that's actually my gift. I used to lie to people like, "Oh yeah, I play basketball." You know, just 'cause like-

    2. JS

      [laughs] I'd believe it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    3. MC

      They, 'cause the people would try and make fun of me or try and fight me or-

    4. JS

      Oh, really? Wow

    5. MC

      ... or bully me in school. Yeah, 'cause I was a fencer.

    6. JS

      Wow.

    7. MC

      'Cause to them it was not a cool sport. And then now my Instagram is Fencer and I'm like, that's what I'm doing. That's my purpose, right? And Michael Strahan, one, one of my great friends and mentor always told me, "Never mess up your main and keep that your main." I was like, "Fencing is my main." Everything else will come, but just don't lose sight of what you were here on this planet to do.

    8. JS

      Did it affect you between when your father left when you were eight and then before you had your now dad that you mentioned, like did that affect you in any way, like?

    9. MC

      I think it did for sure. And I think there are times of like, now that I'm older and I can understand it, like, why are you getting into trouble? Why are you doing these things, right? I think it's probably does stem from trauma or stemming from something because why else would I be acting up? Like, my mom's an amazing mom. She's given me all the right lessons. Like why are things happening? Obviously one of my best mates, Lewis, was, "Bruv, you need to attack that. You need to understand that," right? Like, why is this happening? And I, you know, went on a spiritual, I went on a spiritual journey and understood, oh wow. And I hadn't talked to him for 10, for over 10 years.

    10. JS

      Oh, wow.

    11. MC

      Yeah.

    12. JS

      Your biological father.

    13. MC

      Yeah. And then, you know, I had this awakening, picked up the phone and called him and said, "Hey Dad, this is Miles. How are you? I don't wanna know about the past. How's everything going?" Because I also realized that kids don't realize that their parents are growing up as well. And that was like, oh wow. Not saying right or wrong, but once I did that, it was like a [sighs] And then I think I started to just understand way more about myself. So I think definitely I had trauma without even knowing it was trauma at the time. And then now it's like I've got such a clear understanding of that probably made me who I am. So I almost wouldn't want it any other way. And then my stepdad, who is my dad, is the, is the most amazing person. He taught me how to be a man. And I think that's the coolest part is having this kind of rollercoaster journey created, you know, this person in front of you. But I think not having that growing up somehow helped me not take no for an answer and, and, and really knock some doors down. So I think it definitely was a time when I had to be like, okay, why are you getting in trouble? Why are you getting arrested? Why, you know, why are you doing these things?

    14. JS

      Did you get arrested?

    15. MC

      Yeah. One time I was just stupid at competition and I was like throwing these like shampoo bottles down just-

    16. JS

      [laughs]

    17. MC

      And then it was just stupid and I got handcuffed and then my mom walked in. Oh, this is the worst story.

    18. JS

      [laughs]

    19. MC

      And then my mom walked in as it happened and I was like, "Oh my God."

    20. JS

      You're more scared of your mom than the cop

    21. MC

      100%.

    22. JS

      Yeah.

    23. MC

      Oh my God.

    24. JS

      At that age, for sure.

    25. MC

      And then it was just like these moments of like, why are you getting in trouble? Why are you get into fights? Just, you know? But I think it all stemmed from trauma that I was like ... Small things like I never had that, uh, what's it, the birds and the bees talk, whatever that is, your parent, all those small little things that I think are important, especially at that age. So I think that was definitely a reason for all of my negative antics was definitely probably because it was just my mom and she was-

    26. JS

      Trying her best

    27. MC

      ... oh, she was crushing it, but she never complained. I never saw her cry. I never saw her anything. And now she's h- hopefully living the life, but she is the strongest man and woman I know by far.

    28. JS

      What did your biological dad say when you called him after those 10 years?

    29. MC

      I remember yesterday it was like a, a, "Hello?" I was like, "Yes, this is Miles." And he was like, "Uh, hi son." And then I was like, "Listen, I don't care about the past. Do you need anything? How are you?" Talked for about, I wanna say it was like 45 seconds I think I remember us being on the phone, and then it was just like a whoa. But it was like a really nice closing a chapter and then opening a chapter.

    30. JS

      Mm.

  16. 39:15 – 44:50

    When Life Leaves You Feeling Helpless

    1. JS

      a lot of our physical and mental blocks are actually emotional. If we were able to get past and do the emotional thing, then we'd be able to do physical and mental things that we don't even think is possible, but we're all blocking ourselves and limiting ourselves because there's some sort of emotional unlock that we haven't allowed, whether it's forgiveness, resilience, courage, fear, whatever it may be. And that's really powerful to hear, man. Thank you for sharing that.

