Joe Rogan Experience #1514 - Joe De Sena

1. 0:00 – 4:16

   The traveling kettlebell: commitment, TSA rules, and lost luggage stories

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (singing)

   2. JSJoe De Sena0:00

      Thanks for doing this.

   3. JRJoe Rogan0:01

      My pleasure. Hello, Joe.

   4. JSJoe De Sena0:02

      That's right. (laughs)

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:02

      How are you? We're rolling.

   6. JSJoe De Sena0:03

      Oh, we're rolling.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:03

      What's going on, man?

   8. JSJoe De Sena0:04

      All right.

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:04

      Nice to meet you.

   10. JSJoe De Sena0:05

       Thanks for having me.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:06

       So, uh, the kettlebell, you bring this fucking thing everywhere you go.

   12. JSJoe De Sena0:10

       I, I do.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:10

       Literally everywhere?

   14. JSJoe De Sena0:10

       I, I, uh, lived overseas and I started at... You know why I started it? I had a, um, 696-pound guy come to the farm, uh, six years ago, and he wanted, he wanted help losing weight. And I, I helped him, uh, over 18 months get down to 265 pounds.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       Wow.

   16. JSJoe De Sena0:31

       And one of the methods I used to motivate him was I said, "As you lose weight, I'll carry weight." And e- eventually I was carrying a 100-pound sandbag. Fast forward, and, and we can get into it, I moved overseas with my family and I tried to carry that 100-pound sandbag 'cause I had made that commitment to him and they wouldn't let it through TSA. So when I landed in, in, uh, Asia, I asked my wife, I said, "Hey, could you order a 20-count po-" It's stupid that I'm carrying a sandbag. "Can you order a 20-pound kettlebell? I'll just carry a 20-pounder around so I'm not a complete fraud." And she confused pounds with, uh, ke- kilograms and I ended up with a, a 44-pounder and it just became my shtick, my thing. (laughs)

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:13

       (laughs)

   18. JSJoe De Sena1:13

       (laughs)

   19. JRJoe Rogan1:14

       So when you... You say you carry it everywhere, I mean, you go everywhere with it.

   20. JSJoe De Sena1:17

       I go everywhere with it. So on pande... During the pandemic, I haven't... Like I wouldn't carry it if we were going to a grocery store, but if, if I'm traveling to see you or I'm going anywhere in the world, kettlebell's coming with me. Vegas, anywhere.

   21. JRJoe Rogan1:27

       Do you take it as a carry on? Like how does-

   22. JSJoe De Sena1:29

       Depends on the country. Um, we operate in a lot of countries and, and every country treats it differently. So some US flights, they'll let me carry it on, which is strange. Uh, others, they, they ask me to check it.

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:40

       You know, they won't let you bring a pool cue on a plane?

   24. JSJoe De Sena1:43

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:43

       'Cause they say it's like a weapon.

   26. JSJoe De Sena1:44

       Well, the stuff-

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:45

       How is that not like a weapon?

   28. JSJoe De Sena1:46

       Well, uh, my answer to them is, "You'd have to be pretty fucking strong." (laughs)

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:50

       You, you're pretty fucking strong.

   30. JSJoe De Sena1:51

       I'm not that strong. (laughs)
2. 4:16 – 7:25

   Japan’s discipline culture and early COVID response

   1. JRJoe Rogan4:16

      They're, uh, they have like one of the lowest death rates and l- lowest, uh, p- problems with COVID. Like th- they're one of the countries that handled it the best. And we're trying to figure out why and I think it's, it's probably they- they're really good at following rules, very disciplined.

   2. JSJoe De Sena4:35

      Well, they-

   3. JRJoe Rogan4:35

      And they wear masks all the time when they're sick.

   4. JSJoe De Sena4:38

      They we- so I lived there for a year and, and, um, during COVID, w- I put together this phone call that happened every morning. I called it the warrior call, 5:27 AM, and I had all our teams from, uh, 40 plus countries get on the call, 30 minutes, "Give me an update from Japan. Give me an update from China. Give me an update from France." Just very quick. And they shut down Japan right away. I mean, they did not fuck about and, and, you know, they're not shaking hands in Japan, right? They've got the bow.

