Joe Rogan Experience #1443 - Jonathan Ward

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   ... one. Jonathan, you…

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      ... one. Jonathan, you are the first man ever... Not only the first man I've ever met who made his own leather jacket-

   2. JWJonathan Ward0:05

      (laughs)

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:05

      ... but absolutely the first man who made his own leather jacket who's ever been on the podcast wearing that jacket.

   4. JWJonathan Ward0:10

      Why, thank you so much.

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:11

      It's a fucking sweet jacket, man.

   6. JWJonathan Ward0:13

      I'd show you my G-string, but it's probably-

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:15

      (laughs)

   8. JWJonathan Ward0:15

      ... a little much for this time of day. (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      Well, how are you functioning... Uh, is it, like, on the side? How are you tying that one?

   10. JWJonathan Ward0:20

       Well, I like... I prefer a center rear yank.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:23

       Oh.

   12. JWJonathan Ward0:23

       So does my wife 'cause it's... She can just put the leash right on it and, you know-

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:26

       Nice.

   14. JWJonathan Ward0:26

       ... two for one. Keeps her, keeps me on the-

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:27

       When did you get into making leather stuff? Is that a, a recent thing?

   16. JWJonathan Ward0:31

       Uh, about three years ago. But, I mean, Joe, my whole life I've just been a rampant fan of craftsmanship.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:38

       Mm-hmm.

   18. JWJonathan Ward0:38

       And I've done various deep dives throughout my life into, like, all sorts of different art forms. In fact, the reason automotive design became my thing and turned into a business was because my hobbies of painting and sculpting and, and finish carpentry, woodwork, and all these different things. If you think about it, transportation is like this incredibly communicable extroverted combination of so many different art forms.

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:02

       Yeah.

   20. JWJonathan Ward1:03

       So, I've been also as... In my travels in the last 10 years or so, or, uh, maybe five, I've really been focusing on... Always have been focusing on, like, getting immersed in that local culture. But now I've stepped that up a notch and I'm doing, like, these deep dive travels into different art forms of different cultures, so leather craft. I've been visiting tanneries and studying for masters in the US and in, uh, Morocco and Mexico. I just got back, liks- last week, uh, from Mexico doing it.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:34

       Really?

   22. JWJonathan Ward1:35

       Yeah, it's super fun. And it's zen because for me now at this point, the scale of the shop is such that I'm actually doing a disservice if I'm out there actually building your car, right? And 'cause that's what I used to do. I'd weld it and shape it when I was on the floor. But at our size, I'm, I'm not. And our fill rates, as you recall, suck. It takes forever for us to finish anything. And there's something about just literally putting on your podcast, going in my spare bedroom at home 'cause my son's off at college, so the second his ass was out of there it was like, "Leather studio."

   23. JRJoe Rogan2:10

       (laughs)

   24. JWJonathan Ward2:10

       And I totally built that sucker out with really good audio and lighting and stuff. So, being able to come from sketch to a finished good within a matter of weeks 100% myself, independent of everything, I needed that. I wa- I really kind of felt I was losing that t- tactile craft connection at work.

   25. JRJoe Rogan2:27

       Well, what you do is so unusual. And, um, um, i- there's other people that build cars, there's other people that do, do innovative things with automobiles. But, wha- what you're doing is at a level and with a, with an obsessiveness that is, to me, th- deserves to be rewarded. I love it. I love the fact that you make these fucking... I love the fact that you do those derelicts where you leave the patina on the cars, where you take these c- beautiful old cars that have ex- like, they're, they're gorgeous because of the life that they've lived.

   26. JWJonathan Ward3:03

       Totally. I love 'em. Right.

   27. JRJoe Rogan3:04

       And you just redo the inside so that you can drive them really well-

   28. JWJonathan Ward3:08

       Yeah, 'cause, you know, you-

   29. JRJoe Rogan3:08

       ... and they don't smell bad. (laughs)

   30. JWJonathan Ward3:09

       ... you, you see it and you're down with the romantic sort of-
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   What year were you…

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      generation Corvette is as early as I go. And then really I, I look to '67 Mustang, '65, '66.

   2. JWJonathan Ward15:06

      What year were you born?

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:06

      '67.

   4. JWJonathan Ward15:08

      Okay, so that's the problem.

   5. JRJoe Rogan15:09

      But it's not. It's my high school years. During my high school years, in the '80s, that was, those were the cool cars. The cool cars were the '60s muscle cars.

