CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 1:10
Cold open: sobriety jokes, cigars, and jumping into the chaos
Joe and Joe List kick off with rapid-fire banter about sobriety, drugs, and whether List wants a drink or a cigar. The tone is immediately conversational and self-deprecating, setting up List’s nervous energy for the stories to come.
- •List reiterates he doesn’t drink; they riff on the “heroin” sobriety joke
- •Cigar talk and settling in (empty stomach jitters)
- •List frames himself as anxious/self-critical, priming the later topics
- 1:10 – 5:47
Downtown Austin scare: being confronted on the street near Sixth/Seventh
List recounts a tense late-night walk in downtown Austin near Sixth Street and a shelter area. He describes being verbally accosted, accused of racism for stepping off the sidewalk, and deciding to sprint away to avoid escalation.
- •Austin downtown described as crowded with unhoused people and volatile energy
- •List notices suspicious movement (bike loop) and steps into the street
- •Two men confront him, accuse him of following them, get in his face
- •List chooses to run; Creek security offer; he opts for Lyft next time
- 5:47 – 7:41
Real self-defense mindset: swallowing pride, running, and MMA training
Joe validates List’s decision to run and expands into practical self-defense philosophy. They connect it to martial arts culture: the goal is getting home safe, not “winning” a street fight.
- •Best avoidance strategy is leaving—running beats fighting
- •Martial arts instructors prioritize de-escalation and escape
- •List’s MMA training is framed as safety/skills, not violence
- •They discuss how intimidation is often the point of harassment
- 7:41 – 15:47
Jiu-jitsu ‘nerd assassins’ and why fighting strangers is a bad bet
The conversation shifts to how common MMA and jiu-jitsu training has become, making random fights far riskier than people assume. Joe explains why technical grapplers can look harmless while being extremely dangerous.
- •Example of a skilled female cop/bar fight video as a culture contrast
- •More people train now; appearances are misleading
- •Eddie Bravo’s “nerd assassins” concept and technique-as-game framing
- •Comics who train (e.g., Chris Gethard) and the allure of quiet competence
- 15:47 – 17:49
Strength weirdness: gymnastic rings, Cirque du Soleil, and Beatles ‘Love’
They detour into extraordinary body control—rings strength records and Cirque performers—and how humbling it is to watch. Joe recommends Cirque du Soleil’s Beatles-themed ‘Love’ as a standout live experience.
- •Rings strength/‘Iron Cross’ record and general grip endurance discussion
- •Cirque performers’ unreal strength and balance (headstands, one-arm holds)
- •Joe praises ‘Love’ as uniquely well-orchestrated with Beatles music
- •Comics’ instinct to be dismissive vs appreciating live spectacle
- 17:49 – 36:15
Michael Jackson theories: castrato idea, early recordings, and fame-induced weirdness
Joe lays out a speculative theory about Michael Jackson being chemically castrated to preserve his voice, connecting it to historical castrati singers and early audio recordings. They widen into how extreme fame can distort a person’s life and legacy debates about allegations.
- •Castrato history and example recording (Alessandro Moreschi)
- •Discussion of early audio recording timelines and artifacts
- •MJ’s body/voice compared to his brothers as ‘evidence’ for the theory
- •Fame, public narratives, and uncertainty around allegations
- 36:15 – 50:13
Language, identity, and Indigenous rights: terms, treaties, and resource rules
A discussion about terminology (e.g., “American Indian,” “Inuit,” “First Nation”) turns into hunting/fishing rights and the impact of colonization. Joe outlines historical trauma, reservation realities, and how resource-management systems clash with special legal allowances.
- •Regional differences in preferred Indigenous identifiers
- •Examples of differing wildlife/fishing regulations for First Nation people
- •Historical displacement, forced schooling, and cultural destruction
- •Ghost Dance origins as a response to existential threat
- 50:13 – 1:01:10
Osage murders and Scorsese talk: ‘Killers of the Flower Moon’ and film greatness
They pivot to the Osage murders story and the coming Scorsese adaptation, then zoom out to Scorsese’s filmography. The conversation becomes a broader celebration of classic cinema and what makes certain eras (especially the ’70s) endure.
