CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 3:01
Cameron Hanes’ relentless training mindset (run/lift/shoot)
Joe welcomes Cam and immediately dives into Hanes’ extreme daily routine, teasing him about running twice a day and the “moderation is for cowards” mantra. They debate conditioning, adaptation, and whether “overtraining” is real or just lack of preparation.
- 3:01 – 4:25
Injuries, joint pain, and ditching daily Advil
The conversation shifts to injury prevention and how Hanes avoids joint issues despite high volume. Joe shares his elbow tendonitis from chin-ups and kettlebell cleans, while Cam explains he used to rely on Advil daily until learning about NSAID downsides.
- 4:25 – 5:46
Kratom for pain relief and why it’s controversial
After quitting Advil, Cam mentions kratom as an alternative that seems to help. Joe describes kratom’s dose-dependent effects and discusses government efforts to restrict it, framing it as a clash between regulation and herbal self-medication.
- 5:46 – 8:14
Building up to ‘ridiculous reps’ and avoiding beginner mistakes
They return to Hanes’ high-rep strength work (e.g., full stack sets) and how long it takes to safely build that capacity. Cam cautions against copying his workouts too soon, emphasizing gradual progression to prevent injury and frustration.
- 8:14 – 9:14
Social media: mostly positive, but the poison comments stick
Joe and Cam talk about online feedback dynamics—how a small amount of negativity dominates attention. They connect this to hunting posts, especially predator harvests, which can trigger intense backlash.
- 9:14 – 13:55
Predators, public perception, and the ‘save the wolf’ disconnect
A bear-hunting post leads into a broader discussion about predators and how people romanticize them. They argue that bears, wolves, and coyotes are efficient killers, and that reintroduction or protection debates often ignore real-world impacts on animals, livestock, and people.
- 13:55 – 19:06
Under Armour wolf commercial and animal athleticism
Cam recounts filming with a large wolf for an Under Armour commercial, including how they elicited a snarl and why it was saved for the end. They compare wolves’ endurance and gait to dogs and humans, emphasizing how animals are ‘built’ for movement.
- 19:06 – 26:27
Hunting education, open-minded media, and Joe’s influence (float tanks)
Cam credits the podcast format for changing minds about hunting by allowing nuance and long-form context. Joe cites sensory deprivation tanks as another example of the show’s cultural impact, explaining how he popularized float centers worldwide.
- 26:27 – 41:38
Toxic tribalism, diet ideology, and meat ethics
They broaden into culture and media bias (CNN vs Fox) and the idea of ‘toxic tribalism.’ The conversation moves into veganism, nutrition (B12), and how shaming backfires—plus why people should understand the reality of meat production.
- 41:38 – 57:42
Factory farming imagery vs. hunting as ‘noble’ meat procurement
A graphic article about industrial meat production becomes a springboard for arguing that people should not be shielded from how meat reaches their plate. Both emphasize hunting’s connection, reduced waste, and the personal responsibility of killing what you eat.
- 57:42 – 1:08:59
Ultra-running mindset: suffering waves, grinding, and Courtney Dauwalter’s dominance
Joe and Cam explore the mental mechanics of ultra-endurance: fluctuating highs/lows, no guarantees of recovery mid-race, and the necessity of shutting off the ‘quit’ voice. They discuss Moab 240 specifics and Courtney Dauwalter’s outsized performance and unconventional fueling.
- 1:08:59 – 1:12:41
Why hard things become addictive: mountains, sheep country, and Cam’s 5K event
They connect ultra-running to mountain hunting: once you’ve done extreme challenges, small ones feel less compelling. The talk pivots to Cam’s Keep Hammering runs and Joe’s story of being forced into running after struggling through a 5K.
- 1:12:41 – 1:32:34
MMA detour: endurance, camps, and evolving techniques (low calf kicks)
The conversation veers into UFC analysis: Francis Ngannou’s gas tank and grappling gaps, AKA’s hard sparring culture, and why ‘being pushed’ matters. They also break down the modern effectiveness of low calf kicks and how striking evolves as knowledge leaks across disciplines.
- 1:32:34 – 1:35:46
Conservation wins, public land policy, and Cam’s role with Interior councils
Cam previews an upcoming policy announcement about protecting winter migration corridors for deer and elk from development. He explains his appointment to the International Wildlife Conservation Council and why being ‘in the room’ matters amid media distortion and political pressure.
- 1:35:46 – 2:36:10
Africa, trophy imports, and the paradox of hunting as conservation
They lay out the controversial economic logic: regulated hunting can fund habitat protection and anti-poaching, while bans can remove incentives and worsen outcomes. They discuss elephants, lions, rhinos, local realities, and the public’s selective empathy for ‘charismatic’ animals.
