The Joe Rogan ExperienceJRE MMA Show #109 with Gordon Ryan
CHAPTERS
- 0:00 – 1:20
Gordon Ryan’s rapid rise and crediting Jon Danaher
Joe opens by calling Gordon the best pound-for-pound grappler and asks how he separated from the pack so quickly. Gordon attributes much of his acceleration to Jon Danaher’s coaching and the team’s approach to skill development.
- •Rogan frames Gordon as an all-time great at just 25
- •Gordon credits Danaher as the key catalyst for his progress
- •Training timeline: ~10 years training, ~5 years as a pro
- •The role of elite coaching in compressing development time
- 1:20 – 5:09
Inside the Danaher mystique: full names, rash guards, and the fanny pack
They riff on Danaher’s eccentric habits—his stoic coaching voice, calling athletes by full names, and always wearing rash guards. The conversation becomes a humorous look at the culture and personality around the Danaher Death Squad.
- •Why Danaher uses full names to address athletes clearly
- •Danaher’s ‘street rash guards’ and even ‘date rash guards’
- •The ever-present fanny pack and speculation about what’s inside
- •Danaher’s unusually singular obsession with martial arts
- 5:09 – 8:44
Why DDS keeps winning: details, innovation, and a submission-first mindset
Gordon explains that other teams copy the outline of DDS techniques but miss the fine details that decide outcomes at the elite level. He contrasts DDS’s goal of hunting submissions with the broader sport’s tendency to game rules and stall for points.
- •Copying ‘general ideas’ without micro-details fails at the top level
- •Innovation vs imitation: improving what already works
- •Many competitors optimize for minimal work and decision wins
- •DDS philosophy: control that reliably leads to submissions
- 8:44 – 15:13
How Danaher’s training evolved: leg-lock era to positional systems and EBI dominance
They discuss how the team’s training changed over time: first exploiting the leg-lock gap, then tailoring preparation to rule sets. Gordon describes the shift toward targeted positional rounds and how EBI’s overtime positions forced rapid improvement in back escapes.
- •Early focus: making the team world-class at leg locks
- •Later focus: rule-set specific preparation (EBI, ADCC, IBJJF)
- •More positional sparring to build depth in ‘key positions’
- •Tim Kennedy vs Roger Gracie footage inspired back-escape breakthroughs
- 15:13 – 20:34
Seven-days-a-week training, obsession, and constant novelty
Rogan questions the ‘no days off’ approach; Gordon defends it as active recovery and mental continuity. He emphasizes Danaher’s constant tape study and daily technical novelty as a way to avoid plateaus and keep athletes engaged.
- •No days off; intensity scales based on fatigue
- •Active recovery: show up lighter rather than skip training
- •Avoiding boredom through nonstop new techniques
- •Danaher studies tape obsessively and brings fresh ideas daily
- 20:34 – 22:28
Legacy goals and the problem of finding opponents
Gordon describes an end-of-career goal: an untouchable legacy. Rogan notes Gordon’s difficulty getting matches because opponents fear reputational damage for relatively small paydays.
- •Gordon’s long-term aim: records no one can surpass
- •Top grapplers reluctant to face him due to downside risk
- •Pay disparity vs boxing (Tyson comparison)
- •Wagner Rocha as a rare elite opponent willing to step up
- 22:28 – 28:39
Trash talk, ‘King Ryan’ persona, and calling submissions in advance
They explore Gordon’s unusual combination of dominance and constant online trolling. Gordon explains how backlash after early wins pushed him to lean into authenticity and marketing, including pre-calling submissions and showmanship.
- •Trash talk works only if you can consistently back it up
- •Examples: predicting finishes (mounted armbar, triangle envelope)
- •Origin story: online hate after EBI win sparked the persona
- •Using spectacle to build attention in a niche sport
- 28:39 – 32:17
Social media crackdown: deleted comments, bans, and the cost of trolling
Gordon explains how Instagram and Facebook moderation has limited his online antics. He describes repeated strikes, erased comment threads, and how it’s become too time-consuming to keep battling haters.
