Joe Rogan Experience #1995 - Chad Stahelski

1. 0:00 – 2:39

   Smelling salts cold open and celebrating John Wick’s absurd scale

   1. JRJoe Rogan0:00

      (drum roll) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. NANarrator0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. NANarrator0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (rock music) Get out. Chad, just get ... take ... oh.

   4. CSChad Stahelski0:16

      Is that how we're gonna start the show?

   5. JRJoe Rogan0:17

      Take a hit of that. Take a hit of that. We'll start the show. Just get in there.

   6. CSChad Stahelski0:20

      Oh, geez.

   7. JRJoe Rogan0:22

      (laughs)

   8. CSChad Stahelski0:22

      (laughs)

   9. JRJoe Rogan0:22

      And that's, that's not even a fresh one.

   10. CSChad Stahelski0:25

       Okay.

   11. JRJoe Rogan0:26

       When they're fresh, they's a little-

   12. CSChad Stahelski0:26

       I just wanted to do it twice to make sure that was real.

   13. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       Shout out to, uh, how do you say his name? Pre- Jujimufu?

   14. CSChad Stahelski0:31

       Jujimufu.

   15. JRJoe Rogan0:31

       Jujimufu for his-

   16. CSChad Stahelski0:33

       Ugh.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:33

       ... smelling salts.

   18. CSChad Stahelski0:34

       Because it was fresh. He couldn't do that twice.

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:35

       Do it, it's fresh. If it's fresh, you get, like, that close. And you're just like ...

   20. CSChad Stahelski0:40

       Yeah, no, I'm awake.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:41

       That was a good one, though. Whoo!

   22. CSChad Stahelski0:42

       Definitely awake.

   23. JRJoe Rogan0:43

       I'm gonna bring these to the comedy mothership.

   24. NANarrator0:45

       All right.

   25. JRJoe Rogan0:45

       I'm gonna see. I'm gonna see.

   26. CSChad Stahelski0:47

       (laughs)

   27. JRJoe Rogan0:47

       I'm gonna, I'm gonna take a big blast right before I go on stage. It's supposed to wake up your central nervous system or something.

   28. CSChad Stahelski0:53

       Yeah, it sucks.

   29. JRJoe Rogan0:53

       I don't even know if there's any science to it.

   30. CSChad Stahelski0:55

       No, it just sucks.
2. 2:39 – 6:43

   From stunt performer to The Matrix: the audition that changed everything

   1. JRJoe Rogan2:39

      So, you started off as a stuntman.

   2. CSChad Stahelski2:43

      Yeah.

   3. JRJoe Rogan2:43

      And how did you, how did you transition to becoming a director? Because that's like ... There's gotta be a lot of barriers that are in the way.

   4. CSChad Stahelski2:51

      I think different time, for sure. You know, before, before cellphones, before all that stuff, we started as a stunt guy, before all the streamers. Um, you know, I was working for this guy Ernie Orsatti way back in the day, a brilliant stunt coordinator, second unit director on television. And I was working on, I don't know if you remember, the old show, like, Pretender with Michael T. Weiss-

   5. JRJoe Rogan3:10

      Mm-hmm, yeah. Sure, yeah.

   6. CSChad Stahelski3:10

      ... and stuff. He could be anything, that kinda thing.

   7. JRJoe Rogan3:11

      Yeah.

   8. CSChad Stahelski3:12

      And, uh, I was doing a gig on that. I'd just done a car hit. I think I was only, like, 24. I split my head open on the windshield. (laughs) I was a mess. And then, uh, he comes to me as I'm holding the ice pack on my head. He's like, "Hey, they're having auditions for this sci-fi film in Burbank." He's like, "You know, you're off. You can, if you hurry, you could make it." And I'm in jeans and a T-shirt and I'm bleeding and I'm like, "All right. Yeah, sure, I'll go make ..." "It's for that Keanu Reeves guy." You know, Speed had come out. (laughs) I'm like, "Keanu Reeves? I'll go see him, sure." So, we go up there, and it was an audition for The Matrix. And, you know, I ... At the time, you remember, back in the day, there weren't a lot of martial art movies at a, at a big budget level. It was, like, Steven Seagal or Van Damme or, uh, you know, uh, Mark Dacascos, all those guys at the time. And martial arts, you know, they didn't do them in big budget films. It was considered low budget, you know, action porn kinda thing. And, uh, we get there, get to this big warehouse in Burbank, and you saw this guy, really scruffy looking with a neck brace, you know, punching. It's Keanu. He had just come out from neck surgery.