- •Basic synopsis of Osage murders tied to oil wealth and systemic exploitation
- •Scorsese as a defining filmmaker; reaction to The Irishman and FX debates
- •’70s movies as gritty, lasting classics vs ’80s cheesiness
- •Rapid-fire references: Dog Day Afternoon, Taxi Driver, Godfather, Jaws, Alien
- 1:01:10 – 1:18:51
Norovirus, show business, and comedians’ grossest bonding rituals
List tells a severe sickness story (norovirus confusion) and how it intersected with gigs, including nearly opening for Louis CK while ill. The topic spirals into comedians sharing poop photos, diet disasters, and Joey Diaz/Ari Shaffir horror stories.
- •Norovirus realities and how contagious it is
- •‘Must do the show’ mentality vs not infecting others (Louie’s reaction)
- •Comedians sending each other poop pics; why civilians find it insane
- •Diet experiments (keto/peanut butter, carnivore diarrhea) and nicotine effects
- 1:18:51 – 1:24:10
COVID era comedy returns: venues reopening, vaccines, and supplement talk
They discuss standup returning in New York with dividers, mic swapping, and reduced capacity. List shares his Moderna experience; Joe emphasizes baseline health, vitamins, and the concept of ‘breakthrough’ infections and reporting.
- •Comedy Cellar reopening logistics and how it affects momentum
- •List’s vaccine side effects timeline and recovery
- •Breakthrough cases and what counts in official statistics
- •Joe’s supplement/vitamin pitch: vitamin D, general health ‘insurance policy’
- 1:24:10 – 1:47:35
Escaping the nursing home: Morse code door crack and autonomy questions
A news story about an elderly couple escaping a memory-care unit after deciphering the keypad sparks a debate about competence and freedom. They connect it to broader anxieties about aging, dementia, and exploitation in elder care.
- •Tennessee escape: listening to keypad tones and using Morse code experience
- •Joe questions the logic of confinement when someone shows high competence
- •Facility being fined and whether that’s fair or performative
- •Related elder-care media: The Father, I Care A Lot (and audience backlash)
- 1:47:35 – 2:17:15
Wrestling and fighting damage: botches, concussions, and pain tolerance
They explore pro wrestling’s physical toll, viral ‘botch’ clips, and how repeated head trauma changes susceptibility to knockouts. Joe compares it to MMA examples and shares his own experiences with getting rocked in kickboxing.
- •Behind-the-scenes fascination with wrestling’s road grind and injuries
- •Concussions: why KOs can happen ‘too easily’ after prior damage
- •Examples from MMA fights and the mechanics of clean KOs/spinning elbows
- •Joe’s personal story of legs shutting off after a perfect hook (TKO)
- 2:17:15 – 2:47:52
Comedy craft and lineage: Boston scene, bombing lessons, and ‘kill’ culture
They dig into comedy development: how Boston’s hard rooms shaped a punchline-heavy ethic, why bombing can be transformative, and how following killers requires resetting the room’s energy. Joe and List share old-scene names, road-gig realities, and the grind of improvement.
- •Boston’s expectation to ‘kill’ and how that influences style and pacing
- •Following strong acts: bring the room down to your frequency, then build
- •Joe’s formative Breuer bomb story and how fear undermines performance
- •Old-school logistics: MapQuest/legal pad directions, VFW/firehouse gigs, local legends
- 2:47:52 – 2:49:29
What comedy is now: specials vs albums, social media anger, and tribe mindset
The closing stretch becomes a meta conversation about comedy’s place in culture: why live matters, why social media distorts perception, and how podcasts changed comedians’ independence and collaboration. They end by plugging List’s projects and his YouTube special.
- •Why specials can’t capture the best version; albums vs filmed specials
- •Social media amplifying anger; Twitter as a loud minority and comic infighting
- •Podcasts creating independence and a more cooperative ‘comedy tribe’
- •Plugs: Tuesdays with Stories, Mindful Metal Jacket, and ‘I Hate Myself’ on YouTube