   5. JRJoe Rogan5:05

      Mm-hmm.

   6. JSJoe De Sena5:06

      Uh, taxi drivers are wearing gloves. They don't mess around. So no, no surprise that, uh, they, they killed it right away.

   7. JRJoe Rogan5:13

      It's so interesting how human beings that, you know, basically not much different other than they're from a different climate, you know, dif- different genes, but it's just amazing how differently they live. It's am- it's amazing how they all have... Like when I was in Japan, I've only been once, but when I was in Tokyo, I was like, "Everyone is so polite." Like you're walking down the street and it's like there's no garbage anywhere, it's very clean, but yes- yet it's very packed. There's a lot of people and everyone is very friendly. Like it's like the way they handle everything, everything is very polite, very orderly. One thing I found interesting, I couldn't go to the gym unless I went back to my hotel room and put a long sleeve shirt on.

   8. JSJoe De Sena5:54

      No tat, no tattoos. No.

   9. JRJoe Rogan5:54

      Yeah, they wouldn't let me out. I'm like, "I'm not yakuza, I'm, I'm-"

   10. JSJoe De Sena5:57

       You, you're, you're, you're a mafia.

   11. JRJoe Rogan5:58

       "... I'm a American." (laughs)

   12. JSJoe De Sena5:59

       You're a mafia there. (laughs)

   13. JRJoe Rogan6:01

       Yeah, they wouldn't let me show... You cannot have any visible tat, let's, at least in the gym that I was working out at.

   14. JSJoe De Sena6:05

       No, it's ev- it's every, it's everywhere.

   15. JRJoe Rogan6:07

       Couldn't have any visible tattoos.

   16. JSJoe De Sena6:07

       And, and, um, you know, there's simple little things they did to affect human behavior, like we couldn't find garbage cans on the street like you would in New York or somewhere else. So you find yourself in a situation where you can't dispose of the garbage, right? So now you're sticking it in your pocket. So within a month-... you're, you're not creating garbage anymore because it's a pain in the ass.

   17. JRJoe Rogan6:27

       Mm.

   18. JSJoe De Sena6:27

       Right? You're figuring out how to, um, use less and get rid of less.

   19. JRJoe Rogan6:32

       Mm.

   20. JSJoe De Sena6:32

       Like, so they've changed behavior. Subways are spotless.

   21. JRJoe Rogan6:36

       Yeah. I didn't watch, uh, I didn't actually get on any of the subways but, uh, everything was spotless.

   22. JSJoe De Sena6:42

       Yeah.

   23. JRJoe Rogan6:42

       It was just, it was weird.

   24. JSJoe De Sena6:43

       And people are thin.

   25. JRJoe Rogan6:44

       Yeah.

   26. JSJoe De Sena6:45

       Right? Fit.

   27. JRJoe Rogan6:46

       Yeah.

   28. JSJoe De Sena6:47

       Smoke, they smoke a little too much, isn't it?

   29. JRJoe Rogan6:49

       They smoke a lot.

   30. JSJoe De Sena6:49

       Yeah.
3. 7:25 – 23:37

   Extreme weight loss experiment: 696 to 265 pounds on a Vermont farm

   1. JSJoe De Sena7:25

      So, um, after I helped that, that, uh, guy lose that weight, uh, the company-

   2. JRJoe Rogan7:31

      How did you do that, by the way? He, he lost 400 pounds?

   3. JSJoe De Sena7:34

      Uh, yeah.

   4. JRJoe Rogan7:35

      Close to it?

   5. JSJoe De Sena7:35

      Close to it. So, um-

   6. JRJoe Rogan7:36

      In a year?

   7. JSJoe De Sena7:37

      18 months.

   8. JRJoe Rogan7:38

      That's amazing.

   9. JSJoe De Sena7:39

      It was amazing, but you're not gonna be... We may be at odds on this, but I went, um... And I'll tell you why. We went raw fruits and vegetables only, and, um, here's a guy that was eating eight, eight Egg McMuffins a day for breakfast and two two-liter Sprites.

   10. JRJoe Rogan7:54

       Jesus Christ.

   11. JSJoe De Sena7:55

       Right? So he gets... He balloons to 696 pounds.

   12. JRJoe Rogan7:57

       How long did it take him to get that big?

