The Joe Rogan ExperienceJoe Rogan Experience #1435 - Suzanne Santo & Gary Clark Jr.
CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 0:47
Cold open, introductions, and deciding to play live
Joe welcomes Suzanne Santo and Gary Clark Jr., expressing how excited he is to have them together. They quickly decide to kick things off with a song, setting a loose, hangout vibe for the episode.
- 0:47 – 5:13
Live performance: “Bad Beast” (acoustic jam)
Suzanne and Gary perform “Bad Beast” live in-studio, with Gary accompanying on guitar. The performance becomes an immediate centerpiece and establishes their musical chemistry.
- 5:13 – 8:28
How they’ve collaborated so little—and the viral “Midnight Rider” moment
After the song, they talk about how surprisingly few times they’ve performed together, despite knowing each other for over a decade. Joe recalls seeing their Jameson after-party performance go viral after he posted it, especially their spontaneous “Midnight Rider” cover.
- 8:28 – 10:31
Downtown LA as ‘Blade Runner’: gentrification, danger, and surreal contrasts
The conversation veers into the strange reality of downtown Los Angeles—beautiful buildings alongside visible homelessness and street crime. Gary shares a recent experience where a driver warned him not to wander the area.
- 10:31 – 13:57
Tarantino, modern audiences, and the shrinking tolerance for on-screen violence
Joe asks about Quentin Tarantino’s film and they unpack the shock factor of extreme violence in modern movies. They discuss why Tarantino ‘gets away with it’ artistically and how cultural expectations (“woke reaction”) might limit newcomers.
- 13:57 – 16:20
Practice, instruments, and the mystery of “having a sound”
They pivot back to music—Joe praises Gary’s instantly recognizable guitar tone. Suzanne talks about being a multi-instrumentalist and how her relationship to practicing has changed from fear-based to joy-based.
- 16:20 – 17:47
From Galileo to social media: truth, control, and the modern information trap
A discussion about historical punishment for challenging orthodoxy (Galileo) expands into modern social control via politics and social media. Suzanne shares frustration about not knowing what’s true anymore and the stress of navigating constant, conflicting information.
- 17:47 – 25:19
Nicotine, cigarettes, and a detour into addiction: gambling and pool-hall characters
Joe compares public fear of coronavirus with normalized harms like smoking, sparking a debate about nicotine’s cognitive effects. Suzanne tells an intense family story involving an aneurysm and a cigarette, which leads into Joe’s memories of gamblers and addiction in New York pool halls.
- 25:19 – 31:30
Poker psychology, sunglasses at the table, and why Joe avoids ‘slow’ hobbies
Suzanne describes casual poker as a social hang and a way to read people; Joe frames it as part ‘amateur psychic’ and part skill. They riff on table behavior (sunglasses), then broaden into Joe’s aversion to hobbies like poker and golf because they can become time sinks.
- 31:30 – 37:15
Origins of music to aliens and the ‘ideas are a lifeform’ theory
From wondering about the first instruments (drums, reeds, catgut strings), the conversation escalates into Egypt timelines and extraterrestrial speculation. Joe argues humans are so unusual that alien involvement is at least worth considering, then reframes creativity as channeling ideas that “propagate” through people.
- 37:15 – 1:04:33
Creative discipline and ‘Resistance’: tuning the radio, Dan Harmon, and The War of Art
They dig into the creative process: showing up, staying receptive, and balancing technique with vibe. Suzanne references Dan Harmon’s ‘gingerbread man’ metaphor, while Joe brings up Steven Pressfield’s concept of Resistance and the need for disciplined practice to access inspiration.
- 1:04:33 – 1:29:00
Psychedelics, MAPS, microdosing, and a surprising insomnia breakthrough (Cereset)
Terence McKenna’s stoned ape theory leads into broader psychedelic talk: microdosing for post-tour depression, decriminalization efforts, and PTSD therapy research via MAPS and MDMA. Suzanne then shares a detailed account of using Cereset—audio-feedback brain training—to resolve long-term insomnia and reduce anxiety, linking it to past head injuries.
- 1:29:00 – 1:36:30
Austin, Texas identity: busking years, Clapton’s call, and coping with rapid change
They shift to Texas—Austin’s culture, heat, growth, and artistic independence—while Gary describes his long grind playing for tips and tiny payouts. He pinpoints the turning point: getting invited by Eric Clapton to play a festival in 2010, and shares a healthy attitude toward newcomers and competition.
- 1:36:30 – 1:46:32
Music industry reality: self-releasing, labels as banks, and streaming economics
Suzanne explains her push against traditional industry pathways—self-funding, self-releasing, and the struggle of proving viability without backing. Gary outlines labels’ practical functions (marketing, tour budgets, promotion), while Suzanne highlights the harsh streaming math and how copyright ownership can dramatically shift who profits.
- 1:46:32 – 3:51:01
Whiskey-fueled tangents: Prince stories, sick shows, food poisoning, and touring grit
As drinks flow, the room gets sillier and more confessional—missed chances to see Prince, working out drunk, and the chaos of performing while sick. Joe and Gary trade horror stories about vomiting and food poisoning on the road, highlighting the unglamorous side of entertainment.