    2. MC

      It feels good to talk about, you know?

    3. JS

      Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    4. MC

      'Cause it's like I almost forgot we're on a podcast. I feel like we're just-

    5. JS

      [laughs]

    6. MC

      ... you know, we're just having a chat.

    7. JS

      We're just chatting. Yeah.

    8. MC

      And I think that's the cool thing is like emotions are your best friend, right? If you're feeling a certain way, you can lean into it. Just don't let that dictate your entire day. So I think that's something that I learned as well. If I'm feeling this way, let it out and then move on. And then it, it all ties into just understanding who you are at the core. 'Cause I finally know now who Miles is. 'Cause I've had to take those, you know, hard looks in the mirror, figure out, take, take the losses with all the wins, and now understand that, okay, now I've got a clear path of what I want to do.

    9. JS

      How did you develop all these mindsets and principles? Where did you learn them from? Because you're like, I'm like talking to a philosopher over here.

    10. MC

      [laughs]

    11. JS

      Like, you know, like, no, but I mean it in a, I'm saying it in a positive sense. Like you've got ... It almost feels like you've got these codes that you follow and you're, you programmed your mind to think in a certain way. Where did you pick them up from along the way?

    12. MC

      My mom said the same thing recently.

    13. JS

      Oh, really?

    14. MC

      And I, and I don't really know where they've come from, but I just feel like if you're gonna have to do something, right, why not try and do it with a smile on your face? Right. If I gotta go to training, if I'm angry or not, I have to do it anyway. And I think one of the biggest moments, which I'll talk about right now, which I don't like to talk about and no one really knows, but the first Olympic qualifier I was on the way to, I believe Vegas to, to support Lewis for the race. My sister suffered a stroke, 37 years old. That was probably the hardest moment I've ever had to kind of understand, and I forget about the Olympics, right? I flew to Miami, opened the door, and I see my sister with a, with a feeding tube and a breathing tube. Unfortunately, you know, it, it's, it's the times when you have to just lean into it. And that was the first time I became a man, and it's the first time I ever saw my mom cry. Sorry, Mom. But I just was like, okay, this is happening. How do we find some type of silver lining in this moment? And, you know, sat in the hospital writing things down, journaling. All those past situations prepared me for this. I was able to just be a umbrella for the, for the family, and I think that was the moment where I was like, okay, wow, I, I got this. You know, she's got two beautiful kids, you know, obviously this is, you know-Domestic violence, which is, which is one thing which is awful. And I think this is my sister who, as a brother, she understands what I wanna do is, you know, is take care of my sister. And, you know, there's certain things that, you know, she won't tell you or these things because she knows what her, what her, what her brother would want to do. And I, I was like, "Okay, Miles, we're gonna figure this out." And I was able to make the Olympic team, which probably the first time any- anybody's gonna know while dealing with this. I would fly from Japan to Miami, spend some time in the hospital, help out with the kids, changing nappies for the first time, you know, just being there for my family. And my mom and, and dad did the most incredible job I've ever seen of just becoming parents again. And I think that's where whoever you believe in i- is, is testing you because he knows you can handle it. And I realized that I can handle anything. And it was kind of compartmentalizing this is, you know, going from the hospital ICU to a competition and somehow doing well is the biggest accomplishment I could... I don't even know how I did it, to be honest with you. I've got no idea [chuckles] . So g- making the Olympics was like, that was nothing. So I think that's when you feel helpless, right? And you feel like, "I can't do anything," because I literally can't do anything but just give positive love and energy. And I figured out a way to, if I can make my, my family feel at ease or smile and, you know, that's gonna help through this process. That to me was the first time I became a man, 100%. So now talking about it and, and, you know, showing people what I had to go through, I think you realize why I go so hard because there's nothing that will stop me or can stop me because I, I've seen my, you know, my sister on those ICUs, which is the scariest place to be. And as her brother, you know, making her smile and doing those things is why you're put on this, on this planet Earth. And I think you got people around you to talk about it. Um, you know, Lewis would f- fly in and see my sister. You know, that's the most emotional thing I've ever been through is just time and support. Knowing how busy he is and, and, you know, spends just being there for me is, like, beautiful. So I think if I can take that and as, like, my Dragon Ball Z and, you know, build that up and give it to the world, we c- uh, uh, we can do anything.