   13. JSJoe De Sena7:59

       (exhales loudly) To get back to s-

   14. JRJoe Rogan8:01

       No, as big as he was.

   15. JSJoe De Sena8:02

       Oh, um, he, you know, when he-

   16. JRJoe Rogan8:04

       Was he always big?

   17. JSJoe De Sena8:04

       When he, yeah, when he left, he said... He, he was crying. He said to me, "This is the first time, as far as I can remember, where I fit in one airplane seat."

   18. JRJoe Rogan8:12

       Oh, wow.

   19. JSJoe De Sena8:12

       So this was, this was over a long period of time. But he, um, we did raw fruits and vegetables, and then we did a... We started with a 10-mile hike every day.

   20. JRJoe Rogan8:21

       10 miles every day?

   21. JSJoe De Sena8:22

       Every day.

   22. JRJoe Rogan8:22

       Wow.

   23. JSJoe De Sena8:22

       And then it, and then it went to 20.

   24. JRJoe Rogan8:24

       Jesus.

   25. JSJoe De Sena8:24

       It went to 10 in the morning, 10 at night, raw fruits and vegetables. We got to a point where he was losing two to three pounds a day.

   26. JRJoe Rogan8:31

       That 10 and 10 is a, that is a, that's a long hike and a lot of time. Like, how much time was that taking him every day?

   27. JSJoe De Sena8:37

       He gave up work. He, he worked for Comcast. They were kind enough to say, "You're on leave." Um, I cov-

   28. JRJoe Rogan8:42

       Wow.

   29. JSJoe De Sena8:42

       I covered the expenses, which was like two stalks of celery and an, and a glass (laughs) of water every day. It was not, you know, it wasn't much of an expense. And, um, and he spent the whole day basically hiking.

   30. JRJoe Rogan8:53

       So he hiked all day, and what kept him motivated? Just this idea that he was gonna lose weight at the other end?
4. 23:37 – 1:08:34

   Discipline vs relapse: rapid results, psychological hooks, and weight rebound

   1. JRJoe Rogan23:37

      And so, after 18 months, did you let him have a cake?

   2. JSJoe De Sena23:40

      No, did not let him have a cake.

   3. JRJoe Rogan23:41

      (laughs)

   4. JSJoe De Sena23:41

      (laughs) But I'll tell you what. Somebody heard about what I did, and this guy shows up. Number Two, we'll call him. Uh, and he's 300 pounds, and he wants to get to 200. And I said, "All right, head up the mountain. You're gonna sleep in the cabin." 'Cause I just went through all that time with the other guy. "And we're gonna be much more efficient here. First week, you're only eating apples. Gotta clean out your system." I gave him giant bushel of apples, put him on top of the mountain. 30 days, we had him down to 200 pounds. And-

   5. JRJoe Rogan24:11

      What?

   6. JSJoe De Sena24:12

      30 days.

   7. JRJoe Rogan24:13

      100 pounds in 30-

   8. JSJoe De Sena24:14

      Lost 100 pounds in 30 days.

   9. JRJoe Rogan24:15

      That seems scary.

   10. JSJoe De Sena24:16

       Scary. Hiking, raw fruits and vegetables. And, um, here's a guy that was sedentary, a truck driver, not really moving around much. Uh, eating shit foods. I mean, it's not rocket science, right? You eat shit food, you're not active, you're gaining weight.

   11. JRJoe Rogan24:28

       Right.

   12. JSJoe De Sena24:28

       Uh, you eat good food, you're very active, you lose weight.

   13. JRJoe Rogan24:31

       Right.

   14. JSJoe De Sena24:31

       And, and, um, his girlfriend picks him up after 30 days.... and they fucking leave the farm, unbeknownst to me, and they go straight to Ben & Jerry's.

   15. JRJoe Rogan24:40

       (laughs)

   16. JSJoe De Sena24:41

       And they put on, like, 18 fucking pounds-

   17. JRJoe Rogan24:43

       Oh.

   18. JSJoe De Sena24:43

       ... in a day.

   19. JRJoe Rogan24:45

       Oh.

   20. JSJoe De Sena24:46

       Right?

   21. JRJoe Rogan24:46

       Yeah.

