CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 2:44
Sharpe’s pitch: mobilizing non-voters with hope (and making voting easier)
Joe opens by praising Larry Sharpe’s logical style, and Sharpe frames his campaign strategy around activating people who’ve checked out of politics. They discuss voter apathy, online/phone voting, and why the two-party system benefits from low participation.
- •Sharpe’s core electoral path: reach the huge block of non-voters
- •Rogan’s argument for online/phone voting as a world-changing shift
- •Sharpe claims major parties rely on voter apathy plus loyal party activists
- •2016 as a lesson: rallies/events translate into turnout
- •Fear vs hope as motivators in a two-party system
- 2:44 – 4:05
Mass shootings: loneliness, relationships, psychotropic drugs—and incentives to avoid root causes
Rogan raises Sharpe’s controversial take on mass shootings: commonalities like isolation and medication. Sharpe argues the system prefers controversy over solutions, reframing many mass shootings as ‘public suicide’ and emphasizing community and purpose.
- •Two shared factors: lack of relationships and psychotropic drugs
- •Sharpe: mass shootings as ‘public suicide’ similar to ‘death by cop’
- •Why schools: perceived enemies + soft targets + planning
- •Sharpe’s root causes: loneliness, lack of purpose, lack of community
- •Debate over whether politicians avoid the topic for power vs political viability
- 4:05 – 6:55
School security proposal: concealed carry for willing staff to remove ‘soft target’ planning
Sharpe proposes allowing licensed teachers/administrators to carry if they choose, arguing uncertainty removes a shooter’s ability to plan. Rogan probes the logic, including whether known armed officers become first targets and whether guns are the real driver versus intent.
- •Allow permitted staff to carry voluntarily; no mandate to carry
- •Known school officer = predictable target; uncertainty deters planning
- •Claim: shooters will find alternative weapons if guns aren’t available
- •Security framed as reducing planning incentives rather than adding laws
- •Rogan agrees on mental health factors but challenges Sharpe’s political-cynicism claim
- 6:55 – 10:22
New York gun policy: SAFE Act, red-flag laws, and medical reporting concerns
The conversation shifts from national framing to New York’s specific gun laws. Sharpe argues the SAFE Act already penalizes certain medication use with firearm removal and warns that expanded red-flag laws could widen confiscation based on subjective reports.
- •SAFE Act: psychotropic drug treatment can trigger firearm loss
- •Medical professionals as de facto enforcement/reporting channel
- •Red-flag expansion: teachers potentially petitioning to remove firearms
- •Concerns about false positives and broad discretionary power
- •Rogan tees up returning to broader school-shooting solutions later
- 10:22 – 15:29
Why New York’s governor race matters: five-way path, Cuomo, and ballot mechanics
Sharpe claims a Libertarian win in New York would reshape national politics and describes the race as unusually winnable due to multiple candidates and plurality rules. They discuss Cuomo’s political dominance, Sharpe’s polling/name-recognition problem, and debate strategy.
- •New York’s national symbolic weight; Cato freedom ranking and outmigration
- •Five-way race + plurality = ~30% could win
- •Polling: ~25% among voters who know Sharpe; name recognition is hurdle
- •Debates as force multiplier (Jesse Ventura analogy)
- •Cuomo as ‘king’; Nixon likely squeezed out by party machinery
- 15:29 – 16:05
Fusion voting and party lines: Working Families Party and New York’s unique structure
Sharpe explains New York’s ‘fusion’ system where candidates can appear on multiple party lines, which can blur genuine third-party influence. Rogan reacts to the complexity and how it can be used to channel issue-based voters back to major-party candidates.
- •Fusion state mechanics: candidates can run on multiple ballot lines
- •Working Families Party and line-shopping for major candidates
- •Cuomo/major parties leveraging multiple lines to capture issue voters
- •How ballot structure affects third-party viability
- •Sets up discussion on reform and voter engagement tools
- 16:05 – 17:39
Online voting skepticism + New York’s hostility to innovation (Uber, vaping, blockchain)
Rogan returns to online voting, but Sharpe hesitates due to security/tech uncertainty. Sharpe broadens into a critique of New York’s resistance to new industries, attributing it to old-money power and regulatory capture that pushes young people out.
- •Sharpe likes online voting conceptually but won’t commit without security proof
- •New York rejecting/attacking new tech and industries (blockchain, hemp, vaping)
- •Uber taxes tied to MTA as an example of punishing innovation
- •Corruption/entrenched interests as an anti-innovation force
- •‘A new New York’ slogan and the state’s retiree-unfriendly cost structure
- 17:39 – 19:51
Systemic decline: retirees leaving, pensions, budget pressure, and ‘rebuild from scratch’ framing
Sharpe argues New York’s tax base is eroding as retirees and working families leave, while pension obligations remain. He frames the state as fundamentally broken and calls for root-level reforms instead of ‘tweaking’ around the edges.