   9. JRJoe Rogan4:08

      Oh, Jesus.

   10. CSChad Stahelski4:09

       And there's, like, 15 Hong Kong and Chinese stuntmen there, ah, screaming and yelling. I said, "Hey, I'm here for the audition." And I meet these, uh, these two fellas that come over. It's the Wachowskis at the time, uh, now Lana and Lily. And they introduce themselves and we're like, "Hey, you know, I'm Chad. I'm here for the ..." "Okay, great. This is Yuen Woo-ping." And I was like, "Oh." You, no one could told us. And Yuen Woo-ping we knew from, was the big choreographer that started Jet Li and Jackie Chan.

   11. JRJoe Rogan4:33

       Oh.

   12. CSChad Stahelski4:34

       Did, like, Iron Monkey.

   13. JRJoe Rogan4:36

       Oh, wow.

   14. CSChad Stahelski4:37

       You know, Once Upon a Time in China and all that stuff.

   15. JRJoe Rogan4:38

       Hmm.

   16. CSChad Stahelski4:39

       So it was Yuen Woo-ping and his guys. And they're like, "Okay, you just, you just follow this guy." And this little guy named Tiger Chen. Tiger Chen. (laughs) Fucking phenomenal. The guy could do triple flips, twists, this ... Could do anything. A Wushu champion. They ... "Just follow that guy. Just do what he does."

   17. JRJoe Rogan4:54

       Oh, God.

   18. CSChad Stahelski4:54

       And for the next hour, I tried, you know, being the tall white guy, trying to just keep up with him. Um-

   19. JRJoe Rogan4:59

       Can you do all that stuff?

   20. CSChad Stahelski5:00

       God, no. God ... (laughs)

   21. JRJoe Rogan5:01

       (laughs)

   22. CSChad Stahelski5:01

       I just did as much as I could till I fell down. But I, I was pretty flexible. I had a good gymnastic background, so I'd throw a back flip, I'd do the kicks, I'd do all the spin hook kicks. And, you know, we'd train with a lot of taekwondo guys and stuff, so we were pretty good at all the kicking and punching and some of the acrobatics. But then it got to a level, he picks up a stick, and now it's ... You know, you've seen the Wushu guys.

   23. JRJoe Rogan5:18

       Yeah.

   24. CSChad Stahelski5:19

       They're going mental. And I'm like, "Oh, boy." You know, at the end of an hour, you know, I'm in jeans and a T-shirt still bleeding from a head wound. (laughs)

   25. JRJoe Rogan5:25

       Oh, Jesus. Did you have a concussion?

   26. CSChad Stahelski5:27

       I ... Probably, yeah.

   27. JRJoe Rogan5:28

       (laughs)

   28. CSChad Stahelski5:29

       I think so. Knowing now, looking back, like, yeah, that didn't seem too good. Um, but I finished, drove home, thought, "Wow, I really screwed the pooch on that one." And I never thought I'd hear from those guys again. And then, like, a month later, I get a call, "Hey, can you come back?" And exact same audition again, exact same.

   29. JRJoe Rogan5:44

       Wow.

