The Joe Rogan ExperienceJoe Rogan Experience #1469 - Adam Perry Lang
CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 0:45
Restaurant shutdown reality check & APL’s immediate pivot
Joe opens by praising Adam Perry Lang’s steakhouse APL and frames the conversation around the unprecedented crisis facing restaurants during COVID shutdowns. Adam describes the emotional whiplash of suddenly losing dine-in service and trying to keep purpose and momentum amid uncertainty.
- •APL as Joe’s favorite LA steakhouse; why Adam is a timely guest
- •Shock of the shutdown and the feeling of the ‘switch turning off’
- •Initial mindset: keep cooking, help people, figure it out later
- •The broader devastation for small businesses doing everything right
- 0:45 – 3:27
Keeping staff afloat, triage decisions, and early charity partnerships
Adam explains how he tried to protect his team, what it meant to cut staff dramatically, and how the restaurant looked for ways to stay useful. He details early charitable efforts, including a meal-donation match with Jimmy Kimmel supporting St. Joseph’s Center.
- •Decision not to lay off employees immediately; then needing to cut ~90%
- •Leadership moments with his GM and the team’s support
- •Takeout plus charity as a dual strategy
- •Jimmy Kimmel partnership: donate a meal for every meal prepared
- 3:27 – 5:45
Frontline meal logistics: feeding hospitals and designing comfort menus
The discussion turns to the operational mechanics of feeding healthcare workers. Adam breaks down how organizations connect restaurants with hospitals, how meals are packaged and delivered, and why comfort food became central during the crisis.
- •Frontline LA as the connector between restaurants and hospitals
- •Preparing and packaging 150 meals at a time for hospital workers
- •Balancing healthy meals with morale-boosting comfort food (meatloaf, mashed potatoes)
- •Menu shift toward comfort food and barbecue during lockdown
- 5:45 – 7:11
Takeout economics: curbside vs delivery apps, and the 10–15% survival problem
Joe and Adam dig into how delivery platforms affect restaurant margins and why direct curbside pickup is preferable when possible. Adam quantifies the drop in business and explains the practical and emotional strategy of staying busy to endure.
- •Curbside pickup preferred; apps expand reach but take significant fees
- •Need to upcharge on delivery apps; business split roughly half-and-half
- •Revenue collapse to ~10–15% of normal capacity
- •Coping strategy: keep moving, serve the neighborhood and frontline workers
- 7:11 – 10:23
Industry outlook, PPP loans, rent deferrals, and the ‘unknown rules’ ahead
Adam describes the anxiety restaurateurs share: unclear regulations, landlord negotiations, and financial tools that don’t fully fit restaurant realities. He explains the PPP program structure and why the restaurant sector struggled to access adequate relief.
- •Fear many restaurants won’t survive; rules and mandates still unfolding
- •Landlord rent deferrals vs still being ‘on the hook’
- •PPP explained: 8-week payroll lifeline, 75% payroll / 25% rent+utilities
- •Restaurants receiving a small fraction of loan volume
- 10:23 – 16:24
Inside APL’s dry-aging: the ‘environmental chamber’ and flavor science
The conversation shifts from crisis to craft: Joe recounts eating extremely long-aged steak, and Adam explains what dry-aging changes in meat. He outlines the environmental variables and the biochemical transformations that create tenderness and deep, altered flavors.
- •What long-aged steak tastes like and why it’s ‘different animal’ territory
- •Dry-aging variables: air velocity, temperature, humidity
- •Concentration of flavor + enzyme-driven tenderization
- •Amino acids, Maillard reaction, and why high-heat cooking matters
- 16:24 – 20:55
How to cook steak properly: tempering, heat methods, and avoiding dry-aged ‘liver’ flavors
Adam details his approach to thicker steaks, resting/tempering techniques, and what temperatures mean in practice. They compare wood-fire cooking versus steakhouse broilers/plancha and discuss how smoke and fuel chemistry can mask dry-age flavor.
- •Tempering method: bring steak to ~105°F, rest, then finish for even doneness
- •Adam’s temperature targets: rare vs medium-rare in his method
- •Why slow-cooking dry-aged meat can turn ‘livery’ and unpleasant
- •Wood-fire vs broiler/plancha: clean heat, crust development, and surface contact
- 20:55 – 28:28
Building a unique dry-age ‘culture’: spores, room differences, and costly inventory bets
Adam explains that dry-aging is not a single standardized process; each room develops its own character like cheese caves. He describes intentionally propagating friendly molds/spores, tasting along the way, and why extended aging is a high-risk, high-cost differentiator.