   6. JWJonathan Ward15:15

      No, that's what I mean, that's what I mean. We've identified the problem. (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan15:18

      But it's not even a problem. It's just like, to me, like, like a, the quintessential shape is like a '69 Camaro. There's something about a '69 Camaro, like God damn did they nail it. They just, it's a timeless classic. It'll always, it'll always be.

   8. JWJonathan Ward15:31

      It's funny, they've been, they've been crawling under my skin lately. I've been thinking-

   9. JRJoe Rogan15:35

      '69 Camaros? Yeah?

   10. JWJonathan Ward15:36

       Yeah. Like, I think it would be interesting to do one, because if, if you look back on the design history, they were, the design team and executives at GM designed that car basically in reaction to trends in European touring cars and sports cars.

   11. JRJoe Rogan15:50

       Mm-hmm.

   12. JWJonathan Ward15:50

       So, there's a lot of Ferrari, direct Ferrari inspiration, like 275s and stuff. So I always thought it'd be interesting to do a elevated, more European perspective version of that gen Camaro. Like devoid of badges, not like all smoothed out like everyone does, but just like elevate the trim, with like that kick-ass egg crate grill and all those details-

   13. JRJoe Rogan16:12

       Mm-hmm.

   14. JWJonathan Ward16:13

       ... but like do it more the way a, a small coach builder would have done it in production.

   15. JRJoe Rogan16:18

       Mm-hmm.

   16. JWJonathan Ward16:19

       There's something to them, for sure.

   17. JRJoe Rogan16:20

       Yeah. When Matt was here last, he was showing me, there's a company that takes an older Ferrari, what was it? Which, which model was it? Do you remember, Jamie? They, they took an older Ferrari and puts, uh, a much more modern Ferrari engine in it and completely redoes everything. But makes it so that-

   18. JWJonathan Ward16:38

       Was it the-

   19. JRJoe Rogan16:39

       ... is it a GTO?

   20. JWJonathan Ward16:40

       Was it the Norwood P4 or was it GTO Engineering? In LA and the UK they do a lot of GTO builds but they stay pretty true to the original form. But Phil Norwood, who used to actually race for Ferrari, he's... I don't think he's doing them anymore but he, for a while, in Texas I believe, was doing what they called the P4 Norwood and those are so badass.

   21. JRJoe Rogan17:04

       Mm-hmm.

   22. JWJonathan Ward17:04

       So like monocoque, superleggera, lightweight, and they were using modern, uh, I think at that time they were, what are they taking like rectesterosis or something? Some modern Ferrari power train. But keeping the like, the original race aesthetic.

   23. JRJoe Rogan17:19

       I'm not sure what company's doing it, but what they were doing essentially was making everything that you could remove and put it back to the original stock form, including the engine, including the suspension, including the transmission, including the brakes. But everything was after-market, so they weren't cutting anything.

   24. JWJonathan Ward17:37

       (laughs)

   25. JRJoe Rogan17:37

       They were sort of replacing stuff but making this way better, w- way more high-performance version.

   26. JWJonathan Ward17:43

       It might be GTO.

   27. JRJoe Rogan17:44

       Yeah.

   28. JWJonathan Ward17:44

       And also, I mean, if you look at one of their recreation cars that are scratch built, and you know the value of the original GTOs is so nuts that-

   29. JRJoe Rogan17:51

       Yeah.

   30. JWJonathan Ward17:52

       ... now like a guy goes, "Oh, well yeah, I'll leave that in the collection." And they'll call GTO and say, "Build me one that looks just like my car and I actually wanna drive it."
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   No. But from a…

   1. JRJoe Rogan30:00

      the money, you know, th- but they want a Bronco, you know? I get it. I see what you're saying, but I get it from their perspective. It's like, "Take this down, take this."

   2. JWJonathan Ward30:07

      No. But from a consumer perspective, I understand the appeal-

   3. JRJoe Rogan30:11

      Yeah.

   4. JWJonathan Ward30:11

      ... of not having to wait and not having to pay as much. But at best, in this industry, you get what you pay for and frankly, even that is a rare equation. What I'm more pissy about is companies that go, "Oh, well now we can charge more for it and let's just deliver something that looks as close to that and copy as much of its trade dress and style, um, and kick it out at a fat margin at what's deemed to be the most acceptable price point." Like...