    15. JS

      Thank you for sharing. How is she now?

    16. MC

      She's getting much better. Yeah, thank you. She's,

  17. 44:50 – 46:38

    Staying True to Yourself Through Success

    1. MC

      you know, she's actually in London.

    2. JS

      Oh, no.

    3. MC

      Yeah, yeah.

    4. JS

      Okay, good.

    5. MC

      With her now she can fly again and-

    6. JS

      Okay

    7. MC

      ... you know, she's obviously recovery, you know, stroke is very extreme, so she still has to learn speech stuff back and-

    8. JS

      Yeah.

    9. MC

      But she can function on her own, and she's stronger than me, so. And as you know, as I'm still her little brother, but I became her b- big brother at that time.

    10. JS

      I've seen people I know go through strokes, and it's, I mean, yeah, it's one of the most scary things to watch someone you love go through.

    11. MC

      At 37.

    12. JS

      At 37. That's, yeah, that's-

    13. MC

      Healthy, run marathons. I can't run a marathon.

    14. JS

      Yeah.

    15. MC

      Yeah, you gotta, you know, choose your partner right and stress is, is, is a real thing.

    16. JS

      Yeah. It puts everything into perspective, those moments.

    17. MC

      It's funny because at that time the Olympics is, is everything for me. When you get there, perspective is mad because it's like that's actually the s- the smallest thing you could accomplish in my life because it's obviously different things I wanna do in my life. But it's funny how, like, at that time it's if I don't make it, my life is over [chuckles] . You know? And then you make it, you're like, "I'm so grateful," but there's so much more to life than just that.

    18. JS

      Miles, what are you most proud of in your life? 'Cause you talked about the hardest times.

    19. MC

      Yeah.

    20. JS

      Most difficult times. What are you most proud of so far?

    21. MC

      Never losing Miles along this journey. I'm still a 12-year-old kid, just 6'5" covered in tattoos, and changing my sport forever is probably the two things I'm most proud of. Winning's great, but changing a sport is bigger than any Olympic gold medal I could ever win. I got a message recently that this kid used to get bullied in school, um, a Black kid as well from North Carolina. Mom sent me a message. He showed them pictures, pictures of me at school and that changed, which is crazy to me, right? S- so, like, that to me is so cool.

    22. JS

      Mm-hmm.

    23. MC

      If I can

  18. 46:38 – 51:01

    The Role Models Who Shaped My Life

    1. MC

      just be a beacon of light to these kids, I've done my job. I think that's what I'm most proud of.

    2. JS

      I can see you, like, getting emotional about it.

    3. MC

      Yeah, I never thought, man, I never in my life thought I would ever have impact on these kids. Never. 'Cause in fencing I never had anyone that I wanted to look, look up to or be like. So if I can see these kids, you know, at the league, they come up to me and they're like, "I love you," I'm like, "I love you," you know, it's [laughs]

    4. JS

      [laughs]

    5. MC

      "I love you too."

    6. JS

      Yeah.

    7. MC

      But it's so beautiful to have this love from them, and the parents are like, "Oh, you're so nice and kind and normal." I'm like, "Yeah, my, my parents raised me to be this way." And I think at the end of the day we're all human beings and, and w- as long as you got a good heart and a good core, I think that, that's, that's the most important thing.

    8. JS

      Definitely. Definitely. And you're, you're surrounded by that too. I mean, like, you know, you mentioned Lewis there as well. Like, he's so humble. He's so down to earth. [laughs] Like-

    9. MC

      You never know

    10. JS

      ... you would never know. You would never know. Like, you know, he's the most unassuming guy.

    11. MC

      [laughs]

    12. JS

      And I feel like who are the other athletes that you admire, that you talk to, that you pick their brain, that you try and understand their process as well and how they live life?

    13. MC

      Well, one was definitely Kobe. You know, like, asking him questions like, "Do you really watch, like, lions eating prey before..." You know? He's like, "Yeah."

    14. JS

      [laughs]

    15. MC

      And I'm like, "Oh my God." And just, like, that mentality is so rare. You realize why he's, you know, the Mamba mentality. That's one of them for sure. Michael Strahan as well has been an amazing person of, of transitional from athlete to post athlete. But yeah, there's not that too many that I've spent too much time with, we're able to, like, sit down and really kind of dissect it.