   30. CSChad Stahelski5:44

       And then, uh, got the call saying, "Hey, would you like to double Keanu Reeves on this sci-fi movie in Australia?" And I was like, "Ah, uh, I got this other gig on TV. I think I'm gonna have to pass." (laughs) And the producer at the time was Barrie Osborne, who went on to do all the, all The Lord of the Rings. And he's like, "Ah!" He's kinda a little angry (laughs) at me for saying no. And, uh, I thought, "Okay, if I fuck that up, I'll never work again."And then-
3. 6:43 – 9:16

   Second-unit directing and the leap to John Wick: from 'Scorn' to a mythic universe

   1. CSChad Stahelski6:43

      You know, that's where I got to know Keanu and all that. Cut to years later, after all that, um, Keanu and I had worked together for so long there, he, he knew I'd been doing a lot of second unit directing, which for people that don't know, it's the action or the, the fight scenes, the car chases, the sunsets, all the shit (laughs) first unit doesn't wanna deal with. Um, usually big action sequences, so they have these action directors or second unit guys go out and do the units, trying to do it more efficiently without, uh, without the cast, with the stunt doubles and such. And, um, Keanu had gotten this script that he thought was something interesting about it. It was called Scorn, and it was the original, uh, John Wick script, where-

   2. JRJoe Rogan7:18

      How did it become called John Wick?

   3. CSChad Stahelski7:20

      Uh, Derek Kolstad's grandfather's name is John Wick.

   4. JRJoe Rogan7:23

      Oh.

   5. CSChad Stahelski7:23

      Derek Kolstad being the writer of it, and so he just gave tribute to his grandfather calling him Wick, John Wick. (laughs)

   6. JRJoe Rogan7:28

      Oh, wow.

   7. CSChad Stahelski7:29

      Pretty trippy, yeah.

   8. JRJoe Rogan7:30

      And so, and how did that become the name of the movie?

   9. CSChad Stahelski7:34

      Um, Keanu at the... The original script, Scorn, the guy was like 65. He lived in a little brownstone.

   10. JRJoe Rogan7:39

       Oh.

   11. CSChad Stahelski7:39

       It was very, very grounded script. I think only two people died in the original script, and it was like one in a car crash.

   12. JRJoe Rogan7:43

       That's hilarious. (laughs)

   13. CSChad Stahelski7:44

       Yeah, it was just very c- it was kind of, it was very Cold War, old school. And that's where the gold coins came from because you didn't wanna leave a paper trail. It had very simple little ideas.

   14. JRJoe Rogan7:54

       Oh, wow.

   15. CSChad Stahelski7:55

       And he handed it to, to myself and was like, "Hey, would you like to take a look at this?" And I was like, "Sure, sure, sure." I read it and I was like, "Uh, yeah, I don't know what to do with this action-wise. He only kills two people." He's like, "Well, we're trying to change it, and we're thinking of this." I'm like, "Well, I..." you know. He's like, "Would you like to direct it?" And I was like-

   16. JRJoe Rogan8:09

       Whoa.

   17. CSChad Stahelski8:10

       ... "Oh, yes, as a matter of fact." (laughs) I have some thoughts-

   18. JRJoe Rogan8:12

       So you had no experience directing, and then you directed John Wick?

   19. CSChad Stahelski8:15

       Just second... Yeah, just second unit, yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan8:17

       Dude.

   21. CSChad Stahelski8:17

       Me and my, uh, partner at time, Dave Leitch, I called Dave... That was on a Friday. I called Dave on a Saturday going, "Hey, we might have a shot. We gotta put a pitch together in 24 hours." So I always had this idea about Greek mythology and how we could layer it and do this like... I'm a big Tolkien fan, so how do you take a, a fantasy gig and make it-

   22. JRJoe Rogan8:33

       Right.

   23. CSChad Stahelski8:33

       ... modern day? So we're like, "Let's take it that way, and we'll put gods and Greeks and Charon and the River Styx, and we'll make this whole Zeus thing going on." And we kind of layered it, and Keanu just heard it on Monday and went, "Hmm. Interesting." (laughs)

   24. JRJoe Rogan8:48

       (laughs)

   25. CSChad Stahelski8:48

       And he said, "Sure, you wanna do it?" I'm like, "Yeah, you know, me and my partner Dave will, we'll co-direct. We'll, we'll, we'll do this," and we brought it to the, uh, producer, Basil Iwanyk, the next day. And he goes, "Well, if Keanu wants you, sure." We, we had done a little tape on that Sunday about, uh, you know, the gun fu stuff. We took aikido, aikijutsu, put in all the close-quarter tactical shit with some reloads, and we did a quick little pre-vis in our, in our space, 8711, back in LA, and showed it to him. Everybody thought, "Oh my God, this is gonna be, you know, great. Can Keanu do it?" We're like, "Yeah, I hope so." (laughs) Like-

4. 9:16 – 13:28

   Keanu’s training, tactical gun handling, and the origin of the reload flip

   1. JRJoe Rogan9:16

      Where did the magazine reload flip come from?

