How to De-Escalate a Shouting Match

1. 0:00 – 0:30

   What to do when someone is yelling: the 3-step plan

   1. JFJefferson Fisher0:00

      How do you stay calm when they're not? When somebody is yelling at you, they're mad at you, they're angry, they are shouting, what do you do in that moment? In today's episode, I am going to teach you. I'm gonna teach you, number one, how to get them to lower their volume. Two, we're gonna add space into the conversation. We're gonna talk how to do that, to regulate our emotions and theirs. And three, I'm gonna give you phrases that you can use that is going to help calm and smooth out the situation

2. 0:30 – 1:01

   Show and podcast mission (quick welcome + subscribe prompt)

   1. JFJefferson Fisher0:30

      for a much more productive conversation. You ready? Welcome to the Jefferson Fisher Podcast, where I'm on a mission to make your next conversation the one that changes everything. If you enjoy learning communication tips, I'm gonna ask you to please subscribe, like, follow this podcast wherever you're listening, and my promise in exchange is that I will make you a better communicator. If you listen to this podcast, even for five minutes, uh, every time we put out an episode, it's going to make you a better communicator, and that's my promise: to deliver

3. 1:01 – 1:32

   Sponsor break: Cozy Earth sheets

   1. JFJefferson Fisher1:01

      good, quality content to help improve your life. This episode is brought to you by Cozy Earth. I love Cozy Earth because I use their products. If you're somebody like me and you use bamboo sheets on your bed, you know exactly what I'm talking about when the summer gets hot. Down here in Texas, it is so scorching hot and humid, and there's one thing that helps keep me cool at night, and it's the sheets from Cozy Earth. They're on our bed right now. You can go to cozyearth.com/jefferson and use the code Jefferson for 40%

4. 1:32 – 2:02

   The reality of a shouting match: why it feels overwhelming

   1. JFJefferson Fisher1:32

      off. Use the code Jefferson. That's cozyearth.com/jefferson. Use the code Jefferson for 40% off. Even if it's hot at night, you can use those sheets to keep you cool, and most of all, cozy. You didn't ask for it, you didn't plan for it, but you're in it now. The other person across from you talking is not talking as much as they are throwing their words in your face. They're shouting. They're yelling. It's hurting your ears. You're scared. You don't know

5. 2:02 – 4:03

   Step 1 — Refuse to raise your voice (don’t join the dominance game)

   1. JFJefferson Fisher2:02

      what to do. How do you handle the situations when somebody is yelling at you? Number one, this is what I want you to do. Number one, you are going to refuse to raise your voice. When somebody's yelling at you, one of the worst things you can do is start to turn up the volume on your voice. That's what our default wants to do. When somebody's yelling, what do you do to try and talk over them? You have to yell over them. You have to ... If they're at a level 10, you have to crank it up to a level 18. Then it becomes a, a play for dominance. Who is the one who can out-yell the other? Who is the one who can scare the threat away? That is a weak position, and I, and I'm gonna tell you why. The people who yell, it tells the other person that they're winning. It tells the other person that they've gotcha. It gives them that sense of control. It gives them that, that hit of dopamine, and it is telling them that, "Hey, I am now pushing their buttons so badly that they are in this state of fight or flight, this fear, where they are yelling, and I now have the control and the emotion. I'm the one that's still in it." It's a bad game to play. I want you to think of a, like, a music that's really loud in the room. What do you kinda have to do? Maybe you're in the car. Maybe you're at the house. You have to yell over it. Nobody can really hear what you're saying, because there's this really loud undertone that's filling all the space. Yeah, that's the other person's voice in this instant. You're not listening to them, and they're definitely not listening to you. All right? So I ... The yelling matches, you know. You have experience with this. We all do. The yelling matches don't do anything except tire out our systems. They, I mean, they just tire us out. Eventually, the yelling has to stop, and now you're kinda out of breath, and now you're tired, and now you feel not just emotionally drained, you also feel physically drained because you gave away your power. You gave away that control. You exerted