   5. JRJoe Rogan30:38

      But with your wait list, like why do you even fuck with that? Like what are you... Why do you pay-

   6. JWJonathan Ward30:43

      It's g-

   7. JRJoe Rogan30:43

      ... attention to those people?

   8. JWJonathan Ward30:43

      May- maybe I'm insecure and childish.

   9. JRJoe Rogan30:46

      (laughing)

   10. JWJonathan Ward30:46

       Or maybe I'm worried that, you know, past a point, it- it's going to erode our business one way or another.

   11. JRJoe Rogan30:52

       Nah.

   12. JWJonathan Ward30:53

       ... you don't think?

   13. JRJoe Rogan30:54

       No, not your business.

   14. JWJonathan Ward30:55

       I mean, and it's cool. Like, scouts, for example. There's, like-

   15. JRJoe Rogan30:57

       Mm-hmm.

   16. JWJonathan Ward30:57

       ... three or four companies now doing scouts their way, with their vision. They're realizing their dream and I, like, I'm here to support them, help them, cheer them on. That's great. It's when people come into a market because they just merely see a capital opportunity, but they're, have no passion or expertise in it, that's where I get pissy.

   17. JRJoe Rogan31:17

       I understand your perspective. My perspective is always a bandwidth perspective. You, say if you, your bandwidth is 100, for, for that's all of your attention that you have, to even give 10 of that to some knuckleheads that are just copying you-

   18. JWJonathan Ward31:32

       It's true.

   19. JRJoe Rogan31:33

       ... it takes away-

   20. JWJonathan Ward31:33

       It wastes energy. Yeah.

   21. JRJoe Rogan31:34

       That's all it, all it does. It just-

   22. JWJonathan Ward31:35

       (laughs)

   23. JRJoe Rogan31:35

       ... takes away from what you're doing, and what you're doing is amazing.

   24. JWJonathan Ward31:38

       I think the last time I thought about it prior to just now bitching to you has been a good three or four months. So I don't give-

   25. JRJoe Rogan31:43

       But is it-

   26. JWJonathan Ward31:43

       ... I don't give it too much thought, but-

   27. JRJoe Rogan31:45

       Just every now and then? A little blip on the radar.

   28. JWJonathan Ward31:47

       Every now and again, it bubbles up.

   29. JRJoe Rogan31:48

       Eh.

   30. JWJonathan Ward31:48

       Eh.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   I love those cars.…

   1. JWJonathan Ward45:00

      talking about them and like had it forever. Drove the piss out of it.

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:03

      I love those cars. I have zero desire to own one now, and I have zero desi- desire to own anything old that hasn't been redone.

   3. JWJonathan Ward45:11

      Yeah.

   4. JRJoe Rogan45:11

      I don't like... There it is, Mr. Enthusiast.

   5. JWJonathan Ward45:14

      Oh, there you go.

   6. JRJoe Rogan45:15

      That's a beautiful car. Goddamn, that's beautiful.

   7. JWJonathan Ward45:16

      He's so funny too 'cause like, as you know, I'm a big watch geek and he's like the antichrist in the watch culture (laughs) because he's all about quartz, like vintage quartz. So like for a short time, Patek made quartz watches.

   8. JRJoe Rogan45:30

      Mm-hmm.

   9. JWJonathan Ward45:30

      And like everyone shuns them, but now like they're immensely collectible.

   10. JRJoe Rogan45:35

       Why, why does everybody hate quartz? 'Cause they just want everything to be mechanical?

   11. JWJonathan Ward45:38

       To me, that's why I won't touch a quartz watch.

   12. JRJoe Rogan45:41

       But what about Grand Seiko where they combine the two of them?

   13. JWJonathan Ward45:44

       I want the heart and soul.

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:44

       They use the, the quartz to sort of accentuate-

   15. JWJonathan Ward45:45

       Well, even Ressence, who's one of my favorite of the weirdos of other brands.

   16. JRJoe Rogan45:49

       Is that your, your watch?

   17. JWJonathan Ward45:50

       Yeah, not my design. This is, uh, Ressence or Ressence is the brand. These are super trippy, but like they just came out with a smartwatch where like when you're on the plane and you enter a new time zone and you land, it'll reset itself. I'm like-

   18. JRJoe Rogan46:01

       What?

