CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 1:10
Cheers, catching up, and the sudden ‘cancel culture from the right’
Joe welcomes Evan with whiskey and coffee and quickly pivots into why he wanted Evan on the show: to address the online dogpile against Black Rifle Coffee. They frame the situation as a surprising mirror of left-leaning cancel culture tactics—coming from conservative circles.
- •Light opening and rapport (drinks, cigars, Austin shout-out)
- •Joe’s reaction to seeing conservatives attack Evan/BRCC
- •Framing the backlash as a ‘weird dog pile’ and cultural moment
- 1:10 – 2:19
How misinformation snowballs: mistrust, rage, and looking for a bogeyman
Evan describes the broader conditions that make smear campaigns easy: mistrust in government and mainstream media, pandemic stress, and conspiratorial thinking. The discussion sets up how a narrative can form without people checking facts.
- •Erosion of trust in institutions and media
- •Pandemic-era anger and polarization
- •Conservatives hunting for ‘conspiracy inside the party’
- •Living through misinformation targeted at you personally
- 2:19 – 6:31
The New York Times profile: agreeing to the interview—and what got left out
Evan recounts how The New York Times approached them, his initial refusal, and why he ultimately agreed to participate. He explains what he hoped would be included—veteran programs and adaptive athlete events—and why the finished piece felt incomplete or skewed by editorial framing.
- •Decision calculus: refuse vs participate for transparency
- •Inviting NYT to meet wounded vets and employees
- •Key veteran-focused stories minimized in final edit
- •Editors and institutional ‘tone’ shaping coverage
- 6:31 – 9:47
‘Lucky’ vs relentless work: building BRCC under extreme pressure
Joe challenges the idea that BRCC’s success was “luck,” and Evan details the grind behind the company’s growth. Evan describes sleeping under his desk, reinvesting everything, selling assets, and carrying heavy family stress while trying to scale the business.
- •Rejecting the ‘got lucky’ narrative
- •Startup hardship: minimal sleep, health warnings
- •Selling possessions and running on credit cards
- •Distinction between capital reinvestment vs personal wealth
- 9:47 – 15:04
Philanthropy and responsibility to veterans: why BRCC exists beyond profit
Evan emphasizes his ethical responsibility to veterans and explains how the business funds giving back. He frames himself as a “capitalistic philanthropist,” focusing resources on veteran employment and support rather than personal enrichment.
- •Hiring veterans at scale and centering post‑9/11 community
- •Giving back early even when cash-strapped
- •Using ‘earned media’ to highlight veteran issues
- •Company mission vs outsider perceptions
- 15:04 – 19:57
Rittenhouse controversy: correcting the record gets spun into betrayal
They unpack how BRCC became entangled in the Kyle Rittenhouse storyline and how a factual clarification (“we didn’t sponsor him”) was reframed online as disavowal. Evan explains why nuance dies on social media and why attempts to clarify can worsen the pile-on.
- •NPR/mainstream claims of BRCC sponsorship
- •Evan’s stance: not profiting from the event; just correcting facts
- •How bloggers/influencers reframed it as ‘hating customers’
- •Limits of Twitter: no room for nuance or context
- 19:57 – 27:52
Fighting racism while being mislabeled: Afghan commando employees and ‘who we really are’
Evan explains the quote about not wanting racists/antisemites as customers and how it was misapplied to all customers. Joe and Evan highlight BRCC’s real-world actions, including helping Afghan allies resettle and employing them—stories Evan says major media missed.
- •Clarifying: rejecting racists/antisemites, not the customer base
- •Wali Taslim story: Afghan commando, refuge, relocation, employment
- •Helping with housing, jobs, legal help, English tutoring, citizenship
- •Media missing human stories in favor of culture-war framing
- 27:52 – 36:34
Why social media breaks humans: clip culture, anger, fear, and isolation
Joe and Evan broaden into how social platforms distort reality through selective clips and outrage incentives. They argue that pandemic isolation amplified online anger, replacing real connection with performative hostility.
- •Example of misleading police clip spreading outrage
- •Context-free communication and ‘headline thinking’
- •Default emotion online: anger as easy connection
- •Pandemic-driven isolation and dependence on screens
- 36:34 – 49:15
Pandemic politics: vaccine passports, ‘rules for thee,’ and distrust in institutions
They critique political performativity around COVID rules and discuss vaccine passports as a lasting power expansion. Joe raises concerns about transmission, breakthrough cases, and the lack of emphasis on general health; Evan frames it as politicization and virtue signaling.
- •Vaccine passport concerns and permanence of expanded power
- •Hypocrisy examples (mask-for-photo behavior, elite events)
- •Breakthrough cases and how risk gets communicated
- •Missing public messaging on fitness/obesity and immune health
- 49:15 – 1:18:29
Liberty, skepticism, and history: reservations ‘for your protection’ as a warning signal
Evan connects skepticism of authority to historical narratives, including Native Americans being moved “for protection.” They argue a healthy society questions power and resists simplified party-line messaging.
- •Preservation of individual liberty as a core value
- •Nez Perce/Chief Joseph history and ‘protection’ rhetoric
- •Skepticism as a sign of a healthy society
- •Conflicting guidance from CDC/politicians fueling confusion
- 1:18:29 – 1:32:39
Political homelessness and the two-party trap: Tulsi, debates, and breaking the lock
Joe describes being socially liberal but pro-guns/military—politically homeless—and Evan agrees many people feel similarly. They discuss structural barriers that keep third-party or outsider candidates out, and why Tulsi Gabbard resonated across lines.
- •Joe’s mixed ideology: welfare safety nets + guns/discipline
- •Tribalism and purity tests pushing people to the middle
- •How debate rules and party machinery lock out challengers
- •Tulsi Gabbard as cross-appeal example; Hillary ‘Russian asset’ smear
- 1:32:39 – 1:55:15
Guns, preparedness, and why opinions shifted during the pandemic
They talk about liberal neighbors and friends warming to firearms and redundancy after social unrest and COVID uncertainty. The conversation covers the logic behind AR ownership, self-defense realities, and the cultural demonization of certain weapons.
- •Neighbors asking about generators, solar, and firearms
- •Pandemic-era gun store lines and changing attitudes
- •Debunking ‘why do you need so many bullets’ framing
- •ARs as familiar tools, protection, recreation, and a freedom symbol
- 1:55:15 – 2:17:51
Veteran mindset, real violence, and Evan’s war stories: perspective on ‘toughness’
Joe and Evan argue many modern activists talk about violence without understanding it, and that escalation would be catastrophic. Evan shares a vivid story from the Philippines—fan boats, searching for terrorist cells, karaoke nights—illustrating the surreal intensity of his past work.
- •Critique of performative ‘tough’ posturing (Antifa, civil war talk)
- •Veterans as a reality check on what conflict looks like
- •Philippines story: show of force, searching for Abu Sayyaf, karaoke
- •Freedom enabling even ridiculous expression—and the responsibility it entails
- 2:17:51 – 3:07:22
Comedy detour: great comedians, club etiquette, and balancing fame with family
The conversation pivots into comedy: Joe’s top comedians, the nature of ‘wild’ comedy, and how drop-ins work at clubs. They end on the importance of family time, Joe’s kids reacting to recognition, and how upbringing shapes parenting.
- •Joe’s picks: Chappelle, Louis C.K., Burr; all-time mentions (Pryor, Kinison, Hicks)
- •Clean vs edgy comedy (Hedberg, Gaffigan, Regan)
- •Club dynamics: bumping sets, respect, why Joe calls ahead
- •Fame through a child’s eyes and the importance of being present as a dad