- •Retiree flight to the Carolinas/Florida; ‘halfbacks’ joke
- •Pensions as a major budget driver; benefits spent out of state
- •New York budget scale and long-term sustainability concerns
- •Sharpe’s ‘root and branches’ metaphor: stop clipping weeds, rebuild system
- •Rogan steers back to education as a long-term violence-prevention lever
- 19:51 – 22:32
Education reboot part 1: end early standardized testing; shorten K–12 to K–10
Sharpe proposes eliminating standardized testing until high school and removing the last two years of traditional high school. He claims standardized tests distort incentives, stigmatize kids, and enable federal control; Rogan challenges generalizations and feasibility.
- •No standardized testing until high school; critique of test-based teacher evaluation
- •Testing’s claimed harms: labeling kids, mismeasuring life success, funding distortions
- •K–12 called an anachronism; propose K–10 then pathways
- •Rogan pushes back on ‘kids do nothing’ narrative
- •Sharpe argues college remediation equals ‘13th grade’ evidence of failure
- 22:32 – 27:37
Education reboot part 2: five post-10th-grade pathways + $20k ‘mini GI Bill’
Sharpe outlines multiple tracks after 10th grade: prep school, direct associates, trade school, job, or entrepreneurship. He proposes giving each student a time-limited education fund to create market-driven options; Rogan interrogates cost realism and incentives.
- •Five choices after 10th grade: prep, associates, trades, job, start a business
- •‘Make mistakes at 16, not 26’ and restoring rites of passage
- •$20k education credit over five years; state pays providers directly
- •Prediction: new prep/trade schools emerge priced to the credit
- •Cost argument: saving vs current per-student spending and reducing wasted years
- 27:37 – 51:31
Education governance fight: administrators, local control, and ‘centralized control never works’
A long back-and-forth centers on Sharpe’s claim that administrator bloat and federal mandates are the real costs and constraints. Rogan worries cutting funds invites perverse incentives (admins protect themselves, larger classes), while Sharpe insists local boards/PTAs plus transparency drive improvement.
- •Sharpe: districts with more administrators than teachers; box-checking for government
- •Proposal: reduce federal role (lose $4B) to reduce bureaucracy and mandates
- •Rogan’s concern: admin-led cost-cutting could harm teachers/class sizes
- •Sharpe’s governance model: school boards/PTAs/teachers collaborating locally
- •Transparency + accountability as the ‘one string’ attached to funding
- 51:31 – 1:01:19
From regulation to ‘competing standards’: safety vs control (licensing, vaping, supplements analogy)
Sharpe generalizes his philosophy: licensing and regulation often serve control, not safety. Using vaping and supplements, he argues for voluntary standards, third-party verification, and consumer choice—an approach Rogan connects back to possible education oversight models.
- •Licensing as permission/control vs insurance/standards as risk management
- •Vaping license example: paperwork/fees without safety training
- •Health food/supplement market as proof standards can work without heavy regulation
- •Third-party testing and stamps (kosher ‘Circle U’, supplement verification)
- •Applying third-party verification logic to school quality and performance
- 1:01:19 – 1:30:28
Cleaning up New York corruption: reduce Albany power, eliminate authorities, localize decisions
Rogan asks how a governor could tackle endemic corruption. Sharpe argues corruption can’t be eliminated, only reduced and surfaced faster—primarily by shrinking the governor’s discretionary spending and dismantling opaque boards/authorities used for patronage.
- •Corruption deterrence is about likelihood of getting caught, not sentence length
- •Less centralized money from Albany reduces opportunities for pay-to-play
- •Boards/commissions/authorities as corruption vectors and patronage pipelines
- •Regional ‘economic development’ bodies criticized as government picking winners
- •Local governments and private investment as alternatives to state-directed deals
- 1:30:28 – 1:40:54
Revenue without higher taxes: naming-rights leases, toll reform, and private maintenance contracts
Sharpe pivots to a concrete ‘business’ plan: lease naming rights to bridges/tunnels/locks and require maintenance as part of the contract. Rogan becomes enthusiastic, exploring how this could replace toll dependence and reduce corruption by shifting contracting away from government.
- •Rename infrastructure via paid leases (e.g., Verizon Bridge)
- •Contract structure: lessee pays + maintains; state inspects and can revoke
- •Goal: reduce or eliminate tolls and lower long-term maintenance costs
- •Secondary benefit: fewer government contracts = less corruption
- •Extensions: Erie Canal lock sponsorships and making the canal commercially viable
- 1:40:54 – 2:11:09
Pro-growth agenda: small business deregulation, local-only exemptions, hemp/cannabis ‘like onions’
Sharpe outlines ways to attract and retain residents and businesses by reducing barriers: cutting unnecessary occupational licensing and supporting local commerce. He advocates full hemp/cannabis legalization with minimal regulation to prevent crony capture, support farmers, and reduce opioid dependence via alternatives for chronic pain.
- •Occupational licensing critique (hair braiding, dog walking) and its anti-competition effect
- •Local-only business concept inspired by Wyoming: fewer federal burdens if sales stay in-state
- •Farm support: treat farmers appropriately and enable niche value-added products
- •Legalize hemp and cannabis; regulate ‘like onions’ to keep small producers competitive
- •Medical angle: chronic pain options beyond opioids; broader access to THC/CBD products
