PARIS HILTON ON: Overcoming Abuse, Toxic Fame & Finding REAL LOVE | Jay Shetty

1. 0:00 – 5:19

   Intro

   1. PHParis Hilton0:00

      When that happened, you know, I was 14 years old and-

   2. JSJay Shetty0:04

      Wow

   3. PHParis Hilton0:04

      ... he completely took advantage of his power as a teacher at the school, and to be doing that to a little girl was just so wrong. The bestselling author and host.

   4. JSJay Shetty0:14

      The number one health and wellness podcast. On Purpose with Jay Shetty. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose, the number one health podcast in the world, thanks to each and every one of you that come back every week to become happier, healthier, and more healed. Now, you know my favorite thing in life is sitting down with people who are able to be open, vulnerable, and honest about their experiences in a way that we can all learn from, in a way that we can all feel inspired by and empowered by in our own lives, and today's guest is someone who has a new memoir out. Now, I've read this memoir cover to cover, and I can honestly tell you, it is one of the most authentic, open, genuine accounts that I feel allows someone to claim back their narrative, and I recommend you read it as well. And I'm gonna tell you who I'm sitting down with today. I have the fortune and honor of sitting down with the one and only Paris Hilton, CEO, New York Times bestselling author, philanthropist, DJ, designer, recording artist, actress, host, model, and influencer. Paris has defined and dominated pop culture, commanding her position as one of the most recognizable faces on the planet. I grew up watching her, so I know very well. Paris has masterfully harnessed her self-made spotlight to architect a thriving entertainment and consumer products empire which spans an impressive range of businesses and verticals, including TV, film, audio, music, publishing, licensing, consumer products, brand partnerships, and so many more. In 2006, she created Paris Hilton Entertainment, a multi-billion dollar company consisting of 45 branded stores, 19 product lines, and 29 fragrances that has amassed over $4 billion in revenue. In 2001, Variety declared Paris Hilton as a billion dollar entrepreneur in recognition of her successful business and global brand. Paris's new book is out now. It's called Paris: The Memoir. I literally just finished reading it and today we have Paris Hilton in the studio. Paris, thank you for being here.

   5. PHParis Hilton2:19

      Thank you.

   6. JSJay Shetty2:20

      I-

   7. PHParis Hilton2:20

      Thank you for the introduction.

   8. JSJay Shetty2:21

      Oh, I meant it, and congratulations. You know, I, whenever I sit down with someone who's written a memoir, and I want everyone who's listening to really understand this, because I think people see memoirs coming out and they see books coming out, and you just, you kind of think, like, "Oh, yeah, someone's just telling their story." And I think what I found really fascinating about yours is I can't imagine how hard it was to retell so many of these stories-

   9. PHParis Hilton2:50

      Mm

   10. JSJay Shetty2:50

       ... and to relive so many of them, and I just wanted to thank you for being able to go there so many times, because I think even though as in your own words, where people may think that they don't relate to you, I actually think that the stories you tell are so much more relatable than people would expect, and I just want to thank you for, for sharing them so vulnerably.

   11. PHParis Hilton3:11

       Thank you.

   12. JSJay Shetty3:12

       Yeah.

   13. PHParis Hilton3:12

       It was definitely very difficult and emotional, but extremely just therapeutic just putting it all out there, 'cause it's so much that I've held onto for so long and so many things that I've never told anyone, like, things I've never even wanted to say out loud because I didn't even want to think that they were real. But, um, it's just been, um, the most healing experience of my life.

   14. JSJay Shetty3:41

       So you feel it's actually been heal- even though it was uneasy-

   15. PHParis Hilton3:44

       Yes

   16. JSJay Shetty3:44

       ... it's actually been something that has been therapeutic. It's been healthier than unhealthy. Were there parts where you were like, "Oh, gosh, I just need a break from this," like?

   17. PHParis Hilton3:53

       Definitely. S- so many parts, just 'cause I've been through so many traumatic experiences in my life, so just to have to write them down, and then doing the audio book was even, that was even harder, having to say things out loud, especially in a room with three strangers I've never met before and having to tell my story. But I'm so happy that I did my audio book as well, because I think it's important for people to hear the story from the person who wrote it.

   18. JSJay Shetty4:20

       Yeah. That's such a great point, too. Even having to say it out loud for yourself, I think so many of us, we hold our truth so deeply buried inside of us, and we might think it, but we never actually speak it out loud, and that's, that's such a great example. I never thought about it like that. I think the other thing, before we dive in, I wanted to mention, which I loved about your memoir, is you were so phenomenally observant. I almost feel like you had a hawk eye, where, like, you were able, you're, like, able to, like, find all these details. You're incredibly smart, like, phenomenally, like, astute at just spotting these tiny details and patterns and connections, and the stories you tell and the history you tell, and I was, I, I really enjoyed it. I literally felt like you were talking to me. And I read it. I didn't listen to it. Uh, and now I'll have to listen to it, but I read it and I literally felt like I was like this talking to you.

   19. PHParis Hilton5:10

       Yes. [laughs]

   20. JSJay Shetty5:11

       Yeah.

   21. PHParis Hilton5:11

       Thank you. [laughs]

   22. JSJay Shetty5:11

       So it, it, it's hard to do that. It's hard to pull that off, so I, I just want everyone to know who's gonna read it that you, you're really gonna feel that. Where I wanted to

2. 5:19 – 7:48

   Trusting people too much can sometimes negatively impact us

   1. JSJay Shetty5:19

      start was you talked a lot about how, and I think this is completely true, you said most of us regret things that we didn't do, not things that we did do. But you said in your 20s there are a few things you do regret, and I was wondering, were there regrets that you did do or didn't do, and what were they?

   2. PHParis Hilton5:38

      For me, I feel that everything that I've done in life has made me who I am, and I'm such a strong person, and especially after writing this book and just seeing my life story and everything that I've been through, I feel that I don't have regrets in life, 'cause it's made me the woman I am today.

   3. JSJay Shetty5:59

      What made you say that, that chapter? Did I think you were just like, "Ah, I've got a couple of regrets." Like, even if they were silly ones, like, I'm guessing there weren't any big ones.

   4. PHParis Hilton6:07

      Relationships. Like, I wish I didn't meet certain people. Like, I, I wish I didn't let certain people in my life that shouldn't have been in my life, people with bad intentions, because I've, especially growing up, was just always just so trusting of ev- of everyone and would let anyone in, and there's so many people who just didn't deserve that.

   5. JSJay Shetty6:27

      Do you think you've got better at assessing and evaluating energy and intentions around you because of all your bad and negative experiences, as you were saying? Do you feel like you've found a better radar, or is it just something that we all keep making mistakes on because it's so hard? Because what I read is you wanna be a trusting person. You wanna be a, a loving person. You wanna feel loved, like we all do, but have you found that you've got better at it? And if so, what would you say you've got better at in terms of sensing people's energy and intention?

   6. PHParis Hilton6:57

      I think in the beginning, I was just unexperienced in life, so I, I really didn't know, and I had been through so much in life, so I think I was just, after the trauma that I experienced as a teenager, I was not, I don't know, I think in the right head space to make decisions on being in a relationship. Like, the first person I started a relationship with, I was not ready for that. And because of so many things that happened to me, my heart just had this huge wall around it for a very long time, and so many things had happened that it made me not trust anyone. And it wasn't until with my husband that I had those walls come down and I actually let someone in. But that took me a very long time, just from so many life experiences that

3. 7:48 – 9:52

   Paris explains how fame and money can drastically change people

   1. PHParis Hilton7:48

      made that me that way.

   2. JSJay Shetty7:49

      Yeah. And I wanna, and I wanna get to that, because I wanna talk about a lot of those things you just mentioned, but one line that really took me, like, kinda spellbound me in your book was, "Everyone was under the spell of love and money." And when I read that, I was thinking about it, and I was wondering, it kind of aligns with what you're saying here, that a lot of people with negative intentions or unhealthy intentions are often under the spell of love and money, and that makes them do crazy things. I mean, what were some of the craziest thing you saw people do, maybe not even to you, but what were some of those things that you saw when people were bound by this spell of love and money, as you say? What, what lengths have you seen people go to?

   3. PHParis Hilton8:29

      I just have seen people change where money can just take over their mind, and who they are as a person, and any, like, values they have would just go to the side. Just seeing people change, especially fame and money. I've just seen so many people come into this town, some people come and go, and the fame and the money get to their head so much where they become a different person and start thinking that they're better than others and treating others beneath them, and that's something that I hate more than anything. I... When someone is unkind to someone and treats someone as if they're lower than them, that's, like, one of the things that is one of my pet peeves.

   4. JSJay Shetty9:14

      Yeah, it's interesting, right? Like, you can't buy class.

   5. PHParis Hilton9:17

      Mm-hmm.

