Joe Rogan Experience #2028 - Jermey Corbell & George Knapp

1. 0:00 – 15:00

   (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast,…

   1. NANarrator0:00

      (drumbeats) Joe Rogan podcast, check it out.

   2. JRJoe Rogan0:04

      The Joe Rogan Experience.

   3. NANarrator0:06

      Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. (instrumental music plays)

   4. JRJoe Rogan0:12

      Hello, George.

   5. GKGeorge Knapp0:13

      Hey, Joe.

   6. JRJoe Rogan0:13

      Hello, Jeremy. What's up? Good to see you guys.

   7. GKGeorge Knapp0:16

      Hey, man.

   8. JRJoe Rogan0:16

      The two musketeers at the front lines of UFO disclosure. (laughs) It is, uh, scary if that's true, Joe. (laughs)

   9. GKGeorge Knapp0:23

      I think you guys are. I mean, uh, you're, you're certainly prominent.

   10. JRJoe Rogan0:28

       Can I get the mic turned up on this bad boy?

   11. GKGeorge Knapp0:30

       Yeah, there's a little thing, uh, right there.

   12. JRJoe Rogan0:32

       Oh, shit.

   13. GKGeorge Knapp0:32

       You get to hear your own voice. There's a volume knob right there.

   14. JRJoe Rogan0:36

       Excellent.

   15. NANarrator0:37

       We're up, we're up.

   16. GKGeorge Knapp0:37

       It's exciting times.

   17. JRJoe Rogan0:38

       It is. It's very exciting times.

   18. GKGeorge Knapp0:40

       I've said it a few times that I'd never thought I would see it in my life, you know. I would just keep plugging away for... This is my 36th year doing this, chasing this crazy story. I never thought it would make this much progress. Still a long way to go, but...

   19. JRJoe Rogan0:52

       Are you apprehensive at all that some of the stuff that they're releasing is bullshit? Of course. (laughs)

   20. GKGeorge Knapp0:59

       Of course.

   21. JRJoe Rogan0:59

       W- w- w- who, who, who's releasing?

   22. GKGeorge Knapp1:01

       I mean, when you see these, uh, these... The Pentagon's talking about it, when, you know, uh, intelligent officials. You ever wonder whether or not it's disinformation?

   23. JRJoe Rogan1:13

       Yeah, I'll... You wanna?

   24. NANarrator1:15

       Yeah, go ahead.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:15

       So yeah, I'll take that first. Um, yeah, I've heard you kinda talk about that a bunch.

   26. GKGeorge Knapp1:18

       Yes.

   27. JRJoe Rogan1:18

       You know? And I think it's a very healthy suspicion to have. Uh, my perspective is a little different, in that people are always coming at me with fake information, like, every day, all the time. But the people in government that we have been able to kind of, um, (clicks tongue) interface with, I wish there was an adult in the room. I wish that this was orchestrated through the media. It would give me some sort of hope that someone has some sort of control on this, and that has not been my experience.

   28. GKGeorge Knapp1:48

       Okay, what is your exper- like, what are you, what's your impression of how it's all happening?

   29. JRJoe Rogan1:53

       It's a big question. I, I don't know where to start on that. But I, just, here's what I know. I know that there are people in government that want some level of disclosure on whatever this is, without defining it. Just, there should be oversight. So, I know that to be true. There are good people that think that people are running amok and there must be oversight, not just financially, but if these types of technologies actually exist?

   30. GKGeorge Knapp2:20

       Right, who's in control of them and why?
2. 15:00 – 30:00

   Yeah. They had 40…

   1. JRJoe Rogan15:00

      in Russia, they had this policy at first to engage these things and they lost pilots.

   2. GKGeorge Knapp15:06

      Yeah. They had 40 different incidents during that study where, uh, Russian war planes chased UFOs. Three of those cases, the UFOs turned around and shot 'em down. They disabled the planes and the planes crashed. Two of those pilots died, and after the third crash, the Russian Ministry of Defense put out the order, "Leave 'em alone. They may have, quote, incredible capacities for retaliation. Just leave 'em alone."