   2. CSChad Stahelski9:19

      That... Funny thing that... I'm gonna give total cred to Keanu.

   3. JRJoe Rogan9:23

      Wow.

   4. CSChad Stahelski9:23

      100%. He started doing that in the second one. We're like, I'm like, "Dude, what are you doing?" He's like, "I gotta check it. Wow, fuck." (laughs) He started doing it. I was like, "That's awesome. Gotta keep doing it."

   5. JRJoe Rogan9:31

      It is awesome. People do that now.

   6. CSChad Stahelski9:33

      And then he'd just single hand check. Yeah, it's a r- it's a legit thing.

   7. JRJoe Rogan9:35

      Yeah.

   8. CSChad Stahelski9:35

      They're doing a competition

   9. NANarrator9:36

      I thought was pretty funny.

   10. JRJoe Rogan9:36

       You know how crazy that is? That an actor for a film decides to come up with a thing, and it's actually a quicker way to eject a magazine.

   11. CSChad Stahelski9:45

       He, he did, can do... He can do forehand and backhand.

   12. JRJoe Rogan9:47

       (clicks tongue) Wow.

   13. CSChad Stahelski9:47

       He does some trippy thing... He does it with the AR too. Like, you'll watch in the second one, he'll do a quick flip with the AR, and he'll put it on there. You're like, "Where the fuck did he get that?" (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan9:54

       Well, he really, really trained for that movie.

   15. CSChad Stahelski9:57

       That's him.

   16. JRJoe Rogan9:58

       I mean, you can really tell. I mean, it's... There's films where guys do tactical scenes where you go like, "Okay, you know, I can buy it."

   17. CSChad Stahelski10:05

       Right.

   18. JRJoe Rogan10:06

       But, but in that movie-

   19. CSChad Stahelski10:07

       The, the, the typical military way of cutting through-

   20. JRJoe Rogan10:09

       Mm-hmm.

   21. CSChad Stahelski10:09

       ... you know, pieing the, the corners and going on stuff.

   22. JRJoe Rogan10:11

       Yeah.

   23. CSChad Stahelski10:11

       The very tactical sense. I think you're right. I, I, I see that. It just... It's like with martial arts. You can do the quick finger jab in the eye, right?

   24. JRJoe Rogan10:18

       Right.

   25. CSChad Stahelski10:18

       Some... Once in a while, that staccato beat is cool, but choreography, and for the, the visual of it, I think sometimes you have to add something. You have to show people something they kind of expect, subvert it, and give them something a little bit different. You know?

   26. JRJoe Rogan10:31

       Yes.

   27. CSChad Stahelski10:31

       Spice it up a little bit. So I think we went more with the competition sense. You know, I, I saw Taron online. You know, JJ Perry, a buddy of mine, introduced me to Taron online, and I saw Taron, and I saw some of the quick... I was like, "Fuck, that's what we're... We gotta put a little spice in this."

   28. JRJoe Rogan10:43

       Yeah.

   29. CSChad Stahelski10:44

       And then sent Keanu out there, and he-

   30. JRJoe Rogan10:45

       Taron is such a freak.
5. 13:28 – 17:29

   Martial arts evolution, stance switching, and Chad’s training background

   1. JRJoe Rogan13:28

      Yeah, I think that's one of the reasons why left-handed people are so good at things.

   2. CSChad Stahelski13:31

      I... What'd they say, like, you know, back in the day, you know, in gladiatorial or whatever, like, they're left-handed 'cause it was hard... It wasn't so much that they were better, they just... You weren't used to, to, to fighting with them.