   6. JSJay Shetty9:17

      Like, fame and money can't buy class. I've always felt that way, that-

   7. PHParis Hilton9:20

      Yes

   8. JSJay Shetty9:21

      ... when you see people come into those things, it doesn't change your taste or your habits or your values. It kind of just amplifies who you already are. I think I've heard many people say where it almost just, it almost exposes you for who you really are when, when those things-

   9. PHParis Hilton9:36

      Yeah

   10. JSJay Shetty9:36

       ... come your way. Yeah.

   11. PHParis Hilton9:37

       Yes.

   12. JSJay Shetty9:38

       I think you said in the book, or, or you've said once before when asked about self-esteem, and I really wanna talk about the things that happened in your teenage years, but I think self-esteem is such a big topic in the world today, especially because of social media, especially because of

4. 9:52 – 13:27

   Opening up about your struggles and abuse is difficult but somehow rewarding

   1. JSJay Shetty9:52

      so much self-judgment and self-criticism. And when you've been asked before, you've mentioned, like, you're good at pretending sometimes, or you have been good at pretending, and I wonder, when was it that you allowed yourself to, to stop pretending and really start working on it? Like, like, what did that take? Because I feel like most of us, it's so much more easier to pretend, and we hide behind it. But I feel like you claiming your narrative back in this book was almost saying, "Well, I'm not going to let what's happened to me define my self-esteem." Would you say that's fair or?

   2. PHParis Hilton10:24

      Definitely everyone goes through that, and it took me a while just after what I had went through. My self-esteem was just destroyed from the things that were said to me and the abuse that I suffered, um, when I was a teenager at these troubled teen schools. I don't know, I don't even like to call them schools. And it wasn't until my documentary back in 2019 where I really started doing this just whole path of self-discovery and really just talking about so many things I had never told anyone. And then with now my book, that was the second part of it, 'cause I wasn't even ready at that point to open up in ways I did. But I've just grown so much in the past couple years, and then getting married with my husband, it's just my life has completely changed, and I'm gonna be always forever so grateful to Alexandra Dean, the director of my documentary, because that film literally changed my life.

   3. JSJay Shetty11:30

      Making it changed your life.

   4. PHParis Hilton11:32

      Yes, in so many ways. And now really just turning my pain into a purpose and helping make a difference in other people's lives has just been so rewarding, and I feel that people understand me in ways that they didn't before.

   5. JSJay Shetty11:48

      Yeah, yeah.

   6. PHParis Hilton11:49

      And it just feels really good to finally be understood.

   7. JSJay Shetty11:53

      I wanna tap into some of those events, because I think, I actually think there's more people suffering in silence than people who are vocal about the pain and what they've been through. And I think that what I meant earlier, which I said this to you offline, but I wanna repeat it here on the show, that- I think a lot of people, for a lot part of your life, see parts of your life as unrelatable. But then when you open up about these things in the book, I actually think I have a lot of friends, and especially women that I know, that have been through similar things but have never opened up and have held it tight or opened up to a couple of people. And so I'm hoping that with you opening up in this way, a lot of people will look at that and go, "Well, maybe I need to talk to someone or maybe I can reach out." So I, I wanted to talk about some of them. I mean, the first one that comes up is you have your teacher who you call Mr. Abercrombie, who's, like, manipulating you and grooming you and, and making you think in a certain way. And it's really interesting because our teenage years are these years where, like, we wait to be liked to feel likable, or we wait for someone to desire us to feel desirable, and I think you're in, like, eighth grade.

   8. PHParis Hilton13:04

      Yes.

   9. JSJay Shetty13:05

      And he's, he's preparing you in this way and then, you know, he takes you in his car one night and he kisses you and pulls you into him and, like, you know, it's completely against your will. You don't know what's going on. At the same time, it's nice to be, like, wanted, and you talk about that before. I can't imagine that being someone's, like, you know, first kiss to, to that degree and, like,

5. 13:27 – 16:09

   Holding on to uncomfortable things and finding the courage to talk about it

   1. JSJay Shetty13:27

      you talk about how, like, because your parents kind of caught you. And of course, the book goes into much more depth. I'm just synthesizing it for the, for the question. But you didn't want to talk about it with them, and they didn't talk about it with you. Like, what does it feel like when you hold onto uncomfortable things? What does that feel like, and then what gave you the courage to actually say, "I need to talk about this"?

   2. PHParis Hilton13:51

      For me, um, that's just how my family was. Like, we didn't like to talk about things, and for the... When that happened, you know, I was 14 years old, and he completely took advantage of his power as, you know, a teacher at the school, and to be doing that to a little girl was just so wrong. And, um, I'm so glad that my parents ended up driving out the driveway, 'cause who knows what he would have tried to do. And after that happened, I just didn't ever talk about it with my family up, up until a few weeks ago when I asked my mom and I said, "That night that you caught me in the car and you were chasing me in the car and everything, did you know who that was?" And she said, "No." And I was like, oh, I always thought my whole... Since I was a teenager, I thought that she knew that it was that, and she had no idea until now. She just thought it was some teenage boy.

   3. JSJay Shetty14:56

      Wow.

   4. PHParis Hilton14:56

      Mm-hmm.

   5. JSJay Shetty14:56

      Up till, like, a couple of weeks ago.

   6. PHParis Hilton14:57

      Literally up until a couple weeks ago when she read my book.

   7. JSJay Shetty15:01

      And what was her reaction to that? I mean, what did she-

   8. PHParis Hilton15:03

      In shock. She just couldn't believe it. She was in shock of so many things in the book. She... My sister and her, we just spoke about it, like, at my house a few weeks ago, and they were both just crying and saying, "I can't believe it. You didn't tell us any of this. Like, I wish you could have came to us." But it's just, it's hard to talk about things, and especially when you're raised in that way where you don't really talk about anything that's hard. It's been difficult. Um, but I'm so glad that I finally got the courage to do it, and I know that my story is really important, and I wish that I had this book back when I was a teenager because I would have definitely not felt so alone and misunderstood.

   9. JSJay Shetty15:53

      Yeah. Yeah, I, I mean, I... It's really interesting, isn't it? Family, like, we feel so close to... We all feel, and I think you do a... I think you really healthily talk about how, like, no one's family's perfect, but you love your family, but then there's complex, and that's, that's just... I think a lot of us

6. 16:09 – 19:39

   “The shame shouldn’t be on you, but on the person that hurt you.”

   1. JSJay Shetty16:09

      have that experience where it's like our families would say the same thing. Like, "Why didn't you tell me?" But then at the same time, it's like, "Well, if I told you, you may not have reacted in a way that was helpful." Did- do you feel like, did- do you feel like when your mom read that she, like, felt s- some guilt or, like, or how did she carry that? Like-

   2. PHParis Hilton16:26

      She definitely felt guilty, but I, I think as a kid, you just, you're scared. Like, "Oh, I'm gonna get in trouble." And think that's something that shame is such a powerful, powerful thing, and that's a really important message in my book, that the shame shouldn't be on you. It should be on the person that hurt you, and I felt like I just h- hold, held onto so much shame my whole life because of other people hurting me. And it feel... I think other people who have been through the same thing need to hear that as well.

   3. JSJay Shetty17:01

      That is so powerful. I just want everyone who's listening or watching right now to go back and listen to that because that, what you just said, is so true. I'm gonna try and repeat what Paris just said so beautifully, that when someone else does something to you, the shame should not actually be something you have to feel and experience. It's actually on them. And yeah, I was noticing that. I actually was, when I was making notes, it was like shame and embarrassment are these constant themes in the book, and it's so interesting because all of us in our lives, we always feel embarrassed for someone else. "What will my parents think of what I did?" Or, "I feel so ashamed of myself for what someone did to me," when actually what you just said is they should be feeling shameful of what they did. But like Mr. Abercrombie that day in the car, just drops you off and runs away because they wanna, like, just run away from that. And you start to realize actually that person is feeling so much shame-

   4. PHParis Hilton17:54

      Yeah

   5. JSJay Shetty17:54

      ... that they're trying to... They have to lie to themselves about it in order to escape it. But I love that. I hope that everyone who's listening just feels freed by recognizing that, that the shame you're feeling is actually for the person who hurt you to feel. And what, what really hit me was also just, again, talking about vocalizing things. You said it took you so long to even use the word pedophile-

   6. PHParis Hilton18:15

      Yeah

   7. JSJay Shetty18:15

      ... because you didn't wanna- Explain to us why it was important to use the word, but why it took you long.

   8. PHParis Hilton18:23

      I think that I h- had just been so manipulated by him, and I didn't wanna think of myself as a victim. But now, as an adult, I look back on that and think of when I have a daughter one day, and she's a teenager, and if someone had tried to do something like that to her, I couldn't even imagine, and it just angers me. And I never had told anyone that story, but I know it's an important story because I know that's something that happens every day to people.