   3. JRJoe Rogan15:29

      A- and one last thing about that blew my mind. We did a episode about this, like him going to Russia, the whole thing. They talked about, in those documents, that they knew how many satellites that we had dedicated to looking for UFOs. Is, is that correct?

   4. GKGeorge Knapp15:43

      Yeah. Yeah, I, I met this Russian scientist who had worked on their version of Star Wars. He lived in one of these secret cities. He'd never spoken to a, any journalist, let alone a Western journalist. And he started telling us about the, the work that they were doing. He, he, he showed me this tabletop, uh, model of a, like a laser weapon that he called the weapon of the aliens, but he said he'd been involved in the Russian space program in the earliest days. They had satellites up there that were seeing these things coming in and out of space into the Earth's atmosphere and going out. He said, "The Americans, I know that you guys had those satellites, you were seeing the same stuff we were." Their intelligence agents got information from the US, they knew we were collecting information, uh, back then. They know we're collecting it now.

   5. JCJeremy Corbell16:29

      (inhales deeply) And when, when they say that they had jets shot down, is that ... Do we have instances of jets getting shot down in America?

   6. GKGeorge Knapp16:38

      We do. Um, it's, it's kinda sketchy because a lot of those records, we have records of the planes going down, but not ... There's no indication that the UFOs were responsible other than the Captain Mantell incident. That's a pretty famous UFO case, uh, where he chased a UFO and then crashed. I think he might have run out of gas, and the, I think, the Air Force tried to explain he was chasing the planet Venus, which is preposterous, you know?

   7. JCJeremy Corbell17:01

      Mm-hmm.

   8. GKGeorge Knapp17:01

      Yeah, we have some.

   9. JRJoe Rogan17:03

      Yeah. The CIA actually fully funded a, a, a movie narrated by Rod Serling.

   10. JCJeremy Corbell17:08

       Oh, wow.

   11. JRJoe Rogan17:09

       Uh, it's called UFOs: Past, Present or Future. And there's two versions, and you, you can find it online. This is the most incredible UFO movie of all time because it's funded by the CIA to try to apologize for that incident of saying he chased Venus. It's a cool old school documentary on UFOs n- narrated by the Twilight Zone guy.

   12. JCJeremy Corbell17:27

       Ah. Wow.

   13. JRJoe Rogan17:29

       Yeah. Fact.

   14. JCJeremy Corbell17:31

       So w- the Russians, how many crafts have ... Like, we n- supposedly Grusch said that the United States is in possession of 12.

   15. JRJoe Rogan17:41

       We should, we should, uh, back up on Grusch, right? Like-

   16. JCJeremy Corbell17:45

       Okay.

   17. JRJoe Rogan17:46

       He ... What, what I'm thinking is something big happened. We had these hearings, right?

   18. JCJeremy Corbell17:50

       Right.

   19. JRJoe Rogan17:51

       And everybody knows Grusch 'cause they saw him for the first time during that. In those hearings, he did not say that. And so there's an important thing there, what he said and what he couldn't say during those hearings, so I am not gonna say that Grusch has ever said that. That's not in his DaP sir, like that's not authorized shit. If somebody said that, I don't know who said it. All we know, he said, was right there in that hearing.

   20. JCJeremy Corbell18:15

       (sighs) Okay.

   21. JRJoe Rogan18:15

       You see what I'm saying? It's like there's a lot of rumors out there and, and I, and I don't know.

   22. JCJeremy Corbell18:20

       So this 12-... recovered vehicles, yes.

   23. JRJoe Rogan18:21

       You've heard it from people and I've heard it from people.

   24. JCJeremy Corbell18:24

       Yeah.

   25. JRJoe Rogan18:24

       Not from Grusch, though. You know?

   26. JCJeremy Corbell18:26

       Okay. Okay, so I'm confused. So what has Grusch said? Grusch s- said they definitely have physical crafts?