- •Posts/comments being removed at high rates due to reporting/algorithm
- •Accumulated violations lead to instant deletions and threats to accounts
- •Facebook ‘perma-banned’ cycle: brief access followed by long bans
- •Shift toward minimal posting: promotion over argument
- 32:17 – 36:24
MMA transition and team loyalty: waiting for someone else to ‘carry the crown’
Rogan steers toward MMA; Gordon explains Danaher’s belief that grappling is about to explode professionally. Gordon says he’ll move into MMA only when teammates can fill his jiu-jitsu role, emphasizing a homegrown team model over recruited superteams.
- •Danaher prefers Gordon stay in grappling during a growth phase
- •Gordon’s condition: transition to MMA after teammates reach similar dominance
- •Team cohesion and loyalty as a competitive advantage
- •Contrast with recruitment-heavy teams; DDS as a system with shared style
- 36:24 – 41:03
ADCC ambitions, superfight rules, and Garry Tonon’s double workload
They discuss Gordon’s desire to do both ADCC superfight and a weight division—something unprecedented. Gordon also breaks down Garry’s demanding schedule: MMA plus jiu-jitsu every day, with Danaher coaching striking and MMA systems too.
- •ADCC structure: absolute winner vs superfight champion; scheduling constraints
- •Gordon requests superfight + weight division (five matches)
- •Garry trains MMA and jiu-jitsu seven days a week, often back-to-back
- •Danaher’s breadth: striking, wrestling, wall work, full MMA coaching
- 41:03 – 46:52
Recovery habits: sleep, stretching struggles, and Rogan’s sauna pitch
Rogan asks about recovery tools; Gordon says he relies mostly on sleep and occasional massage/stretch assistance, avoiding ice baths. Rogan argues sauna use could improve endurance and inflammation, offering to share research.
- •Primary recovery lever: consistent 8–10 hours of sleep
- •Stretching is a weakness; uses help to stay accountable
- •No ice baths (hates cold); open to sauna but inconsistent
- •Rogan cites heat shock proteins and endurance benefits
- 46:52 – 51:29
Injuries, rehab, and competing through setbacks (LCL surgery, ADCC camp turnaround)
Gordon recounts limited striking experience due to injuries and tight competitive schedules. He describes returning to competition 6–7 months after LCL reconstruction, using PT, mobility work, and BFR training, plus the psychological struggle of regaining timing.
- •Striking development interrupted by LCL tear and ADCC camp demands
- •Return timeline: first tournament at 6 months, ADCC at 7 months post-op
- •Rehab: PT focus on hip/back mobility; BFR for recovery/strength
- •Performance ‘switch’ late in camp as timing returned
- 51:29 – 57:28
Grappling’s growth needs personalities and submission-oriented rulesets
Rogan and Gordon discuss how grappling can grow as a spectator sport, emphasizing finishes as the equivalent of knockouts. Gordon argues that more athletes need exciting styles and promotion, and that training systems must prioritize movement and submissions over stalling.
- •Submissions as the viewer hook—like knockouts in boxing
- •Need for more big personalities beyond ‘humble’ interview clichés
- •Spectator ceiling exists, but production/commentary can expand the audience
- •Boring meta (e.g., 50/50 stalling) hurts growth; training must drive action
- 57:28 – 1:01:37
Danaher the polymath: PhD, tape-study obsession, knives, and pig-hunting roots
They return to Danaher’s unique background—academic credentials, encyclopedic knowledge, and eccentric interests. Stories about collecting custom knives and growing up hunting hogs in New Zealand highlight how unusual his life experience is for an elite coach.
- •Danaher’s academic pedigree (Columbia, philosophy) and teaching past
- •Tape study across eras and sports; ‘closest thing to Google’
- •Knife collecting and gifting blades for major wins (katana story)
- •Pig hunting with dogs in New Zealand as part of his upbringing
- 1:01:37 – 1:13:56
Wild hogs, bison management, and ethics of eradication vs hunting
The conversation detours into Texas’s feral hog problem—damage costs, hunting methods, and why eradication programs exist. They also discuss bison population control in national parks and practical realities of hauling big game out.