- •Dry-age as terroir: rooms differ by airflow, ceiling height, circulation
- •Seeding the room with ‘friendly mold’ from trimmed crust to spread spores
- •Tasting at 30/50+ days to dial in the room’s sweet spot
- •Inventory risk: carrying massive aging stock to create a signature profile
- 28:28 – 37:40
Food as art and craft: Bourdain’s influence and the pre–Food Network kitchen mentality
Joe and Adam reflect on how Anthony Bourdain helped people understand cuisine as an art form and cultural bridge. Adam contrasts old-school kitchen progression and motivations with the celebrity-driven incentives that emerged with Food Network-era fame.
- •Bourdain’s role in translating chef passion to the public
- •Cooking as art (curiosity) vs craft (repeatable consistency)
- •Shift in motivation: love of the work vs notoriety/celebrity
- •Traditional progression: line cook → sous chef → chef vs shortcut expectations
- 37:40 – 45:38
Custom steak knives, theft deterrence, and Adam’s path into bladesmithing
They discuss the signature APL touch: Adam-made steak knives and the practical problem of customers stealing them. Adam shares the felony-threshold pricing joke and recounts tracking down a knife thief, then explains how formal metalwork training became a serious pursuit.
- •APL’s custom knives as part of the dining experience
- •Pricing at $950.01 as a theft deterrent tied to felony threshold
- •Story: knife stolen into a baby carriage; returned after warning
- •Learning bladesmithing: New England School of Metalwork and hammer-ins
- 45:38 – 56:36
Samurai sword interlude: steel, heat treatment, and the ‘soul of the blade’
Joe shows Adam a papered samurai sword from the 1500s, prompting a deep dive into steel craftsmanship. Adam explains quenching, molecular structure, and why heat treatment defines blade performance and elegance.
- •Examining a 500-year-old Japanese blade and its balance
- •Heat treatment/quench as the defining step in blade quality
- •Hard vs tough steel tradeoffs; brittleness vs razor sharpness
- •Cultural idea of putting the maker/user’s ‘soul’ into a blade
- 56:36 – 1:21:31
Cooking techniques debate: reverse sear, wild game, and sous vide (especially lobster)
Adam critiques the reverse-sear approach for steaks, emphasizing flavor compounds created when browning happens while juices re-adhere to the meat. They carve out exceptions for lean wild game and praise sous vide’s precision for delicate proteins like butter-poached lobster.
- •‘Sear’ vs ‘browning’ terminology; crust as primary flavor driver
- •Why Adam dislikes reverse sear for beef steaks; flavor loss vs perfect edge-to-edge pink
- •Wild game exception: brown first, then finish gently with rest/carryover
- •Sous vide’s best use cases: butter-poached lobster tails and delicate shellfish
- 1:21:31 – 1:33:02
Fly fishing obsession: catch-and-release ethics, dry-fly culture, and Huey Lewis as mentor
The conversation veers into fly fishing, where Adam describes the meditative, technical nature of the sport and why his group is committed to catch-and-release. They unpack dry-fly purism, ‘cheating’ with subsurface rigs, and the surprising detail that Huey Lewis is part of the fishing circle.
- •Why catch-and-release feels sustainable and ritualistic to Adam
- •Dry flies vs subsurface/nymphing; matching the hatch and reading conditions
- •Group culture and social pressure; Jimmy Kimmel as dry-fly devotee
- •Huey Lewis connection and fishing Montana hatches like the swallow hatch
- 1:33:02 – 1:47:46
Hunting, conservation funding, and responsible meat sourcing
Joe connects hunting ethics to conservation economics, explaining how licenses and excise taxes fund wildlife management and habitat. Adam then details his beef sourcing philosophy—relationships with purveyors, humane handling, and how stress affects meat quality—leading into a nuanced grass-fed vs grain-finished discussion.
- •Bow hunting difficulty, ethics, and the ‘one moment after ten days’ reality
- •North American conservation funding via hunting licenses and Pittman–Robertson-style mechanisms
- •Adam’s sourcing: Niman Ranch relationships, combo beef, antibiotic/steroid-free practices
- •Temple Grandin and low-stress slaughter; ‘dark cutter’ meat as a stress outcome
- •Grass-fed vs grain-finished framed as nutrition and terroir, not absolutes
- 1:47:46 – 1:57:49
Diet talk and chef lifestyle: carnivore month, intermittent fasting, sugar, and brutal hours
Joe describes his month-long carnivore diet experience and how it affected energy, weight, and cravings, while Adam shares what’s feasible when you taste food all day. They close by discussing intermittent fasting, sugar’s addictive pull, a chef’s long workdays (including sleeping at the restaurant), and the leadership strain during lockdown.
- •Joe’s carnivore month: mostly ribeyes/elk/eggs, weight loss, high energy, boredom
- •Adam’s reality: tasting meat daily but rarely eating full steaks
- •Intermittent fasting as Adam’s most effective structure; late-night cravings problem
- •Sugar cravings and the ‘poisoned’ feeling after heavy junk food
- •Chef schedule: 10am–late, overnight BBQ timing, sleeping on-site, stress compartmentalization