   27. JRJoe Rogan18:34

       So he was really... So let me just set the scene for you with this-

   28. JCJeremy Corbell18:37

       Okay.

   29. JRJoe Rogan18:37

       ... hearing thing, right? Um, so I know when people think this is like orchestrated, (laughs) man. Uh, we fought for every millimeter o- of doing that hearing, like I personally did, you know, and- and- and so did George. And the idea was, what can the public... What can we put out to the public and let everybody know this is important to us? It's the first time in history that you have Commander David Fravor, Lieutenant Ryan Graves, and then one whistleblower, a guy named David Grusch, who we- we can't validate what he said because it's all classified information. But Commander Fravor, uh, uh, friends of ours, you know, Commander Fravor, he like just told what happened to him. He chased a UFO. Then you've got Ryan Graves, who his whole squadron has been seeing these things, and you've had both on your podcast. But Grusch stood up there and he was very careful with his words, and I want people to know why. If you look at that setting, you're gonna see right behind him was, uh, a guy named Chuck, Chuck McCullough.

   30. JCJeremy Corbell19:36

       McCollough.
3. 30:00 – 45:00

   Right. …

   1. JRJoe Rogan30:00

      depending on which one you wanna identify him with. He's g- he's out, man. And they did some bullshit on him like time card, like out of, out of 12,000 billable hours, maybe there's like 30 hours somewhere where you didn't do it right. They were doing anything they could to fuck with this guy. So that was our first like heads up, "Oh, dude, how this guy gets treated is gonna dictate everybody else that has come to us in private."... saying, "I, I, I think this is illegal, what I'm doing."

   2. JCJeremy Corbell30:28

      Right.

   3. GKGeorge Knapp30:29

      Among the complaints they issued to try to take away his security clearance was that he had mental health issues.

   4. JRJoe Rogan30:35

      Yeah.

   5. GKGeorge Knapp30:35

      So, he was suspended for a couple of months. They did a background investigation of his allegations, the allegations that have been made against him, and they cleared him, reinstated him, reinstated his security clearance. He stayed on the job for a couple more months and then retired, 'cause he s- sees the handwriting on the wall and he left. And that's when he started, um, plotting the next chapter. And now, we're seeing the backlash, uh, process firing up once again. After he testifies in front of Congress in that hearing and offers to tell them more in a classified setting, uh, and, and spill all the beans, uh, they, they gotta find a media guy to go after him. Uh, this article in The Intercept says that.

   6. JRJoe Rogan31:14

      Yes, uh, The Intercept did a smash piece. By the way, we already knew all about Dave Grusch's P- PTSD.

   7. JCJeremy Corbell31:20

      Mm-hmm.

   8. JRJoe Rogan31:20

      And at the time, his best friend, one of his dear friends just talk- got off the phone with him, blew his own brains out, right? So he was like, drinking. He was in a bad place. The first day, day one, I talked to him. I said, "What dirt are they gonna pull up on you? If, if what you're telling me is true, they're gonna get some dirt." And he goes, "Look, man. I had PTSD. I dealt with it. I survived it. Nothing horrible happened." But, you know, he told us day one, "Man, that intercept thing was some bullshit." They, they come in and they, they try to discredit what he said because of his PTSD shit. And the thing is, that happened to Lazar. Like, if you believe or don't believe, don't care. That did happen to Lazar, too, where people tried to discredit his character to try to minimize what he's telling you.

   9. JCJeremy Corbell32:01

      Hm.

   10. JRJoe Rogan32:02

       So we saw that with Dave, and that was only the visible stuff. I'm telling you, things behind the scenes that have been done to Dave and his family, it's disgusting. Like, not even just like, pull your clearance kinda shit. Like, there are people that don't want him... Th- he's an embarrassment, you know, to the Department of Defense. I- if what he's saying, he's coming outta school and he's saying, "I saw some BS." Like, they don't want that.