   22. JSJoe De Sena24:47

       So, I mean, there's psychological issues that I ... th- that's not what I'm fixing. I'm, I'm doing the physical part.

   23. JRJoe Rogan24:53

       Well, I gotta think that a person willing to do 18 months, is that what you said with that gentleman?

   24. JSJoe De Sena24:57

       He hung in for a while.

   25. JRJoe Rogan24:59

       That 18 months is-

   26. JSJoe De Sena25:01

       Yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan25:01

       ... just psychologically, you're building up some pretty spectacular endurance.

   28. JSJoe De Sena25:04

       Yeah.

   29. JRJoe Rogan25:05

       Just fr- raw fruits and vegetables for 18 months-

   30. JSJoe De Sena25:08

       Yeah.
5. 29:14 – 36:41

   Discipline, fighting culture, and the “Spartan paradox” of training for a date

   1. JSJoe De Sena29:14

      He- here's a question I have for you. I agree with you hun- 100%, body weight and, and discipline.

   2. JRJoe Rogan29:18

      Yeah.

   3. JSJoe De Sena29:19

      But you, you were a fighter. Tell me if you agree with this. In, in the '70s, I remember as a young kid seeing Rocky.

   4. JRJoe Rogan29:26

      Yeah.

   5. JSJoe De Sena29:26

      And that was my introduction to, uh ... For many kids, actually, in America, right?

   6. JRJoe Rogan29:29

      Sure.

   7. JSJoe De Sena29:29

      That was our introduction to fighting. And what ... For whatever reason, at a very young age, it, it was intriguing to me that a person, a fighter would get out of shape and then get in shape.

   8. JRJoe Rogan29:41

      Yeah.

   9. JSJoe De Sena29:41

      Why wouldn't they just stay in shape the whole time? Right?

   10. JRJoe Rogan29:44

       Yeah. It's, it's a discipline issue. It's also, like, a lot of fighters are wild people, you know? One of the things that fuels them is not just this desire to compete. They, they, they're wild. They like to get fucked up. They like to drink, they like to party, they like to womanize, they like to go out on the town and be the fucking man, you know? And, and they get fat. Like, Roberto Duran was famous for that, right? He'd get real fat in between fights and then he'd have to lose weight. And just, you know ... That, there's guys that don't, like Bernard Hopkins never, never gained weight and he was super disciplined and always ate really clean.

   11. JSJoe De Sena30:18

       Yeah.

   12. JRJoe Rogan30:18

       And was a elite athlete deep into his 40s. I mean, he was a world champion deep into his 40s-

   13. JSJoe De Sena30:23

       Yeah.

   14. JRJoe Rogan30:24

       ... which is very unusual for a boxer.

   15. JSJoe De Sena30:26

       And, and so my question is, is, um ... It makes sense why they go in and out and they don't, they don't maintain it, but then the very disciplined fighters would perform better, I would imagine, right? Because-

   16. JRJoe Rogan30:37

       Then, yeah, and for the most part, yeah.

   17. JSJoe De Sena30:40

       ... do you think, 'cause this is the way... I, I call it the Spartan paradox, right? You probably have a better name for it from all the years of fighting, but, like, if you have a date on the calendar... The Spartans knew they were going to battle.

   18. JRJoe Rogan30:51

       Mm-hmm.

   19. JSJoe De Sena30:51

       If you know you got a fight coming up, you'll do those pushups, those squats, right? And those crunches.

   20. JRJoe Rogan30:57

       Some guys will.

   21. JSJoe De Sena30:58

       But if you know you got a battle coming-

   22. JRJoe Rogan31:00

       Okay, I'll give you an example.

   23. JSJoe De Sena31:01

       Okay.

   24. JRJoe Rogan31:01

       Andy Ruiz.

   25. JSJoe De Sena31:02

       Okay.

   26. JRJoe Rogan31:02

       Andy Ruiz, he comes in last minute, knocks out Anthony Joshua, becomes the heavyweight champion of the world. First Mexican heavyweight champion of the world. He's a fucking hero. Gets fat as fuck, balloons up to 280. This is while training for the next fight, weighs in at 280, loses the rematch. Knew it was coming. Got rid of his trainer, had all sorts of fucking problems in camp, partied too much. Knew it was coming. Knew the day it was coming.