    16. JS

      You're all busy. Everyone's got a crazy schedule.

    17. MC

      Yeah.

    18. JS

      Athletes have the craziest schedules.

    19. MC

      You know, it's, I understand your time is scarce, so it's not, might, might be the wrong time or whatever, but I would say definitely obviously Lewis, Michael, KobeThose are kind of the people that I'm able to, you know, you as well.

    20. JS

      [laughs] I'm not an athlete though, but yeah.

    21. MC

      I mean, you, like you said, you know, if you ... I think understanding your thoughts is, is the hardest sport.

    22. JS

      Yeah. Yeah.

    23. MC

      But yeah, there's not many I've really had the opportunity to spend time with beyond just, "Hi, I respect what you do and best of luck."

    24. JS

      Miles, what have I not asked you that you wish I did? What have you not shared? What have you not talked about?

    25. MC

      No, you've asked great, great questions. Geez.

    26. JS

      [laughs] I was just curious, man. I was like, you know, we just had fun last summer and that's all thanks to Lewis too. Big shout out to Lewis-

    27. MC

      Yeah

    28. JS

      ... for connecting us. But I'm like, we just had a good time and I was like, I wanna get to know this guy, you know? 'Cause you're obviously operating at a high level, but I didn't realize, and this is what I love about doing this, like this is why I love this podcast so much, is because I thought the most interesting thing was what you did. And now I'm sitting with you, I'm like, no, what you've been through and what you've lived through and what you've learned is so much more interesting. And, and I think that's the reason why the podcast is called On Purpose because it's people's purpose and their mission and their values and their belief is so much more fascinating than what we do for work. What we do for work is great, it's cool, but beyond that, there's a whole human that, you know, that lives and exists.

    29. MC

      Exactly. Exactly. And the human is like what keeps us going. It's the heart rate, it's everything. But at the end of the day, we have these gifts in life and it's like how are you gonna use these in the best way possible, right? So from a little kid from London to having two Nike shoes never in my life to creating a wa- to a fencing league is just all you need in life is self-belief. And I have that tattooed right here. That's all you need in life. If you have those, you know, pinnacles and those beliefs, you can do anything.

    30. JS

      Yeah.

  19. 51:01 – 53:20

    The Importance of Strong Male Friendships

    1. MC

      you know, these kinda surface level is like I know that if I was to ever like talk to you about something, you'd give me an, an honest answer. I think that's the key is I never want any friends or people around me that it's like, "Oh, are you doing good?" It's like, let me be real with you. And I think that's the key is whoever is around you is a reflection of yourself. So like, you know, all the boys, Spins, they're all just amazing humans that push me to be a better person. I think that's the key to, to why we're so special in our crew is because we keep each other accountable, we support each other, and we generally want each other to win for to- I think is a very rare thing for people, especially men in general.

    2. JS

      I was about to say that's what's so impressive about it is that it's a group of men who are killing it on their sports, like doing incredible things, but at the same time have this like brotherhood that you guys have all built with each other. That feels like a massive, massive thing to be proud of. Especially when right now men are, there's so much loneliness for men across the world.

    3. MC

      Yeah.

    4. JS

      Especially in the States, the loneliness statistics are so high and men don't know how to connect with each other. They can't pick up the phone to each other. What would you say to a man who's lonely, doesn't know how to pick up the phone to his friend and tell him how he feels? What would you say?

    5. MC

      This quote was, was we're just passing through and I tattoo it here where it's whatever moment you're feeling, know that's not forever, right? And I think that's something to understand is like this is not gonna be forever, but also people want to know what is really going on with you. And I think it's not a, you're not a burden. It's actually a gift to be able to like have your friends, you know, be honest and true to themselves about you. Like that's actually a, a, I love to hear that. Like it actually lightens my day whether it's a, a sad thing, it's like oh no, he really cares about me because he's coming to me as one of his last r- you know, kind of resorts. So I would just say you're, lean into however you're feeling, but please just call your friends. Like you're never alone. I'm grateful that I've never been in that situation, but if I ever was I know I could call any of my boys up and they'll get me through it. If you lose a race or lose a competition, I'ma call you like, "Bro, that's how I feel." And then you feel better. Just know that this emotion's not forever and it's actually beautiful to talk to your friends about it because it actually makes me feel good knowing that you're coming to me. So it's almost like it's therapy for, for the both of us. So I think if-

    6. JS

      Absolutely. Well said

    7. MC

      ... yeah, just-

    8. JS

      Yeah

  20. 53:20 – 57:17

    What is Inside a Professional Fencer’s Gear Bag?