   11. GKGeorge Knapp32:30

       So, we are in the pushback phase. They, they not only... The intelligence community and military folks tipped off a reporter and said, "Go look for this." And they found some police records of where he was drinking too much and was suicidal, uh, and, and that was adjudicated. Uh, it was looked at. The Department of Defense, his, his employers looked into it. He'd gone through treatment. He got past it. He was a better person, a stronger person for it. But they leaked that information to just besmirch his character, and now we see additional, uh, pushback in Congress. So, this committee that h- held this hearing into UFO/UAP matters, um, it was a sub-committee on national security of the Oversight Committee, the larger committee. Since that hearing happened, uh, the Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee got together with the Chairman of the Oversight Committee and decided no more UFO hearings in the House. Enough of that bullshit. We're not doing that anymore because, in their words, it could be an embarrassment to the Department of Defense. You're damn right it would be an embarrassment for what's gonna come out.

   12. JRJoe Rogan33:32

       I mean, it was a big success, you know, to have this, this publicly done. It's the first time in history that we have direct witnesses, like two pilots and then a whistleblower. It was the first time in history. We f- we fought for every millimeter of that territory to get that to happen. It was not received well by the intelligence community. You know, they did not like that that happened. And that's pretty telling to me, uh, th- that we should do it again.

   13. JCJeremy Corbell33:58

       (laughs)

   14. JRJoe Rogan34:00

       Now, when Grusch first found out about this stuff, he was tasked with trying to uncover it?

   15. GKGeorge Knapp34:08

       It was his job.

   16. JRJoe Rogan34:09

       It was his job. And why did they... Like, what was the suspicion? Like, what was the ir- initial impetus to get him to-

   17. GKGeorge Knapp34:17

       Well-

   18. JRJoe Rogan34:17

       ... look into this stuff?

   19. GKGeorge Knapp34:18

       It's the suspicion we've had for a long time, that there is a crash retrieval program, that we have recovered technology that is not made here, that we're trying to reverse engineer it and figure out how it works so that we can duplicate it.

   20. JRJoe Rogan34:29

       Right, but who- Yeah. ... who sent him? So there's a r-

   21. GKGeorge Knapp34:32

       U- UAP Task Force. So the UAP Task Force was formally created by Congress to look into the bigger picture. Jay Stratton-

   22. JRJoe Rogan34:38

       And they suspected that something was wrong?

   23. GKGeorge Knapp34:40

       Yeah. Jay Stratton was the head of it. He'd been at the Defense Intelligence Agency. He was with naval intelligence. He kept getting pulled back into the UFO arena from different jobs. Very credible guy. He was in charge of the UAP Task Force. He put together this amazing briefing document that inc- included film and video and photos of UFOs that have been gathered by the US military over the past 30 years. He'd give those presentations to Congress, to the Joint Chiefs, to defense contractors, uh, 'cause he wanted people to know about it. And as part of that job, he assigned Dave to look into special access programs. Can you find evidence of crash retrievals, reverse engineering, any of that stuff we've been hearing rumored for 30, 40 years?

   24. JRJoe Rogan35:24

       A- and this is really about oversight, okay? So the way I understand it from people involved is that, "Look, we have to have oversight over these types of programs and technologies." Like, "It's good we're doing them. It's good we keep it secret." Like, that's their standpoint. But they're like, "We have to have a process of oversight." Do you remember the, the Church Committee back in the '60s?

   25. JCJeremy Corbell35:47

       Mm-hmm.

   26. JRJoe Rogan35:47

       Was it '60s or '70s? Um...

   27. GKGeorge Knapp35:49

       '70s.