   27. JSJoe De Sena31:27

       What, what, wouldn't do the work?

   28. JRJoe Rogan31:28

       W- Wouldn't do the work. Just, just was living the lifestyle. Just got too wrapped up in the fact that he was the champ and too wrapped up in partying and next thing you know, he'd lost the title and now, you know, he- he's faced with this very difficult task of trying to get a fight for the title now, because he's a dangerous fighter still, but people... He's not really the draw that he could've been. If he had beat Joshua the second time, he's a superstar, you know? He's just... He's up there with Tyson Fury.

   29. JSJoe De Sena31:53

       He got cocky.

   30. JRJoe Rogan31:54

       He got... Well, whatever it was, man. He got lost in the lifestyle. The lifestyle gets a lot of these guys. You know, you're hanging out with a lot of, lot of, uh, your buddies that you came up with. You know, maybe you got a buddy who drives you around, maybe you got another buddy who does security and they like to party and there's girls and there's maybe a little bit of cocaine, a little bit of alcohol.
6. 36:41 – 48:30

   Cornell saga and what discipline really means: focus, obsession, and personality fit

   1. JSJoe De Sena36:41

      Yeah, those are the GOATS. So I, I, um...... I graduate high school and I wanna go back to the neighborhood. I don't wanna go to college, right? 'Cause for obvious reasons, I wanna be around these guys, and I got this business that's, that's doing great. And a friend of mine says, um, (smacks lips) because my mom moved to Ithaca, New York to get me away from the neighborhood when they got divorced. So a friend of mine in Ithaca says, uh, "Why don't we go to Cornell?" Cornell's in Ithaca. And I said, "How the fuck would we go to Cornell? My grades suck. Uh, I'm not planning on going to college, I got this business." He said, "My dad's a professor, he'll get us in." (smacks lips) So coming from the neighborhood I came from, that made sense. We got a guy that's gonna get us into college. So, um, we both apply. We, we do great on the application, we do great in the interview. Neither of us get in. But now I'm interested, right? When you, when somebody pushes back and says, "No, you're not allowed to come here."

   2. JRJoe Rogan37:30

      Mm-hmm.

   3. JSJoe De Sena37:30

      Now you, now you want in. It wasn't even my intention to go to college, but now I wanna go. So, uh ...

   4. JRJoe Rogan37:35

      (laughs)

   5. JSJoe De Sena37:36

      (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan37:36

      (laughs)

   7. JSJoe De Sena37:36

      Because they said no.

   8. JRJoe Rogan37:37

      Right.

   9. JSJoe De Sena37:38

      Right? So I say to him, and this ties to what you were just saying, I say to him, "Well, fuck, if we're gonna do it, (smacks lips) why don't I spend the summer going to St. John's in Queens while I'm doing my pool business and learn how to study?" 'Cause I haven't, I, I've never studied.

   10. JRJoe Rogan37:54

       Mm-hmm.

   11. JSJoe De Sena37:54

       Buckle down, get serious, get discipline. He says, "Screw that, we're gonna go to Vegas. Why don't we go to Vegas, give up your business, go to Vegas, we'll party all summer, and then we'll buckle down in September when we get here? Why would we, why would we waste the summer? This is our last summer." So we diverge. And I study and I run my business and he goes to Vegas. And, um, (smacks lips) we both come back and we reapply. We do well that semester. Um, we, we're allowed to go, it's called extramural, we're allowed to take three classes non-matriculated in the school, and then, and then apply. We both do it, and they don't, they don't accept us. (smacks lips) So, uh, he diverts, he goes to Veg- he goes to UNLV. And, and I stay, and I say, "Fuck this, I'm just, I'm doing it again." And I do it a second time, I do it a third time. Finally, fourth time, they accept me and I pound my chest, and I tell people this story, right? "Look, look how great I am. I was disciplined unlike him who went to ..." He became a giant medical marijuana (laughs) guy in Vegas.

   12. JRJoe Rogan38:52

       (laughs)

   13. JSJoe De Sena38:52

       And I'm fucking laying barbwire for a living. (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan38:55

       (laughs)

   15. JSJoe De Sena38:55

       So maybe, (laughs) maybe discipline and that g- ... I don't know. But, um ...