    1. MC

      ... just talk and I, and being lonely like is, I don't want anyone to feel lonely. If I see a little kid at the club or at a competition, I'll just go up to them, "Hey man, how are you? You all right?" It takes two seconds and that might be like, "Oh, he said hi to me." Like that might change that everything. Also I think knowing your, your purpose and your celebrity in a mind of the fencing world, those moments change lives and I think seeing that is, is, is really, really cool. You know, I'll be driving sometimes I'll just, I'll just scream out, "Hey, I love you."

    2. JS

      [laughs]

    3. MC

      Why not?

    4. JS

      Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    5. MC

      You know? Just like those small little gestures are just nice.

    6. JS

      Yeah, yeah.

    7. MC

      And I think-

    8. JS

      Yeah

    9. MC

      ... you know, I'm just generally a happy person, but if I can actually really, really I'll leave you with this is Spins messaged me and it was a quote was like, "I make people feel better when they've left me" and it was the best thing I could, you know, I could ever- And he sent it to me. I was like-

    10. JS

      That is the best thing

    11. MC

      ... that feels, you know, like-

    12. JS

      That's my favorite type of person

    13. MC

      ... you know? Like that feels so nice. Like oh, I, I feel good now.

    14. JS

      Yeah.

    15. MC

      So if I can, if I can be that, please.

    16. JS

      So Miles, walk us through the gear 'cause this is gonna bring back some memories for me of course.

    17. MC

      Yeah, yeah.

    18. JS

      Yeah. So-

    19. MC

      I got you. So this is, these are my babies hereSo we have two masks

    20. JS

      What's the difference in the masks?

    21. MC

      Just like-

    22. JS

      Just the swag

    23. MC

      Yeah, yeah

    24. JS

      Yeah

    25. MC

      Just the swag

    26. JS

      Okay

    27. MC

      Um, and then-

    28. JS

      And you can see through these

    29. MC

      Yeah, perfectly

    30. JS

      Okay

  21. 57:17 – 1:02:28

    Miles on Final Five

    1. MC

      and-

    2. JS

      Was it hard to decide whether you fought for America or England?

    3. MC

      Yeah. I mean, Lewis just tells me every other day. But I'm like, "If you can get me knighted, bruv, we'll see"

    4. JS

      Oh [laughs]

    5. MC

      But, uh, but I did it-

    6. JS

      You'd switch [laughs]

    7. MC

      Yeah, yeah. Well, I didn't realize I was gonna be a professional fencer. I did it 'cause we needed, instead of an O2 visa, we needed to just stay in the country. And then my little sister was born in New York, and then that's how we got our citizenship. And then I was like, "Oh, wow," and then it was too late. Dude, they tried to have me do media training. I was like-

    8. JS

      Yeah

    9. MC

      ... to switch my accent

    10. JS

      Yeah

    11. MC

      You know, 'cause, "Oh, I'm from London." And then I was like, "I'm not, I'm like, I'm, I'm not gonna change it"

    12. JS

      Yeah, of course, man

    13. MC

      But, you know, obviously, you know, America's done amazing things for me, so I'm grateful for this country. Um, but obviously I was born in, you know, St. Mary's Hospital, so-

    14. JS

      Yeah, yeah [laughs]

    15. MC

      I'm still a London boy

    16. JS

      I love that

    17. MC

      But yeah, yeah, yeah

    18. JS

      So cool, man. Thank you for these gifts

    19. MC

      My pleasure, mate

    20. JS

      It's amazing

    21. MC

      I always like to come to someone and give someone something

    22. JS

      No, that's very-

    23. MC

      Shout out to-

    24. JS

      ... very thoughtful. That is very thoughtful

    25. MC

      Yeah, yeah

    26. JS

      Appreciate it. Miles, this has been amazing. Honestly, I feel like I got to know you on such a deep level. This is the good thing about a podcast too. Even when you think you know someone-

    27. MC

      Yeah

    28. JS

      ... you sit down and talk to them for, like, an hour and a half, and you're like, "Oh, wait a minute. I didn't realize." We end every episode of On Purpose with a Final Five. These questions have to be answered in one sentence maximum.

    29. MC

      Okay

    30. JS

      Miles Chamley-Watson, these are your Final Five. Question number one, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received?

Episode duration: 1:02:29

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