   28. JRJoe Rogan35:50

       So the Church Committee. Everybody in the intelligence agency that I know will say there's BC and AC, before the Church Committee, after the Church Committee. It, it, it basically was a way to level the playing field so there's not this type of, you know, shenanigans that are going on, the fucked up shit they learned from the Church Committee. So what they're saying now is, "Look, some stuff needs to be kept secret for national security. If we can turn some of this shit into weapon systems," right? Like, we don't want... We don't give out, uh, blueprints to make an atom bomb. We admit atom bombs are real, but we don't give out blueprints. So some of it needs to be kept secret, but they're all about oversight.... if you don't have communication between the subcontractors that are working on this exotic stuff, if it exists, we need to be aware of that. At some level, me- we meaning senate and senate intelligence committees, all that stuff, oversight. So without that oversight, you're just letting people run amok and go crazy with this stuff. And I'll tell you first hand, right, there are people that have come to me and George that are currently employed in agencies and they feel like they are being held hostage in these programs. Like, there's, there's ways to keep people in programs and to not let them out by dangling this, like, "Well, what are you gonna do if you lose your clearances? You gonna go work at Home Depot?" You know, that's, that's the way that, that I've heard some people describe to me and George of why they're so terrified right now, is because their whole lives, their wives, their dogs, their children are all dependent upon these little faction groups kinda keeping them in a program. If that's true, that's fucking horrible.

   29. GKGeorge Knapp37:34

       And what just happened to Dave Grusch, the sliming of Dave Grusch by this, uh, this really pretty poorly researched, uh, article is an example to all them.

   30. JRJoe Rogan37:44

       Yeah.
4. 45:00 – 1:00:00

   That sounds right. …

   1. JCJeremy Corbell45:00

      but the electrons are jostled around a bit as they move, so they lose energy as they travel. This jostling is called electrical resistance. In a superconductor, there is zero resistance, and an electrical current can flow perfectly smoothly without losing any energy."

   2. JRJoe Rogan45:15

      That sounds right.

   3. GKGeorge Knapp45:16

      (laughs)

   4. JCJeremy Corbell45:16

      And so this is something that apparently... So this was something that was just discussed, like, recently about, uh, superconductor at room temperature-

   5. GKGeorge Knapp45:25

      Right.

   6. JCJeremy Corbell45:25

      ... which was kinda debunked.

   7. JRJoe Rogan45:26

      Oh, is it? (laughs)

   8. JCJeremy Corbell45:27

      Yeah, I believe it was debunked.

   9. JRJoe Rogan45:28

      Oh, dude, I always saw that in the news. Yeah.

   10. JCJeremy Corbell45:29

       Was it debunked?

   11. GKGeorge Knapp45:30

       It's been debunked a couple of times. They keep turning-

   12. JCJeremy Corbell45:32

       Yeah.

   13. GKGeorge Knapp45:32

       ... taking another stab at it.

   14. JRJoe Rogan45:33

       It's like Chinese propaganda or something?

   15. JCJeremy Corbell45:35

       No. I think these... I think they couldn't replicate it or... D- find out what it is.

   16. That's, that's as far... I think that's exactly it.

   17. JRJoe Rogan45:41

       Yeah, they couldn't.

   18. JCJeremy Corbell45:42

       They couldn't replicate it.

   19. JRJoe Rogan45:43

       Right, right. So check it out, though. What I can say is, um, so I have two pieces of graphene and they're like these little squares. And one is... They're metamaterials, mean- meaning it doesn't occur in nature. We made them. I have two kinds, two pieces. One piece is a three-degree variation from perfect atomic layering. The other one is like a seven-degree variation from perfect atomic layering. So like graphite from a pencil, I think, and they layer the atoms perfect. The one that's seven degree and the one that's three degree, if you have an ice cube, and I take the seven degree of orientation off from perfect and I push it into an ice cube, it's like a hot knife through butter. It instantly gets cold and your finger gets cold and it stops in the ice, right? Because it's transferring the heat, I guess this is a superconductor, I think. It, it, it pushes, um, the heat from my fingers right in. So that material has unique principles and properties because of the way they atomically layered it.

   20. JCJeremy Corbell46:38

       Mm-hmm.

   21. JRJoe Rogan46:38

       The three-degree one, it goes much deeper and faster because it's like a, it's like a faster transaction of that heat. So we, we've learned that metamaterials, when we orient them, we make them in a certain way, they have special or unique properties. So a lot of... S- so back to this guy. Um, a lot of what it seems like we're doing is trying to get derivative technologies from something that's more advanced than what we have.