   16. JRJoe Rogan38:59

       Well, you know, sometimes people find a path ...

   17. JSJoe De Sena39:02

       Right.

   18. JRJoe Rogan39:02

       ... that suits their personality. Like, oft- oftentimes people confuse discipline with focus, and this is what, w- why that's important. There are things that some people can excel at because they're focused on them and because they're drawn to it and they have an incredible passion for it, versus, like, you tell a guy, like, "Hey, you know, you're gonna study to be an electrical engineer." And he's like, "I don't wanna be a fucking electrical engineer." "Well, you gotta have discipline." And so they don't have the drive and they don't, they don't get excited about it and they don't do ... But if you tell that guy, "Whatever, you're gonna be a golfer." And he fucking loves golf and he's practicing every day, and he becomes a professional golfer. And you say, "Well, I, I thought that guy didn't have any discipline." Well, it's not that he didn't have any discipline, he's just not interested in that other thing. I was never a disciplined kid. But I was, but I would find things that I loved and I was obsessed. And I always felt embarrassed by it because people would say, "Oh, your son ..." Like, to my mom, "Your son is so disciplined." And she'd be like, "My son's fucking crazy." Like, he's not disciplined. He finds these things and that's all he does all day long.

   19. JSJoe De Sena40:10

       Right.

   20. JRJoe Rogan40:10

       Like, it's not really discipline because he doesn't clean his room.

   21. JSJoe De Sena40:13

       Right.

   22. JRJoe Rogan40:13

       He's, he's fucking lazy. There's all sorts of shit he's supposed to doing. I never did my homework. There's all the ... But if I had a thing that I was into, I was obsessed.

   23. JSJoe De Sena40:22

       You were crazy about it.

   24. JRJoe Rogan40:23

       But I would, it would bother me that I didn't really have discipline. Like, if I had jobs that I had to do, I didn't do a good job at them-

   25. JSJoe De Sena40:29

       Yeah.

   26. JRJoe Rogan40:29

       ... like, you know, construction jobs that I had. But when it came to martial arts-

   27. JSJoe De Sena40:33

       How, how did you find those things, though? How did you find those things? You stumbled upon it?

   28. JRJoe Rogan40:36

       I just got lucky.

   29. JSJoe De Sena40:37

       Right.

   30. JRJoe Rogan40:37

       Just got luck- martial arts, I just got lucky, and it clicked (snaps fingers) with me, like, almost immediately. I, I became obsessed, you know? And I, I wanted to be ... I wanted to excel at it, and so I was just doing it all day long. And it was kind of stunning from, for my family, 'cause they didn't even know I had that in me.
7. 48:30 – 1:02:45

   The anti-video-game boot camp: kids, phones, and engineered hardship

   1. JSJoe De Sena48:30

      I, I, I'd, I'd vomit if my... Let's go down this road. Can I read you-

   2. JRJoe Rogan48:34

      Sure.

   3. JSJoe De Sena48:34

      ... a text? You're gonna, you're gonna die with this one, okay? Um, I, a month ago, about a month ago, I said, "Listen, school's out. All the kids are playing video games. I'm gonna hold a camp on the farm," kinda like what I did with, with the guy that was heavy.I'm gonna invite, uh, friends and families kids 'cause nobody's gonna send me, uh, kids that don't know me. It's gonna be a fucking badass camp, 14 days of hell, no video games, no phones, and we are just gonna crush these kids and turn them into little soldiers.

   4. JRJoe Rogan49:05

      (laughs)

   5. JSJoe De Sena49:06

      So I get- (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan49:07

      How old are these kids you're talking about?

   7. JSJoe De Sena49:08

      I had my daught- my seven-year-old daughter all the way up to an 18-year-old, so I had f- I have four children, so seven to, to 18, uh, most of them 11 and 13.

   8. JRJoe Rogan49:19

      Now was this their idea or their parents' idea?

   9. JSJoe De Sena49:21

      So I get ... let me just ... I get the idea, and I reach out to a bunch of friends and family, and I said, "I wanna hold this camp, uh, call it from the end of June through mid-July. Uh, who's in? Who wants to send me their kids?"