- •Feral hogs as an invasive species causing large-scale damage
- •Ethical argument: hunting as wildlife/crop management
- •Bison culls in parks and the ‘not really hunting’ debate
- •Logistics of big game harvest and meat utilization
- 1:13:56 – 1:37:33
Nutrition under gastroparesis: constant nausea, limited foods, and travel challenges
Gordon reveals a major ongoing health issue: gastroparesis, likely triggered after recurring staph infections and repeated antibiotics. He describes constant nausea, strict dietary limits, weight fluctuations, trial medications, and strategies like carbonated drinks, clean routines, and exploring travel accommodations with kitchens.
- •Gastroparesis symptoms: delayed emptying, constant nausea, early fullness
- •Diet constraints: mostly chicken, rice, eggs; avoid red meat/fried/greasy/spicy
- •Testing and treatment: gastric emptying test; trial-and-error meds; Zofran
- •Travel worsens symptoms; considers Airbnbs/cooking solutions; kombucha helps burping
- 1:37:33 – 1:45:06
Andre Galvão beef and the backstage slap incident
They unpack the origins of tension with Andre Galvão—passive-aggressive posts, match negotiations, and personal escalation. Gordon explains the backstage confrontation where he slapped Andre after being pushed and called names, and why he believes Andre expected Gordon to be non-confrontational in person.
- •Beef origin: post-ADCC absolute win and ‘real king’ jabs
- •Andre’s high price demands vs typical ADCC purses
- •Backstage confrontation: push, insults, Gordon’s slap response
- •Gordon frames it as marketing plus boundaries: ‘online persona’ vs real conflict
- 1:45:06 – 1:49:46
Competing hurt: broken hand before ADCC, neck issues, and future-proofing
Gordon details a freak e-bike accident that damaged his hand right before ADCC, adding to prior breaks. Rogan emphasizes neck and back as grappling’s long-term liabilities, recommending tools like the Iron Neck to prevent the kind of disk-replacement injuries seen in other elite grapplers.
- •E-bike throttle accident crushed hand between tire and fender pre-ADCC
- •Still competed: ADCC then Palhares shortly after; healed with time off
- •Chronic neck soreness largely from wrestling head pressure
- •Rogan recommends Iron Neck; examples of athletes with artificial neck disks
- 1:49:46 – 2:00:20
Cross-discipline match formats, ADCC rules, and no-gi specialization vs gi
They discuss hybrid matches (Pat Downey) and why certain rule sets are more interesting and more MMA-relevant than pure wrestling vs pure submission-only. Gordon explains why he won’t pursue gi competition seriously, arguing no-gi is the professional future and that specialization is the whole point.
- •Pat Downey dual-format: submission-only + freestyle; why it fell flat
- •ADCC scoring and ‘scrimmage wrestling’ as MMA-adjacent grappling
- •Better hybrid concept: no guard pulls/limited submissions to force wrestling
- •Gi vs no-gi: entertainment, audience understanding, and specialization rationale
- 2:00:20 – 2:03:10
Can other teams catch up? Imitation without nuance, and Craig Jones as an exception
Rogan asks if other teams have adopted the DDS system; Gordon argues most only copy surface-level techniques. He praises Craig Jones for fully immersing himself by relocating and embracing their positional training, leading to major improvement.
- •Most teams copy leg locks/back attacks superficially, not the fine structure
- •No one is ‘going beyond’ DDS innovation in Gordon’s view
- •Craig Jones moved to NYC to train, embraced positional rounds, leveled up
- •System advantage: deep reps in narrow ‘key’ positions
- 2:03:10 – 2:45:14
Leaving New York: pandemic policies, taxes, and the Puerto Rico training setup
Gordon explains why he disliked NYC even before COVID, and how pandemic shutdowns and rising costs accelerated the team’s exit. He describes Puerto Rico as an interim solution with guaranteed private training space, their current gym situation, and the slower island pace—plus the practical car-buying lessons.
- •NYC downsides for full-time athletes: cost without enjoying the city
- •COVID restrictions and business closures pushed relocation decisions
- •Puerto Rico chosen due to friends/private mat space as a fallback plan
- •Current training at Combat 360 while building a larger facility; island lifestyle quirks