   22. JCJeremy Corbell47:04

       Mm-hmm.

   23. JRJoe Rogan47:04

       And it could be little things. So he, all he saw was a superconductor. Okay? I believe that's the right word. That's all he saw. He only has suspicion. It's never been put to market since the '70s. What the fuck? He worked on one. So that's one type of like, I don't know, whistleblower or, or witness that we got. But there are other types, there are other people that are like physically working on the machines. Then there's people that are just in a bureaucratic role. Then you've got people like David Grusch who do discovery on finances and programs and interview people. This whole tapestry or mosaic of individuals leads me to feel that where there's smoke, there's fire. Th- all of this, th- there's something to it. It's just, where is it from?

   24. GKGeorge Knapp47:54

       I think we're in kind of a pushback mode now, though. Since that hearing, that might have been the high watermark. Uh, you know, Jeremy and I have been talking about it, it, publicly for a while. The closer we get to the goodies, the closer the public gets or Congress gets to actually seeing the saucers or finding out where the programs are, the harder these guys are gonna push back. The true keepers of the secrets have dug their feet in. I mentioned about this House chairman, uh, Intelligence Committee chairman. He represents Wright-Patterson Air Base. That, he gets a lot of campaign donations from big aerospace companies. Uh, Wright-Patterson, of course, home of Hangar 18 and all the rumors about Roswell wreckage and other things being stored there. That's his district. He's the guy that said no more hearings on UFOs.

   25. JRJoe Rogan48:35

       Is that Representative Turner?

   26. GKGeorge Knapp48:36

       Turner. Mike Turner.

   27. JRJoe Rogan48:38

       So he s- he kind of put the kibosh on it.

   28. JCJeremy Corbell48:40

       Hmm. "Claims China is a bigger threat to the US than aliens." Okay.

   29. JRJoe Rogan48:44

       Well, that's probably true. I mean-

   30. JCJeremy Corbell48:46

       Yeah?
5. 1:00:00 – 1:15:00

   How did Bob meet…

   1. JRJoe Rogan1:00:00

      puts it under his ashtray, puts in new film, snaps it again. They confiscate his, his film. But he had some underneath his cigarette lighter whatever, and h- he actually gave those to me. So I got the, the best shot of Area 51 you'll ever see from lake level was by John Lear. Now Bob knew John. That's where all the conspiracies come in, 'cause John is like this UFO nut, the godfather of conspiracy. But when he was-

   2. GKGeorge Knapp1:00:24

      How did Bob meet John?

   3. JRJoe Rogan1:00:25

      Well, this is your turf. Yeah.

   4. GKGeorge Knapp1:00:26

      Yeah. Through a guy named Gene Huff, who was a- This is post-exposure, post, uh... He, he met him before he worked out there.

   5. JRJoe Rogan1:00:33

      Really?

   6. GKGeorge Knapp1:00:33

      Uh, there was a guy named Gene Huff who did a real estate appraisal for, uh, John Lear's house. And, uh, Gene was friends with Bob, and they... Gene and, uh, Lear struck up a conversation, brought Bob in to the... to meet him, and, um, it was only after that that Lazar got hired out there. He would have arguments with Lear about this crazy UFO stuff.... because I'd already done a couple of interview- interviews with him in the, in the late '80s.

   7. JRJoe Rogan1:00:59

      With Lear.

   8. GKGeorge Knapp1:01:00

      With Lear, before I met Lazar. So, Lazar was not a believer. He said, "I don't believe it. Poor John, he's crazy with this UFO stuff."