   9. JSJay Shetty18:53

      I literally read your book as if I was reading it about my daughter. Like, that's how I was, like... And I don't have a daughter, but I was-- I have a younger sister who I've always been very protective of. And to me, when I was reading your book, that's literally the lens, what you just said, is how I read the book, where I was just like, "If this happened to my, like, my younger daughter or younger child, even son, like, whoever it is, I can't imagine how upset I'd feel if I didn't keep that door open for them." And I just wanna, you know, if there's any parents listening as well, I just hope that this inspires you to really keep that door open with your kids because it's so easy to judge them, and it's so easy to make it out like you made every right decision and your kids are making bad decisions. But I promise you, you'll be so much happier if

7. 19:39 – 21:52

   Children are so often scared to tell their parents about their struggles and they tend to keep it to themselves

   1. JSJay Shetty19:39

      the communication lines are always open. I mean, speaking of communication with parents, you, you said there were some things that were difficult for your mom to, mom and to discuss. Obviously, this was one of them. Like, what were the other things that you felt your mom really, like, was just shocked by and just felt like she wished you could have spoken to her about it?

   2. PHParis Hilton19:58

      My mom had me when she was 19, so she was a kid herself.

   3. JSJay Shetty20:03

      True.

   4. PHParis Hilton20:03

      And that generation, like, I think a lot of people really didn't talk about their feelings. Like, no one was talking about mental health. It was just, I think that generation is just how they were raised, so I could understand why she was that way. And now, ever since she's read my book and watched my documentary and has learned so much from me in that way, we've just never been closer. So it's been, uh, a really healing experience for both of us as well.

   5. JSJay Shetty20:37

      Yeah, and I hope that encourages anyone who's felt like that for a long time because like you're saying, most of us are not gonna tell our parents what we're doing when we're doing it. Like, I, I was the same. I had so many secrets from my parents. Like, my parents never knew about any of the girlfriends I had. My parents never knew about anything that I was up to because I was scared of them being mad at me and upset with me because the, the line in my house was, "Focus on your education. Don't worry about girlfriends." And so as a young boy, all you care about is having girlfriends.

   6. PHParis Hilton21:05

      Yeah.

   7. JSJay Shetty21:05

      And I was like, "Well, as long as I can get good grades, I'm just gonna carry on doing all this other stuff." And it's interesting because I feel like even as we get older, we're still scared of our parents, right?

   8. PHParis Hilton21:14

      [laughs] Yeah.

   9. JSJay Shetty21:15

      Like, it's almost like it never stops, and so it's, [laughs] it's so, it's so strange. Like, me and my wife talk about this all the time. Like, she talks about how, like, she's still scared sometimes to tell her parents, uh, about what she's up to or whatever.

   10. PHParis Hilton21:26

       Yeah.

   11. JSJay Shetty21:27

       Uh, right?

   12. PHParis Hilton21:27

       I always feel like a teenager with my parents.

   13. JSJay Shetty21:29

       Yeah.

   14. PHParis Hilton21:29

       I don't know why. I just... It's just how it is. [laughs]

   15. JSJay Shetty21:31

       Yeah, and all of us feel that way, and there's this, uh, there's-- It's so important that I think we get the courage even as adults because a lot of us are like, "Oh, that was the past. It doesn't matter." But actually, it will, it will actually change the relationship you have with your parents when, when you can actually open up the lines of trust. The- On the flip side, you have a beautiful relationship with your grandma. Like, that comes across in the book-

8. 21:52 – 24:10

   How does Paris view her grandma and what role she played in her life

   1. PHParis Hilton21:52

      Yeah

   2. JSJay Shetty21:52

      ... so, like, strongly and beautifully. And when you speak about her, I feel like it just comes out the page, and it's beaming, and, like, your, your appreciation and your admiration for her is just this amazing thing. What would you say is the lesson that you think has stayed with you that she taught you that is like, that you still carry with you every day? Like, what, what would you say that would be if you had to pick one?

   3. PHParis Hilton22:15

      She was just a force of nature. Like, would just walk in a room and light it up and always made me feel so confident. And I remember when I was a little girl, she told me that she went to a psychic, and the psychic said, "One day, your granddaughter is gonna be one of the most famous and most photographed women in the world." And she said, "I know that's gonna happen one day, and I just want you to always remain the same sweet, down-to-earth girl that you are with such a big heart and so kind, and never let that get to your head." And that was something that I always kept close to my heart, and nothing ever changed. No matter what happened in my life, I always remained the same sweet person, and I think that's so important to be kind, and that's something that she really instilled in me my whole life.

   4. JSJay Shetty23:07

      Yeah, I mean, that, that sounds like a great thing everyone should tell their kids. Like, I, I love all of that because it's almost like, "I believe in you. I know you're gonna be successful. But don't forget where you came from, who you are, and how you treat people." Like, that's what's, what's foundational and really important. And yeah, it's, it's-- we all need that figure in our lives, like, whether it's a grandparent, an uncle, an aunt, a friend who, who reminds us of who we need to continue to be because it's so easy to get distracted. But what I think is really interesting is how you kept that mindset when... So you go-- And I know you don't like calling it a school, and, and I agree from your-

   5. PHParis Hilton23:44

      Yeah

   6. JSJay Shetty23:44

      ... description of the CEDU, right?

   7. PHParis Hilton23:46

      CEDU.

   8. JSJay Shetty23:47

      CEDU, yeah.

   9. PHParis Hilton23:47

      Yeah, one of them, Provo Canyon School.

   10. JSJay Shetty23:49

       Yeah.

   11. PHParis Hilton23:50

       Cascade in ascent.

   12. JSJay Shetty23:52

       Yeah. So, like, looking at all of these facilities, even when they're taking you there, it almost feels like you're being kidnapped.

   13. PHParis Hilton24:00

       Yes.

   14. JSJay Shetty24:00

       You have handcuffs walking through an airport when you're not a convict or, you know, you haven't done something illegal.

   15. PHParis Hilton24:08

       No.

   16. JSJay Shetty24:08

       And then it's even like when

9. 24:10 – 26:59

   When everyone is telling you that you’re broken and you need to be fixed

   1. JSJay Shetty24:10

      they explain it, they're like, "We're going to this place to fix you." And your reaction is w- that there's nothing wrong to fix. Like, what do you fi... What I'm fascinated by is, like, how did you Hold onto the idea that there was nothing to fix when everything around you is programming you to believe that you're broken, you're wrong, and you're needing fixing. Like, how do you not take that all in?

   2. PHParis Hilton24:39

      I knew that I didn't deserve to be there. And, you know, I wasn't a bad kid. I, I lived a very strict life, um, very sheltered. Then I moved to New York City, started sneaking out, getting bad grades. And my parents talked to a therapist-

   3. JSJay Shetty24:58

      Yeah

   4. PHParis Hilton24:59

      ... who recommended that I go to these emotional growth boarding schools, and they had no idea. They just thought it was a normal boarding school. And, um, the way they take kids to these places is they have two men come into your room in the middle of the night and say, "Do you want to go the easy way or the hard way?" And literally hold up handcuffs, and this is how children are brought to these places. And, um, it's extremely traumatizing. That's something that I had severe nightmares for t- two decades. It wasn't until my documentary and all the advocacy work that I've been doing that those nightmares have finally went away. But for me, I just always thought to myself that I am, I know that I'm a good person, I don't deserve to be in here, and that was the only thing that caught me, keep me, kept me going, was who I was gonna become and what I wanted to be when I got out of there.

   5. JSJay Shetty25:58

      Did you see other people break down? Like, did you see-

   6. PHParis Hilton26:00

      Yes

   7. JSJay Shetty26:00

      ... other people around you just like... Because I, I find that to be one of the hardest things, where if you're being told you're broken, if you're being told you're wrong, if you're being told you're wrong and, you know, letting your parents down, and, and by the way, you're doing very normal things at this point.

   8. PHParis Hilton26:16

      Yes. [laughs]

   9. JSJay Shetty26:16

      Like, there's like, you know, like, I think sneaking out, you know, getting, getting bad grades, getting in trouble is actually pretty normal for any teenage kid. Like, it's-

   10. PHParis Hilton26:24

       And I had attention deficit-

   11. JSJay Shetty26:26

       Yeah

   12. PHParis Hilton26:26

       ... disorder, which no one knew because no one was talking about that either.

   13. JSJay Shetty26:31

       Yeah.

   14. PHParis Hilton26:32

       So that's the reason I couldn't pay attention in school and was getting bad grades, and no one knew why. They just thought that I was purposely trying to not pay attention, but I just really couldn't focus.

   15. JSJay Shetty26:43

       Yeah. Yeah, and it's incredible to think that, and this, I think this is what's coming out so much today, where people who weren't able to focus at school because of ADHD or, or, or other challenges that they have are doing phenomenally well in business-

   16. PHParis Hilton26:55

       Yes

   17. JSJay Shetty26:55

       ... and in life, and it's like you start to recognize that there isn't this

10. 26:59 – 30:01

    Turning your supposed ‘incapability’ into your own super power

    1. JSJay Shetty26:59

       correlation between... It, it's not like, oh, if you did got good grades, you had a great career or great profession. It could very well be the opposite. How, how do you find you've been able to... What's different about business than school, I guess, that you've been so passionate about and been so prolific at, that you feel is different about how you approach school?