   3. JRJoe Rogan13:40

      Well, I think, also... Well, there's definitely that, like when you spar with people, especially in boxing.

   4. CSChad Stahelski13:45

      Yeah, when they go southpaw.

   5. JRJoe Rogan13:46

      When you spar southpaws, it's so confusing. I remem-

   6. CSChad Stahelski13:48

      Well, it fucks up your footwork-

   7. JRJoe Rogan13:49

      Yeah.

   8. CSChad Stahelski13:49

      ... 'cause you don't wanna keep stepping on their foot.

   9. JRJoe Rogan13:51

      Exactly. Yeah.

   10. CSChad Stahelski13:52

       Kickboxing, maybe, is a little bit different. Yeah.

   11. JRJoe Rogan13:53

       Well, kickboxing, you're... Well, MMA in particular, like the elite guys like Sandhagen, these guys, they, they switch stances constantly.

   12. CSChad Stahelski14:01

       Yeah, constantly.

   13. JRJoe Rogan14:01

       And so there's this... You're getting overloaded with possibilities all the time.

   14. CSChad Stahelski14:06

       Right.

   15. JRJoe Rogan14:06

       Which makes it so interesting.

   16. CSChad Stahelski14:08

       Yeah.

   17. JRJoe Rogan14:08

       When you get to these high-level guys, you know, when you get to, like, an Israel Adesanya guy, they, they give you so many looks. You don't know what the fuck is going on.

   18. CSChad Stahelski14:16

       They, they're changing that stance all the time. It's very-

   19. JRJoe Rogan14:18

       Yeah, and feinting all the time and-

   20. CSChad Stahelski14:20

       I- it's very interesting. I came up... I did a lot of Boxe Francaise, like Savate, which is very open stance-y, like, they'd mo-... It's constant motion, if you watch those old Savate guys, right? They're constantly moving. So they, they would fol- from almost a false lead, and you see so much of that now in MMA.

   21. JRJoe Rogan14:32

       Mm, yes.

   22. CSChad Stahelski14:32

       It's false leads, they're switched so you don't... It's hard to gauge or set them up.

   23. JRJoe Rogan14:36

       Yes.

   24. CSChad Stahelski14:36

       It's fascinating to watch now. I think athletes today, especially in martial arts, are like, just... Right? Whole nother level.

   25. JRJoe Rogan14:42

       Whole nother level.

   26. CSChad Stahelski14:43

       Whole nother. You can't even compete with what-

   27. JRJoe Rogan14:44

       They're the best of the best.

   28. CSChad Stahelski14:45

       Oh my God.

   29. JRJoe Rogan14:45

       It's like, they're... No one's ever been better.

   30. CSChad Stahelski14:47

       No.
6. 17:29 – 28:40

   Designing John Wick’s “fairy tale”: Baba Yaga, neon noir, and audience cues

   1. JRJoe Rogan17:29

      This scene... What... Who was the Russian gentleman, the, the guy who plays the father? He has-

   2. CSChad Stahelski17:33

      Yeah, Michael Nyqvist.

   3. JRJoe Rogan17:34

      Yeah. That guy was so good.

   4. CSChad Stahelski17:35

      So good. He was in, uh, the original Girl with Dragon Tattoo, and I think he did-

   5. JRJoe Rogan17:38

      Yes.

   6. CSChad Stahelski17:39

      ... the, the third Mission: Impossible, I think he was the bad guy in.

   7. JRJoe Rogan17:42

      He died recently, right?

   8. CSChad Stahelski17:43

      Yeah, he died a couple years ago. Um, I think he... I don't know if it was a heart attack or stroke, but he died. He still has a nice, uh, uh, charity thing that they do every year for him.

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:50

      God, that guy was so good.

   10. CSChad Stahelski17:51

       Fantastic guy, fantastic guy.

   11. JRJoe Rogan17:53

       That fucking scene.

   12. CSChad Stahelski17:54

       Swedish actor.

   13. JRJoe Rogan17:55

       The scene when he's explaining to his son, who's also awesome, the guy who was in Game of Thrones.