   10. JRJoe Rogan49:35

       (laughs)

   11. JSJoe De Sena49:35

       And (laughs) -

   12. JRJoe Rogan49:36

       You're gonna keep the kids there?

   13. JSJoe De Sena49:37

       And I'm gonna keep the kids-

   14. JRJoe Rogan49:38

       Feed 'em, take care of 'em?

   15. JSJoe De Sena49:39

       ... on the farm. I'm gonna feed 'em. It's on me, but I'm gonna turn them into ... you know, it'll be fun. I'm, I'm embellishing a little bit when I use some of these words like fun. And um-

   16. JRJoe Rogan49:48

       (laughs)

   17. JSJoe De Sena49:49

       ... uh, um, really what I wanna do is, is turn them into warriors and get them off their friggin' phones. And selfishly, for me, selfishly, I want my kids to be ... like, it's hard to, for me to do this to my kids alone, but if there's another, uh, 16 kids around, 18 kids around, everybody gets sucked up in the vortex, like-

   18. JRJoe Rogan50:06

       Right.

   19. JSJoe De Sena50:06

       Right? So anyway, uh, first day, start ... unbekno- unbeknownst to me, we left their phones, uh, i- in their rooms. And unbeknownst to me, every night when they got done with their work, they would then get on the phones, of course they would, I just wasn't thinking about it, and start texting the parents, "Get me the fuck outta here."

   20. JRJoe Rogan50:25

       Ugh.

   21. JSJoe De Sena50:26

       "This guy's fucking nuts." Right? But I don't know that's happening. My wife's not there. I got our four children. I got 18 other kids. And the texts that are going back to the parents those first three days, I'm gonna read you one.

   22. JRJoe Rogan50:39

       Okay.

   23. JSJoe De Sena50:39

       But they're, but they're going nonstop, and it, they eventually get to my wife. She then immediately races to Vermont, like, "What are you doing? This is not even your business. Why are you doing this? Uh, people are gonna hate us. Uh, what if ... uh, we can't have ... we can't do this. We're, we're ..." So, um, I'm fighting with her. I'm fighting with the kids' parents because now, I'm, now I'm five days in, and I'm saying, "Listen, our four kids are gonna finish. The De Sena kids are gonna finish this."

   24. JRJoe Rogan51:04

       Well, what is ... y- you s- set up a schedule?

   25. JSJoe De Sena51:06

       So this guy ... I got an Olympic wrestler living with us, a guy named Andy Hrovat, who, uh, just happens to live with us, which is a, a story. I've got, um, a, a mountain warfare school veteran, uh, who's living ... who's there in Vermont. And I've got, uh, this woman we call the seed huntress, so she's more like my mom, bohemian, this and that. And those three people are gonna provide expertise along with my insanity of, all right, we're going up and down the mountain. We're carrying rocks. We're going in ice cold water. And we're gonna run it like buds basically, the kids ...

   26. JRJoe Rogan51:35

       Okay.

   27. JSJoe De Sena51:35

       ... the girls and the boys. Right? So at the end of it, I get texts from the parents that say, "Do you know ..." L- let me send you some of the texts I was receiving while, while you were there, Joe. So this is, this is the parent. "How's it going?" to his 15-year-old son. Kid responds, "Awful." Parent says, "Joe said you're doing great." Kid says, "This might be the worst experience of my entire life. It's literally like we're in the military." Parent's not taking the bait. Parent says, "There's gotta be something good about it." Kid says, "Literally nothing." Parent says, "Is it harder than a seven-minute Peloton ride?"

   28. JRJoe Rogan52:12

       (laughs)

   29. JSJoe De Sena52:13

       (laughs) 'Cause he, 'cause (laughs) 'cause he just won't take the fucking bait. Is that right?

   30. JRJoe Rogan52:18

       (laughs)
8. 1:02:45 – 1:16:20

   From Wall Street burnout to Vermont farm: animals, culture clash, and the deer fiasco

   1. JSJoe De Sena1:02:45

      So I, I got a hunting story.

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:02:47

      Okay.

   3. JSJoe De Sena1:02:48

      So, um, I'm not a farm boy at all but we... I meet my wife, like I said, 2000, uh, we buy the farm in Vermont.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:02:55

      Why did you decide to buy a farm in Vermont?