   9. JRJoe Rogan1:01:07

      So, this is fact, and it's so funny, like knowing all these guys, 'cause I wasn't there like he was, but I get to talk with everybody and grill them. The one- I think it was Jim Goodall that was in the car with him, he remembers Bob saying, "Oh, poor John Lear." And Jim Goodall is like, "Why?" And he's like, "'Cause he believes this UFO nonsense." So, that was where Lazar was at prior to getting the job out at the test site- Hm. ... is he didn't believe any of this nonsense. In fact, so much so that, remember, I think he told you when he first went in, they had a little decal of an American flag on the saucer, and he thought, "Oh, those idiots. Everybody thought UFOs were from outer space and they're ours," you know?

   10. JCJeremy Corbell1:01:44

       Right.

   11. JRJoe Rogan1:01:44

       And, and then he quickly realized, wait a second. That-

   12. JCJeremy Corbell1:01:48

       Hm.

   13. JRJoe Rogan1:01:49

       ... you know, the- this isn't, this can't be ours.

   14. GKGeorge Knapp1:01:51

       It's fascinating to see now that Dave Grusch has come forward and give some credence to, we have reverse engineering programs. We have a crash retrieval program. Aerospace companies are stashing this stuff in some hangar somewhere. All the stuff that Lazar had said as being true, they now say, "Oh, gosh, I guess it is true. But that Lazar, he's still a liar. We don't believe him," you know?

   15. JRJoe Rogan1:02:11

       Yeah.

   16. GKGeorge Knapp1:02:11

       You have to kinda do some mental gymnastics to do that.

   17. JRJoe Rogan1:02:14

       Yeah.

   18. JCJeremy Corbell1:02:15

       It's just fascinating when you see these crafts move exactly the way that he described them in 1989.

   19. GKGeorge Knapp1:02:22

       Yeah.

   20. JRJoe Rogan1:02:23

       Straight up.

   21. GKGeorge Knapp1:02:24

       Yes.

   22. JCJeremy Corbell1:02:24

       It's pretty wild 'cause you're seeing footage from like, what is it, 2014 or something like that?

   23. GKGeorge Knapp1:02:29

       Yeah, the gimbal, yeah.

   24. JCJeremy Corbell1:02:30

       Yeah, and it's like, okay, it moved exactly like he described. Turns on its side, shoots off.

   25. JRJoe Rogan1:02:36

       So, so that's a, a common thing, is Bob Lazar must be the m- luckiest con man on planet Earth to get so much shit right over all these years.

   26. JCJeremy Corbell1:02:47

       Yeah.

   27. What's that? What's the controlled disclosure campaign plan?

   28. JRJoe Rogan1:02:51

       What is this from, Joe?

   29. JCJeremy Corbell1:02:52

       This is listed at the bottom of that document, they're talking about the MDAA for 2024, and this is the UAP section I've been reading through.

   30. Whoa. Controlled disclosure campaign with respect to unidentified anomalous phenomena recorded, uh, records originated prior to review board termination.
6. 1:15:00 – 1:16:00

   A commodity, a commodity.…

   1. JCJeremy Corbell1:15:00

      to try to get us to do things here or to try to recreate souls, which is like a very bizarre thought. You know, that l- the soul is a thing that y- you, we carry around saying-

   2. JRJoe Rogan1:15:12

      A commodity, a commodity.

   3. JCJeremy Corbell1:15:13

      ... and there's, and that there's some sort of value to having so many souls.

   4. JRJoe Rogan1:15:16

      That's like... Oh, this is old school. This is my gateway drug into UFOs, was John Lear. And first time I sit down with him, you know, he's like got this big cigar and he's looking at me, and he's like, "We're all property. We're property." You know, I'm like, "What the fuck is he talking about?" And he, and he was talking about how (laughs) the aliens saw us as kinda like a wine, and our bodies are containers and our souls are being matured as like a commodity, you know, for these al... Like, he was a, he was a wild dude. Like, I'm not saying I believe any of this. I'm just saying he gave me that idea day one.

   5. JCJeremy Corbell1:15:50

      When he said matured, like, is a soul of an intelligent person more valuable than the soul of a dummy?

   6. JRJoe Rogan1:15:58

      I wish we could ask John Lear, but he's dead.

Episode duration: 2:54:42