    2. PHParis Hilton27:19

       I feel that my ADHD, I consider it my superpower, and I think that's why in business and everything that I've done, I've always been very future-thinking and thinking outside of the box and being a risk-taker and someone who is an innovator and pioneer, and I really attribute that to my superpower of ADHD. [laughs]

    3. JSJay Shetty27:46

       [laughs] Yeah. But how, how do you, how do you, I guess, not... How does not always being able to force yourself to focus actually become a superpower in business? Like, that, how does that work?

    4. PHParis Hilton27:57

       Thinking in a different way.

    5. JSJay Shetty27:58

       Mm.

    6. PHParis Hilton27:59

       And with ADHD, my doctor, Dr. Hallarow, says that it's like having the brain of, like, a Ferrari with bicycle brakes, so you're kind of just always moving really fast and thinking really fast, and I think that's why in business I've done so many things first because I just, I don't know, just t- took a risk, and I'm impulsive.

    7. JSJay Shetty28:24

       [laughs] Yeah. And that can s- And that's interesting, isn't it? Because it's almost like in school everything has to have a process and a method and a approach, whereas sometimes in business actually trying something out and being impulsive or making a intuitive decision can actually work out, whereas being intuitive, school is not valued at all.

    8. PHParis Hilton28:45

       Yeah, I think I just found it to be boring.

    9. JSJay Shetty28:46

       [laughs]

    10. PHParis Hilton28:47

        Besides, I loved art class, uh, music class, but math was not my favorite. [laughs]

    11. JSJay Shetty28:53

        Yeah, yeah. My favorite subjects at school were art and design, philosophy, and I, I was, I, I enjoyed economics because of how, how it was taught. But art and design and philosophy were by far my favorite subjects at school. And it's really interesting because when I was at school, all I'd ever hear is, "Jay, those are dumb subjects to focus on. Don't focus on those subjects. They're not gonna get you a job." And now when I look at my life, I feel like my entire life is art and design, philosophy, and economics.

    12. PHParis Hilton29:20

        Yes.

    13. JSJay Shetty29:20

        Like, that's, that's literally it. And so it's interesting how we all have strengths that, that we miss out on. I wanted to roll back a few years because the experience that you describe about meeting the guy in the mall, and then it's almost like you go through this experience and you wake up the... You wake up and you're like, you know what's happened, but again, it's another moment where you don't want to tell anyone about what's happened. And I just feel every time I was reading your book and I read these points, it was like a punch in the gut for me. I was just like, "I can't believe it, that something keeps happening that is not something that

11. 30:01 – 34:58

    Paris recalls how she was abused and how she tried to hide it because of shame

    1. JSJay Shetty30:01

       you're inviting or encouraging, and it's someone taking advantage. It's someone going far beyond any point of consent."

    2. PHParis Hilton30:10

       Yeah.

    3. JSJay Shetty30:10

       And again, you're having to hold onto it. Can you walk us through that and just talk again about what it feels like to have to hold onto something the second time around, especially when this is, like, from your first kiss to your first sexual experience? How does that keep accelerating internally? Like, what's going on internally?

    4. PHParis Hilton30:28

       That was another thing in my book that I had never told anyone. Like, after that happened, I never said it out loud again and just tried to forget it. And, um, my friend and I were at the mall when I was 15 and a half.

    5. JSJay Shetty30:46

       15, yeah.

    6. PHParis Hilton30:47

       Yeah. And we had met these two older guys that we had seen, like, every weekend there, and they got our numbers and invited us over. And I had never drank alcohol in my life before, and he had these wine berry coolers, these wine coolers, and kept telling me to drink it and pressuring me, and I kept saying no. And then he was like, "It's open. Just do it." So I had a couple sips, and then, uh, I was roofied and knocked out and woke up with him on top of me and whispering, "You're dreaming, you're dreaming." And, um, that was just terrifying to go through and something that I felt ashamed for when, again, that was not my fault. This was someone who took advantage of a young girl.

    7. JSJay Shetty31:40

       And, and how did it feel like a second time thinking, "I can't tell anyone again"? I guess my question is would, would shame and embarrassment keep cycling in this way? Do you feel like you literally held onto that shame and embarrassment until the doc and the book? Like, would you say you've carried it for that long? And what does that feel like as it festers?

    8. PHParis Hilton32:00

       It's extremely, it's isolating. You just feel alone, just like that no one knows, but it's something that you're holding onto. And yeah, it was something that I held onto until I wrote it in my book because I know that has happened to so many other people, and ever since I've released my book, so many people have written me letters and contacted me on social media or met at my book signings that have went through the same experience, and they were all thanking me for them not feeling alone and them being able to talk about it for the first time and hold the people accountable for what they did to them.

    9. JSJay Shetty32:42

       And why do you think we do that? Why do you think we don't keep those people accountable, but we see it as our mistake or our ... Like, you know, you walk away thinking, "I'm such an idiot. I'm so stupid. I shouldn't have done that." Like, why do you think that is? Why is it that we just reflect it back onto ourselves, seeing as you've gone through things like that?

    10. PHParis Hilton33:02

        I don't know why we do that. I wish I knew why. But I think when people can talk about things like this and it makes others feel safe to be able to talk about it as well, and that's something that I'm working on every day, just all of this. This is ... Like, I have been healing, but there's so much there, and I've now put it out to the whole world, and it's just ... It's been, um, hard just talking about it and just thinking about it.

    11. JSJay Shetty33:37

        Yeah.

    12. PHParis Hilton33:37

        But again, I know it's important for others to hear.

    13. JSJay Shetty33:41

        We're so quick to judge others, so when we hear about these things, if it's never happened to us, we always think, "Oh, but they could have avoided it." And then when it happens to you, you reflect that judgment onto yourself and you think, "Oh, I could have avoided it."

    14. PHParis Hilton33:57

        Yeah.

    15. JSJay Shetty33:57

        And so it's almost like the more we judge others, and we're quick to judge others, we actually judge ourselves more. And the more we judge ourselves more, the more we are judging others, and it kind of becomes this vicious cycle where we judge ourselves, we self-sabotage, we self-criticize. Then we judge others, we criticize them, we point fingers, and it just keeps going round. And it's almost like if we gave ourselves more grace, we'd give others more grace, and if we gave others more grace, we'd give ourselves more grace. And I do think that when people tell their stories, like, I, I can't relate or say I've gone through anything that you've gone through, but hearing your story, and I'm sure for the people who have been victims and have gone through these things, ho- I'm hoping that it creates a sense of empathy and compassion and grace for everyone. Because I think the reason we don't tell everyone is because we think that they somehow think it was our fault.

    16. PHParis Hilton34:49

        Mm-hmm.

    17. JSJay Shetty34:50

        Would you-

    18. PHParis Hilton34:50

        They judge you.

    19. JSJay Shetty34:51

        Yeah. And have you felt this time when you've opened up through your book, do you still feel that there's been judgment back? Because I know in the past when

12. 34:58 – 38:44

    Finally getting the understanding you deserve for going through so much suffering as a child

    1. JSJay Shetty34:58

       things have happened, there's been a sense of ... Like you've talked about before, like the idea of when you, uh, se- when you're seen as a sex symbol, it's like you're like, "I like the symbol part because that's, like, iconic," but it's like when people start labeling you, would you say that this time when you're sharing the book, you felt that people have really received it well through the book as opposed to other ways? Or do you still find that there's still some judgment that's always gonna be there?

    2. PHParis Hilton35:25

       The reaction to the book has just been incredible, just overwhelming with so much love and support, and just the things that people have said to me at the book signings and every single interview, and people are just ... It just feels amazing to finally be understood and have people respect me and have empathy and kindness. And I feel because I had pa- played a character for so long, people had no idea, and now they know that there's so much more to me, and that's been incredible. I f- I haven't felt any, any negative energy at all, so that's just been the best feeling ever.

    3. JSJay Shetty36:13

       That makes me so happy.

    4. PHParis Hilton36:14

       Yeah.

    5. JSJay Shetty36:14

       I'm so happy to hear that, honestly.

    6. PHParis Hilton36:15

       Yes.

    7. JSJay Shetty36:15

       Congratulations.

    8. PHParis Hilton36:16

       Thank you.

    9. JSJay Shetty36:17

       You, you deserve that, and little Paris deserves that too, and, you know, I'm so happy to hear that because I think being understood is, is the hardest thing, and especially being understood for the trauma that's unseen. Like, everyone sees the Page Six or sees-

    10. PHParis Hilton36:32

        Yeah

    11. JSJay Shetty36:32

        ... the front cover or sees whatever, but no one really- Really sees the inner child that actually went through all of this, because that's, that's the part of you that the character's covering. The character's not covering the truth. It's covering the inner child that's experiencing all of this and is not mature enough and not smart enough and not ready enough to endure so much suffering and, and so much pain.