6. 4:03 – 6:05

   Why staying quiet works: mirroring, exposure, and control signals

   1. JFJefferson Fisher4:03

      that energy rather than protecting it and conserving it. So how do you do that? How do you do that in the moment? You refuse to raise your voice. That means if somebody's yelling at a 10, you're gonna stay right here at a one. Maybe you're at a three. Maybe you're at a one. It's ... The reason why it, it works so well is because people will mirror what they see, naturally. They don't even know it's happening. If you're yelling and I'm staying right here, you're gonna do one of two things. One, you're either gonna get frustrated at me because you're realizing that you can't control me, and that's frustrating, uh, or two, you are naturally going to pull down your voice because you're gonna hear the, the discrepancy. That's k- that's kind of a bigger word. It's w- the difference. You can hear the difference, the discrepancy, the, the big, um, from ... the gap between where they're at and where you're at, and they're gonna feel like they're overexposed. Like, you ... There's a reason why people don't just yell in a quiet room, because it's, it's calling all the attention to them. They feel w- overexposed. In a big gym, when it's ... if everybody's quiet, or maybe it's, uh, at church or wherever it is. Now, there are places that are preserved because they are religious places or whatever it is. Nobody yells at these because it is calling all the attention. They're gonna feel overexposed. Whatever they said, everybody's gonna hear it. People don't like that, even in one-on-one settings, because they feel like what they're saying is being overexposed and nobody's listening. Uh, uh, just to yell, to yell doesn't do any good. So they'll naturally start to pull their volume down. That's how you do that. Doesn't matter how high they go, you stay at a three. You stay at a one. I know that's hard to do, and it's really hard to do in the moment, but I promise you, it is telling them that you are the one in control. You are the one that is unbothered, that you're the one that is not

7. 6:05 – 8:36

   Step 2 — Inject time to regulate emotions (use your breath first)

   1. JFJefferson Fisher6:05

      threatened. By their behavior. You know how much of a power move that is? It's huge. Two, it's not just the volume I want you to be able to turn down. It's the regulation of emotions. How do you get people to naturally start to go, "Whew, okay. Yeah. All right, now I'm, I'm getting back into the mode. Now I'm, I feel like my normal self." Instead of being The Hulk, they're now Bruce Banner. They're, they're back to normal. All right? That's a Marvel reference in case you're wondering. Yeah. How do you do that? You inject time into the conversation. There's one thing that will help regulate people's emotion more than anything there is, and that is time. What matters right in this instant probably doesn't matter so much later tomorrow. You ever got an email that you read and you get really upset about it? You look at it again and read it the next day, it hardly has the same effect. Time has a way of solving things out. You had a bad argument with someone, three years later you're like, "What did we even argue about? Why did we... I don't even remember what we argued about." It doesn't matter. Time has a way of sifting out what is truly important and essential and valuable in your life. So we're gonna do that in the conversation, and you do that by what I teach, and anybody who's a fan of this podcast knows, and anybody who's read the book, The Next Conversation, knows, let your breath be the first word that you say. Wherever a first word would be in your response, use a breath. So instead of this, like when people snap. You ever been in a conversation with somebody and somebody snaps and they say something like, "You know what would be really, you know what, you know what would be really nice? You know what would be really nice?" And all of a sudden you go, "Okay. Here we go. Lights are on now." Now they're really s- ratcheted up in, in the conversation. The snap happens. Whenever you inject time as a way of slowing things down, and it keeps the emotional aspect of your mind from taking a hold of the steering wheel, keeps your logical side in place, where you're very aware. You're much more aware of your emotions, aware of what you're saying. You're more intentional, and you choose your words more wisely. When you're emotional, you don't really care about your w- word choice. You just, you just say things. It doesn't even matter to you if they make sense. You ever been in an argument where y'all are both just being so ugly that you, you're saying things that don't even really make sense? You're throwing words and you don't even care what they mean. I don't care if it's logical or not. They're just words. They're just getting out. You're gonna do time. Inject time. Use your breath and slow things

8. 8:36 – 10:08

   Slow speech = calm authority: a quick voice comparison demo

   1. JFJefferson Fisher8:36

      down. Here's a comparison. Here's a comparison. Which one of these people, I say people, it's still me. Hey, it's Jefferson. Which one of these voices sound more in control to you? Sound more calm to you? Somebody you wanna listen, somebody you f- wanna follow, somebody you want to mirror? Here's voice one. "I already, I already told you, I'm not gonna do that. I already told you I'm not going to do that, okay?" "I already told you I'm not going to do that." One or two? And put it down there in the comments wherever you're listening. One or two? Number one says I'm grasping for control. Listen to me. I need all the control. I've given it all up. Now I'm trying to get it back. I already told you I'm not gonna do that. Second voice says, "Nah, I, I never lost control. I'm not losing it. I never let it go. I already told you, I'm not gonna do that. Not gonna do that." The second voice is always the one that sounds more centered, more grounded. Why? Because you're using time, so I slowed my words down. It, it's, uh, yeah, I, I, I turned down the volume of my words, so I'm not yelling, but I slowed my words down. Yeah? Much better using time to your advantage. Number three, we're gonna use phrases. I'm gonna

9. 10:08 – 11:09

   Step 3 — Use ‘no-oriented’ questions to dissolve tension (Chris Voss technique)