   14. CSChad Stahelski17:59

       Yeah.

   15. JRJoe Rogan17:59

       What is his name?

   16. CSChad Stahelski17:59

       Alfie, Alfie Allen.

   17. JRJoe Rogan18:01

       Alf- That guy's incredible.

   18. CSChad Stahelski18:02

       So good.

   19. JRJoe Rogan18:02

       He's-

   20. CSChad Stahelski18:02

       We, we cast a lot of Game of Thrones.

   21. JRJoe Rogan18:04

       Oh my God.

   22. CSChad Stahelski18:04

       I love, I used to love Game of Thrones.

   23. JRJoe Rogan18:05

       He's so good.

   24. CSChad Stahelski18:06

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan18:07

       He's such... He plays such a good fuckhead.

   26. CSChad Stahelski18:09

       Oh my God, he's such a good prick, but like-

   27. JRJoe Rogan18:10

       Yeah.

   28. CSChad Stahelski18:11

       ... in, in life, it's so funny. He is the shyest, quietest, super nice, like, hardest worker, just never left set, always there ready to do his thing, the sweetest kid ever.

   29. JRJoe Rogan18:20

       Yeah, well, I can believe it.

   30. CSChad Stahelski18:22

       And he just played... He's so good in the role.
7. 28:40 – 34:26

   How the first film almost didn’t happen: rejected pitches, indie release, and breakout

   1. JRJoe Rogan28:40

      Did you ever- Any idea it would be so huge, though?

   2. CSChad Stahelski28:42

      No, I swear-

   3. JRJoe Rogan28:42

      When it was done, though, you had to know you nailed it.

   4. CSChad Stahelski28:44

      No, we got, we got weird comments back. We got like too many head shots, cut out all the head shots. We got i- you can't kill the kid, Alfie Allen, and you can't kill the puppy. Somebody's gotta live. The, you know ... We were independent, so everyone was scared that we weren't gonna get picked up. 'Cause we had been ... We went ... When we shopped it, we went to, I think, four or five studios, and we didn't, we didn't even finish the pitch. They're like, "Nah, we're cool. Thank you."

   5. JRJoe Rogan29:06

      Really?

   6. CSChad Stahelski29:07

      Yeah, we didn't, we didn't get bought, so we made the thing independently with Thunder Road, with Baz Launic and Erica Lee. Um, and it wasn't till we came out here, actually, to Fantastic Fest, like no one was buying the movie, so Baz said this great ... "Let's go. We'll show it at Fantastic Fest, see if anybody will clap." So me, Dave, and Keanu sneak in real low-key. We're gonna do a little surprise thing at that, and Keanu will do his little, you know, wave to the crowd. And the crowd goes fucking mental, like mental. And like the first family and friends we had, everyone got was really quiet afterwards. (laughs) Like, no applause, it was just really quiet. (laughs)

   7. JRJoe Rogan29:40

      Really?

   8. CSChad Stahelski29:40

      Yeah.

   9. JRJoe Rogan29:41

      Why?

   10. CSChad Stahelski29:41

       And then-

   11. JRJoe Rogan29:41

       What do you think that is?

   12. CSChad Stahelski29:42

       I- I just think at the time, you know, we're, we're in the fast cut shaky cam, and it was, you know, the, the, the just ... It was so ludicrous that he's gonna kill 68 or 86 people over a puppy, and no one got that-

   13. JRJoe Rogan29:54

       (laughs)

   14. CSChad Stahelski29:54

       ... who was ... I know, it was fucking ... And I mean, th- you gotta remember, this is how we pitch it.

   15. JRJoe Rogan29:57

       Right.

   16. CSChad Stahelski29:58

       So like we'll go to a studio and go, "Okay, so we got this g- we got Keanu Reeves, right? I know we're a first-time stunt guys, but it's a, it's an action movie, right?" And they say, "Okay." And, uh, but, "And we're g- he's gonna shoot all this stuff. And so his wife dies of natural causes." Like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah. The bad guys don't kill her." Like, "No, no, no, no." "But they kill his puppy." I'm like, "Yeah." "And he kills all the people because of the puppy, but not the ... What?" Like, they're like, "Well, what happens next?" I'm like, "No, that's it. The next 45 minutes are like just, you know, rampage." And yeah, yeah, no, we didn't, we didn't sell it very, very much. (laughs)

   17. JRJoe Rogan30:28

       (laughs)

   18. CSChad Stahelski30:28

       So-

   19. JRJoe Rogan30:28

       But they must be kicking themselves now.