    12. PHParis Hilton36:58

        Yeah.

    13. JSJay Shetty36:59

        Does your inner child feel safer now? Does it... Or, or how do you think about your inner child with the healing work that you're doing?

    14. PHParis Hilton37:05

        Finally feel safe, just with everything. My husband is just so incredible. Having my little baby boy, I just feel that my life is-

    15. JSJay Shetty37:13

        Well deserved

    16. PHParis Hilton37:14

        ... thank you, complete finally. I just feel that I've built a real life, and I'm just so proud of everything that I've accomplished. And just reading my story, I'm a survivor and I'm a badass. [laughs]

    17. JSJay Shetty37:30

        [laughs] I love that. That's- I mean, it's- you definitely are. You definitely are. It's, uh... But, and, and you see it, you know? It's like, it's challenging because, you know, there's so many people that the media kind of naturally picks on in that way, and sometimes it's good for business and sometimes it makes sense for the character and- but there's always more going on, and I feel like you and, you know, even someone who's your close friend, like Britney Spears as well, like have both had the kind of tabloid clickbait articles, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And I think you went to her wedding last year too-

    18. PHParis Hilton38:06

        Yeah

    19. JSJay Shetty38:06

        ... and you've, you've stayed strong even though sometimes the media pits you against each other or does that. How have you managed? Because I feel like there's something really interesting that's happened in, in culture. When you started influencing, using that word from your book, there was a lot of like, even, even for actors back in the day and musicians, what I've heard is it was like, well, you can, you are the only influencer, and everyone else can't be. If they come up, then you're gonna go down. I had a lot of actors tell me that what they were told is, "You have to be the number one Black actor, and if you're friends with the other Black actor, then you can't be friends because people are gonna choose one of you." And I feel like that happens

13. 38:44 – 42:38

    Getting women support from other women as a celebrity

    1. JSJay Shetty38:44

       in culture and race, it happens in careers, it happens in industries. How did you manage to keep a real friendship with Britney during a time when all of this is happening to both of you at the same time? Like, how do you keep a genuine relationship at that level where you're both these, these huge tabloid targets?

    2. PHParis Hilton39:03

       For me, 'cause we understand each other, and she's one of the kindest, most down-to-earth people and is just so lovely. I think it's important when women support each other because we're all in this together, and I think the 2000s were definitely about trying to pit women against each other in the media, and they were so cruel to us and targeted us, and it was really difficult to have to deal with just the constant pressure from the media and people inventing stories and paparazzi chasing, and it was just really crazy time. But it's important when then you can have friends around you that can understand that 'cause they go through the similar experiences.

    3. JSJay Shetty39:55

       Yeah. I think, I think that's the hardest part, right? Like, there's only like 1% of people who are having any given experience, and that applies across the board. And it's like if you're not friends with people who are going through the same thing and have the courage to open up to each other, you can feel so alone.

    4. PHParis Hilton40:11

       Yeah.

    5. JSJay Shetty40:11

       And it's amazing that you've been able to maintain that because it almost feels like as more rumors get told, you're more scared. Is that- would you say that's fair? Like, do you feel as more comes out about you that's not true, you become more fearful how people view you? I think in the book you talk about one point, like, you're like, "Every room I go into, I know what people have seen or what they know." I guess my question is how has that stopped you from just closing off and hiding and actually going, "Well, no, I'm still gonna be who I want to be"? Because I can imagine that when you walk in already feeling like you have a big sign on your forehead, it's, it's hard to walk into new places, but you t- keep doing it with business. You keep walking into boardrooms. You keep walking into new environments. Like how have you found that strength?

    6. PHParis Hilton40:55

       Just from being in this business for so long and also what I went through as a teenager at these schools just made me, I think prepared me for Hollywood in a way because I had just been through such abuse that literally I could take anything. You build a tough skin when you're constantly around this, for sure.

    7. JSJay Shetty41:18

       The, the abuse in the schools was worse?

    8. PHParis Hilton41:20

       Yes. So it definitely prepared me for anything.

    9. JSJay Shetty41:24

       Are you still friends with anyone who went to the schools that you kind of stayed connected with, and have they kind of found themselves again or-

    10. PHParis Hilton41:31

        I reconnected with some of the people that I was there with, um, and it's just been amazing just to come together and tell our stories and just have made so much impact, and now I've changed laws in nine states and now going back to Washington, DC in two weeks to introduce our new bill to push for federal legislation. So it's just been really empowering just to meet with people that have been through the same thing as me and who knew me before all of this, and now to really fuse our voices and are now saving children's lives.

    11. JSJay Shetty42:13

        I'm, I'm so glad that we're talking about this on, on purpose because I feel like that is such a journey of pain into purpose, and I think you said it in your book that actually when you started helping and doing this work and not just doing this work of trying to help the people who went there, but trying to change laws so that people never end up there in the first place. Like that approach

14. 42:38 – 44:47

    Pushing for a change in schools where abuse are happening

    1. JSJay Shetty42:38

       is When you actually started to feel like you were healing.

    2. PHParis Hilton42:43

       Yes.

    3. JSJay Shetty42:43

       Like when you're actually not just trying to heal yourself, but when you're trying to help others, that's when you really felt it. Can you walk us through how hard it is to try and push forward a new bill or change legislation in nine states? Like, can you walk us through, like, just how technically challenging that is and, and what you come up against? Because I don't think... We always hear these announcements, but I don't think people know what goes into that.

    4. PHParis Hilton43:05

       This is every day of my life. Working, I have Rebecca Melendrez, my head of impact, um, at Eleven Eleven Media, and we are constantly speaking with senators, traveling, going and telling my story. Um, I've been back and forth to DC, and this is a multi-billion dollar industry, so there's-

    5. JSJay Shetty43:30

       The schools?

    6. PHParis Hilton43:31

       Yes.

    7. JSJay Shetty43:31

       Yeah.

    8. PHParis Hilton43:31

       There's thousands of these schools. There's hundreds of children that have died in these places. Um, just the reports we have of abuse and peop- there's no regulations and, um, it's just a lot having to go in there and, and really push for this because people don't understand. They don't know what's happening behind closed doors. And since it's such a profitable industry, it's also difficult because there's so many people that are trying to fight us against it. But when I actually go there and speak to them face to face and they hear the stories of myself and the other survivors that I bring with me, that's when they understand what's happening. And when people know that that's happening, they can't just ignore it.

    9. JSJay Shetty44:19

       Mm.

    10. PHParis Hilton44:19

        So everyone that we've been speaking to, when they hear and we actually go there, that's when it really makes a difference, and I think that's why we've been so impactful.

    11. JSJay Shetty44:31

        What do you say to survivors or of the schools or even people that you've been, who've been through abuse? Like, what do you, what do you, what... How can a friend help someone, a friend in their

15. 44:47 – 47:00

    It’s helpful to know that you have friend who listens to you and you have a safe space where you can feel at ease

    1. JSJay Shetty44:47

       life who's gone through some sort of abuse? Like, how do you be a good friend to that? Because I can imagine that a lot of people are listening right now going, "I don't know what to say to my friends 'cause I don't, I've never been through it. I don't know how to connect." Like, w- what's helpful?

    2. PHParis Hilton44:59

       It's just helpful to know that they can tell you and that you'll be there for them and not judge them and let them know it's not their fault. And just think of being able to talk about it and having a safe space where you can make them feel supported and just know that you're there for them, uh, and whatever they need.

    3. JSJay Shetty45:25

       And what do you think, like, really creates that safe space? Because I feel for so many people, we think we're so close to so many people, but you almost figure out that you're not. There's only a few people you can- and then you, you even named some of your closest friends who've kind of been through the same stuff. But like, what really defines a safe space for you? You know, what is... You've talked about the relationship that you have with Carter, your husband, and the space you have right now, but what has made it safer? Like, what's actually created that environment differently now than you've ever had?

    4. PHParis Hilton45:54

       'Cause I have people around me that I can trust, and it's definitely about knowing that when you say something that people are not gonna go and repeat it. So that's something that I've just learned over the years, even before I would test people in my life and tell them some fake rumor and then just see if it would end up in Page Six or in the media, and that was a big test back in the day that I would do with people, and a lot of people failed that test. And now I ha- I don't have anyone around me that I would even have to worry about that with, and that's something that's really important to me is trust because trust and loyalty is priceless to me.

    5. JSJay Shetty46:40

       That's such a great test.

    6. PHParis Hilton46:42

       Yeah. [laughs]

    7. JSJay Shetty46:42

       That's such a great, that's such a great test.

    8. PHParis Hilton46:44

       Yeah.

    9. JSJay Shetty46:45

       If anyone's wondering if you have a real friend, tell them a fake rumor about yourself and see who, see if it comes back to you.

    10. PHParis Hilton46:50

        Exactly.

    11. JSJay Shetty46:51

        That's like, wow. What was the fakest thing you ever said? Do you remember? What was, like, a rumor that-

    12. PHParis Hilton46:56

        I don't even-

    13. JSJay Shetty46:56

        ... like, the ones you pushed the boundaries on?