   1. JFJefferson Fisher10:08

      teach you some phrases that are going to help dissolve the tension, especially when things are really heated like this. And I'm, I'm gonna give you a frame to do it in. I, I say frame. I'm gonna give you a few little, uh, techniques, I think is the best word for me to put this. And this is a technique that I learned from one of my very good friends. Uh, he's always been a big role model of mine, and we've since become very good friends. Chris Voss. His, he has his book, Never Split the Difference, great book. And what he does, one of the FBI techniques, is people don't like to say yes to things. They love to say no. No is our default. We would like to say no to things. So you turn a question to get a no in exchange for them opening up, getting more of what you want. So what we're gonna do is use a frame, begin the question to get a no answer out of this. And how you get a no is you begin with a negative in the part of your sentence.

10. 11:09 – 13:44

    The exact de-escalation phrases to use (Are you against / opposed / is it unreasonable?)

    1. JFJefferson Fisher11:09

       I know I'm kinda getting weird and technical here, but this is the fun stuff that, that I like. I'm sure there's a button where you can skip it 15 seconds and we'll get there. All right, so if you wanna add, uh, let me rephrase that. If you want to get the other person to calm down, you're gonna ask a question to them that's going to get them to say no, because they're not gonna wanna tell you yes. They're going to want to say no. How we're gonna do that is at the beginning of your sentence, begin with a negative. Here are some options that I like to u- to, to use. Are you against, are you opposed, and is it unreasonable? Those are the three that I like to mix up. So instead of saying, "Can you please calm down?" You want them to say yes, right? But they won't. They definitely don't wanna say yes to that. "Calm, can you just calm down? Please, can you just lower your voice?" Yeah, that's, they're not gonna wanna say, "Oh, yes. Yes, I will. I will calm my voice. I just had a moment, didn't I?" No, it's gonna just ratchet them up. They're gonna get more angry. "You're gonna tell me to calm down? Calm down?" Not gonna go well. Instead, when you get the no, it's a whole lot easier. So it sounds like this. "Are you against us talking just at a normal tone?" Or, "Is it unreasonable to ask us to talk without yelling?" "Are y- are you opposed to having a conversation without us raising our voices?" "Are you opposed to having a conversation in a, in a normal voice?" Th- they're, they're gonna say naturally no to that. They're not going to-- they're not gonna say yes. If I were to say, "Are you ... Is it unreasonable for us to have a conversation in a normal voice?" Are they gonna say yes? No, they're not gonna say yes to that. They're going to say no. Naturally, they're gonna just kinda calm d- they're, they're gonna melt in that second. They're gonna come down several steps to meet you more of where you are, more in the one to three range, where they were up in the, the 10s and 12s. Uh, "Is it unreasonable for us to have a conversation in a normal volume?" Probably they're not even gonna answer you, most likely. They're gonna naturally just start to come down and talk in a normal tone, 'cause they don't wanna tell you yes, they wanna say no. And whenever you start with, "Are you against?" "Are you opposed?" "Is it unreasonable?" It's g- it's getting to the no response. That's what you want in this instant, because that's where they're w- wanting to say, and now they're hearing you. When you combine it with you lowering your

11. 13:44 – 15:36

    Putting it all together + closing resources

    1. JFJefferson Fisher13:44

       voice, your volume, and slowing down your words and adding time to help regulate, and then use a question that gets a no, like, "Are, are you against us having a conversation just without the yelling? Uh, is, is, is that something you're against?" They're not gonna say no, or they're not gonna say yes to that. All right? That's how you stay calm when they aren't. It happens in every relationship, in every, every facet of life, I feel like, there's always going to be that, because it's the emotional, it's the emotion out of every human. It's natural. So ... And sometimes, you know what? That person is us. I'm the one that is having the big emotional reaction. I'm the one that is yelling. I'm the one that's doing that. And sometimes if somebody across from me is mirroring what good communication sounds like, if the person across from me is slowing down their words and not yelling and not b- biting what I'm ... the, the bait that I have by yelling at them, it's going to calm me down, too. So it's, it's, it's part of all of us. Cool? If you enjoy communication tips, I have a newsletter where I send out one piece of communication tip right to your inbox every week for free. You can find the link down there in the show notes. My book, The Next Conversation, has been out several months now, and it's, uh, it's the best part of ... It's beaten every expectation I could think in terms of what v- value and joy it's brought to me to help other people. If you are looking to buy it, you can at the links down in the show notes, anywhere where you like to pick up and read books. And if you're wanting to learn more, The School of Communication is always open to help you practice and improve your next conversation. As always, you can try that and follow me.

Episode duration: 15:37