   20. CSChad Stahelski30:30

       Yeah, well, uh, Lionsgate bought us internationally, and then they sold us to domestic. And, um, since then, you know, we've gone through a couple regime changes at Lionsgate, but now, like, the last one was really cool. Like, everyone's on board, like Joe Drake, Nathan Cahane, Matt Leonetti, um, you know, um, Adam Fogelson. Everybody that's part of the regime, they really pushed this last one. They, they knew John Wick was cool, they loved the third one, and they got on board. But for the first, first round, it w- we had ... Once we sold it, the movie came out. Before it even came out, there was like this lag. They bought it, and then there's like six months before we hit theaters. I think Dave went off and did Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles 9 or whatever it was. I went off and did like The Grimsby Brothers, or Brothers Grimsby, Sacha Baron Cohen movie, second unit down in South Africa for like five months because I was broke. Um, it was pretty funny. Yeah, we, we thought we'd never direct again, so we were like, "We better go find some stunt jobs." (laughs)

   21. JRJoe Rogan31:19

       (laughs)

   22. CSChad Stahelski31:20

       And then it worked out. And then, um, like, uh, not even a month after it had opened, Keanu called up and he go, "Hey, uh, they called me about doing number two, but I'll only do it with, with you guys. You in?" And I was like, "Are you kidding? Yes. Uh, fuck, we're in. Whatever it takes."

   23. JRJoe Rogan31:34

       Wow.

   24. CSChad Stahelski31:35

       Yeah. It was-

   25. JRJoe Rogan31:35

       That's awesome.

   26. CSChad Stahelski31:35

       ... completely nutty, man.

   27. JRJoe Rogan31:37

       Yeah. And number two just picks up right where number one left off.

   28. CSChad Stahelski31:40

       Yeah. And we just were like, "Okay."

   29. JRJoe Rogan31:41

       And right off the jump, like, opening scene.

   30. CSChad Stahelski31:43

       Yeah. We had no idea what to do.
8. 34:26 – 1:06:12

   Action filmmaking mechanics: choreography as dance, long takes, and safe gunfire

   1. JRJoe Rogan34:26

      So how much time did he have to train martial arts before John Wick 1?

   2. CSChad Stahelski34:30

      Oh, God, it wasn't that. He was coming out of a couple films, so he hadn't been, um... Like, he wasn't in fight shape. That was... So, you know how, you know how it is. Just like, you can't just jump back in. So we gave him like, I think, three to five weeks with some of the trainers we found to get into shape, to get into shape. You know, cut weight, got himself back in, stretched. You know, kind of got back into where he was on The Matrix. And then we stuck him with the, the fight teams and the stunt guys. I think we had him within three months. That was probably the shortest one we did. That was about three months to get him into that shape and teach him all the, you know, the aikido stuff and the aikijutsu.

   3. JRJoe Rogan35:06

      Well, you need so... There's so much going on in those movies physically that you need to be proficient in.

   4. CSChad Stahelski35:11

      Yeah.

   5. JRJoe Rogan35:12

      The gun stuff, the, the throws, jujitsu, striking, everything.

   6. CSChad Stahelski35:17

      The jujitsu was the new thing for him. Pro- probably not the most physically demanding, but you know how it is. W- we're used to using your hands and feet.

   7. JRJoe Rogan35:22

      Mm-hmm.

   8. CSChad Stahelski35:23

      I mean, I'm sure you remember the first time he transitioned to jujitsu. It's like it looks easy, but you're like, "Ah."

   9. JRJoe Rogan35:27

      Yeah.

   10. CSChad Stahelski35:28

       Completely-

   11. JRJoe Rogan35:28

       It's an eye-opener.