    14. PHParis Hilton46:59

        I don't even remember.

16. 47:00 – 52:54

    Finding it difficult to deeply connect with someone because of fear and past trauma

    1. PHParis Hilton47:00

       Maybe just like, oh, there was, like, a guy or something. Like, I have no idea. Just something stupid and then it would end up and I would be like, "Oh, man."

    2. JSJay Shetty47:08

       [laughs]

    3. PHParis Hilton47:09

       [laughs]

    4. JSJay Shetty47:10

       How does it feel? Because at one point in your book, I think, you know, you talk about this reputation that you developed in the media of like, oh, she sleeps around, she's always with lots of men, and then it's like... And you're like, "Well, that just wasn't the case." Was there a part of you that it was just that was part of the character and it worked, or was there a part of you that just felt, "No, that's not true. I want people to know"? Like, how, how did you process that?

    5. PHParis Hilton47:34

       I just knew that it wasn't true, and in the media, any time I was seen with someone at a party or whatever, people would just assume that that was the case. But no one had any idea what I had went through that had made me really fearful. Like, even though I was known as this sex symbol, I didn't feel that way inside at all, and I was so scared to let people in. That's why a lot of my relationships didn't work because I was, like, a teenager in a way where I only would want to kiss and make out, and that was it. And a lot of people wouldn't be able, for themselves to stay loyal because all I would do is kiss, and they wanted more. And then the media, they just assumed that it was a lot more wilder than it really was because in reality it was actually quite innocent.

    6. JSJay Shetty48:26

       Yeah. And did you just accept that? You just realized you couldn't change that narrative and it was gonna be what it was gonna be, or was it something you didn't pay attention to?

    7. PHParis Hilton48:37

       I just tried just to not pay attention to things. I just feel that The media just always was constantly inventing rumors about me, and I just felt like a target a lot of the times 'cause I just felt that it was s- myself and then a certain group of girls that they would do this to.

    8. JSJay Shetty48:55

       What I find the most amazing thing is even in this interview, so many times you've said, "I'm in a better place now. I'm in a..." And I, and I know you're saying there's still healing. I know you're not saying it's figured out and it's perfect. I don't, I don't think that's what you're saying. Uh, but what I'm hearing is like, you know, I've worked through things, I've found a good partner, like I'm in a healthy space. I think the hardest, hardest thing after going through all of these things from an outside perspective is how do you trust another man? Like, right? Like, it's like you've had all these men who've abused you, mistreated you, who've exploited you with the sex tape, who've, who've, who've used your image in ways without even ever consulting or any sort of consent and comple- you know? So and it's like you've gone through all of this. How do you even think about dating someone, let alone marrying someone for real? Like, because I feel like that requires so much of yourself, and although you're sitting here and obviously, you know, you're a new mom and like and I'm so happy, but I can only imagine that I've had... And I've had people, by the way, ask me this question when I'm on tour, where they'll say to me, "Jay, I've just been so abused or misused or mistreated. How do I love again? How do I trust again?" How have you continued to believe in real love and real trust and loyalty when you've seen the complete opposite your whole life?

    9. PHParis Hilton50:17

       It was extremely difficult just not being able to let anyone in for so long, and with Carter, I wasn't even looking for love at this point. This was back in 2019. I had went home to the Hamptons for Thanksgiving, and I saw Carter that day at Thanksgiving lunch, and he was just so sweet and kind to his mom, and it was just so different than all the other guys. And he's a Midwestern boy from a town of 800 people, and he's just like this sweet, nerdy, like, cute, like, just kind person who's... doesn't care about fame or any of this. He's just so the opposite of everyone that I've ever known and just has this incredible family values and is just this angel. Like, I really believe that my grandmother and his dad are up in heaven and planned for us to meet because right away it was just so different, and this like electricity that I had never felt. And, um, it was literally like we were inseparable right away. We moved in with each other, and it just... Then the world shut down in March, so then we were really together. Before that, I'd been on the road and traveling over 250 days out of the year for two decades. So I never really had time to get to know someone because I was always on a plane. So just having to be in one place and not the world shutting down, and it was just me and him together. And I feel like times during COVID, like one year of that is like seven years of like my normal life because my life is usually so, um, busy with everything I'm doing. So all of that has just been like... I don't know, it's just been so different than any other relationship where I just felt like this is my destiny.

    10. JSJay Shetty52:23

        That's beautiful.

    11. PHParis Hilton52:24

        Mm-hmm.

    12. JSJay Shetty52:24

        Congratulations.

    13. PHParis Hilton52:25

        Thank you.

    14. JSJay Shetty52:26

        I'm so, so happy to hear that. I can see you come to life and you like-

    15. PHParis Hilton52:28

        Yeah

    16. JSJay Shetty52:28

        ... there's a, there's a, there's a glow when you're talking about Carter, which is, which is really beautiful to see. But how, how and when did you start feeling comfortable with talking to him about what had gone on? Because I'm guessing that was a safe space probably the first time you'd felt it from someone you were close to.

    17. PHParis Hilton52:48

        Mm-hmm.

    18. JSJay Shetty52:49

        What was that process like? Because I can imagine it's also really scary to be like, "I found

17. 52:54 – 55:57

    Finding genuine love and allowing yourself to be vulnerable and intimate with another person

    1. JSJay Shetty52:54

       a really great thing. Now I'm gonna share what my real trauma is and challenges is, and how does this affect, like, will that person stay? Will they run away?" These are like the real things real people think about. How did you get-- How did you start sharing what you'd been through, and when did you start feeling like you wanted to do that?

    2. PHParis Hilton53:12

       It was just... I feel that timing is everything, and I had just finished filming my documentary when we started dating. So I was already going through this whole just like emotional journey, and then I showed him my documentary, and he was the first person I had showed it to. So he learned so much about me from that, and then he just started asking me so many questions, and since I had already opened about it in the film, I felt, I feel like that really prepared me for being able to speak about it in real life to people. [laughs]

    3. JSJay Shetty53:48

       Do you remember an interesting question he asked you about your experience that you felt like really brought you both closer together? Like, was there something specific that he asked about that when you... and what was your answer and one that-- something that brought you closer together than you were before that?

    4. PHParis Hilton54:02

       Yeah. I think it was just the way he was. He just actually listened, and he started crying during certain parts of our conversation 'cause he s- felt just so emotional for what I had went through, and just to see someone cares that much really just made me trust him even more, just to know that he cared so much to even, I don't know, have a conversation like that 'cause I feel like I just had never really had such a deep conversation with someone before.

    5. JSJay Shetty54:37

       Mm. You, you said that you don't cry about a lot of this much anymore, but when did you really allow yourself to cry about it and feel it through? When was that opportunity you gave yourself?

    6. PHParis Hilton54:52

       A lot of times I would cry just, just after going through things in life and just feeling so alone, just coming home at the end of the night and having no one to talk to about it. Um, just a lot of times in my life, and especially after my documentary and writing my book, just rereading all of that has just been, um, so emotional just to have to feel it all.

    7. JSJay Shetty55:26

       Yeah. Yeah. You even spoke about, you know, hiding your pregnancy from your family, and that was something that you and your, you know, you and Carter kind of kept to yourself. And I, I was, when I, when I first learned about that, I was like, that was so interesting to me because it seems like in one sense, your life since you were young has been so public and so broadcasted and so overly commented upon and been out there, and then almost you're having this really precious, personal, beautiful moment. And

18. 55:57 – 1:01:59

    Why living a very public life made Paris more protective of her own family

    1. JSJay Shetty55:57

       my interpretation was that it was a protection of like, no, this needs to be personal and private and sacred and, and special. Is w- is that what was going through your mind of why you wanted it to be so private? Like, what, how did that decision come about, where it's like, no, well, actually, this is the one thing that is gonna be that way?

    2. PHParis Hilton56:15

       I just felt that my life has been so public for over two decades of being in this whole industry, and with my baby, I just felt that this was something that I didn't want all the outside opinions from the world or just the online trolls or anyone talking about my son until he was here on this, in this point world and healthy and safe. And I just, I don't know, I just feel like I wanted to keep that for me. So no one knew about it till he was literally a week old.

    3. JSJay Shetty56:53

       Wow.

    4. PHParis Hilton56:53

       Mm-hmm.

    5. JSJay Shetty56:54

       What's the pleasure in public broadcast, and what's the sweetness in private, sacred, personal experience? Talk to me about the difference of the joy you get from, like, being in media and being on stage, being in front and center, and then what's the difference in how it feels when you get to have a special experience like that? I just want everyone to hear, because I think those are two things we crave and chase.

    6. PHParis Hilton57:21

       For me, I love to make other people happy and feel that energy and love, and it's just an amazing feeling. Um, but then to be with my baby boy and just have him laying on my chest and looking up at me and I with those innocent eyes and just this little sweet, precious angel who's just my world. So they're two different feelings. Like, one is just exciting, but then the other one is actually just true real love.