   19. JWJonathan Ward46:02

       ... I have a thumb and an index finger that work pretty fucking good. I can set my own watch.

   20. JRJoe Rogan46:07

       How does it do that?

   21. JWJonathan Ward46:08

       Oh, it's got a smart-

   22. JRJoe Rogan46:09

       It's a mechanical watch that does that?

   23. JWJonathan Ward46:10

       Yeah, mechanical quartz combination.

   24. JRJoe Rogan46:12

       Oh, wow.

   25. JWJonathan Ward46:13

       But these are super trippy 'cause the entire-

   26. JRJoe Rogan46:15

       Whoa.

   27. JWJonathan Ward46:16

       ... movement rotates as it tells the time.

   28. JRJoe Rogan46:18

       What? Let me see that.

   29. JWJonathan Ward46:19

       Yeah.

   30. JRJoe Rogan46:19

       That's crazy.
5. 1:00:00 – 1:11:57

   Oh, yeah? …

   1. JWJonathan Ward1:00:00

      a really nice camaraderie within that community. There's, like, Movement Motors in Austin's doing really nice retrofits and-

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:00:06

      Oh, yeah?

   3. JWJonathan Ward1:00:07

      EV West has been around forever. They're really the granddaddies on the scene and-

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:00:11

      Movement Motors-

   5. JWJonathan Ward1:00:12

      ... you know, Stealth.

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:00:12

      ... in Austin?

   7. JWJonathan Ward1:00:13

      Mm-hmm.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:00:13

      Did they ... Are they the ones that did that Mustang?

   9. JWJonathan Ward1:00:16

      Um, I think they've done a 'Stang. They just finished doing a 2002 BMW. They did a early GTV Alfa. They've done all sorts of different, like, pretty cool diverse range of platforms. And then of course, um ...... um, uh, Z Electric down in Orange County that started out doing just the bugs, now the bugs and the buses, and now 911s. And it's like, there's such a large and welcoming, kind, cool community of people in that space.

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:00:43

       Now, when you charge a Tesla, it's easy. You know, you look for the Tesla superchargers. They're all over the place. You press a button on your, the screen and it shows you where they are. It'll navigate you to them. When you try to get one of th- You can't charge a regular car at a Tesla superstation, can you?

   11. JWJonathan Ward1:00:59

       No. And there's different... So there's the standard... I forget the anachron. We could call Rich. Uh, the J blah, blah, blah connector. But there's a standard municipal connector, and then there's also the new fast charge network. But it depends on where you live. But for example, around here, it's a joke. They're everywhere. So like, I have an app when I'm driving that '49 Merc and, you know, I was, uh, speaking at Barrett-Jackson and had it there in town for while I was visiting. And then you network the apps and you find it. But we, we made that one supercharger-compatible, because the client's gonna install one in his house and bunk the system. Otherwise, you try and go to a public Tesla charger, it has to do a handshake and it says, (laughs) "No." Like-

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:01:38

       Oh, is that what it is?

   13. JWJonathan Ward1:01:39

       ... "You may not charge here."

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:01:41

       So you can have it supercharger-compatible for like... I have one on the wall back there-

   15. JWJonathan Ward1:01:45

       Yeah.

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:01:45

       ... for my car. So it would work with that?

   17. JWJonathan Ward1:01:47

       Yes, that's my understanding.

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:01:48

       Oh, sweet. Like, uh-

   19. JWJonathan Ward1:01:48

       But not a public in-, uh, installation.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:01:51

       Ah, okay.

   21. JWJonathan Ward1:01:51

       Those have to go through a whole handshake protocol-

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:01:54

       Ah, I see.

   23. JWJonathan Ward1:01:54

       ... sending data back and forth.

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:01:55

       Yeah. That's interesting that they decided to do it that way, you know?

   25. JWJonathan Ward1:01:58

       Well, it was fun. We put one, um, behind the front license plate, so we did one of those old school articulating plates, like remember on the gas fullers-

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:02:06

       Ah.

   27. JWJonathan Ward1:02:06

       ... right on the plate? So that has the one interface connector. And then the other one, I machined this unnecessarily groovy sort of gas cap under the original fuel door on the Merc, and then that's for the other style charger.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:02:21

       So do you... Oh, so you could charge it with different ones. So the supercharger-

   29. JWJonathan Ward1:02:25

       Correct.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:02:25

       ... is one.

Episode duration: 2:15:50