   5. JSJoe De Sena1:02:57

      You know, I... So-

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:02:58

      Where were you living at the time?

   7. JSJoe De Sena1:02:59

      So I... We'll go back. So I, I built the, the swimming pool business, turned into a little bit of a construction company. Somehow fight my way, graduate college and meet a guy at, at Cornell who, um, says, "What are you doing when you graduate?" I said, "I'm going back to the neighborhood." And he says, "Oh, you're a fucking idiot." He goes, "You gotta go to Wall Street." I don't know anything about Wall Street. I remember the '87 crash, I figured people don't make money there anymore. He says, "It's just like the neighborhood, only they do it with a pen instead of a gun. You gotta go, you gotta go to Wall Street." So he pushes me there and I, and I, um, I land on Wall Street. I get a job, I eventually build a business. I had a nice run and, um... But I... Just like you, I didn't wanna be at a desk all d-... I didn't like it. I didn't feel good. I started to gain weight. Um, the folks around me, we were making a lot of money but, uh, folks had psychological problems I couldn't fix. Like, "I can't believe John next to me got $50,000 more, you know, bonus than I did." We're making more money than we deserve. Are you fucking cra-... Like, are you kidding me? Right? Like, they had problems I couldn't fix. So I was dying to get out of there. I had a picture of a red barn on my desk. I just wanted to go to a farm.

   8. JRJoe Rogan1:04:05

      (laughs)

   9. JSJoe De Sena1:04:05

      I don't know why. I just wanted to leave. Sold the business, found a farm in Vermont, covered bridge, idyllic, the whole thing, and, uh, meet my wife and, and we buy this farm. And, um, got a tractor and just-

   10. JRJoe Rogan1:04:21

       How long you been doing this?

   11. JSJoe De Sena1:04:22

       So 2002, so 20 years ago, bought the farm and then, um-

   12. JRJoe Rogan1:04:27

       And you just decide Vermont? On what?

   13. JSJoe De Sena1:04:29

       I, you know-

   14. JRJoe Rogan1:04:30

       Vermont's gorgeous.

   15. JSJoe De Sena1:04:31

       I was on a f-... I didn't know anything. I knew Queens, um, my wife, the girl I met was from Boston. I, I didn't really... You know, you, if you're in Queens, you know Connecticut. I didn't really know Vermont. I'd skied in Vermont. You probably skied in Vermont. And, um-

   16. JRJoe Rogan1:04:44

       I never have.

   17. JSJoe De Sena1:04:45

       You never went? You never been?

   18. JRJoe Rogan1:04:46

       No, I did some gigs up there, though.

   19. JSJoe De Sena1:04:48

       Okay.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:04:48

       When I was doing standup. But it's beautiful. It's cold as fuck to go

   21. JSJoe De Sena1:04:51

       It's cold as fuck. And w- so we had gone on a, on a date, my wife and I, to a friend in Idaho. We went out to Idaho for, like, a snowshoeing thing. And on the way back, I saw this real estate magazine in the plane and it had, uh, homes and ranches in Jackson Hole, which you gotta be pretty wealthy to buy anything in Jack-... 20 million, 25, crazy numbers. There was one ad in that magazine that said, uh, "Farm house in Vermont, covered bridge, mountain, horses, 420 grand." I was like, "Wow, I gotta go to Vermont." (laughs)

   22. JRJoe Rogan1:05:25

       (laughs)

   23. JSJoe De Sena1:05:25

       She's in Boston, I'm in New York. It's a lot cheaper than fucking Jackson Hole, so-

   24. JRJoe Rogan1:05:30

       No one's up there too.

   25. JSJoe De Sena1:05:32

       No one's up there. So we bought the place and, uh, we settled in, sold the business in New York and, uh, started making kids. I bought some Scottish Highlander cows and, um, started to learn-

   26. JRJoe Rogan1:05:44

       So those are those weird hairy cows?

   27. JSJoe De Sena1:05:45

       The big hairy cows with the big horns, epic looking.

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:05:48

       Why'd you get those?

   29. JSJoe De Sena1:05:49

       They're beautiful. They're just gorgeous.

   30. JRJoe Rogan1:05:51

       Just for that reason?

Episode duration: 2:29:13