    7. JSJay Shetty58:02

       Mm.

    8. PHParis Hilton58:03

       And I feel that for so long, I always considered all of that type of attention love, but now I know what real love truly is.

    9. JSJay Shetty58:14

       Wow. Yeah. That, that hit.

    10. PHParis Hilton58:16

        Yeah. [laughs]

    11. JSJay Shetty58:16

        Uh, that hit. I want everyone to take that away, that we often think of attention as love. We think of validation as love. We think of compliments as love, but love actually isn't any of that. Those are just almost like fake currency or fake money.

    12. PHParis Hilton58:35

        Yeah.

    13. JSJay Shetty58:35

        And yeah, real love is, is what you're experiencing now with your baby boy and with Carter and with yourself at the deepest level. Like, do you feel that... We hear these words like self-love and self-care all the time now. They're, they're all over the world, but how do you define self-love now? Like, do you feel like this is the first time in your life that you've allowed yourself to love yourself, or have you loved yourself throughout all of this?

    14. PHParis Hilton59:01

        It's the first time I've gotten to know myself, so therefore I could really love myself because I feel that for so long I was just very lost, and I had been through so much that I was just living such this fast-paced life that I never even had time to think about anything, and I think I purposely made myself so busy that I wouldn't have time to think about anything that, that I'd went through in my life. Um, and now just I've gotten, getting to know myself and just feel so many different feelings, now I truly can love and know every part of me.

    15. JSJay Shetty59:47

        Mm. Absolutely. Absolutely. How are you hoping to be as a mother now, like having, you know, you've had an interesting relationship with your own family, which you talk about in the book so much. I think we all have complex relationships with our own parents and family, and we love them, we appreciate them, and then there's certain decisions. There's a, you know, you talk about how like, you know, at one point you wished that your parents would just say, "Sorry we did that," but then you've learned to understand that they may never get there. How does that, how have you become okay with... We'll get to the mothering part, but how have you become okay with that? Because I think for a lot of people, that's the hardest thing, where it's like, "My parents were wrong. They made a mistake. They should be sorry. They should be accountable." But you're actually saying, "I do feel all those ways, but at the same time, I actually feel like that's okay. That's their journey, and that's their story, and I'm okay with that." How do you-- 'cause that's a real nuanced, subtle place to be. How do, how do you become okay with that?

    16. PHParis Hilton1:00:42

        For me, just knowing everything I know now, I think for when I was a teenager and I was sent away, I Was so just s- sad, and I was angry. But now being an adult and just doing all my research and now finding out that these schools are completely manipulative, and they lie to the families and have all this false advertising and fake brochures and just, it's such an evil industry, and my parents had no idea, and they were tricked. And that's something that I realize now, and, um, so I can't be angry at them because they were just trying to do what they thought was right.

    17. JSJay Shetty1:01:39

        Yeah. That, that requires a lot of maturity though. Like, that requires a lot of looking at the context because I find, like, when you don't have that context, it's so easy to be in conflict with someone. But when you actually create that context and you zoom out and you go, "Wow, like, this is a big industry. So many people have been brainwashed. So many people have been marketed

19. 1:01:59 – 1:04:23

    Parenthood can completely change you and make you understand your parents better

    1. JSJay Shetty1:01:59

       to, and so many people have been made to believe that this is the best thing for their kids," to the point that you're on the phone, and they're still saying, "No, no, no, just work the program." And how does that affect how you wanna be a mother? Because I can imagine that it makes you wanna be really protective and j- but at the same time, like, you've also lived a life where you know the benefits of exploring. Like, you, you talk about in the book multiple times of, like, you're happy you partied, you're happy you went out. Like, you're not, you're not upset with that, and then it's like, how do, how do you think about with becoming a mother and how you plan on raising a child? Like, how do you think about protecting versus also exploring and curiosity and how that... how, how you help a child with all those crazy decisions we all have to make?

    2. PHParis Hilton1:02:45

       Now that I'm a parent, I can completely understand just if I had a daughter and she was sneaking out in the middle of the night in New York City, and I had no idea where she was, I would be so terrified. So I can completely understand just how my parents were just scared because they were just trying to protect me, and I think that's a hard part because you just wanna protect your children so much. And I think when you're so strict, it just makes them wanna rebel. So I don't know. I think I'm definitely [laughs] gonna be strict.

    3. JSJay Shetty1:03:20

       [laughs]

    4. PHParis Hilton1:03:21

       I'd hope that my little Phoenix does not rebel, but at least I'll be more prepared because of everything that I've went through. And also, I won't be able to be tricked about sneaking out or any of that because I know everything. [laughs]

    5. JSJay Shetty1:03:39

       [laughs] Oh, good.

    6. PHParis Hilton1:03:40

       But I'm hoping that he will just feel so safe that he'll be able to tell me anything, or he won't wanna hide anything because I think that's when kids will sneak out or do things or lie because they feel like they can't talk to you.

    7. JSJay Shetty1:03:54

       Yeah. I think that's what it is. That, that really resonated for me. Every kid in the world is gonna make bad mistakes and bad choices and bad decisions. I mean, it's... I don't know anyone who hasn't. But if you feel safe enough and comfortable enough to tell your parents, and you don't feel like you have to hide from them, then you can actually solve stuff with them, and you don't feel judged by them. That, that makes the world of a difference. I, yeah, it's, it's funny what [laughs] you said there. Like, you're like, "He's never gonna be able to get away with

20. 1:04:23 – 1:05:24

    Does money truly translate to having complete freedom

    1. JSJay Shetty1:04:23

       anything," because you're, you're the n- you're the, uh, ult- but he is your son, so-

    2. PHParis Hilton1:04:27

       Yeah

    3. JSJay Shetty1:04:27

       ... you never know. Like, he, he might be s- he's gonna be super smart as well and know exactly how to play the game.

    4. PHParis Hilton1:04:32

       Exactly. [laughs]

    5. JSJay Shetty1:04:34

       You, you said in your, you said in your documentary that you don't believe you will be truly happily, happy until you have one billion dollars. Uh, how's that goal changed? How, how has that metric changed?

    6. PHParis Hilton1:04:46

       I think before I had such a focus on money because I really saw that as freedom 'cause that was something I said to myself, "When I get out of here, I'm gonna become so successful, make so much money that no one will be able to control me or tell me what to do." But now I've just become so successful in everything I've created with my media company and all of that, and I'm so proud, but that's not my main focus. I care more about babies than billions. [laughs]

    7. JSJay Shetty1:05:19

       [laughs] Babies over billions.

    8. PHParis Hilton1:05:21

       Yes.

    9. JSJay Shetty1:05:22

       Yeah. [laughs]

    10. PHParis Hilton1:05:22

        Or I can have both.

21. 1:05:24 – 1:09:06

    Believe in manifesting who you truly want to become and it shall happen

    1. PHParis Hilton1:05:24

       [laughs]

    2. JSJay Shetty1:05:24

       You can have both. I love that. One of, one of the things that, uh, really struck me in your book, and I'm, I'm happy to hear that shift in, uh, goal. That's beautiful. I think one of the things that shifted, you said this, and you talked about how you got robbed of time, and then you said the only way you got through, and I thought this was so true and so powerful, and that's why I wanna share it with everyone. You said the only way you got through the school, specifically you're talking about the school at that time, but assuming pretty much everything in your teens that you went through and your 20s, you said, "I created a future world, a future self, and a future life without boundaries," and that's how you survived. Can you walk us through what that means? Like, how were you in this, almost in prison, like it sounds that way, the way you described it, but creating a future world, a future self, and a future life? What does that look like when you're in prison chaos, like pain? How are you doing that?

    3. PHParis Hilton1:06:24

       I was just so, just sad and depressed, and it was just so horrible of what I was going through every single day that I just started just creating in my mind of f- this whole life that I wanted and what I wanted to do when I got out of there and just building this kind of almost fantasy life of who I could be and, um- I really do believe in manifestation and really manifesting who you can become because I really believe that I did that, and it all started from just so much pain and then wanting to turn it into something positive

    4. JSJay Shetty1:07:09

       How much of it happened the way you imagined it versus how much of it has actually been better than you imagined or less than? Because, yeah, I'd love to know.

    5. PHParis Hilton1:07:20

       I just ... I always had big dreams, but I had no idea it would ever be on this level. And it was just, um ... It's been such a journey, just everything that I've went through. Like, when I was a little girl, I wanted to be a veterinarian, and then moved to New York and just saw just this whole other world of business and everything, and I think that just sitting there and having time just to really think about everything, and I always dreamed of having one perfume, and now I'm about to release my 30th, and it's just that I feel like everything I've really put my mind to has, has came true.

    6. JSJay Shetty1:08:05

       And that was just your focus. So when you're in that school facility, and you're going through all of this, your mind's just there. Is, is that literally you just sit there and visualize it?