   12. CSChad Stahelski35:29

       Yeah, it really is. And only even recently for me, I, I'm starting to feel like, "Oh, I can move." I, I... It feels just as good to be on my back as my butt, as my... like, you know.

   13. JRJoe Rogan35:37

       Mm-hmm.

   14. CSChad Stahelski35:37

       But I think we took a lot of inspiration from dance. Like, uh, you know, most of what we do is dance, they're based on dance drills. They're not based on martial art drills. They look like martial arts. We kick, punch, but we don't train the actors in Thai pads or focus mitts or heavy bag. We'll do maybe a little of that for impact stuff, but it's mostly about memory. 'Cause if a guy can punch and kick, that's great. But if he can't remember five moves, you're not much good to us.

   15. JRJoe Rogan36:00

       Right.

   16. CSChad Stahelski36:00

       And it's more, you know, martial arts is action, reaction or causing the guy to be off balance. All our guys are trained to, to keep him on balance, to, to make it look crazy, but they gotta dance with him.

   17. JRJoe Rogan36:10

       Hmm.

   18. CSChad Stahelski36:10

       So it's about that metronome, keeping the beat going.

   19. JRJoe Rogan36:14

       Mm-hmm.

   20. CSChad Stahelski36:14

       So when we trained him, um, he hadn't been trained that way before. It was more about memori- memorizing, uh, you know, a few moves, hitting some guys and whatnot.

   21. JRJoe Rogan36:21

       Specific sequence.

   22. CSChad Stahelski36:22

       But we realized we had no money and we had no time. And every time you do punches and kicks, you see in most movies, right? Like, they're on you, right over my shoulder.

   23. JRJoe Rogan36:28

       Mm-hmm.

   24. CSChad Stahelski36:29

       Then, you know, you take the hit and it goes over your shoulder so I can sell the hit. So you're always doing these reverses. So if I do a big wide shot profile, you throw in a nice roundhouse kick, I gotta cut somewhere to show the impact, unless you're really kicking me, which not advisable most of the time. So all, every time, the more punching and kicking and striking you do, or if Keanu's not doing the motion, I gotta cut more. And every time I cut, it's a setup. It's the, it's, it's just time-consuming. Not that it's bad or good, it's just time-consuming. We knew we weren't gonna have that, so we're like, "Fuck, what do we do? Okay, we're just gonna grab people." (laughs) "We're just gonna make it all grappling." And, like, is that gonna look... You know. You gotta remember, it's all during The Bourne, so everything's gonna look very slow, you know, compared to what it was. But we're just, we're gonna do all gr- We're gonna do aikido, aikijutsu, or jujitsu. That's it. That's all you get. And if you get a punch, it'll be a contact hit. That's all we're gonna do. No punches, no kicks, no nothing. And we'll do it all in one take.

   25. JRJoe Rogan37:16

       Hmm.

   26. CSChad Stahelski37:17

       And we're all like, "Uh, yeah, sounds good." Um, you know. (laughs) No one...... no. Yeah, we thought it was a complete disaster after the first two days of shooting the fight scenes. We're like, "This is gonna suck. We're fucked." Um-

   27. JRJoe Rogan37:28

       Why'd you think that, though?

   28. CSChad Stahelski37:29

       D- I think it was everyone's mindset. Like, we did it out of necessity, and we thought it was cool. But like, you'd see people that would, "Where's the k-" Like, you know, s- sometimes people look at it and go, "Well, he's doing the same throw over and..." I mean, Ippon Seoinage looks the same, but for us, the different grips, the different throw, it, it all looks different to me. Like-

   29. JRJoe Rogan37:44

       Mm-hmm.

   30. CSChad Stahelski37:44

       ... I, I'm a throw, you know, I love judo porn. I, I could watch a million different throws. It's awesome. Um, for some people, it all looks the same. They wanna see the cool jump spin hook kick or something like that. Um, but then we put in the close quarter stuff, and when you're seeing it, remember, we don't have the muzzle flashes on, we don't have the blood splatters.

Episode duration: 2:05:06