    7. PHParis Hilton1:08:15

       It was like an escape, definitely. Was ... Otherwise, it would've just been so hard to go through if I didn't have dreams of what I wanted to do.

    8. JSJay Shetty1:08:27

       And would you say that was the same technique with one of the things that hit me was like, you know, you felt good things happening in a role before, and then, you know, specifically in the example when you're talking about Simple Life comes out. It's g- it's gonna come out. It's ... You're excited about it. The sex tape comes out straight after. All of a sudden everyone's, you know, tearing you apart, taking you down. It's the worst things happen where, you know, it's put up in a grocery store sign. You know, there's ... You talk about all of this in the book, and I'm thinking, you're just feeling like you've got through the tough time, your life's on track, and then all of a sudden it's like this something goes back in your face again. I'm like,

22. 1:09:06 – 1:13:18

    Going through a painful moment and finding the courage to be brave enough to take control of your life

    1. JSJay Shetty1:09:06

       how did you just ... I, I constantly ... When I was reading the book, I was just like, "How do you get up from this," right? Like, was it again the same visualization and manifestation that helps you break through that, or what helps you overcome and reframe that? Because I think that would just knock people out forever.

    2. PHParis Hilton1:09:24

       I ... That was one of the most painful experiences to go through, just to have been with someone and really loved and trusted them, and something that was one night of your life where you never thought anyone would see it, and then the whole world is watching it and judging and just being so cruel, and it was just mortifying, and I didn't leave my house for like months, and I didn't wanna see anyone. I canceled the press tour for The Simple Life. I just was ... It was so just painful to go through that, and just to have the whole world just knowing that everyone was watching it, and it just felt like he took away something from me because I had always looked up to these amazing women and like Princess Diana, and I just felt that because of what he did to me, the whole world would always assume that I was, was something that I wasn't, just based upon one night with someone who I really trusted.

    3. JSJay Shetty1:10:42

       What's the first step you took outside your house? What gave you the courage to do it, and how did you realize, "I'm not gonna let that person define my narrative"?

    4. PHParis Hilton1:10:53

       Mm. It definitely took a while for me to feel brave enough to go out there, and my first thing that I did was actually Saturday Night Live with Jimmy Fallon, and I feel like I took control of the narrative there just with that script, with how they wrote it. I thought it was just really-

    5. JSJay Shetty1:11:21

       Yeah, you share in the book really well

    6. PHParis Hilton1:11:22

       ... just a funny way to ... I don't know how to describe it, but I just felt like I was taking control of my narrative in that way.

    7. JSJay Shetty1:11:30

       Mm. Yeah. When I, when I read your story and when I listen to them, like, here's someone who has just never backed down, like never given up, and I think this book, which I encourage everyone who's listening to read, I re- I really do because I think when we see things in the news, they're very different to when you see it from the viewpoint of the person going through it.

    8. PHParis Hilton1:11:53

       Yeah.

    9. JSJay Shetty1:11:53

       And I just want everyone to think about for a second just how you feel when your friends think something differently than the truth or how you feel when your parents or maybe you live in a bigger community, and they all think something of you that wasn't true, or they see something about you and they react to it differently, and you know inside of you how you feel when your narrative is taken away from you and it's stripped away from you, and another narrative is placed on you. I think everyone in the world knows what that feels like on some scale and some level, and I hope that it allows us to see that nuance in everyone else. It's not saying that anyone's perfect or anyone's amazing. It's saying that can we just accept that there are two sides to every story, that there are ... there's countless hidden truths that we never discover, that we're not aware of, and that there's nuance to everything, there's subtleties to everything, and that everything isn't how it's made to seem and the way it's presented, and if we could just give ... people the benefit of the doubt, we'll probably give ourselves the benefit of the doubt as well.

    10. PHParis Hilton1:13:04

        Definitely.

    11. JSJay Shetty1:13:05

        Yeah.

    12. PHParis Hilton1:13:05

        Don't judge a book by its cover.

    13. JSJay Shetty1:13:07

        Yeah, and, and, uh, we all do that all the time. Um, Paris, it has been such a joy talking to you today because I really appreciate your trust. I know you haven't done a lot

23. 1:13:18 – 1:18:41

    Paris on Final Five

    1. JSJay Shetty1:13:18

       of interviews and you haven't... I, I really appreciate and value your trust and your team's trust in me, and having this conversation with me today, it really means a lot to me, having read your book, to actually get to sit with you. And we end every episode with a final five. These are five questions that have to be answered in one word to one sentence maximum. So short answers. You're, you're very good at taglines and all the rest of it, so this should be easy for you. But, uh, Paris Hilton, these are your final five. Question number one is, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received?

    2. PHParis Hilton1:13:52

       You only live once, so make the most of it.

    3. JSJay Shetty1:13:54

       Okay. And what's the worst... Second question, what's the worst advice you've ever had or received?

    4. PHParis Hilton1:14:00

       The worst advice that I've ever seen is when people say to care so much about the opinions of others. And I feel that in my life that I used to just care so much about what others think, and I think it's just important to care only about people in your life that love and care about you, think, and not others who are not good people.

    5. JSJay Shetty1:14:26

       Amazing. Question number three, how would you define your current purpose?

    6. PHParis Hilton1:14:31

       My current purpose is to make the world a safer place for children.

    7. JSJay Shetty1:14:37

       Oh, that is a beautiful purpose. Thank you for doing that. Like, I'm, I feel so grateful that that's your purpose. I think that's such a need in the world right now. And the legislations and the bills and, you know, it's, that's the only way it's really gonna happen to, to make sure that it doesn't happen in the first place in a proactive way. So that's really beautiful.

    8. PHParis Hilton1:14:58

       Thank you.

    9. JSJay Shetty1:14:59

       If you had a message or an intention or a, something you would say to the people that have hurt you and made you feel like you were the one who had to be shamed and embarrassed, what would you say to them?

    10. PHParis Hilton1:15:12

        You should be ashamed of what you've done, and I hope that you read this book and you never do it again.

    11. JSJay Shetty1:15:27

        Thank you. Uh, great answer again. Uh, I think it's so interesting, like, to really, to really feel remorseful and to really feel sorry means to really try your best to live through the pain you caused someone. I don't think you can... You can never really take-- You can never take back what you did, and you can never, to be honest, your sorry and your remorse can never really repay the other person, and I'm guessing you've had to do all this work without any apologies or remorse, right? Or has there ever been any apology or remorse from any of these people or never?

    12. PHParis Hilton1:16:13

        Mm. No. Never. Mm-mm.

    13. JSJay Shetty1:16:24

        I think that's the, uh, that's probably one of the most incredible lessons from this book is that there's a famous quote that says we should learn to accept apologies that we've never received.

    14. PHParis Hilton1:16:37

        Mm-hmm.

    15. JSJay Shetty1:16:38

        And it seems like that's what your work is doing, that you've learned to accept apologies that actually never came your way. And I love what you said about people reading the book to really understand how much they can potentially wreck and ruin someone's life, especially a young person. Uh, fifth and final question. You'll like this one. If you could create one law in the world that everyone had to follow, what would it be?

    16. PHParis Hilton1:17:05

        My law would be that everyone has to do one kind thing every single day.

    17. JSJay Shetty1:17:12

        Beautiful.

    18. PHParis Hilton1:17:13

        I feel that the more things that people do, the better place the world will be.

    19. JSJay Shetty1:17:18

        I love that. [laughs] Paris, thank you for being here. Thank you for writing this book. I want to ask you a question. Is there anything that, anything that's on your heart and mind that I haven't asked you about that you really wanted to share that I want to open it up, give you that space. Is there anything you'd like to share, anything I haven't asked you that you feel is really front of mind or front of heart for you? Doesn't have to be-

    20. PHParis Hilton1:17:38

        I can't think of anything.

    21. JSJay Shetty1:17:39

        Great. That's good. That's a good thing.

    22. PHParis Hilton1:17:41

        I feel like I've talked about so much good stuff.

    23. JSJay Shetty1:17:41

        That, that makes me happy.

    24. PHParis Hilton1:17:42

        [laughs]

    25. JSJay Shetty1:17:43

        That makes me happy. I just, I just wanted to honor it, uh, because I, you know, I, I really feel you've been so giving and kind and generous-

    26. PHParis Hilton1:17:50

        Thank you

    27. JSJay Shetty1:17:50

        ... uh, through your story, and I want everyone out there who's listening and watching to go and grab a copy of the book, Paris the Memoir. Uh, give it to a friend who's gone through something, or you might know they've gone from, through something, and they're not sure how to process it, and they're thinking about it. They're struggling with it. I think that this book is gonna open up some incredible conversations about abuse, about ADHD, about connection to our families and parents, about rediscovering ourselves, and I hope it starts that conversation for you and your friends. Uh, Paris, thank you again.

    28. PHParis Hilton1:18:24

        Thank you.

    29. JSJay Shetty1:18:25

        Thank you.

    30. PHParis Hilton1:18:26

        So happy that I came on this.

Episode duration: 1:18:41